PF2 Sorcerer Healer

[Malapterus]

This is the best forum I could find for Pathfinder 2, so please redirect me if I belong somewhere else.

I'm looking to make a sorcerer who fancies himself a doctor. The DM has made this an Archetype game, and I am looking at an Ancient Elf, so I'd get to start with two Dedication feats. Low-key triple class!

Obviously I could take the Angelic origin and make Heal one of my special Sorcerer spells, but I want more than that. I want to cure diseases and poisoning, and heal old scars and lost parts. I want a healing cantrip. Essentially, in my downtime, my guy would want to wander around whatever small town we're parked in and practice his physical and magical remedies on the townsfolk - free of charge, of course.

Sadly, I cant tell if Sorcerers have any access to any healing magic beyond Heal from the aforementioned origin.

I'm not looking to min-max here, but I do want this guy to be able to competently heal while also doing ore traditional blasty sorcery to back up his party.

Does anyone know a good way to build this? As always, any insight would be appreciated.

[RogueJK]

This is the Dungeons and Dragons 5th Edition specific subforum. However, I'll give it a crack as I dabble in PF2 too.

The DM has made this an Archetype game, and I am looking at an Ancient Elf, so I'd get to start with two Dedication feats. Low-key triple class!

Unless your DM is bending the rules, Ancient Elf doesn't let you override the requirement that after taking a Dedication you must take 2 further archetype feats before taking another Dedication. So you can't be Triple-Classed right off the bat under the standard rules.

Also keep in mind that Ancient Elf only allows you to choose a Multiclass Dedication. Basically, this means it has to be a Dedication for one of the basic classes (Fighter/Cleric/Rogue/Bard/etc.), not any of the other types of Archetypes. So the best healer archetypes don't qualify for Ancient Elf's ability, including Blessed One (for extra magical healing) and Medic (for extra mundane healing).

As result, Ancient Elf isn't really all that useful in a Free Archetype campaign like yours, and especially for what you're wanting. Even if you stick to a basic Multiclass Archetype, you'd get your initial Archetype at 1 instead of 2, and then not be able to take a free Archetype feat at 2 because you don't qualify for any of the rest yet, and have to wait until 4 to take your Level 4 Archetype feat. Compared to everyone else who takes their Dedication at 2 with their free feat, and then takes Level 4 feat at 4 just like you. Unless your DM is being lenient.

I want a healing cantrip.

No such thing. Closest thing would be a Focus Spell that heals, such as the Blessed One's Lay On Hands. You can cast it, then Refocus for 10 minutes, then cast it again. So it's not at will like a Cantrip, but you can do it as much as you want throughout a day with the number of recastings only limited by the amount of time you have available to repeatedly Refocus.

Or you can also use a Healer's Kit and Medicine checks without using up spell slots. Anyone can do a little of that with just the Medicine skill, but this nonmagical healing and status removal effects can be significantly boosted using Medicine-related feats as well as archetypes like the Medic.



Therefore, I'd pick a different Heritage than Ancient Elf, and go with something like this as a basic framework for a healing-focused Sorcerer-Doctor:

1) Go with Angelic Bloodline Sorcerer. Grab a Background like Barber, Back Alley Doctor, Field Medic, or similar that gets you the Medicine skill and either the Battle Medicine or Risky Surgery feat, as well as a stat boost you like (such as CHA, DEX, or CON). Take Versatile Human Heritage and take as your free General feat whichever one of Battle Medicine or Risky Surgery you didn't get from your background. Take Natural Ambition as your Ancestry Feat to grab a Level 1 [Sorcerer Class Feat].

2) Medic Dedication (Free), Continual Recovery (Skill), [Sorcerer Class Feat]. Medic Dedication also grants you Expert proficiency in Medicine here.

3) Signature Spell: Heal. Ward Medic (General)

4) Doctor's Visitation (Free), Divine Evolution (Class), Treat Condition (Skill, and your third Medic Archetype feat meaning you can take another Dedication at 6)

5) [Ancestry Feat]

6) Blessed One Dedication (Free), Mercy (Class), Holistic Care (Skill)

7) Master proficiency in Medicine, Assurance: Medicine (General)

8) Invigorating Mercy (Free), Blessed Spell (Class), [Skill Feat]

9) [Ancestry Feat]

10) Greater Mercy (Free), [Sorcerer Class Feat], [Skill Feat]

Etc.

This combo of Angelic Sorcerer, Medic, and Blessed One makes you a real powerhouse healer both in and out of combat, using Heal spells (including as a freely heightened Signature spell as well as an additional free highest level casting from Divine Evolution), focus spells like Angelic Halo and especially Lay on Hands for repeated extra healing, and lots of non-magical Medical treatment options for times when you don't want to expend spell/focus resources. You can not only heal HP damage, but also have several options to either magically or medically remove statuses, diseases, and poisons too. You also still have access to all the other usual Sorcerer spellcasting stuff, and you still have other available Ancestry, Class, Skill, and General feats open to flesh it out in other ways beyond just being a super capable healer.

Also, even just Angelic Sorcerer + Blessed One is a very capable healer. Medic is just gravy. So if you're feeling too constrained by not having enough feats, you could skip Medic and many/all of those Medicine-related feats in favor of pursuing some different capability, and just rely on Heal + Lay on Hands (with all the Mercy effects) for your healing needs.

[Psyren]

The PF2 threads we have are usually in the 3.5/PF1/Other-d20 subforum here: https://forums.giantitp.com/forumdisplay.php?59

[LibraryOgre]

The Mod Ogre: Moved.

[Kurald Galain]

So I'm curious if PF2 actually counts as "the d20 system". I mean, sure, it uses a d20 but so do lots of other games, and 4E and 5E have a different design and aren't "the d20 system" any more either.

...I'm inclined to think that, as first published, it was intended to count (because Paizo likes to claim it's still the same setting as PF1 and so forth), and after the recent-ish clash with WOTC"s legal department they probably don't intend it as anything WOTC-related anymore.

I don't have official word on this though (ETA: i.e. from Paizo). Any thoughts?

I'm not looking to min-max here, but I do want this guy to be able to competently heal while also doing ore traditional blasty sorcery to back up his party.

Anyway, to answer the OP's question, I don't think you can do this. PF2 really really needs a cleric in the party, and while technically any class can sort-of-kind-of heal, that is just not sufficient in an actual adventuring day.

[Maat Mons]

Sadly, I cant tell if Sorcerers have any access to any healing magic beyond Heal from the aforementioned origin.

I haven't looked much into Pathfinder 2e, so this might be a dumb question, but doesn't selecting the Angelic bloodline mean you pick your spells from the Divine tradition? Wouldn't that mean you'd have access to most of the same spells as Clerics and Oracles?

Yeah, it looks like any of the Sorcerer bloodlines that use the Divine spell list (Angelic, Demonic, Diabolic, Psychopomp, Undead, Wyrmblessed) or the Primal Spell list (Elemental, Fey, Nymph, Phoenix) have access to oodles of healing spells. Also, while I haven't played in a game of PF2, so you should be highly skeptical of any recommendations I give, the Phoenix bloodline and the Shock to the System spell look neat, if you have access to them.

[Psyren]

So I'm curious if PF2 actually counts as "the d20 system". I mean, sure, it uses a d20 but so do lots of other games, and 4E and 5E have a different design and aren't "the d20 system" any more either.

...I'm inclined to think that, as first published, it was intended to count (because Paizo likes to claim it's still the same setting as PF1 and so forth), and after the recent-ish clash with WOTC"s legal department they probably don't intend it as anything WOTC-related anymore.

I don't have official word on this though. Any thoughts?

The official position from the mods, at least so far, has been that there isn't sufficient reason for PF2 to get a different subforum from PF1 and 3.5 at this time. See here and here for examples, as well as here for official "PF2 belongs in other d20" voice of mod. (And of course, the fact that LibraryOgre moved the thread here.)

[Maat Mons]

Oh, oops, I edited my previous post because I didn't see someone else had posted. I thought I was avoiding a double post, but really I was just screwing up the chronology. My bad.

[Kurald Galain]

Yeah, it looks like any of the Sorcerer bloodlines that use the Divine spell list (Angelic, Demonic, Diabolic, Psychopomp, Undead, Wyrmblessed)

Yeah, but they don't get the cleric's class features or feats, notably Healing Font (which gives substantially more top-level healing spells per day). PF2 casters get substantially fewer spells per day than in PF1.

The official position from the mods

I mean official word from Paizo regarding their intentions, after the whole WOTC copyright debacle from last year. It's about the company's publishing plans; clearly Paizo is not going to mind either way which subforum their threads end up in

[Psyren]

I mean official word from Paizo regarding their intentions, after the whole WOTC copyright debacle from last year. It's about the company's publishing plans; clearly Paizo is not going to mind either way which subforum their threads end up in

Oh, I misread your post then.

P2R uses its own independent open license called ORC, instead of the OGL. While WotC has plans to republish the 3.5 SRD that PF1 and PF2.0 were based on under Creative Commons like they did with the 2014 5e SRD, that hasn't happened yet (and we have no concrete idea for when it will), so Paizo was better served by not waiting / continuing to base their entire business model on the OGL's uncertain future. There are other reasons why they felt the CC didn't adequately address their concerns as well, which you can read in the "AxE" (Answers & Explanations) document in the link. Starfinder 2 will also release later this year under the ORC.

[Arutema]

Back on the topic of healing as as a sorcerer? How well does the primal list work out for the task? Thinking of putting together a fey bloodline sorcerer with a healing bent.

[Maat Mons]

According to Archive of Nethys, the following spells are tagged as “Healing:” Breath of Life, Cauterize Wounds, Cloak of Light, Devour Life, Field of Life, Gentle Breeze, Heal, Healing Well, Life Pact, Martyr's Intervention, Moment of Renewal, Neutralize Poison, Positive Attunement, Raise Dead, Ravening Maw, Regenerate, Remove Curse, Remove Disease, Remove Paralysis, Restoration, Restore Senses, Revival, Shock to the System, Soothe, Soothing Spring, Soulshelter Vessel, Spirit Link, Stabilize, Summon Healing Servitor, Vital Beacon

Of those, the following are on the Primal spell list: Cauterize Wounds, Cloak of Light, Field of Life, Gentle Breeze, Heal, Healing Well, Life Pact, Martyr's Intervention, Moment of Renewal, Neutralize Poison, Positive Attunement, Ravening Maw, Regenerate, Remove Disease, Remove Paralysis, Restoration, Restore Senses, Shock to the System, Soothing Spring, Soulshelter Vessel, Stabilize, Summon Healing Servitor, Vital Beacon

And the following are not on the primal spell list: Breath of Life, Devour Life, Raise Dead, Remove Curse, Revival, Soothe, Spirit Link