Evaluate this character

[Mr. Friendly]

So, our party just got almost wiped out and my character needs to be replaced. We are 20th level and only our Bard survived the encounter. The rest of party is coming back as:

• Warblade-ish character, not sure of race and specific classes.
• Sorcerer/Wizard/Ultimate Magus, human I think
• Rogue/Exemplar

So they want me to come back as a cleric. Normally I would make some super-optmized cleric/healbot so I could back up my party in this high-powered and lethal game, but I have really wanted to play this character concept for a while...

Race: Orc
Class: Cloistered Cleric

Now, we have to build our characters with a 32 point buy, so here is what I am using for stats:

STR 18 (+4 from Orc) = 22
DEX 8
CON 8
INT 18 (-2 from Orc) = 16
WIS 8
CHA 8 (-2 from Orc) = 6

The basic idea is that he is Ted was taken in as an infant by a monastic order of priests, dedicated to Pelor. He studied constantly and because so many of the priests were weak from their years of studies, he worked constantly moving boxes and crates. Unfortunately, working all day and studying all night meant little sleeping, which has left his health in poor condition. He's also not very coordinated. His poor eyesight and hours indoors left him in a bad way. Then the BBEG of our campiagn attacked the monastary and killed everyone. Except the head of the order and my character. Who will now join the PCs and try to stop this evil menace! Which is what the head of the order has ordered him to do, conveniently enough.

Name: William Jacob Henderson (but everyone calls him Ted for no reason)
HP: (we get half/lvl) 43
AC: 15
Domains: Sun, Healing, Knowledge
Class: Cloistered Cleric 20
Feats: Skill Focus: Profession (Laborer) (1st), Sacred Vow (3rd), Vow of Obediance (6th), Vow of Non-Violence (9th), Vow of Peace (12th), Vow of Purity (15th), Skill Focus: Diplomacy (18th)

Now, I don't want to "gimp" myself here, so I am putting all of my extra statpoints into charisma, so I can be a really effective backup diplomat, in case the Bard ever dies. It also helps my Vow of Peace, bringing the DC for the Calm Emotions effect to 24. Of course the BBEG and all his minions are undead, but it's the principle that is important here. Plus, it's not like my character would know that.

A little more background on the Order he belongs to and equipment:
Now, Ted saved all his money from his entire life and had amassed a small fortune, due to smart investments. Luckily the BBEG didn't get it either. He was going to use it to buy gear, but the Head of the Order demanded he hand it all over to rebuild the monastary, to which my character naturally had to obey. It's kind of like getting a free Vow of Poverty, but without the complicated and convoluted "bonuses". I'm also getting a free Vow of Silence, which isn't really a feat, but my character will not speak. I would take Silent Spell, but I can't cast anyway. Besides taking it would be too munchkinish.

Skills: This part was tough, since I had a lot to choose from.

Diplomacy: 23
Decipher Script: 23
Profession (Laborer): 23
Knowledge (Religion): 23
Knowledge (The Planes): 23
Knowledge (Arcana): 23
Knowledge (Local): 23
Knowledge (History): 23
Knowledge (Geography): 23

Pretty cool character, huh?

What do you think?

This post is intended for entertainment purposes only. If you laughed, good.

[NEO|Phyte]

Full orcs get a Wis penalty.

Looks pretty decent, aside from that.

[Telonius]

Well, other than not actually being able to cast any spells, not bad. Switch the Wis and Int scores, Clerics (even cloistered ones) use Wis as their casting stat. The problem with your character is that he's at least marginally useful - he might know something and write it down. If you switch over to Wis, he'll be much less likely to know anything (lack of skills). The high wisdom will allow him some will saves, true; but without his Holy Symbol he'll still be nerfed.

Another problem is that he's still capable of doing something - hauling things for the rest of the party. You need to make that Str bonus go away somehow.

[AKA_Bait]

Well, other than not actually being able to cast any spells, not bad. Switch the Wis and Int scores, Clerics (even cloistered ones) use Wis as their casting stat.

All the skills will need fixing as a result also.

[Emperor Demonking]

I'm sorry to say that build is rubbish. It's like the herb maker but not a joke. Go back to the drawing board.

[Solo]

What's the point of being a Cloistered Cleric if you can't cast any spells again?

[Adumbration]

Let me get this straight:

This is an orcish high-strength high-int cleric, who can't fight, speak and can't cast spells. With high Knowledge skills that aren't worth a thing, because he can't speak them to his allies. Plus crappy AC. Plus high ranks in Diplomacy, which he can't use because he can't speak. Plus no equipment.

You have also mentioned that this is high-powered and lethal campaign.

Am I missing something or is this character extremely weak? Granted, the fluff is decent enough, but even roleplaying that sucks, since you can't speak.

EDIT: Playing this character is like shooting yourself in the leg with a shotgun. Repeatedly. No offence, but... Yeah.

[Telonius]

This post is intended for entertainment purposes only. If you laughed, good.

[Adumbration]

No, I didn't laugh. Not until I read the blank text.

[Frosty]

I wasn't sure it was a joke until I saw the skill-selection, then I knew that it had to be.

[Severedevil]

Cute, but a strawman character doesn't make your point very well... particularly when there's no actual justification for his stats, or the claim that he's a cloistered cleric rather than an expert or commoner. The character you've drawn up here isn't crunched even remotely to his fluff, making it rather poor roleplaying... why is he twentieth level again? Moving crates? He should be a first level commoner or expert. Or maybe a dual-classed commoner/expert.

[Emperor Demonking]

Cute, but a strawman character doesn't make your point very well... particularly when there's no actual justification for his stats, or the claim that he's a cloistered cleric rather than an expert or commoner. The character you've drawn up here isn't crunched even remotely to his fluff, making it rather poor roleplaying... why is he twentieth level again? Moving crates? He should be a first level commoner or expert. Or maybe a dual-classed commoner/expert.

.

Are you sure its a strawman rather than a simple joke.

[Mr. Friendly]

Cute, but a strawman character doesn't make your point very well... particularly when there's no actual justification for his stats, or the claim that he's a cloistered cleric rather than an expert or commoner. The character you've drawn up here isn't crunched even remotely to his fluff, making it rather poor roleplaying... why is he twentieth level again? Moving crates? He should be a first level commoner or expert. Or maybe a dual-classed commoner/expert.

But if the monastary was inhabited only by cloistered clerics and he was a baby, he would have no possible way of knowing that any other classes existed, at least not without using OOC knowledge. He's 20th level because that is the level of the campaign. Doesn't the DM determine things like the starting level of your characters?

[tyckspoon]

If you're actually serious about this, you have to be aware that he's going to get killed. Killed so very hard. You could increase his survivability (erase a few of the Cloistered Cleric levels and go into the Apostle of Peace or whatever that Super Pacifism PrC is), but that won't change the fact that he's almost entirely useless as an adventurer. I would say go for it if you were starting at a much lower level (preferably 0, so you could take Wizard levels instead..), but putting Ted into a 20th level party is cruel to the rest of the party who are expecting some kind of useful help.

[Draz74]

But if the monastary was inhabited only by cloistered clerics and he was a baby, he would have no possible way of knowing that any other classes existed, at least not without using OOC knowledge.

Show me where the rules say that you can't take a class without knowing it exists.

I'd totally let characters take most classes -- especially Commoner, Warrior, Rogue -- without having to know such a class exists.

In fact, depending on the setting, most characters may not know that most classes (including their own) exist. In a setting without a Fighter College, is there anything fluff-wise that separates a low-level Fighter from a Fighter/Barbarian from a high-level Warrior? I think they'd all be the same, as far as in-character knowledge is concerned. They'd just be "non-magic people who are real good at fighting."

[CASTLEMIKE]

No unless this monastary is on an isolated demi-plane it seems like an awful lot of work to make a marginal suboptimized character who should also "know" NPCs, All the core classes Clerics, Fighters, Druids, Monks, Wizards and the intelligence based "Spellcaster" variant also exists (since he is aware that cloistered clerics exist same rule source for the class) from interaction over the years since Cloistered Clerics are the equivalent to a community of spellcasting sages who will routinely interact with other classes who consult them as a knowledge resource. Consider playing an intelligence based spellcaster who can cast arcane and divine spells with a D4 for hit points, has ASF, 2 base skill points a level and minimal skills to choose from.

[Tengu]

Starting with 22 strength? This character is an extremely cheesy munchkin whose stats have little to do with his actual backstory, and are made solely to be as powergamery as possible. You should be ashamed.





And so should you, if you've read this post seriously.

[Xefas]

Hilariously enough, I used a strikingly similar characters as an NPC in one campaign. The PCs kept insisting that if what they were doing as so important, that the organization they were working for would hand over some really high level guy to help them.

So, I gave them a Half-Dragon Half-Ogre with a spellcasting class, too small a stat to actually cast spells, insanely high strength that was negated by a Vow of Nonviolence and Vow of Peace, and who only spoke or could understand a language that none of the PCs had access to.

He was something like 5 or 6 levels higher than the PCs, but ended up only being useful as the luggage carrier. He would also occasionally grapple a party member if they were being overly violent.