OOTS #1299 - The Discussion Thread

[brian 333]

Potato salad should be served cold in a bowl of hot gumbo.

[KorvinStarmast]

I have never said that I liked potato salad. As I mentioned, I dislike stuff with mayo in it.

But I have never heard of warm potato salad. My family always insisted on cooled or at least room temperature.

I need to PM the recipe to you. It has no mayo. I need to go and find that 3"x5" card it is on.

[Doug Lampert]

I wonder what the owlbear wanted to ask.

How many licks does it take to get to the chewy elven center of a Vaarsuvious pop?

Fortunately, he was able to find the answer to that one on his own prior to his lamentable death.


Late, but I can't didn't resist.

[Quizatzhaderac]

I am not an expert but I may be wrong. But I suppose my impression is that if an Englishperson or American were to experience the typical diet of the other for a week or so, they would be familiar with most dishes. The majority of foods would be things they eat at home (including things like apple pie and fried chicken, which have migrated in each direction).

Having actually done this (lived in England for 2 1/2 years), it was a huge culture shock for me.

If I had to describe it as a big thing, I'd say its a philosophical difference; but probably a full picture requires understanding the many small differences, and
and frequencies of things, and how "normal" things are considered.

Let's consider the dish spaghetti and meatballs. Tomatoes are Peruvian, wheat is middle eastern, pasta Chinese, cows are from somewhere in the Eurasian steppe, and the whole combination in recognizable from is from Italy. But the key question is, is it an utterly normal dish in America? Yes; it's older than living memory; it's widely made; it's available at regular grocery stores (without even going into the ethnic isle), and it's assumed that generally people like it. If someone doesn't want it, that raises the questions: "are they vegetarian?", "do they have an allergy?" "What part of it you don't like? The cards, the acidity?"

Contrast that to Pad Thai, which is available in every city in the U.S., but hasn't yet been accepted as a "normal" food yet. Very few people would cook it for themselves. It's not weird to just not like Thai food, to never have had it, and to have no interest, and an unwillingness to try it.

English curries, and BBQ, and interesting seasonal and local dishes absolutely exist. I haven't checked in decades, so they might not be uncommon, in a statistical sense, but they aren't "normal". Those aren't going to show up at a restaurant without a theme. It's more acceptable to just boil everything or use no seasoning except salt.

[halfeye]

Having actually done this (lived in England for 2 1/2 years), it was a huge culture shock for me.

If I had to describe it as a big thing, I'd say its a philosophical difference; but probably a full picture requires understanding the many small differences, and
and frequencies of things, and how "normal" things are considered.

Let's consider the dish spaghetti and meatballs. Tomatoes are Peruvian, wheat is middle eastern, pasta Chinese, cows are from somewhere in the Eurasian steppe, and the whole combination in recognizable from is from Italy. But the key question is, is it an utterly normal dish in America? Yes; it's older than living memory; it's widely made; it's available at regular grocery stores (without even going into the ethnic isle), and it's assumed that generally people like it. If someone doesn't want it, that raises the questions: "are they vegetarian?", "do they have an allergy?" "What part of it you don't like? The cards, the acidity?"

Contrast that to Pad Thai, which is available in every city in the U.S., but hasn't yet been accepted as a "normal" food yet. Very few people would cook it for themselves. It's not weird to just not like Thai food, to never have had it, and to have no interest, and an unwillingness to try it.

English curries, and BBQ, and interesting seasonal and local dishes absolutely exist. I haven't checked in decades, so they might not be uncommon, in a statistical sense, but they aren't "normal". Those aren't going to show up at a restaurant without a theme. It's more acceptable to just boil everything or use no seasoning except salt.

This is hysterical (in a bad way) and untrue.

[brian 333]

This is hysterical (in a bad way) and untrue.

What do you really think? Give us a bone to gnaw on.

[Mordar]

It's more acceptable to just boil everything or use no seasoning except salt.

This is hysterical (in a bad way) and untrue.

I don't know...the last three English meals I had were boiled and without much beyond salt. The guy was a little stringy and would have been better marinated then grilled. The woman was fine, I guess, but uninspired. Would definitely have benefitted from some curry treatment. The baby, though, was perfect boiled, exactly 6 minutes so firm but still gooey inside.

...hrm, maybe not what people mean when they say English cuisine?

- M

[bunsen_h]

The baby, though, was perfect boiled, exactly 6 minutes so firm but still gooey inside.

"[...] Don't have a cookout with Baby: he's so small, he'll only serve six.
The steaks that you get will be paltry, he's hardly got ribs or drumsticks..."

"[...] She cut her baby brother in two
And served him up as an Irish stew..."

[KorvinStarmast]

"[...] Don't have a cookout with Baby: he's so small, he'll only serve six.
The steaks that you get will be paltry, he's hardly got ribs or drumsticks..."

"[...] She cut her baby brother in two
And served him up as an Irish stew..."

I've known the second one for about 50 years, but the first is a gem that I'd missed. Thank you!

[bunsen_h]

I've known the second one for about 50 years, but the first is a gem that I'd missed. Thank you!

You're welcome. I was a bit hesitant about posting such a grotesque and tangentially-related link. It's a fun little ditty to sing in a group of intelligent punsters who are able to come up with their own new verses. The version that I've got in my songbook has references to Thatcher and Reagan, which suggests its age -- the web page that I linked to dates it to 1984.

[jdb-44]

Famous last words?

I did have a question whether or not Bloodfeast chomping on Calder's neck would prevent the dragon's fire-breathing ability from functioning.

The only RPG's I've ever played were Wizardry I (PC), Legends (TI-99/4a), Tunnels of Doom (TI-99/4a), and Kingdom of Loathing (online), so I'm not very good with D&D mechanics.

Upvoted for Wizardry I reference!

Where a monster's breath attack did half of the monster's remaining HP in damage.

Nothing like getting surprised by a bunch of Poison Giants!

POISON GIANT BREATHES!

VELIAN TAKES 40 DAMAGE
DROGLIN TAKES 40 DAMAGE
TRAELONE TAKES 40 DAMAGE
KHOOMI TAKES 40 DAMAGE
LYSTYK TAKES 40 DAMAGE
KWAI CHANG CAINE TAKES 20 DAMAGE

[KorvinStarmast]

Upvoted for Wizardry I reference!

Where a monster's breath attack did half of the monster's remaining HP in damage.

Nothing like getting surprised by a bunch of Poison Giants!

POISON GIANT BREATHES!

VELIAN TAKES 40 DAMAGE
DROGLIN TAKES 40 DAMAGE
TRAELONE TAKES 40 DAMAGE
KHOOMI TAKES 40 DAMAGE
LYSTYK TAKES 40 DAMAGE
KWAI CHANG CAINE TAKES 20 DAMAGE

And they all took about 10 Sonic Damage thanks to the shouting.

[Kardwill]

Upvoted for Wizardry I reference!

Where a monster's breath attack did half of the monster's remaining HP in damage.

Nothing like getting surprised by a bunch of Poison Giants!

POISON GIANT BREATHES!

VELIAN TAKES 40 DAMAGE
DROGLIN TAKES 40 DAMAGE
TRAELONE TAKES 40 DAMAGE
KHOOMI TAKES 40 DAMAGE
LYSTYK TAKES 40 DAMAGE
KWAI CHANG CAINE TAKES 20 DAMAGE

My bane were the "small objects/creeping coins". IIRC, they had 1HP, they came in several big groups (usually 20+), they resisted most low-level magic, every one of them used a breath attack that did nearly no damage, and they had other groups that joined them as reinforcement if they survived the round.

So it was

"Small object 1/7 calls for reinforcement!

20 Small objects appear!

Small object 2/27 breathes!

Character 1 takes 1 damage
Character 2 takes 0 damage
Character 3 takes 0 damage
Character 4 takes 1 damage
Character 5 takes 0 damage
Character 6 takes 0 damage

Small object 2/27 breathes!

Character 1 takes 0 damage

[...]

Small object 27/27 breathes!

Character 1 takes 1 damage
Character 2 takes 1 damage
Character 3 takes 0 damage
Character 4 takes 1 damage
Character 5 takes 0 damage
Character 6 takes 1 damage"

Every.
Single.
Turn.

Those things were totally harmless for a mid-to-high level group, but so tedious that they were "Tiltowait Bait". As soon as I got the initiative back, I used the single most powerful direct damage spell in the entire game (Tiltowait, the "atomic explosion that does 100 damage to every monster of every group in the room" spell) against a bunch of 1HP monster just to be sure to wipe out every single creature of every single group before the survivors could summon 18 more ^^

[KorvinStarmast]

Those things were totally harmless for a mid-to-high level group, but so tedious that they were "Tiltowait Bait". As soon as I got the initiative back, I used the single most powerful direct damage spell in the entire game (Tiltowait, the "atomic explosion that does 100 damage to every monster of every group in the room" spell) against a bunch of 1HP monster just to be sure to wipe out every single creature of every single group before the survivors could summon 18 more ^^

Nuke it from orbit in the room, just to be sure. Were you wearing the lead plate armor as self protection?

[Precure]

"British foods are bad" is a US idea exported into the world as part of american cultural expansion, like all those french jokes.

[brian 333]

"British foods are bad" is a US idea exported into the world as part of american cultural expansion, like all those french jokes.

Wait, hold on just a minute here...

There are French Jokes? How hard are they to translate into English?

Emil and Jaques took the Chunnel to England for dinner.
"Why do you do this," Jaques asked. "Does it give you a greater appreciation for the fine wines and gourmet cooking at home?"
"Non, mon Ami," Emil replied. "I come to eat in England because I am a masochist, and I find that eating English cuisine is far more brutal than flogging myself."

[KorvinStarmast]

Wait, hold on just a minute here...

There are French Jokes? How hard are they to translate into English?

Emil and Jaques took the Chunnel to England for dinner.
"Why do you do this," Jaques asked. "Does it give you a greater appreciation for the fine wines and gourmet cooking at home?"
"Non, mon Ami," Emil replied. "I come to eat in England because I am a masochist, and I find that eating English cuisine is far more brutal than flogging myself."

Flagellants, Fromage, and Frites: it's Guy Fieri's now series on the Food Network.

[Tzardok]

"British foods are bad" is a US idea exported into the world as part of american cultural expansion, like all those french jokes.

I disagree. Dunking on the French is time-honed European tradition. France was in different times at war with England (especially England; see Hundred Years War), Spain, Germany, Italy and others (not that it differs from other nations in that regard), and making fun of your "ancestral" enemies is just normal.

And if I had to guess who's responsible for "British food is bad", I'd blame... the French. French Cuisine exists since the 17th century and was already back then held up as the best cooking style by European nobles. So the French had all reason to look down on other's cooking. And who would they look down on the most? Their ancestral enemy at the time: the English (see also Hundred Years War)!

[danielxcutter]

I may have missed it being mentioned earlier but I believe a lot of the current negative aspects about British cuisine came around largely due to the Industrial Age and WWII.

[Peelee]

Because if you just want me to keep clarifying what I have already said (pretty clearly IMO), then I'm not too interested.

You claimed it was US specific complaint, then acted like you hadn't, then reaffirmed that you had. I don't know what words i would use to describe your posts, but i do know i absolutely would not use "clear".

"British foods are bad" is a US idea exported into the world as part of american cultural expansion, like all those french jokes.

Wrong.

Flagellants, Fromage, and Frites: it's Guy Fieri's now series on the Food Network.

I'd watch it!

[KorvinStarmast]

I'd watch it!

FWIW, San Antonio's "The Jerk Shack" got a visit from Guy.

[Ruck]

This great little diner in Houston I used to live nearby did too. Best burgers in the city.

[Peelee]

This great little diner in Houston I used to live nearby did too. Best burgers in the city.

Do they cook to order? I live right by a place that is willing to do rare burgers. Only two kinds of owners would allow that, ones who know everything about their meat they deal with and ones who won't be in business long. This place has been in business longer than I've lived here.

Ain't nothing like a rare burger.

[Ruck]

Do they cook to order? I live right by a place that is willing to do rare burgers. Only two kinds of owners would allow that, ones who know everything about their meat they deal with and ones who won't be in business long. This place has been in business longer than I've lived here.

Ain't nothing like a rare burger.

I think so. It's not a very big establishment, although I think it's been around since 1920 or so.

No worries about contamination with a rare burger?

[Peelee]

I think so. It's not a very big establishment, although I think it's been around since 1920 or so.

No worries about contamination with a rare burger?

There's ways to mitigate that and reduce the risk to acceptable levels. It's still on the restaurant to take on the risk, of course, which is why most won't do it, and which leaves the two aforementioned categories of restaurants that will.

Also, i traveled through Texas the other week. By far the most inhospitable state on the entire trip. We got w lot of laughs out of it, at least. And nowhere near Houston.

[brian 333]

There's ways to mitigate that and reduce the risk to acceptable levels. It's still on the restaurant to take on the risk, of course, which is why most won't do it, and which leaves the two aforementioned categories of restaurants that will.

Also, i traveled through Texas the other week. By far the most inhospitable state on the entire trip. We got w lot of laughs out of it, at least. And nowhere near Houston.

Huh.

I never have had hospitality issues in Texas. Maybe you experienced 'large highway syndrome', where everyone is on the road or serving those on the road, and being cooped up in a car with loved ones for extended periods of time makes many folks grumpy.

I have spent quite a bit of time in Texas and many other places, and have very few stories of inhospitality from the locals.

Iowa: six Louisiana boys at dinner is a party in Iowa. Apparently, an obnoxiously loud party, as nobody in that restaurant spoke except to order. We got dirty looks, until tip-time, at least.

Wyoming: Louisiana boys can't drive in the ice, and the Wyoming folks let us know!

Florida: "Why the heck are you putting pickled peppers on my roast beef sandwich?" is not an appropriate question. Plus, they do judge you if you ask for gravy.

Bar fights don't count, do they? I don't remember most of those anyway.

[Peelee]

Huh.

I never have had hospitality issues in Texas. Maybe you experienced 'large highway syndrome', where everyone is on the road or serving those on the road, and being cooped up in a car with loved ones for extended periods of time makes many folks grumpy.

I have spent quite a bit of time in Texas and many other places, and have very few stories of inhospitality from the locals.

From the locals? Oh my, no. It was the signs, my friend. The signs!

We drive in from New Mexico (which really is a land of enchantment, just gorgeous landscapes. Unlike Arizona, which had nothing. Glad they got the Grand Canyon because they got shafted otherwise). Going across the top hat, so not much time spent in the state. We get in, and the very first billboard has, in enormous letters, "Welcome to Texas. YOU'RE NOW A FELON". Yeah, i realize it was about edibles vis a vis NM, but still, that's a hell of a welcome. Next sign, a couple minutes in, was for the Texas Welcome Center. 173 miles. Fun fact, I-40 through Texas is only 177 miles. The welcome center was on the way out! Welcome to Texas, now leave! But that's nothing compared to the homegrown business. Buc-ee's famously ha billboards far from rhe actual location. We're in Texas, home of Buc-ee's! How far could it possible be? The billboard helpfully told us. A hundred miles? Two hundred? Four? Oh my sweet idealistic reader, the billboard simply read "Buc-ee's 1,092 miles". ELEVEN HUNDRED MILES! We actually saw it the next night, going from the southwest corner to the northeast corner, the worst possible way to cross the state. Not only was thus Buc-ee's in Tennessee, it was on the farthest corner of Tennessee it could have been! Texas not only said "if you want our gas station, go to Tennessee", they also engineered it so there was a damned mountain range between us and Texas! How petty can you be?

But, like i said, it was good for a lot of laughs. And also, i kind of loved that drive, because the vast, vast majority of it was just massive windfarms, as far as the eye could see. Even farther, really. Disappearing into the fog miles off. Really neat visual. And most importantly, always remember: welcome to Texas, you're now a felon.

[Ruck]

There's ways to mitigate that and reduce the risk to acceptable levels. It's still on the restaurant to take on the risk, of course, which is why most won't do it, and which leaves the two aforementioned categories of restaurants that will.

Also, i traveled through Texas the other week. By far the most inhospitable state on the entire trip. We got w lot of laughs out of it, at least. And nowhere near Houston.

If you got nowhere near Houston, then I'm not surprised it was inhospitable, because that means you didn't get to the... well, I don't want to say civilized parts, but the four* biggest cities with the most going on are all about 3-4 hours apart, tops.

(* - five, if you want to count Dallas and Fort Worth separately.)

[danielxcutter]

From the locals? Oh my, no. It was the signs, my friend. The signs!

We drive in from New Mexico (which really is a land of enchantment, just gorgeous landscapes. Unlike Arizona, which had nothing. Glad they got the Grand Canyon because they got shafted otherwise). Going across the top hat, so not much time spent in the state. We get in, and the very first billboard has, in enormous letters, "Welcome to Texas. YOU'RE NOW A FELON". Yeah, i realize it was about edibles vis a vis NM, but still, that's a hell of a welcome. Next sign, a couple minutes in, was for the Texas Welcome Center. 173 miles. Fun fact, I-40 through Texas is only 177 miles. The welcome center was on the way out! Welcome to Texas, now leave! But that's nothing compared to the homegrown business. Buc-ee's famously ha billboards far from rhe actual location. We're in Texas, home of Buc-ee's! How far could it possible be? The billboard helpfully told us. A hundred miles? Two hundred? Four? Oh my sweet idealistic reader, the billboard simply read "Buc-ee's 1,092 miles". ELEVEN HUNDRED MILES! We actually saw it the next night, going from the southwest corner to the northeast corner, the worst possible way to cross the state. Not only was thus Buc-ee's in Tennessee, it was on the farthest corner of Tennessee it could have been! Texas not only said "if you want our gas station, go to Tennessee", they also engineered it so there was a damned mountain range between us and Texas! How petty can you be?

But, like i said, it was good for a lot of laughs. And also, i kind of loved that drive, because the vast, vast majority of it was just massive windfarms, as far as the eye could see. Even farther, really. Disappearing into the fog miles off. Really neat visual. And most importantly, always remember: welcome to Texas, you're now a felon.

Whoever does those billboards either has an underdeveloped sense of humor or an overactive one.

[KorvinStarmast]

In the central and eastern parts of the state, the usual Buc-ee's signage seems to start about 60 miles out. They have some of the finest rest stop restrooms in the state, in a close race with a place on US HWY 59: Prasek's near El Campo. (Their home made sausage is a must-have purchase when we travel to and from Houston to visit various family in that area).