New OOTS products from CafePress
New OOTS t-shirts, ornaments, mugs, bags, and more
Page 45 of 48 FirstFirst ... 203536373839404142434445464748 LastLast
Results 1,321 to 1,350 of 1415
  1. - Top - End - #1321
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Batcathat's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2019

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Just because there's more planets doesn't mean it's more likely.
    Again, why not? You have given plenty of good reasons why interplanetary life is very (and yes, that should really be "very" to the power of some very high number) unlikely, but none that I've seen for why the size of the universe would make it less likely. Me finding a guy named Bartholomew who plays golf and likes wearing two socks of different color is very unlikely (if admittedly in a more mundane sort of way than interplanetary life) but for every city I add to my list of places to search, I'm more likely to find him, not less. Now, is it possible that he doesn't exist at all? Sure, but searching the entire world makes it more likely that I find one of him than just searching my home town.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Other life in the universe? Sure. Other interplanetary life? Probably not. And definitely not "certain".
    I agree with the first conclusion and the last. Not sure about the middle one. Yes, an interplanetary civilization has to win a lot of lotteries, but the number of tickets might be high enough to make even that one sort of likely.

  2. - Top - End - #1322
    Dragon in the Playground Moderator
     
    Peelee's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Birmingham, AL
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Quote Originally Posted by Batcathat View Post
    Again, why not? You have given plenty of good reasons why interplanetary life is very (and yes, that should really be "very" to the power of some very high number) unlikely, but none that I've seen for why the size of the universe would make it less likely. Me finding a guy named Bartholomew who plays golf and likes wearing two socks of different color is very unlikely (if admittedly in a more mundane sort of way than interplanetary life) but for every city I add to my list of places to search, I'm more likely to find him, not less. Now, is it possible that he doesn't exist at all? Sure, but searching the entire world makes it more likely that I find one of him than just searching my home town.
    Because, again, two planets that meet specific criteria is significantly more complex than one planet that meets specific criteria. Finding a guy named Bartholomew who plays golf and likes wearing two socks of different color is very unlikely, yes, and searching more cities makes it more likely you'll succeed. However, finding a guy named Bartholomew who plays golf and likes wearing two socks of different color who also has a sister who likes wearing two shoes of different brand lowers the odds much more than adding another city raises them. Take us, for example. If we ever actually become an interplanetary species, it's pretty much a given (based on current knowledge) that Mars will be where we go to. The problem is Mars kinda sucks for the alternate site. The colony will be entirely reliant on Earth for it's continued existence, even if we manage to somehow make it a permanent settlement. And even Mars being that is us winning yet another lottery on top of all the other lotteries we've already won. Every other planet and moon in thd solar system is not only worse but is so bad that Mars is effectively our only shot, and even if another planet or moon waz better it would be exponentially harder by being much further out - yet another of the lotteries we won is it's proximity to us (metaphorically, you now need Bartholomew and his sister to have bought houses next to each other as well).

    Any additional planet makes the likelihood of meeting the lowest possible criteria a single planet needs to meet more likely, yes. But we need the lowest possible criteria for two planets, and that's actually wonderfully analogous with buying another lottery ticket but a seventh ball was added in. Yes, getting another ticket technically raised your chances, but the seventh ball drastically lowered them far beyond any advantage the second ticket got you.

    Hence, extraterrestrial life (one planet)? Sure, probably. interstellar extraterrestrial life (minimum of two planets)? Probably not. Exponentially less likely for that reason alone, ignoring that the minimum required conditions on the first are also much higher.
    Last edited by Peelee; 2024-07-08 at 10:38 AM.
    Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.

  3. - Top - End - #1323
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Batcathat's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2019

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Any additional planet makes the likelihood of meeting the lowest possible criteria a single planet needs to meet more likely, yes. But we need the lowest possible criteria for two planets, and that's actually wonderfully analogous with buying another lottery ticket but a seventh ball was added in. Yes, getting another ticket technically raised your chances, but the seventh ball drastically lowered them far beyond any advantage the second ticket got you.

    Hence, extraterrestrial life (one planet)? Sure, probably. interstellar extraterrestrial life (minimum of two planets)? Probably not. Exponentially less likely for that reason alone, ignoring that the minimum required conditions on the first are also much higher.
    Again, I'm not disputing that interplanetary life is a lot less likely than extraterrestrial life in general. I'm disagreeing with the assumption that more planetary systems somehow makes it less likely to find one.

    Though I think I might see where the misunderstanding lies. I'm not saying (and I don't think anyone else is either) that interplanetary civilizations living on more planets somehow makes them more likely, just that finding such civilizations is more likely the more planetary systems we include in the search.

  4. - Top - End - #1324
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Anonymouswizard's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    In my library

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    If I'm very lucky I might have a new boyfriend soon. He is very cute and an utter sweetie.

    He is also not [insert person here], sorry shippers.
    Snazzy avatar (now back! ) by Honest Tiefling.

    RIP Laser-Snail, may you live on in our hearts forever.

    Spoiler: playground quotes
    Show
    Quote Originally Posted by Zelphas View Post
    So here I am, trapped in my laboratory, trying to create a Mechabeast that's powerful enough to take down the howling horde outside my door, but also won't join them once it realizes what I've done...twentieth time's the charm, right?
    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Raziere View Post
    How about a Jovian Uplift stuck in a Case morph? it makes so little sense.

  5. - Top - End - #1325
    Dragon in the Playground Moderator
     
    Peelee's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Birmingham, AL
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Quote Originally Posted by Batcathat View Post
    Again, I'm not disputing that interplanetary life is a lot less likely than extraterrestrial life in general. I'm disagreeing with the assumption that more planetary systems somehow makes it less likely to find one.
    Imean, the bmBathrolemew's sister was the simplest i cook make it. Barty is a planet, the different colored socks and golf were the conditions needed to have life. His sister is another planet for the life to go to (to be interplanetary), and being a sister and the shoes are the requirements for that planet to be suitable for the life to go to. Each person existing exactly in that form isn't that unlikely. Both people existing exactly in that form with the specific relationship to each other is. It is, by necessity, a much more complex and unlikely event.

    Actually, i think i can make it simpler. There's a bag with numbered balls. Going from one to five. You need to pull out a ball numbered 1, then a ball numbered 2, then a ball numbered 3, in that specific order. Adding more balls does increase the number of balls that are numbered 1, 2, and 3, but it decreases your likelihood of success, because now in addition to drawing balls in the wrong order, you can also draw multiples of the same ball.

    I'm not going to do the actual math on that example, it's already radically simplified and not the best analogy, but hopefully it demonstrates the point well enough.
    Quote Originally Posted by Batcathat View Post
    Though I think I might see where the misunderstanding lies. I'm not saying (and I don't think anyone else is either) that interplanetary civilizations living on more planets somehow makes them more likely, just that finding such civilizations is more likely the more planetary systems we include in the search.
    I am understanding you just fine. I'm simply disagreeing because fhe complexity of the relationship is more than "more planet = more likelihood".
    Quote Originally Posted by Anonymouswizard View Post
    If I'm very lucky I might have a new boyfriend soon. He is very cute and an utter sweetie
    HUZZAH!
    Quote Originally Posted by Anonymouswizard View Post
    He is also not [insert person here], sorry shippers.
    Oh, i don't send anything through Royal Mail.
    Last edited by Peelee; 2024-07-08 at 11:28 AM.
    Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.

  6. - Top - End - #1326
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Batcathat's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2019

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Imean, the bmBathrolemew's sister was the simplest i cook make it. Barty is a planet, the different colored socks and golf were the conditions needed to have life. His sister is another planet for the life to go to (to be interplanetary), and being a sister and the shoes are the requirements for that planet to be suitable for the life to go to. Each person existing exactly in that form isn't that unlikely. Both people existing exactly in that form with the specific relationship to each other is. It is, by necessity, a much more complex and unlikely event.
    Again, I'm not disagreeing with that part, just not seeing why an unlikely even would be even more unlikely if there were more potential places for it to happen. However small the chance of any given planetary system to produce the basic requirements for two planets that could sustain intelligent life, I can't see why adding more planetary systems to the mix would make it less likely for it to happen.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Actually, i think i can make it simpler. There's a bag with numbered balls. Going from one to five. You need to pull out a ball numbered 1, then a ball numbered 2, then a ball numbered 3, in that specific order. Adding more balls does increase the number of balls that are numbered 1, 2, and 3, but it decreases your likelihood of success, because now in addition to drawing balls in the wrong order, you can also draw multiples of the same ball.
    Sure, and if what we wanted to do was to find a planetary system with an interplanetary civilization on our first try, you would be absolutely correct, more options means we're less likely to find it on our first try. But if the question is whether or not one (or more) exists at all, then increasing the number of balls we get to pull out makes it more likely to eventually get the right combination.

    EDIT: Also, wouldn't it be more correct to have each new planetary system be a new bag of balls rather than adding to the same one?
    Last edited by Batcathat; 2024-07-08 at 11:46 AM.

  7. - Top - End - #1327
    Dragon in the Playground Moderator
     
    Peelee's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Birmingham, AL
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Quote Originally Posted by Batcathat View Post
    Again, I'm not disagreeing with that part, just not seeing why an unlikely even would be even more unlikely if there were more potential places for it to happen. However small the chance of any given planetary system to produce the basic requirements for two planets that could sustain intelligent life, I can't see why adding more planetary systems to the mix would make it less likely for it to happen.



    Sure, and if what we wanted to do was to find a planetary system with an interplanetary civilization on our first try, you would be absolutely correct, more options means we're less likely to find it on our first try. But if the question is whether or not one (or more) exists at all, then increasing the number of balls we get to pull out makes it more likely to eventually get the right combination.

    EDIT: Also, wouldn't it be more correct to have each new planetary system be a new bag of balls rather than adding to the same one?
    Ok, let me try one final time.

    Life is rare. Million balls, one or two are gold. Life needs to start on that rare gold ball. Another million balls, another one or two gold. More gold balls means more chance to find life.

    However, to be interplanetary, life must go to another ball, and not just any ball can do. We aren't going to be interplanetary with Venus or Jupiter or Mercury or Neptune. They won't work. We can't with Mars,because we got lucky.

    So, second planet is silver. Not as rare as gold. Let's say ten per million, why not. Adding more balls addds proportionally more silver balls.


    However, the number of gold balls and the number of silver balls aren't something you can just say "there's more now", because, and this is the super important part which i think keeps getting neglected in your math, they need to occur simultaneously together. Adding another ~ million balls which are nor silver means it's that much harder for the Silver ball to ne next to the gold ball, even though there's more silver balls.

    The added complexity is in them occurring TOGETHER. And note how I never aid wits impossible, i said it's likely. Because, again, you're adding specificity. Today is someone's birthday. Practically guaranteed. More specific, though, today is a lady's birthday, who was born in Mexico but currently lives in Norway as a tech CEO and is named Black Betty. The pool of candidates is narrowed considerably. Sure, the population in general going up means more people, but that does not correlate with more female births in Mexico named Black Betty who get C-suite jobs in IT and move ti Scandinavia. Each detail is independent of all other details, and adding another 0 to the number increases the randomness.

    Again, this is as close to "in an infinite universe anything is possible" fallacy as I've seen without actually being that, because you're assuming a flat statistical probability. It is not.

    That's it. I am exhausted of ways to explain.
    Last edited by Peelee; 2024-07-08 at 12:07 PM.
    Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.

  8. - Top - End - #1328
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Batcathat's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2019

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    However, the number of gold balls and the number of silver balls aren't something you can just say "there's more now", because, and this is the super important part which i think keeps getting neglected in your math, they need to occur simultaneously together. Adding another ~ million balls which are nor silver means it's that much harder for the Silver ball to ne next to the gold ball, even though there's more silver balls.
    But the balls are not randomly distributed. When any given planetary system comes into existence, there's X chance there will be a gold ball, Y chance there will be a silver ball and Z chance there will be both. More importantly, planetary system A having both doesn't mean planetary system B is less likely to (granted, my understanding of how planetary systems are formed is rudimentary at best, but at the very least I've never heard of a reason why one system being capable of supporting life would make another one less likely to).

    That said, I think we've both said what we have to say on the matter (probably ten times each), so I think we can agree about letting this be the final part of it (until someone else gets involved and everything starts up again. The universe might be hard to predict, but this forum is not. )

  9. - Top - End - #1329
    Ettin in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jul 2011

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Peelee, you've made a fairly strong argument that increasing the size of the universe doesn't increase (or at least, doesn't meaningfully increase) the chance that there would, at some point, be life that starts on one and spreads to another.

    You have provided no explanation whatsoever for your claim that it decreases that chance.
    Last edited by enderlord99; 2024-07-08 at 08:35 PM.
    Spoiler: Vanity quotes
    Show
    Quote Originally Posted by Strigon View Post
    Wow.
    That took a very sudden turn for the dark.

    I salute you.
    Quote Originally Posted by AuthorGirl View Post
    I wish it was possible to upvote here.

    I use braces (also known as "curly brackets") to indicate sarcasm. If there are none present, I probably believe what I am saying; should it turn out to be inaccurate trivia, please tell me rather than trying to play along with an apparent joke I don't know I'm making.

  10. - Top - End - #1330
    Dragon in the Playground Moderator
     
    Peelee's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Birmingham, AL
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Quote Originally Posted by enderlord99 View Post
    Peelee, you've made a fairly strong argument that increasing the size of the universe doesn't increase (or at least, doesn't meaningfully increase) the chance that there would, at some point be life that starts on one and spreads to another.

    You have provided no explanation whatsoever for your claim that it decreases that chance.
    That's a fair point.
    Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.

  11. - Top - End - #1331
    Ettin in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jul 2011

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    That's a fair point.
    It was the same point BatCatHat kept making, which you've already stated was blatantly wrong, phrased differently.

    Why is it "fair" when I say it but not when they do?
    Last edited by enderlord99; 2024-07-08 at 08:35 PM.
    Spoiler: Vanity quotes
    Show
    Quote Originally Posted by Strigon View Post
    Wow.
    That took a very sudden turn for the dark.

    I salute you.
    Quote Originally Posted by AuthorGirl View Post
    I wish it was possible to upvote here.

    I use braces (also known as "curly brackets") to indicate sarcasm. If there are none present, I probably believe what I am saying; should it turn out to be inaccurate trivia, please tell me rather than trying to play along with an apparent joke I don't know I'm making.

  12. - Top - End - #1332
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Anonymouswizard's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    In my library

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    So cream flavoured ice cream is actually superior to all other flavours, even the divine rum and raisin. Anyone here who disagrees is of course free to be wrong.
    Snazzy avatar (now back! ) by Honest Tiefling.

    RIP Laser-Snail, may you live on in our hearts forever.

    Spoiler: playground quotes
    Show
    Quote Originally Posted by Zelphas View Post
    So here I am, trapped in my laboratory, trying to create a Mechabeast that's powerful enough to take down the howling horde outside my door, but also won't join them once it realizes what I've done...twentieth time's the charm, right?
    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Raziere View Post
    How about a Jovian Uplift stuck in a Case morph? it makes so little sense.

  13. - Top - End - #1333
    Dragon in the Playground Moderator
     
    Peelee's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Birmingham, AL
    Gender
    Male

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by enderlord99 View Post
    It was the same point BatCatHat kept making, which you've already stated was blatantly wrong, phrased differently.

    Why is it "fair" when I say it but not when they do?
    Because I'm no longer advancing any arguments at all on that and that was the easiest and most expedient response for me to make to you.

    As is the case here.

    Quote Originally Posted by Anonymouswizard View Post
    So cream flavoured ice cream is actually superior to all other flavours, even the divine rum and raisin. Anyone here who disagrees is of course free to be wrong.
    Cream flavored? So like, just unflavored ice cream?

    Imean, you're not wrong, I've just never heard it called that before.
    Last edited by Peelee; 2024-07-08 at 09:11 PM.
    Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.

  14. - Top - End - #1334
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Anonymouswizard's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    In my library

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Cream flavored? So like, just unflavored ice cream?

    Imean, you're not wrong, I've just never heard it called that before.
    Oh yeah, nobody else does. I'm phrasing it specifically to point out that it does have a ton of flavour that normally gets covered up.

    Like it's no great secret that sweetened cream is delicious, and I'm actually confused as to why unflavoured ice cream isn't more widely available.
    Snazzy avatar (now back! ) by Honest Tiefling.

    RIP Laser-Snail, may you live on in our hearts forever.

    Spoiler: playground quotes
    Show
    Quote Originally Posted by Zelphas View Post
    So here I am, trapped in my laboratory, trying to create a Mechabeast that's powerful enough to take down the howling horde outside my door, but also won't join them once it realizes what I've done...twentieth time's the charm, right?
    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Raziere View Post
    How about a Jovian Uplift stuck in a Case morph? it makes so little sense.

  15. - Top - End - #1335
    Dragon in the Playground Moderator
     
    Peelee's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Birmingham, AL
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Quote Originally Posted by Anonymouswizard View Post
    Oh yeah, nobody else does. I'm phrasing it specifically to point out that it does have a ton of flavour that normally gets covered up.

    Like it's no great secret that sweetened cream is delicious, and I'm actually confused as to why unflavoured ice cream isn't more widely available.
    Agreed on all points.

    Also, waiting at the airport pickup lot would be better if the plane wasn't delayed an hour. Hasn't even taken off yet.
    Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.

  16. - Top - End - #1336
    Troll in the Playground
     
    DataNinja's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Gender
    Female

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Quote Originally Posted by Anonymouswizard View Post
    If I'm very lucky I might have a new boyfriend soon. He is very cute and an utter sweetie.

    He is also not [insert person here], sorry shippers.
    Pretty sure you never, ever need to apologize to anyone who ships real people. Because the activity's just creepy.

    But good luck with the new beau! Hope it works out well for all involved.
    The stars predict tomorrow you'll wake up, do a bunch of stuff, and then go back to sleep.~ That's your horoscope for today.

    01001110011001010111001001100100

  17. - Top - End - #1337
    Dragon in the Playground Moderator
     
    Peelee's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Birmingham, AL
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Quote Originally Posted by DataNinja View Post
    Pretty sure you never, ever need to apologize to anyone who ships real people. Because the activity's just creepy.
    I think they're usually called "pilots".
    Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.

  18. - Top - End - #1338
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    MindFlayer

    Join Date
    Feb 2015

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Quote Originally Posted by DataNinja View Post
    Pretty sure you never, ever need to apologize to anyone who ships real people. Because the activity's just creepy.
    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    I think they're usually called "pilots".
    It depends, if you are shipping real people as cargo rather than as passengers, you are probably called a "human trafficker", or even a "slave trader".

    I suppose, if the people aren't human, that would be "elf trafficker", "wookiee trafficker", or whatever.
    Last edited by DavidSh; 2024-07-09 at 08:24 AM.

  19. - Top - End - #1339
    Titan in the Playground
     
    DrowGuy

    Join Date
    Dec 2015

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Well my older brother who I have a very good and tight relationship lost my debit card because due to the stress that he dealing at his current job. The funny part is that I'm not even mad at him. I sympathize where my older brother coming from and I forgive him. Also I called the company to cancel my lost card and order a replacement card in the next 7-10 business days.
    Last edited by Bartmanhomer; 2024-07-09 at 08:51 AM.
    It's time to get my Magikarp on!

  20. - Top - End - #1340
    Dragon in the Playground Moderator
     
    Peelee's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Birmingham, AL
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidSh View Post
    It depends, if you are shipping real people as cargo rather than as passengers, you are probably called a "human trafficker", or even a "slave trader".

    I suppose, if the people aren't human, that would be "elf trafficker", "wookiee trafficker", or whatever.
    Yeah, that was my first inclination, but I decided to go with a less dark route.
    Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.

  21. - Top - End - #1341
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Anonymouswizard's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    In my library

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Quote Originally Posted by DataNinja View Post
    Pretty sure you never, ever need to apologize to anyone who ships real people. Because the activity's just creepy.
    I just remember a joke from years ago about shipping me with Bartmanhomer. Which to be fair I think sprouted from me jokingly denying the pairing. I was going to be more specific but there was no setup this time.

    But good luck with the new beau! Hope it works out well for all involved.
    Thank you! Hoping he eventually wants to meet my polycule.

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidSh View Post
    It depends, if you are shipping real people as cargo rather than as passengers, you are probably called a "human trafficker", or even a "slave trader".

    I suppose, if the people aren't human, that would be "elf trafficker", "wookiee trafficker", or whatever.
    Wookieee, three es
    Snazzy avatar (now back! ) by Honest Tiefling.

    RIP Laser-Snail, may you live on in our hearts forever.

    Spoiler: playground quotes
    Show
    Quote Originally Posted by Zelphas View Post
    So here I am, trapped in my laboratory, trying to create a Mechabeast that's powerful enough to take down the howling horde outside my door, but also won't join them once it realizes what I've done...twentieth time's the charm, right?
    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Raziere View Post
    How about a Jovian Uplift stuck in a Case morph? it makes so little sense.

  22. - Top - End - #1342
    Titan in the Playground
     
    DrowGuy

    Join Date
    Dec 2015

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Quote Originally Posted by Anonymouswizard View Post
    I just remembered a joke from years ago about shipping me with Bartmanhomer. To be fair I think sprouted from me jokingly denying the pairing. I was going to be more specific but there was no setup this time.
    Hold up. What joke was that?
    It's time to get my Magikarp on!

  23. - Top - End - #1343
    Troll in the Playground
     
    BisectedBrioche's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Some rainly old island
    Gender
    Female

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidSh View Post
    It depends, if you are shipping real people as cargo rather than as passengers, you are probably called a "human trafficker", or even a "slave trader".

    I suppose, if the people aren't human, that would be "elf trafficker", "wookiee trafficker", or whatever.
    "Humanoid" works pretty well for fantasy/scifi settings.

    And avoiding the "wow, I wasn't before" joke.
    Hi, I'm back, I guess. ^_^
    I cosplay and stream LPs of single player games on Twitch! Mon, Wed & Fri; currently playing: Fallout: New Vegas (Mon/Wed) and The Legend of Zelda: Oracle of Seasons (Thurs or Fri)

  24. - Top - End - #1344
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Metastachydium's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2020

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Quote Originally Posted by BisectedBrioche View Post
    "Humanoid" works pretty well for fantasy/scifi settings.
    Full disclosure: humanoid feels too forcedly technical as a fantasy term for any quasi-premodern setting; I accept it as a useful mechanical descriptor in, say, D&D, but even there, I'd probably avoid using it in-game (not that in that particular context it would be a good synonym for person, given all the other generally people-coded types).

  25. - Top - End - #1345
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    RangerGuy

    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Quote Originally Posted by Metastachydium View Post
    Full disclosure: humanoid feels too forcedly technical as a fantasy term for any quasi-premodern setting; I accept it as a useful mechanical descriptor in, say, D&D, but even there, I'd probably avoid using it in-game (not that in that particular context it would be a good synonym for person, given all the other generally people-coded types).
    I've struggled with this, especially when having non-humans say it. In most lore, weren't elves at the height of their power when humans were still crawling around in the mud? Why would an elf refer to themselves as a "human-oid"?

    My go-to fix for this has just been to use the term "mortals" interchangeably with "humanoids." I haven't run into a problem with it yet!

  26. - Top - End - #1346
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Anonymouswizard's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    In my library

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Quote Originally Posted by Bartmanhomer View Post
    Hold up. What joke was that?
    You'll excuse me if I don't dig it up, it clearly wasn't serious in context and ended up in a discussion of my gender identity.

    Quote Originally Posted by Metastachydium View Post
    Full disclosure: humanoid feels too forcedly technical as a fantasy term for any quasi-premodern setting; I accept it as a useful mechanical descriptor in, say, D&D, but even there, I'd probably avoid using it in-game (not that in that particular context it would be a good synonym for person, given all the other generally people-coded types).
    Honestly I've never had an issue with technical language in fantasy settings, people in ye olde days woulde havee hade technicale languagee evene ife ite wase differente toe oure currente terminologye.

    I will however agree that it feels oddly humanocentric outside of things like Shadowrun (where elves and dwarves are the new kids on the block). Or I suppose settings like Unknown Armies where the world really does revolve around humanity. For casual conversation I think somewhat standard 'folk' works, although that could also very feasibly apply to nonhumanoid intelligents (same with things like 'mortal').

    For science fiction I like the Rocket Age approach of 'sophonts'. I'm not sure if it's accurate but it feels right
    Snazzy avatar (now back! ) by Honest Tiefling.

    RIP Laser-Snail, may you live on in our hearts forever.

    Spoiler: playground quotes
    Show
    Quote Originally Posted by Zelphas View Post
    So here I am, trapped in my laboratory, trying to create a Mechabeast that's powerful enough to take down the howling horde outside my door, but also won't join them once it realizes what I've done...twentieth time's the charm, right?
    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Raziere View Post
    How about a Jovian Uplift stuck in a Case morph? it makes so little sense.

  27. - Top - End - #1347
    Titan in the Playground
     
    AssassinGuy

    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Quote Originally Posted by Ionathus View Post
    I've struggled with this, especially when having non-humans say it. In most lore, weren't elves at the height of their power when humans were still crawling around in the mud? Why would an elf refer to themselves as a "human-oid"?

    My go-to fix for this has just been to use the term "mortals" interchangeably with "humanoids." I haven't run into a problem with it yet!
    Presumably because theyre speaking human language when they use the word so they didn't get to write the rules. I'd wager the equivalent term in elvish has no allusions to humans at all.
    “Evil is evil. Lesser, greater, middling, it's all the same. Proportions are negotiated, boundaries blurred. I'm not a pious hermit, I haven't done only good in my life. But if I'm to choose between one evil and another, then I prefer not to choose at all.”

  28. - Top - End - #1348
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Anonymouswizard's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    In my library

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Quote Originally Posted by Keltest View Post
    Presumably because theyre speaking human language when they use the word so they didn't get to write the rules. I'd wager the equivalent term in elvish has no allusions to humans at all.
    I don't know, people like to make their elves French. Which probably means that every third phrase in elvish is an insult directed at allusion to the English humans
    Snazzy avatar (now back! ) by Honest Tiefling.

    RIP Laser-Snail, may you live on in our hearts forever.

    Spoiler: playground quotes
    Show
    Quote Originally Posted by Zelphas View Post
    So here I am, trapped in my laboratory, trying to create a Mechabeast that's powerful enough to take down the howling horde outside my door, but also won't join them once it realizes what I've done...twentieth time's the charm, right?
    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Raziere View Post
    How about a Jovian Uplift stuck in a Case morph? it makes so little sense.

  29. - Top - End - #1349
    Colossus in the Playground
     
    Rater202's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Where I am

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    My go-to for using "human-centric" terms is that every species calls themselves by their language's equivalent of "man" and other humanoids are referred to in relation to that and whatever the common language is just happens to have originated as a human language.

    So in the elf language their word for "elf" would mean "man" and their word for humans would mean something along the lines of "short-lived man."

    Let's be honest, if we encountered and opened up lines of communication with sapient, human-like space aliens they'd almost certainly be comparing us to them as much as we did them to us: We'd be calling them humanoid but if they called themselves Flipskippers they'd be calling us Flipskipperoid.
    I also answer to Bookmark and Shadow Claw.

    Read my fanfiction here. Homebrew Material Here Rater Reads the Hobbit and Dracula
    Awesome Avatar by Emperor Ing
    Spoiler: Ode To Meteors, By zimmerwald
    Show
    Quote Originally Posted by zimmerwald1915 View Post
    Meteor
    You are a meteor
    Falling star
    You soar your
    Way down the air
    To the floor
    Where my other
    Rocks
    Are.

  30. - Top - End - #1350
    Titan in the Playground
     
    DrowGuy

    Join Date
    Dec 2015

    Default Re: Ionathus's Random Banter #249 -- Directionless Rambling Is Now Mandatory

    Quote Originally Posted by Anonymouswizard View Post
    You'll excuse me if I don't dig it up, it clearly wasn't serious in context and ended up in a discussion of my gender identity.
    Ok, You're excused then.
    It's time to get my Magikarp on!

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •