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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Akennedy's Avatar

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    Default Simple Paladin Power Boost?

    Okay, this may sound ludicrous, however, I'm stupid enough to say it anyway.
    Personally, I find paladins rather useless after 5th or 6th level, there power level significantly decreases, as a fighter or cleric can outshine the paladin any day of the week, even holidays. I want to propose a (what I think to be) simple fix to the power level of the paladin. Give the paladin 6th or 9th level spells (don't shoot me!), however, only give him 3 castings per day of each level and limit his spell list to the domains of his patron deity. How do you think this would help the paladin? Over/underpowered? Any thoughts/suggestions greatly appreciated.

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    Default Re: Simple Paladin Power Boost?

    It would be mechanically sound, I think, but it would also go against the normal 'feel' of a Paladin. If you enhance the class's spellcasting, you bring it closer to a normal Cleric or a Favored Soul, especially with a full nine level progression. The Paladin already has trouble making itself distinct from those classes.

    Personally, I would try to do something with the Paladin's (relatively) unique mechanics, Smite and Lay on Hands. Smite is relatively easy to work with. One of the biggest problems with it is that Paladins simply don't get anywhere near enough Smites to be useful. Make the allotment (Cha mod) + level-derived smites, and now the Paladin has enough Smites to consider using them in less-than-completely-optimal situations as well as more solid reason to consider investing in his Charisma.

    One of the Paladin's other major problems is fairly obvious- he's got massive blank spaces in his level progression, and the features he does get are pretty worthless (More Remove Disease? Sarcastic huzzah.) Bonus Divine feats would be nice, as well as a higher-level ability that isn't just a simple continuation of his low level talents.. perhaps a Divine Conversion ability that would allow Lay on Hands(and/or Remove Disease uses), Smites, and Turn Undead attempts to be converted into each other? If he does wind up with a lot of Divine feats, he's going to be hungry for extra Turn attempts, and more Smites are always appreciated. Some higher level options for Smites would also be nice (maybe a choice between Divine and Smite feats for bonus feats?), so that the Paladin can do something other than I Smite His Head Off when called for.. it's not a coincidence that this kind of thing appears to be the 4th Ed plan for the Paladin.

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Troll in the Playground
     
    RTGoodman's Avatar

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    Default Re: Simple Paladin Power Boost?

    I don't know if giving them more spellcasting is necessarily the correct fix, though I don't think it's really overpowered to give them access to higher-level spells (though certainly not 9th level spells).

    Not to "toot my own horn" or anything, but my variant paladin (in my signature) changes the flavor, but I think it also gives the Paladin new things at higher levels (i.e., more access and better auras), as well as new (and better, I think) abilities for his special mount. Really, the lack of new/better class features at high level is part of why I made variant - the aura progression awards staying in the class, rather than PrCing out after 5th level.

    Also, it's a not a "simple" fix, but someone on the boards (I can't remember who) did a complete rewrite of the Paladin that I remember seeming pretty great. They had different paths (defense, offense, etc.) or something like that for the Paladin to specialize in, and actually gave concrete mechanics for the Paladin's Code (which add new things to the Code, but also give new abilities).
    Last edited by RTGoodman; 2007-12-30 at 08:16 PM.
    The Playgrounder Formerly Known as rtg0922

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  4. - Top - End - #4
    Titan in the Playground
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    Default Re: Simple Paladin Power Boost?

    Quote Originally Posted by rtg0922 View Post
    Also, it's a not a "simple" fix, but someone on the boards (I can't remember who) did a complete rewrite of the Paladin that I remember seeming pretty great. They had different paths (defense, offense, etc.) or something like that for the Paladin to specialize in, and actually gave concrete mechanics for the Paladin's Code (which add new things to the Code, but also give new abilities).
    That'd be my "How-It-Should-Be Paladin".

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Troll in the Playground
     
    RTGoodman's Avatar

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    Default Re: Simple Paladin Power Boost?

    Yep, that's the one. I tried to search for it a bit ago, only to be foiled by that 300 second "cool-down" time.
    The Playgrounder Formerly Known as rtg0922

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    Duke Malagigi's Avatar

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    Default Re: Simple Paladin Power Boost?

    How about my Consecrated Knight class? Or is it to much?
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    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Akennedy's Avatar

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    Default Re: Simple Paladin Power Boost?

    @tyckspoon - what if I made the paladin revolve around his lay on hands ability? Make the paladin somewhat compatable with the spell points varient except his Lay on Hands pool is his spell points. make smite cost so many points, and spells cost so many points. Also, give him things like the dragon shaman that cure disease and whatnot at the expense is their lay on hands pool. Also, make every lay on hands point heal 1/2 the paladin level (min 1 or 2). Does this seem... good?

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Titan in the Playground
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    Default Re: Simple Paladin Power Boost?

    Paladins always seemed to me to be the religious warrior type more than a cleric who could fight sometimes... why not look at something like the Crusader?
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    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: Simple Paladin Power Boost?

    If you just want a boost, make his spellcaster level be his full paladin level, instead of half his paladin level. Now his divine favor will be a lot more useful, and several other spells will last longer.
    And allow players to get that feat that allow a paladin to quicken all his spells.

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