1pg character using C.Scoun and C.Champ

[Erk]

Hi folks! I got Complete Scoundrel and Complete Champion for Christmas. I also have Unearthed Arcana, and access to several other books via friends. I am making a 2-class gestalt starting at level 1 to use in a single player campaign - that is, just me and my girlfriend with her GMing.

So far, I am looking at either rogue/cleric or beguiler/paladin [though combining something with Warlock also looks appealing]: I want to use both of my new sourcebooks to some degree, and I want to play either NG or LG. I want to be extremely versatile, as I am the only PC in the party: I have to be able to take the occasional beating in melee, get past most obstacles somehow, heal myself at least a little, and I like to be able to sneak around and have skills and skill tricks (those look like LOTS of fun). Can anyone help me out? I'd love some suggestions for fun, self-sustaining builds. Don't go beyond about L5 please, beyond suggesting a PrC or two I could look into at that stage.... I don't know if the game will even last that long. My GM is very receptive to suggestions on alternate rules to use (UA etc) what with me being the only PC.

[Frosty]

How would you reconcile being a Beguiler and a Paladin at the same time? Paladins by nature don't die. As a Beguiler your entrie career is centered around deception.

Now, paladin of freedom or Grey guard I can understand...

[RTGoodman]

You mentioned Warlock, so how about either Warlock//Fighter or Warlock//Ranger? That'll get you a full BAB, a couple of good saves, eldritch blast all day, several skills and abilities, and some feats (if you go fighter) or an animal companion (if you go ranger).

Also, if you do that, you might want to look at the eldritch glaive (I think) invocation that lets you melee full attack with your eldritch blast (maybe with some Power Attack fun, if you can you both at the same time).

[Erk]

How would you reconcile being a Beguiler and a Paladin at the same time? Paladins by nature don't die. As a Beguiler your entrie career is centered around deception.

Now, paladin of freedom or Grey guard I can understand...

Paladins do die, but I assume you meant lie.

I hold to the opinion of a paladin as put forth in Elizabeth Moon's awesome (D&D inspired) trilogy, the Deed of Paksenarrion. You should totally read it if you haven't, it's fantastic

Basically, a paladin's duty is to pursue good deeds to the best of his or her ability. Deception is not by nature evil; in fact, the idea that in order to be a paladin one must charge forward shining and shouting and waving a massive sword is just being Lawful Stupid. Turning invisible, sneaking into a den of iniquity and watching villains long enough to be sure they are truly villains, then smiting them down from the shadows is still paladinny. So is capturing and ensorcelling a slaver to get a true confession from him of who his buyers are.

Paladins shouldn't lie, I agree, but the idea that they can't deceive in any way is a pretty hard-line reading of the class. :)

(also, don't even get me started on the UA variant paladins :( holy cop-out, I was really excited to see what cool alternate abilities they suggested, and instead get some half-hearted attempt to water down the paladin class :P)

You mentioned Warlock, so how about either Warlock//Fighter or Warlock//Ranger? That'll get you a full BAB, a couple of good saves, eldritch blast all day, several skills and abilities, and some feats (if you go fighter) or an animal companion (if you go ranger).

Also, if you do that, you might want to look at the eldritch glaive (I think) invocation that lets you melee full attack with your eldritch blast (maybe with some Power Attack fun, if you can you both at the same time).

I'm not really keen on being primarily a damage dealer, and that build unfortunately would only make cursory use of my new books. I did consider warlock/fighter for some time though. Rangers aren't really my style. You do raise some cool food for thought though.

Has anyone ever seen a Celestial variant on the warlock, with more or less the same abilities but a good/lawful oriented alignment?

[Kizara]

Don't care for ethier of those books, but I find that cleric works great on '1 side' of a gestalt. Druid not bad ethier.

Consider cleric/druid for maximum WTFness.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Blah, at first I thought you were talking multiclassing rather than gestalting...

Warlock//Rogue/Nightsong Enforcer

Warlock 4 gives you Decieve Item, you can take ten on UMD checks. You now own all wands. You can sneak attack with your Ranged Touch Attack. Have a nice day. With the right feat selection, you can also Sneak Attack out to 60', which just so happens to be the range of your Eldrich Blast.

Devil's Sight, gives you the ability to see even in magical darkness. Combine with Darkness to create situations which almost guarentee sneak attacks. Entropic Warding makes you immune to being tracked and resistant to ranged attacks. Baleful Utterance = Shatter. So you can't pick the lock, blow it up. Walk Unseen = free ring of invisibility. Very fun for rogues to play with.

[Erk]

Warlock/Rogue/Nightsong Enforcer

Warlock4 gives you Decieve Item, which lets you take 10 on any UMD check and a 2d6 RTA and 3 Least Invocations. I strongly suggest either Devil's Sight (see even in magic darkness) or See the Unseen (see invis and darkvision), Spiderwalk (spider climb at will? Yes please), and Entropic Warding (Pass Without Trace, Entropic Shield, AND unable to be tracked by scent? What more does any sneak want?)

So, now you have a RTA you can Sneak Attack with and unlimited number of times per day, can see in the dark (even magical dark if you get Devil's Sight, or see the invisible wiht See the Unseen), can walk up walls and celings, are harder to hit with ranged attacks, and cannot be tracked by any means.

Want more with that?

Take Warlock 6 and pick up 3d6 RTA and Walk Unseen to be your very own Ring of Invisibility for free. Then go Rogue2, then on to go Nightsong Enforcer.

OK, I have to admit that is pretty frigging cool. I hadn't looked in that much detail at the incantations for warlock. Spider climb at will on a rogue build would be incredibly fun, and I could mix in a few of the divine rogue options from Complete Champion to get a little more of the flavour I'm looking for (heroic rogue, if that isn't clear yet )

Once again I wonder if there is a Celestial warlock variant out there... CG is acceptable though if I wanted to use the warlock base class. Or I could just go make a Celestial warlock variant, since I tend to do that sort of thing.

[RTGoodman]

Once again I wonder if there is a Celestial warlock variant out there... CG is acceptable though if I wanted to use the warlock base class. Or I could just go make a Celestial warlock variant, since I tend to do that sort of thing.

I believe Complete Mage has a PrC called Eldritch Disciple for good-aligned Warlock/Clerics, and there a bunch of feats in it for Fey-descended (i.e., good-aligned) warlocks. There might actually be another PrC that's for Good warlocks that aren't multiclassed, but I'm away from my books right now and can't check.

Also, since you have Complete Champion, you might want to check out some of the Domain Devotion feats - some are pretty good, and can get you some flavorful abilities that also might make up for the fact that you're just one character.

[Draz74]

Factotum//Archivist is about the best solo Gestalt character. Talk about flavor (though it's strange flavor for LG or NG), flexibility, and Intelligence synergy. There's probably a better possibility out there, but as far as builds with only 2 base classes, no PrC's (and, again, for soloing), this is the best it gets.

2 new books? Easy. Factotum + Complete Scoundrel feats is a natural, flavor-wise; and Archivist can learn whatever new divine spells are presented in Complete Champion.

[Khanderas]

I hold to the opinion of a paladin as put forth in Elizabeth Moon's awesome (D&D inspired) trilogy, the Deed of Paksenarrion. You should totally read it if you haven't, it's fantastic

Paladins shouldn't lie, I agree, but the idea that they can't deceive in any way is a pretty hard-line reading of the class. :)

I agree on both accounts. The books about Paks are great. Starts out as a mercenary soldier and wants to stay there. No godly revelations, gliding into paladinhood is just "the right thing to do".

Sometimes it is wise to NOT march to the nearest evil stronghold and proclaim they are to be executed for their evil deeds. A dead paladin is helpful to noone (I guess some here would disagree :D )

[Destro_Yersul]

Factotums are brilliant for versatility. They do, quite literally, everything. Not as well as the classes specialising in those things, which is why they usually need backup. With Gestalt, that ceases to be a problem.

A dead paladin is helpful to noone (I guess some here would disagree :D )

Evil clerics.