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  1. - Top - End - #1
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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    http://wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd...authentic=true

    I'm a forum nub so I don't know how to work spoilers, can someone else post it?

    Anyway, it took me a couple seconds to get a grip on some of the terms I was seeing. It's definitely different. After reading it over a few times I kind of liked it, though some terms I'm still only guessing at, like abilities being standard/minor, I think they're referring to the type of action it is to use that ability. Anyway, peruse, and let the whining begin
    Last edited by Tren; 2008-01-26 at 12:39 PM.

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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Few things I notice:
    -Pit Fiend is likely to be a race now
    -There's a class or something similiar named "Elite Soldier"
    -Teleport is now a type of movement
    -Attacks and special abilites seem to be listed together
    -Chaos/Law is gone, or at least devils don't figure on this axis
    -There's set amount of XP for monsters.
    Last edited by Morty; 2008-01-26 at 12:40 PM.
    My FFRP characters. Avatar by Ashen Lilies. Sigatars by Ashen Lilies, Gulaghar and Purple Eagle.

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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Something I'm surprised with is the fact that it saves at only +2. Are save DCs changing that dramatically?

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    WolfInSheepsClothing

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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Saves are actually in the 40s...

    AC 44; Fortitude 42, Reflex 38, Will 40

    What saving throws +2 means...hmm... I really can't think of anything. Maybe it's just a modifier to saving throws derived from the base devil or immortal humanoid type? Though that seems like a waste of a line...
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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Quote Originally Posted by Fax_Celestis View Post
    Something I'm surprised with is the fact that it saves at only +2. Are save DCs changing that dramatically?
    Do you mean the Pit Fiend itself's saves? Because the line above it says "AC 44; Fortitude 42, Reflex 38, Will 40".

    If you mean the save DC on the Pit Fiend's abilities though, there may be something in another part of the rules that makes "+2" make more sense. Like if there's a default DC based on level (or creature type, or "class", or whatever), and the +2 is on top of that. Like if some other part of the mechanics winds up giving a L26 Devil save DCs of, say, 30, then the Pit Fiend would have save DCs of 32. Something like that.



    Edit: Bah, Theli beat me to it!
    Last edited by Artanis; 2008-01-26 at 01:07 PM.
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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    The 'Elite' thing was covered in another article it means that it is effectively two enemies.

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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Other interesting things :

    Senses Perception +23; darkvision - Senses covered by skills are gone?

    Bloodied 175 - I wonder what is that.
    Last edited by Spiryt; 2008-01-26 at 01:12 PM.
    Avatar by Kwarkpudding
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    Rush in and die, dogsI was a man before I was a king.

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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Quote Originally Posted by Spiryt View Post
    Other interesting things :

    Senses: Perception +23; darkvision - Senses covered by skills are gone?
    Bloodied 175 - I wonder what is that.
    Perception:

    Perception covers pretty much all senses, it's Spot, Listen, and maybe Search rolled into one. So that covers the senses. They probably don't put any other skills on there because they wouldn't really be relevant. A Pit Fiend's job is to get stabbed to death by adventurers, so you don't really need to remind everybody what their Religion check is


    Bloodied:

    Bloodied means, basically, "half health". Certain abilities only work when bloodied, and certain abilities only work on bloodied opponents. There may be times when bloodied comes at a different fraction, but even if there aren't, it's worth a couple words in space that otherwise would've been wasted to avoid having to hassle with division, especially in the middle of a fight.
    Last edited by Artanis; 2008-01-26 at 01:16 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cheesegear View Post
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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Bloodied seems to also be a major part of the rogue's shtick. Once bloodied, they can commit major damage to finish the creature off.
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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Quote Originally Posted by Artanis View Post
    Bloodied:

    Bloodied means, basically, "half health". Certain abilities only work when bloodied, and certain abilities only work on bloodied opponents. It's probably listed there so that the DM doesn't have to hassle with division. Not really necessary, but an extra two words to save some annoyance won't hurt anybody.
    Yay! Finally some difference between full being "full health" and being almost eviscecrated.

    Quote Originally Posted by Artanis View Post
    Perception:

    Perception covers pretty much all senses, it's Spot, Listen, and maybe Search rolled into one. So that covers the senses. They probably don't put any other skills on there because they wouldn't really be relevant. A Pit Fiend's job is to get stabbed to death by adventurers, so you don't really need to remind everybody what their Religion check is
    Not yay. When I had seen that I though " I hope that all senses are not in this "Perception" together". It's little stupid for me.
    Avatar by Kwarkpudding
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    Rush in and die, dogsI was a man before I was a king.

    Whoever makes shoddy beer, shall be thrown into manure - town law from Gdańsk, XIth century.

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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    The oddest thing to me is this:
    Melee Pit Fiend Frenzy (standard; at-will)
    The pit fiend makes a flametouched mace attack and a tail sting attack.
    Is it really necessary to specify yet another action type in order to use a combination of actions listed earlier?

    I guess this is the price paid for getting rid of the full attack line...

    Edit: Although perhaps frenzied actions have some side-effect or something...
    Last edited by Theli; 2008-01-26 at 01:22 PM.
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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Quote Originally Posted by Spiryt View Post
    Not yay. When I had seen that I though " I hope that all senses are not in this "Perception" together". It's little stupid for me.
    Can I ask why you think that? I run in a lot of games right now where Listen/Spot become Perception, Open Lock/Disable Device become Disable Device, Knowledge (Arcana)/Spellcraft become Knowledge (Arcana), and Hide/Move Silently become Stealth. Makes things a lot simpler, and cuts die rolling nearly in half in sneakier situations.

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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Quote Originally Posted by Theli View Post
    The oddest thing to me is this:


    Is it really necessary to specify yet another action type in order to use a combination of actions listed earlier?

    I guess this is the price paid for getting rid of the full attack line...

    Edit: Although perhaps frenzied actions have some side-effect or something...
    Actually, I think it stems from the fact that 4e is getting rid of multiple attacks in a round except via special abilities. This is one of those abilities, as it lets the pit fiend attack with both its mace and its tail sting.

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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Quote Originally Posted by Fax_Celestis View Post
    Can I ask why you think that? I run in a lot of games right now where Listen/Spot become Perception, Open Lock/Disable Device become Disable Device, Knowledge (Arcana)/Spellcraft become Knowledge (Arcana), and Hide/Move Silently become Stealth. Makes things a lot simpler, and cuts die rolling nearly in half in sneakier situations.
    Yeah well, it's always better when things can be done quick.

    But for the cost o common sense. Sense of hearing is something completely different from sight. Just as ability to stay unseen and ability to move without sound...

    Well, overally those are probably different tastes. I like many different skills, it give more choice, customisation - like someone who can hide pretty well and fast but is heavy on his foot, so he'll make qite a noise even when sneaking.
    Avatar by Kwarkpudding
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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Spoiler'd for your pleasure.

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    Last month, I shared the elf racial entry from the upcoming 4th Edition Player's Handbook with you. It went over so well that I thought I'd do something like it again this month. This time, though, I've decided to dive into the Monster Manual files and see how that book is coming along. Just today, for example, Mike Mearls and I finished reviewing every minion and swarm in the book, making sure that the rules for these are clear, concise, and easy to use at the table. I was going to show you one of those, but while they're all cool and great for the game, they aren't anywhere near the sexiest monsters in the book. No, I want to share with you something meaty, something substantial, and something well and truly at the top of the pile of D&D monsters. Something new won't work for this purpose, since I want you to be able to compare the 3E version to the 4th Edition version if you have a desire to make such a comparison.

    For all these reasons and more (and because the art sketch by Arnie Swekel is just wonderful), I've settled on the pit fiend. Here's the entry from the new Monster Manual in all its current glory. Enjoy!

    PIT FIEND
    Nobles of the Nine Hells, pit fiends form an elite ruling class that oversees vast numbers of lesser devils. Only the archdevils known as the Lords of the Nine stand higher than the pit fiends.

    Each pit fiend is lord of a large domain within one of the layers of the Nine Hells and is vassal to the archdevil who rules that layer. A pit fiend might govern a city, command a fortress, lead a great legion, or serve as a seneschal or counselor for an archdevil. With the exception of Asmodeus, each Lord of the Nine commands no more than a dozen or so pit fiends.

    As the lords, barons, viziers, and generals of the Nine Hells, pit fiends rarely confront adventurers in person. They are the progenitors of devilish schemes, and they step in only when important plans go awry or when great plots reach fruition. In the Nine Hells proper, pit fiends command vast numbers of lesser devils. Penetrating the defenses of a pit fiend's castle and destroying the mighty devil in its own demesne is a deed of truly epic proportions.

    Description
    This hulking devil stands 12 feet tall and has red scales, leathery wings, and a long whiplike tail. It carries a massive mace and wears an ornate breastplate decorated with evil runes and symbols.

    Pit Fiend Level 26 Elite Soldier (Leader)
    Large immortal humanoid (devil) XP 18,000
    Initiative +22 Senses Perception +23; darkvision
    Aura of Fear (Fear) aura 5; enemies in the aura take a 2 penalty on attack rolls.
    Aura of Fire (Fire) aura 5; enemies that enter or start their turns in the aura take 15 fire damage.
    HP 350; Bloodied 175
    AC 44; Fortitude 42, Reflex 38, Will 40
    Resist 30 fire, 15 poison
    Saving Throws +2
    Speed 12, fly 12 (clumsy), teleport 10
    Action Points 1
    Melee Flametouched Mace (standard; at-will) Fire, Weapon
    Reach 2; +31 vs. AC; 1d12+11 fire damage plus ongoing 5 fire damage (save ends).
    Melee Tail Sting (standard; at-will) Poison
    +31 vs. AC; 1d6+11 damage, and the pit fiend may make a free followup attack. Followup: +29 vs. Fortitude; ongoing 15 poison damage, and the target is weakened (save ends both effects).
    Melee Pit Fiend Frenzy (standard; at-will)
    The pit fiend makes a flametouched mace attack and a tail sting attack.
    Ranged Point of Terror (minor; at-will) Fear
    Range 5; +30 vs. Will; the target takes a 5 penalty to all defenses until the end of the pit fiend's next turn.
    Ranged Irresistible Command (minor 1/round; at-will) Charm, Fire
    Range 10; affects one allied devil of lower level than the pit fiend; the target immediately slides up to 5 squares and explodes, dealing 2d10+5 fire damage to all creatures in a close burst 2. The exploding devil is destroyed.
    Infernal Summons (standard; encounter) Conjuration
    The pit fiend summons a group of devil allies. Summoned devils roll initiative to determine when they act in the initiative order and gain a +4 bonus to attack rolls as long as the pit fiend is alive. They remain until they are killed, dismissed by the pit fiend (free action), or the encounter ends. PCs do not earn experience points for killing these summoned creatures. The pit fiend chooses to summon one of the following groups of devils:


    8 legion devil legionnaires (level 21), or
    2 war devils (level 22), or
    1 war devil (level 22) and 4 legion devil legionnaires (level 21)
    Tactical Teleport (standard; recharge 4 5 6) Teleportation
    The pit fiend can teleport up to 2 allies within 10 squares of it. The targets appear in any other unoccupied squares within 10 squares of the pit fiend.
    Alignment Evil
    Languages Supernal
    Skills Bluff +27, Intimidate +27, Religion +24
    Str 32 (+24) Dex 24 (+20) Wis 20 (+18)
    Con 27 (+21) Int 22 (+19) Cha 28 (+22)
    Equipment flametouched mace, noble signet ring

    Pit Fiend Tactics
    A pit fiend fights close to its enemies, catching them in its aura of fear and aura of fire. On the first round of combat, it spends an action point to use infernal summons. It then uses point of terror against a tough-looking foe and tactical teleport to place two allies in flanking positions around that foe. With its remaining minor action, the pit fiend uses irresistible command on an ally within range.

    A pit fiend alternates between point of terror and irresistible command, sometimes using both if it has a spare move action it can replace with a minor action. Otherwise, the pit fiend uses pit fiend frenzy, teleporting as needed to gain a better position.

    A pit fiend does not sacrifice its life needlessly and makes a tactical retreat if death is imminent.

    Pit Fiend Lore
    A character knows the following information with a successful Religion check:

    DC 25: Pit fiends are the nobles of the Nine Hells. Each pit fiend serves as a vassal to one of the nine archdevils and commands a fortress, city, or army in its master's domain.

    DC 30: Once every 99 years, a pit fiend can grant a mortal's wish by performing a terrible ritual. Only the most powerful and promising of mortals are offered such a temptation.

    DC 35: Well-known pit fiends include Baalzephon, one of the powerful circle of pit fiends known as the Dark Eight; Gazra, who governs the city of Abriymoch in Phlegethos, the Fourth Hell; and Baalberith, the major-domo of the palace of Asmodeus.


    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    What else is going on around here right now? The Player's Handbook is in Typesetting, and we're poring over the galleys to make every last improvement we can before it goes to print. The Monster Manual is in its last two weeks of Managing Editing, the stage right before it goes into Typesetting. And the Dungeon Master's Guide is about to leave Editing and enter its Managing Editing stage. So, from a certain point of view, the end of the process is in sight. At the same time, all kinds of other things are in process or just beginning.

    For example, our Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide and Player's Guide have just entered Development, and Design is underway on a number of projects -- many of which I can't talk about just yet. As for D&D Insider, maybe I'll take some time next month to talk about how the digital initiative is shaping up.

    Meanwhile, I need to select monsters from this wonderful Monster Manual file for my game tomorrow night. Let's see if Biggy Small and company can get out of this one -- bwaHAHA!

    Until then ...

    Keep playing!

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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    So...monsters can have action points...and spending them will give them more actions...

    Pit Fiend Tactics
    A pit fiend fights close to its enemies, catching them in its aura of fear and aura of fire. On the first round of combat, it spends an action point to use infernal summons. It then uses point of terror against a tough-looking foe and tactical teleport to place two allies in flanking positions around that foe. With its remaining minor action, the pit fiend uses irresistible command on an ally within range.

    A pit fiend alternates between point of terror and irresistible command, sometimes using both if it has a spare move action it can replace with a minor action. Otherwise, the pit fiend uses pit fiend frenzy, teleporting as needed to gain a better position.
    So what do we have here...2 standard actions and 2 minor actions on the first round of combat takes an action point expenditure...

    Minor actions can take the place of a move action... (nothing special, but nice to have it laid bare like this)

    The 2nd paragraph here is odd... It's hard to interpret... Maybe you're allowed a standard action, a minor action, and a movement action normally and the action point just gives you an extra standard action? And maybe teleporting is just a regular movement? (It has a rating of 10...so 10 squares teleportation?) Or maybe it requires both a movement and a minor action.
    Last edited by Theli; 2008-01-26 at 01:42 PM.
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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Quote Originally Posted by Theli View Post
    The 2nd paragraph here is odd... It's hard to interpret... Maybe you're allowed a standard action, a minor action, and a movement action normally and the action point just gives you an extra standard action? And maybe teleporting is just a regular movement? (It has a rating of 10...so 10 squares teleportation?)
    Looks like.

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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Quote Originally Posted by Theli View Post
    The oddest thing to me is this:


    Is it really necessary to specify yet another action type in order to use a combination of actions listed earlier?

    I guess this is the price paid for getting rid of the full attack line...

    Edit: Although perhaps frenzied actions have some side-effect or something...
    My guess is they just want to be clear in case something happens that robs a Pit Fiend of certain abilities. For instance, somebody could sunder the Flametouched Mace, meaning that he has to use the Tail Sting alone.
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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Looks like Initiative is not a Skill like SWSE. Too bad.

    Looks like they changed the name of Swift Action to Minor Action. Meh.

    I'm glad to see that they've eliminated the laundry list of pointless abilities that never end up being used.

    Also, I can't figure out why they screwed with the stat bonuses. Any ideas?

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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Because players have a mental block against accepting negatives perhaps?
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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Heh, you can find out about a 'well known' Pit Lord...only with a DC 35 check? Maybe he's not so well known after all.
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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Or maybe the abyss just likes to keep its secrets...
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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Observations:
    • Languages: Supernal - Will all creatures from outside the Material Plane/Feywild/Shadowfell speak this? Seems silly, with the basic languages in 3E I always have trouble finding appropriate languages for the high-int characters.
    • XP: 18000 - Removing the CR vs. PC level table. I suppose I don't mind, it was kind of superfluous and tedious to look up every time XP was awarded, so nice.
    • Everything measured in squares now. I take that as a bad thing, I was kind of hoping (although I didn't expect it) that they'd switch to the metric system, I get a headache from thinking in feet, yards, miles, Fahrenheit degrees, inches, and pounds.
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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Quote Originally Posted by Swooper View Post
    Observations:
    • Everything measured in squares now. I take that as a bad thing, I was kind of hoping (although I didn't expect it) that they'd switch to the metric system, I get a headache from thinking in feet, yards, miles, Fahrenheit degrees, inches, and pounds.
    From what I've heard, 1 square = 5 feet = 1.5 meters, approximately. It should now actually be easier to find the metric measurements, since it's just one-and-a-half times the square measurement.


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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Quote Originally Posted by Swooper View Post
    Everything measured in squares now. I take that as a bad thing, I was kind of hoping (although I didn't expect it) that they'd switch to the metric system, I get a headache from thinking in feet, yards, miles, Fahrenheit degrees, inches, and pounds.
    Who's to say a "square" isn't two meters instead of five feet? That's one of the advantages of an inexplicit system.

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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Quote Originally Posted by Person_Man View Post

    Also, I can't figure out why they screwed with the stat bonuses. Any ideas?
    Because they think bigger numbers look preetier? I've heard that now stat bonuses look like in 3ed, but 1/2 of level is added. But then, everyone gets this, so only real change is that numbers are bigger. Unless monster HD don't count, that is.
    Last edited by Morty; 2008-01-26 at 04:40 PM.
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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    As regards the "+2 Saves" thing, popular opinion on the ENWorld forums is that that's not a saving throw as we know it in 3E. Rather, it's a save as per the new DDM rules. Basically, when you have an ongoing debuff, you make a "save" each round to throw off the effect. You roll 1d20, and if you get 10 or higher, the effect goes away. (Notice how the ongoing fire and poison damages call for a "save" but don't specify a DC, nor which save is required.)

    So, the pit fiend's special ability allows him to make this type of save on an 8 or higher.
    Last edited by Dausuul; 2008-01-26 at 04:44 PM.

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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Quote Originally Posted by Person_Man View Post
    Also, I can't figure out why they screwed with the stat bonuses. Any ideas?
    Huh. Didn't notice that the first time through. I have absolutely no idea what to make of it. Are the numbers in parentheses the bonus (like how 18 in a stat is +4 in 3e), or some sort of baseline?
    Quote Originally Posted by Cheesegear View Post
    Girlfriend and Parents: Why do you spend so much money on that stuff?
    Me: Would you rather I spent all my money on alcohol like others in my peer group?
    G&P: You keep spending as much money as you want!
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    Bossing Around Mad Cats for Fun and Profit: Let's Play MechCommander 2!

    Kicking this LP into overdrive: Let's Play StarCraft 2!

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    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Quote Originally Posted by Fax_Celestis View Post
    Who's to say a "square" isn't two meters instead of five feet? That's one of the advantages of an inexplicit system.
    Good point. I guess I'm just miffed they're taking another step towards forcing us to use a battlemap and miniatures, which is something my group has never done and I doubt we will.
    Quote Originally Posted by Narsil View Post
    This is a D&D web forum. There's more cheese here than there is in France.
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    Titan in the Playground
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    Default Re: 4E: Pit Fiend stat block

    Quote Originally Posted by Swooper View Post
    Good point. I guess I'm just miffed they're taking another step towards forcing us to use a battlemap and miniatures, which is something my group has never done and I doubt we will.
    Thing is, D&D's always been mini-centric. It's been playable without, but it did originate from the tactical wargame Chainmail. Hell, IIRC 2e didn't measure in squares or in feet: it measured in inches moved on the table. If anything, having a fixed square distance instead of a fixed metric/imperial distance makes non-mini play easier, since you can be more arbitrary about distances.

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