Big Bad Battle Sorceror

[Paragon Badger]

So I wanted to use a Battle Sorceror variant as the big bad. Yes, it reduces the sorceror's already tiny spell list. I don't care, I like the fluff.

I've got a pretty good idea of his equipment, mithral shield and mithral breastplate (Needs to spend a feat in shield proficiency, though, bleh.) that adds up to +7 AC and 5% Arcane Spell Failure, (20% if he's using a spell isn't derived from his class levels) since Battle Sorcs ignore failure in light armor, and mithral reduces an armor category from medium to light. ^_^

My question is...

What spells would be a good choice for him?

Ideally, He relishes blood. All his damage should come from his melee-ing, with the spells used to weaken his foes or for utility... or for sadism.

The level is still up in the air, though, so any spell level's fine.

[SurlySeraph]

Blade of Blood (PHB II) leaps to mind.

[Fizban]

Stack Githcraft on that Mithral Heavy Shield for a 0% ASF. I don't remember exactly how much it costs, but it's not more than 500gp, and has no effect on any other prices (a simple non-magical item template, from DMGII). You don't need shield proficiency unless you've got an armor check penalty from the shield, and you don't.

Githcraft Mithral Heavy Shield: +2 AC, 0% ASF, 0 ACP, call it 1,750gp just to be sure.

[Jayngfet]

try wands, a big bad must have minions, odds are some of them have spells, any spell he dosen't have he could take, plus whatever magic items he has

make the shield do random magical crap when hit

roll a d10

1=baleful polymorph

2=flesh to stone

3=summon monster IV

4=cone of cold

5=magic missile

6=chain lightning

7=sunburst

8=iorn body

9=teleport

10=mass inflict moderate wounds

[Zincorium]

With a battle sorceror, the Battlecaster feat from complete arcane will let you wear up to mithril plate mail with no worries about spell failure.

Really, where battle sorcerors come into their own is in Gish builds that concentrate on a minimum of spells to get by. Abjurant champion and the swiftblade Prc from Wotc's site are both very, very good for someone who has a limited number of spells to get by on.

[Paragon Badger]

Blade of Blood (PHB II) leaps to mind.

What page? I couldn't find it in the index or contents. >_<

Stack Githcraft on that Mithral Heavy Shield for a 0% ASF. I don't remember exactly how much it costs, but it's not more than 500gp, and has no effect on any other prices (a simple non-magical item template, from DMGII). You don't need shield proficiency unless you've got an armor check penalty from the shield, and you don't.

Githcraft Mithral Heavy Shield: +2 AC, 0% ASF, 0 ACP, call it 1,750gp just to be sure.

Ah, thanks! ^_^

try wands, a big bad must have minions, odds are some of them have spells, any spell he dosen't have he could take, plus whatever magic items he has

He's at the head of a lawful evil army, so he's got plenty of minions. The good guys are a resistence movement, though, so apart from anti-scrying/dimensional anchors, I have to figure out a way to stop him from teleporting into their base and going to town. (Which is very in-character for him. If he was any other classes, it'd be multiclass Barbarian/Paladin of Slaughter)

With a battle sorceror, the Battlecaster feat from complete arcane will let you wear up to mithril plate mail with no worries about spell failure.

Really, where battle sorcerors come into their own is in Gish builds that concentrate on a minimum of spells to get by. Abjurant champion and the swiftblade Prc from Wotc's site are both very, very good for someone who has a limited number of spells to get by on.

Thanks, I'll check those out... But I don't want to cheese him out too much. It's a solo campaign, and the main character is a rogue. He's backed up by human mooks, though the PC has a rogues' guild turned guerilla resistence to call on.

[Kurald Galain]

Really, where battle sorcerors come into their own is in Gish builds that concentrate on a minimum of spells to get by.

One word: Duskblade.

[Zincorium]

One word: Duskblade.

Except that duskblades don't get shield and haste.

Which, while they're an excellent class and very fun to play, means your partial and thus inaccurate quote falls on it's face. Duskblades cannot be swiftblades, and they get very little real benefit from abjurant champion.

[Isomenes]

Except that duskblades don't get shield and haste.

Which, while they're an excellent class and very fun to play, means your partial and thus inaccurate quote falls on it's face. Duskblades cannot be swiftblades, and they get very little real benefit from abjurant champion.

I think you're on to something, but at the same time, they don't need any modifications to their armor to reduce spell failure, which allows you to focus more on other options. They have full BAB, and their spell list is precisely in line with what the OP is looking for: melee-enhancing spells. A duskblade would make a terrifying battle sorcerer variant.

To the OP: if you're set on Battle Sorc, it's still worth it to look through the Duskblade spell list for ideas. It's in the PHB II, page 24 (just after the example character). The class is built around melee casting.

[Paragon Badger]

How does that look? 13 sounds like pretty much the minimum level I'd expect an army of thousands to appoint as their leader. :P And he's using 32 or 34 point buy, considering his big bad status and all.

Spoiler

Show

Class: Battle Sorceror 13
Race: Human
Level: 27

Alignment: Lawful Evil

BaB: +9/+4
Melee Attack: +14 (1d8+4, 17-20/x2)
Full Attack: +12/+7 (1d8+4, 17-20/x2) and +12 (1d8+2, 20/x2)

AC: 26 (Touch: 15, Flat-footed: 23)

Fortitude: +4
Reflex: +7
Will: +8

Base Speed: 30 (6 squares)
Initiative: +3

Hit Points: 13d8 (64)

Strength: 18 (+4)
Dexterity: 16 (+3)
Constitution: 10 (+0)
Intelligence: 12 (+1)
Wisdom: 10 (+0)
Charisma: 18 (+4)

Feats: Two-Weapon Fighting, Combat Casting, Shield Proficiency, Shield Specialization@, Improved Shield Bash, Oversized Two-Weapon Fighting*

Proficiency: Simple Weapons, Long Sword, Light Armor

Arcane Failure Chance: 0% when casting spells derived from class levels, 15% otherwise.

Skills:
Concentration (16) +17
Knowledge(Arcana) 16 +17
Intimidate (16) +20
Spellcraft (16) +17

48 (16/8)

Items:

Keen Long Sword
1d8 Slashing, 17-20/x2
8315 GP, 4 lb.
+1 Enhancement bonus to attack

Mithral Breastplate +2
+5 AC Bonus, Max Dex Bonus: +5
Arcane Spell Failure Chance: 15%
Speed: 30 ft.
5350 GP, 15 lb.
+2 AC

Githcraft Mithral Heavy Shield of Bashing +1
+2 AC Bonus, 1d8 Bludgeoning, 20/x2
Arcane Spell Failure Chance: 0%
2770 GP, 5 lb.
+1 Concentration, +1 AC

Ring of Protection +2
8000 GP

Belt of Giant Strength +4
16,000

Total GP: 40435
NPC Wealth Per Level: 35000

Spells per day:
0: 5
1st: 5+1
2nd: 5+1
3rd: 5+1
4th: 5+1
5th: 3
6th: 2
7th:
8th:
9th:

Spells known:
0: 8 (Resistence, Bestow Wound%, Detect Magic, Read Magic, Light, Mage Hand, Message, Arcane Mark)
1st: 4 (Identify, Charm Person, Blade of Blood@, Feather Fall)
2nd: 4 (Obscure Object, Protection from Arrows, Darkvision, Bladeweave*)
3rd: 3 (Dispel Magic, Hold Person, Suggestion)
4th: 3 (Dimension Door, Crushing Despair, Wrack$)
5th: 2 (Dismissal, Dominate Person)
6th: 1 (Tenser's Transformation)
7th:
8th:
9th:

*Complete Adventurer
%Heroes of Horror
@PHB II
$Complete Divine

And after one standard action...

w/ Tenser's Transformation:

Melee Attack: +19 (1d8+6, 17-20/x2)
Full Attack: +17/+12/+7 (1d8+6, 17-20/x2) and +17 (1d8+3, 20/x2)

HP: 13d8+2 (90)
AC: 32 (10 + 7 Armor, +4 Shield, +4 Natural, +2 Deflection, +5 Dex)

Str 22, Dex 20, Con 14, Int 12, Wis 10, Cha 18
Fort +11, Ref +9, Will +8

Duration: 13 rounds

[Haakon]

The build looks good and the fluff seems sound!

One thing about your item selection though: the Keen long sword would cost 8315 gold (since you can't just put Keen on a weapon, it has to be +1 first. Unless, you as the DM choose it not to be, heh). Don't forget about a familiar, you have that option too, which can be changed to suit him. Your missing a bunch of skill points. You should be getting 4 per level (2 from Sor, 1 from Int and 1 for being human).

Since he seems to enjoy damaging people, what about the Electric Vengeance spells from SC? I know there is a small chance of him being hit with a higher AC, but they seem to fit. You can always change the descriptor of the spell as well and change the visual to suit the "blood" theme.

You also might want to look at some of the Fiendish Heritage Feats from Complete Mage, since you mention he is evil and leading LE minions.

[avr]

Have you considered a spell storing rather than keen sword? Hold person on an attack, with the possibility of a coup de grace next round can terrify players.

Actually, make that a spell storing battle axe. Higher crit mod on the coup de grace.

[CASTLEMIKE]

Since you are the DM I'd let the BBEG be a Stalwart Battle Sorcerer. I'd probably make him an Abjurant Champion.

I'd have him take an Arcane Disciple feat like the Spell Domain (or other of your choice) for more spellcasting utility. I'd strongly suggest a Dragon magazine bloodline feat for additional known spells. I'd consider giving him a Dragon feat like the Greyhawk Nexus feat for spontaneous Summoning spells. I'd consider letting him burn a feat to acquire MotAO spell pool access for a little more limited spell utility.

http://realmshelps.dandello.net/datafind/feats.shtml

[Maerok]

I've heard Paladin 2/Battle Sorcerer X/Eldritch Knight 10. Take Battlecaster twice for no ASF heavy armor. Then grab Tenser's Transformation... Or that SpellComp spell that turns you into the massive Warforged killamajig.

You could also do Swiftblade (WotC online except or something like that somewhere) for a haste maniac.

Can a gish cast while holding a greatsword (or fullblade )? Or would that be a case for Still Spell.

[Isomenes]

Can a gish cast while holding a greatsword (or fullblade )? Or would that be a case for Still Spell.

Somatic Weaponry will let you do it without spell level adjustment.

[Maerok]

Where can one find that? CWar or CMag?

Edit: CMag
I was thinking: Paladin 2/Battle Sorceror 6/Abjurant Champion 5/Eldritch Knight 7

H: Improved Initiative
1: Combat Casting
3: Somatic Weaponry
6: Battlecaster (medium armor)
9: Battlecaster (heavy armor)
9 (EK 1): Fighter Feat: Improved Toughness
12: Maximize Spell*
15: Craft Magic Armors and Armor*
18: Combat Reflexes*

* or anything else useful

[CASTLEMIKE]

Where can one find that? CWar or CMag?

Complete Mage or right here:
http://realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-...c_Weaponry,all

[Paragon Badger]

Aha! I found a lovely little gem in Complete Divine. You gain +4 Caster Levels, up to a maximum of your HD....so, that's 4 levels I can spend on a different class and still get the spells I would have had if I continued in Battle Sorc.

So... voila;

Spoiler

Show

Class: Battle Sorceror 9, Fighter 4
Race: Human
Level: 27

Alignment: Lawful Evil

BaB: +10/+5
Melee Attack: +16 Long Sword (1d8+7, 17-20/x2)
Ranged Attack: +14 Shield Sling (1d8+4, 20/x2) 20 ft. range increment.

Full Attack: +14/+9 Long Sword (1d8+7, 17-20/x2) and +13 Shield Bash (1d8+2, 20/x2)

AC: 26 (Touch: 15, Flat-footed: 23)

Fortitude: +7
Reflex: +10
Will: +11

Base Speed: 30 (6 squares)
Initiative: +3

Hit Points: 9d8 + 4d10 (60)

Strength: 18 (+4)
Dexterity: 16 (+3)
Constitution: 10 (+0)
Intelligence: 12 (+1)
Wisdom: 10 (+0)
Charisma: 18 (+4)

Feats: Practiced Spellcaster%, Brutal Throw*, Improved Shield Bash, Weapon Focus(Long Sword), Weapon Specialization(Long Sword), Force of Personality*
Bonus Feats: Shield Specialization(Heavy)@, Agile Shield Fighter@, Shield Sling@

Proficiency: All simple and martial weapons, All armor and shields

Arcane Failure Chance: 0% when casting spells derived from class levels, 15% otherwise.

Skills:
Concentration (12) +13
Knowledge (Arcana) (12) +13
Intimidate (16) +20
Spellcraft (12) +13
Ride (12) +15

64 (16/8)

Items:

Keen Long Sword +1
1d8 Slashing, 17-20/x2
8315 GP, 4 lb.
+1 Enhancement bonus to attack and damage

Mithral Breastplate +2
+5 AC Bonus, Max Dex Bonus: +5
Arcane Spell Failure Chance: 15%
Speed: 30 ft.
5350 GP, 15 lb.
+2 AC

Githcraft Mithral Heavy Shield of Bashing +1
+2 AC Bonus, 1d8 Piercing, 20/x2
Arcane Spell Failure Chance: 0%
2770 GP, 5 lb.
+1 Concentration, +1 AC

Ring of Protection +2
8000 GP

Belt of Giant Strength +4
16,000

Total GP: 40435
NPC Wealth Per Level: 35000

Spells per day:
0: 5
1st: 5+1
2nd: 5+1
3rd: 5+1
4th: 5+1
5th: 3
6th: 2
7th:
8th:
9th:

Spells known:
0: 8 (Resistence, Bestow Wound%, Detect Magic, Read Magic, Light, Mage Hand, Message, Arcane Mark)
1st: 4 (Identify, Charm Person, Blade of Blood@, Feather Fall)
2nd: 4 (Obscure Object, Protection from Arrows, Darkvision, Bladeweave*)
3rd: 3 (Dispel Magic, Hold Person, Suggestion)
4th: 3 (Dimension Door, Crushing Despair, Wrack%)
5th: 2 (Dismissal, Dominate Person)
6th: 1 (Tenser's Transformation)
7th:
8th:
9th:

*Complete Adventurer
%Heroes of Horror
@PHB II
%Complete Divine

w/ Tenser's Transformation

HP: 86, AC: 32 (+10 Base +7 Armor, +4 Shield, +4 Natural, +2 Deflection, +5 Dex)

Base Attack: +13/+8/+3
Melee Attack: +20 Long Sword (1d8+9, 17-20/x2)
Ranged Attack: +18 Shield Sling (1d8+6, 20/x2), 20 ft. range increment

Full Attack: +18/+13/+8 Long Sword (1d8+9, 17-20/x2) and +17 Shield Bash (1d8+3, 20/x2)

Fort +14, Reflex +12, Will +11
Str 22, Dex 20, Con 14, Int 12, Wis 10, Cha 18

Lasts 13 rounds.

[GoodbyeSoberDay]

Aha! I found a lovely little gem in Complete Divine. You gain +4 Caster Levels, up to a maximum of your HD....so, that's 4 levels I can spend on a different class and still get the spells I would have had if I continued in Battle Sorc.

So... voila;

Spoiler

Show

Class: Battle Sorceror 9, Fighter 4
Race: Human
Level: 27

Alignment: Lawful Evil

BaB: +10/+5
Melee Attack: +16 Long Sword (1d8+7, 17-20/x2)
Ranged Attack: +14 Shield Sling (1d8+4, 20/x2) 20 ft. range increment.

Full Attack: +14/+9 Long Sword (1d8+7, 17-20/x2) and +13 Shield Bash (1d8+2, 20/x2)

AC: 26 (Touch: 15, Flat-footed: 23)

Fortitude: +7
Reflex: +10
Will: +11

Base Speed: 30 (6 squares)
Initiative: +3

Hit Points: 9d8 + 4d10 (60)

Strength: 18 (+4)
Dexterity: 16 (+3)
Constitution: 10 (+0)
Intelligence: 12 (+1)
Wisdom: 10 (+0)
Charisma: 18 (+4)

Feats: Practiced Spellcaster%, Brutal Throw*, Improved Shield Bash, Weapon Focus(Long Sword), Weapon Specialization(Long Sword), Force of Personality*
Bonus Feats: Shield Specialization(Heavy)@, Agile Shield Fighter@, Shield Sling@

Proficiency: All simple and martial weapons, All armor and shields

Arcane Failure Chance: 0% when casting spells derived from class levels, 15% otherwise.

Skills:
Concentration (12) +13
Knowledge (Arcana) (12) +13
Intimidate (16) +20
Spellcraft (12) +13
Ride (12) +15

64 (16/8)

Items:

Keen Long Sword +1
1d8 Slashing, 17-20/x2
8315 GP, 4 lb.
+1 Enhancement bonus to attack and damage

Mithral Breastplate +2
+5 AC Bonus, Max Dex Bonus: +5
Arcane Spell Failure Chance: 15%
Speed: 30 ft.
5350 GP, 15 lb.
+2 AC

Githcraft Mithral Heavy Shield of Bashing +1
+2 AC Bonus, 1d8 Piercing, 20/x2
Arcane Spell Failure Chance: 0%
2770 GP, 5 lb.
+1 Concentration, +1 AC

Ring of Protection +2
8000 GP

Belt of Giant Strength +4
16,000

Total GP: 40435
NPC Wealth Per Level: 35000

Spells per day:
0: 5
1st: 5+1
2nd: 5+1
3rd: 5+1
4th: 5+1
5th: 3
6th: 2
7th:
8th:
9th:

Spells known:
0: 8 (Resistence, Bestow Wound%, Detect Magic, Read Magic, Light, Mage Hand, Message, Arcane Mark)
1st: 4 (Identify, Charm Person, Blade of Blood@, Feather Fall)
2nd: 4 (Obscure Object, Protection from Arrows, Darkvision, Bladeweave*)
3rd: 3 (Dispel Magic, Hold Person, Suggestion)
4th: 3 (Dimension Door, Crushing Despair, Wrack%)
5th: 2 (Dismissal, Dominate Person)
6th: 1 (Tenser's Transformation)
7th:
8th:
9th:

*Complete Adventurer
%Heroes of Horror
@PHB II
%Complete Divine

Yeah, every gish wishes bonus caster levels actually added to spellcasting progression. Hell, every caster with an orange ioun stone wishes that was true. But it's not. Le sigh for you.

[Paragon Badger]

Gah, should have read that better.

It was a sweet dream, while it lasted, though.

[Neftren]

I wrote a battle sorcerer who was completely based off Wand usage.
http://www.shonuffstudios.com/gothmo...iew.php?id=200

The idea is to go for all offensive spells to craft new wands with. With the metamagic spell trigger feat and such, you can' pull off a pretty efficient PbP character, but in any long and drawn out campaign, the XP hits are going to be pretty severe in the long run.