What can I do with Polymorph?

[Frosty]

Well, I've never used Polymorph or any of its cousins before. Being a full caster who specializes in metamagic-blasting, what can I do with Polymorph to make me either deadlier or harder to kill in combat? If I use Polymorph, should I still bother with Alter Self at all?

[SamTheCleric]

You could polymorph into a will-o-wisp to get a +9 dex mod, +9 deflection to ac, small size and immunity to spells with that allow spell resistance... oh and invisibility at will.

Though... i'm sure there are 876490174 better things you could do.

[Mr. Friendly]

Well, I've never used Polymorph or any of its cousins before. Being a full caster who specializes in metamagic-blasting, what can I do with Polymorph to make me either deadlier or harder to kill in combat? If I use Polymorph, should I still bother with Alter Self at all?

A can of worms you have opened, young padewan.

I predict good advice within 3 posts, a link to the polymorph guide on Gleemax within 10 and a flame war within 20.

And yeah, you are basically done with Alter Self, unless you want to keep it to use for disguising yourself and such for less cost than Polymorph. Alter Self may also still have usefulness if your Type is something other than humanoid.

[Frosty]

Yes, but how do I do somatic/verbal components as a Will O the Wisp?

[streakster]

Try here. If they can't break it, no one can.

EDIT:Heh, Mr. Friendly you called it while Ninja-ing!

[Frosty]

Hmm...I want something with great defensive qualities...maybe a pixie?

[Ivius]

Try to get a flying form; most warriors can't fly. Small or smaller sizes are also good. Pixies have both of these and more, so they would be a pretty good candidate. And being able to cast spells in that form doesn't hurt either.

[Frosty]

I've got another question. Can Polymorph Any Object turn me into a Pit Fiend? Normal polymorph has limits, but if PaO can even turn someone into a...chair, say, then it'snot a stretch that it cna turn me into a Pit Fiend or Planetar?

[Nohwl]

probably. just make sure to make it permanent.

[Emperor Tippy]

I've got another question. Can Polymorph Any Object turn me into a Pit Fiend? Normal polymorph has limits, but if PaO can even turn someone into a...chair, say, then it'snot a stretch that it cna turn me into a Pit Fiend or Planetar?

PaO has an HD limit of 15 HD, so no permanent Pit Fiend. You need shapechange for anything above 15 HD and over 25 HD you need epic magic.

[Chosen_of_Vecna]

PoA is a joke. Look at the duration factors. You can transform yourself into any mammal for a duration of permanent, including one with a higher Int score. Yeah, how's that for ridic.

Also, check out the Demons in various books, you can turn yourself into an Ice Devil and get huge bonuses to all your stats, including a racial to Int, and it will last two weeks. What's a single 8th level slot every two weeks when the +6 Racial int alone probably gives you another one.

[Frosty]

I still don't undersyand the duration factor. It seems very vague. How long can I PoA into a Pit Fiend for? and how did you get 2 weeks for an Ice Devil?

now I know I don't get any supernatural or even the extraordinary special qualities, but what about racial stuff like Fire Immunity?

[Ascension]

Everyone knows the primary use of PaO should be turning missiles into whales and bowls of petunias!

You get bonus points if the DM turns the bowl of petunias into a returning reincarnated villain.

[tyckspoon]

Assuming a human, a Pit Fiend (assuming PoA isn't forced to abide by Polymorph's 15 HD limit, anyway- I think it is, at least for transforming into live things. That would also make a Pit Fiend ineligible by type, as Polymorph can't do outsiders. Still, for the sake of example:) polymorph would have a duration factor of..

Same Kingdom: Animal, for a sufficiently broad definition of animal (it's not plant or mineral, at least.) +5
Same Class: Probably not. Outsiders aren't mammals.
Same Size: No, but you might be able to cheese this with Enlarge Person or other size boosts.
Related: Only if you're twisty and can slide an explanation past your DM (A Human Mage is related to a Pit Fiend because we both cast spells! Being Fiendish or a Half-Fiend would probably get you this point, tho.)
Same or Lower Intelligence: Possible. If your Int is at or better than 26 (probably including long-term bonuses like items and Tomes, but not a Fox's Cunning), you get this bonus. Although if you qualify, the transformation might be a step down in your bonus spells and DCs. Assume another +2 here.

That gives a duration factor of +7, which lasts for a solid week. Most of the stuff you want to poly into should at least qualify for Same Kingdom, which means you'll usually get a 20 hour duration.

[JBento]

Depends. If you're the DM, you can ban the hell out of it - and you should. If you're the player, then I feel the best use for the P-word group of spells in the PHB (except Baleful, which isn't overpowered considering) is the one advocated in TLN's guide: LET IT BE!!!!!
Leave it there.
Lying in a corner.
Alone.
Untouched.
Don't look at it.
In fact, don't even think about it.

...

There. You've gone and done it.

[Illiterate Scribe]

Depends. If you're the DM, you can ban the hell out of it - and you should. If you're the player, then I feel the best use for the P-word group of spells in the PHB (except Baleful, which isn't overpowered considering) is the one advocated in TLN's guide: LET IT BE!!!!!

Let it be, let it be, let it be, let it be.
Whisper words of wisdom, let it be.

And when the broken built PCs living in the world agree,
there will be an answer, let it be.

[Frosty]

I just want to have a lot of fun scaring the hell outta people. My main offense is casting spells, but how cool is it to have a spell-slinger that can also *eat* you? Like...a T-rex or a Tendriculous?

[Mr. Friendly]

I just want to have a lot of fun scaring the hell outta people. My main offense is casting spells, but how cool is it to have a spell-slinger that can also *eat* you? Like...a T-rex or a Tendriculous?

Right well you can't cast spells in forms like T-Rex or Tendriculous without a lot of feats (Still, Silent, Eschew Materials) and then you will still need high spell slots to cast them.

[Frosty]

T-rex have arms. I already have eschew materials. Although I may not be able to take Natural Spell...

[Mr. Friendly]

T-rex have arms. I already have eschew materials. Although I may not be able to take Natural Spell...

The T-Rex arms are debateable, as you need to have your fingers to waggle and point. The T-Rex still can't speak though...

Honestly, it is a game balance issue. You must not be allowed to do this because it fundamentally breaks the game (beyond it's already broken point); if you can polymorph into a T-Rex, why doesn't every wizard do it? Things just get outright silly from there.

[Squash Monster]

Why would you turn yourself into a T-Rex? You're more powerful than a T-Rex already. If you just want to scare people cast an Image spell on yourself and hide in an image of the Tarrasque.

Now, as for who you actually should turn into a T-Rex...

Statistically speaking, you have somebody useless in your party. Turn them into a T-Rex.

If the mean evil guy keeps kicking puppies, turn the puppies into T-Rexes.

If you're really desperate, use Summon Monster to summon a fiendish monstrous centipede then polymorph it into a T-Rex. (The monstrous centipedes usually have the highest hit dice per level).

[Starbuck_II]

My suggestions:
Annis Hag
Girallion (it can speak due to Int) Gorilla mage!
Lammasu (can cast so you could as it, it can fly)
Brown Bear (why not) I like bears, can't cast I guess though.
Hydra: if just want alot of AoO attacks (2 AoP, but all heads in each)
Treant: It offers plant type, NA, good Str/reach, little tall (huge) though. It can speak so it can cast.
Cloaker: Hold Person at will as a special attack. He has other moans, but they are area effects and may affect allies so I just use the Hold ability.
It can fly.
Carrison Crawler: paralyzing touch is okay. Just cool looking to me.

[Frosty]

Well how about Alter-selfing into a Raptoran for Flight then? I need a flying form that can cast spells.

I may have a Malconvoker... orsomething (a summoning presrige class) in my party, who'll specialize in summoning evil things. I can probably polymorph those.

[JBento]

[NITPICK] Actually, you can't cast spells as a Lammasu unless they're stilled. Lammasu don't have functional arms. They can cast spells for the same reason that the armless nagas can. [/NITPICK]

Why is the above nitpick when it's such a big deal? Because lammasu really isn't the way to go. If people allow you P-word spells (and you have no shame), what you want is something on the lines of the War Troll, which is horrendously good for his HD and lets you cast spells at the same time...



I'VE BEEN DRAWN INTO P-WORD SPELLS DISCUSSION - NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOEEEEEEEEEESSSSS S!!!!!!

[Azerian Kelimon]

Of course, if you want to go with the ultimate cheesezorz, it's simple.

PaO into a choker. Double spells, here we come!

[Frosty]

And where can I find a wartroll?

It's funny. Whenever someone writes "p-word" I keep thinking "Power Word"

[Azerian Kelimon]

Polymorph Is not a power word.

Polymorph is a power word is a power word, however.

[JBento]

Yes, the Choker would be a neat trick - IF the P-word spells granted you the (Su) abilities of the new form, which, accordind to the srd, they don't. If they did, the Balhanoth (sp?, MM4 or 5) would be the caster-form caster killer.
"Whass that? Spells? No, I don't think so. No, no magic items either, sorry. Can I eat you now?"

Wartrolls, IIRC, are in the MM2, though I could be wrong and I'm AFB so I can't confirm. Also IIRC, they have EXACTLY 15HD - Coincidence? I think NOT!

And "Polymorph is a power word" is actually a power sentence