Transmuter PrC search

[Proven_Paradox]

So, I'm going to be playing a focused specialist transmuter in an upcoming game, barring evocation, necromancy, and enchantment. Normally, when I play a wizard, my first PrC stop is probably going to be Master Specialist, but looking at the greater esoterica for transmutation... It's almost a slap in the face. Abjurers get to cast personal spells on others--including the suddenly very powerful Anti-Magic Field. Evocers get to deal 150% damage. Illusionists get to still/silence/eschew their spells for free. Conjurers get automatic quicken spell.

Transmuters get to do damage on the level of a first level warrior with a morning star. Give him a greatsword, and he'll probably do better most of the time. The lesser and medium esoterica are similarly unimpressive compared to other schools.

So, with my old stand-by out of the question, I turn to you, playgrounders. What would you suggest for a transmuter PrC? Transmutation focus would be nice, but at this point I'm willing to go without it. Neutral good alignment. It's gestalt, so I can afford to lose a caster level or two by picking it back up on the other side, but I'd rather not have to do that for more than four levels.

[jcsw]

What level are you starting at? Master Transmogrifist is a fun class, though you lose exactly four caster levels throughout the thing.

[Proven_Paradox]

Starting at level 1, so things have a while to develop.

Master Transmogrifist... Seems kind of lame to me. The whole point of polymorph is that you can choose any form; limiting yourself to a few favored forms seems somewhat counter-productive to me. I'll admit that it's been a while since I've looked at it. I'll take another look and see what I think, but yeah, I was looking for something else.

[jcsw]

He's not limited to several shapes, he just gets bonuses for using the favored shapes.

And stealing the Split(Ex) (It gives immunity to bludgeoning, not slashing and piercing) of the snowflake ooze and attaching it to the black pudding/brine ooze is really funny. Immunity to Slashing, Piercing and Bludgeoning is awesome.

[Bayar]

I suggest this: Bar abjuration instead of necromancy, get yourself some ray of enfeeblement and backbiter, prepare Launch Bolt tree times, forget PrC.

Transmuters are powerful enough without PrC. Focused specialist transmuters dont need anything besides new levels in Wizard.

[CASTLEMIKE]

If the Precocious Apprentice feat trick works going Beguiler at first level then Transmuter and Ultimate Magus for five or more levels for some spell meta and some useful low level spontaneous spellcasting.

[Ned the undead]

Master Transmogrifier from Complete Arcane! NAO!

[Jack_Simth]

Wild Mage is often funny. But really, there aren't too terribly many Transmutation-focused PrC's out there... except, as has been mentioned, Master Transmogrifist (but that loses you caster levels).

What do you have on the other side? You might think of something that complements the abilities you get from there.

[Temp.]

War Weaver (HoB) might be worth the lost caster level if you want to focus on buff spells.

Beyond that, I don't know. Anything with full casting is probably going to end up about the same.

[Proven_Paradox]

I suggest this: Bar abjuration instead of necromancy, get yourself some ray of enfeeblement and backbiter, prepare Launch Bolt tree times, forget PrC.

Transmuters are powerful enough without PrC. Focused specialist transmuters dont need anything besides new levels in Wizard.

But that's so boriiiiing. If I were going for sheer power, yeah, that's probably what I'd do--and I'd also be unwilling to lose caster levels through any means, even if I can pick them up. Also, necromancy is barred because of character background (just as transmutation is the focus instead of conjuration, in which case I would have no problems finding a PrC).

If the Precocious Apprentice feat trick works going Beguiler at first level then Transmuter and Ultimate Magus for five or more levels for some spell meta and some useful low level spontaneous spellcasting.

Precocious Apprentice definately does not work in this game.

Wild Mage is often funny. But really, there aren't too terribly many Transmutation-focused PrC's out there... except, as has been mentioned, Master Transmogrifist (but that loses you caster levels).

What do you have on the other side? You might think of something that complements the abilities you get from there.

Wild Mage has that chaotic alignment requirement, and this character just doesn't come out as chaotic to me, nor does he seem like the sort who would gravitate towards wild magic. Plus, rolling for caster level adds a lot of bookkeeping I'd rather not deal with.

Right now, on the other side is pixie racial progression. This a character concept I've never played before, so I'm not sure how things will develop as we go, but rogue or swordsage may end up on the other side when I'm done with the racial progression. I'm open to suggestions there too, but that's not really what I'm focused on right now. (No factotum, already discarded that idea.)

War Weaver (HoB) might be worth the lost caster level if you want to focus on buff spells.

Beyond that, I don't know. Anything with full casting is probably going to end up about the same.

Ah, I forgot to add a book list. It's quite long, but HoB isn't on it.

Like I said, full casting isn't a necessity, though it's certainly a plus. 2-3 caster levels lost isn't a big loss to me since I can take a level of wizard on the other side to make up for it. Much more than that, though, and it starts to cramp the other side a bit much.


Available books

Spoiler

Show

Core, Expanded Psionics, PHB II, Miniatures Handbook
Completes: Adventurer, Arcane, Divine, Mage, Psionic, Scoundrel, Warrior
Races: Destiny, Stone, Wild, Dragon
Frostburn, Sandstorm, Stormwrack
Tome of Battle, Tome of Magic
Magic of Incarnum, Dragon Magic
Unearthed Arcana
Magic Items Compendium, Spell Compendium
Savage Species

[Jack_Simth]

Wild Mage has that chaotic alignment requirement, and this character just doesn't come out as chaotic to me, nor does he seem like the sort who would gravitate towards wild magic. Plus, rolling for caster level adds a lot of bookkeeping I'd rather not deal with.

Right now, on the other side is pixie racial progression. This a character concept I've never played before, so I'm not sure how things will develop as we go, but rogue or swordsage may end up on the other side when I'm done with the racial progression. I'm open to suggestions there too, but that's not really what I'm focused on right now. (No factotum, already discarded that idea.)



Ah, I forgot to add a book list. It's quite long, but HoB isn't on it.

Like I said, full casting isn't a necessity, though it's certainly a plus. 2-3 caster levels lost isn't a big loss to me since I can take a level of wizard on the other side to make up for it. Much more than that, though, and it starts to cramp the other side a bit much.


Available books

Spoiler

Show

Core, Expanded Psionics, PHB II, Miniatures Handbook
Completes: Adventurer, Arcane, Divine, Mage, Psionic, Scoundrel, Warrior
Races: Destiny, Stone, Wild, Dragon
Frostburn, Sandstorm, Stormwrack
Tome of Battle, Tome of Magic
Magic of Incarnum, Dragon Magic
Unearthed Arcana
Magic Items Compendium, Spell Compendium
Savage Species

Okay, so with a Pixie on the other side, you've got a slight nature-theme already. A three level dip into a divine casting class on one side or the other would net you Geomancer (CD; should be permitted, as it only advances one side of your casting).

You've got a lot of stealth going on through being a Pixie; Unseen Seer could do you well (although it should be forbidden as a dual-progression class)

The Pragnostic Apostle (complete Champion) gives a bit of a divine knoweledge bent for a Wizard.

[Proven_Paradox]

Okay, so with a Pixie on the other side, you've got a slight nature-theme already. A three level dip into a divine casting class on one side or the other would net you Geomancer (CD; should be permitted, as it only advances one side of your casting).

You've got a lot of stealth going on through being a Pixie; Unseen Seer could do you well (although it should be forbidden as a dual-progression class)

The Pragnostic Apostle (complete Champion) gives a bit of a divine knoweledge bent for a Wizard.

Geomancer is one I never considered for some reason... I'll look into that.

The DM has okayed dual-progression classes. God knows why, but that makes Unseen Seer an option. The class looks good until you get to Divination Spell Power. Losing a caster level for everything but divination hurts, a lot.

CChamp isn't on that list of books allowed, so Paragonistic Apostle is out, and either way it requires affiliation with the Paragonistic Assemble. Among the costs of joining that group is required donation of at least 5% of all treasure you gain at low ranks, which increases to 10% if you go into higher ranks (which, given the affiliation score system, you undoubtedly will). The benefits for joining said group are completely negligible. (Meanwhile, all you have to do is pretend to care about the Six from Shadow to get 25% off all potions and scrolls from the Disciples of Legend. I find myself wondering if Wizards put any thought whatsoever into the affiliation options in CChamp before they published them.) Tangent aside, that's not an option.

I'mma take another look at Geomancer though.

[Jack_Simth]

Geomancer is one I never considered for some reason... I'll look into that.

Because it's a horrid PrC for non-gestalt cases. Entry requirements are similar to the Mystic Theurge, in that it requires three levels in two primary spellcasting classes if you're being efficient (Cleric/Wizard or Druid/Wizard) and more if you're not, and only advances one side - it's worse than the Mystic Theurge from a power perspective in standard play. This is anethma to most of the people who tout their character builds.

You're playing Gestalt, though, where a three level dip can go in your "off" side, and so you can keep full progression on one of the two, without getting behind on your progression. Hence it's useful here.

The DM has okayed dual-progression classes. God knows why,

Makes me wonder what he'll be throwing your way.

but that makes Unseen Seer an option. The class looks good until you get to Divination Spell Power. Losing a caster level for everything but divination hurts, a lot.

Two words: Practiced Spellcaster.

CChamp isn't on that list of books allowed, so Paragonistic Apostle is out, and either way it requires affiliation with the Paragonistic Assemble. Among the costs of joining that group is required donation of at least 5% of all treasure you gain at low ranks, which increases to 10% if you go into higher ranks (which, given the affiliation score system, you undoubtedly will). The benefits for joining said group are completely negligible. (Meanwhile, all you have to do is pretend to care about the Six from Shadow to get 25% off all potions and scrolls from the Disciples of Legend. I find myself wondering if Wizards put any thought whatsoever into the affiliation options in CChamp before they published them.) Tangent aside, that's not an option.

I'mma take another look at Geomancer though.

Cool.

[Proven_Paradox]

So, Geomancer is a really good possibility. With a level of cleric before going into it, as I understand it, I could cast arcane spells in heavy armor and with a shield (up to the spell level limit, of course, which would take a few levels to catch up to my maximum spell level, but the eventuality is nice), the gradual transformations fit this character well, and some of them are pretty useful. Favored soul or druid are a bit more likely character-wise, though. My main problem with this path is that I only have so many actions to cast my spells. Barring divine metamagic persist shenanigans (which I do not wish to participate in) I'd be dividing my time between buffing allies and arcane-y goodness, or ignoring one side all-together. I've got five levels taken up by racial progression, though, so I'll have plenty of time to ponder it. A good recommendation though, thanks for reminding me about that one.

I found another one, not so much transmutation focused as I'd like, but that might be interesting... What does the Playground collectively think of the Wild Soul in CMage? I would abuse the hell out of being able to cast Baleful Polymorph, Time Stop, and such spontaneously (hilarity ensues). Having some summon/day things are nice too. This would also leave me free to do whatever I want for the other side, rather than leaving me pigeonholed into doing something with divine spellcasting. All this for the cost of one caster level, which I can easily reclaim on the other side of the gestalt before moving on to something else.

Right now, I could go either way with those two. I'm open to new suggestions too, of course.