[3.5] Dragon proficiencies

[Ellisthion]

I have a silver dragon assuming human form. Do dragons gain any sort of proficiencies naturally? Does assuming human form give any sort of proficiency?

If I want the dragon, in human form, to wield a sword and wear a breastplate, does that necessitate spending 3 feats?

[de-trick]

im not sure, but it would not be game breaking, id rather have a dragon only have 1 or 2 sword attacks then 6-7 normal dragon attacks.

[marjan]

They are proficient with simple weapons in human form:

Dragon Type

A dragon is a reptilelike creature, usually winged, with magical or unusual abilities.
Features

A dragon has the following features.

* 12-sided Hit Dice.
* Base attack bonus equal to total Hit Dice (as fighter).
* Good Fortitude, Reflex, and Will saves.
* Skill points equal to (6 + Int modifier, minimum 1) per Hit Die, with quadruple skill points for the first Hit Die.

Traits

A dragon possesses the following traits (unless otherwise noted in the description of a particular kind).

* Darkvision out to 60 feet and low-light vision.
* Immunity to magic sleep effects and paralysis effects.
* Proficient with its natural weapons only unless humanoid in form (or capable of assuming humanoid form), in which case proficient with all simple weapons and any weapons mentioned in its entry.
* Proficient with no armor.
* Dragons eat, sleep, and breathe.

[Bag_of_Holding]

As marjan mentioned above, dragons usually do not get any weapon proficiencies (except for their natural weapons) unless they have alternate form supernatural ability (by virtue of colouration or feat) in case of which they have simple weapon proficiency. Also, they do not get any armour proficiency either- I'd rather take a level in a character class than spending 2 feats to wear a breastplate though.


Edit: If you want to wield a sword as in longsword or greatsword, you'll still have to spend a feat to gain martial weapon proficiency in a specific weapon. Unless, of course, you wanted to wield dagger/s.

[Jimp]

Could they spend their feats on proficiencies for humanoid form?

[marjan]

Could they spend their feats on proficiencies for humanoid form?

Well, nothing in the description of the Alternate Form says that you loose your proficiencies, so I don't see why not.

[KillianHawkeye]

Technically, they would retain proficiency even when in dragon form as well. Basically, it doesn't matter if you are capable of wielding the weapon, you can still be proficient in it.

Anyway, don't dragons have a high enough attack bonus that they can just eat the -4 nonproficiency penalty?

[Tsotha-lanti]

If I want the dragon, in human form, to wield a sword and wear a breastplate, does that necessitate spending 3 feats?

Yes, it does.

Giving the dragon one fighter level, though, gives it all those proficiencies without the feat expenditure, plus another feat, and is worth +½ CR.

But like KillianHawkeye says, dragons don't really care, most of the time.

[nargbop]

Hee! Colossal-sized sword wielded by a gold dragon with Fighter levels!

[DigoDragon]

Anyway, don't dragons have a high enough attack bonus that they can just eat the -4 nonproficiency penalty?

They're Dragons, they eat ANYthing.
But yeah, when you have a high enough attack bonus (Dragon, high-level fighter, etc.), a little -4 penalty becomes trivial. Oh, don't forget Dragons get to keep their spellcasting to boot so they could probably throw a few enchantments on their weapon to negate the penalties anyway.