Looking for Sacred Fist Suggestions

[Haakon]

I'm playing a Human 2nd level Monk/4th level Cleric/3rd level Sacred fist in an upcoming game. I have most of the build figured out, but I am still looking for a few suggestions for feats.

*Feat needed for prestige class.

Human Feat:
1st level Feat: Improved Natural Attack
Bonus Feat: Improved Unarmed Strike*
1st level Monk Feat: Stunning Fist*
2nd level Monk Feat: Combat Reflexes*
3rd level Feat:Combat Casting*
6th level Feat:Superior Unarmed Strike
9th level Feat:

Alright, so I have a free spot at 1st level and at 9th level (at which I will have a +7 BAB, in case your curious). Right now I'm punching as a level 14 Large Monk (level 14 due to: Monk 2 + SF 3 + Monk's Belt 5 + Feat 4) for 3d6 + Strength. I don't have stats yet, since the game starts in a few days and I plan on rolling there. I wouldn't mind leaving a slot open to take a feat for Wis or Dex to hit, to reduce MAD. If there are any decent Divine feats as well, but remember Charisma won't exactly be a primary stat, so its likely to be low. I think about DMM, but would need a metamagic feat that has less then a 2 level increase to get more then 1 use out of it.

Thanks for the suggestions.

Edit: There, no longer scared of Fists!

[Kaihaku]

Scared Fist? What's it afraid of? Sorry, I don't normally point such out but that's a funny typo.

[Epinephrine]

Eeeeeeeeek!

[Vortling]

Intuitive attack from BoED gives Wis to attack with simple weapons, such as your fists. If you can spare the feats and are allowed, Quicken DMM could save you buffing time.

[Frosty]

GO Ur priest instead of Cleric

[Eldariel]

Ur-Priest is broken - if you want a really kickass character, that's the way to go. Anyways, I'd consider Archivist as well - Archivist Spell List contains numbers like Lion's Charge that would be really useful (at the cost of only being able to enter Sacred Fist a bit later though). If not, I'd probably consider Open Least Chakra: Hands and Shape Soulmeld: Sphinx Claws (Magic of Incarnum) to gain Pounce - the single most important ability any Monk can have, and especially important for a Monk who intends on dealing damage like a Sacred Fist.

Also, as said, Intuitive Attack is great. In fact, they're so great that I'd skip Superior Unarmed Strike down the line and pick up Intuitive Attack and the Soulmeld-feats for now to allow you to truly deliver Flurries and to hit (then just focus on pimping out Wis). This would make you hit far, far more accurately. DMM: Persist or DMM: Quicken would both obviously improve the build by a score, but they'd pretty much eat up your open feat slots for the early levels. Still, it'd probably be worth it to get DMM. I'd go for them in the next slots - Extend Spell can be gained through Planning-domain which seems quite in-flavour for a Monk.

Also, I'd consider (if using fractional BAB) Monk 1/Cleric 5/Sacred Fist 3 instead simply because you'll still reach level 11 base Monk Unarmed Strike which goes level 20 with Superior and Monk's Belt, and because the extra level of casting is much more valuable at this point than Evasion and feat (since the feat comes from such a limited list). Either way, ask your DM to have your Sacred Fist-levels stack with Monk-levels for Stunning Fist - it's idiotic that the class requires for you to have Stunning Fist to enter and then doesn't give you any extra uses or anything for it throughout the entire progression.

[MeklorIlavator]

Doesn't monk get Improved unarmed strike as a bonus feat at first level? That should free up another feat slot.

[Leon]

I'm playing a Human 2nd level Monk/4th level Cleric/3rd level Sacred fist in an upcoming game. I have most of the build figured out, but I am still looking for a few suggestions for feats.

*Feat needed for prestige class.

Human Feat:
1st level Feat: Improved Natural Attack
Bonus Feat: Improved Unarmed Strike*
1st level Monk Feat: Stunning Fist*
2nd level Monk Feat: Combat Reflexes*
3rd level Feat:Combat Casting*
6th level Feat:Superior Unarmed Strike
9th level Feat:

Improved natural Attack has a +4 BAB requirement and thusly cant be taken at 1st level

[BobVosh]

Human Feat: Extra Turning
1st level Feat: Combat Casting*
Bonus Feat: Improved Unarmed Strike*
1st level Monk Feat: Stunning Fist*
2nd level Monk Feat: Combat Reflexes*
3rd level Feat:Quicken
6th level Feat:Superior Unarmed Strike
9th level Feat:DMM:Quicken

[ocato]

Well, when you're placing stats, keep in mind that you're looking at 4th level casting too. With 4th level spells you can Greater Magic Weapon (I think monk unarmed strikes can be hit with that, not 100% sure), Magic Vestment, and Divine Power yourself to avoid anything seeming too low. It's not perfect but it'll keep you in the running. Another nice way of using those turnings is Divine Spellpower, which will help catch up level dependent spells with a simple turning roll. Spontaneous Wounder (If you go LN and choose to spontaneously cast cure spells) isn't bad for subbing in your inflicts for punches. When playing a cleric, it's always good to prepare for the ridiculous and spontaneous-casting yourself out of wasting spell slots. If you haven't chosen your domains yet, I'd suggest something pretty standard like Strength, War, or something else you'll get a good run out of the spells from. Of course something a bit off like Cold isn't terrible either (You'll get miles out of Chill Touch, I guarantee it). All in all, just try to have fun with it. Sacred fist is one of the character ideas I've always wanted to try but never have. I hope it works out well for you!

[Adumbration]

If you have Dragon Magic, you should definitely drop the Improved Natural Attack, and buy Fang Ring. Gives Improved Natural Attack (unarmed strike) and Improved Unarmed Strike as feats, plus when you crit, you deal 1 con damage.

For the petty cost of 10 000.

[Haakon]

I plan on being Good, so Ur-Priest is out.

Archivist requires Int for spell casting, so that makes me even more MAD then a normal monk. We don't use fractional BAB, Monk 2 saves me a feat slot (yes I know I'm not supposed to lose any caster levels, but this character is more for fun and trying something new, rather then showing up everyone else).

I'll go take a look at the soulmeld feats (since I have never looked in that book before).

Didn't know that about Improved Natural attack, I'll take a look at it again and figure out if its worth it or not.

My domain choice is huge, but very limited and none of them really stand out at all.

Spending 3 feats (Extra Turning, Quicken and DMM: Quicken), just so I can have 1 quickened spell a day, just doesn't seem worth it to me.

Considering I only have a budget of 36,000 gold, try to find room for a Fang Ring isn't going to happen.

The class is something I have wanted to play for a while, but never had the chance too. We will see how it goes.

[Aneantir]

IMy domain choice is huge, but very limited and none of them really stand out at all.

Travel Domain. Take the Travel Devotion feat in place of the Travel Domain ability. Move your movespeed as a swift action for 1 minute. Spend 2 turning attempts per activation after the first.

[mostlyharmful]

Bear in mind that even if you aquire Pounce through Sphinx Claws you still can't use the Flurry action after moving, Flurry is a full round action distinct from Full Attacking I'm afraid. Very choice material for a Homebrew re-ruling but there you go.

[Rad]

Travel Domain. Take the Travel Devotion feat in place of the Travel Domain ability. Move your movespeed as a swift action for 1 minute. Spend 2 turning attempts per activation after the first.

A sacred fist NEEDS travel devotion. Get it no matter what.

[Lyndworm]

I don't mean to derail the thread, but could anyone tell me in which book is Superior Unarmed Strike? Thanks.

Zack

[Fax Celestis]

I don't mean to derail the thread, but could anyone tell me in which book is Superior Unarmed Strike? Thanks.

Zack

Tome of Battle.

[Durendal]

"A monk must use a full attack action to strike with a flurry of blows."

Quoted from the SRD

Flurry of Blows requires a full attack action and thus can be used with a pouncing charge.

[Eldariel]

Tome of Battle.

Same goes for Snap Kick, the other Unarmed booster. And Stormguard Warrior, the quinessential Two-Weapon Fighting booster too for that matter (and seeing that TWFing unarmed is one of the better ways to work it out, it ain't bad for Unarmed either...). In fact, every combat style but Power Attacking gets so much better with ToB (and even Power Attack gets the maneuvered Charges that don't provoke and deal extra)...

[Chronos]

And Superior Unarmed Strike and Snap Kick don't even need any of the new mechanics (maneuvers etc.) from Tome of Battle. They're perfectly usable even if they're the only things you use from that book.

[Xan]

I'm also working on a sacred fist, level 9, for an upcoming run through Tomb of Horrors. I was wondering, does anyone know of any Cleric/Monk hybrid feats out there?

[Keld Denar]

Don't sell out Improved Grapple. In an adventure with mostly humanoid foes, this can be pretty crippling. When you hulk up all the way with Divine Powah and Righteous Might, you get a sizeable bonus to str, size, and BAB, making grappling a fairly advantageous strat. Plus, you do all your unarmed strike damage often enough. Plus, you can "flurry" in a grapple, using each of your subsequent attacks to progress the grapple into the pinned stage.

Travel Devotion is massive. Dump all your extraneous turn attempts into that, if you can. You want to be able to use it in ~4 encounters a day.

A decent finisher for SF is Ordained Champion from CChampion. Its a Heironeous only PrC, but adaptable to just about any lawful diety depending on your setting. Gets some neato abilities, including the ability to autoquicken your Divine Powah spell. Entry reqs aren't to bad either. You probably won't get too much use out of the smite ability since you won't have many turn attempts, but the rest of it is decent.

[Talya]

GO Ur priest instead of Cleric

The irony of taking a class called "Sacred Fist" with the fluff behind an Ur-Priest is, I hope, not lost on you.

[Keld Denar]

The irony of taking a class called "Sacred Fist" with the fluff behind an Ur-Priest is, I hope, not lost on you.

Nah, its a pretty common build, often nicknamed Sacreligious Fist, due to the godhating nature of the class. Nothing in it keeps you from being an evil bastard, you just to be able to turn undead and other stuff.

Also, an oft overlooked spell is Earth Hammer, in Races of Stone. Its a swift spell that lasts rounds/lvl, and increases the size catagory of your weapon by 1. You'll be swinging a gargantuan fist about, not too shabby. Also, if you can either get polymorphed or killed/reincarnated as a dwarf, the spell also grants your weapon the Adamantine type to overcome hardness and DR. Not too shabby for a 3rd level spell.

If one of your party members is a wizard, get em to memorize you a copy of Greater Mighty Wallop, a 3rd level spell from Races of the Dragon. Increases the size catagory of your bludgeoning weapon by 1/4 CLs. Its that good! Unfortunately, it doesn't appear on any domain lists, and per the FAQ, Extra Spell won't get you it, but its an all day buff, so if you could get it cast on you in the morning, you'd be good all day provided you don't get dispelled.

[Talya]

Nah, its a pretty common build, often nicknamed Sacreligious Fist, due to the godhating nature of the class. Nothing in it keeps you from being an evil bastard, you just to be able to turn undead and other stuff.

Also, an oft overlooked spell is Earth Hammer, in Races of Stone. Its a swift spell that lasts rounds/lvl, and increases the size catagory of your weapon by 1. You'll be swinging a gargantuan fist about, not too shabby. Also, if you can either get polymorphed or killed/reincarnated as a dwarf, the spell also grants your weapon the Adamantine type to overcome hardness and DR. Not too shabby for a 3rd level spell.

If one of your party members is a wizard, get em to memorize you a copy of Greater Mighty Wallop, a 3rd level spell from Races of the Dragon. Increases the size catagory of your bludgeoning weapon by 1/4 CLs. Its that good! Unfortunately, it doesn't appear on any domain lists, and per the FAQ, Extra Spell won't get you it, but its an all day buff, so if you could get it cast on you in the morning, you'd be good all day provided you don't get dispelled.

I'd say the cheese factor here is incredible, except you're paying for it by playing a monk. Still, a monk with full "cleric" casting is actually decent...

[Keld Denar]

I'd say the cheese factor here is incredible, except you're paying for it by playing a monk.

Could have been worse...could have just told him DROOD20 NOOB and he'd have a much better unarmed attacker with better buffs and spellcasting.

Ur-Priest, other than being obscenely cheezy is actually pretty neato flavor wise. You are basically stealing magic from the gods, and laughing at them for it. Sacred Fist is just using your extreme insight and divine connection to punch people in the face.

Ur-Priest is kind of like...a person stealing a wireless signal from the neighbors. What you do with that signal is your own choice. You can hack someone's bank account, or donate to the Red Cross, or just log on and play WoW. It matters not how you got if, after you've gotten it, as long as its always available. The Sacreligious Fist just uses his stolen internets to cast Divine Powah and send punches via email.

[Starbuck_II]

Could have been worse...could have just told him DROOD20 NOOB and he'd have a much better unarmed attacker with better buffs and spellcasting.

Ur-Priest, other than being obscenely cheezy is actually pretty neato flavor wise. You are basically stealing magic from the gods, and laughing at them for it. Sacred Fist is just using your extreme insight and divine connection to punch people in the face.

Ur-Priest is kind of like...a person stealing a wireless signal from the neighbors. What you do with that signal is your own choice. You can hack someone's bank account, or donate to the Red Cross, or just log on and play WoW. It matters not how you got if, after you've gotten it, as long as its always available. The Sacreligious Fist just uses his stolen internets to cast Divine Powah and send punches via email.

Bluff 6 ranks: how do you qualify?
It isn't a Cleric, Monk, or Sacred Fist Class skill.

So how do you get that? Multiclass into Rogue or Beguiler?

[Keld Denar]

Bluff 6 ranks: how do you qualify?
It isn't a Cleric, Monk, or Sacred Fist Class skill.

So how do you get that? Multiclass into Rogue or Beguiler?

Errr....I'm pretty sure theres a feat like Apprentice or something lying around that give you a skill as a class skill. Otherwise, a 1 level dip into Warlock or something would work, and give a nice all day least invocation.