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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    DruidGuy

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    Sep 2007

    Default Elan VS V's Veiws as a player conflict

    I know at least one of you hates the role play vs roll play pun, but its relevant here.

    To V's "player", the gam..erm.. quest, is a linear series of obstacles to overcome, which give you experience, which let you overcome more obstacles, untill you can complete the final que..ermm. save the world. WHY therkla, Kubato, and the demon need to be defeated is an irrelevant waste of precious brain power. They're just a block of stats, special abilities, HP and AC. Thats it. Beat them, collect the xp and move on. He's not immersed in the game, so he treats it like a game.



    To elan's player, actualy getting to the resolution is almost irrelevant. Its the journey that matters. The drama, the relationships, the interactions, the love and tensions are what matters, and all the world saving stuff and combat is just a smaller, less important element that drives the rest of the story. He's fully immersed in the game, so he treats the people like they're as real as he is.

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Tempest Fennac's Avatar

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    Default Re: Elan VS V's Veiws as a player conflict

    That is an interresting way of looking at it (I tend to be a mixture of both due to attempting to RP convincingly while primarily being more concerned with the end rusult).
    "It doesn't matter what you think I'm supposed to be, 'cause I myself know all too well." Line from "King of My World" by Saliva.
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  3. - Top - End - #3
    Dwarf in the Playground
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    Default Re: Elan VS V's Veiws as a player conflict

    Definitely possible. V recently sounds a lot more like the idiot at the table who has a hard time concentrating to the game and getting immersed with the story (Happens a lot of times, mostly after the 10th session or so) and the others seem to be trying to knock some sense into hir with strictly in-game endeavors. Interesting... Maybe the DM is at fault, or shhe represents a few of us who hate this direction of the strip in general.

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Dwarf in the Playground
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    Default Re: Elan VS V's Veiws as a player conflict

    I think V's "player" simply got bored of endless subplots and story derailing(s) and started power playing.
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  5. - Top - End - #5
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Kaihaku's Avatar

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    Default Re: Elan VS V's Veiws as a player conflict

    Well... Elan's shifts around actually fit with a player like that very well.
    Umuntu ngumuntu ngabantu.

    Your living is determined not so much by what life brings to you as by the attitude you bring to life; not so much by what happens to you as by the way your mind looks at what happens.
    ~Kahlil Gibran

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Warren Dew's Avatar

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    Jun 2008

    Default Re: Elan VS V's Veiws as a player conflict

    derfenrirwolv, I think there might be some validity to what you're saying. However, I'd suggest a modified set of descriptions with a different bias to balance the view:

    'To elan's player, actualy getting to the resolution is almost irrelevant. As long as the play focuses on the story of his own character - his character's relationships, his character's interactions, the love and tensions between his character and others - he's happy. All the world saving stuff and combat is a small, unimportant element that just provides a backdrop for his story. Involving NPCs with his character is especially valuable, since that avoids wasting spotlight time on the other players' characters and allows the other players to concentrate on being an appreciative audience for him; for this reason, he treats the those particular NPCs as being as real as his character is.

    'To Vaarsuvius' player, the story is there to provide a series of interesting encounters for the players to overcome together. Each encounter provides for character advancement, which lets the group overcome more and more difficult obstacles until they can finally complete the long term goal of saving the world. Therkla and Kubota were irrelevant side plots tossed in just to please the spotlight hog and waste everyone else's time; the demon was similar, though at least it provided an interesting opponent.'
    Last edited by Warren Dew; 2008-09-29 at 10:41 PM.

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    DruidGuy

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    Sep 2007

    Default Re: Elan VS V's Veiws as a player conflict

    As long as the play focuses on the story of his own character - his character's relationships, his character's interactions, the love and tensions between his character and others - he's happy

    Given how happy Elan is for other people's sub plots

    http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0471.html

    I don't think he needs to be the one having emotional/character development as long as SOMEONE's getting it. I don't think he's the emo spotlight hog you're making him out to be. He didn't ask V why heshe wasn't crying over a lost lute or the death of "the guy with a halbard" he was asking V about one person V had killed in cold blood and another person V had just sat there and watched for 10 minutes. He doesn't understand why V isn't enjoying the story

    'To Vaarsuvius' player, the story is there to provide a series of interesting encounters for the players to overcome together.
    V NEEDS to win. Its not enough for him to be good or interesting he needs to win. V was AWSOME during the battle for azure city. He took out the elementals, and held the gap with some creative buffs and maximizing the effective warrior level/foot ^2 at the gap. Except against the Mounted undead,every spell he used was used to its upmost effectiveness.
    It wasn't enough because he lost.

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Elan VS V's Veiws as a player conflict

    When to me, its rollplay all the way!
    Strange,I expected that to rhyme.
    Anyway, when it comes to morals, elan scores a touchdown.
    When it comes to power, V sends him FLYING.
    Credit for my various avatars goes to Dashwood,Cealocanth,Kwarkpudding,Randomizer,kpengu in,Alarra,Bisected8,zimmerwald1915, and Thanqol.

    Once known as "Gamerkid".

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Pixie in the Playground
     
    BarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: Elan VS V's Veiws as a player conflict

    Quote Originally Posted by Warren Dew View Post
    derfenrirwolv, I think there might be some validity to what you're saying. However, I'd suggest a modified set of descriptions with a different bias to balance the view:

    'To elan's player, actualy getting to the resolution is almost irrelevant. As long as the play focuses on the story of his own character - his character's relationships, his character's interactions, the love and tensions between his character and others - he's happy. All the world saving stuff and combat is a small, unimportant element that just provides a backdrop for his story. Involving NPCs with his character is especially valuable, since that avoids wasting spotlight time on the other players' characters and allows the other players to concentrate on being an appreciative audience for him; for this reason, he treats the those particular NPCs as being as real as his character is.'
    I agree with this statement. With the small modification of the argument that Elan's player can show patience as long as the other players subplots are considerably shorter then his.

    Quote Originally Posted by Warren Dew View Post
    derfenrirwolv,'To Vaarsuvius' player, the story is there to provide a series of interesting encounters for the players to overcome together. Each encounter provides for character advancement, which lets the group overcome more and more difficult obstacles until they can finally complete the long term goal of saving the world. Therkla and Kubota were irrelevant side plots tossed in just to please the spotlight hog and waste everyone else's time; the demon was similar, though at least it provided an interesting opponent.'
    I also agree with this assessment albeit I'd like to add that V's player argues that V is a more intellectual player and considers the grand scheme of things instead of what in his/her mind is petty roadblocks in the way of saving the world. To V's hypothetical player's defense He/she is playing her character just as well as Elan's taking into account the fact that His/her character's motivations focuses upon arcane power which will not be able to be achieved by the world comming out of it's own ass.

  10. - Top - End - #10
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Scarlet Knight's Avatar

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    Hudson Valley, NY
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    Default Re: Elan VS V's Veiws as a player conflict

    A player who chooses a bard often feels left out during dungeon quests ("Go ahead, Bard, sing at them!") But when he can roleplay - love won & lost, diplomacy, intrigue- he's in his element.

    No so all other characters. V & Durkin's players are basically sitting around watching Elan get his turn in the spotlight.

    I think we've all played with a player who just wants the game to change direction & goes "$#&* this!" and blows something up just to force a plot change.

    Thus, one of the earliest learned D&D rules of DMing: Never split up the party.

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Pixie in the Playground
     
    BarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: Elan VS V's Veiws as a player conflict

    True but since Elan took that Prestigeclass he's a more active combatant.

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