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  1. - Top - End - #301
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    MindFlayer

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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Dalek Kommander View Post
    Neutral Evil is just pure Evil, with no fixed loyalty to Law or Chaos to get conflicted over.
    GOT YOU!!!

    I knew you'd slip some time.

    Neutral should not exist on the Law/Chaos axis.

    Which I said a couple of strips ago and you dismissed.

    Now you're saying the same thing.

    I Win!!!

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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by RMS Oceanic View Post
    Haley was aphasiac for almost 150 strips, and people felt that was long. The pay off at the end was worth it, so hopefully, so will Roy's revival.
    But at least during Haley's inability to talk, the plot kept going.
    Last edited by Lord Seth; 2008-10-09 at 01:47 PM.

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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    I gotta say, I've read so many long arc webcomics that this doesn't feel terribly long to me. Personally, I have enjoyed every bit of it.

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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Avilan the Grey View Post
    I must say that I am starting to feel bored with OOTS. I have spent a long time now waiting for the Order to get their act together and actually follow some kind of plot, but instead it is quite obvious that the Order is No More, and probably never will be again. Instead we are going to be treated to more and more plot-jumping and lack of progress (and please don't give me the "character growth" thing, you know what I mean with progress).

    I have realized several strips ago that we will never see Roy again. I have come to understand that the Order will never be reunited, and if they meet again it will be as enemies.
    In the commentary for "War and XPs", it's stated pretty obviously that Roy will come back.

    EDIT: Exact words: "Rest assured that bringing the team back together will have a cost--a heavy toll paid by one member of the Order that could change them forever."

    This states clearly that the Order will come back together at some point.
    Last edited by Lord Seth; 2008-10-09 at 01:50 PM.

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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    All those 'gotcha' questions. He'll be asking what comic newspaper he reads next.

    Have to say tho', I really hope these darkest days are just before the dawn. Any group of players I know playing these characters would have given up on their GM and wandered off to play World of Warcraft or formed a new roleplaying group by now. Roy's player would have slipped into a catatonic state a month or so ago, and V's player would be denied pizza for buggering up the group's chances still further.

    btw, whatever happened to team evil? haven't heard from them in ages.

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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    I actually find Elan's complete lack of any facial expression whatsoever for the entire first page to be disturbing on a level that the ominous foreshadowing involving Qarr does not quite reach yet. I guess it seems more out of character than V's behavior. V's always been arrogant, this isn't the first time she's called Elan an idiot, and she's never had any particular loyalty to the paladins of Azure City. She feels her companions are dragging her into time consuming affairs in which she has no personal stake and distracts from what's really relevant, so this seems like a natural progression.

    I would wager her feelings were hurt more than she'd care to admit when Elan said that Therkla had greater depth than she did. Dammit, Elan, I love you and I love your character development in general, but that was not cool.

    So it seems like things are being set up that Vaarsuvius will be the one to "pay a heavy toll" in bringing the Order back together, but the way he's developing, I can't help but wonder if that's a red herring and Elan will be the one to make a sacrifice. Either way, whatever's going on with him may be subtler than what's going on with V, but there's definitely something going on.

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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    Hmm. It may be just me but Elan seems to have already paid a price. After all, it was his refusal to partner up with Therkla that resulted in her permanent death, that's a heavy burden for such a fun-loving fellow to bear.

    Just went and read some of the earlier posts - looks like I'm not the only one getting a bit depressed. I do take the point that if I were reading it in book form I'd be zipping ahead to find out what happens, but I liked Oots because it was fun and reminded me of how much fun RP could be. I don't recall ever playing such a depressing campaign - my groups always liked a challenge but if the GM got too heavy we'd steal his dice until he let up.

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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Seth View Post
    EDIT: Exact words: "Rest assured that bringing the team back together will have a cost--a heavy toll paid by one member of the Order that could change them forever."
    Hehe, you should have spoiler-tagged that. Now I'm pretty sure Vaarsuvius is being set up as the toll-payer...
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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Terbovus View Post
    Hmm. It may be just me but Elan seems to have already paid a price. After all, it was his refusal to partner up with Therkla that resulted in her permanent death, that's a heavy burden for such a fun-loving fellow to bear.

    Just went and read some of the earlier posts - looks like I'm not the only one getting a bit depressed. I do take the point that if I were reading it in book form I'd be zipping ahead to find out what happens, but I liked Oots because it was fun and reminded me of how much fun RP could be. I don't recall ever playing such a depressing campaign - my groups always liked a challenge but if the GM got too heavy we'd steal his dice until he let up.
    I think everyone is going to pay some kind of price, but there is one member who is going to suffer much more than the others. I'm still thinking it is going to be either Belkar or V.
    Here are two good sites for Dragon Cave dragons.
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    http://dusk.datavibe.net/draco/index.php
    http://www.sotidragon.net/

    You just put your dragons on there and they'll get the clicks you need. And you can also click other people's dragons as well. I hope this helps.

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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by banjo1985 View Post
    Well, all I can say is good. Nice to get rid of V for a while,
    While this is a guess, this may well mean we are going to see more of V, not less. He has mostly been off camera studying up til now, but the next
    10+ strips may be entirely V.

    Quote Originally Posted by banjo1985 View Post
    This fragments the Order further, but I can see Durkon and Elan getting more done now they don't have to watch a half crazy elf all the time.
    But what are they to do? They are helping the fleet, which is pretty much going nowhere until Xykon leaves Azure City. We can create one easily enough, but right now we have virtually no plotline for them.

    Quote Originally Posted by pjackson
    The scene shows V's tactical errors clearly.
    V initially refuses to cooperate and blasts away ineffectually.
    Meanwhile Durkan and Hinjo cooperate and wound the devil.
    Then V changes tactics, asks for Durkon's assistance and together they take down the devil.
    Yet at the end, Dunkon is saying V was passing up a chance to say 'I told you so.' In other words that V was right and the others were at fault for not following her lead instead of suggesting alternate things he could do. [Durkon of course also offers the claim the tactic was risky, but the counter 'it worked, didn't it?' hardly needs to be stated]
    Assistance works two ways, and on the face of it, it was the others who were at any fault for not assisting V.

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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Terbovus View Post
    All those 'gotcha' questions. He'll be asking what comic newspaper he reads next.

    Have to say tho', I really hope these darkest days are just before the dawn. Any group of players I know playing these characters would have given up on their GM and wandered off to play World of Warcraft or formed a new roleplaying group by now. Roy's player would have slipped into a catatonic state a month or so ago, and V's player would be denied pizza for buggering up the group's chances still further.

    btw, whatever happened to team evil? haven't heard from them in ages.
    Yeah that's been my problem; things are taking way too long, especially considering that none of this has anything to do with the main plot. The Therkla subplot went on too long considering it went absolutely nowhere, for example. Another example is that in what I consider to be massively out-of-character stupidity, Celia took Roy over to Greysky City to get him resurrected (we all know how that turned out), when if we hadn't bothered with that he'd be back by now most likely. Here we had a point where it looked like progress was being made, but then we just got thrown a sidequest that was caused by what I still consider to be a completely idiotic move by someone who is supposed to be more intelligent than that.

    My main problem with the most recent few strips is that it looked like things were winding down and we'd finally have some real progress, but then that was seemingly thrown out the window with this strip. I guess I'll reserve judgement until 600, but if I don't see any kind of real progress by then I'm going to be annoyed.
    Last edited by Lord Seth; 2008-10-09 at 03:27 PM.

  12. - Top - End - #312
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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Terbovus View Post
    All those 'gotcha' questions. He'll be asking what comic newspaper he reads next.
    Yay, someone else was amused by the Palin joke! C'mon, I know OotS has an international fanbase, but there have to be more people who find that funny.

    Quote Originally Posted by Terbovus View Post
    btw, whatever happened to team evil? haven't heard from them in ages.
    What about the bit with O-Chul? Wasn't that long ago.
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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    Warning, MASSIVE sod spoiler. There about 50% of the story main plot points below.

    Spoiler
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    Team evil has been down in Azure City for now six months if I recall correctly. I'm of course assuming that Daigo didn't waste any time mating after they left. This is disturbing. I don't think the "must learn more about the gates before we move on" excuse could satisfy Xykon that long. Sod gave me thoughs that this + 2 to intelligence you get by transforming into a Lich has gave him enough brains to realise that Redcloak knows he can't learn anything else around the city.

    Therefore, if they a still sitting there, doing nothing, Xykon has an intrest in doing so. It could be that he believes no existing force can now stop him for getting the next gate, so he can take his time and let Redcloak resolve the matter of the new goblin nation.

    Speaking of which, if Reddie truly puts his mind to it, and I think he's doing that right now, his ultimate goal which is to establish a fully fonctionnal goblin nation his being furfilled at the moment. Why would he need to further the Plan any longer? Because then he would have the assurance nobody would try to retake the city by fear of the Snarl? I stand pretty convinced that's not enough of a reason to further endanger the fabric of the universe. I would rather seek a way to re-seal the gates and try my luck of uniting all goblins of the world into one big nation which would use the Azurite ancient territorry has their new fertile country. And maybe work out with the other races of the world to be diplomatically regonized has a race worthy of sharing the world with them fairly.

    That would imply getting rid of Xykon, fast. And throw away all that "I killed my brother so now if I turn back on my ideas he would have died in vain" crap and just addmit he was mistaken when he did so and that now he should seek the forgiveness of his departed brother by actually letting go of the Plan and try something less insane that using a god-killing abomination as a tool, which sounds, and always did, VERY risky.


    Oh well, I guess we'll just wait and see what comes up on #600 :)
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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    Great strip. I'd probably be more concerned here if I were particularly attached to V as a character. Oh, poor Elan...
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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    I have to say I've been worried about V for quite some time. S/he has been looking really stressed ever since the messenger bird incident (which was hilarious!)
    Can't wait to see what happens next.
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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    V made his/her choice to leave. That imp out smarted V once, I am thinking it could do so again. V also might have made a choice to leave based on past events. Even if V runs into Haley and Roy, I am thinking what V has done will cause problems. Most wizards even the rather powerful ones cant take on great numbers all at once and the odds on V getting arrested are good. Elan was alittle impressive there, he may not have agreed with what V did, but he didnt turn in his team mate. It is possible that the imp knocks out V also and he is saved by Durkon, Elan, and crew.

    To the ones that want to see Hinjo join the party, I dont think that will happen. He is a ruler and he still has alot of work to do for his own people.

    It will be interesting to see where this leads though. I am hoping Haley got Roy raised by now.

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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by esmerelder View Post
    *sobs* This is worse than Season Six of Buffy!
    Apart from the musical episode, NOTHING is worse than Season Six of Buffy!



    Except maybe season seven...

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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    I really do hope V becomes a Lich. Maybe join Xykon. Just maybe. Two liches working together doesn't look right though, especially to male Mage liches. V is working his way to Arthas's path. Think he's doing the write thing, goes to the dark side, finally becomes the Lich King or in our case, a lich like Kel'Thuzard.

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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    I am sure someone mentioned, but I love V's reference to The Rime of the Ancient Mariner. The albatross quote.
    Last edited by Obrysii; 2008-10-09 at 08:21 PM.
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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    I don't really think it was a reference. I think that was just a common belief back then...
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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Boogastreehouse View Post
    Apart from the musical episode, NOTHING is worse than Season Six of Buffy!



    Except maybe season seven...
    Actually I thought the episodes preceding and the one episode immediately following the musical episode were pretty good. It just all went to heck after "Tabula Rasa".

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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Gentoo44 View Post
    I don't really think it was a reference. I think that was just a common belief back then...
    "Albatross around the neck" is not a phrase I am familiar with in other contexts beyond the poem, nor does a google search return anything but references to the poem.

    The fact they're out on a ship doesn't help.
    Last edited by Obrysii; 2008-10-09 at 09:24 PM.
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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Stormoverkrynn View Post
    It is possible that the imp knocks out V also and he is saved by Durkon, Elan, and crew.
    That imp is just a lousy imp. No, he does not have any fantastic physical powers. As a mage, V is not likely to be much of a physical powerhouse either, but she can still likely take the imp without using his spells.
    The imp's danger is from temptation. He may be able to offer V what she very much wants. He is not going to have to attack him.

    Quote Originally Posted by Stormoverkrynn View Post
    It will be interesting to see where this leads though. I am hoping Haley got Roy raised by now.
    Haley at this point in comic time is just meeting the cleric, and has yet to recover Roy, or deal with her old friend.

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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Dalek Kommander
    Neutral Evil is just pure Evil, with no fixed loyalty to Law or Chaos to get conflicted over.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eric View Post
    GOT YOU!!!

    I knew you'd slip some time.

    Neutral should not exist on the Law/Chaos axis.

    Which I said a couple of strips ago and you dismissed.

    Now you're saying the same thing.

    I Win!!!
    No, neutrality is STILL the midpoint on the axis between law and chaos, much like zero is a NUMBER between positive and negative numbers. If I said zero wasn't positive or negative, would you shout that I've "slipped up" and admitted that zero isn't a number?

    If that question sounds familiar, it's because it's basically the same thing I said last time. Nothing about my arguement has changed, and nothing about my argument contradicts what I said: netural evil people have no allegiance to law or chaos, because they are at the midpoint between law and chaos. All other things being equal, they're just as likely to choose one option as the other.
    Last edited by Dalek Kommander; 2008-10-09 at 10:16 PM.

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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by drakokirby View Post
    I really do hope V becomes a Lich. Maybe join Xykon. Just maybe. Two liches working together doesn't look right though, especially to male Mage liches. V is working his way to Arthas's path. Think he's doing the write thing, goes to the dark side, finally becomes the Lich King or in our case, a lich like Kel'Thuzard.
    Why would she become a lich. as pointed out by me and others that would be a step DOWN in arcane power not up. It is a +4 LA which means V would lose a lot of spells per day.

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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Seth View Post
    EDIT: Exact words: "Rest assured that bringing the team back together will have a cost--a heavy toll paid by one member of the Order that could change them forever."

    This states clearly that the Order will come back together at some point.
    All I'm sayin, V better be paying the price for being so mean lately...

    V is working his way to Arthas's path.
    Oh noes, that is not good...
    Last edited by link55557; 2008-10-09 at 11:34 PM.
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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by brilliantlight View Post
    Why would she become a lich. as pointed out by me and others that would be a step DOWN in arcane power not up. It is a +4 LA which means V would lose a lot of spells per day.
    That isn't how becoming a lich works.

    If V is level 13 and becomes a Lich, it won't make him a Lich 4 / Wizard 9, it'll make him a Lich 4 / Wizard 13, he won't GAIN Wizard Levels until he gets the experience to become an 18th level character, but he wouldn't -lose- anything (well, in the long run he would...)
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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    Hooray for the Arthas theory, that game rocked!

    Still, I find it highly unlikely...

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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Alces View Post
    Hehe, you should have spoiler-tagged that. Now I'm pretty sure Vaarsuvius is being set up as the toll-payer...
    Really? I would've went for
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    in that scenario.

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    Default Re: OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

    Oh snap. Why am I suddenly seeing V taking control of one of the gates and either using the power of the Skein or else releasing it? What has more power than the hate and rage of four pantheons?

    Uh oh...

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