OOTS #599 - The Discussion Thread

[Estovus]

Lots of things are at the DM's discretion. I would prefer to avoid throwing things randomly into the 'discretion' category.

You'd have to be insane if, as a DM, you wouldn't make discussing strategy in the middle of a battle cost actions.

I'll half agree there. Durkon spent time - if your previous use of discretion is accurate - trying to talk strategy with Vaarsuvius. If V wasn't there, then they might not have wasted that time.

Are you suggesting they could've won the battle more easily without V? Because if so, I think your bias against her is clouding your judgement more than just a little bit.

Are you suggesting that Xykon and Redcloak wouldn't be any less of a threat without the army at their back? I find that highly improbable. So why is the OotS not helped at all by an army at theirs?

In theory, yes. We'll never know, because they do have an army, but insofar as they're the main driving force of the main characters, they would be no less of a threat.

[chiasaur11]

As some have said, there is NO WAY this bodes well for anyone.

Also, Dire half-dragon bone-eating saltwater werepiranahs must be added to more campaigns.

[teratorn]

Tinfoil hat on. I don't see this related to V's 4 words, but to he oracle's pre-murder words:

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Belkar's illusion was in part responsible for V losing patience with Elan. If the imp manages to somehow finish off V, then this would fit with the other far-fetched theories the Oracle was talking about.

[Laurentio II]

That it was, though it took him longer than it had to. If he'd said that at the beginning, that could have been done two or three rounds earlier for all we know.

For all we know, the Chromatic Spray was a last second plan when Vaarsuvius noticed that direct damage from his part was not going to work. So, two or three round earlier there was no reason to ask for.

About the general issue, I understood your point, but I don't agree. Vaarsuvius already showed to be more efficient and competent that the average of the team, and most of the PNG. His apex was during the siege war, and the fact that he is currently lacking both in social skills and in strategy has been indicated as a consequence of not meditating for a long period. That is not a competence issue, as the motivation is obsession.

For the purpose of the discussion (that could be considered done, on my part), I'm ignoring all the comic and novel convention, that would made trash of both mine and your arguments.

[Pronounceable]

This is the best that could've happened. Anything else would force a confrontation between Hinjo and V.

And V's almost right. Durkon and especially Elan has done nothing (admittedly there's not much Elan can do, but Durkon could've helped V with some divine spells) about finding Roy and Haley. They seem to have dedicated themselves to the woes of one nation while the whole world is in danger. Of course, blaming Durkon and Elan for his failure is quite irrational.

As for predictions: Next strip will have Roy looking down on the world and commenting on various subplots. Can Roy spy on Xykon and RC? I don't see why not.

Idle speculation: Would it be too outlandish if, when he finds Haley and co. V (with his hatred of such cliches) manages to remove Haley's nemesis (Krystal, was it?) as well? It'd have a certain symmetry...


And that imp? He's going back to hell in an ashtray...

[AKA_Bait]

You'd have to be insane if, as a DM, you wouldn't make discussing strategy in the middle of a battle cost actions.

Why's that? Sometimes you have players who really like having a quick back and forth midbattle. It makes the game more enjoyable for them. Fun>Realistic Battle timing.

[mroozee]

I don't think this has anything to do with the Oracle's prophecy for V.

[Lance]

Well, there goes my theory...

I thought V was acting strange because the imp had gotten to him/her first and cast a suggestion that nothing should get in the way of V's studies, not even "friends".

[Traker]

Here is what I think will happen.
So let's say that V is level: 16 her/his will save(with only its class bonus) would have a plus 10 to its will save. so I do not think that V will be under the control of the imp if he casts suggestion.

[Neopolis]

Last one was #424.

I guess this is 2 pages, but it's still one comic!

[Yoyoyo]

Not sure which is better, Dire half-dragon bone eating saltwater warepiranhas or the Vaporizing Flu.

Elan's "Have a nice trip" line rules. He may very well have been ready to ask V to leave before V so nicely volunteered. Although, I'm bummed s/he's gone. With Belkar down and V leaving, all the loose cannons are jumping ship (sorry about the pun).

[Belkster11]

Well, there goes my theory...

I thought V was acting strange because the imp had gotten to him/her first and cast a suggestion that nothing should get in the way of V's studies, not even "friends".

If V was under a suggestion spell, his eyes would be yellow and/or swirly.

[orcmonk89]

I bet the OotS' DM must be pissed with his gaming group right now.

DM: What, so you want to split the party even more?
V's Player: Clearly.
DM: *mutters curse words under his breath, graps graph paper and begins to sketch new, barren, spell-resistant-monster-filled island.* You asked for it...

[RMS Oceanic]

I feel like I'm missing a page or two, though. I don't know WHY V is so enamored of Haley and Roy and not Durkon and Elan.

Well, (s)he was always friendly with Haley, and respected Roy's intelligence. However, I would like to reiterate that these are NOT h** primary motivation to find them. H** primary motivation is that h** magic cannot do it, so (s)he will throw bigger magical sledgehammers at the problem until it breaks. This goes back to what Roy said to Eugene in Origin of PCs:

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Roy: A big problem that arcane spellcasters have is their utter faith in magic.
Eugene: Poppycock! Magic is supremely powerful and has no weakness ever at all!

V essentially subscribes to Eugene's POV, and will not be convinced h** magic cannot overcome an obstacle. You glimpse this in 504 or so, where V laments his being unable to beat back the Hobgoblins, because (s)he didn't have enough magical power. (S)he can't (or maybe won't) realise that magic is not all powerful, or maybe Azure City didn't need a blaster mage, but somebody who thinks outside the box a little. I know (s)he can't cast cloudkill, what with it being conjuration and all, but if (s)he cast something like Wall of Fire, then Permanency'd it, that would have kept back 90% of the hobgoblins and zombies.

And if we recall Start of Darkness, there's another character who believes that magical force is the best answer to a problem:

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Xykon. "You can keep your finely tuned watch. Give me the sledgehammer to the face anyday."

[Yoyoyo]

I bet the OotS' DM must be pissed with his gaming group right now.

DM: What, so you want to split the party even more?
V's Player: Clearly.
DM: *mutters curse words under his breath, graps graph paper and begins to sketch new, barren, spell-resistant-monster-filled island.* You asked for it...

Like it. Or, perhaps, the DM asking V's player is he's sure he wants to be that far away from the Cleric. Because, you know, anything can happen [evil laugh].

[innk]

And so another party split.
Awesome really.

Wait a minute, what was this strip all about again?

Ah nevermind.....

[Raiser Blade]

Heyyyy


You got politics in my OotS

[Person_Man]

Crud.

I, for one, hope that this is just a big buildup to getting the band back together. Having 4+ parallel indeterminate story lines is starting to make OoTS seem like Heroes.

Just my 2 cp.

[derfenrirwolv]

Funny comic, but if panel 6 of Elan/Hinjo is a subtle dig on the current US political situation, I have to say I'm disappointed with the Giant for the first time in many comics. Board ban aside, I come here to laugh and escape the real world, not be reminded of it

Its not exactly the first time the real world has made it into the comics.



What i think will happen next...


http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0465.html


A LN character can have a LE familiar i beleive.

Qarr "I see you are currently without a familiar. Perhaps i could join you, and tempt you slowly to the darkskide, mayby help you find that redhead you wanted. It will be realy cool! I can sit on your shoulder and win arguments with your concious and stuff!

V: I have no idea of what you're speaking. My familiar is right here and has been all along *pop* Lightning bolt.

[Mr. Scaly]

And the Order of the Stick bites the dust! The next time Nale comes for over the top revenge he might just win.

Seriously, I think the comic is heading for a pretty dark ending the way it's going. The heroes are scattered and at each other's throats, one is dead, another left in a fit of rage and a third is useless/going to die soon anyway. All of which plays a happy song for Xykon's team.

[AstralFire]

You'd have to be insane if, as a DM, you wouldn't make discussing strategy in the middle of a battle cost actions.

I suppose I'm insane. I don't make it cost anything, that would make rounds interminably boring in many cases.

Are you suggesting they could've won the battle more easily without V? Because if so, I think your bias against her is clouding your judgement more than just a little bit.

Yes, I am, and no it is not. I have no bias against V, I actually rather like the character. However, I'd like V to wake up and smell the roses and I'm rather jaded towards anything 'cool' that he has done, so he really hasn't garnered any points from me on that front since AC.

In theory, yes. We'll never know, because they do have an army, but insofar as they're the main driving force of the main characters, they would be no less of a threat.

So what is the logic in going "well, might as well let the army die!"

[DrivinAllNight]

This strip to me drives home the fact that this will be a long long comic, and while it may be divided in what it shows and who's story line is being played out at one time, it is still a great story in the long run, since many books of just words will have varied subplots, especially with so many main characters to play with here, we should just be happy there is only 3 different branches going so far. And maybe will be effective by itself, maybe not, but it will be fun to see how they are all doing as they progress. And if it seems disjointed it is only because it takes a week to see three pages of the story. If you could go back and read the beginning to end, it wouldn't seem so disconnected.
Just my 2Gp

[DSCrankshaw]

Fifty points for everybody who theorized a Vaarsuvius/Qarr tag-team! Have yourselves a cookie!

Thanks. I'll do that.

[joela]

Nice. Will 600 have V. joining the forces of evil? Or get Elan and Durkon kicked off the boat once the pallies discover Elan's lie?

LUV IT.

[kerravon]

Now what???? I swear, every time I get an update, it makes me all the more anxious for the NEXT update! ARRRGGGGG!!! Darn my impatience!

[CarpeGuitarrem]

Oh SNAP.

This is one of the best plot-moving strips yet.

[Morgan Wick]

Couple of interesting points, other than V potentially effectively and unilaterally (well, with some help from Elan) kicking Elan and Durkon out of the Order of the Stick (which I'm sure Haley will overrule unless V convinces her Elan cheated on her):

"And here I thought the hardest part would be getting back aboard a ship with two paladins."

Hmm... what was Qarr's real plan, and how is it now served by going after V...?

[ss49]

This webcomic is reminding me more and more of the WoT. And not in a good way.

Also; just because the koboracle told V how to obtain UAP, doesn't mean V will. Haley made the conscious choice to "not look the gift horse in the mouth"; if she had acted normally she would still be speaking Consonant. V could let the opportunity pass. Maybe.

[AstralFire]

Other way around. Durkon can claim rank over V since he was one of the two founding members and even without Elan in the mix, I believe Roy is closer to Durkon by far. He has abandoned the order, not kicked them out.

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Personally, I think this is leading to an Order of the Scribble-like team full dismembering, only because they're the title characters, most of the team will eventually be reassembled. Durkon and Elan might separate out of pure utility, Celia and Haley might indeed just get sick of Belkar and leave him. As for who will do the reorganization, just about everyone but Belkar's a good candidate. Roy, because he's the leader. Haley because she's also a good leader. Elan because he's growing as a character. V because he might grow as a character. Durkon because Durkon hasn't done much as an independent character since the Dungeon of Dorukan.

[Eric]

This is gonna be hilarious. Lien will find Kubota's armor on the seafloor, and report that he got away again.

Actually, that would be the best way to ensure he stays dead. If everyone thinks he's loped off to be a recurring villain, he'll not be resurrected.

I suspect Quar will get zapped big time. If only because he'll get in the way trying to turn V.