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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Bandededed's Avatar

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    Default Chosen of the Nameless One (LA? PEACH)

    Chosen of the Nameless One
    Acquired template, which can be added to any creature with an int greater than 3

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    You heard a voice in your mind, and you accepted the power it offered you. In the blink of an eye, this power changed you in more ways than you could possibly understand.


    Size and Type: Size is unchanged, but type changes to outsider (native).
    HD: Unchanged
    Speed: Unchanged
    AC: -
    Attack: Unchanged
    Full attack: Unchanged
    Damage: ---
    Special Attacks: ---
    Special Qualities: Regeneration 1 + 1 / 5 HD, Immunity to death effects. Superior Geas/Quest (see below)
    Abilities: Unchanged
    Skills:
    LA: +2

    Regeneration: Your body becomes extremely resistant to damage and death; you regain the number hit points indicated per round, regardless of damage type or your number of hp, even if those are at or below -10. You cannot regrow lost body parts though you can reattach them in one minute by holding it to the stump. This means that there is a way to kill you - if you are knocked unconscious, your head can be removed from your body as described below. You die in 10 minutes if it is not reattached.

    Decapitation: In order to decapitate a creature, it must be helpless. You must make a normal Coup de Grace attack, and specify that this attack is to decapitate the creature. Then, you must successfully kill the creature with this attack. Should this fail, you may try again as long as you satisfy the criteria above.

    Superior Geas/Quest: In exchange for your power, you accept the Geas of the Nameless one: "Find me, and name me," This is a special case of Geas, though. You receive no saving throw, but it only activates if your character should chance upon some kind of knowledge of the Nameless One and not attempt to retrieve it in any / every way possible.

    Cosmetic changes: Hair and skin color darkens from it's original color to black within a few minutes of acceptance. Your eyes become pure white, with no iris or pupil visible.

    Well, this is really an oddball template that I thought of the other day, and decided to actually make (rather than, say, sleeping). It does add 1 HD and 1 LA, but I'm not certain that that measure is correct. It now adds +2 LA, but I'm waiting to hear more before I make the final decision. I want to keep it there, though, so if anything seems too silly overpowered I'll probably change it.

    Also - I want to keep the immunity to death effects and regeneration, it's important to the concept I see of someone with the template being immortal, but not invincible.
    Last edited by Bandededed; 2008-12-02 at 08:08 PM.
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  2. - Top - End - #2
    Ettin in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Chosen of the Nameless One (LA? PEACH)

    So, 1HD, DR, Regeneration, all good saving throws, +10' speed, Darkvision, & immunity to death effects? All for LA+1 & plot hook? D00d, sign me up!

    This is ridiculously overpowered. It's LA+3 AT LEAST.

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Chosen of the Nameless One (LA? PEACH)

    I thought the equivalent of racial HD was a bad thing...

    Well, maybe I should find a weaker race to take it from, though it does fit...

    hmm...

    I think: drop the DR, the darkvision and the speed boost. Does that bring it anywhere closer to your happy place?
    Last edited by Bandededed; 2008-11-10 at 07:36 PM.
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    Default Re: Chosen of the Nameless One (LA? PEACH)

    Also, the regeneration bypassed by nothing means that you will never die and stay dead until old age would kill you.
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    My motto: Repensum Est Canicula.

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    Leiningen will win, even if he must lose in the attempt.

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    Ettin in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Chosen of the Nameless One (LA? PEACH)

    Racial HD are great if you're already paying for them with a LA anyway. If you're gonna have one, d8 is a nice balanced choice. If you drop DR, Darkvision & the +10' speed increase, you'll be around LA+2, I'd guess. That quest isn't much of a detriment, if you consider that every character in the game gets plot hooks thrown at them (which is essentially what the quest is), regardless of whether they have a special template or not. I'd still jump on this if it were only LA+1. The bonuses are great, & the DM's gonna send the players on some crazy mission anyway, so at least I'd know which one he's gonna eventually choose.

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    Default Re: Chosen of the Nameless One (LA? PEACH)

    I see this as +3 at least, if only for the Regeneration. Adding a HD is strange for a template, and a mechanic that I for one would like to see removed. The only template that does so, to my knowledge, is the Zombie, which cannot be a PC.

    Regeneration is an incredibly potent tool in the hands of the PC...and if that regeneration is bypassed by nothing, it's TO potent, and should be eliminated immediately. Never dying is not even REMOTELY balanced.

    And then a +2 bonus to all Physical ability scores? Well, as Regeneration is best given to the front-line fighters who'll be soaking the damage, that's just icing on the cake, which I'd gladly eat for a +1 LA and a racial HD that increases by BaB AND gives me a ton of skill points and +2 to all saves. Hell, that's better than a level in Fighter!

    So this needs some serious reconsideration, or a much higher LA.

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    Pour Djinn and tonic water into a glass filled with ice cubes. Stir well. Garnish with lime wedge. Serve.

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    Troll in the Playground
     
    PirateGirl

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    Default Re: Chosen of the Nameless One (LA? PEACH)

    I agree that the LA should be +3 rather than +1. It's overpowered for just a +1 level adjustment. A template which rewards its recipient with regeneration is tricky to balance under the best of circumstances. In this case, it is simply too powerful. The idea that a PC is just going to offered this template by a powerful and superior being, "The Nameless One", out of the goodness of its heart is absurd. There should be a catch to this or at least some explanation as to what would motivate the Nameless One to bestow this template.

    "Chosen of the Nameless One" sounds suspiciously like a type of cultist. This usually indicates near fanatical loyalty and rabid devotion. This works for NPCs quite well, but it is harder to impress upon PCs. Moreover, you may want to restrict this to devotees of the Nameless One. If you haven't fleshed out the Nameless One, you should. The level of power should be quite high if it can bestow this template on its followers.

    Immunity to death effects is also potent, but you could justify this by adding a requirement of having been the recipient of raise dead spell.

    As a player, this class is drool-worthy. As a DM, this class is a nightmare. It can easily indicate favoritism if it is handed out as a reward. I don't mind powerful templates, but not all of them are suitable for PCs. In many cases, I find that templates work better for monsters and NPCs than for PCs.

    Debby

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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Chosen of the Nameless One (LA? PEACH)

    Ok, latest changes:

    Removal of the HD, and increase the LA to +2
    Removal of the ability score adjustments

    I'm also considering scaling back the regeneration to 2 or maybe just 1, since even with the reduction the main immortal thing is still there, though the speed with which is finishes is slowed. Also, with the type change to outsider (unless native gives some benefit which I am unaware of), you are unable to be raised or resurrected. Hence, the mechanics reason for the regeneration and immunity to death effects.

    Looking back, perhaps I should have slept for that hour and tried this when I was a bit more rested...

    Also, I'll try to get some more fluff up on the Nameless One (who is a god, and a lost one at that) by tonight. I need to move it from my notebook to the PC. It's important, and I'm sorry I haven't had a chance to do it yet.
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    Firbolg in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Chosen of the Nameless One (LA? PEACH)

    Ultimately, the problem is still granting regeneration that is overcome by nothing. This thing simply cannot die. That HAS to change before this has any semblance of balance, and before we can analyze it at all on a PC worthy scale.

    Also, to my knowledge, native outsiders can indeed be raised...not certain on that though. Still, not being able to be raised is meaningless if you never die in the first place...
    Last edited by Djinn_in_Tonic; 2008-11-12 at 02:23 PM.

    Ingredients

    2oz Djinn
    5oz Water
    1 Lime Wedge


    Instructions

    Pour Djinn and tonic water into a glass filled with ice cubes. Stir well. Garnish with lime wedge. Serve.

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    Troll in the Playground
     
    NecromancerGirl

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    Default Re: Chosen of the Nameless One (LA? PEACH)

    This template is awesome in terms of theme, and I really like the idea of people being chosen by this "Nameless One" seemingly at random.

    You could keep the regeneration , but I think there would then have to be a specific method for killing the character.

    How 'strong' is the regeneration ability you would like to use? Different creatures with regeneration can have different specific times for regrowth and re-attachment of lost body parts.

    If you allowed the Chosen to have 'ogre-mage' style regeneration, it would be required to re-attach any body parts it loses. You would then be able to kill the Chosen by knocking it unconscious and decapitating it - the head would die after roughly ten minutes.

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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Chosen of the Nameless One (LA? PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by lesser_minion View Post
    This template is awesome in terms of theme, and I really like the idea of people being chosen by this "Nameless One" seemingly at random.
    Thanks!

    Quote Originally Posted by lesser_minion View Post
    You could keep the regeneration , but I think there would then have to be a specific method for killing the character.

    How 'strong' is the regeneration ability you would like to use? Different creatures with regeneration can have different specific times for regrowth and re-attachment of lost body parts.

    If you allowed the Chosen to have 'ogre-mage' style regeneration, it would be required to re-attach any body parts it loses. You would then be able to kill the Chosen by knocking it unconscious and decapitating it - the head would die after roughly ten minutes.
    That's... a freaking great idea! I'll go edit that in.
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  12. - Top - End - #12
    Troll in the Playground
     
    NecromancerGirl

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    Default Re: Chosen of the Nameless One (LA? PEACH)

    One problem with decapitation is that there are no rules for it apart from specific special effects like vorpal weaponry and a few monster extraordinary abilities - this might still lead to kobold wizard style cheese, so it may be worth providing rules for decapitating a helpless Chosen with a coup-de-grace attempt.

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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Chosen of the Nameless One (LA? PEACH)

    Well, I've put some rules up there for the decapitation of any creature. Let me know if there's anything wrong with them.
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    Default Re: Chosen of the Nameless One (LA? PEACH)

    Only problem...with a 10 minute time before re-attachment, this still won't kill the character unless there's a TPK and no one is left alive to reattach your head. I'd give it a round, tops, if not an immediate kill (as most things won't bother to strike an unconscious foe when others are up and moving).

    Ingredients

    2oz Djinn
    5oz Water
    1 Lime Wedge


    Instructions

    Pour Djinn and tonic water into a glass filled with ice cubes. Stir well. Garnish with lime wedge. Serve.

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    Ogre in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Chosen of the Nameless One (LA? PEACH)

    Did you in any way get this idea from wizard to earth sea?
    ~Sweet avatar by Miss Nobody~

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike
    You killed it, its dead, it exploded, Good Job.
    Quote Originally Posted by Logalmier View Post
    "I need a latter! Quick, find a psion so he can make one with his mind!"

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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Chosen of the Nameless One (LA? PEACH)

    I forgot something, geez. I'm changing the way beheading rules relate to the Chosen specifically, by allotting a specific amount of damage that must be taken before their head comes off. But what would be a good number? Con x2? Maybe a flat number?

    Quote Originally Posted by Djinn_In_Tonic View Post
    Only problem...with a 10 minute time before re-attachment, this still won't kill the character unless there's a TPK and no one is left alive to reattach your head. I'd give it a round, tops, if not an immediate kill (as most things won't bother to strike an unconscious foe when others are up and moving).
    Hmm. I initially agreed with the 10 minute time because it sounds like something I had heard before, where there are actually about ten minutes of time that a persons brain will still function (badly!) after decapitation. Which may be a myth, but meh.

    Maybe I should just make it so that being decapitated doesn't kill one, but renders it's body useless. Drop the head in some rock or something and you have a ready made plot hook (if you need one, I guess). Also makes a interesting substitute for an emergency ball.

    Psion uses telepathy (or actual applicable power, I don't remember). "Guys, wait a second... That rock is thinking!"

    Demons_eye: Unfortunately, I did not see the earth sea miniseries, so no.
    Last edited by Bandededed; 2008-12-03 at 11:17 PM.
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