Advice for an Archivist[3.5]

[Ereth]

I am looking for advice in useful spells and feats for an archivist. I am aiming for a buffer or controller role. Starting level is 3, Eberron. 32 point buy, chosen stats: str12 dex12 con14 int16 wis14 cha10.

Anything else i may need to know? thank you very much.

[kamikasei]

Check with your DM about what you can and can't do.

A lot of the reason Archivists are considered very powerful is because they can learn spells from lists like the Paladin's or Ranger's, letting them learn a powerful spell with a low spell level. If you can do this, the advice will be quite different to if you can only take from full divine casters' lists, e.g. clerics or druids.

Similarly, your access to spells from domains will affect your options.

[Thurbane]

Quick piece of advice before I go to bed: don't forget to raid the "other" divine spell lists, hard and often - Cleric Domains and Adepts, especially.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Archivist Spell List, including Secret Page which puts any spell you'd ever want onto only one page of your prayerbook.

Batman is probably the way to go on this.

[Tengu_temp]

Advice for an archivist? Try not to outshine the rest of the party.

[Jimp]

Make sure to check with your DM about how lenient he is with using spells from different lists. The class is good anyway, but the more silly-good stuff depends on using other spell lists.
As for what spells are good, that list on Gleemax is a good place to start.

[Eldariel]

You could go with Int 18 if you intend on using Magic for combat. Alternatively, you could go Archivist Archer (those things are awesome). What you'd want to focus on really determines what spells you should prioritise. Also, which sources is indeed important. Obviously you'll have:
Druid
Cleric
Ranger
Paladin

However, the other options:
Adept
Divine Bard (Unearthed Arcana)
Various PrCs with their own lists

could all be used and give you early access to many spells (Trapsmith has Dispel Magic on level 1, for example, and Adept has Heal on level 5) and access to many spells you wouldn't have at all (like the whole Bard spellbook).

[Sstoopidtallkid]

Don't forget the Healer class, the Planar domains, and classes like Spirit Shaman. If you can get Leadership and an Artificer cohort, you will win, now and forever.

[monty]

I always liked Holy Sword (it's personal, though, so don't bother unless you're doing the fighting). +5 weapon and more at level 7? Yes, please.

[wadledo]

I always liked Holy Sword (it's personal, though, so don't bother unless you're doing the fighting). +5 weapon and more at level 7? Yes, please.

Now, where is that from?

[monty]

Now, where is that from?

It's a core Paladin spell.

[wadledo]

It's a core Paladin spell.

.......Some day I'm actualy going to have to play a Paladin, so that things like ths don't happen.

Also, 3rd level buffer/controler's are a bit difficult.

[Eldariel]

.......Some day I'm actualy going to have to play a Paladin, so that things like ths don't happen.

Also, 3rd level buffer/controler's are a bit difficult.

3rd level is quite optimal for a controller. You have Glitterdust, Web, Color Spray, Sleep, Entangle, Silence and company, which are some of the most effective spells of those levels, and happen to mostly be control-spells (max out Int for saves though - dropping Str and Cha for it may be prudent). Bless, Blessed Aim, Protection from Alignment and company make for decent buffing too.

[wadledo]

3rd level is quite optimal for a controller. You have Glitterdust, Web, Color Spray, Sleep, Entangle, Silence and company, which are some of the most effective spells of those levels, and happen to mostly be control-spells (max out Int for saves though - dropping Str and Cha for it may be prudent). Bless, Blessed Aim, Protection from Alignment and company make for decent buffing too.

Arcane Controller, yes.
Divine? Less so.

[Eldariel]

Arcane Controller, yes.
Divine? Less so.

Archivist is more of an Arcane controller than a Divine one anyways. Thanks to Domain, he has access to all the critical Arcane spells, coupled with a few good additions from Druid- and Cleric-lists. And last I checked, this thread was about Archivists.

EDIT: Web I couldn't find. Sorry. So you'll have to make do with the rest, getting Web level 3 from Anyspell.

[Nohwl]

Don't forget the Healer class, the Planar domains, and classes like Spirit Shaman. If you can get Leadership and an Artificer cohort, you will win, now and forever.

why do you need an artificer cohort?

[Eldariel]

why do you need an artificer cohort?

Everybody needs an Artificer cohort.

[Sstoopidtallkid]

why do you need an artificer cohort?

To craft scrolls of spells from random off-the-wall lists that you couldn't realistically find in-game.

[Nohwl]

i thought they changed it for artificers in the errata. maybe im wrong, i havent read it in a while.

[PurinaDragonCho]

EDIT: Web I couldn't find. Sorry. So you'll have to make do with the rest, getting Web level 3 from Anyspell.

Adepts get Web.

I don't believe Anyspell is viable for Archivists - it has to be cast from a domain slot, and Archivists don't have domain spell slots. Some people think Holt Warden from Complete Champion can give you domain slots... but as I read it, you could really only cast Plant Domain spells from them.

I'm very interested in this thread, though. Playing a Rogue 3 / Archivist 9 right now.

[Eldariel]

Adepts get Web.

I knew I was forgetting something. Yea, that's why it worked out.

I don't believe Anyspell is viable for Archivists - it has to be cast from a domain slot, and Archivists don't have domain spell slots. Some people think Holt Warden from Complete Champion can give you domain slots... but as I read it, you could really only cast Plant Domain spells from them.

Meh, that's just dumb. Well, you've got almost all the spells you could want anyways between Divine Bard, Adept, Domains and PrCs.

[PurinaDragonCho]

By the way, one spell I've found really useful (at least at lower levels) is Produce Flame. Touch attacks are nice. I always overlooked that spell until I started playing my current character.

When you can get it, Holy Smite is also awesome.

[ColonelFuster]

Multiclassing into Archivist was the best move my rogue ever made. Dex and Int stats maxed, making touch attacks with sneakies... good times.

[Nohwl]

i checked wizards, and they did errata it. a 12th level warlock could make divine scrolls. i dont know of anything that could do it earlier.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

The only scroll you ever need to obtain is Secret Page, from someone with the Rune domain. As it happens, just having that domain gives them Scribe Scroll, so it wouldn't be a stretch to be able to get one. Then you can just cast that to switch a spell already in your book to any other spell you want it to be, and then you've got the spell written down to learn it. No need for someone to craft scrolls, no problems with trying to find someone who has the spell you want as a divine spell.

[Nohwl]

are there any feats that an archivist should take? i know knowledge devotion and quicken spell are nice, but that leaves 5 or 6 feats open.

[Drammel]

I've mentioned it before in another thread, but it's worth saying again. Take Lore of the Gods from Complete Champion if you have access. If you worship a god with the Knowledge domain (just worship, you don't need the actual domain) you get a +10 to all Knowledge checks which is exactly the type of check the Archivist's class skill Dark Knowledge is. Dark Knowledge is a DC 15 check with additional benefits for how far over you pass that DC. Without even taking stat bonus into consideration, at level 3 with max ranks in the pertinent Knowledge skill you're looking at an automatic check of 17 on a roll of 1. That's the minimum benefit. Incidentally, the spell also lasts an hour per level. That's just my 2 cent though, I'm fond of Dark Knowledge for some odd reason.

Which brings me to my philosophy on Archivist feats. If you think there are going to be any giants, fey, golems, or dragons in your campaign take Archivist of Nature and Draconic Archivist, located conveniently a few pages after the Archivist entry in Heroes of Horror.

[Sstoopidtallkid]

I've mentioned it before in another thread, but it's worth saying again. Take Lore of the Gods from Complete Champion if you have access. If you worship a god with the Knowledge domain (just worship, you don't need the actual domain) you get a +10 to all Knowledge checks which is exactly the type of check the Archivist's class skill Dark Knowledge is. Dark Knowledge is a DC 15 check with additional benefits for how far over you pass that DC. Without even taking stat bonus into consideration, at level 3 with max ranks in the pertinent Knowledge skill you're looking at an automatic check of 17 on a roll of 1. That's the minimum benefit. Incidentally, the spell also lasts an hour per level. That's just my 2 cent though, I'm fond of Dark Knowledge for some odd reason.

Don't forget the Collector of Stories Skill Trick, for +5 to Knowledge checks to ID monsters.

[Drammel]

Don't forget the Collector of Stories Skill Trick, for +5 to Knowledge checks to ID monsters.

You sir, are my new personal hero.

[monty]

Dip Sacred Exorcist and pick up some divine feats.