My Little Pony LXXIII: Luna's Sordid Dreams? I'm Not Googling That...

[Aotrs Commander]

Random question that occurs to me... Do we know how many episodes there are this season? Have just got 13 or a full 26 this time around?

[Soras Teva Gee]

Random question that occurs to me... Do we know how many episodes there are this season? Have just got 13 or a full 26 this time around?

A full season is my understanding.

[Rater202]

Random question that occurs to me... Do we know how many episodes there are this season? Have just got 13 or a full 26 this time around?

full 26.

so, Question, if I converted to your temple, would you use your divine powers to make Rainbow Pie mandatory?

[Metahuman1]

full 26.

so, Question, if I converted to your temple, would you use your divine powers to make Rainbow Pie mandatory?

Not his area of expertise.


Besides, I'm like 99.9% sure the Pink One Blows him out of the water in terms of cosmic secrets/powers/ability's.

[Humble Master]

Just imagine them together.

"BASTARA! TRULY, WE DOTH ENJOY THINE COURTSHIP, FOR IT IS BEFITTING OF A PRINCESS OF THE NIGHT!!!!!

".......Why did I agree to this?......"

They certainly will interact with each other, they just wont form any kind of relationship. Both Luna and Bastara are kind of outcasts, but Luna wants to be accepted by others, Bastara prefers to be alone (except for Meralin) Still, I must admit it could create some humorous situations.

"Why must this world be lead by silly princesses of love and the sun?!"
"Art thou imply that we are a silly princess?"
"What is your domain?"
"The glorious dark night and the dreams of those who sleep under it!"
"Hmm, glorious domain of the night you say? We might be able to tolerate each other. Shall we stalk the land as shadows..."
"And grant happy and comforting dreams to my subjects?"
"I was going to say slit the throats and shred the minds of your enemies but..."

I want a changeling plushie now.

Warning: may feed off of your love for it.

I am not a paladin type. xD
My PrC would be something bard based. Charisma focussed. Dex second. Likely sourced from the BoEF. But better written.

Depending on how intimate you wanted the class to be I could actually homebrew it.

[Aotrs Commander]

A full season is my understanding.

full 26.

Huzzah!

so, Question, if I converted to your temple, would you use your divine powers to make Rainbow Pie mandatory?

Pretty sure it says "light, dark and technology" on the portfolio, not "shipping." Not even "starships" which would be... not at all close.

Why would I do that?

I don't even demand Spike/Rarity is mandatory, and that could loosely be described as the only "ship" that I have a particular affinity for (and that's largely because the early fandom treated Spike like crap more than any other reason).

Heck, if I had that sort of power, you don't think my first move would be make no shipping mandatory (meaning that, reality-wide procreation would cease entirely, thus leaving the universe eventually to the most deserving, i.e. the Undead i.e. Liches i.e. me?)

Tell, you what, though, I'll combine my technology and pony powers and give you as close as I get offhand, which is to say Twilight and Pinkie shipping...

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I am doing it right?

[Metahuman1]

Huzzah!



Pretty sure it says "light, dark and technology" on the portfolio, not "shipping." Not even "starships" which would be... not at all close.

Why would I do that?

I don't even demand Spike/Rarity is mandatory, and that could loosely be described as the only "ship" that I have a particular affinity for (and that's largely because the early fandom treated Spike like crap more than any other reason).

Heck, if I had that sort of power, you don't think my first move would be make no shipping mandatory (meaning that, reality-wide procreation would cease entirely, thus leaving the universe eventually to the most deserving, i.e. the Undead i.e. Liches i.e. me?)

Tell, you what, though, I'll combine my technology and pony powers and give you as close as I get offhand, which is to say Twilight and Pinkie shipping...

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I am doing it right?

I'd buy that if I wasn't broke, so you can't be doing it too wrong.

[Rater202]

Pretty sure it says "light, dark and " on the portfolio, not "shipping." Not even "starships" which would be... not at all close.

Why would I do that?

So I don't use my godslaying sword to kill you and add your portfolio to my own eventual one.

or worse, I'll hug you.

and Twinkie is not close enough to RainbowPie

[DigoDragon]

Cragodile, you just got served by the Applejack!

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Seems like anything becomes instantly cute in plushie form. Although...I'm gonna get hate for this, but I don't find those things that cute. I think it's the fangs.

I think the only plush I haven't seen yet is of Sombra... okay I just googled it and it seems his clothes aren't easy to do. Anyway, changeling fangs.. I think the fangs would look better if they were a non-furry material.

I'm still waiting on 4th Dimension to get some new ones in.

My wife was looking at those this morning.

The Build-a-Bear Fluttershy came out today and we plan on getting one for our daughter. Not the best manes as far as plush goes, but price-wise they're affordable (and we got a $10 off coupon so... yeah). It's for my daughter anyway. After a week all their manes look like Pinkie Pie.

Wait for it. Pinkie and Rainbow Dash have been drinking Screwdrivers and Hard Cider.

Oooh, vodka.

I am doing it right?

It's like they're on intergalactic surfboards. :3

Warning: may feed off of your love for it.

Yes, we tend to do that a lot. At least I'll know it wouldn't go hungry... though my daughter would probably grab her plush ponies and beat the stuffings out of it simply because that's what she knows.

[Humble Master]

Yes, we tend to do that a lot. At least I'll know it wouldn't go hungry... though my daughter would probably grab her plush ponies and beat the stuffings out of it simply because that's what she knows.

It does bring up the question: Why do the Changelings have to replace someone? Couldn't they just disguise themselves as a pony and find love the normal way?

[Gamerlord]

Couldn't they just disguise themselves as a pony and find love the normal way?

Probably takes them a lot longer than just replacing someone. Also, from what we saw of "Cadence"/Chrysalis, they already have enough trouble blending into pony society without needing to create an entirely new identity. If it weren't for the wedding she wouldn't have been able to fool a vegetable.

[Humble Master]

Probably takes them a lot longer than just replacing someone.

True, but they also stand a lot more to gain. If a group of Changelings made themselves into an entire family and one of them married the entire Changeling family (hopefully) gets love out of the deal. I guess it comes down to how much love a Changeling actually needs to survive.

[Gamerlord]

True, but they also stand a lot more to gain. If a group of Changelings made themselves into an entire family and one of them married the entire Changeling family (hopefully) gets love out of the deal. I guess it comes down to how much love a Changeling actually needs to survive.

I'm now imagining a sitcom starring a group of disguised changelings trying to get hitched.

[Humble Master]

Probably takes them a lot longer than just replacing someone.

True, but they also stand a lot more to gain. If a group of Changelings made themselves into an entire family and one of them married the entire Changeling family (hopefully) gets love out of the deal. I guess it comes down to how much love a Changeling actually needs to survive.

Edit:

Probably takes them a lot longer than just replacing someone. Also, from what we saw of "Cadence"/Chrysalis, they already have enough trouble blending into pony society without needing to create an entirely new identity. If it weren't for the wedding she wouldn't have been able to fool a vegetable.

I'm not sure how Chrysalis was shown to be bad at blending in with pony society? The only trouble she encountered was Twilight who is the one pony who probably knew Cadence the best.

[Gamerlord]

Edit:I'm not sure how Chrysalis was shown to be bad at blending in with pony society? The only trouble she encountered was Twilight who is the one pony who probably knew Cadence the best.

You mean besides the nasty attitude she only managed to get away with because most of the cast excused it as wedding stress/ was too busy preparing for the wedding to notice?

[Rater202]

Remember last night, when I posted this?

Spoiler: Somepony is sick.

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Thats how I've been feeling all Day.

And the doctors office is closed, cause off the holiday.

I always get sick at the least convenient times.

[MCerberus]

Nope. Shipping is a gift, and everyone may ship as they see fit.

Wait, if I'm the Element of Heartburn, with domain over spicy pasta and insane drama-fueled crack ships...

and Lixie is the high-ruler of all shipping...

doesn't that make me officially Lix's minion?

[Humble Master]

You mean besides the nasty attitude she only managed to get away with because most of the cast excused it as wedding stress/ was too busy preparing for the wedding to notice?

Except that none of the cast knew Cadance. If it were not for Twilight they would probably have just assumed Cadance (read Chrysalis) was a pony with a bad attitude.

Remember last night, when I posted this?
Thats how I've been feeling all Day.

And the doctors office is closed, cause off the holiday.

I always get sick at the least convenient times.

You have my condolences. Get well soon.

[Lix Lorn]

I'm now imagining a sitcom starring a group of disguised changelings trying to get hitched.

Fund it.

Wait, if I'm the Element of Heartburn, with domain over spicy pasta and insane drama-fueled crack ships...

and Lixie is the high-ruler of all shipping...

doesn't that make me officially Lix's minion?

(pets)
Whossa good pony. Yes you are you are! ^^

[erikun]

Except that none of the cast knew Cadance. If it were not for Twilight they would probably have just assumed Cadance (read Chrysalis) was a pony with a bad attitude.

But isn't the whole point of disguising yourself as a specific pony being capable of fooling those who are familiar with them? I mean, if you just want to look like a pony, that will be a lot easier. Heck, you don't even need to look like a pony - look like a zebra or a donkey, and you can fool others easier.

[Humble Master]

But isn't the whole point of disguising yourself as a specific pony being capable of fooling those who are familiar with them? I mean, if you just want to look like a pony, that will be a lot easier. Heck, you don't even need to look like a pony - look like a zebra or a donkey, and you can fool others easier.

If Chrysalis was trying to establish a foothold in Canterlot it would make sense that she would disguise herself as a higher up.

Actually, I had an idea. If Changelings are not limited to pony disguises what is stopping a Changeling from disguising itself as say, a fluffy puppy, and endearing itself to a young filly?

[erikun]

If Chrysalis was trying to establish a foothold in Canterlot it would make sense that she would disguise herself as a higher up.

Actually, I had an idea. If Changelings are not limited to pony disguises what is stopping a Changeling from disguising itself as say, a fluffy puppy, and endearing itself to a young filly?

Size, probably. Also eating dog food.

[EDIT] Actually, the comics mentioned that changelings could only turn into a "pony" (although I'm sure there's some leeway there) but a different creature could turn any anything else... including a dog. So no dogs for changelings, at least by strict canon.

[Humble Master]

Size, probably. Also eating dog food.

[EDIT] Actually, the comics mentioned that changelings could only turn into a "pony" (although I'm sure there's some leeway there) but a different creature could turn any anything else... including a dog. So no dogs for changelings, at least by strict canon.

Thank you for that information on what Changelings can turn into, good to know.

Also yah, I guess Changelings would probably not enjoy eating dog food.

[Pendulous]

My wife was looking at those this morning.

The Build-a-Bear Fluttershy came out today and we plan on getting one for our daughter. Not the best manes as far as plush goes, but price-wise they're affordable (and we got a $10 off coupon so... yeah). It's for my daughter anyway. After a week all their manes look like Pinkie Pie.

The Build a Bear ones look terrible. I don't care how cheap they are, I wouldn't get one. None in the area anyway. 4th Dimension is the first ones I've seen from an official site (that's in the U.S.) that has fan-quality plushies. That's...a weird statement. "as good as fan made". Seriously, come on Hasbro.

[Kairaven]

If changelings feed off love, showing love would be like regurgitating your food all over some one. Stands to reason why they wouldn't show it except maybe to changeling babies, hence the apparent bad attitude.

[Afool]

Hmmm, if consider quite a few species of birds, then showing affection might be how they literally vomit/provide food for the younglings.

Fascinating.

[MCerberus]

(pets)
Whossa good pony. Yes you are you are! ^^

Can I have a cookie if I ship Gummy x Cryssi?

[HamHam]

Kimi Sparkle continues to provide us with the deep thoughtful MLP analysis we have come to expect from the internet's only pegasister reviewer.

[Brazen Shield]

We made our local news :)

Also, Hi Ohad!! (I know him~)
The article is a bit better than the video.

[SiuiS]

REIGN OF QUOTES
The first day

Sea pony is negative-five months old, and has already kicked me in the face. x_O"

S4 in 11 hours and 30 min!

Isn't this exciting? Are you excited, 'cause I'm excited, I've never been so excited-- well, except for the time that I started posting ponies here at GitP, but I mean really, who can top that?

You're swell~!
Seriously! I miss having you about, Kairaven Heavenly Doodles. We should hang out more!

True, I mean WoTC has done worse:

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Yes, that bunny on the top is actually part of the creature.

I'll have the stat block of the Fluffy Devourer tomorrow...

That's actually TSR inc., previously TSR hobbies and before that, Tactical Studies Rules.

Dipper and Twilight... make a surprisingly wonderful coupling. o.o

They really do! That last one, with shorthair Twiley...

Lookit me, talking about shorthair and longhair like with dogs. Twiley is not Marchande, silly SiuiS!

Surprised nobody beat me to it- that's from TSR, not WotC.

I was defenestrated! I had to crawl back in and get medical treatment first. u.u

I have stolen MCerberus' idea.

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I am nervicited.

I don't always save pony images, but when I do, they're usually DirtyTabs.

15 minutes remain...except I'm not really going to be able to watch the episode until this evening. On the plus side, a day without browsing random ponysites sounds like a remarkably productive day to me.

You'd think so, right?

Spoiler: Comic #11

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Ah, so it does. "Author of the year" and "Daring Do" plaques on the wall.

And now... time for ponies!

Spoiler: not spoilers

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I still think Twilight Velvet is a Victorian lesbian joke.

I also like to think, following from this, she actually writes erotic romance stories and she is just really gods-awful bad at it. That's where Twiley gets her inclination for bad fan fiction. You know, like when she wrote about their hips moving in time like an asynchronous set of binary stars?

Best fanfic, That.

'DAT ANIMATION I think they are a bit too shiny though,and at some points it looks like they got too close to the Crystal Empire.

ur a crystal empire!

Twilight still being Twilight, now with nervous flying and bumping her head on the ceiling.

Spike still being the one to actually keep things running. It's a miracle Celestia hasn't stolen him to be Equestria's chief logistics officer or something.

Pinkie Pie writing letters from the future.

Also, love how exhibit A of "why we're friends" is because their unity powers are engraved in stained glass in the royal palace. In multiple places.

HAHAHAHAHAHA IT IS PAST TUESDAY
SPOIL THIS, SUCKER!

I like to think that Celestia knows what she's doing. Twiley is like a black hole of productivity. Her perfectionism (admittedly flanderized over time – am I the only one who remembers the nerd winning a foot race because she was smart and not intelligent?) creates numerous situations where being half as well-organized would create markedly improved efficiency. Spike follows Twiley because no matter how productive Spike can make the capital, the Twiley Zone in Ponyville would be a sufficiently large drain as to make it economically untenable.

I mean, look at the damage control with Spike Right. There. Imagine if he instead had to wait to hear about it through the inefficient pony post, and then deploy resources manually out to the pony boondocks.

S4 Ep1
Of course there's a faster way to get to Ponyville, Twi.

It's called teleport!!

Isn't the distance too far?

Pinkie Pie
Or Twilight is just THAT predictable to her.

Eeeeyup.

Is it just me, or did the magic Twilight use to blast the potion look disturbingly like Sombra's dark magic?

First, was it ever called dark magic, as in "this is dark magic and what dark magic looks like is this"? Or is that an assumption? I can't recall.

Because clearly, this is Alicorn magic. You know, the magic only alicorns have?

Only, alicorns are royalty, right? And we see one male pony with this magic; Sombra. We see one clearly male royal; Blueblood.

I extrapolate that Princess-hood is a female trait (... Is it weird I have to spell that out?), and that male royals are not princesses. That is, not alicorns.

Sombra was an old royal, who craved the specific magics of the distaff, and somehow, mastered them. Bitter from a life of being second-rate through no fault of his own, he took this power and wielded it like a cudgel, enslaving ponies and ruling as a tyrant. He was a non-Alicorn alicorn.

Blueblood is a direct-line descendant, probably.

Call back to more Sombra's dark magic.
And that NMM Transformation sequence yay!!

Alicorn magic, not dark magic.

Her wings do look kinda big and awkward for her. Maybe it's intentional, dunno.

It is. The princesses all have Griffon wings, as opposed to Pegasus wings. Twilight is in that awkward puberty phase where some parts are too long and some parts too short.

Well, that was sudden. Oh my, here comes the tentacle fics

PRINCESS BONDAGE

Where .... Where did that seat belt come from? o.O

MORE PRINCESS BONDAGE

Huh ... that was a strange way to stop magic

Visual gag, nothing more. I the unicorn horn channels magic specifically through vibration, as is implied throughout the show, ten touching the horn and dispersing that vibration would be sufficient to stop the magic outflow. The lick and sizzle (THATS WHAT SHE SAID) is all for humor.

Dark magic? Huh

Alicorn magic.

Flying laser battle! Well this topped a whole bunch of fanfics! I don't remember lasers in the ones I read. I made a DBZ reference when I saw Celestia shoot off the elements on her sister too. Overall this is a really fun history lesson!

Aye. Felt like the frieza fight. Suddenly, supersaiyan! And by suddenly I mean twenty minute gradual metamorphosis exciting everypony, and shocking Nopony.

Idiot balls for everypony!!

Seriously, that was stupid to sent Twi back. Elements need everyone present to work. I know they're all worried about losing Twilight and then Equestria being without a princess, but Cadance isn't that far in the background

At that point they knew they didn't need the elements. There was never going to be a laser light show, and quote frankly, I enjoy that by the time the ponies are all "ho hum, a threat, let's break out the macguffins" the macguffins go away.

They were returning them to a stationary place. They could have given them all to Pinkie Pie and said "stash these in a harmony tree in case of Harmony Emergency" and she would have done it.

Hmm, I think Discord was probably right. And that was an awkward bit of group dynamics all around. I like this conflict though. The opinion of everyone other than Twilight wasn't really wrong. Being a leader does come with responsibility not to always throw yourself headfirst into danger because you need to, y'know, lead.

But on the other hand, I think it should have been obvious that something related to the elements of harmony would require all of them.

Aye. But again, they didn't need everypony. They needed the physical objects in one location, and that's it.

It's too bad they couldn't build that up more, though. I hope the expound on this whole "you have responsibilities, now" thing.

Gummy being used as a nail file for Discord? Awesome!

I know!

Something that lets the girls use their corresponding elements without the physical gem, huh? Guess that doesn't only happen in the movies.

Correction: the "elements" are the gems. Honesty is not an element, although there is an element of honesty.

It's understandable, but we seem to have compartmentalized things in this fandom along generic RPG lines very quickly, and are missing out on the wonder that is supposed to be inherent in mystical connections on emotional level that allows for massive magical conduction.

When sailor moon was big, no one was blasé about her friends in spirit helping to overcome Queen Beryl's might and end her with union and togetherness. So why is the same thing with ponies just "oh yeah, these six artifacts are attuned to six ponies and together they combine their readied actions for a single full round action magic nuke"?

It would be better to say they become the element harmony they embody, and could then harness their energies as if they were themselves physical elements. Although I don't think that's the best or most interesting possibility.

Oh, and of course Zecora would have elixirs of legend lore just lying around.

Certainly. I'm sure before she packed up and left in shame she was all "what is this news that stirs the ground? I shall find out what evil abounds!" And whipped up potion after ungent after incense, trying different means, before finally creating something at the limit of her capacity that she could not, in the end, use herself.

Gee

So here's a thought. Zecora mentions that the potionelixir can be whitened only by "alicorn magic". But this is not the magic of friendship, as Magical Mystery Cure implied. No, no! It is a kind of magic we've seen only three, maybe four ponies use: Princess Celestia, Princess Twilight and King Sombra, with Sunset Shimmer as an edge case based solely on similar, though not identical, visual effects. Perhaps what we know as "dark magic" is, in fact, a kind of "alicorn magic," one only that breed can use without going all demon-y or "crystals, slaves, blargh" on us. Note that Luna's transformation was not accompanied by "dark magic", and that she did not use it after her transformation.[/spoiler]

Oh, no. The energy is not itself corruptive, it is merely that those who were not natural heirs to it – Sunset, Sombra, Trixie – craved it for wicked reasons and acquired an approximation through wicked ends.

Koschie was an acanthus, and knew not death inherently though of it's magic he was a Master. He could do all the things Masters of death could do. He did not have the innate understanding of it, though; it's inevitability, it's used, it's place in the natural progression of things, the cycle if life, rebirth, and life. And so his raw talent was wielded in a flawed way. Cobalt, meanwhile, understood that death is a natural thing, and has it's place and importance whether you like what it is, or no.

Everyone who wanted Alicorn magic didn't want Alicorn magic; they wanted the fear and compliance of others. They wanted power. They wanted dominion. Alicorn magic just happened to be an already existing form of that raw level of power, and so they said "I want Alicorn magic". Really, it's no different than humans who want status, security and power over others saying "I want money".

Oh, and
Celestia, and Luna now too, continue to be utterly defenseless and in need of constant saving. Is it a princess theme? If you're a princess, you must be saved from trouble by others.

I'm not buying it. The ancient contingency plan of an incarna has warred for passive millennia against you and finally come to fruition isn't 'oh you're helpless now'. It's the PC problem; the reason PCs are awesome is not because PCs are always awesome but because you pick someone awesome to be a PC.

Celestia and Luna obviously deal with weird stuff all the time. They have a busy life with their diplomatic envoys, ancient magical archives, continent spanning spy networks, cloak-and-dagger skulduggery and philosophical contests. You only seem them when **** hits the fan and things are so desperate they're willing to call in Twilight. That's not coincidental, and that's not Warfing, that's just how storytelling goes.

I mean, they were dealing with an epic coup attempt for how long before Twilight found out by accident because there was also a wedding? How long were the astronomers and sooth Sayers Gazing into the ether before Twilight was informed there ever was a crystal empire? It's heavily implied that both princesses are up to the elbows in crazy poop, and we only touch the surface of it.

It was good to see Luna kicking Celestia's tail in the flashback, though. Even if it was without Celestia fighting back.

Yeah. :)

An interesting thought is that Trixie using the Alicorn amulet also had a different visual effect. Perhaps that amulet was developed specifically as a way to give somepony "alicorn magic" who couldn't normally use it, and the reason it drives ponies to evil who wear it is precisely as you said: using that sort of magic if you're not an alicorn makes you start going "crystals!, slaves! blargh!" or some variation thereof depending on individual personality.

I don't buy it. It's not specific to the amulet; power corrupts. If most people have someone bully them, and suddenly get power – they're rich, or have bodyguards, or are a superhero or royalty, or something, they WILL react in a fashion consistent with not only winning but grinding the former oppressor's nose in it. It's an established trope and theme, it pervades literally every medium, and those of us who can manage not to so that, have that resiliency because we've already been there at least once and learned our lesson.

Trixie turned evil, at least in part, because rather than roll over and accept that Trixie was right and was right the whole time and they were so ashamed, ponies had the audacity to resists! She had to show them how wrong they were and how strong and secure she was! She had to!

Huh? That second one is too blurry, I don't get what we're supposed to be seeing.

Discord is visible in the window.

I'd swear that was pointed out before though, and people dismissed it as just a shadow...

No, I still think they didn't have enough time. The problem with sending Twilight away and having her come back is that it was too sudden and then too quick of a turnaround. I think there was no way to do this in one episode because the flashbacks and the problem explanation almost took up a full episode slot by themselves. And even with two episodes, the new aspect of the conflict was handled very quickly and really was lackluster.

If anything, I'd have preferred they found a way to send Twilight Sparkle out of the group at the end of the first episode and then spent part of the second episode contemplating the conflict between her status and her desire to be in the thick of things with her friends. Had that gone on longer and we'd had more time both to explain why Twilight needed to separate and why it was a problem, it would have held up better than the less than 5 minute exile+rejoin that we got.

Aye. It's the same timing Derp that made feeling Pinkie Keen into a weird anti science diatribe instead of what it was supposed to be.

I laughed far too hard at this.

I don't get it. Explain?

[
S4 Other Thoughts
[SPOILER]So... I guess the Everfree Forest predates the sisters as some anomaly held in place by the Tree of Harmony. And the sisters built their castle right over it (maybe as a measure to protect the tree so it doesn't get ill, but abandoned it I suppose after Luna's banishment). And the tree had Celestia, Luna, and Twilight's cutie marks on it...

...okay, this tree has me super curious as to where it came from. Also, Celestia needs to write down things. Must have forgotten about keeping an eye on the tree.

Celestia and Luna came from the tree. They are it's fruit. The cycle of sun and moon is harmonious and fair. The tree that is Harmony bore them forth, budding when ponies were in need of stability, but they were not strong enough to truly oppose the chaos. Returning to the tree, they stripped it of its colors, it's essence, bleeding them away into separate but concentrated forms.

Also, is it just me, or does everything with discord remind you of the old sonic the hedgehog cartoons? Everything is crazy gems and weird checkerboard floors and colored backgrounds.

I find it curious that Twilight can apparently cast entirely improvised spells on the spot, successfully, even though she has no idea what the magic she's casting is supposed to do.

Spell? What spell? There is a difference between magic and spell.

Twilight was called upon to harness magic, an energy, at a level and rate and type that only as Alicorn can handle. In mage terms, it's not using an actual spell, just releasing mana touched by your watchtower.

Unless it literally was "turn this thing white" and nothing else, in which case ... why the overly dramatic dark alicorn magic? Is changing the color of liquids something only alicorns can do?

Because the type of magic required is the 'over dramatic dark magic stuff' kind. Anyone can put out the minimum energy, the basic 'unicorn glow'. It takes effort to put out the maximum; Twilight is special specifically because she has such a large well of energy and also a wide enough bus to use it, and the technical skill for refined control.

Well.

Pony season 4 is going to have work quite hard to top Doctor Who, all I can say.

Fracking hell, that was awesome.

Mm. I actually disagree! But that may just be that I don't like Moffat or his trends.

[SPOILER="Thoughts on part 2"]
... So... Celestia hasn't beat anyone and the one time she did fight, she got her ass kicked. And this time she ran, albeit for noble reasons. Why do people think she's strong again? I mean at least put up a shield or something...

Because she is one of four known ponies to have natural access to alicorn-level magic? Just because someone can push a button and nuke a country doesn't mean they always will, forever. Restraint is very important, the most important part about personal power. You would not believe how irate I am at this weird trend to define how reserved you are by how off-the-handle you can fly.

Think about it. People are always talking about how much willpower they have, and that's why it means so much when they give in, etc., but you all do realize that willpower means nothing if you only have it when it doesn't matter? The guy who doesn't lift a finger to fight because of his morals until after most of his friends are dead isn't moral and restrained, he's stupid. He still gave in when tested. His resolve only exists when there is nothing to be resolute about.

Hyperbole, granted, but still.

"We're simply lost without you." Great. So you'll never do something that stupid again, right? Good. "We need our friend." And, ya know, the demigoddess with power over all magic.

Divinity isn't implied in Any real way. Not is Twilight ever shown to be more powerful or more useful than anyone else. She's just the best at magic, and there is an entire science there we don't get to see that has difficulty built in in stages.

Math also has difficulty built in in stages, and a good friend of mine, a mathematician I believe, has famously said "people think that you only like math or get into math because it's easy for you. But that's not true. Professionals still make mistakes."

Wait, so they can show up at the Summer Sun celebration now? Wouldn't Ponyville need them even more with the trashed town?

It is at the lowest point that we need our faith and rituals. Broken is the man who, say, forsakes Christmas and all it means because of a blizzard.

And a giant starburst... because.

... What, really? Twilight cutie mark at Twilight, when every princess of the kingdom is represented.

Twilight is the liminal state of between. That's also why she is magic; if the princesses are elemental, fundamental, personified, then twilight is the gating moments when the wonderful and terrific can seep in between the cracks and infect our humdrum lives. She is the pony of wonder and mysticism, she is Princess of Transitions. Luna is the jovial witch goddess of passion and darkness on all it's meanings, from a warm tumble in the hay to a heated knifing as your purse slips away. Celestia is the constant, moreso than the northern star, warm and enriching and implacable and stable. Twilight is defined as undefined,the time both night and day.

When the sun rises and the moon sets, or vice versa, that is Twilight. And hence, her spark.

Awwh, Celestia didn't tell Spike he didn't need to bow to her. He saved the Crystal Empire. And he still had to bow and Celestia kinda ignores him. ]

They haves established relationship. Spike bows because that's what he does. They are both comfortable with it and it probably means something different to him than the others. It's like calling someone 'mom' even when they stop holding that position. It's loving formality.

Twilight bows because OCD. XD

it wasn't. protecting the leadership, preserving the chain of command, or keeping the figures the people will look to in a crisis safe is not a trivial concern

Conceptually yes. But they could have handled it better, because they failed to establish that leadership as valid or important. It works for children ("we need a princess! You're a princess! Lead us!" "Okay! Here are orders!") but there was room for depth there that never manifested.

If the guards had done that, and also tried to stop her until she delegated, and then ponyville was in an uproar and mayor mare looked to her when everyone looked to the mayor, that would ha established her importance. As it is, we are saving the important thing without importance. They never clarify the value they are so obsessed with.

If you'll notice, it wasn't exactly improvised either. She pumped Dark Magic into it that she Blue Mage'd into her repertoire in s3.

Alicorn magic.

that info came from faust, so... it's unclear. That said, this doesn't really disprove it. Luna could easily have been pushed and manipulated to that point.[]

Coming from Faust is exactly why it is VERY clear; it is disproven.

"Anything not laid out in the show is open and here are my intentions. Anything laid out in the show is canon, even if it contradicts these intentions".

Faust has given the reins to others (intentional or no). They seem to have a coherent Schema. It is poor form to ignore that for disproven ideas when the originator wants us not to ignore that Schema.

2-parter general thoughts
Let's talk about the elements


That's Celestia with Magic, Kindness, and Generosity; Luna has Loyalty, Honesty, and Laughter. Make of that what you will.

That was my first response too. Haha. "What? Freeze frame!"

Doctor Who and Pony. This day can't get much better.

Also...

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Nailed~ it!

Oh yeah, also

Another DBZ beam battle. Seems to happen between authority figures.

Indeed. I had hoped that a fight between magic using monarchs would manifest differently, myself. Luna conjures clouds and thunder as an afterthought, and Celestia exudes a clarity and serenity seen by rocks at sea in a typhoon. Swirling thunderheads leveling the palace while in Celestia's vicinity they dissipated into a calm downpour as the two engaged in strafing guerrilla melee, with lightning, and shields and redirects. Would have made much more sense.

Still, Soras is right. In a fight, simplicity is key. That's why you never hear about soldiers of fortune learning capoeira; too flashy, not direct enough and way too complicated in execution. You don't spinning axe heel kick where a palm thrust or a gunshot would work.

It would be kinda nice to see Celestia (and Luna) use something other/more than giant laser blasts in battle. Something a little more creative and varied like the Twi vs Trixie battle, only less silly.

Yeah.

... Fund it?

Though seriously this IS an area where simplicity is actually a virtue.

Yup.

[It's always a treat to hear Applejack curse in that cute way of hers. Also good to see Discord is getting airtime. Interesting that there's a Summoning spell for him. Is that spirit specific or could there be spells to summon any pony?

Specific. It also utilized the elements of Harmony, did it not? That strikes me as a specifically built-in containment measure to restrain him enough to get him there.

Wow, but tat's a complicated mane for a plush Cherry Jubilee.

Will look later.

I think it's interesting to note that the Elements that Celestia and Luna use are generic gems and not fitted to them personally like they are with Twilight and her friends. We also see Celestia using all of them to defeat NMM. It suggests that they were not bound to them in the same way, or nearly as much as the Mane 6 and may not have had any personal "favorite elements" so to speak.

It makes it seem more plausible that both of them could have used any of the six elements equally well, or equally poorly.

Yes. I liken this to the Sisters being part and parcel of the elements, myself. As part of their elemental nature. The more mortal ponies needed elements as such because their gross, dense world of science and matter didn't interface properly with the raw magic.

I like the fact that Twilight is basically being groomed to be the third and most beautiful Silmaril.

What if this whole episode was just an excuse to have Discord literally "sowing the seeds of discord"?

We have a weiner!

Honesty-Loyalty are close enough to frequently be confused, and that Kindness-Generosity are very similar as well. Laughter is a very vague "keep people happy" and Magic an even more nebulous "holds friendships together". It doesn't seem that odd of a split, really.

I would say honesty and loyalty can be frequently misunderstood, but not so much confused.

Your OTP is LunaxLuna?

Mine is!

Good catch. He does say "thousands of moons ago." Of course, 12000 moons ago would be around 1000 years, and would still be "thousands of moons." Still, an odd phrasing.

Not so odd. A moon cycle is a shorter and more universally consistent measure if time than a season. I can't actually think of many places in the United States that have four seasons, let alone equal ones. But a moon is always the same, from here to saddle Arabia.

Or is this a case of OT3...? (I learned term on TV Tropes yesterday on a - comparitively brief - accidental trope-time-browse...)

Lix is so rubbing off on you~

I guess they were just attuned to them in a different way. They were in their natural/original form then and perhaps that's how they originally worked. When NMM smashed them in the pilot, they had to reassemble themselves to reattune and picked a simpler form for that assembly. Thus, they fixed themselves, but the reduction in power meant they were locked to a specific pony in order to still work.

Maybe.

Why do you assume atunement at all? It's more likely that, like a cross before a vampire, you don't attune anything to you but must yourself attune to this other thing. As harmonious beings who brought peace to Equestria, Celestia was able to demonstrate all elements in her persona. Conversely, Rainbow Dash can't use kindness not because it isn't attuned to her, but because she herself does not resonate with Kindness as a mystic virtue.

I'm not normally a straight-Twi shipper, but this humanized TwiMac has something about it that I just really like, and which makes the ship actually seem ... nice (nothing spoilery about this picture)

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It's nice, but it's not Twi/Mac. Not really. Those two artfully done, well drawn people could be anyone. There is no Twilight or Big Mac in there. It lacks their essence. It is in That regard sterile.

It's a freaking fantastic picture though! Don't get me wrong. I love it~

Hello ponythreads, long time no see:

Spoiler: Thoughts on the episode

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Oh god it is good to go in with low expectations, a lot of things impressed me. Relinquishing them of the elements was a great move, Discord was illustrated to be just as untrustworthy as he was as a straight villain, and the flashback sequence reveal took me by surprise fairly well.

Also I liked that they didn't try to force another musical episode.

Spoiler: Also dirty joke incoming:

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Zecora: I'm afraid it is a mystery to me as well, but I may have something that, if combined with a spell... I do not dare to use it myself, the results would be tragic. It only responds to alicorn magic. Princess Twilight, you can turn the potion from purple to white. After a sip, you may see why the sky is day and night.

[casts spell]

Twilight: ...does the potion really have to be white? Sort of makes it look like...

Rainbow Dash: Come on Twilight! Drink it already!

Jakhaivah! Nice to see you, sport!

I didn't catch that line. Ew.

*Catches and Carries back in to thread*

You're not getting away that easily.

*Pirate Ninja Wizard zorro swashbuckler Pony Wizard log rests in Rater's arms, with a note pinned on it that reads "Ha Ha!" In the manliest, most over-the-top swashbuckle font possible*

*a pony gallops away in the distance, to the sound of raspberries*

1. When was your child's due date again?!

2. Ouch.

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S4 Opener:

"Royal doodies"

*snerk*

Okay, okay, in all seriousness, this was a fantastic way to kick off the season. Addressed dang near everything people were curious/worried about at the end of last season, the pacing felt incredible, the lighting animation blew me away, we got to see some spectacular flashbacks, we got to see the origin of the Elements of Harmony, we lost the Elements of Harmony, we got a massive plot hook for the rest of the season, Discord being delightfully vague about everything, Discord with thousand-year-old dormant contingencies, Discord with a sassy maid walk, I could go on but a sentence any longer is illegal everywhere except Texas, so I'll leave it at that. So many good things that I'll be geeking out over all week.


And a thing I just realized; Discord knew about the Tree of Harmony and the Elements. So...y'know. Have fun with that thought.

Of course. Discord is chronally asynchronous. He has probably seen most of what will happen and just isn't of a mind to deviate from that. He knew this would happen and knew he could do all the chaos he wanted – after all, he already knows the end result so what's the harm? No one got hurt!

It also makes sense with his irritation at Fluttershy. He knows she is going to give in to his magic in S2 opener, the fun is in how. Her resistance was probably very bothersome because he had 100% certainty and yet she still held out.

The first of two major gripes were that the whole "go home Twilight" bit felt wonky. Out of place, rushed, and too quickly resolved. However, moving it back to before they entered the forest probably would've solved all those problems. The other was that it felt like the Tree of Harmony's backup power magic thing was never really explained. What was its magic? Why did it go out now of all times? Did somepony tamper with it? Would have been nice to have a little more detail there.

Second part; Discord's seeds finally sprouted and shut it down. He sent them to root for just that purpose.

Oof. And now I have six pages of ponythread to catch up on. Wish me luck, folks; I'm goin' in!

*dives headlong into a pile of spoiler boxes*

Ha! Six? We'll have you crashing double-digits yet, private!

Rollin' around at the speed of sound...~

Got places to go
Gotta follow my rain~bow

Hype Train status: I have thrown the entire caboose into the boiler, dragon-kicked the throttle into the next zip code, and am currently swinging from the whistle pull.

THATS WHAT SHE SAID

I hope so, doubly so if it means we get more of Sombra. I've seen so many fan works take him in a lot of interesting directions (*cough cough Tea Party cough*) that it'd be a shame if that's all we see of him. Plus, we've already seen the results of one villain's disused contingency plan; who's to say the calculating, trap-clever Sombra didn't leave behind a few surprises?

Would be interesting, but hey. It's a kids show, and I doubt they really have the room to investigate that sort of thing. You don't get into grey morality until preteen literature. Which means Sombra is an understated and clever villain, he's a caricature. Until proven otherwise, of course.

More to the point, I find it massively impressive that she kept a straight face when she saw a little filly - all but bursting with magical potential - suddenly get a Cutie Mark from the Tree of Harmony.

Why?

Seriously. Why?

Shining Armor has the same thing. The spark just generically represents magic. Sunset Shimmer had a so. cutie Mark, that was on the tree of Harmony too.

I like it because it adds a air of mysticism to things. Prophecies hidden in old wive's takes, predictions, astral journeys... There's a lot to take in there and people are still focusing on DBZ blasts and solar system sham

It's mighty difficult to not have damsels be in distress when they make up nearly 86% of your main characters.

But in all seriousness, I didn't ever get the impression that Twilight was a damsel needing saving. With the facehugger-gas-vines, as soon as she got room to breathe she was blasting them away like they were nothing. As for the cragodile, she certainly could have handled it better, but then again it was an ambush. Twilight is by no means a combat-trained caster, and suddenly finding yourself face-to-face with an enormous rock monster is a harrowing experience at the best of times. She had a moment of panicked hesitation, then jumped in to help her friends tie it up. Seems about right for what we've seen of her.

There's a big difference between "Augh, I need saving!" and, "Augh! I got ambushed and didn't have my spells on a hair-trigger!"

Word. Her reaction to the cragodile was about the same as her reaction to the hydra. And the sea serpent. And the manticore... Hmm. Pattern.

The problem, if you're inclined to see it as one, is made especially egregious by the fact that Twilight teleported through the wall so as not to crash into it (though she left Spike behind to crash...what's up with that?). We could have done without the reminder that the method she chose wasn't necessarily the speediest.

You've got that backwards.

That Twilight only teleported as a last resort, across short distances, and could only brig herself and leave spike is probably meant to prove that Magic Is Not Panacea. It's hard. She's failed before. She has shown off during a song, under no stress, but hell! People can so cartwheels for days but still have trouble doing a side handstand out of the way of danger. His plot second precision timing under duress is hard.

Practical difficulties (which may or may not be a handwave) aside, thematically the episode was served much better by having Twilight fly. Becoming gradually better at flying is a sign she's becoming more comfortable in her new skin and her new role. An easy visual reinforcement of the dialogue which shows the same thing.

Yuss.

OH COME ON! IT WAS DISCORD'S FAILED PLAN THE WHOLE TIME?!? Arrg. Could have been so cool. A whole "balance of the world" thing and how taking the element upset the balance. How Celestia and Luna essentially screwed with the natural order of magic when they took the Elements and the world itself was rebelling! Could have been amazing. Ah well, at least this episode wasn't as bad as certain others.

Balance is often misunderstood and always poorly represented. The 'balance' most people think of is actually Stasis, not balance.

Harmony is one of those things spread by sharing, not diminished. Having the world thrown out of whack because of Harmony would be rather silly.

Wait, how is it that Celestia and Luna could be overcome by the vines in Canterlot, yet the Mane 6 in the middle of the Everfree forest were able to easily best them?

The vines were meant to subjugate the harmonious. They were designed to sap the power of the tree. What power would Celestia and Luna have that wasn't of Harmony?

Haha! That's a good one. It was nice to see Discord be mischievous without being evil. As for the Teleporting thing, yeah it's so inconstant with Twi that it sometimes hurts my head. At least give it a try or explain to me why it wouldn't work.

I Dunno. I mean, Canterlot is a day away by train. Has Teilight ever single-shot teleported a day away? We've seen her struggle with a group in a hurry with a basic dimension door, and we've seen her short range teleport repeatedly, but never as I recall has she ever obviated story level distance.

We've been told that he's got a song in the season so I presume there will be at least one more appearance.

I think we already got our song, friend. Trolololol?

It did seem a bit odd that the vines were helpless to weaker creatures (Heck, a window pane chopped a thick vine in half). I guess the vines threw their A game at the sisters and then got lazy with the others.

I don't understand or give credence to any stance that looks at a pony who can balance asymmetrically on its front legs and stop a multiton speeding cart with it's back legs in a resting locked position, and call that pony a weaker creature.

Nah, see. The thing about the vines is they were specifically designed to capture Luna and Celestia. Just that, nothing more.
So everything else was just them engaging in casual spite and anarchy for it's own sake. They had already completed their mission.

I liked Zecora's statement of the Everfree being too wild now. I know it's the vines, but I like the idea that the forest was held in check by the tree of Harmony and when it was weakened the forest itself ran rampant, separate from anything Discord did.

You know what this episode went out of the way to prove, in a way that I whole-heartedly approve of? Y'know, aside from all of the other stuff I loved to death?

They go out of their way to show, multiple times, that just because your a princess that you're not an invincible god of some kind. You're a unicorn with wings, that's about it. How strong you are otherwise is entirely dependent on who you are and not what you are.

+10 for handling all the former rumors that Twilicorn would be able to solve all problems with OMGALICORNPOWERS, cause they don't exist.

Aside from intriguing hints of dark magic/alicorn magic type deals, and all that resulted in was being able to drink a potion.

Aye. People mixed up causation. One does not get extraordinary power by becoming an arch mage, one becomes an archmage by getting extraordinary power. Assuming that getting a promotion grants you bonus power is silly.

Oh, yeah. Also something that stood out and that I approve of.

Night and Day at the same time, as some kind of side effect of the Tree of Harmony starting to die and/or Celestia and Luna being vined.

It may not be entirely irrefutable proof that the whole day-night cycle is because of the movement of earth-style celestial bodies thing, but it's pretty damn close.
This puts canon a lot closer to confirming the way I head-canoned it, with it being entirely possible to say, have ponyville stuck in eternal night even if it was daylight somewhere else. Wibbly Wobbyl Magicy Wagicky.

Which is to say that night is an actual thing rather than just the shadow of the planetoid you are standing on.

Yep. Night is it's own emanation from the moon. Total confirmation, there.

[*] • …And incoming Fluttershy tentacle-vine fic.

Huh. Somehow, I missed that.

[*] • "We wouldn't go through your books without permission"? It's a LIBRARY for pony's sake. It's what ponies DO in a library.

Ah, no, it used to be a public library. But private libraries exist. Twilight's house is clearly referred to (I think as a loft), and it is not a public building people can walk into and out of. She has a library, but her saying "to the library!" Is no more indicative of building name than if one were to say "to the lobby!"

The idea that she must work as a librarian because modern society only has libraries as public buildings where one checks out books is a mite bit short sighted.

[*] • WAIT. Wait wait wait wait waaaaait. Alicorn magic looks just like the dark magic we saw Sombra use?

Yep! Sombra was one hell of a sorcerer, and I'm pushing for him having been royal.

[*] • THAT is a crocodile? Ye goddesses, man. I'm staying away from your version of Florida.

cragodile.

[*] • …Am I the only one who's worried about the giant crocodile that they've left tied up in the dangerous forest of doom and death?

Yep! *hums cheerily*

[*] • Nope. Nope! NOOOOPE.Avi. Twilight does not get a sonic Twiboom, and no amount of your silly show canon will persuade me otherwise!

*shrug*

Your loss!

It's sad because it's true.

What is? Valve selling keys in Cyrillic?

I figure the day/night thing was a side effect from the chaos magic of the vines. As Twilight pointed out, the weirdness certainly had Discord's signature on it since it was one of his old plans from centuries back (And we know discord can control the sun/moon as well).

I dunno. We know discord can make cycles and time wonky, but I don't think he can control the sun and moon. It's a more "everything is weird" thing, than anything else.

Plus this has happened before, and discord was very pointedly not doing anything. There was no discord magic; there was the world thrown out of whack because those who control the heavens were incapacitated and that which held the wild at bay was diminished and chained.

Still, the important part is that this exact thing has happened before with even less discord involvement; the sun and moon are confirmed to have their own separate emanations here, but the revalation predates discord.

Celestia is often thought of having pink hair, or even a pink coat, when she was roughly Luna's age.

That's actually been explained already.

anyone else notice the increase in animation quality? extra shading, more body movement in the walk cycles, etc.

what do you think the odds are it will stick?

100%. They have the resources now, they aren't going anywhere.

S4 Spoiler-- The Problem with Alicorn Twilight (comic)

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My opinion is that as long as the powers are consistent, then they don't need to be explicitly defined. ...okay, powers probably should be consistent regardless of the explanation.

Man. I am totally going to make that pony feature in my next game somehow. O.O

This story must read

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On my first attempt, I became tiny ninja princess equine with awesome unseeable cutie mark after boldly walking off the path in deadest night and kissing making passionate love with spider prince ... on the rocks! Flawless victory!

Heh. That was... Something.

I think this humanized Dash may be the most intensely ... spot-on depiction of her in human form I've yet to see. That attitude! Awesome!

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Dat Dashie :f

S4 Inception
Those boots. Ouch. Almost "Jessica Rabbit" style heels.

That's an actual, popular style of boot if you can believe it. It relies on the smallness of the foot, but you're basically still walking on the balls of the foot under the toes. It just looks weird because of the size.

At first I was like "WTF" with the fact that it's 73 chapters composed of only 50-100 words per chapter. But maybe it would have been good to mention that it's a "Choose your own adventure" kind of story.

I thought Deadly Adcoon's description gave it away, personally.