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Thread: MTG Share your Card Designs II
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2019-12-19, 07:34 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
They changed something way back when they were properly defining the color pie isn't the same as them just blatantly changing it now.
The same way you can make Oko, Thief of Crowns have a passive Hexproof from White and claim that's Oko is broken. Yeah, it's broken, but not because it has Hexproof from ...
Literally, everything else about it is broken.
Also I was talking about permanents. Hexproof is better on non-permanents since it acts as a counter for spells/abilities.
Trading one of your give hexproof cards for one of the opponent's removal spells isn't massively better than the opponent holding on to the removal spell because he can't target your hexproof creature.
Neither Fiendslayer nor any of "Hexproof from" permanents were broken
because it's 99% the same as does nothing. It's not a reactive ability like on Veil of Summer, and it's not a mass hexproof like Veil of Summer.
You are right in the sense, that mass Hexproof is a problem. But a
Veil of Summer 1R
Instant
You and permanents you control have hexproof from blue and black.
Would probably not see ban.
If True-Name Nemesis didn't have protection from chosen player then it wouldn't even be good, it is absolutely broken because it has protection from chosen player, but a card like:
Bad-Name Nemesis - 6UUU
Creature - Fish - M
As Bad-Name Nemesis enters the battlefield, choose a player.
Bad-Name Nemesis has protection from the chosen player.
1/1
Would obviously suck.
Giving hexproof from is 100% one of the reasons Veil of Summer was a too powerful card.
But you add a draw a card and your spells are uncounterable, and it will be a problem. I think the draw a card is the biggest offender tbh.
Veil of Summer 1R
Instant
If an opponent has cast a blue or black spell this turn, draw a card.
Would be a very bad card?
Can you see how your argument doesn't at all hold up?
If Veil of Summer drew a card without doing anything else it would be incredibly bad. Cantrips aren't good because they replace themselves, they are good because they do something relevant while replacing themselves.
It's not much of a point. Lots of cards see Modern/Legacy play.
And on further scan it was played in 0 Modern and 1 Death and Taxes (Legacy) deck according to MtgTop8.
But colors that don't get Wither, get Wither. Yeah, that makes no sense. Also all colors can pay life.
We've been over this before, don't state cards this old as examples of the colorpie, Sylvan Library i absolutely not a green card by todays color pie.
Also an entire set.
Don't toot your own horn too hard. You're not that good.
I've been thinking something along the line of:
Sneaky - Can only be blocked by creatures with vigilance.
I like this take a lot.
Adaptable
Whenever this creature attacks or blocks, you may have it get +1/-1 or -1/+1 until end of turn.
You could have it be 'blocks or becomes blocked' instead, which makes it a bit worse as a clock but harder to effectively block.
It's triggered, which makes it more complicated than the other evergreen keywords, though not nearly as much as prowess. It stacks, which none of the other keywords do.
It also doesn't seem to scale as well as the other keywords. It's not going to matter that much on a 6/6.
There's also the problem of -power +toughness not being something red can usually do.
The name also needs to be something that feels more red.
You could have it be 'blocks or becomes blocked' instead, which makes it a bit worse as a clock but harder to effectively block.
I think it has some of the same problems, but what about:
Shifty (Switch this creature's power and toughness when it has attacked this turn)
It's not a trigger, but it lasts until end of turn to prevent weird stuff where you change back after combat and die. It also doesn't switch multiple times if you have multiple combat phases.
I also saw someone suggest a flagbearer like mechanic, as both red and blue have redirection effects. It might very well be too complicated though, and could end up a rules nightmare.
More ideas:
Can't be blocked if you've cast an instant or sorcery spell this turn. - I see a lot of issues with this one.
When this creature enters the battlefield, draw a card, then discard a card. - Trigger. Power varies a lot with the set.
Can’t be blocked except by creatures with defender. - Defenders suck and are too few. Evasion isn't needed in the colors.
When this creature becomes target of a spell (an opponent controls), return it to your hand. - Complicated/weird. Bad hexproof.
I really like the idea of power toughness switching or +/-, as it's one of the few ways blue gets combat relevant abilities, and it is also in red. Unfortunately they might just be too complicated for a variety of reasons.Last edited by Ninjaman; 2019-12-19 at 07:35 AM.
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2019-12-19, 07:43 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
Yes, but out of those effect (barring protection since it's all those rolled into one), not being damaged by X is probably the strongest and hexproof from is bottom tier.
Yeah, but "Hexproof from" on a creature is bottom tier. Sure it changes game state against stuff that targets. But number cards that don't need to target are bigger (see any creature).
No. First strike, doesn't stop working. You trade life for creature. It's still forcing a trade. Yeah, life is cheap resource, but not when you're low on it.
"Hexproof from X" is irrelevant because 2/2 bear with hexproof dies to a 2/2 bear. Hexproof prevents a tiny percent of cards, compared to cards it doesn't deal with.
EDIT: Got Ninjad by Ninjaman. It's almost poetic.
They didn't change it just once either.
Yes, I said mass hexproof AND reactive hexproof is a problem. Which part of that wasn't clear?
Reactive Hexproof >> Proactive Hexproof. One is you can't target this. The other is a counterspell for spells/abilities.
A do nothing, draw a card is not that impressive. Card drawing is a resource, that's super valuable, but not on it's own.
Add some effect and a card draw, and the story becomes much different.
No, I just discount regular and competitive. Even on everything barring regular you get 2 and 5 for it respectively. So yeah, it sees some play in modern/legacy.
Plus, Fiendslayer has Lifelink and First strike. That makes him way more powerful than the hexproof part does. Hexproof is a nice addon, but not vital.
Hey it's about as legal as the red card you posted, so it's a fair deal.
This is funny coming from a guy who takes two Scars block card as example of green having "counter prevention".
But no, point is still valid, as you said, set mechanic can go into other colors within a set.Last edited by -D-; 2019-12-19 at 01:19 PM.
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2019-12-19, 01:53 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
I'll mention Fiendslayer Paladin again. It is mostly played against mono red decks. Those decks rarely play creatures with more than 2 power, so having first strike it can hit or block everything anyways, and not dying to their burn spells is huge. If it had said "Fiendslayer Paladin can't be blocked by red or black creatures" it would have been so much worse.
"Hexproof from X" is irrelevant because 2/2 bear with hexproof dies to a 2/2 bear. Hexproof prevents a tiny percent of cards, compared to cards it doesn't deal with.
Hexproof is powerful enough that 1/1s with it see play.
Yes hexproof from [color] is a lot worse than that, but it's very far from not mattering 99% of the time.
They didn't change it just once either.
They can't just go "Screw it, divination in white" just because in the past they've went "actually maybe red should also have access to loot".
Yes, I said mass hexproof AND reactive hexproof is a problem. Which part of that wasn't clear?
Reactive Hexproof >> Proactive Hexproof. One is you can't target this. The other is a counterspell for spells/abilities.
Good reactive hexproof cards:
Heroic Intervention, Dive Down, Blossoming Defense, Vines of Vastwood, Lazotep Plating, Rattlechains
Good proactive hexproof cards:
Drogskol Captain, Fleecemane Lion, Geist of Saint Traft, Gladecover Scout, Gruul Spellbreaker, Invisible Stalker, Sigarda, Host of Herons, Silumgar, the Drifting Death, Silhana Ledgewalker, Slippery Bogle, Thrun, the Last Troll, Sylvan Caryatid, Vine Mare
A do nothing, draw a card is not that impressive. Card drawing is a resource, that's super valuable, but not on it's own.
Add some effect and a card draw, and the story becomes much different.
Of course my comparison was unfair, given that the whole purpose of it was to show that your comparison was unfair.
No, I just discount regular and competitive. Even on everything barring regular you get 2 and 5 for it respectively. So yeah, it sees some play in modern/legacy.
Plus, Fiendslayer has Lifelink and First strike. That makes him way more powerful than the hexproof part does. Hexproof is a nice addon, but not vital.
You are paying 1 mana for the "hexproof". The fact that Fiendslayer Paladin is that much more successful in these formats than Knight of Meadowgrain proves that the hexproof is exactly part of what makes it usable.
Yes the other two keywords are huge as well, but like with Veil of Summer this is a case of all three parts being needed for the card to be good, of course with a much weaker end result in this case.
Hey it's about as legal as the red card you posted, so it's a fair deal.
This is funny coming from a guy who takes two Scars block card as example of green having "counter prevention".
We've also been over this before, don't use Scars block as an example of black mechanics being allowed in other colors, as black bleed into all the other colors that block.
I have also said multiple times that counter prevention might not be in green anymore, but that is no reason to assume it is in black.Last edited by Ninjaman; 2019-12-19 at 01:54 PM.
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2019-12-20, 09:02 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
I was speaking overall. Overall there are more creatures than instant/sorceries. Sure Fiendslayer is good in some matchups that love using instant/sorceries. But it seeing play is not a valid argument.
When you look at Fiendslayer at lowest level. It having Lifelink is much more important than having "Hexproof from".
I mean various crap saw play in a right deck, if the meta was Ok. It seeing play is not an impressive argument.
No. A blanket "Prevent all damage" card on 1/1 would probably make it rare and put it's CMC to 3. That ability alone is worth 2 mana and rarity bump.
You might be right that "Can't be blocked by" is weaker than Hexproof.
My argument was that it costing 0 resource is a problem. Anything that's free or worse gives you resources for free is a problem. Phyrexian mana is a problem because it gives you something for almost nothing (life is the least important resource). Casting something without costing a card is a problem etc.
Getting something for free is always a problem.
Eh, they were at some point part of it, also an entire set.
Yeah. And I said, even you admit that set mechanic like (Wither/-1 counters/Phyrexian mana) can go into a set, into colors it doesn't usually belong.Last edited by -D-; 2019-12-20 at 09:28 AM.
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2019-12-20, 04:04 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
Why does overall mean anything? A mainboard Stony Silence is absolutely terrible, but that doesn't mean it's not a killer sideboard card.
Overall there are more creatures than instant/sorceries.
Sure Fiendslayer is good in some matchups that love using instant/sorceries. But it seeing play is not a valid argument.
When you look at Fiendslayer at lowest level.
It having Lifelink is much more important than having "Hexproof from".
A 3 mana 2/2 lifelink first strike would have seen no play, but Fiendslayer Paladin saw play, that means its ability was relevant.
I mean various crap saw play in a right deck, if the meta was Ok. It seeing play is not an impressive argument.
It was absolutely played for the meta, but that's kind of the point, the ability was good in that meta.
I see you once again completely ignored my comparison with Knight of Meadowgrain.
No. A blanket "Prevent all damage" card on 1/1 would probably make it rare and put it's CMC to 3. That ability alone is worth 2 mana and rarity bump.
You might be right that "Can't be blocked by" is weaker than Hexproof.
Hexproof is for instance way more powerful than vigilance.
Eh, they were at some point part of it,
also an entire set.
Yeah. And I said, even you admit that set mechanic like (Wither/-1 counters/Phyrexian mana) can go into a set, into colors it doesn't usually belong.
You can do it if it's important to your set mechanic, not on a whim. If the only way you're using corruption is putting it on yourself then all colors can do that. If corruption is used in different ways then green and blue don't get to put it on themselves, because they don't get to pay life.Last edited by Ninjaman; 2019-12-20 at 04:05 PM.
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2019-12-21, 05:36 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
SpoilerLast edited by enderlord99; 2019-12-21 at 05:37 AM.
I use braces (also known as "curly brackets") to indicate sarcasm. If there are none present, I probably believe what I am saying; should it turn out to be inaccurate trivia, please tell me rather than trying to play along with an apparent joke I don't know I'm making.
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2019-12-30, 07:03 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
The card has two problems. First. It's too parasitic. You have to sacrifice three specific creatures or three Changelings. So you pull it out of the booster pack, and it's very underwhelming.
Second problem is its effects. It's simply too powerful. Like unprintably bad. Assuming, your opponent doesn't play blue - you essentially get to do nothing for a turn.
You have a card that's both hard to play, and hard to print.
So how would I improve this? Exiling a spell for 1BU is fine. Exiling entire hand is just brutal of an effect, look at Thought Distortion. That alone is 6 mana. No exile the spell and stop draw.
Yes. Limited.
Look. Lanterns saw play in the mainboard, does that mean Lanterns are some kind of OP or powerful cards? No. They just found a niche.
Sideboard Stony Silence is horrible in Limited as well.
The discussion was - which of the components of Protection aka Resistance was most powerful. Damage is by far the most powerful part. Because it's on most things, creatures, spells, etc.
We're not talking about Hexproof though. Hexproof from color. That's 1/5th of the Hexproof strength.
Also, you are undervaluing evasion. Hexproof with no evasion/pump is just dead card.
Corruption is mostly self-inflicted.
Only colors that can give corruption to opponents are black and red (with blue being strictly optional). And corruption negation is white.
What I mean by blue optionally
Machinations U
Instant - U
Counter target spell. If a spell is countered this way, spell's controller may gain a corruption counter. If they do, they draw a card.Last edited by -D-; 2019-12-31 at 05:35 AM.
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2019-12-31, 05:47 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
Why does it matter that a card that clearly wasn't meant for limited is bad in limited?
Look. Lanterns saw play in the mainboard, does that mean Lanterns are some kind of OP or powerful cards? No. They just found a niche.
Sideboard Stony Silence is horrible in Limited as well.
The discussion was - which of the components of Protection aka Resistance was most powerful. Damage is by far the most powerful part. Because it's on most things, creatures, spells, etc.
Hexproof prevents a tiny percent of cards, compared to cards it doesn't deal with.
Preventing damage being more powerful than giving hexproof doesn't make hexproof not matter 99% of the time as you claimed.
We're not talking about Hexproof though. Hexproof from color. That's 1/5th of the Hexproof strength.
It's like claiming Plague Engineer's ability is 1/100 of the power of Curse of Death's hold, because there's a 100 different creature types, clearly missing that you want to use it in the matchups where it hits most of your opponent's creatures.
Also, you are undervaluing evasion. Hexproof with no evasion/pump is just dead card.
Geist of Saint Traft doesn't need either of those.
Carnage Tyrant doesn't need either of those.
Thrun, the Last Troll doesn't need either of those.
Yes most small hexproof creatures are played with pump, but that's kind of the point of them.
Once again you've ignored my comparison with Knight of the Meadowgrain.
I'd also like you to reply to this point:
Sure Fiendslayer is good in some matchups that love using instant/sorceries. But it seeing play is not a valid argument.Corruption is mostly self-inflicted.
Only colors that can give corruption to opponents are black and red (with blue being strictly optional). And corruption negation is white.
Machinations U
Instant - U
Counter target spell. If a spell is countered this way, spell's controller may gain a corruption counter. If they do, they draw a card.Last edited by Ninjaman; 2019-12-31 at 06:08 AM.
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2019-12-31, 09:35 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
How do you mean not meant for limited? Every card is meant for limited. Each card will participate in limited, with a small side note for mythics. Those can be arbitrarily powerful since they have little chance of being pulled at limited.
You claimed that since it's used in few decks in older Eternal format means, it's powerful. I'm just noting that by that logic, Lantern is some kind of OP card, since it sees play many times more.
To me, a card seeing play in a deck, means, it found its niche. A proof of it being powerful is that it's A) relatively recent B) sees play in meta decks. E.g. Oko is OP he immediately saw play in meta decks like say top 20. Fiendslayer didn't, ergo for I don't consider it that powerful.
Yes. We were discussing which of Resistance from X parts was weakest. Those parts where
A) Hexproof from X
B) Can't be blocked by X (evasion)
C) Damage immunity from X
To me, the Hexproof from X is definitely not as strong as Damage from X. I might have misvalued Evasion. You noted Hexproof was a powerful evergreen, I noted damage immunity was way more powerful since it is too strong to print.
You're forgetting I already talked about this - Reactive protection/hexproof is >>> than passive protection/hexproof.
Plague engineer is played in a different way. You'll never going to play it in a way that's useless. So while there are 100 different types, you'll always target something.
A permanent with Hexproof from X, at the moment, can't choose their color, if they did my evaluation would differ.
Look, Vigilance is an awesome evergreen, since it's on Questing Beast and Zetalpa, and those are powerful bombs.
Yeah, no, that's not how you compare their power and usage.
To compare Hexproof for its value, you need to isolate it and look at creatures that have just Hexproof and how it impacts their CMC.
How do you deal with a plain creature with Hexproof in a low power setting aka Standard/Limited? You ignore it or AoE it. How do you win with it? You give it some evasion and/or pump it.
Now water this down, since we are discussing Hexproof from X. Then, you just find the colors the creature isn't hexproofed from. E.g. against Fiendslayer, you play a white removal, like Path To Exile.
How is Fiendslayer Paladin seeing play for it's "hexproof" ability not an argument for its hexproof ability being useful.
Any card can be useful given right support cards and metagame.Last edited by -D-; 2019-12-31 at 09:49 PM.
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2020-01-01, 09:35 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
Stony Silence isn't meant for limited. Yes you can pull it in packs, but it's not a card that is expected to see play in limited, it exists for constructed.
You claimed that since it's used in few decks in older Eternal format means, it's powerful. I'm just noting that by that logic, Lantern is some kind of OP card, since it sees play many times more.
I said it was useful, and it sees play because of this.
I never said Fiendslayer Paladin was a very powerful card, I said its hexproof ability wasn't useless 99% of the time, which is what you claimed. You keep ignoring this.
Yes. We were discussing which of Resistance from X parts was weakest. Those parts where
A) Hexproof from X
B) Can't be blocked by X (evasion)
C) Damage immunity from X
To me, the Hexproof from X is definitely not as strong as Damage from X. I might have misvalued Evasion. You noted Hexproof was a powerful evergreen, I noted damage immunity was way more powerful since it is too strong to print.
"Hexproof prevents a tiny percent of cards, compared to cards it doesn't deal with. "
You consistently try to argue against points I never made to begin with.
You're forgetting I already talked about this - Reactive protection/hexproof is >>> than passive protection/hexproof.
Good reactive hexproof cards:
Heroic Intervention, Dive Down, Blossoming Defense, Vines of Vastwood, Lazotep Plating, Rattlechains
Good proactive hexproof cards:
Drogskol Captain, Fleecemane Lion, Geist of Saint Traft, Gladecover Scout, Gruul Spellbreaker, Invisible Stalker, Sigarda, Host of Herons, Silhana Ledgewalker, Slippery Bogle, Thrun, the Last Troll, Sylvan Caryatid, Vine Mare
Plague engineer is played in a different way. You'll never going to play it in a way that's useless. So while there are 100 different types, you'll always target something.
A permanent with Hexproof from X, at the moment, can't choose their color, if they did my evaluation would differ.
Protection also only matters some of the time, doesn't make it useless.
Look, Vigilance is an awesome evergreen, since it's on Questing Beast and Zetalpa, and those are powerful bombs.
Yeah, no, that's not how you compare their power and usage.
Questing Beast loosing vigilance would not make the card that much worse, while Geist of Saint Traft would go from a very powerful card to being unplayable if you removed hexproof.
To compare Hexproof for its value, you need to isolate it and look at creatures that have just Hexproof and how it impacts their CMC.
Aven Fleetwing - Wind Drake
Flying, Haste and Hexproof are generally the stronger evergreen keywords.
Indestructible and Double Strike are in a league of their own, nut they don't really show up at common.
How do you deal with a plain creature with Hexproof in a low power setting aka Standard/Limited? You ignore it or AoE it. How do you win with it? You give it some evasion and/or pump it.
Benthic Giant
Cold-Water Snapper
Dungrove Elder
Horror of the Dim
Lumberknot
Plated Slagwurm
Primal Huntbeast
Rubbleback Rhino
Sacred Wolf
Scaled Behemoth
Striped Riverwinder
Vine Mare
Most of the time these might as well have shroud. Pump/evasion isn't necessary.
Now water this down, since we are discussing Hexproof from X. Then, you just find the colors the creature isn't hexproofed from. E.g. against Fiendslayer, you play a white removal, like Path To Exile.
If you play Fiendslayer Paladin against a Boros burn deck in modern they can board in two Path to Exiles in to deal with it, and have to hope to draw it. Those are pretty good odds for the Fiendslayer Paladin
Against legacy burn which is mono red their best answer to fiendslayer is 1-2 Sulfuric Vortex in 75.
How is the argument of something seeing play, an argument of it being useful?
Any card can be useful given right support cards and metagame.
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2020-01-02, 08:04 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
It's still designed with Limited in mind. Otherwise, too many SS-like cards get in the card pool and make Limited disappointing.
Each card is accessed on several Axes, corresponding to popular formats and purposes. Sure, you can let few slip by, but in general you need to watch the overall cards.
First off. That's not a Hexproof from X.
Second, he had "resistance" to two colors.
Third, he had lifelink and first strike making him good at dealing with annoying hasters that control likes.
Fourth, he's underplayed as it is. I mean is he even in 0.01% of all white decks being played now?
Fifth, it seeing play is not a high bar, especially only in some lower ranks.
It's still infinitely better than Hexproof from <COLOR>.
Your comparison had Carnage Tyrant, Regenerating Troll, and lif
Questing Beast loosing vigilance would not make the card that much worse, while Geist of Saint Traft would go from a very powerful card to being unplayable if you removed hexproof.
Yeah, but those are late game bomb to seal the deal. They come pre-pumped, but if you are getting to turn 6+ land unless you are Control, that's end game turf.
Sure, but being a sideboard or even main-deck card is terribly context-dependent. Everyone is running with enchantment creatures? Oh, look. Elf that kills enchantments is seeing play in my main-deck (yes, it's that bad). No one is playing enchantments, out he goes... etc.
Yeah, I keep forgetting Fiendslayer is way worse. He won't see play if Grim Lavamancer is used by red.
So, yeah, he's worse. You don't need a white spell to kill him. Just target him with red ability.
Because usefulness depends on the context. Just because you're useful against burn deck at point A, doesn't mean you'll be useful at point B.
Furthermore, I don't see how he seeing play has anything to do with Hexproof from X being useful when they didn't print a decent permanent card with "Hexproof from" in... ever.
------------------------
BTW not sure if you're following Theros reveals, but the resemblance is uncanny.
Spoiler
Last edited by -D-; 2020-01-02 at 08:11 PM.
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2020-01-03, 03:53 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
Stony Silence specifically isn't designed with limited in mind.
Stony Silence is absolutely dreadful in limited, you would play Fiendslayer Paladin in limited.
First off. That's not a Hexproof from X.
If a worse version of Hexproof from X is useful, then Hexproof from X is useful.
Second, he had "resistance" to two colors.
In standard is mattered a little, outside of standard it matters very very little, since you typically only board it in against mono red, and those decks don't play black removal.
Third, he had lifelink and first strike making him good at dealing with annoying hasters that control likes.
Fourth, he's underplayed as it is. I mean is he even in 0.01% of all white decks being played now?
Him seeing little play says something about the general powerlevel of the card not being that high, it doesn't mean that the "hexproof", that you're deliberately paying 1 for, is useless 99% of the time.
Seeing even a little play in non-rotational formats already makes him better that the vast majority of mono red hate cards that saw no success outside of standard.
Fifth, it seeing play is not a high bar, especially only in some lower ranks.
Your initial claim was that the ability was useless 99% of the time, I'm showing that claim was wrong. I'm not saying Fiendslayer Paladin is some super powerful OP card.
It's still infinitely better than Hexproof from <COLOR>.
It is better, it isn't infinitely better. Hyperbole helps your argument to no extend.
Your comparison had Carnage Tyrant, Regenerating Troll, and lif
Questing Beast loosing vigilance would not make the card that much worse, while Geist of Saint Traft would go from a very powerful card to being unplayable if you removed hexproof.
Yeah, but those are late game bomb to seal the deal.
They come pre-pumped,
The extend to which you are changing the question is amazing.
You can't first claim hexproof creatures need pump, then change it to being french vanilla hexproof creatures need pump, and then change it to small french vanilla hexproof creatures need pump.
You are constantly moving the goal posts of your arguments. That just goes to show how badly they hold up.
Think of the argument you actually want to make and then make that, rather than change it every reply.
but if you are getting to turn 6+ land unless you are Control, that's end game turf.
Sure, but being a sideboard or even main-deck card is terribly context-dependent.
Saying it's context dependent doesn't matter. We're not discussing the
Everyone is running with enchantment creatures? Oh, look. Elf that kills enchantments is seeing play in my main-deck (yes, it's that bad). No one is playing enchantments, out he goes... etc.
Also in case you're referring to Reclamation Sage, that card is playable main deck.
Yeah, I keep forgetting Fiendslayer is way worse. He won't see play if Grim Lavamancer is used by red.
So, yeah, he's worse. You don't need a white spell to kill him. Just target him with red ability.
And if he had the "useless 99% of the time" hexproof from instead then he wouldn't have this problem.
Because usefulness depends on the context. Just because you're useful against burn deck at point A, doesn't mean you'll be useful at point B.
Fiendslayer Paladin sees play over Knight of the Meadowgrain specifically because the last ability is useful.
Furthermore, I don't see how he seeing play has anything to do with Hexproof from X being useful when they didn't print a decent permanent card with "Hexproof from" in... ever.
I mentioned this before, they've printed a total of two uncommons with "Hexproof from [color]". That's not a good enough basis to judge a mechanic as useless.
Also, both Knight of Malice and Knight of Grace see play in standard, both as a mainboard and sideboard card.
You can't just judge a mechanic by the cards that exist with it, especially not when the amount of cards is so small.
Cipher is a very powerful ability, as it allows you to cast a card multiple times. The problem was Wizards recognized this, and therefore made all the cipher cards so awful that even with the powerful ability they were still bad. But don't tell me a shock with cipher wouldn't see play specifically because it had cipher.
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2020-01-03, 05:01 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
...The applicability of Grim Lavamancer is specifically because Fiendslayer Paladin has less than Hexproof From, being even more narrowed down to specifically spell targeting. And its unplayability likely has a lot more to do with the various Protection-granters in general doing the job better for being able to actually protect your stuff on-board and usually can be whatever you want, and when it comes to dealing with Black in Modern, Mirran Crusader is going to be quite a deal better for having outright Protection, so it simply doesn't take any combat damage, and Double Strike, so it'll deal quite a bit more. Especially when pumped.
And Paladin en-Vec also does First Strike and "screw Red and Black" at 2/2 for 3, being Protection From both, so unless you're really desperate for Lifelink or playing Pioneer, it isn't particularly notable. Even in those cases, Lone Rider is often going to turn out better unless you're dealing with exceedingly heavy Red and Black removal, in which case Brave the Elements and Gods Willing are better in most cases for, again, actually protecting whatever's on board instead of just giving the one resistant body, and let you pick whatever you need protection from. Unless it's Colorless.
When it comes down to it, the issue with "Hexproof From", as Fiendslayer Paladin downgrades it, is putting it on a largely-regular creature, making it need to compare to a lot of other things, including packing Protection-granters and the non-Hexproof creatures, especially all the Protection From floating around in Modern. A 3/2 First Strike for 2 that can't be targeted by Black, which is what Knight of Grace does, is pretty darn good, but ultimately not enough to be played outside the cases where your gameplan relies on that one hard-to-kill attacker and the enemy's based around targeting stuff with Black, or there's quite a number of 3-and-under toughness creatures you want dead when they swing, which is again done better by Paladin en-Vec and Mirran Crusader, for not caring about the damage and being unblockable (or being a 4/4 First Strike Trample attacking as early as turn 3 for Lone Rider as It That Rides As One). The powerhouse of Hexproof is when it's on stuff like Geist of Saint Traft, where it enormously complicates the removal of something that's often desperately necessary to get rid of.
Fiendslayer Paladin in particular is doomed to the sideboard at best, and very specifically against red burn, because Black has the better option of Knight of Glory to beat it down. And ultimately has to compete with It That Rides As One, which is bigger, costs less mana to drop and has Trample, at the cost of starting as a 1/1 until you can gain 3 life in a single turn. Which can trivially amount to sticking a pump spell on it when it blocks the following turn, which is often a better state than running something that can't be attacked into to begin with because you're actually getting rid of enemy resources.
The TL;DR, here, is that Hexproof mostly matters when it applies to White and Green so your stuff targeting is important, or when it's on something that's important to preserve. And a simple First Strike Lifelinker usually isn't enough compared to running outright Protection-granters, which also stop combat damage and can even make your creatures effectively unblockable. It's that there's simply better options the great bulk of the time, not that it's irrelevant. When it's inbuilt to something with a good effect, it's a good ability, simply put.
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2020-01-03, 07:27 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
Missing, the point here. It's absolutely designed with Limited in mind. That's why you don't see it in any set that would make an impact, i.e. "artifacts matter" sets.
Yes, some cards can be great in Constructed and bad at others, or great for Commander and bad for others. Fiendslayer wasn't designed as a strict sideboard card. He's still somewhat decent in Limited.
I was talking about giving a permanent Hexproof from Color, not Hexproof from All-Color, or Hexproof from A and B. Because playing Hexproof from a single color in an environment where most decks are multicolors (i.e. Constructed/Limited/Commander), is exactly as writing " ".
Also it saw some play in some meta. Congrats. Now you can join the illustrious ranks of Illusions of Grandeur. Or Sheherezada.
And the reason why Fiendslayer won't see much play, is because red already has answers for it, but at some (this?) point of time it didn't, so you could side it.
I personally would run Auriok Champion any day of the week, over the Fiendslayer, for some reason they didn't include it. I assume that Plague Engineer makes Auriok Champion worse.
You can guarantee value with Plague Engineer. You can play it proactively (shutting down some creatures) or reactively. That's why you see it played a lot.
Yeah, gotta stop arguing with you before bed. But it's more or less complete. Sure Questing beast Vigilance is not important, but a Carnage Tyrant without Hexproof is still great. 6 CMC 7/6 Trampler, that can't be countered. Sign me up.
I can try. Standard is a giant scam
Hopefully, you see why I dislike talking about Standard. I mean, he could be great. Or the white decks just lost their powerful anti-burn card, and have to settle with Fiendslayer, because he's the only other game in town.
Those creatures (most of them being green creatures with hexproof) still could use evasion/pump (e.g. flying/trample). They just don't need it as much. Most hexproofer creatures are generally smaller, since most creatures are in range of 2-3 CMC, followed by 4-5, then 6+ is its own rank.
Moving goalpost? I adjust my viewpoint when new evidence emerges.
Ok let's put your claim to the test. According to MTGTop8, Grim Lavamancer played as side/main board card in 6901 decks (vs Fiendslayer's 15?). Monastery Swiftspear is a Burn staple, and it plus Grim Lavamancer are in 2904 decks, but it seems a lot of those are coming from Commander or some ****. Let's look at Modern. Here we have Grim Lavamancer is played in 1284 decks. Compared to 5 decks for Fiendslayer.
Lavamancer is still played way more overall. I think there might be more Lavamancer mainboards than Fiendslayer has main+sideboards. Lavamancer might see less play, because dregde/delve hate is now more prevalent.
What format? Also, if you play Vine Mare, will the opponent still see turn 6?
Vine Mare probably uses some pump, especially in Aggro decks, since those want to win now, rather than later. You still win by pumping it, since it's a safer target for pump.
No, you can't. Whether Fiendslayer is playable in meta depends on the other cards in meta. It has little to no value with what is printed on it.
Here is a thought experiment. Meta has Auriok Champion (AC for short) and Fiendslayer (FS for short). AC is used against burn. Wizards print Plague Engineer (PE for short), suddenly AC isn't played, but FS is. Now let's say wizards print a creature that negates PE. Now, AC starts seeing play and FS falls out of fashion.
Or here is another. Meta has PE and no AC, so people play FS. But now dredge is no longer a priority, there is less graveyard hate, so Grim Lavamancer can be played againt and FS is replaced by another card.
See how one unrelated part of meta has changed the value of FS? That's my problem with deeming something valuable in meta. It's essentially random.
Yeah, but did he saw play because he was good, or because cards that occupied his niche (anti-burn cards) were hosed out by another unrelated card? Or because no one expected him and didn't prepare.
Did he saw play because he was a Human (vs Knight of Meadowgrain) or a Knight (vs Auriok Champion)?
Or because he had 2 toughness?
Did he saw play because his CMC puts him out of range of some spells/abilities? Etc.
There are many parameters and you are ignoring all of them for a "simple" explanation.
Yes, you can. You can look at evaluations designers from MTG gave it. I'm not saying they are perfect, but they are more accurate. If they were too off the mark, the cards would see a lot of use (e.g. Oko)
It's a 2CMC 2/2 creature. That's common quality. They added something similar to Battle Brawler, which is an uncommon, but since it's weaker, they added Hexproof from Black. Yeah. I don't think they value it highly. I'd say it's probably like a <0.5 CMC.
---------------------------
In liue of the thread title.
Power Overwhelming - 2R
Creature - Avatar
Whenever an enchament is sacrificed, put a +1/+1 counter on CARDNAME.
T, Sacrifice an enchantment: Target creature gains +1/+1 and haste until end of turn.
2/2Last edited by -D-; 2020-01-03 at 07:59 AM.
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2020-01-03, 10:48 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
When you're playing against burn Fiendslayer Paladin is so much better it's not even funny. Protection against all damage matters very little, since only Monastery Swiftspear doesn't die to a 2 power first striker. Gaining life is massive against mono red.
Outside of standard Paladin en-Vec has only seen play in duel commander and highlander, and half those decks play Fiendslayer Paladin too.
Even in those cases, Lone Rider is often going to turn out better
Lone Rider has no success outside of duel commander.
unless you're dealing with exceedingly heavy Red and Black removal, in which case Brave the Elements and Gods Willing are better in most cases for, again, actually protecting whatever's on board instead of just giving the one resistant body, and let you pick whatever you need protection from. Unless it's Colorless.
In order to do that with Brave the Elements or God's Willing, you need to have a different lifelink first striker, hold mana up to protect it, and hope you have more protection than they have removal. Spoiler alert: You Don't. The deck is called burn for a reason, they're gonna have enough burn spells to remove a toughness 2 creature.
The point of Fiendslayer Paladin is that you don't care if they burn your other creatures, Fiendslayer Paladin can win by himself if he has to.
When it comes down to it, the issue with "Hexproof From", as Fiendslayer Paladin downgrades it, is putting it on a largely-regular creature... ...The powerhouse of Hexproof is when it's on stuff like Geist of Saint Traft, where it enormously complicates the removal of something that's often desperately necessary to get rid of.
Fiendslayer Paladin in particular is doomed to the sideboard at best, and very specifically against red burn,
And ultimately has to compete with It That Rides As One, which is bigger, costs less mana to drop and has Trample, at the cost of starting as a 1/1 until you can gain 3 life in a single turn.
Source: Look at Lone Rider's results.
Which can trivially amount to sticking a pump spell on it when it blocks the following turn,
2. Opens you up for getting 2-for-1'd if your opponent has an instant speed removal spell. Against burn they very well might have.
3. That requires you to draw 2 particular cards rather than 1, and if you only draw one of them then you're bad shape.
which is often a better state than running something that can't be attacked into to begin with because you're actually getting rid of enemy resources.
Go on MTGtop8, search, toggle regular off and type in the card you want to search for. That way you can find out what results the cards actually have.
TL;DR: You're not judging Fiendslayer Paladin for how it's used.Last edited by Ninjaman; 2020-01-03 at 02:41 PM.
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2020-01-03, 02:32 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
If by designed with limited in mind you mean designed to not matter in limited, then sure, but then it was a weird reply to me saying it's not meant for limited.
Yes, some cards can be great in Constructed and bad at others, or great for Commander and bad for others. Fiendslayer wasn't designed as a strict sideboard card. He's still somewhat decent in Limited.
Dreadbore didn't destroy a lot of planeswalkers in limited, doesn't mean that clause doesn't matter 99% of the time.
I was talking about giving a permanent Hexproof from Color, not Hexproof from All-Color, or Hexproof from A and B.
Because playing Hexproof from a single color in an environment where most decks are multicolors (i.e. Constructed/Limited/Commander), is exactly as writing " ".
Even against a black red deck, some of their removal will be multicolored, so you still dodge it, and you're blanking above half of it, so you're still down to looking at something 4-8 spells that hit it. That's very far from being blank.
Do you actually think that if Tarmogoyf had hexproof from black, that wouldn't make the card any better in modern?
Also it saw some play in some meta. Congrats. Now you can join the illustrious ranks of Illusions of Grandeur. Or Sheherezada.
And the reason why Fiendslayer won't see much play, is because red already has answers for it, but at some (this?) point of time it didn't, so you could side it.
In Pioneer it's also pretty solid, it being a knight definitely helps, but it also was in the board of an Azorious control list.
I personally would run Auriok Champion any day of the week, over the Fiendslayer, for some reason they didn't include it. I assume that Plague Engineer makes Auriok Champion worse.
Fiendslayer was legal in a different standard environment, and in pioneer.
Auriok Champion requires you to play many creatures, Fiendslayer can be played in control.
Fiendslayer Paladin has better synergy with equipments and auras, so if your deck plays a lot of those it might be better.
The card I was most surprised about not being mentioned was Kor Firewalker.
You can guarantee value with Plague Engineer. You can play it proactively (shutting down some creatures) or reactively. That's why you see it played a lot.
If Plague Engineer only worked on Humans, elves and spirits, then you would only play it in matchups where lots of those creatures showed up.
Yeah, gotta stop arguing with you before bed. But it's more or less complete. Sure Questing beast Vigilance is not important, but a Carnage Tyrant without Hexproof is still great. 6 CMC 7/6 Trampler, that can't be countered. Sign me up.
Hopefully, you see why I dislike talking about Standard. I mean, he could be great. Or the white decks just lost their powerful anti-burn card, and have to settle with Fiendslayer, because he's the only other game in town.
I think you've forgotten what we're arguing here. We're not arguing about whether or not Fiendslayer Paladin is a powerful card, we are arguing about whether or not the "hexproof" clause is a relevant line of text for its usage.
Those creatures (most of them being green creatures with hexproof) still could use evasion/pump (e.g. flying/trample). They just don't need it as much.
When you're blocking you don't need either.
You attack with your big hexproof beater, and if your opponent chumps, great, that's a 1-for-0, do this a few times and you win by card advantage.
And you seem to forget the best evasion in the game: removal.
Most hexproofer creatures are generally smaller, since most creatures are in range of 2-3 CMC,
followed by 4-5, then 6+ is its own rank.
Moving goalpost? I adjust my viewpoint when new evidence emerges.
Ok let's put your claim to the test. According to MTGTop8, Grim Lavamancer played as side/main board card in 6901 decks (vs Fiendslayer's 15?). Monastery Swiftspear is a Burn staple, and it plus Grim Lavamancer are in 2904 decks, but it seems a lot of those are coming from Commander or some ****. Let's look at Modern. Here we have Grim Lavamancer is played in 1284 decks. Compared to 5 decks for Fiendslayer.
Lavamancer is still played way more overall. I think there might be more Lavamancer mainboards than Fiendslayer has main+sideboards. Lavamancer might see less play, because dregde/delve hate is now more prevalent.
My point wasn't that Fiendslayer Paladin is a better card, or that Grim Lavamancer sees no play. My point was that it's played as a few of, and not even in all burn decks. It does offer burn an out to Fiendslayer Paladin, but not a very consistent one. Your hate card doesn't become bad just because the opponent might have 2 answers to it.
What format? Also, if you play Vine Mare, will the opponent still see turn 6?
You might have them dead by turn 6, you might not. How is that relevant?
Vine Mare probably uses some pump, especially in Aggro decks, since those want to win now, rather than later. You still win by pumping it, since it's a safer target for pump.
You're not going for pumping it no, you're going for it being a 5 power creature for 4 mana that doesn't die to removal.
No, you can't. Whether Fiendslayer is playable in meta depends on the other cards in meta. It has little to no value with what is printed on it.
Here is a thought experiment. Meta has Auriok Champion (AC for short) and Fiendslayer (FS for short). AC is used against burn. Wizards print Plague Engineer (PE for short), suddenly AC isn't played, but FS is. Now let's say wizards print a creature that negates PE. Now, AC starts seeing play and FS falls out of fashion.
Or here is another. Meta has PE and no AC, so people play FS. But now dredge is no longer a priority, there is less graveyard hate, so Grim Lavamancer can be played againt and FS is replaced by another card.
See how one unrelated part of meta has changed the value of FS? That's my problem with deeming something valuable in meta. It's essentially random.
And it will see a lot of play because of its "hexproof" which you seem to forget is what we are discussing.
Yeah, but did he saw play because he was good,
or because cards that occupied his niche (anti-burn cards) were hosed out by another unrelated card? Or because no one expected him and didn't prepare.
Did he saw play because he was a Human (vs Knight of Meadowgrain)
Being human might be a reason for playing him in modern humans though, (him or Auriok Champion), since Kor Firewalker isn't a human.
or a Knight (vs Auriok Champion)?
Or because he had 2 toughness?
Did he saw play because his CMC puts him out of range of some spells/abilities? Etc.
Bant hexproof was also a deck that could board him in to great effect since it could slap Auras on him.
There are many parameters and you are ignoring all of them for a "simple" explanation.
The problem with Fiendslayer Paladin isn't that his protection isn't pushed enough. The "hexproof" does what it's supposed to.
The problem is that the rest of the card isn't pushed enough. Modern and Legacy have large enough card pools that in order for a card to be good, it needs to be pushed.
Yes, you can. You can look at evaluations designers from MTG gave it. I'm not saying they are perfect, but they are more accurate. If they were too off the mark, the cards would see a lot of use (e.g. Oko)
I said you can't judge a mechanic by the cards that exist with it, like you're doing with "hexproof from [color]".
If they printed this card:
Fiendslayer of Meadowgrain - WW
Creature - Kithkin Knight - R
Hexproof from red
First strike, lifelink
2/2
You can bet that card would see play in part due to the hexproof from red.
It's a 2CMC 2/2 creature. That's common quality. They added something similar to Battle Brawler, which is an uncommon, but since it's weaker, they added Hexproof from Black. Yeah. I don't think they value it highly. I'd say it's probably like a <0.5 CMC.
Exactly what makes it potentially really useful is that it isn't valued that highly. Hexproof from red is obviously a lot worse than hexproof, but if you're playing against a mono red deck you don't need red hexproof, and because the ability is weaker the rest of the card can be stronger.
It needs to go on a specific kind of card, you can't just strap it onto anything, but on the kind of creature you want to play against that kind of deck it's good.
It's also better than it looks because green and blue aren't that relevant.
Hexproof from:
Loxodon Avenger - 1WG
Creature - Elephant Soldier - R
Hexproof from black
If a spell or ability an opponent controls causes you to discard Loxodon Avenger, put it onto the battlefield instead of putting it into your graveyard.
4/4
Fiend Tamer - 1W
Creature - Human Cleric - R
First Strike
Hexproof from Red
Whenever a red card is put into an opponent's graveyard from anywhere, gain 1 life.
2/1
Menivert, the Channeled - 2RUG
Legendary Creature - Elemental - M
Hexproof from black and from white
Whenever a land enters the battlefield under your control, exile the top card of your library. You may cast spells exiled with Menivert the Channeled.
4/6
Scorching Pyre - 1RR
Creature - Elemental - R
Trample
Hexproof from white
Whenever a creature enters the battlefield under an opponent's control, Surge Pyre deals 1 damage to that creature's controller
3/2
Freezing Tempest - 1UU
Creature - Elemental - R
Flying
Hexproof from red
At the beginning of combat, tap up to one target creature.
2/2
Consuming Growth - 1GG
Creature - Elemental - R
Reach
Hexproof from blue
At the beginning of your upkeep you may exile target instant or sorcery from an opponent's graveyard. If you do, draw a card.
2/4
Festering Grave - 1BB
Creature - Elemental - R
Deathtouch
Hexproof from green
Whenever one or more creatures attack you, put a -1/-1 counter on target attacking creature.
1/3
Blazing Light - 1WW
Creature - Elemental - R
First strike
Hexproof from black
Whenever you or a permanent you control becomes the target of a spell an opponent controls, put a +1/+1 counter on Blazing Light
3/1
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2020-01-03, 04:44 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
Come again?
In Modern he's played a lot in 3/5 Humans and 1/5 Company of Humans.
In Pioneer 4 of 9 decks are called "Knights".
In Legacy he's played in Death and Taxes 14/14. Out of the 14 decks, 12 of those decks run Cavern of Souls and bunch of Humans.
Hang on, your measure was comparing Fiendslayer Paladin to Meadowgrain, and said since both of them have similar cost and Fiendslayer has a better resistance, so its the resistance that makes him outstanding.
But when you compare Fiendslayer Paladin to en-Vec, en-Vec has way better resistance, so the deciding factor should be lifelink/first strike.
Which proves my point, on its own the "Hexproof from red/black instant/sorceries" is not good. Without lifelink, he's not a large threat. And without frst strike he wouldn't have survivability. His saving grace is that it's slightly more resistant than paper which gives you life.
A creature 3CMC 1/3 creature with protection from red, and "At beggining of your upkeep gain 2 life", would see more play than your Fiendslayer of Meadowgrain.
In essence constructed is a random evolving format. You can't know what's going to be good. Do you know if Wizards will headdesk and print another Oko-on-A-Smug-o-Copter-Veil?
My point wasn't that Fiendslayer Paladin is a better card, or that Grim Lavamancer sees no play. My point was that it's played as a few of, and not even in all burn decks. It does offer burn an out to Fiendslayer Paladin, but not a very consistent one. Your hate card doesn't become bad just because the opponent might have 2 answers to it.
In Modern there are:- 1824 decks running - Monastery Swiftspear and Goblin Guide, the most frequent burn cards.
- 1247 decks running - Monastery Swiftspear, Goblin Guide and Grim Lavamancer.
So Lavamancer is in approx 68% if burn decks. Is ~70% is considered few
The burn is consistent, you just need to play 1 fetch and 1 burn. Or play Faithless looting, or play 2 spells, which as we know is impossible for a red burn deck.
You know what these might actually decent against? Oko. Otherwise fine design.
Also, I'd push "Hexproof from" in another way.
Anti-Mage 1WW
Creature - Human Knight - R
Hexproof from instant and sorceries.
Whenever an opponent casts an instant or sorcery, you gain 2 life.
2/2
"I smell magic in the air"
Hyper Pest UU
Creature - Insect - U
Flying.
Hexproof from 3 or less (This creature can't be targeted by spells and permanents with CMC of 3 or less).
1/1
"Oh, we just call them annoying **** around here"
Also if we're adding suggestions I want to change my entry
Power Overwhelming - BR
Creature - Avatar - U
Whenever a permanent is sacrificed, put a +1/+1 counter on CARDNAME.
B/R, T, Sacrifice an enchantment: Target creature gets +1/+1 and gains haste until end of turn.
2/2
EDIT:
Kambal, Consul of Legislation - WU
Legendary Creature - Human Advisor - R
Whenever an opponent casts a spell, with paid mana cost, less than converted mana cost, exile it.
2/3
"He knows every trick of the trade. Mostly because he invented them himself."Last edited by -D-; 2020-01-03 at 06:51 PM.
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2020-01-03, 07:36 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
I didn't say it wasn't relevant that he was a human, I said that wasn't the reason they run him. If Knight of the Meadowgrain was a human they wouldn't run it instead.
Hang on, your measure was comparing Fiendslayer Paladin to Meadowgrain, and said since both of them have similar cost and Fiendslayer has a better resistance, so its the resistance that makes him outstanding.
But when you compare Fiendslayer Paladin to en-Vec, en-Vec has way better resistance, so the deciding factor should be lifelink/first strike.
Which proves my point, on its own the "Hexproof from red/black instant/sorceries" is not good. Without lifelink, he's not a large threat. And without frst strike he wouldn't have survivability.
I've already said you can't just slap hexproof from [color] on anything and expect it to matter.
Of course if it needs to win combats then it needs a statline and abilities to win combats, but if it has to swing in for damage then it needs evasion instead.
His saving grace is that it's slightly more resistant than paper which gives you life.
A creature 3CMC 1/3 creature with protection from red, and "At beggining of your upkeep gain 2 life", would see more play than your Fiendslayer of Meadowgrain.
Also Fiendslayer of Meadowgrain is much better in the mainboard, for instance as a one of to grab with Recruiter of the Guard.
Nyx-Fleece Ram was a fine card, but not much more than that.
In essence constructed is a random evolving format. You can't know what's going to be good. Do you know if Wizards will headdesk and print another Oko-on-A-Smug-o-Copter-Veil?
The fact that there is randomness doesn't mean you can't still know things.
So Lavamancer is in approx 68% if burn decks. Is ~70% is considered few
My point was that it's played as a few of, and not even in all burn decks.
Or play Faithless looting,
2. You don't play that in burn.
Anti-Mage 1WW
Creature - Human Knight - R
Hexproof from instant and sorceries.
Whenever an opponent casts an instant or sorcery, you gain 2 life.
2/2
"I smell magic in the air"
It reminds me of this card I made in the make your own card challenge some time ago:
Silverforged Sentinel - 2W
Artifact Creature - Golem - U
First strike, protection from instants
3/1
I think I prefer hexproof though, as you can both play pumps on it yourself, and the opponent can damage it with instant speed aoe, which ends up making it more interactive.
Hyper Pest UU
Creature - Insect - U
Flying.
Hexproof from 3 or less (This creature can't be targeted by spells and permanents with CMC of 3 or less).
1/1
"Oh, we just call them annoying **** around here"
The design is neat, the card itself is way underpowered.
Also if we're adding suggestions I want to change my entry
Power Overwhelming - BR
Creature - Avatar - U
Whenever a permanent is sacrificed, put a +1/+1 counter on CARDNAME.
B/R, T, Sacrifice an enchantment: Target creature gets +1/+1 and gains haste until end of turn.
2/2
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2020-01-03, 10:26 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
Yeah, but it might explain why Kor firewalker doesn't see play.
An apter comparison might be En Vec. Protection -> Hexproof from, but gets Lifelink.
You put it at two? I guess, it might work, maybe not being human is enough to lower the price.
But ok.
Paladin Cul-de-Sac WW
Creature - Human Knight
Protection from red and black. At beginning of each end step you gain 2 life.
2/2
"By flame of Uldum, none shall pass!"
The sheer number of cards interacting, and all the ways they can interact means predicting interaction is probably pointless.
Like all ecosystems, it's a chaotic system.
So? Not sure what your point is. Grim Lavamancer is in most burn decks at 1 or 2, (2 seems more common with first being mainboard, second being sideboard).
1. It was banned relatively recently.
2. Maybe, but burn never had problem dumping a large part of hand into the graveyard. From my experience, never did it lack food for firing. Plus since burn plays Sunbaked Canyon, they have way to stack the graveyard.
Yeah, but also Bontu.
Good thing black doesn't have any annoying enchantments it might want to remove.
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2020-01-04, 04:39 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
Literally the from the same paragraph as what you originally quoted:
Being human might be a reason for playing him in modern humans though, (him or Auriok Champion), since Kor Firewalker isn't a human.An apter comparison might be En Vec. Protection -> Hexproof from, but gets Lifelink.
You put it at two? I guess, it might work, maybe not being human is enough to lower the price.
Paladin Cul-de-Sac WW
Creature - Human Knight
Protection from red and black. At beginning of each end step you gain 2 life.
2/2
"By flame of Uldum, none shall pass!"
Was this meant to only trigger during your own end step, because that would make it a lot more fair, but I still think it would be too strong to see print.
You can always make a more powerful card, but that doesn't mean that card could ever get printed.
The point with first strike and hexproof from and some lifegain ability is that you can make a creature that is really good against burn, while not being too powerful overall. If you use protection then in order to make a card that is as good against burn then it ends up being too powerful in general compared to similar cards.
The sheer number of cards interacting, and all the ways they can interact means predicting interaction is probably pointless.
So? Not sure what your point is. Grim Lavamancer is in most burn decks at 1 or 2, (2 seems more common with first being mainboard, second being sideboard).
2. Maybe, but burn never had problem dumping a large part of hand into the graveyard. From my experience, never did it lack food for firing. Plus since burn plays Sunbaked Canyon, they have way to stack the graveyard.
Cemetery Keeper - 1G
Creature - Dryad - R
Hexproof from Black
Creature cards can't leave Graveyards.
2/2Last edited by Ninjaman; 2020-01-04 at 04:40 AM.
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2020-01-04, 07:49 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
Yeah, since last was too UP, I swinged for how powerful I could make it.
That part you're unsure is why it is IMO random. A new interaction, or change of interaction change it completely.
Well, it's going to see play as much as Fiendslayer paladin in a match. Decks run 1-2 Fiendslayer in side IIRC.
Seems oddly specific. Also is the wording correct? This would prevent exiling creature cards from graveyard.
Reminds me of a card, I have.
Keeper of Corpses -3B
Creature - Naga Cleric - U
Spells and abilities your opponent control can't target cards in your graveyard.
4/2Last edited by -D-; 2020-01-04 at 07:53 AM.
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2020-01-04, 08:03 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
Less powerful than this for certain.
That part you're unsure is why it is IMO random. A new interaction, or change of interaction change it completely.
Well, it's going to see play as much as Fiendslayer paladin in a match. Decks run 1-2 Fiendslayer in side IIRC.
If there is a small chance that you draw a specific of your cards, and there is a small chance that I draw a specific of my cards, the chance that we both draw them together is much smaller.
Seems oddly specific. Also is the wording correct? This would prevent exiling creature cards from graveyard.
To start with it said "Cards can't be exiled from graveyards" but that was way too good for 2 mana with a body and a form of defense.
It stops:
Reanimation spells.
Recursion to hand.
Creatures that can be cast from graveyard (Gravecrawler, Escape).
Creatures that can be returned from graveyard (Amalgam, Narcomoeba, Exhume)
Creatures that can exile themselves to do something (Embalm, Scavenge)
Exiling creatures to do something (Scavenging ooze, Delving creatures)
Keeper of Corpses -3B
Creature - Naga Cleric - U
Spells and abilities your opponent control can't target cards in your graveyard.
4/2
Not sure how good this part is by itself since you can still have your graveyard exiled.
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2020-01-05, 09:29 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
Creative flavored red cards:
Passionate Artist - 1R
Creature - Human - R
At the beginning of your upkeep, exile the top card of your library. You may cast it this turn if it's an instant.
2/1
Erratic Pianist - 1R
Creature - Goblin - U
Whenever you cast a spell, if it's the second spell you cast this turn, discard a card, then draw a card.
1/1
Scrapheap Scavenger - 2R
Creature - Goblin Artificer - U
Whenever an artifact card is put into a graveyard from anywhere, create a 1/1 Servo creature token.
1/2
Affection - R
Instant - U
Gain control of target creature until end of turn. That creature can't attack or block this turn.
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2020-01-05, 05:57 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
Keeper cares about your graveyard a lot more, but I could see changing that ability to target others. You can pay for it to become a card that has +X/X counters, where X is the cards in your graveyard. It keeping your graveyard intact synergizes with its alternate form.
Yeah, I left out the clause that mass graveyard sweepers, partly because my set doesn't have those and partly because it's uncommon.
Honestly, not that exciting for a rare. It's a very selective impulse draw. I assume because artist, it's instant, right? Some kind of burst of inspiration.
Ok, I admit, Goblin having a go at the piano, is not what the poor piano deserved.
What exactly is this supposed to do? You can't attack or block, you can't activate its abilities, since no haste.
I can think of a few limited uses. Namely, sacrifice it for value. Or use the passive/triggered ability. Very hard to use in Limited.
-------
Hot Coals - 1R
Artifact - Uncommon
When CARDNAME enters the battlefield, choose a creature.
At the start of each upkeep, CARDNAME deals 2 damage to the chosen creature.
Is this correct wording? And is this affected by flicker effects? I believe it should.
Kambal, Consul of Investigation - 1WU
Legendary Creature - Human Advisor - Rare
Whenever an opponent casts a spell paying less mana, than its converted mana cost, exile it.
If a land is tapped for two or more mana, it produces {C} instead of any other type and amount.
2/3Last edited by -D-; 2020-01-05 at 07:37 PM.
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2020-01-05, 06:47 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
I don't understand what you're saying here.
Yeah, I left out the clause that mass graveyard sweepers, partly because my set doesn't have those and partly because it's uncommon.
Agent of Erebos
Crook of Condemnation
Nihil Spellbomb
Relic of Progenitus
Scavenger Grounds
Sentinel totem
Tormod's Crypt
Honestly, not that exciting for a rare. It's a very selective impulse draw. I assume because artist, it's instant, right? Some kind of burst of inspiration.
It's possible that it could be instant or sorcery, but I was a bit conservative with this kind of effect, since you could easily make a deck where it just draws you a card every second turn.
Ok, I admit, Goblin having a go at the piano, is not what the poor piano deserved.
What exactly is this supposed to do? You can't attack or block, you can't activate its abilities, since no haste.
I can think of a few limited uses. Namely, sacrifice it for value. Or use the passive/triggered ability. Very hard to use in Limited.
You can also grab static abilities, and some triggered abilities.
And of course synergies with sacrificing.
I imagine it would be in a set where it would interact with at least one of the mechanics.
It's not meant to be super useful, but there's lots of neat little things you can do.
Hot Coals - 1R
Artifact - Uncommon
When CARDNAME enters the battlefield, choose a creature.
At the start of each upkeep, CARDNAME deals 2 damage to the chosen creature.
Is this correct wording? And is this affected by flicker effects? I believe it should.
I feel like this should be an aura. It sticks around after the creature dies, but it doesn't do anything with that, and it's colored anyway.
Kambal, Consul of Investigation - 1WU
Legendary Creature - Human Advisor - Rare
Whenever an opponent casts a spell paying less mana, than its converted mana cost, exile it.
If a land is tapped for two or more mana, it produces {C} instead of any other type and amount.
2/3
I'm not sure how to word the last ability. I'm thinking maybe the wording from Nix. "Whenever an opponent casts a spell, exile it if an amount of mana less than its converted mana cost was spent to cast it."
I'm thinking maybe do it Trinisphere style "Each spell that would cost less than its converted mana cost to cast costs its converted mana cost to cast.". That way cards that have a discount aren't just uncastable.
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2020-01-06, 05:18 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
I kept writing library instead of graveyard. Guess I need sleep.
In essence Keeper of Graves transforms into a Pile of Maggots (with +1/+1 counters for each card in the graveyard). It "Hexproofing" graveyard synergizes with second form.
Sure, but set I design doesn't have anything like that at uncommon. And I think it's fine to have a way to bypass it.
Rare are often, cards that are bombs in limited (source: Quite the Rarity by MaRo). Granted they relaxed some conditions, Uncommons can be legendary permanents, but less often than rares.
The card in question doesn't strike me as rare, in any way. It's not complex, splashy, narrow, or super impactful.
Well, we had quasi Enchantment with Glass Casket. Why not a quasi aura?
The idea these are kind of "torture devices" as one-off auras that can be reused, given some sort of flicker or a card that can return them to hand.
Yeah, it's basically a stricter Lavinia. A Lavinia that cares how you're paying for it. So you can't Delve or Phyrexian your way, if you have enough lands.
I think the easiest way, is to just change to rules to have term "paid mana" and it how much mana was transferred from mana pool, to pay for the spell.
As for the Damping Sphere part, yeah, I mean. Honestly, I'd just copied the text. One thought that does occur to me, "If a land is tapped for two or more mana, it produces instead one mana of any color or one colorless mana." Or I could drop that part, but people didn't consider it flashy enough without it. Plus, it makes some sense he has a way to hose Delvers, Phyrexians, Convokers but not a way to hose Tron?
Something akin to Mob probably too good for Standard, but meta card for Pauper.
Emergent Pattern - 1UU
Instant - C
Counter target spell.
Emerge 3U.Last edited by -D-; 2020-01-06 at 06:03 AM.
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2020-01-06, 05:39 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
You probably don't want to have only one of the two effects be onesided. At the moment the 'pay costs' ability only affects opponents, but the 'tron tax' ability is universal, which would likely feel untuitive - I'd either make them both onesided, or both universal.
Maybe something like this?
Kambal 1UW
Mana costs can't be changed, and can't be paid except with mana.
Spells can't be cast without paying their mana costs.
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2020-01-06, 06:33 AM (ISO 8601)
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2020-01-06, 07:04 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
Last edited by enderlord99; 2020-01-06 at 07:06 AM.
I use braces (also known as "curly brackets") to indicate sarcasm. If there are none present, I probably believe what I am saying; should it turn out to be inaccurate trivia, please tell me rather than trying to play along with an apparent joke I don't know I'm making.
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2020-01-06, 07:04 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MTG Share your Card Designs II
I feel like kicker and additional costs come up pretty rarely. If anything, it's a worse card than having it only affect discounts, because it negates Thalia.
This is sort of a grey area in the rules - Trinisphere's wording implies that mana cost setting effects would take additional costs into account (you can cast kicked spells through a Trinisphere even if the CMC is still 1). You could probably word it better, though.
"Each spell that would cost less mana to cast than its converted mana cost costs its converted mana cost in mana to cast" is a bit of a mouthful, though.Last edited by Gauntlet; 2020-01-06 at 07:07 AM.