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2021-04-23, 02:39 PM (ISO 8601)
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Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
It seem that a lot of the form and the tv tropes page seems to run on the idea that Thor is GC.
In the comic their dose not seen to be any prove that he is chaotic, and a big piece of evidance say he cannot be chaotic. He empowers Lawful clerics. A cleric cannot be two spaces away from the diety that they worship.I should get a Signature
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2021-04-23, 02:43 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2020
Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
The clerics he empowers are all Lawful Good, which is only one step removed of CG
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2021-04-23, 02:43 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
Avatar by linklele. How Teleport Worksa. Malifice (paraphrased):
Rulings are not 'House Rules.' Rulings are a DM doing what DMs are supposed to do.
b. greenstone (paraphrased):
Agency means that they {players} control their character's actions; you control the world's reactions to the character's actions.
Second known member of the Greyview Appreciation Society
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2021-04-23, 03:03 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2018
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- Middle, Nowhere
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2021-04-23, 03:43 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2009
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- Somewhere in Utah...
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Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
In the 3.0 Deities and Demigods Thor is Chaotic Good.
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2021-04-23, 03:45 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2006
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- Mangholi Dask
Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
In the early strips, for instance #73, Thor was portrayed a lot more chaotically than his recent appearances. Since those early appearances were all we had to go on for a long time, "CG" became pretty much accepted.
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2021-04-23, 04:05 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2009
Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
I was going to try this - but deleted the post as it might have been viewed as overly political or potentially insulting (not to you but to all of us - although it wasn't intended to be).
In brief the forum could be considered a superorganism under some social theory.
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2021-04-23, 04:10 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2015
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Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
"The forum" does not speak with one voice. It is a cacophony of voices, hence the question is based on a false premise. Attempting to superimpose that status of "superorganism" on this forum is a lost cause. The 1232 thread, and the plethora of disagreements therein, as well as the V & I thread, demonstrate but two examples of a lack of consensus as the normal state of being.
Which is fine.Avatar by linklele. How Teleport Worksa. Malifice (paraphrased):
Rulings are not 'House Rules.' Rulings are a DM doing what DMs are supposed to do.
b. greenstone (paraphrased):
Agency means that they {players} control their character's actions; you control the world's reactions to the character's actions.
Second known member of the Greyview Appreciation Society
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2021-04-23, 04:13 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2021
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- In my room
Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
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2021-04-23, 04:25 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2006
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- Meridianville AL
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Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
That would be like how Sune who is CG can't have LG clerics and paladins, except that she totally does.
That would be like how Mystra who is NG can't have LE clerics, except that she totally does. (3 steps away)
That would be like how Saint Cuthbert who is LN allows LE clerics, except that he totally does not, and that one is in core.
There are allowed to be exceptions, there is an exception in core, there are many exceptions in specific settings.
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2021-04-23, 05:05 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2015
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Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
And we're well past the point where anyone should expect strict fidelity to the rules if that would get in the way of the story.
(If you really need an in-universe explanation, perhaps the bet expanded Thor's possible range of clerics since he's been basically charged with keeping the dwarves from going to Hel.)
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2021-04-23, 05:08 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2010
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Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
I would call Saint Cuthbert a restriction instead of a exception, but exception are the alternate to the rule. wouldn't the razor say that no exception(or homebrew or house rule) would be closer to text than assuming one.
One could argue that Thor was acting chaotic in his first few appearances, but that would only prove he was not Lawful.
Thor dose not seem to champion Chaos or Law. He is Good in big giant letters.I should get a Signature
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2021-04-23, 05:46 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2014
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Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
Possibly because Thor doesn't favor Chaotic over Lawful or Neutral. He may be Chaotic Good without especially championing it as a favored alignment; in so many words, he doesn't care what else you are, as long as you're Good. (In the same way that Loki, in his recent appearances, hasn't seemed especially Evil, even though by SRD he is Chaotic Evil. Loki seems more concerned with Chaos than Evil to me.)
Thor's recent, less-Chaotic seeming behavior can be chalked up to A) Characterization Marches On, and B) the fate of the world is at stake, so he's been forced to stop getting hammered on giant steins of beer and take things seriously for a change. Once the world is saved, he'll be the first to reach for a big, big drink.
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2021-04-23, 06:07 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2020
Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
Thor's upholding of the divine law seems to be something all gods share.
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2021-04-24, 09:28 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2014
Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
Have we seen clerics of Thor who weren't dwarves? Dwarves seem to lean towards the Lawful side in OotS, possibly due to the Bet. It's quite possible Thor makes an exception for dwarves as he is their patron deity.
Or maybe Thor is just Neutral Good with leanings toward the Chaotic side.Last edited by Quebbster; 2021-04-24 at 09:28 AM.
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2021-04-24, 11:19 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2006
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- Poland
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Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
Thor was introduced as Durkon's deity at the very start of the comic, when neither he nor Durkon had a lot of characterization. Once they did, their relationship couldn't exactly be retconned. Besides, even if Thor is CG, he and Durkon seem to get on fine.
My FFRP characters. Avatar by Ashen Lilies. Sigatars by Ashen Lilies, Gullara and Purple Eagle.
Interested in the Nexus FFRP setting? See our Discord server.
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2021-04-24, 12:38 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2015
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Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
Avatar by linklele. How Teleport Worksa. Malifice (paraphrased):
Rulings are not 'House Rules.' Rulings are a DM doing what DMs are supposed to do.
b. greenstone (paraphrased):
Agency means that they {players} control their character's actions; you control the world's reactions to the character's actions.
Second known member of the Greyview Appreciation Society
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2021-04-24, 01:30 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2010
Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
Alternatively, Thor respects that rule as much as the specifications of Control Weather.
https://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0353.html
Why? Because he is Thor. That's why.Last edited by faustin; 2021-04-24 at 01:31 PM.
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2021-04-24, 02:42 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2019
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Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
Because he was pretty chaotic for most of his appearances.
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2021-04-24, 03:46 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2013
Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
I don't like the implications of clerics going 3 steps away from their god, especially if that means going from one end of an axis all the way to the other, but I'll concede such a thing is possible. What I don't understand is what seems to be a consensus that not only can Thor be Chaotic Good, but that he definitely is, or possibly even must be so. Yes, he's dismissive of some of the rules and restrictions surrounding Gods' relationships with mortals and the Snarl and all of that, but Roy, someone who is Lawful, has also been, shall we say, less than satisfied with abstruse rules and red tape from time to time. And we've seen just how actively harmful some of these rules can be when abused, so that never felt conclusive to me, and yet I've felt like "Thor=CG" was about as close to a consensus as this forum is capable of having.
And at least half of us would be too busy explaining why this Snarl can't be as deadly as the original to avoid getting ripped apart by it.
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2021-04-25, 12:18 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
Wasn't there a forum post where Rich said that Thor was NG?
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2021-04-25, 06:30 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2007
Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
Not that I know of. The closest to that is The Giant saying that OOTS Thor is not required to match D&D Thor or Nordic Legends Thor.
https://web.archive.org/web/20070220...ead.php?t=7283
Originally Posted by The GiantMarut-2 Avatar by Serpentine
New Marut Avatar by Linkele
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2021-04-25, 06:49 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2009
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Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
Last edited by Peelee; 2021-04-25 at 06:50 AM.
Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.
Number of times Roland St. Jude has sworn revenge upon me: 1
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2021-04-25, 07:03 AM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2009
Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
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2021-04-25, 07:09 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
To our knowledge, that contri ution consisted of a single act: telling the Dwarves about the bet, which Hel did not expect at all and could be argued to be Chaotic.
Aside from that, Thor seems to gleefully bend the rules at the slightest provocation (rules that all gods, regardless of alignment, agree to follow), which is further evidence that he is likely Chaotic (or, at least, non-Lawful).
There is weak evidence for Chaotic. So far as I can tell, there is no evidence for Lawful.Last edited by Peelee; 2021-04-25 at 07:10 AM.
Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.
Number of times Roland St. Jude has sworn revenge upon me: 1
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2021-04-25, 07:15 AM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2009
Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
You can read panel 5 that way but I don't - to me it seems more active then merely what was mentioned in panel 4 (same strip).
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2021-04-25, 01:02 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2021
Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
Assuming he was active in the shaping of that culture, by that point being honorable was the only way for dwarves to save their souls. Even a CG person would see reason to take the Lawful route, if it's the only Good one available.
However he would have had to understand honor pretty well himself in order to guide them on it, which could be weak evidence for Lawfulness, even though some Chaotic people are good at understanding Lawful thinking.
There's also a little more evidence in that he accepted "honor" as the terms of the bet in the first place.
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2021-04-25, 01:46 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2015
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- State of Uncertainty
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Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
I will once again point out that Minrah, the cleric of Thor we've spent the second-most amount of time with, seems far more Chaotic than Lawful in her outlook. People seem to think that the fact that she's a dwarf must mean she's lawful, but she seems to me to be very clearly a person who values her own individuality and personal decisions than the dictates of society.
Some people think that Chaotic Neutral is the alignment of the insane, but the enlightened know that Chaotic Neutral is the only alignment without illusions of sanity.
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2021-04-25, 02:08 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2020
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Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
We are the Forum. Lower your fire walls and surrender your accounts. We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own. Your culture will adapt to service us. Resistance is futile.
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2021-04-25, 02:34 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Why dose the forum seem to think Thor is CG?
None; but I am not saying he is Lawful, not being Lawful dose not make you Chaotic.
Minrah cannot be Chaotic by the laws of leadership and cohort. She could be Neutral good. From the SRD
Cohort Level
The character can attract a cohort of up to this level. Regardless of a character’s Leadership score, he can only recruit a cohort who is two or more levels lower than himself. The cohort should be equipped with gear appropriate for its level. A character can try to attract a cohort of a particular race, class, and alignment. The cohort’s alignment may not be opposed to the leader’s alignment on either the law-vs-chaos or good-vs-evil axis, and the leader takes a Leadership penalty if he recruits a cohort of an alignment different from his own.I should get a Signature