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2016-02-24, 06:13 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Index of the Giant's Comments V - On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Index
Last edited by Mad Humanist; 2016-02-27 at 03:31 AM.
Ever wondered how many games are mentioned in the comic? I have listed them all in a geeklist: https://boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/2...es-order-stick
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2016-02-25, 04:57 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Index of the Giant's Comments V - On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Ind
You agree with some of the proposed removals but think that most are perfectly acceptable.
Hmmm, there have been 5 proposed removals, so you agree with two but thinks that 3 have to stay? Could you be more specific?
This is not why I proposed those removals.
For four of the five, anyone can find the answer in the comics.
- The diamond dust one in 844?, well, maybe 845 wasn't up when the quote was included. Now, really, Durkon and Roy talks about it right after.
- There was a lot of discussion about if Haley had means to dye her shoes on the mechane while getting new armor. When the quote was included, word of the Giant was the only way to know she did dyed them. Now, it's unecessary.
- Elan's rapier thing, well, I think it was unecessary from the beginning. And it's outdated now. Word of the Giant is useless here.
- Protection from law: I think it's just a joke, really. You don't walk through a cop while caught red-handed because you casted protection from law. That's not what the spell does. At all. A good joke, but just a joke. A good one, ok, but would you include this?
- Haley not being Orrin's daughter? The suspicion was made because of the joke about Haley being part dragon and because of the baby's hair, but we've seen Haley's mom, Haley is not fifteen, we knew afterwards that Familicide killed the Draketooth and since Penelope died, so did her daughter (it's actually because the daughter died that Penelope died), we know that Haley's dad is not Orrin either, and so on.
Fortunately or unfortunately, those quotes are the only one for which I feel we can remove them. Out of slightly less than 200 quotes I've looked at (still have the "Writing" part that I want to read).
The other quotes give us the Giant's viewpoint, sometimes some rules explanation. It answers questions for which only the writer can answer and for which there is no certainty within the comics. Without these quotes, anyone answering would just be sharing his opinion of what the Giant had in mind here, or why he did that.
At any rate, I don't think there is much to declutter, courtesy to curators.Posting from France
Sorry for my accent.
Thanks to neoseph7 for my avatar (Allen Walker from D.Gray-Man)
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2016-02-25, 06:59 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Index of the Giant's Comments V - On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Ind
I don't have any idea how this idea might go over with the Giant/moderators, since it would almost certainly lead to more similar requests down the line, but it just occurred to me as I finished reading the previous post.
There seems to be a growing concern that the index as currently constituted has already become somewhat unwieldy and that the issue will only worsen as the index continues to grow, increasing the calls to remove some quotes.
The ability to sticky the current version, which of course would need staff approval, would allow us to start an "Index 2" for more recent quotes that ought to be recorded while allowing the current list to stop increasing in size.
I suspect the idea might not be popular with the staff, though, since there would likely soon be clamoring for more stickied threads crowding the top of the forum which is probably something they'd prefer not to encourage.
(I don't have any empirical evidence for this, aside from the lack of any stickied topics not begun by the Giant, himself, and just my own guess based on the way other issues are managed.)
Still, given that the Giant has expressed some direct support for at least some of the goals/content of this thread, it might not hurt to ask about it?
100% of the requests you never make will fail to be approved, after all....
I don't know. It was just something that occurred to me just now.Last edited by pearl jam; 2016-02-25 at 07:01 AM.
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2016-02-25, 08:45 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Index of the Giant's Comments V - On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Ind
I think that would create a total mess. Ideally we would want as few indexes as possible. The argument for splitting one is to make the two more manageable than they would be separately. I think there is an argument for having a thread that answers common questions whether the answer is a post from the Giant, a tweet or a comic strip. However that may be too much work. We could also easily fill the front page with sticky threads.
Ever wondered how many games are mentioned in the comic? I have listed them all in a geeklist: https://boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/2...es-order-stick
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2016-02-25, 12:11 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Index of the Giant's Comments V - On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Ind
FeytouchedBanana eldritch disciple avatar by...me!
The Index of the Giant's Comments VI―Making Dogma from Zapped Bananas
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2016-02-25, 12:25 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Index of the Giant's Comments V - On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Ind
Last edited by Mad Humanist; 2016-02-25 at 03:18 PM.
Ever wondered how many games are mentioned in the comic? I have listed them all in a geeklist: https://boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/2...es-order-stick
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2016-02-25, 04:28 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Index of the Giant's Comments V - On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Ind
TBH I'd probably do something like this as well, but after starting the Brick Awards I've realized how much of a pain moderating a thread is.
Thanks Jasdoif!!
Also, an extremely cumbersome, not at all practical, but effective solution to our problem would be to have the full text of every quote from Rich in the Index.
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2016-02-25, 06:05 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Index of the Giant's Comments V - On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Ind
And I thank you for the break from the Stick Awards. It's most welcome.
Yeah, yeah. You'd think "once a week" isn't that big of a deal. And it isn't. At all. But week after week after week without being able to blow it off once or twice if one isn't feeling it? Yeah. Thanks for the break. :-pConcluded: The Stick Awards II: Second Edition
Ongoing: OOTS by Page Count
Coming Soon: OOTS by Final Post Count II: The Post Counts Always Chart Twice
Coming Later: The Stick Awards III: The Search for More Votes
__________________________
No matter how subtle the wizard, a knife between the shoulder blades will seriously cramp his style - Jhereg Proverb
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2016-02-25, 06:17 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Index of the Giant's Comments V - On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Ind
Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.
Number of times Roland St. Jude has sworn revenge upon me: 2
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2016-02-25, 06:55 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Index of the Giant's Comments V - On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Ind
Tends to be a widespread view, it'd be nice to have but no one wants to put the effort into it. Not an uncommon concept. Still, it does leave you (and everyone else who would want it) without the thread....
Look at it this way: martianmister didn't start the original Number of Character Appearances thread, Porthos didn't start the original Stick Awards thread, and I didn't start the original Index of the Giant's Comments thread. Even if it does turn into something you can't keep up with, as happened to ThePhantasm, that doesn't necessarily mean it's going to stop. The simple fact this project interests you enough to post here, nearly two years after I took over, should attest to that.
The initial setup is usually where the heavy lifting applies, it gets relatively easy after that. For instance, I only had to spend a night transcribing ThePhantasm's freeform text version of the Index into an XML structure of my design once, and only had to spend a morning write the XSLT that groups/sorts/bbcodes the tables and spoilers once; the ongoing part is mostly copy/paste/edit that only takes a couple minutes, tracking support or votes which can have a very slow pace (minimal effort over time), and devising titles and descriptions which is most of the fun.
And that's overkill if you're just tracking questions and comics, without needing to worry about specific dates (comics are chronologically ordered) or distinguishing posts from external URLs and stuff.
Keeping the scope in mind helps there. A thread dedicated to answering common questions by referencing comics, for example, really only needs to be updated when new common questions or new comics come along...and it's likely new questions come along when new comics along. The lack of a set time frame makes it more leisurely.FeytouchedBanana eldritch disciple avatar by...me!
The Index of the Giant's Comments VI―Making Dogma from Zapped Bananas
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2016-02-25, 07:09 PM (ISO 8601)
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2016-02-25, 10:11 PM (ISO 8601)
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2016-02-26, 12:51 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Index of the Giant's Comments V - On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Ind
Why should a man be scorned if, finding himself in prison, he tries to get out and go home? Or if, when he cannot do so, he thinks and talks about other topics than jailers and prison-walls?
Pokemon:
Spoiler
Friend Code: 4484-7979-9172
DS name: Ben
In-game name: Lief
Friend safari: Charmeleon, Pansear, Ninetails
Brew:
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2016-02-26, 12:59 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Index of the Giant's Comments V - On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Ind
Ya know, it might be worthwhile to discuss the merits of changing to an instant-runoff voting method for thread titles.
...is something i would say if i didnt have admiration and respect for the already hard work of the curator of our fruitful little corner of the boards, and wanted to burden him with a far heavier workload.Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.
Number of times Roland St. Jude has sworn revenge upon me: 2
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2016-02-26, 01:22 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Index of the Giant's Comments V - On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Ind
The quote in the index that I think you are referring to (this one) also has the Giant state that he put in a line about Orrin's daughter's age specifically to eliminate the possibility that it was Haley. The Giant's motivation for specifying the age isn't in the comic, only the age itself. That quote is not redundant with the comic.
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2016-02-26, 01:36 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Index of the Giant's Comments V - On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Ind
You can discuss it if you like. It wouldn't have mattered here though; "On a Saner Forum" had over half the votes, which is sufficient for IRV to declare a winner.
The more general issue, though, is that IRV (and preferential voting systems in general) need to have the set of choices defined before the vote can fairly start; I'd need to set aside extra pages to split it into multiple phases, and then do more formal voting....I don't think it'd be more convenient for anyone.FeytouchedBanana eldritch disciple avatar by...me!
The Index of the Giant's Comments VI―Making Dogma from Zapped Bananas
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2016-02-26, 01:37 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Index of the Giant's Comments V - On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Ind
Can I provide a needlessly complicated solution to this problem? Do bananas grow on trees?
Obviously we should all submit rankings of proposed titles. Then we could simply choose the Condorcet winner, or, in its absence, allow the thread curator to select among the Condorcet non-losers. A trivial script in any number of languages could handle... I'll stop.
Although, the index title does exceed the post title limit (which is four characters less than thethreadfirst eight posts??? title limit because life is like that...). I propose that the index be retitled to bring the main title in line with the title of the posts .
I ... what problem does that solve?
Durkon Throws Diamond Dust
Haley's Boots of Speed
Orrin Draketooth's Daughter
Agreed. Dump these.
Elan's Rapiers
Eh. I lean against cutting it on the grounds that it's not directly addressed by the comic, but it's also not particularly interesting. No vote.
Protection from Law is Illegal
Meh. I favor keeping it, but could be argued around.
Agreed re: all proposed non-removal changes, super-duper-agreed re: mentioning the comic establishing that V's children are adopted.Last edited by unbeliever536; 2016-02-26 at 01:39 AM.
Why should a man be scorned if, finding himself in prison, he tries to get out and go home? Or if, when he cannot do so, he thinks and talks about other topics than jailers and prison-walls?
Pokemon:
Spoiler
Friend Code: 4484-7979-9172
DS name: Ben
In-game name: Lief
Friend safari: Charmeleon, Pansear, Ninetails
Brew:
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2016-02-26, 07:49 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Index of the Giant's Comments V - On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Ind
Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.
Number of times Roland St. Jude has sworn revenge upon me: 2
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2016-02-26, 08:05 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Index of the Giant's Comments V - On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Ind
.
-.____________________
./___________________()-------Ron Miel
|...___________________--------sits down
|..| |_________________()-------and starts
|..|/__________________--------singing
| ___________________()-------about gold
.
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2016-02-26, 04:04 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Index of the Giant's Comments V - On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Ind
Well if we're going to have a conversation on how we determine thread titles, having it before we have to determine thread titles would be prudent. This applies regardless of embiggenment of any related punchline.
And isn't making white text obvious like explaining a joke?Since we're able to post despite truncation, I don't think this is severe enough to constitute a problem; certainly not enough of a one to alter a chosen-by-vote title and draw attention to anyone who doesn't go back and edit the titles in their own already-existing posts.
Clearly I'll need to be more mindful of brevity with regards to future thread titles, though.Last edited by Jasdoif; 2016-02-26 at 04:05 PM.
FeytouchedBanana eldritch disciple avatar by...me!
The Index of the Giant's Comments VI―Making Dogma from Zapped Bananas
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2016-02-26, 04:23 PM (ISO 8601)
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Index of the Giant's Comments V - On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Index
Last edited by Mad Humanist; 2016-02-26 at 04:24 PM.
Ever wondered how many games are mentioned in the comic? I have listed them all in a geeklist: https://boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/2...es-order-stick
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2016-02-26, 04:55 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Index of the Giant's Comments V - On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Ind
Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.
Number of times Roland St. Jude has sworn revenge upon me: 2
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2016-02-26, 05:08 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Index of the Giant's Comments V - On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Ind
Idle question, Jasdoif:
I just noticed you've been keeping minor version numbers for the index in the OP. Are those "updates since last thread, or something else?Why should a man be scorned if, finding himself in prison, he tries to get out and go home? Or if, when he cannot do so, he thinks and talks about other topics than jailers and prison-walls?
Pokemon:
Spoiler
Friend Code: 4484-7979-9172
DS name: Ben
In-game name: Lief
Friend safari: Charmeleon, Pansear, Ninetails
Brew:
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2016-02-26, 11:54 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Index of the Giant's Comments V - On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Index
Going forward, sure; but extant posts would need to be edited by their authors. It isn't the ease of doing it that poses a problem for me anyway, fixing a minor truncation isn't valid justification for fixing a vote
Update cycles completed in the current thread (which I suppose aligns with "updates since last thread"). The "Latest Additions" table in the first post is keyed off the version number, so including that version number in the post seems sensible.FeytouchedBanana eldritch disciple avatar by...me!
The Index of the Giant's Comments VI―Making Dogma from Zapped Bananas
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2016-02-27, 04:04 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Index of the Giant's Comments V - On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Index
Why should a man be scorned if, finding himself in prison, he tries to get out and go home? Or if, when he cannot do so, he thinks and talks about other topics than jailers and prison-walls?
Pokemon:
Spoiler
Friend Code: 4484-7979-9172
DS name: Ben
In-game name: Lief
Friend safari: Charmeleon, Pansear, Ninetails
Brew:
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2016-02-27, 10:33 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Index of the Giant's Comments V - On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Ind
I'm in support of most of the removals but abstain with respect to Protection from Law being illegal. For all that it was a tongue in cheek comment, "Wait, why not just buy Protection from Law?" is the sort of fridge logic I could see coming up on the forums in the future, and linking the comment would be useful. It is one easily found via a comment search on the boards, though, so I abstain.
I am: Neutral Good: -2 chaos, -21 evil and 15 balance!
Can't find the strip you're looking for? Head on over to OOTS Strip Summaries!
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2016-02-27, 03:08 PM (ISO 8601)
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2016-02-27, 04:09 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Index of the Giant's Comments V-On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Index
FeytouchedBanana eldritch disciple avatar by...me!
The Index of the Giant's Comments VI―Making Dogma from Zapped Bananas
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2016-02-27, 06:40 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Index of the Giant's Comments V-On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Index
Now it looks a little sloppy, like V-On is a word (a censored form of the word Vogon? I can live with censoring the Vogons and their poetry, so this isn't necessarily bad) in the title rather than a number and the beginning of a subtitle.
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2016-02-27, 07:32 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Index of the Giant's Comments V-On a Saner Forum, We Wouldn't Need this Index
FeytouchedBanana eldritch disciple avatar by...me!
The Index of the Giant's Comments VI―Making Dogma from Zapped Bananas