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  1. - Top - End - #1051
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    Quote Originally Posted by Leecros View Post
    Except...Not...The concept of an absolute ruler was not something that was prevalent in the Middle-Ages. It didn't start manifesting until the later periods of the time frame that Crusader Kings II covers. A King's vassals and (to a much greater extent) their council definitely had influence on what a King decided to do. Vassals had land and money and armies and it was an important task for a Feudal Lord to keep them content or they would express their displeasure in various ways. A King couldn't just do whatever he wanted with no backlash.

    It was a union of necessity as the administration efficiency of the Roman Empire was gone outside of the ERE requiring rulers to give out land, because they could not possibly manage it all. In fact, part of the reason why France had such an issue during the Hundred Years War is because they were still very feudal at the time and their vassals were much more autonomous than their foes. That is also why for the longest time in Europa Universalis that France's land was full of vassal nations instead of the large, unified nations that other countries get. They were late to the party. There is a fairly large difference between a Feudal Monarchy and an Absolute Monarchy.
    Yep, absolute rulers are a much later invention. For most of the Middle Ages, kings and other feudal lieges had real trouble with controlling their vassals. My own nation for example, the Kingdom of Hungary, had tons of problems with unruly vassals who sought to restrict the power of the king. If the king was a charismatic badass, they were content. But if the king was weak, our vassals practically ruled their fiefdoms like their own little kingdoms. This has gotten so bad by the beginning of the 16th Century (classic feudalism continued here for much longer than in Western Europe), that the majority of the vassals flat-out refused to take up arms against the Ottoman invasion. Which had disastrous consequences for everyone...

  2. - Top - End - #1052
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    Aye, the system actually does a really good job at showing how dependent rulers could be on their vassals, historically. Feudalism wasn't a system of strong King weak vassals, it was more often weak king strong vassals. Strong King weak vassals was the transition into the pre-modern age.
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  3. - Top - End - #1053
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    The thing though is that even though you were dependant on your vassals, the method here seems unhistorical and very heavy handed. The act of "voting" seems... odd. A council is a council, aka advisers. Not a Riksdag.
    I did buy the expansion, btw. I will proceed to turn the Gälta family founder in 1066 into Erik Stake, my second attempt at a custom ruler ever.
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    Quote Originally Posted by Avilan the Grey View Post
    The thing though is that even though you were dependant on your vassals, the method here seems unhistorical and very heavy handed. The act of "voting" seems... odd. A council is a council, aka advisers. Not a Riksdag.
    As mentioned, you can still do things against your council's wishes. It's just that in doing so will cause them to become discontent for a little while. I think you may be focusing a bit too much on the term 'voting' which is...admittedly a mistake by the development team, because today when you think of voting; you think that "Okay, if there's enough votes yes, then this goes forward. If there's enough votes no, then it doesn't go forward."

    that's simply not the case in Crusader Kings II.In Crusader Kings II, If the majority of the council disapproves of an action, then you can still go forward with it regardless of their opinion on the matter...They will just get annoyed at you. Unless maybe the council authority becomes full? I don't know about that far. I'm not personally sure what you can/can't do if Council Authority reaches full. It's never happened to me.

    Quote Originally Posted by Avilan the Grey View Post
    I did buy the expansion, btw. I will proceed to turn the Gälta family founder in 1066 into Erik Stake, my second attempt at a custom ruler ever.
    Good Luck!
    Last edited by Leecros; 2016-04-26 at 01:59 PM.
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    teleporting Hyper Nixon solves problems with Patriotism.

  5. - Top - End - #1055
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    Quote Originally Posted by Leecros View Post
    Good Luck!
    Thank you!
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    Quote Originally Posted by Leecros View Post
    As mentioned, you can still do things against your council's wishes. It's just that in doing so will cause them to become discontent for a little while. I think you may be focusing a bit too much on the term 'voting' which is...admittedly a mistake by the development team, because today when you think of voting; you think that "Okay, if there's enough votes yes, then this goes forward. If there's enough votes no, then it doesn't go forward."

    that's simply not the case in Crusader Kings II.In Crusader Kings II, If the majority of the council disapproves of an action, then you can still go forward with it regardless of their opinion on the matter...They will just get annoyed at you. Unless maybe the council authority becomes full? I don't know about that far. I'm not personally sure what you can/can't do if Council Authority reaches full. It's never happened to me.
    Yeah, it's sort of like negative stability in EU; people have a huge and somewhat unreasonable aversion to it, but tyranny is just a number!

    (It's a shame this wasn't introduced a couple expansions back, or the response would be "no, tyranny is a Way of Life")

    Also, having just tried it, you can indeed defy the council vote even with Full Council Authority.
    Last edited by Guancyto; 2016-04-26 at 03:10 PM.
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    Okay...

    Plan is:

    Start Date: Stanford Bridge
    Region: Dal (the independent Swedish county bordering Norway)
    Custom ruler and family: The Stake family.
    Family coat of arms: Sable (black) with Silver (white) Pale. No symbol.
    Starting character (roughly) Erik Stake. Dwarf, Lustful, Wounded, Something something, Genius. Unmarried.

    Edit:
    Spoiler: Count Erik Stake of Dal
    Show








    Last edited by Avilan the Grey; 2016-04-27 at 12:19 AM.
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    I think I just found a way to make merchant republics even more powerful. Apologies if this is known, but if it is...so many questions.

    I started out as Sigurd Ring of Svipjod in the Charlemagne start and did the normal Norse blobbing thing until I was Emperor of Scandinavia. To pass the decade before the Viking Age actually fires in 793, I set about installing my dynasts into every title in the Empire, count or above. I manage all but one, then the Viking age happens so I reform into a merchant republic...and there's only two families, mine and the one count I hadn't killed and replaced.

    So I reload, kill that guy off, and fire the reformation again. I'm now the only merchant family. Quick testing has shown that I remain the only merchant family through the death of the Doge/Patrician, the heir, random dynasts, random non-dynasts,and everyone in the court.

    Since I can only assume people have seen this before: do we know what breaks if I keep going as the only family in the Principality of Scandinavia, or what breaks if there's fewer than five families?

    EDIT: It looks like you do get more merchant families as vassals feudalize.
    Last edited by Trekkin; 2016-04-27 at 04:27 AM.

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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    Quote Originally Posted by Trekkin View Post
    I think I just found a way to make merchant republics even more powerful. Apologies if this is known, but if it is...so many questions.

    I started out as Sigurd Ring of Svipjod in the Charlemagne start and did the normal Norse blobbing thing until I was Emperor of Scandinavia. To pass the decade before the Viking Age actually fires in 793, I set about installing my dynasts into every title in the Empire, count or above. I manage all but one, then the Viking age happens so I reform into a merchant republic...and there's only two families, mine and the one count I hadn't killed and replaced.

    So I reload, kill that guy off, and fire the reformation again. I'm now the only merchant family. Quick testing has shown that I remain the only merchant family through the death of the Doge/Patrician, the heir, random dynasts, random non-dynasts,and everyone in the court.

    Since I can only assume people have seen this before: do we know what breaks if I keep going as the only family in the Principality of Scandinavia, or what breaks if there's fewer than five families?

    EDIT: It looks like you do get more merchant families as vassals feudalize.
    well in my merchant republic game members of my family somehow broke away and became a new family (different crest, same name), so maybe that's a thing.

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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    Are there certain areas that are more enjoyable to play than others? If one were to acquire the game, (as planned), at some point, are there locations that involve more fun? I know some of starting areas, like Ireland, and a couple others for beginners based on reading Let's Play, but are there characters to work with only after you have several games under one's belt?

    Does the best starting areas/characters change with the DLCs? Other than Ruler Designer, are there certain DLCs worth getting before actually having ever played the vanilla game?
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    I probably can't name specific regions that would be enjoyable, but I definitely can say that the 1066 start overall is probably the most fun...unless you want to go for a pagan start. There's a lot going on in the world at the time from the Christian/Muslim wars in Spain, to William the Conqueror, to the Crusades and much much more.

    The one place that can get a little stale in all of the start dates is interestingly enough India(Despite having a whole Expansion dedicated to it). India has a tendency to be stagnant with...not a whole lot to really shake things up in any time period. Rarely do I see exciting things happen in India.
    Last edited by Leecros; 2016-04-27 at 11:05 PM.
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  12. - Top - End - #1062
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    Basically for me it's simple. The further you get away from High Medieval and Europe, the less entertaining it is. Both in time and in regional play so to speak. The reason for this is simple: The game's core mechanics are hard-coded to handle high medieval "game of thrones" play and can't really simulate the rest very well. It still ties you (on a coding level) to things like "duchies" when you play as a nomad tribe, for example.
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    Quote Originally Posted by russdm View Post
    Are there certain areas that are more enjoyable to play than others? If one were to acquire the game, (as planned), at some point, are there locations that involve more fun? I know some of starting areas, like Ireland, and a couple others for beginners based on reading Let's Play, but are there characters to work with only after you have several games under one's belt?
    The Russians are very fun in 1066. Let's set the scene:

    An old Grand Duke has split his lands among his children before he has died and made them independent; you can play as any one of them, or the old man himself. Unfortunately, there is some serious border gore. Aside from fixing the gore, all the children want to form Rus or Ruthenia, which requires them to beat each other up. However, they need each other's help in order to defend themselves from all sorts of pagans - ravenous Tengri Cumans to the east, Pechenegs to the south, Suomenusko tribes to the north, and Romuva to the west. Oh, and the Volga Bulgars nearby are Muslims and not happy.

    You better work quick on reuniting your family lands and Christianizing the pagans, because a threat is brewing to the East. In two hundred years, Mongols will tear up the steppes with the hooves of a million horses, and after they are finished with the Muslims and the Cumans, they will move on to you. In real life, the Mongol Yoke kept Russia under the invaders' thumbs for two centuries. Will you be able to do better?

    Your dynasty - the Ruriks - occupy the third place on the historic high score table, behind only the Capets and Habsburgs. This esteemed family is now in your hands. Don't screw up.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Artanis View Post
    I'm going to be honest, "the Welsh became a Great Power and conquered Germany" is almost exactly the opposite of the explanation I was expecting

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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    Quote Originally Posted by Avilan the Grey View Post
    It still ties you (on a coding level) to things like "duchies" when you play as a nomad tribe, for example.
    Only on a coding level, because Nomads don't really care too much about titles outside of Khan and Khagan.

    With Horse Lords, Nomads are in my opinion really really fun to play. It's far more enjoyable at least than playing as Tribal. I would probably even choose playing a Nomad over playing a Muslim Iqta.

    Quote Originally Posted by russdm View Post
    Does the best starting areas/characters change with the DLCs? Other than Ruler Designer, are there certain DLCs worth getting before actually having ever played the vanilla game?
    I missed this part last time. So i guess i'll reply to this now. A lot of what DLC's to get starting out depends on who you want to play as.

    As mentioned above, the Christian game is really fleshed out. You get access to Christians in Vanilla and they also have added depth in the DLC's Legacy of Rome,Sons of Abraham, Conclave and Way of Life. There's also The Old Gods and Charlemagne for the earlier starting dates. You also need Sons of Abraham to play as a Jewish ruler.

    To play as a Muslim you need Sword of Islam. Again, The Old Gods and Charlemagne adds earlier starting dates and Sons of Abraham, Conclave, and Way of Life adds some extra flavor.

    For Pagans(Norse/Germanic,Romuva, Tengri, etc). The big one is The Old Gods. You need it to play as the Pagans and it opens up a more favorable starting date for their play. Horse Lords isn't necessary to play as a Tengri Nomad, but they are greatly fleshed out by it. There's also Charlemagne for an even earlier starting date and Conclave and Way of Life add extra flavor.

    Finally, we get to India. Raja's of India is necessary to play in India at all and as usual, The Old Gods and Charlemagne add earlier starting dates and Conclave and Way of Life add flavor.

    Hopefully that gives you a general idea of what the DLC's do. As you can see, some of them show up a bunch and others don't. The Big ones are typically considered to be The Old Gods, Sons of Abraham, Way of Life, and Conclave. Conclave is debatable. There's a lot of mixed and conflicting feelings about it, but it does add depth to the education system for your kids. If for no other reason that makes it an all right DLC.

    There's also some I haven't mentioned. Mainly Sunset Invasion and The Republic.

    The Republic adds the ability to play Merchant Republics and all of the flavor necessary to make it enjoyable. It's generally considered an Okay pick up. However, in my experiences...despite it being Three years old. It still has a bunch of weird bugs in it. Especially when combined with new features. I have had situations where I have suddenly just stopped being a republic with no idea how or why and situations where i have lost the game suddenly with the same reaction. So it's largely an At Your Own Risk type of thing...but it is only $9.99(USD).

    Then there's Sunset Invasion.

    How do I put this...Sunset Invasion is useful for adding a whole lot of Fun to Western Europe. A location which has a tendency not to have Fun things happen to them like the Mongol Invasion or Great Holy Wars. It adds an invasion from the sea by a Fun group of people known as the Aztec Empire who come into France and Spain and Great Britain to cause lots of Fun to happen.

    It's horribly ahistorical and is generally considered a blight, pointless, and dumb. My personal opinion is that it is kind of dumb, but it adds something to Western Europe that wasn't there before(and still isn't in India) and that is some big event or disaster that really shakes things up. However, Your Mileage May Vary.

    Edit:
    There is one more thing to mention. Portraits. If you play the game and enjoy it. I highly suggest picking up the portrait packs when they're on sale for 75% off. It doesn't seem like much, but without them. Every character in the game will look either Western European or Arabian. It does so much in little ways to increase the depth of the game that I can't emphasize it enough. They may not be worth $2.00(USD), but they're definitely worth it if you can get them for 75% off.
    Last edited by Leecros; 2016-04-28 at 10:03 AM.
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    Quote Originally Posted by Leecros View Post
    How do I put this...Sunset Invasion is useful for adding a whole lot of Fun to Western Europe. A location which has a tendency not to have Fun things happen to them like the Mongol Invasion or Great Holy Wars. It adds an invasion from the sea by a Fun group of people known as the Aztec Empire who come into France and Spain and Great Britain to cause lots of Fun to happen.

    It's horribly ahistorical and is generally considered a blight, pointless, and dumb. My personal opinion is that it is kind of dumb, but it adds something to Western Europe that wasn't there before(and still isn't in India) and that is some big event or disaster that really shakes things up. However, Your Mileage May Vary.
    Doesn't India get that Ghaznavid or whatever invasion very early on? The dude that appears in Afghanistan with some obscene amount of troops and storms around northern India beating people up. Plus the Mongol Empire, Ilkhanate, and Golden Horde can both get sidetracked and end up in your face.

    I usually play with Sunset Invasion disabled, but that's because I don't play in Western Europe. England and France and Spain (Well, Brittania, Francia, and Hispania) are my end-game bosses, and if they're beaten up by feather-hatted weirdos, then winning isn't worth it.

    In my opinion, playing in 867 removes the need for Aztecs. There are plenty of threats in Europe - vikings and Moors - that start out strong and just get stronger.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Artanis View Post
    I'm going to be honest, "the Welsh became a Great Power and conquered Germany" is almost exactly the opposite of the explanation I was expecting

  16. - Top - End - #1066
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    So, started over for reasons. Basically the same character. Different wife, though.

    Edit:
    How do you hold a feast in Conclave? I don't get that option anymore. Not with this guy, not with the last one either?
    Last edited by Avilan the Grey; 2016-04-28 at 10:39 AM.
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    Quote Originally Posted by Flickerdart View Post
    Doesn't India get that Ghaznavid or whatever invasion very early on? The dude that appears in Afghanistan with some obscene amount of troops and storms around northern India beating people up. Plus the Mongol Empire, Ilkhanate, and Golden Horde can both get sidetracked and end up in your face.
    Unfortunately, In my experiences, The Ghaznavids tend to meet the same fate as Seljuk and Timur. They just don't happen that often and when they do happen, they get put down in a few decades.

    Since...I think it was Rajas of India where the conditions for them to appear were changed and caused them to appear as Courtiers first before going on their crusades. I have seen seen Seljuk once or twice and The Ghaznavids maybe once. I have yet to see the Timurids. This all despite playing several games through to completion.
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    Spoiler: I like thos numbers
    Show


    Also reposting this:
    How do you hold a feast in Conclave? I don't get that option anymore. Not with this guy, not with the last one either?
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    Quote Originally Posted by Avilan the Grey View Post
    Also reposting this:
    How do you hold a feast in Conclave? I don't get that option anymore. Not with this guy, not with the last one either?
    I know at least one of the requirements is that you have to have at least 1 vassal which you don't seem to have in that screenshot.


    the full requirements are:
    Spoiler
    Show
    Must not be at war, nor a prisoner,
    Must not be a repulbic
    Must be Christian, Zoroastrian or Jewish
    Must not be holding a feast already.
    Must have at least 1 vassal.
    Month must be October.
    25 gold
    100 prestige
    Quote Originally Posted by BRC View Post
    teleporting Hyper Nixon solves problems with Patriotism.

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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    Quote Originally Posted by Leecros View Post
    I know at least one of the requirements is that you have to have at least 1 vassal which you don't seem to have in that screenshot.


    the full requirements are:
    Spoiler
    Show
    Must not be at war, nor a prisoner,
    Must not be a repulbic
    Must be Christian, Zoroastrian or Jewish
    Must not be holding a feast already.
    Must have at least 1 vassal.
    Month must be October.
    25 gold
    100 prestige
    Ah! They must have changed that since last time I played.

    I noticed that Erik apparently ousted the proper lord of the Realm; when the game starts Faste Gälta (the "historical" character) is still there, but is now just a courtier.
    This inspired me for Erik's backstory:
    He is basically a self-made count; After Faste's dad (somehow) managed to get independence, Erik realized that being stuck in dungville that is also independent without any possibilities to grow, just didn't fit his ambitious nature. Luckily for him everyone underestimated the "funny dwarf". He ousted Faste's father, and since there was no higher court to appeal to, quickly made himself Count.

    The first of his line.

    Now, he better find himself a good wife.

    Spoiler: ...Well, she's just what the doctor ordered:
    Show


    ...And then swear fealty to the King of Sweden and start kissing behinds. Hopefully he will be made a Councillor AND get a Dukedom soon enough. Of course his main priority is his family. An orphan without heir is not a place to be. Just look at Faste...
    So, Breeding Ahoy!

    Hopefully.
    Last edited by Avilan the Grey; 2016-04-28 at 01:07 PM.
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    Quote Originally Posted by russdm View Post
    Are there certain areas that are more enjoyable to play than others? If one were to acquire the game, (as planned), at some point, are there locations that involve more fun? I know some of starting areas, like Ireland, and a couple others for beginners based on reading Let's Play, but are there characters to work with only after you have several games under one's belt?

    Does the best starting areas/characters change with the DLCs? Other than Ruler Designer, are there certain DLCs worth getting before actually having ever played the vanilla game?
    Flickerdart's selling on Russia is a good one, and Leecros' breakdown of the DLCs are good. My personal two cents on DLC is to get Way of Life, Sons of Abraham and Conclave right away, because they will be useful and add depth to anyone you're playing, no matter where. From there, you can pick and choose which different regions/faiths you want to try and pick up the appropriate DLC.

    As to specific characters that are worth checking out, especially in 1066, it's hard not to go with the classic: William the Bastard. Can you help him get his historical title of William the Conqueror? The Saxons are not as much of a push-over as you may think, so having a decent understanding of the mechanics/relationships will help a lot.

    I personally like the King of Poland in 1066. His stats are crazy, his realm has a lot of potential, but he is surrounded by threats: The HRE, Baltic Pagans, Hungary, Scandinavia, you will never be short of people to butt heads with.

    The Jimenas of Iberia are good fun as well. Brother Kings at each other's throats with the Iberian Muslims waiting to pounce on the slightest weakness.

    It's slightly later, but the 1081 start with Alexios Komnenos in Byzantium is a really fun start, though you'll probably want to get the Legacy of Rome DLC before you try that one.
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  22. - Top - End - #1072
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    Quote Originally Posted by OrcusMcP View Post
    Flickerdart's selling on Russia is a good one, and Leecros' breakdown of the DLCs are good. My personal two cents on DLC is to get Way of Life, Sons of Abraham and Conclave right away, because they will be useful and add depth to anyone you're playing, no matter where. From there, you can pick and choose which different regions/faiths you want to try and pick up the appropriate DLC.
    I'd like to add Legacy of Rome to the must-have list because it adds Retinues, which have a HUGE impact on warfare.


    As for the others, several do very little beyond allowing you to play as certain types of rulers: The Old Gods (Pagans), Horse Lords (Nomads), Sword of Islam (Muslims), The Republic (Merchant Republics), and Rajahs of India (India). While they do generally add some other stuff (TOG adds a new start date, for example), don't bother getting those DLCs unless you want to play as the associated character types.
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    Quote Originally Posted by Artanis View Post
    I'd like to add Legacy of Rome to the must-have list because it adds Retinues, which have a HUGE impact on warfare.
    While that's true, and LoR is certainly worth getting for that, I think for a new player, learning to manage your levies and vassals is more important that retinues.
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    Didn't reunites change to being part of vanilla worth Conclave's release?

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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    Quote Originally Posted by OrcusMcP View Post
    While that's true, and LoR is certainly worth getting for that, I think for a new player, learning to manage your levies and vassals is more important that retinues.
    True. I guess I lost track of that amid all the discussion

    Depending on how new the player is, you might want to do without Conclave as well. While it makes managing your vassals easier (in some ways) for an experienced player, for a NEW player, all the extra stuff to keep track of (who has favors from whom, who's on your Powerful Vassal list, adding even more f***ing types of factions, the new education system, etc.) might be a bit too much to add to an already massive learning curve.


    Quote Originally Posted by Anxe View Post
    Didn't reunites change to being part of vanilla worth Conclave's release?
    Not as far as I know.
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    Quote Originally Posted by Anxe View Post
    Didn't reunites change to being part of vanilla worth Conclave's release?
    The opinion amongst most, or all of the CKII devs is that Retinues should have been a vanilla feature. The same goes for many of the fans who post on the forums.

    The problem is that Retinues was written in as a major feature of Legacy of Rome. If they make it so that they become vanilla features, then they have to do something to compensate people who have bought the DLC for that reason.

    It might not sound like a big deal, but one has to go no farther than the Steam community to learn that there are some very very entitled people out there.
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    Quote Originally Posted by Leecros View Post
    The opinion amongst most, or all of the CKII devs is that Retinues should have been a vanilla feature. The same goes for many of the fans who post on the forums.

    The problem is that Retinues was written in as a major feature of Legacy of Rome. If they make it so that they become vanilla features, then they have to do something to compensate people who have bought the DLC for that reason.

    It might not sound like a big deal, but one has to go no farther than the Steam community to learn that there are some very very entitled people out there.
    I remember that discussion. I just thought they'd gone ahead with the change and given a portrait pack out or something.

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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    I was lucky with DLC as I got all up to Rajas and the game for £30 on offer-though way of life and the old gods are the ones that affect me the most.

    In other news, I only realised now that other Christian rulers can attack you while you're on crusade. That ended up costing me Iberia
    Frisa seems to always be close to doom.
    Last edited by Tentreto; 2016-04-29 at 07:30 AM.
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

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    Default Re: Crusader Kings 2 Thread III: Keeping Up With The Karlings

    Well, It would seem as if the Aztecs quickly found where the power in Europe lies...

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    teleporting Hyper Nixon solves problems with Patriotism.

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