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2019-09-17, 04:42 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2010
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What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
I just had a thought.
Say there is a mortal, and they do something heroic or whatever to make it seem they are worthy, and both The Unconquered Sun and Luna came to them at the same time and found each other trying to Exalt the same person.
The situation is wildly, completely improbable. Astronomically so. I know that. but lets say, for the sake of discussion, that it just does: these two Incarnae are trying to Exalt one person and they won't budge on it.
What happens, because I don't know if anyone has ever asked this question before, but it sounds like something out of myth that Exalted would totally have happen, much like the golden apple of discord being argued over by three goddesses.
So what do you guys think would happen? would this mortal have the unique chance to CHOOSE which Exaltation they get? would Sol and Luna compete over who gets to Exalt them? Do they just flip a coin of ambrosia? What? I don't think there is any wrong answer to this, but I certainly want to hear peoples thoughts on this.
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2019-09-17, 09:50 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2007
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- USA
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Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
First off, Luna and TUS don't choose who exalt. The individual exaltation chooses. And there is a different qualifier for each. Lunars are chosen more because they acted as a type of guardian. For Solar exaltations, it is more dependent on the heroism as typified by the individual caste.
That said, if a Lunar or Solar exaltation tried to attach and exalt a specific mortal at the same time, then ultimately it is the mortal's choice.
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2019-09-17, 10:18 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2005
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- Vancouver, BC, Canada
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2019-09-17, 01:13 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2010
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Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
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2019-09-17, 02:47 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2006
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- Pittsburgh, PA
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Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
I'ma go with "Solar during the day, Lunar at night." With their personalities slowly splintering, too, at a guess. Seems like the most narratively interesting, though god knows how it would work mechanically.
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Grod's Guide to Greatness, 2e: A big book of player options for 5e.
Grod's Grimoire of the Grotesque: An even bigger book of variant and expanded rules for 5e.
Giants and Graveyards: My collected 3.5 class fixes and more.
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2019-09-18, 07:45 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2007
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- USA
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Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
My guess it depends on the person then. Luna always visits when someone exalts as a Lunar. TUS only gives a small message for the Zenith caste. But isn't limited to that.
So my guess is that the person has the choice. To choose which path to go down. I doubt TUS or Luna would force exaltation on someone who didn't want it.
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2019-09-18, 03:42 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2009
Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
If the power levels of the deities aren't too different in 3rd edition from 2nd, I'd guess that Solar one would win if they 'fought' over the human due to TUS being more powerful than Luna. At least, more directly powerful.
I don't know the 3rd edition lore, but I could see something like the person has both. Thus, access to both Solar and Lunar charms plus the inherent abilities of both. Probably overpowered for a PC, but a neat concept for an NPC.
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2019-10-14, 04:11 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2010
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- Dallas, TX
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Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
When two companies wanted to hire me at the same time, I would choose which offer to accept.
If two women were interested in me at the same time, I would choose who to date.
When two D&D groups want me to join them for a Saturday afternoon game, I decide whose house to drive to.
When two colleges admitted me, I chose which one to attend.
Why would this be any different? [And how?]
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2019-10-15, 06:28 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2005
- Location
- Toronto, Canada
- Gender
Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
If you like my thoughts, you'll love my writing. Visit me at www.mishahandman.com.
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2019-10-15, 07:39 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jul 2009
Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
See when a tree falls in the forest, and there's no one there to hear it, you can bet we've bought the vinyl.
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2019-10-16, 09:53 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2010
Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
I thought at first this would lead to two different situations, but I think they actually fold into each other. I realized after a few minutes that they are both same but that they focus on different perspectives (he divine and the mortal) on essentially the same thing.
Essentially the two different Incarnae have some sort of contest, ala God, Satan, and Job, to see who their Chosen drifts to. Not that the person would have the same things happen to them as the biblical story, but that an "average" person would find their life suddenly having a lot of supernatural attention on it, and that attention demanding a response from them. I think the exact nature of that attention would vary a lot on the chosen in particular as well as the Incarnae involved, but I imagine it should be all about the mortal making clear and distinct choices between two different things. What is appealing to me about this is that I think the outcome doesn't have to step on any toes in particular, which makes it playable at least to me. "Luna got this one, well I guess this mortal didn't have what it takes to be a Chosen of Battles" says Mars at the end of the day.Former Owner of GiTP's fanciest Bloodbowl Team: The Fancy Lads
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2019-10-16, 09:58 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2010
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- Dallas, TX
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Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
Oh, very good point.
But I think it's not sufficiently analogous. In the Exalted case, both Incarnae are trying to honor you. If two states want to give me a medal, I do get to choose which ceremony to attend.
But you still make a valid point, requiring me to refine my analogy and explain it better.Last edited by Jay R; 2019-10-16 at 10:17 AM.
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2019-10-16, 04:07 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Oct 2006
- Location
- Pittsburgh, PA
- Gender
Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
Hill Giant Games
I make indie gaming books for you!Spoiler
STaRS: A non-narrativeist, generic rules-light system.
Grod's Guide to Greatness, 2e: A big book of player options for 5e.
Grod's Grimoire of the Grotesque: An even bigger book of variant and expanded rules for 5e.
Giants and Graveyards: My collected 3.5 class fixes and more.
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2019-10-16, 07:55 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2010
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- Dallas, TX
- Gender
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2019-10-19, 02:50 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2007
- Location
- In the Heart of Europe
- Gender
Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
In the Old Lore, this would not happen, as Solars exalt before/during the heroic Deed, and Lunars afterwards.
In the (fluffwise meh to horrible, if mechanically clearly superior) 3rd Edition though....phew....more difficult#.
I am going with "unless very specific circumstances are against it, Solar", as TUS is simply Lunas Superior in everything but Shapeshifting.A neutron walks into a bar and says, “How much for a beer?” The bartender says, “For you? No charge.”
01010100011011110010000001100010011001010010000001 10111101110010001000000110111001101111011101000010 00000111010001101111001000000110001001100101001011 100010111000101110
Later: An atom walks into a bar an asks the bartender “Have you seen an electron? I left it in here last night.” The bartender says, “Are you sure?” The atom says, “I’m positive.”
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2019-10-20, 12:02 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2011
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- 30.2672° N, 97.7431° W
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Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
Last edited by Mutazoia; 2019-10-20 at 12:03 AM.
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2019-10-20, 04:18 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2006
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- Poland
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Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
Considering how rare both Solar and Lunar Exaltations are... the chance of both the deities picking the same mortal is pretty vanishingly small. If it were to happen, I could honestly see it going either way. Lunar Exaltation is a lot more varied, as Luna meets each of their Chosen in a variety of shapes and guises. It also places less emphasis on the "great deed" part, though Solar Exaltation doesn't require it, either. You could say the Sun's superior strength would overpower Luna, or that Luna's mercurial trickster nature would win over.
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2019-10-22, 06:22 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jul 2017
Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
I could go either way on either agreeing to a contest between the two of them to see which one the mortal seems appropriate to (which will have the effect of making the mortal's life exceptionally interesting), or straight up giving the mortal a choice. If a mortal did something so impressive that they get multiple offers for exaltation, without having already been exalted for awesomeness by that point, the incarnae might well think their input had merit. Storywise I'd be slightly more inclined to have them be tested, just because that creates more interesting conflict.
While Sol could probably win if it turned into a contest of who could stuff their exaltation into the mortal harder, incarnae rarely duke it out amongst themselves and their primary pastime is gaming. Being so crude and direct doesn't seem to be their style.
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2019-11-26, 09:21 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2012
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- Various Places
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Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
They would settle their disagreement with a round of the Games of Divinity, then both would get so distracted by the game that they forget about the mortal in question, who then fails to exalt at the appropriate time and dies as a result, leaving them open to an abyssal or infernal exaltation...
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2019-11-28, 03:51 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2015
Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
The two incarnae see the person then decide "That person is too much awesome for exaltation he is Chuck Norris"
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2019-11-28, 04:13 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2010
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Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
I'm just looking at this thread and marveling at how it somehow keeps coming back despite its low post count. liking the funny responses people keep coming up with. I got nothing. I thought this thread would be dead by now, but no its still going. kudos little thread, your still going and you give better answers than the official response- which was basically "we're not answering that.".
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2019-11-28, 11:49 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2014
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2019-11-29, 08:08 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2012
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- Various Places
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Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
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2019-11-29, 08:40 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2006
- Location
- Pittsburgh, PA
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Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
Last edited by Grod_The_Giant; 2019-11-29 at 08:41 AM.
Hill Giant Games
I make indie gaming books for you!Spoiler
STaRS: A non-narrativeist, generic rules-light system.
Grod's Guide to Greatness, 2e: A big book of player options for 5e.
Grod's Grimoire of the Grotesque: An even bigger book of variant and expanded rules for 5e.
Giants and Graveyards: My collected 3.5 class fixes and more.
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2019-11-29, 09:00 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2006
- Location
- Poland
- Gender
Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
I think they're just a sort of divine fire or gift without any specified form.
Last edited by Morty; 2019-11-29 at 09:01 AM.
My FFRP characters. Avatar by Ashen Lilies. Sigatars by Ashen Lilies, Gullara and Purple Eagle.
Interested in the Nexus FFRP setting? See our Discord server.
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2019-11-29, 06:38 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2010
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Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
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2019-11-30, 09:44 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Oct 2006
- Location
- Pittsburgh, PA
- Gender
Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
Hill Giant Games
I make indie gaming books for you!Spoiler
STaRS: A non-narrativeist, generic rules-light system.
Grod's Guide to Greatness, 2e: A big book of player options for 5e.
Grod's Grimoire of the Grotesque: An even bigger book of variant and expanded rules for 5e.
Giants and Graveyards: My collected 3.5 class fixes and more.
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2019-11-30, 10:09 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2006
- Location
- Poland
- Gender
Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
My FFRP characters. Avatar by Ashen Lilies. Sigatars by Ashen Lilies, Gullara and Purple Eagle.
Interested in the Nexus FFRP setting? See our Discord server.
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2019-11-30, 03:48 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2010
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Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
Yeah, the Exaltations are still at the same number of people and still have memories of past lives, they just don't tell you whats underneath the power you get. there is no hard word on how the process of exaltation goes on behind the scenes so to speak, other than that the deity somehow chooses, the person somehow gets Exalted as like 2e, but there is no physical component that can be taken and used for something else.
like, their concern was not to eliminate the mantle thing or anything mystical, their concern was eliminating questions about players abusing what they know about the 2e process of Exaltation to say, beat up the guy who cleans the Exaltations, capture the shards for yourself, then being experimenting on them for your own purposes because Exaltations aren't supposed to be empirically broken down like that. the change is to keep it mystical and important to their perspective.
quite simply according to the devs, asking how Exaltations work in too much detail is focusing on the wrong thing and is unimportant to the game, and have a hard line stance against answering anything about them other than "they're black boxes don't worry about it."
so yeah you can say your own canon is that they are still shards, its just there is a considered reason why shards are no longer a thing, much like with many 2e science-like stuff. they just don't like too much magitech in Exalted, they don't think it fits with the default setting if its used too much, and to them the shard explanation for how Exaltations work was another form of magitech just going too far. these days, I'm just like "whatever man, I have godbound now and its magitech to the nines, in ways that all of Exalted 2e could only dream of."
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2019-11-30, 11:05 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2009
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- Craig, Co
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Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?
Unless it has completely changed, the Maidens claim dibs on a person they want to Exalt when they are born, which makes them the most likely to compete over a single person. UC is likely to let them have it unless there is an overwhelming reason otherwise. Likewise, he is likely to let Luna choose the mortal, as unlike Theron he does not have to assert his authority. Luna on the other hand is rather likely to steal a mortal from the Maidens if the person impresses her. She gets a new deserving chosen, and she throws careful laid plans into chaos, which is a double win.
Now the real question is how do the Maidens choose if they come into conflict with each other? Do they look into the future and use the choice that will be made? Do they ask Sol for an impartial opinion? Do they have a tally of previous times this occured, and attempt to keep it in balance? Do they throw it to the Games to decide?
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