Base Class Contest Chat Thread V: I Scored at the Top of My Base Class

**Alabenson** · 2018-12-28, 09:10 PM (ISO 8601)

And we have thread!

**nonsi** · 2019-01-01, 02:53 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Alabenson

And we have thread!

Combining Ambush Breath and ray breath seems an overkill to me.

**Alabenson** · 2019-01-02, 09:16 AM (ISO 8601)

I just read over the Draconian and it might be more than a tad overpowered. The d12 HD, full bab, all good saves, fairly decent breath weapon and 3/4 casting ending at level 7 spells does seem a bit much for a single class.

Originally Posted by nonsi

Combining Ambush Breath and ray breath seems an overkill to me.

I can understand where you're coming from, especially given that the ability does seem to be particularly potent at the mid to high levels (13+). On the other hand, given the requirements needed to set the ability up it's effectively a once per encounter nuke, and the dracocleptor loses a fair bit of power once it's no longer an option.

**rferries** · 2019-01-03, 12:12 AM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Alabenson

I just read over the Draconian and it might be more than a tad overpowered. The d12 HD, full bab, all good saves, fairly decent breath weapon and 3/4 casting ending at level 7 spells does seem a bit much for a single class.

Fair points, I was balancing for high tiers but that's not really an excuse. I've toned down the casting and breath weapon.

I'll post some critiques once we get more entries, but things are off to a promising start so far!

**UristMcRandom** · 2019-01-06, 01:50 AM (ISO 8601)

I might just be tossing the Drakosteo out and trying again with a different angle. I had a bunch of ideas for it, but now that I'm actually trying to write it all of my inspiration has just evaporated, so I'm gonna probably go a different route.

**Gideon Falcon** · 2019-01-09, 07:56 PM (ISO 8601)

Anybody know what happened to the Prestige Class contest? I can't even seem to find the discussion thread.

**rferries** · 2019-01-09, 08:40 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Gideon Falcon

Anybody know what happened to the Prestige Class contest? I can't even seem to find the discussion thread.

Most recent contest.

Chat thread.

**Gideon Falcon** · 2019-01-12, 03:44 AM (ISO 8601)

So it looks like it's been inactive for five months. Dang.

**Alabenson** · 2019-01-21, 01:42 PM (ISO 8601)

For what it's worth, I've added some minor skill bonuses to the dracocleptor based on what dragon type they select, mostly to help differentiate between them a little more.

Edit:

I've also given the Draconian another read through:
Overall, I think it's a fairly solid gish-in-a-can; getting Con to AC in the form of natural armor was a particularly nice touch since it helps cut down on the MAD most Gishes have to deal with, and between the breath weapon and spells the class would have a decent number of options in and out of combat. I do have a few minor nitpicks, but nothing overly major;
- I find it a little odd that Draconic Linage doesn't come up until level 3; it strikes me more as something that would be a fundamental choice when entering the class rather than something that comes later.
- While I definitely feel that bringing the classes maximum spell level down to 5 from 7 was the right call, what I might suggest is giving them a casting progression similar to a Duskblade's, which would be a little less clunky while a keeping a similar power-level.
Again though, these are minor nitpicks and I feel it's a very good class overall.

**rferries** · 2019-01-21, 08:17 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Alabenson

For what it's worth, I've added some minor skill bonuses to the dracocleptor based on what dragon type they select, mostly to help differentiate between them a little more.

Edit:

I've also given the Draconian another read through:
Overall, I think it's a fairly solid gish-in-a-can; getting Con to AC in the form of natural armor was a particularly nice touch since it helps cut down on the MAD most Gishes have to deal with, and between the breath weapon and spells the class would have a decent number of options in and out of combat. I do have a few minor nitpicks, but nothing overly major;
- I find it a little odd that Draconic Linage doesn't come up until level 3; it strikes me more as something that would be a fundamental choice when entering the class rather than something that comes later.
- While I definitely feel that bringing the classes maximum spell level down to 5 from 7 was the right call, what I might suggest is giving them a casting progression similar to a Duskblade's, which would be a little less clunky while a keeping a similar power-level.
Again though, these are minor nitpicks and I feel it's a very good class overall.

Agreed on lineage being something that should kick in sooner, but I didn't want it to be too much of a front-loaded class and swapping out either the armour or talons really reduces their initial utility. The whole class was in fact a lazy rewrite of a racial class I had devised (applicable to a draconian race that started with a lineage) haha.

I definitely take your point about an alternate progression, but I'll keep the sorcerer casting for symmetry with true dragons (and to allow draconians to potentially benefit from multiclassing).

As for everyone else's entries, I see we all had the same idea of eventually turning into a dragon haha. Nevertheless it's interesting to see the individual spins on them.

Dracoleptor
As always, half the fun is reading the fluff! Quite balanced overall too, just some thoughts:
-Since it's a custom spell list, I'd add all the Draconomicon sorcerer-only spells to it (albeit at different levels, in the same way that bards get mass charm monster etc).
-The breath weapon section is quite dense, I might remove the ray option (though it's a nice merging of the aggressive dragon and precise rogue concepts).
-Similarly, ambush breath is dense. I'd consider switching it to a simple Sneak Attack (that possibly applies to just the breath weapon).
-Treasure Sense may have a typo - a hat of disguise is worth more than 100 gp so shouldn't it be detected?
-Improved Draconic Flight is nice but kind of unnecessary at that level. I'd give them the 2x flight speed when they initially gain the flight speed; any later bonus should be more about maneuverability IMHO.

Dragon
A proper racial class, woohoo! :)
-dragon body is a classic start :)
-I'd remove the age part - a PC gains levels much faster!
-The Hoard chart is a bit much, I'd split the 21+ level section into a later "Epic Progression" section as it's not relevant for most campaigns. Also, if I understand it correctly a dragon has to eat basically ALL their WBL to get the listed benefits - no magic items seems a turn-off for PCs.
-dragon mind is pretty cool for multiclassing, though the base class should give some sort of progression itself
-I like the initial traits; will their be more?
-I'd streamline the traits/growths etc into one type of benefit, and with a less complicated progression.
-Looking forward to seeing more!

Drakosteo
A promising start - the Oracle of Delphi famously interacted with a dragon. Also nice in that it's the only class so far that doesn't involve becoming dragonish haha.

**Lanth Sor** · 2019-01-25, 11:07 AM (ISO 8601)