Test of Spite Exhibition : aethernox vs. PhoenixRivers

[ex cathedra]

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Arena is 30 feet tall, worked stone. Normal lighting.

Buff Rounds : 1 + All Day (12+ hour) buffs.

Starting locations: I'll start somewhere in the top two rows, and you'll start somewhere in the bottom two. Cool?

[PhoenixRivers]

Cool with me.

Buffs: All day: Greater Magic Weapon (+5) on my chain and spikes

1 round: Tattoo of Touchsight

Starting location: C25

Init: [roll0]

[ex cathedra]

Introducing Ryth'lin.

Relevant modes of detection :
True Seeing

Starting position :

H1, 10ft above ground.


Buffs :

Round 1: Drink Potion of Shield of Faith
All-Day:
Persistent Extended Quickened Shield [Power Component: Guardinal Feather]
Persistent Protection From Evil
Persistent Master's Touch
Persistent Blades of Fire
Persistent Ectoplasmic Armor
Persistent Bladeweave
Persistent Burning Sword
Persistent Heroics [Improved Initiative]
Persistent Wraithstrike
Persistent Sonic Weapon
Persistent Weapon Of Impact
Persistent Weapon of Energy [Acid]
Persistent Haste
Persistent Greater Magic Weapon [+3]
Persistent Displacement
Persistent Fly
Persistent Greater Mighty Wallop
Persistent Greater Luminous Armor [Power Component: Guardinal Feather]
Persistent Greater Invisibility
Persistent Greater Mirror Image
Persistent Acid Sheathe
Persistent Greater Blink
Persistent Bite Of The Wereboar
Persistent Extended Divine Power
Persistent Antimagic Field [Extraordinary Spell Aim to exclude myself]
Persistent Bite Of The Weretiger
Persistent Greater Heroism
Persistent True Seeing
Oil of Greater Magic Weapon [+5]


Initiative: [roll0]

[PhoenixRivers]

Relevant modes of Detection: Touchsight

You're up?

And, are there any exploits being used that prevent this character's allowance into Qualifiers?

[ex cathedra]

Ryth'lin

Turn 1 :

Fly forward to K16


Do you have line of sight/effect to the areas surrounding K16, and do you grant it? Also, touchsight within 10ft of K16 fails. You detect nothing there.


Edit:
I do not think I'm exploiting any limited or banned abilities. I simply have a character already in a long-dead dungeon instance, and I didn't feel like making this character dungeon-ready.

[PhoenixRivers]

No, I have no LOS to there, but I have LOE to some areas within 10 feet of it.


I can only assume with the range of that effect, and the description, that it's an AMF. AMF wizard, hm... Must be a melee mage build.

Done with your turn?

[ex cathedra]

Not quite.


I take a total defense action. Because I'm scared.


And now I am. Go ahead.

[PhoenixRivers]

Round 1: Move west, then North, to B15. Activate tattoo of expansion. Expand to cover A14-B16 (squeezing for C row)

Activate Thicket of Blades Stance, cause I can.

Now I must figure out if you're a Grapple base that wanted to avoid FoM, an AMF donut build that wants to use magic while denying it to those close to him, or a Darkstalker/HiPS base, to avoid touchsight/mindsight while sniping. If you're a mage, then 2 and 3 both mean donuting the AMF, simply due to HiPS.

Done, by the by.

[ex cathedra]

Round 2 :


Move to F20.


The field and I move to F20. LoS/E? Not done.

[PhoenixRivers]

You see a portion of me in A17 and B17. Heh.

[ex cathedra]

Oh my. What does this portion look like?

Also, assuming touch sight is your only extraordinary sense, you see nothing within the area that you detect as an antimagic field.

I'll move to B18.


Activate a Belt of Battle


Not done.

[PhoenixRivers]

Holding a spike chain, about 32 feet tall.

At B18, I go back to medium size.

Oh, and one more thing. You're aware that you cannot cast defensively within a rather large area of me.

[ex cathedra]

I attack.

If you don't interrupt my attack:


I am invisible, and I remain so while attacking.

Attack 1:

vs Touch AC.

Hit :

[roll1] Bludgeoning damage
[roll]1d6+1d8 Fire damage
[roll2] Acid Damage
[roll3] Sonic damage.

If successful, make a DC20 will save.
If you fail:

You are stunned for one round.




Attack 2:

vs Touch AC.

Hit :

[roll5] Bludgeoning damage
[roll]1d6+1d8 Fire damage
Acid Damage
[roll7] Sonic damage.

If this is the first successful attack of the round, make a DC20 will save.
If you fail:

You are stunned for one round.




Attack 3:

[roll8] vs Touch AC.

Hit :

[roll9] Bludgeoning damage
[roll]1d6+1d8 Fire damage
Acid Damage
[roll11] Sonic damage.

If this is the first successful attack of the round, make a DC20 will save.
If you fail:

You are stunned for one round.




Attack 4:

[roll12] vs Touch AC.

Hit :

[roll13] Bludgeoning damage
[roll]1d6+1d8 Fire damage
[roll14] Acid Damage
[roll15] Sonic damage.

If this is the first successful attack of the round, make a DC20 will save.
If you fail:

You are stunned for one round.

[ex cathedra]

And the roller disappoints me.

To clarify certain damage rolls:


Attack 1:

[roll0] Fire damage
[roll1] Fire damage


Attack 2:

[roll2] Fire damage
[roll3] Fire damage


Attack 3:

[roll4] Fire damage
[roll5] Fire damage


Attack 4:

[roll6] Fire damage
[roll7] Fire damage

[PhoenixRivers]

That's match. And looking at your buff list, how the hell do you get 28 persisted spells? I'd say that qualifies as "exploit".

Via DMM, that is 196 turn attempts.

Outside of DMM, that's a rather large amount of reduction, which, as a general rule of thumb, is heavily mitigated.

In either case, any build with persistent AMF likely has no place in competetive play. There's quite literally no reliable way to counter it. While I do have characters that could beat it, largely due to the "excluding yourself from AMF" donut effect, there is no counter to an AMF.

If you'd care to bring a different build to matches, that's one thing.

But know that any build independently capable of persisting 28 spells is likely pushing the bounds of "exploit".

[ex cathedra]

Oh, it didn't qualify as an exploit until now, or atleast very soon. I'll show you the sheet. The persist effect is a quality of certain build choices that will be banned, very likely because of this character, I think. I'm not positive, but I may be the first person to use it here.

[PhoenixRivers]

Also, note that I should have seen you.

AMF Suppresses effects in its area, but does not block Line of Effect, nor does it stop effects passing through it. It's why donuting an AMF is typically very foolish. I can cast a magic missile while on one side of an AMF, it will pass straight through, and hit a target on the other side (provided the target isn't subject to the AMF).

Thus, I'd be able to detect anything within the AMF that was excluded from the effect. You.

For another example. You listed true seeing as going out through the AMF. The principle is identical.

[PhoenixRivers]

Oh, it didn't qualify as an exploit until now, or atleast very soon. I'll show you the sheet. The persist effect is a quality of certain build choices that will be banned, very likely because of this character, I think. I'm not positive, but I may be the first person to use it here.

Something does not need to be banned to be an exploit, Aethernox.

[ex cathedra]

That may be true.

In regards towards AMFs:
I really find it hard to say precisely how ESA'd Antimagic Fields work. It doesn't remove the AMF from my space, it simply excludes me from the effect. To what extent it does so is admittedly vague, and deserves further consideration.

I'm sorry if you feel wronged, really.

[PhoenixRivers]

That may be true.

In regards towards AMFs:
I really find it hard to say precisely how ESA'd Antimagic Fields work. It doesn't remove the AMF from my space, it simply excludes me from the effect. To what extent it does so is admittedly vague, and deserves further consideration.

I'm sorry if you feel wronged, really.

Exactly. Touchsight doesn't need to see everything in your square to see YOU.

If YOU are affected normally by magic, then all magic functions normally with respect to YOU.

In other words, I'm not trying to see your square. Your donut is smaller, but it's still a place in the AMF where magic functions.

If it functions going out, it functions going in. There's no vagueness there. No consideration. If you can be affected by blink and invisibility, you can be affected by True seeing and touchsight.

There's not a "these 28 spells affect me, because I like that, and it says so... but those 4 spells don't."

Either spells can pass through an AMF to a target which can be affected, or they can't.

And by RAW, they can.

That means that you'd have had an AoO for moving inward.

[Doc Roc]

RAW: AMF does not block LoE given my understanding. Thus, it does not properly block emanations. So he can see you. It's stupid, but until we rewrite AMF, which is.... distant.... This is how it works.

[ex cathedra]

I am unaffected by the AMF. It still effects the area around me and the area in which I reside, it simply doesn't affect me, specifically. The AMF still functions.

Tide disagrees, so be it. Apologies, PR, really.

[PhoenixRivers]

Which means AoO:

Attack: [roll0]
If Hit, Stand Still: Reflex Save DC 10+[roll1] or stop as if all movement for the turn was used up.

This attack ignores all magical miss chances, and 20% of nonmagical miss chances.

Which means that due to the nat 1, everything still goes off.

[PhoenixRivers]

Attack 1-4, for your attacks

Miss chance 1: [roll0]
Miss chance 2: [roll1]
Miss chance 3: [roll2]
Miss chance 4: [roll3]

1-20 misses.

[ex cathedra]

Poor luck on rolls, for both of us. Does this mean that my action was executed as planned?

[PhoenixRivers]

Yes. But now, it was done legally.

EDIT: And the poorer luck was mine. 1 result that would have missed, and I got it. DC 47 reflex saves are rather difficult to make.

[ex cathedra]

Were you attacking touch AC? If so, that is mostly true.

Really, again, sorry for the confusion. Good game, PhoenixRivers.

[PhoenixRivers]

I was ignoring any concealment granted from magic, and any AC boost granted from magic.

(Pierce Magical Concealment and Pierce Magical Protection)

[ex cathedra]

Pierce Magical Protection requires a single attack as part of a standard action, does it not?