League of Legends XIII: Our Skill is Hard to Deny

[Wandiya]

League of Legends XIII:
Our Skill is Hard to Deny

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NA Server
{table=head]Forum Name|Game Name
Adumbration | Benefice
aethernox | aethernox
Alemil | Alemil
Alter | AlterForm
Arbitrarity | Arbitrarity
assassin89 | nineballcirno
AtwasAwamps | AtwasAwamps
Baron Corm | Baron Corm
Brother Oni | MarineHK4861
Bliss Authority | Companion N00b
Caradryan | Ying Quliang
Copacetic | Azbu
CrnvorousMeece | CarnivorousMeece
Croverus | Croverus
Cute_Riolu | Cute Riolu
Dallas-Dakota | MustacheMan
Darth Mario | Darth Mario
Daverin | Daverin
Dentrag2 | Callinectes
Dichotomy | Kaellin
Djinn in Tonic | The Djinn
Dogmantra | Dogmantra
douglas | DouglasM
Dragonus45 | Dragonus45
Drager0 | Drager0
Dragor | Supernaturalist
Draken | Draken Frosthand
DrakeRaids | DrakeRaids057
Dralnu | TomerIsHot
Duos | DapperGuy
Eldariel | Elealar
efdf | efdf
Elagune | Chopstyx
EndlessWrath | Andurin
Errandir | Ramses III
EternalMelon | EternalMelon
faith | Ferrovax101
Faulty | FaultyClockwork
Fawkes | Count Fawkes
Flechair | Master Zealot
Floogleboogle | Le Shirrif
Folytopo | Folytopo
Frankelshtein | McFinkelstein
glemis | glemis
Gourtox | Gourtox
Gruffard | Gruffard
Incomp | Incomp
Istari | IstariK
Jamin | CapZich
Joran | Jorana
KaizoMK | KaizoMK
Kara Kuro | RaptorKitty
Kettle | Kettle747
king.com | kingcom
Kinslayer | HaunterReqiuem
kmchii | kmchii
Kopaka | CelesHurricane
LegoShrimp | LegoShrimp
lvl 1 sharnian | StarryEagle
Lyxie | Lyxie
Makensha | Jarbis
MammonAzrael | MammonAzrael
Manticoran | Manticoran
MasatoHyuga | MasatoHyuga
Master_Rahl22 | Goltoth
master256 | QWERTYSTOP
Math_Mage | Mathmage
Malmagor Andrigal | Madmal
Maxios | Maxios20
Mike_the_Mystic | Kraemer
Milskidasith | Milskidasith
Moklok | KokoBWare
Mtg_player_zach | MtgPlayerZach
Mushroom Ninja | Mushroom Ninja
Nanoblack | IwearSILLYhats
Necroticplague | Yamidamian
NeoVid | NeoVid
Octopus Jack | Thalric
Pie Guy | Qwazes
pilvento | Kandrass
PhoeKun | PhoeKun
Poison Fish | Baron Von Flib
Raistlin1040 | Sanevale
Rama | Nargus
Raroy | setokaibasmt
RationalGoblin | AtillathePun
Raveypoos | Rhaviewoos
revolver kobold | A Magic Kobold
Serpentine | Lady Serpentine
Shades of Gray | PierreAbelard
shadowwalker64 | shadowwalker65
SidCoolios | Irazel
Silverraptor | Silverraptor
Sirroelivan | Sirroelivan
Slash_712 | Catfud
St. Viers | St.Viers
Starfols | Starfols
SweetRein | SweetRein
TalonDemonKing | TalonDemonKing
TechnOkami | Techn0kami
Temotei | Temotei221
Terazul | Allegretto
term1nally s1ck | silverdevilboy
Thanatos 51-50 | Thanatos Erebus
TheGlowingRogue | I Glow In Dark
Thethan | Thethan
The Valiant Turtle | Valiant Turtle
Thrantar | Thrantar
Thrawn183 | Thrawnyboy
toasty | toastymow
Tono | Tono Chou
Treayn | Treayn
Vauron | Vauron
Volatar | The Volatar
wandiya | wandiya
Winthur | Seyruun
Zabel_Zarock | Jon Talbain
Zeful | Zeful
ZeroNumerous | ZeroNumerous
Zeteni | Zeteni
0tt3r | 0tt3r[/table]

EU Server
{table=head]Forum Name|Game Name
Abakus | Terpfen
Acromos | Crannoch
Adumbration | Adumbration
Alemil | Alemil
Brother Oni | MarineHK4861
Dada | Scrattlebeard
Darwin | DarwinBeGood
Eldariel | Elealar
Even Human | SlyGuyMcFly
Heliomance | Sidhe de Grian
Kurrel | GrinningOni
lord_khaine | Lord_khaine
Morph Bark | Morpheus Bob
Narazil | Narazil
Nargan | Naryuk
Narkis | Narkis
Penthar | Malderon
Raviepoos | Skittles Unicorn
Rockbird | Rockbird
Shadowleaf | AncientPharma
shadowwalker64 | shadowwalker64
Voidhawk | Sidhe ne Awk
Volatar | VolatarUK
Zefir | Einerwie
Ziren | Zirenoid[/table]


??
{table=head]Forum Name|Game Name
olelia | ??[/table]

Smurf Accounts
{table=head]Smurf Owner|Game Name
Silverraptor | GITPSilverraptor
Faulty | MagnetsConfuseMe
ZombyWoof | DiscoGirl
Volatar | Karje
Dogmantra | TheManRatGod
[/table]


MUMBLE
Download here! (http://mumble.sourceforge.net/)
Our main means of communication is a mumble server, playing host to a variety of games, including LoL. Hanging about is a good way to find a game, and if you don't fancy playing something there's always a good chance of a friendly chat. Contact Djinn if you have a question or want to donate money to keep the server running. List of admins available on request.
Address: fish.mumbleboxes.com
Port: 36003

There are also some backup voice servers available for if the main server goes down or you suddenly become allergic to the main one:
Mumble:
Address: mumble.ukgame.com
Port: 59219

Mumble:
Address: 195.90.99.195
Port: 52412

Teamspeak: (http://www.teamspeak.com/?page=downloads)
Address: shados.net
Port: 54203

STREAMS

Silverraptor (http://www.livestream.com/silverrapter?t=527242)

GUIDES

Into the Wild - Guide to Being a Better Jungler (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=10867111#post10867111) by Mtg_player_zach
Laser Bear Udyr (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9657101&postcount=39), by Djinn_In_Tonic
Rammus: Can't touch this. (http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=258919) by Math_Mage
Seizing the fourth digit: Playing your way out of elo hell. (http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=341821) by Math_Mage
Twitch (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=10267058&postcount=1448), by Djinn_In_Tonic
Faulty and Raistlin's Quick Build Database: Notes and Stuff (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=10942497&postcount=1004) by Faulty and Raistlin
Jungle Akali (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=10498621&postcount=1358) by Djinn
How to play everyone's favourite Lightning Squirrel (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=10518034&postcount=154) by Dogmantra
Lee Sin (http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=636475) by Dralnu

CLASSY VIDEOS FOR CLASSY PEOPLE

Jungle Janna! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fC6wm9iaNmM)
How to Win Every Game in League of Legends (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FrsTE1vpoXM)
Panic at the Nexus (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7WlCbaLI3I)
Sunfire Cape Sunday (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xgjfX6crjrg)
Season One Trailer with Commentary (http://www.leagueoflegends.com/news/season-one-trailer-commentary)
D-Town (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wHp4VJ47v0)
Insanity Mix (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fGKN1Adzckk&feature=related)
(Truly, Truly) Outrageous (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fC7S05vI-BU&feature=related)
I'm just a noob (Ryze Ryze Ryze again) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wpr1T-pgaZY&feature=related)
e.o.n Shen (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AHs_cGUPQ3M&feature=related)
Vendrim-Ionia (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ry3E2UQMe3k&hd=1)
Pwn ur FACE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zf9VSDt0EN4)

COMICS

One by our own Elagune (http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=48169)
Learn Your Alphabet (http://img191.imageshack.us/img191/6264/g28376.png) by Dogmantra and Pierreabelard

TRAVEL BACK IN TIME: PREVIOUS THREADS

League of Legends XII: It's Worth It Because I Said So In The Thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=194886)
League of Legends XI: It's Hard to Post Like This in Heels (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=192695)
League of Legends X: Armored Armadillo Delivers Ambiguous Affirmative (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=10646164#post10646164)
League of Legends IX: New Thread Available! Only 6300 IP! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=188076)
League of Legends VIII: Gali-Os: They're idolicious! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=185516)
League of Legends 7: Truly, Truly Outrageous! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=182486)
League of Legends 6: Jannaaaaaaaaaa! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=178334)
League of Legends 5: Tall Grass Used Garen! DEMACIAAA! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=173805)
League of Legends 4:CAWCAWCAWCAWCAWCAW (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=169616)
League of Legends 3: You only need to click once (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=164008s)
League of Legends Goes Where It Pleases 2 (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=158135)
League Of Legends: We post where we please. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=139094)

[Faulty]

Hey, that is a slight misrepresentation. Some of those kills were mine.

I seriously can't get any farm as Jarvan, though. I'd farm with his Q/E, but he's mana starved early game. Should I take Golem or get Manamune or something, or just suck less?

I should probably suck less.

Just practice last hitting with your auto-attacks really.


Also, Rumble spotlight (http://www.leagueoflegends.com/news/champion-spotlight-rumble-mechanized-menace). A manaless tanky melee caster with a new targeting system. So excite.

[Moonshadow]

Okay... wow. I just played one last game when I got the "we're shutting down the servers to patch soon" message. Started playing, started lagging unmercifully hard about 15 minutes into the game. We lose because of lag, game explodes, and when my computer finally recovers, I find I have 1590 LoL error windows.

I should totally get free RP for that :smallamused:

[Faulty]

I wanted to play LoL because I can't get back to sleep and then patch. :(

[ZombyWoof]

Way to perk Ez :smallsigh:

[Faulty]

Patch notes (http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=692602).

Thoughts:
*Rumble is awesome looking.
*Interesting Alistar changes. I'm curious as to how they'll function in game.
*Oddly buffing Caitlyn's early game. I still think she'll be mediocre as all horsefeathers.
*I like the Ezreal changes. It looks like they're trying to make AP relevant again or even add the possibility for building hybrid. At the very least it'll give me a bit more meat out of the AP from Trinity Force.
*I like the Fiddle changes. Seems his scaling will be way better and his Drain will be less irritating while not making his jungling terribad.
*Gangplank changes are really interesting. Deny was an interesting mechanic but I'm not sure I'll miss it. He has a really killer steroid now, his ult is a lot better and Parrrley seems like it'll be more consistant and less "oh hey you're not allowed to be near him and squishy". He seems like he'll make for an acceptable support damager.
*Ryze changes: seem really small. Hopefully they'll continue a bit.
*No more giant tiger claws on towers. :(
*Xin Zhao chanegs seem like he'll be a lot more consistant and will allow him to build tankier without losing damage.
*Yay, Randuin's buff!
*"Updated numerous character bios." :O

[ZombyWoof]

My thoughts:

0) Passing judgment on a champ before I see it played has never worked before for me.

1) Alistair's move speed was moved to 305. HE'S A DEMON ON WHEELS I TELL YA! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=auszi9bUr3o) I mean seriously. Also the rest of his changes don't seem to do much either but I don't remember what his passive was. I was horrible with the cow.

2) Caitlyn is still just inferior to Ashe in every way except her range. I mean seriously her ult is like Ashe's, except a) it doesn't stun, b) it doesn't do AoE, and c) it's not global.

3) Ez buffs? Really? I can see sticking AP ratio on Mystic Shot but adding another AD to his ratio mix is just begging for trouble of the OP variety.

4) Fidds looks about useless now. His drain is AWFUL and their "compensation" for nerfing it to hell and back is .02 ap ratio? Um... ok? I guess you're supposed to jungle off the Crow move now? At least at low levels Crowstorm isn't as simple as "Is Flash up? No? Well I guess I'll go get a sammich now and enjoy the respawn counter." Oh wait, it still is!

5) GP has a better ult and loses a ton of utility off of the deny mechanic loss. Thank god it's gone it was a dumb idea anyways. Paarley was just flat out nerfed... I don't know why they think 5second cds give for more "sustained" damage than 6 seconds, and the loss of 30 damage off his 1400000 damage crits isn't going to give him a less "busrty" feel.

6) RYZE WAS NE... wait. Now see Ryze is a difficult beast because mana scaling is just something they've never done. He still will probably be OP.

7) Sona perked. The only one that matters really is Hymn of Valor though because almost all of your power cords will be for extra damage.

8) I LOVED those particle effects! That makes me super sad.

9) Beast at level 1. Definitely a nice perk on battlecry, but I'd like to see the numbers on his ult now.

10) Aaand now I am going to buy Randuin's Omen as Shen again. Welcome back! How does it feel to be a good item again?

[Faulty]

Zomby, may I ask if your post was a response/semi-response to mine? Because it seems like it is and I'm just wondering why.

[ZombyWoof]

Yes it is, but only because you doing it made me want to do it :smallwink:

Really the major issue with the Ez buffs I see is adding AD to Trueshot Barrage. They don't give the number for some reason but I suspect it's going to be fairly high... which is going to be very dangerous at low levels. Remember what happened when Sivir got the same buff?

[Moonshadow]

Wait, what? Trueshot Barrage already has AD on it o_o

[Misery Esquire]

Wait, what? Trueshot Barrage already has AD on it o_o

They're just making sure. :smalltongue:

[ZombyWoof]

Oh :smallredface: You can see how rarely I play Ez XD

[Dogmantra]

The problem I have though, is that I'm somewhat iffy about Energy Champs, because I like being able to spam my abilities like they were going out of style,

Kennen's main resource system is not Energy, it's Electrical Surge procs on autoattacks. Provided you pay attention to those you will not go dry. Also remember you get Energy back for stunning people, so the best defense, as they say, is a good offense.

[Faulty]

They're making it additive now. At the moment it has a .9 AP ratio and a 1.0 ratio with bonus attack damage, and I think the larger number overrides the smaller. Now they'll add, e.g. if Ez has Trinity Force and a Brutalizer he'd get +55 damage from AD and +27 damage from AP for a total of +82 damage to the ult.

So with a Trinity and 1/3 Archmage's Savvy, at level 18 an AD Ez will now have roughly +30 damage to his ult and +6-7 damage to his Mystic Shots. :smalltongue:

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

League of Legends: XIII: You know you play too much when you dream of Playgrounders as LoL Champions.


Totally happend to me tonight. o.0


Who was who?

[Dallas-Dakota]

There was ''Lux The Djinn'' which looked liked a kind of more pinkish version of Lux with slightly Arabian clothes.

There was a purple version of Cassiopeia, Serpentine.

Miss Fortune - I'm Da Rogue(if you can remember her, old SMBG folks)

I was Gangplank, but with long blonde curly hair like I have.

I can't remember much else, except a vague recollection of Dog also being there.

[TheEndIsNear]

First!

Got my last exam in two days! I gotta Stuplay LoL. lol.

EDIT: I read throught this thread. Don't know why I said first.

[Neftren]

There was ''Lux The Djinn'' which looked liked a kind of more pinkish version of Lux with slightly Arabian clothes.

There was a purple version of Cassiopeia, Serpentine.

Miss Fortune - I'm Da Rogue(if you can remember her, old SMBG folks)

I was Gangplank, but with long blonde curly hair like I have.

I can't remember much else, except a vague recollection of Dog also being there.

Hmm, British Lightning Squirrel in a Pikachu suit?

[Dienekes]

So saw Rumble preview. Looks pretty fun, and his damage output seems really good (especially with so little AP as the announcer says). His ult seems lackluster though.

[Faulty]

So I finally listened to the Ke$ha song that "Press R" is based on and I was disappointed. Haha. I like the KDH version better.


So saw Rumble preview. Looks pretty fun, and his damage output seems really good (especially with so little AP as the announcer says). His ult seems lackluster though.

Phreak is just OP. He always does crazy damage in the spotlights.

His ult seems sort of like Corki's Valkyrie. It's versatility of aim may make it quite useful though. I see it working well it ults like Amumu's and Galio's, or in jungle fights. It also seems like it's a way of denying access to an area unless people want to take damage.

[Dogmantra]

His ult seems lackluster though.

It wouldn't be the first Equaliser that sucks. :smallcool:
That's right ladies and gentlemen, nothing but Equaliser jokes from here on out.

I wonder if Soraka just cries while you're using your ult as Rumble.

You can't get hit with Kayle's ult as Rumble when you're aiming your ult.

Rumble stole Karma's passive.

Boots of Mobility + Low health Rumble = new land speed record.

Rumble can one-shot Teemo with an ult.

IF MAKING TF2 REFERENCES IS SURE TO RESULT IN VICTORY THEN YOU MUST MAKE TF2 REFERENCES, I SAID THAT AND I THINK I'D KNOW A LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT MAKING TF2 REFERENCES THAN YOU!


Phreak is just OP. He always does crazy damage in the spotlights.
I have a theory that Phreak gets stronger the weirder the quints he's using. Health Regen Quints on Rumble makes the champion look OP.
Remember how broken Karma looked in the spotlight? Gold Per Second Quints.

[Serpentine]

There was a purple version of Cassiopeia, Serpentine.Of course :smallcool:

...

I think you need to get out more :smalltongue:

[Faulty]

Of course :smallcool:

...

I think you need to get out more :smalltongue:

Hey Serpentine. Didn't know you played. :smalltongue:

[Eldariel]

Huh. Right now Rylai's + Anivia Slows seems to work again. I dunno what the heck is going on. Trundle went from 395 to 316 in normal Glacial Storm and 288 in Rylai'd Glacial Storm.

[Neftren]

Okay, guys, help me out. When you buy an item with an active steroid (e.g. Yomuu's), when should I use it in order to maximize combat-uptime? Activating it during say, the poking phase of a teamfight seems like such a waste, especially as a melee character. Activating it too late during a teamfight means I'm not really maximizing its uptime. So, thoughts?

[Dallas-Dakota]

Of course :smallcool:

...

I think you need to get out more :smalltongue:

This friday evening good enough for you?:smalltongue:
But to be honest, my parents and college teachers disagree >.< :smalltongue:

[Faulty]

Okay, guys, help me out. When you buy an item with an active steroid (e.g. Yomuu's), when should I use it in order to maximize combat-uptime? Activating it during say, the poking phase of a teamfight seems like such a waste, especially as a melee character. Activating it too late during a teamfight means I'm not really maximizing its uptime. So, thoughts?

Whenever it feels right? Once you're in the carry's face, active Youmuu's; once you're in the middle of the enemy team, and they start running or going for your carries, active Randuin's; when you start getting focused, activate Zhonya's; etc. It depends on the functionality and situation.

[Nargan]

Okay, guys, help me out. When you buy an item with an active steroid (e.g. Yomuu's), when should I use it in order to maximize combat-uptime? Activating it during say, the poking phase of a teamfight seems like such a waste, especially as a melee character. Activating it too late during a teamfight means I'm not really maximizing its uptime. So, thoughts?

In my opinion, Yomuu's, your example, is a tricky one, because when to use it depends on your character. E.g if you're playing Garen, you might want to Yomuu's to catch up with your target, since it stacks with his Q. If you're playing Ezreal, you might use it for the Auto attack buff at the start of a fight, or use it for movement when running away.

If I was you, I'd wait until you see the "pile in" then activate, so give you movement to go into the pile, and attack speed once you get there.

Other items like deathfire grasp, just activate when it's up and they're on high HP, and in range without over-extending.

That's all I can think of off the top of my head, sorry I can't be more help.

[Neftren]

Is it ever worth using Yomuu's when I'm bashing down a tower?

[Dienekes]

Is it ever worth using Yomuu's when I'm bashing down a tower?

Personally I do when sufficiently late game. If you need to get that tower down and you know the enemy is coming quickly the attack speed means you can knock that thing down fast and get out of there before they hit you. And if they come early, you have the much needed bonus speed to again, get the hell out of there.

If the game is not yet into the team fight and kill part of the game, hold onto it for later. But if you're on one of the inner towers yeah, go for it.

[Volatar]

I am going to call Rumble, Wumble. Wumble the Wekenized Wenace.

[Neftren]

This Week's Free Champion Rotation:


Brand
Cho'Gath
Irelia
Karthus
Kog'Maw
Nunu
Singed
Sion
Sivir
Taric

So, I'm probably going to be smurfing this week, since Irelia is free. We'll see though.

[Maeglin_Dubh]

I was just thinking today that I don't think I've ever seen free Karthus week.

This week is going to suck.

[Silverraptor]

There was ''Lux The Djinn'' which looked liked a kind of more pinkish version of Lux with slightly Arabian clothes.

There was a purple version of Cassiopeia, Serpentine.

Miss Fortune - I'm Da Rogue(if you can remember her, old SMBG folks)

I was Gangplank, but with long blonde curly hair like I have.

I can't remember much else, except a vague recollection of Dog also being there.

Nice. I like it when I'm in other people's dreams. Makes my dreams less awkward.>.> (Too bad I'm not in this one. But atleast I was in that one dream as Galio.:smallbiggrin:)

[Eldariel]

Every game I've had thus far has had a Kog'Maw. Wat.

[Dogmantra]

Hey guys.

Rumble is 4800.

And there was much rejoicing.

(also skin idea: "Royal Rumble", boxing gloves and a crown)

[Volatar]

Servers are back up!

Also, there are some new hidden skins that they didn't announce, including "Nunu Bot" which looks awesome: http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/attachment.php?attachmentid=161932&d=1303831205

Theres also a new Morde skin ( http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/attachment.php?attachmentid=161931&d=1303831052 ), and new default Taric art: http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/attachment.php?attachmentid=161930&d=1303830926

[Serpentine]

Hey Serpentine. Didn't know you played. :smalltongue:Yep, sometimes. I'm not very good, though. I'm sometimes only a bit less than mediocre playing Cassiopeia, and I recently discovered she's meant to be the hardest! I'm also a fan of Nidalee and Soraka.
This friday evening good enough for you?:smalltongue:Pick me up at 8 :smallwink:

[Draken]

Servers are back up!

Also, there are some new hidden skins that they didn't announce, including "Nunu Bot" which looks awesome: http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/attachment.php?attachmentid=161932&d=1303831205

Theres also a new Morde skin ( http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/attachment.php?attachmentid=161931&d=1303831052 ), and new default Taric art: http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/attachment.php?attachmentid=161930&d=1303830926

Nunu bot makes me think of Mimiron and Ulduar.

Haven't opened the game yet... Dreadknight Mordekaiser I presume? Just a bit redundant.

New Taric art looks good, better than the original anyway.

[Nargan]

Going to HAVE to play as Brand and Karthus this week. 2 Champs I've wanted for a while but haven't had the IP and haven't been bothered to get the RP.

[Daverin]

So, if that new skin is anything to go off of, apparently Morde feels the need to compensate for something... :smalltongue:

Also, is he wielding an axe-mace?

[Dallas-Dakota]

I'm also a fan of Nidalee and Soraka.Pick me up at 8 :smallwink:


Be sure to wear some orange though, it'l be queensnight.(And no, not as in the LGBT of queen, actually the dutch' queens night.)


We should play toghetter sometime :smallwink:

[Dogmantra]

So.

You know how Rylai's seems really good on Rumble anyway? It also gives his autoattacks a slow when he's overheating. I've only played in a custom so far, his ratios aren't great, but with a Rylai's he's amazing at chasing, and seems like a really tough but ultimately really fun character. Oh, and with max CDR, his rank 3 ult has a 36 second cooldown. Considering Nashor's on him.

And now I'm not going to be able to play with you guys because I wanna play him all the time.

[Astrella]

Okay, I've been having problems patching. (Copying stopping at 81%.)

It's caused by the new Taric splash art: this (http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=694526) fixed it for me. (In case anyone else's been having this problem.)

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

So.

You know how Rylai's seems really good on Rumble anyway? It also gives his autoattacks a slow when he's overheating. I've only played in a custom so far...

Do me a favor? Turn on Smartcasting in a bot game, and let me know how his Ult interacts with it, will you?

[Astrella]

Do me a favor? Turn on Smartcasting in a bot game, and let me know how his Ult interacts with it, will you?

Tried it. Smart casting just automatically makes the line face away directly from you, so it's not advised to use smart-casting for it.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

Tried it. Smart casting just automatically makes the line face away directly from you, so it's not advised to use smart-casting for it.

Well THAT needs to change immediately...

[pilvento]

Check this idea:

min 20 build - berserker graves, trinity force, lantern (ez is going ad!)

final build - same + hextech gunlblade, guinsso rageblade, rabadon deathcap

Im at work now and all i can think about is hybrid ez ideas!

[Zeful]

Tried it. Smart casting just automatically makes the line face away directly from you, so it's not advised to use smart-casting for it.

Yeah there's a couple of threads on it on the LoL forums, one's even got a red post explaining that.

@Djinn: I don't think it's possible honestly. How would smartcasting rumble's ult work ideally given you have to define an Origin and Destination within a defined area? I can't think of anything that would work and not resemble normal casting.

[Hatevah]

Yeah there's a couple of threads on it on the LoL forums, one's even got a red post explaining that.

@Djinn: I don't think it's possible honestly. How would smartcasting rumble's ult work ideally given you have to define an Origin and Destination within a defined area? I can't think of anything that would work and not resemble normal casting.

Have the base where your cursor is when you cast, and follow the direction your mouse moves after casting? By which I mean do the same it does with smart-casting off, minus the clicking business, just wait for the cursor to move [arbitrarily small but significant distance], and that sets the vector from the origin?

Depending on how lag works, that may also get very frustrating...but is better than radially away?

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

Yeah there's a couple of threads on it on the LoL forums, one's even got a red post explaining that.

@Djinn: I don't think it's possible honestly. How would smartcasting rumble's ult work ideally given you have to define an Origin and Destination within a defined area? I can't think of anything that would work and not resemble normal casting.

Smartcasting works just for the first click. Then, you aim and fire normally, just like you would without smart-casting. Ease of use + ability to aim the important part of the ultimate. Problem solved.

[Eldariel]

So. Rumble. His base values seem pretty miserable and he's very much not all that tanky nor all that damaging nor all that CCy nor all that supporty. What exactly does he do?

[Dogmantra]

So. Rumble. His base values seem pretty miserable and he's very much not all that tanky nor all that damaging nor all that CCy nor all that supporty. What exactly does he do?

Nothing much. He chases and pushes like nobody's business though.

[Zeful]

Smartcasting works just for the first click. Then, you aim and fire normally, just like you would without smart-casting. Ease of use + ability to aim the important part of the ultimate. Problem solved.

But then why enable smartcasting for the ult at all, if all it does is shortcut one click? It's a simpler solution and has the same effect.

[Makensha]

Check this idea:

min 20 build - berserker graves, trinity force, lantern (ez is going ad!)

final build - same + hextech gunlblade, guinsso rageblade, rabadon deathcap

Im at work now and all i can think about is hybrid ez ideas!

I warned you about them hybrid Ez's Dog, I warned you.

Any AP Ez build without Lichbane is bad. Period.

[Fjolnir]

Nunu bot looks like the head goron from Ocarina of Time...

[toasty]

Nothing much. He chases and pushes like nobody's business though.

How strong is Rumble in a 1v1 situation? How good is his escape?

Also: can he jungle at all? If Rumble can jungle and/or split push he might be viable in a few team comps. I mean, my next champion is maokai (I need more roaming supports), so I don't care, but if we can have more split pushers, that is always interesting.

Another thing I've noticed: Shen is a really good "part time roamer" if he has his six and teleport. Like, you are really, really mobile and by then your bottom lane partner has some decent farm and can generally last a little running 2v1 (especially if he's someone like Chogath). Your ganks are not the best, but if coupled with a 2nd CC (Ashe Arrow, <3 Faulty) then you're probably going to pick up a kill or two.

Also: I still need to figure out how to play Ryze when the enemy is really aggressive. Its kinda hard since so many heroes outrange you in lanning.

[Inhuman Bot]

Wait why the **** did they nerf Fiddlesticks?

I mean technically his ult does more damage when he gets FIVE HUNDRED AP...

Edit: New Morde skin.

[toasty]

Wait why the **** did they nerf Fiddlesticks?

I mean technically his ult does more damage when he gets FIVE HUNDRED AP...

Generally it seems they nerfed GP and Fid and didn't actually fix Ryze or Cait or do much for Ez. And rumble seems to be not so useful.

HOWEVER, the servers we up in short order. :smallbiggrin:

[Dogmantra]

How strong is Rumble in a 1v1 situation? How good is his escape?
Once you get Rylai's, you can escape pretty nicely. Double taser can either hold down two guys decently or one guy well. Your ult can block off nearly the entire lane, and while it doesn't block like Anivia's wall, it does slow and damage, again with Rylai's, the slow is pretty good (by pretty good I mean base of 35% + Rylai's, + taser if you hit it). His base movespeed is great, building 9/0/21 with quickness gives you 330 to start, boots 2 + your shield pop means you're moving in spurts of up to 450 units per second. He's not amazing in 1v1 depending on matchup, but if you can wrestle away the upper hand with a little bit of superior play, they will have to flash to get away from you.


Also: can he jungle at all? If Rumble can jungle and/or split push he might be viable in a few team comps. I mean, my next champion is maokai (I need more roaming supports), so I don't care, but if we can have more split pushers, that is always interesting.
I imagine Stonewall will have a video about it, and he seems like he'd be an okay jungler, especially since he's nowhere near Blue reliant, however, I'm not entirely convinced of his levels 1 and 2 capability in taking camps. He'd either do them very slowly, or take lots of damage.

[Makensha]

Generally it seems they nerfed GP and Fid and didn't actually fix Ryze or Cait or do much for Ez. And rumble seems to be not so useful.

HOWEVER, the servers we up in short order. :smallbiggrin:

A .2 AP ratio on a 3 second CD is a substantial buff to AP Ezreal. I would say its the most substantial buff he's gotten in the past six months to an ability. This makes me more excited then the base stat buff a while back.

I think they are being cautious with Ryze nerfs, as to not blow him apart. I think the Caitlyn buffs are adding up over time.

Yeah, the Fiddle and Pirate changes are called "Reworks," not buffs. There's a reason for that. They'll probably both have more changes as time goes by. We'll see how they perform in the long run.

[Astrella]

Also: I still need to figure out how to play Ryze when the enemy is really aggressive. Its kinda hard since so many heroes outrange you in lanning.

I personally wouldn't put Ryze in a solo lane, considering his short range, the fact he's safer in a duo lane and has a snare / good damage for aiding in getting kills.

[Inhuman Bot]

New Morde and Nunu skins.

[Dogmantra]

A .2 AP ratio on a 3 second CD is a substantial buff to AP Ezreal. I would say its the most substantial buff he's gotten in the past six months to an ability. This makes me more excited then the base stat buff a while back.

With the AD now adding rather than being either or on the ult and Mystic Shot, I wouldn't be entirely amiss to getting Ghostblade on Apzreal. More Armour Pen for your Mystic Shots is great (still do physical with a Lich Bane, and it's about half your damage), plus a lot of CDR, PLUS the ASPD boost will let you push towers a bit harder. It'd be weird and maybe it wouldn't work, but then maybe it would. It's worth a shot.

[Eldariel]

Generally it seems they nerfed GP and Fid and didn't actually fix Ryze or Cait or do much for Ez. And rumble seems to be not so useful.

HOWEVER, the servers we up in short order. :smallbiggrin:

Pirate seems fine right now. The ult isn't nearly the lottery it used to be and you can machinegun with Parley (though you still need to get up to melee for Mad DPS). Can't speak of the rest yet, tho.

[toasty]

New Morde and Nunu skins.

I want the Nunu skin, badly.

Edit: So Sirro, you would suggest a play on the EU meta, putting your tank (Shen, Cho, etc) top and a support with Ryze? Actually, I could see a Ryze Taric bot going very well.

[efdf]

Also: I still need to figure out how to play Ryze when the enemy is really aggressive. Its kinda hard since so many heroes outrange you in lanning.

I'm not quite sure which heroes outrange Ryze, his Q is really good mostly because of its 675 range. If they go aggressive on you, just combo them, minions aggro really hurts and they'll have to back out or they die.

[Volatar]

My god! How could you not understand the basic concept of adding an approriate notification on a continuation thread such as:

NEW THREAD!!!! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=10862256)

I love you Silverraptor. :smallsmile:

[ZombyWoof]

Honestly I wonder if Hybrid-Zreal will be used now.

[Faulty]

Honestly I wonder if Hybrid-Zreal will be used now.

I highly doubt it. There's not enough there yet to make hybrid desirable over AD.

[Arbitrarity]

Jungle Xin remains super slow. Probably just going to take advantage of his extra AD for more early kills. I can do a 6 min route with Vamp Scepter to get to 5 (starting at golems. Can stay in jungle FOREVER though, since you lose very little health, and get health on wolves), or a standard route (which would like help at blue, but is otherwise smooth and gank-capable at the end (500-600 health)

[toasty]

I'm not quite sure which heroes outrange Ryze, his Q is really good mostly because of its 675 range. If they go aggressive on you, just combo them, minions aggro really hurts and they'll have to back out or they die.

Annie outranges him, I'm pretty sure. I know Caitlyn outranges you (though I might be able to deal with her) and Ashe should do really well against Ryze. I feel that Kass might fair well on him. I know that I lost to a Veigar. Whether or not that says that I suck with Ryze or that Veigar somehow beats Ryze in a lane. I just know that Veigar was stunning me a lot, and he could do it before I could get in range to use my combo on him.

[TechnOkami]

So, how exactly does this new extension of the thread replace the old one? Is it automatic? Do I even need to worry about it?

[Master_Rahl22]

So, how exactly does this new extension of the thread replace the old one? Is it automatic? Do I even need to worry about it?

I'm not sure what you're talking about here. If you're referring to your subscriptions, then no you need to subscribe to this thread and optionally delete the subscription to the old one.

[Makensha]

Annie outranges him, I'm pretty sure. I know Caitlyn outranges you (though I might be able to deal with her) and Ashe should do really well against Ryze. I feel that Kass might fair well on him. I know that I lost to a Veigar. Whether or not that says that I suck with Ryze or that Veigar somehow beats Ryze in a lane. I just know that Veigar was stunning me a lot, and he could do it before I could get in range to use my combo on him.

Annie does not outrange him. Ryze outranges Annie.
Caitlyn's outrange is a single skillshot.
Ashe is pretty easy to deal with because she has to aim her W and you can just stand behind minions.
Veigar should never win a lane to anyone unless he receives constant lane support or is REALLY GOOD (Yes, dedicated Veigar players do exist).
Kass takes more damage before Ryze is silenced then he'll actually do.

Of course, this might have changed slightly with the Mana ratio nerf.

[toasty]

Doesn't Annie's auto attack outrange Ryze?

Anyways, I'm probably a bad Ryze player, and that's the general issue here. :smalltongue:

[Makensha]

Doesn't Annie's auto attack outrange Ryze?

Anyways, I'm probably a bad Ryze player, and that's the general issue here. :smalltongue:

Her AA might, but it is pretty negligible compared to their spells.

[Inhuman Bot]

GP is worse then ever.

[Qwertystop]

I've seen a few mentions of "smartcasting". What is it?

[ZombyWoof]

Her AA might, but it is pretty negligible compared to their spells.
Her AA is one of her greatest harass tools available...

[Copacetic]

Tryed out new fiddle on a Fiddle/Nunu/Vlad/Heimer/Brand team. ONE opponent built magic resist. :smallsigh:. We crushed face. :smalltongue:

[Silverraptor]

I love you Silverraptor. :smallsmile:

Thank you. I aim to please.:smallcool:

[Maeglin_Dubh]

GP is worse then ever.

They fixed it, now it sucks.

[Hyudra]

I've seen a few mentions of "smartcasting". What is it?

It's something you keybind. If it's on, you don't need to click the mouse to confirm a spellcast. It just automatically targets where your mouse is or who your mouse is hovering over.

So you can bind Q to smartcast 1st ability. If you do, you hover your mouse over enemy Teemo and press Q, and it'll use your first ability on him without you left clicking. Kind of like Flash vs. Ignite (or Cassiopeia's Q vs. her W).

Recommended, I must say. Saves you a fraction of a second very regularly.

[Silverraptor]

Really? I keep seeing QQ threads about all the remade characters on the League forum. Now its here too? Did the changes really make the characters that bad?

[Makensha]

Just finished a game as AP Ezreal. It was beautiful. I think I can now say that AP Ezreal has gone from mediocre to decent.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

Things we are no longer allowed to do in games where Djinn is playing

Feed Garen.
Take the kills our Carry could have gotten, when the other team's carries are getting fed and we need fed carries to keep up.
Call for Baron when the enemy team is in an ambush position, and full of AoE champions.
Let them steal Baron and ace us.
Cast Bulwark on the champion MOST likely to survive Fiddlestick's Ultimate, rather than the ones close to dying but also close to running out of range.
Attempt to initiate when the guys backing you up aren't enough to kill the enemy.
Disconnect after winning the teamfight that could seal the game for us.
Pull people out of Ashe's arrow, or fire an arrow after people have been pulled.
Forget to re-bind smartcast to your Nocturne ult, and miss a kill as a result.
Wander ANYWHERE alone when getting curbstomped.
Build early Thornmail against a team where most of the damage is from Kennen and Fiddlesticks.



Things we will (and did) do in spite of the above

WIN.

[Mtg_player_zach]

Can MtgPlayerZach be added to the first post. Also, Mathmage and I are working on cleaning up my jungling guide posted last thread. Expect that soon.


Also, It's free irelia week: http://www.solomid.net/guides.php?g=720.

[Neftren]

Can MtgPlayerZach be added to the first post. Also, Mathmage and I are working on cleaning up my jungling guide posted last thread. Expect that soon.


Also, It's free irelia week: http://www.solomid.net/guides.php?g=720.

I'll probably be smurfing this week, just for the fun of it.

Interesting build. I'll stick to my own though. :smallsmile:

[Inhuman Bot]

They fixed it, now it sucks.

They broke it!

His ult: Make it drizzle, amirite.

Parrrley: Well, yes, his main damage ability had it's damage reduced. Now he basically gets a ranged autoattack, I guess, that doesn't apply his innate.

Remove Scurvey: It's still decent.

Grog Soaked Blades: At least it still has a 50% Mortal Strike.

Raise Morale: See, it's not that much better, but can be used anywhere, but it can't deny.

Bottom line: What does GP Bring to the table? **** all.

[term1nally s1ck]

Really? I keep seeing QQ threads about all the remade characters on the League forum. Now its here too? Did the changes really make the characters that bad?

Alistar can jungle. How can this be bad.

QEWQ, cloth armor 5 pots, start at blue, 1-16-13,
reds -whatever
yellows - armor
quints+glyphs - AP.

[Math_Mage]

Can MtgPlayerZach be added to the first post. Also, Mathmage and I are working on cleaning up my jungling guide posted last thread. Expect that soon.


Also, It's free irelia week: http://www.solomid.net/guides.php?g=720.

And, on that note:


Into the Wild
Zach's Guide to Being a Better Jungler
Table of Contents
-Why Should I Jungle?
-How Should I Set Up for Jungling?
-The Elements of Jungling
---Routes
---Counterjungling
---Dragon
-Ganking
---Types of gank
---Where and when to gank
-Conclusion


Why Should I Jungle?

The jungle is a nest egg of experience and gold. Not farming the jungle is denying your team those benefits, as surely as if you didn’t farm a lane. Two solos and a jungler are going to level faster, get more gold, and contribute more in teamfights than a solo and a duo.

Having a jungler also gives you someone who can gank and cover lanes when needed. So it's even easier for your solo lanes to get farm, because now they have someone who can help them kill the enemy. Even without actual ganks, the constant threat of someone who is always MIA will benefit your laners.

Finally, a jungler is key to controlling the map and securing neutral objectives. A roaming jungler is able to ward useful locations that would be awkward for laners to reach, setting up and safeguarding against ganks. And Smite affords your team control over buffs, dragon, and Baron with a 500-800 true damage nuke.


How Should I Set Up for Jungling?

Always take Smite. This is non-negotiable. You need it to jungle more quickly and safely, and to counterjungle. Your team needs it to safely take Baron and Dragon.

Always max the Awareness mastery. This is non-negotiable. You need to level as quickly as possible when jungling; in particular, you need Awareness to hit level 4 after a standard clear. Beyond that, masteries vary by champion.

With rare exception, cloth armor and 5 health pots are your starting items of choice. No other setup gives as much jungle sustainability. Armor seals are by far the most common jungler’s runes, for much the same reason; the other runes are champion-specific.


The Elements of Jungling

The most important rule of jungling is to use your time wisely. Jungling is the only role where your speed actually affects how quickly you level, so never waste your time. Choose a route your champion can clear quickly and sustainably. Find good opportunities to gank, and don’t sit around waiting for bad ones to turn good. Don’t just counterjungle by camping in a bush waiting for something to happen—things are happening constantly, and every second you’re not making them happen you’re falling behind.

In order to use your time wisely, you need constant map awareness. How are your lanes doing? Who’s MIA, who’s recalling, who’s dead? Where is the enemy jungler? Who can come to help you—or the opponent—in a fight? This knowledge lets you be in the right place at the right time: gank the right lane, steal the right camp, start the right fight.

Routes

To be written.

After the initial clear, it’s important to know camp respawn times so you can time your arrival with the camp’s reapparance, maximizing clear efficiency. Minor camps (wolves, wraiths, golems) respawn every 90 seconds, buff camps every 5 minutes, dragon every 6 minutes, and baron every 8 minutes. Remember when important neutral creeps will respawn—call it out in chat if necessary.

Counterjungling

Counterjungling is denying the enemy jungler XP by stealing his camps, harassing him out of the jungle, and/or killing him. It’s an information war, where you try to figure out where the enemy jungler is so you can steal camps without fear of retribution, and gank him at precisely the right moment. Your primary weapon is knowledge of each jungler’s common routes, clear time, and buff respawn times; Clairvoyance is another valuable tool. You can even start in the enemy jungle, if you know where your opponent is starting. (Be careful at the enemy’s small golems—minions will periodically grant the enemy vision of them. You can check this by seeing if your own minions give vision of your small golem camp.) Later in the jungling phase, you can ward the enemy jungle—this is particularly useful for ganking the enemy jungler at his buffs.

Dragon

Keep dragon warded throughout early game, as soon as it spawns. You should not attempt to solo it unless you know it is safe (no enemies MIA, no dragon ward—you can check the latter with a vision ward or Oracle’s). If you ward the entrances to dragon you can start it. Dragon is an objective you take when you have the advantage in mid or bot lane, but you can’t take a tower—anytime an enemy recalls or dies in either lane, you should be thinking about whether you can do dragon. If the enemy jungler is trying to take it alone, get your team to gank him and steal dragon. If the enemy team is trying to take it together, get your team to set up a dragon fight—unless you can get the advantage elsewhere, e.g. by pushing down mid tower while the enemy mid is at dragon.


Ganking

Ganking is the most important responsibility of a jungler—and the most complicated. Jungle ganks dynamize early-game play. They create snowballing advantages in lanes that you gank. They enable your team to take early towers and dragons. Other elements of jungling, if done well, get you ahead; ganking well gets your whole team ahead.

Types of gank

As above, every gank is about giving your team the advantage; but that doesn’t mean every gank is about killing the enemy laner(s). You can also gank to…
-Burn summoner spells. If you can force that Ashe to flash, that’s five minutes she won’t have that advantage in a fight—and five minutes when you can come back and gank her for real.
-Initiate a lane cover. If you chase the enemy laner off your tower, giving your near-dead laner a much-needed chance to recall, heal, and buy, then you’ve done your job.
-Force a recall. An enemy that’s at base can’t farm, and can’t stop you from taking dragon, pushing a tower, or stealing the enemy’s jungle.

Naturally it’s better to get kills when you gank. 300+ gold is nothing to sneeze at. But keeping these other goals in mind lets you back off from a successful gank, rather than over-committing on a risky kill that you don’t need to attempt.

Where and when to gank

Three well-chosen ganks are better than nine poorly-chosen ones. Every time you choose poorly, you waste valuable time. Don’t go in without considering the following factors:

-Are you ready to gank? Obviously if you don't have any health, you shouldn't be ganking; but there's more to gank readiness than health totals. Most junglers gank first at level 4 with double buff. Red buff in particular is tremendously helpful for ganking, with extra damage and a permaslow. If you don’t need to gank immediately and you can get red buff before ganking, do so.
-Is the lane pushed? An early-game towerdive is extremely risky and usually ill-advised. Pushed lanes are almost never good gank targets. A lane at your tower, on the other hand, is a great place to look for ganks.
-Are the enemies gankable? A Corki with full health/mana, both summoners, and Valkyrie up is a poor gank target. A Vlad with low health, no flash, and Sanguine Pool on CD is a good gank target. In between? You’ll have to use your judgment.
-Can your allies support you? It’s no good starting a 3v2 fight if your allies are incapacitated to the extent that it’s effectively 1v2. You will most likely want to simply cover this lane while your allies pill one at a time.
-Do your allies need the gank? If Ashe is having a farm-off with the enemy Janna in mid at full health, you don’t need to gank that lane because farmed Ashe > farmed Janna. On the other hand, if Ashe is tiptoeing around a Malzahar at half health, she needs the jungle gank to win that fight.
-Who benefits from your gank? If mid lane and bot lane are equally gankable, gank mid. If Ashe and Pantheon both need ganks, gank for Ashe. Some teammates are more important than others, and you need to account for this to some extent. Don’t go for a stupid gank over a good one just because an important teammate asked, though.

One common element among the above factors is that your team is responsible for setting up good ganks. It’s very difficult for the jungler to create a good gank out of nothing. Knowing when your lane needs to be gankable is a valuable skill for laners. Oftentimes a laner also needs to initiate a gank. It’s much easier for a jungler to sandwich and clean up an opponent after the laners initiate than for the laners to chase down the opponents after a jungler initiation. Coordination wins games, here as anywhere else. Talk to your laners, help them make your life easier.


Conclusion

Simply being in the jungle benefits your team; but a jungler can do much more than that. Junglers are the cornerstone of a team in the early game. In a laning phase otherwise filled with farmfests, junglers create dynamic play with ganks, map control wars, and jungle fights. This guide illustrates the basic principles of being a better jungler; but the only real way to improve is to put these principles to the test with constant practice. Go forth and jungle well, and good luck!

Expect further changes; this is just another draft.

[faith]

^good start.
great advice.

[Maeglin_Dubh]

Advice on new Alistar? I have the points, but I'm unsure whether to drop them on him or save up for another 3150.

[term1nally s1ck]

SO GOOD.

You know the basic role of a tank? Keep the squishies safe. There is NO better champ at that than Ali, and he can initiate pretty spectacularly when needed too.

Oh, and he's an amazing duo laner, and a jungler, and a roamer.

[toasty]

Advice on new Alistar? I have the points, but I'm unsure whether to drop them on him or save up for another 3150.

Alistair is the most awesome support ever. He needs no items and he still is an amazing tank! He ganks like its nobody's business! He has all the CC of Janna but without having to mess with that silly whirlwind of Janna's. He even has a cool little heal that's good for laning, when heals are most important!

Oh, and you can build him AP and lolwut he now is really cool. Shame they removed that passive where he could backdoor as well. :smalltongue:

[term1nally s1ck]

Toasty, I think you may have missed that his current passive does damage to towers. :smallwink:

[Silverraptor]

Disconnect after winning the teamfight that could seal the game for us.


Okay, Djinn. While I find the rest of the things slightly humorus, this has actually upset me quite a bit.:smallmad: Do you know how much yelling was directed at me during the entire time of that final winning teamfight before they grabbed the cord of the wireless modem and pulled it from the wall, nearly wrecking the power cord so that I could never connect to the internet until I bought my own, new power cord!?!:smallfurious:

[Mtg_player_zach]

Alistar can jungle. How can this be bad.

QEWQ, cloth armor 5 pots, start at blue, 1-16-13,
reds -whatever
yellows - armor
quints+glyphs - AP.

Some theorycrafting.

Cloth armor 5 pots.

Attack speed reds.
Armor Yellows.
Choice blues.
Movespeed quints.

Heart of gold.
Mobility boots.
Sheen.
Kage's pick.
Spirit visage.
Rylais.
Deathfire grasp.
Will of the ancients.
Lichbane.
Randuins.
Abyssal Scepter.

All seem to be good options.

[term1nally s1ck]

Passive scaling with AP, as well as high ratios, made me go AP quints and glyphs.

After that, I just went standard tank build. His jungle is fast and effective, and he's only low at blue and a bit above 1/2 hp at red.

[Maeglin_Dubh]

Toasty, I think you may have missed that his current passive does damage to towers. :smallwink:

So, he now has a tiny Ghost each time he casts, and can still backdoor?

BOUGHT.

[term1nally s1ck]

:smallbiggrin:

I solo'd a tower from full with triforce, blue (and hence maxed cdr), and 190 armor.

[Inhuman Bot]

Okay, Djinn. While I find the rest of the things slightly humorus, this has actually upset me quite a bit.:smallmad: Do you know how much yelling was directed at me during the entire time of that final winning teamfight before they grabbed the cord of the wireless modem and pulled it from the wall, nearly wrecking the power cord so that I could never connect to the internet until I bought my own, new power cord!?!:smallfurious:

Maybe you're using the internet too much.

[Silverraptor]

Maybe you're using the internet too much.

Noooooo...

It was them saying, "Come here, NOW!" just before said winning teamfight so I could get a heatting pad for my grandmothers back, "All During That Teamfight!":smallmad: In fact Djinn, you're lucky my grandfather has to use a cane to move around, or I would've DCed right as the team fight was starting, instead of at the end.:smallmad:

[Moonshadow]

I wonder what would happen if you had Brand/Anivia/Kennen all gang up on a single target? Blazed/Chilled/Marked, it's an elemental orgy just waiting to happen!

That said, I think that if you have Marks on 4 or more enemies and you use Kennen's W, it should automatically yell "CHUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU!" in /all chat :smallbiggrin:

[Faulty]

So I played Irelia for the first time today. She always seemed kinda uninteresting to me but man she's actually quite fun. I think I may get her when I get RP.

[Math_Mage]

Dagger/Longsword starts are amusing on jungle Xin post-patch, even though they're probably totally nonviable. I haven't tried starting him at blue yet, and I also haven't tried Smiting blue wraith instead of a small golem. I bet Vamp Scepter's similarly fun-but-ineffective.

EDIT: What I did try was Dagger-start, golems-wraiths-wolves, Smiting a small golem. I cleared the small camps tremendously fast, but didn't have enough health to take blue; too, I didn't have enough gold to buy anything when I recalled--my own speed worked against me.

EDIT2: Dagger definitely isn't viable for starting at blue. I finished golem with under 80 health and wolves put me down to 10 or thereabouts.

Oh, checked my runes. That's probably not helping. I only have 7 armor from seals; picked up some AS seals for some godawful reason. I have a mix of AS and Apen reds; a mix of Armor and AS seals; CDR blues; a movespeed quint; and two Apen quints. Total stats are:
15 Apen
9.8% AS
7 Armor
5.9% CDR
1.5% MS

Of course, a better rune page won't make Dagger Xin significantly better.

[Mtg_player_zach]

And, on that note:


Into the Wild
Zach's Guide to Being a Better Jungler
Table of Contents
-Why Should I Jungle?
-How Should I Set Up for Jungling?
-The Elements of Jungling
---Routes
---Counterjungling
---Dragon
-Ganking
---Types of gank
---Where and when to gank
-Conclusion


Why Should I Jungle?

The jungle is a nest egg of experience and gold. Not farming the jungle is denying your team those benefits, as surely as if you didn’t farm a lane. Two solos and a jungler are going to level faster, get more gold, and contribute more in teamfights than a solo and a duo.

Having a jungler also gives you someone who can gank and cover lanes when needed. So it's even easier for your solo lanes to get farm, because now they have someone who can help them kill the enemy. Even without actual ganks, the constant threat of someone who is always MIA will benefit your laners.

Finally, a jungler is key to controlling the map and securing neutral objectives. A roaming jungler is able to ward useful locations that would be awkward for laners to reach, setting up and safeguarding against ganks. And Smite affords your team control over buffs, dragon, and Baron with a 500-800 true damage nuke.


How Should I Set Up for Jungling?

Always take Smite. This is non-negotiable. You need it to jungle more quickly and safely, and to counterjungle. Your team needs it to safely take Baron and Dragon.

Always max the Awareness mastery. This is non-negotiable. You need to level as quickly as possible when jungling; in particular, you need Awareness to hit level 4 after a standard clear. Beyond that, masteries vary by champion.

With rare exception, cloth armor and 5 health pots are your starting items of choice. No other setup gives as much jungle sustainability. Armor seals are by far the most common jungler’s runes, for much the same reason; the other runes are champion-specific.


The Elements of Jungling

The most important rule of jungling is to use your time wisely. Jungling is the only role where your speed actually affects how quickly you level, so never waste your time. Choose a route your champion can clear quickly and sustainably. Find good opportunities to gank, and don’t sit around waiting for bad ones to turn good. Don’t just counterjungle by camping in a bush waiting for something to happen—things are happening constantly, and every second you’re not making them happen you’re falling behind.

In order to use your time wisely, you need constant map awareness. How are your lanes doing? Who’s MIA, who’s recalling, who’s dead? Where is the enemy jungler? Who can come to help you—or the opponent—in a fight? This knowledge lets you be in the right place at the right time: gank the right lane, steal the right camp, start the right fight.

Routes

To be written.

After the initial clear, it’s important to know camp respawn times so you can time your arrival with the camp’s reapparance, maximizing clear efficiency. Minor camps (wolves, wraiths, golems) respawn every 90 seconds, buff camps every 5 minutes, dragon every 6 minutes, and baron every 8 minutes. Remember when important neutral creeps will respawn—call it out in chat if necessary.

Counterjungling

Counterjungling is denying the enemy jungler XP by stealing his camps, harassing him out of the jungle, and/or killing him. It’s an information war, where you try to figure out where the enemy jungler is so you can steal camps without fear of retribution, and gank him at precisely the right moment. Your primary weapon is knowledge of each jungler’s common routes, clear time, and buff respawn times; Clairvoyance is another valuable tool. You can even start in the enemy jungle, if you know where your opponent is starting. (Be careful at the enemy’s small golems—minions will periodically grant the enemy vision of them. You can check this by seeing if your own minions give vision of your small golem camp.) Later in the jungling phase, you can ward the enemy jungle—this is particularly useful for ganking the enemy jungler at his buffs.

Dragon

Keep dragon warded throughout early game, as soon as it spawns. You should not attempt to solo it unless you know it is safe (no enemies MIA, no dragon ward—you can check the latter with a vision ward or Oracle’s). If you ward the entrances to dragon you can start it. Dragon is an objective you take when you have the advantage in mid or bot lane, but you can’t take a tower—anytime an enemy recalls or dies in either lane, you should be thinking about whether you can do dragon. If the enemy jungler is trying to take it alone, get your team to gank him and steal dragon. If the enemy team is trying to take it together, get your team to set up a dragon fight—unless you can get the advantage elsewhere, e.g. by pushing down mid tower while the enemy mid is at dragon.


Ganking

Ganking is the most important responsibility of a jungler—and the most complicated. Jungle ganks dynamize early-game play. They create snowballing advantages in lanes that you gank. They enable your team to take early towers and dragons. Other elements of jungling, if done well, get you ahead; ganking well gets your whole team ahead.

Types of gank

As above, every gank is about giving your team the advantage; but that doesn’t mean every gank is about killing the enemy laner(s). You can also gank to…
-Burn summoner spells. If you can force that Ashe to flash, that’s five minutes she won’t have that advantage in a fight—and five minutes when you can come back and gank her for real.
-Initiate a lane cover. If you chase the enemy laner off your tower, giving your near-dead laner a much-needed chance to recall, heal, and buy, then you’ve done your job.
-Force a recall. An enemy that’s at base can’t farm, and can’t stop you from taking dragon, pushing a tower, or stealing the enemy’s jungle.

Naturally it’s better to get kills when you gank. 300+ gold is nothing to sneeze at. But keeping these other goals in mind lets you back off from a successful gank, rather than over-committing on a risky kill that you don’t need to attempt.

Where and when to gank

Three well-chosen ganks are better than nine poorly-chosen ones. Every time you choose poorly, you waste valuable time. Don’t go in without considering the following factors:

-Are you ready to gank? Obviously if you don't have any health, you shouldn't be ganking; but there's more to gank readiness than health totals. Most junglers gank first at level 4 with double buff. Red buff in particular is tremendously helpful for ganking, with extra damage and a permaslow. If you don’t need to gank immediately and you can get red buff before ganking, do so.
-Is the lane pushed? An early-game towerdive is extremely risky and usually ill-advised. Pushed lanes are almost never good gank targets. A lane at your tower, on the other hand, is a great place to look for ganks.
-Are the enemies gankable? A Corki with full health/mana, both summoners, and Valkyrie up is a poor gank target. A Vlad with low health, no flash, and Blood Pool on CD is a good gank target. In between? You’ll have to use your judgment.
-Can your allies support you? It’s no good starting a 3v2 fight if your allies are incapacitated to the extent that it’s effectively 1v2. You will most likely want to simply cover this lane while your allies pill one at a time.
-Do your allies need the gank? If Ashe is having a farm-off with the enemy Janna in mid at full health, you don’t need to gank that lane because farmed Ashe > farmed Janna. On the other hand, if Ashe is tiptoeing around a Malzahar at half health, she needs the jungle gank to win that fight.
-Who benefits from your gank? If mid lane and bot lane are equally gankable, gank mid. If Ashe and Pantheon both need ganks, gank for Ashe. Some teammates are more important than others, and you need to account for this to some extent. Don’t go for a stupid gank over a good one just because an important teammate asked, though.

One common element among the above factors is that your team is responsible for setting up good ganks. It’s very difficult for the jungler to create a good gank out of nothing. Knowing when your lane needs to be gankable is a valuable skill for laners. Oftentimes a laner also needs to initiate a gank. It’s much easier for a jungler to sandwich and clean up an opponent after the laners initiate than for the laners to chase down the opponents after a jungler initiation. Coordination wins games, here as anywhere else. Talk to your laners, help them make your life easier.


Conclusion

Simply being in the jungle benefits your team; but a jungler can do much more than that. Junglers are the cornerstone of a team in the early game. In a laning phase otherwise filled with farmfests, junglers create dynamic play with ganks, map control wars, and jungle fights. This guide illustrates the basic principles of being a better jungler; but the only real way to improve is to put these principles to the test with constant practice. Go forth and jungle well, and good luck!

Expect further changes; this is just another draft.

Can this find it's way into the first post?

[Raistlin1040]

When the first two people pick Malzahar and Garen, your response shouldn't be instalock Ashe, Ez, and Eve. Eve is the world's easiest jungle ganker, and if you can't get super fed on her easy gank skills, you shouldn't be jungling with her. If you are playing Ezreal, you should not have mid priority over Malzahar, especially if there's already an Ashe. And finally, if your friendly neighborhood Malzahar lists the focus order as such "Akali, Nocturne, Ezreal, Trundle, Morde", do not blow all of your ults on Morde and Trundle.

[Serpentine]

Alistair has been improved? Yay! He's another of my favourites ^_^ What'd they do to him?

[TechnOkami]

Alistair has been improved? Yay! He's another of my favourites ^_^ What'd they do to him?

I swear Serpentine, your picture is like an amoeba :smalltongue:

[ZombyWoof]

Alistair has been improved? Yay! He's another of my favourites ^_^ What'd they do to him?
Cow is flipping awesome. His trample is boss... but saddly the only alistair I've seen all day is a flaming idiot. He towerdove 2 people at level 3 without any support at all :smallannoyed:

it was kind of my bad for messing up the gank (I missed volley thanks to minions) but still.

[Serpentine]

I swear Serpentine, your picture is like an amoeba :smalltongue:An amoeba? :smallconfused: My picture is like an amorphous single-celled organism that moves by oozing out pseudopods and looks pretty cool under a microscope?

[TechnOkami]

An amoeba? :smallconfused: My picture is like an amorphous single-celled organism that moves by oozing out pseudopods and looks pretty cool under a microscope?

:smallcool: Yes.

[Serpentine]

...huh.
Fair enough.

[Ziren]

Most undeserved loss ever:

http://img690.imageshack.us/img690/6018/3v5.png (http://img690.imageshack.us/i/3v5.png/)

Caith had the solo top lane and went afk for a few minutes after she and I got ganked once. Of course, she didn't tell anybody about this and the other team used this to push a tower down before I was able to do anything about it.
About five minutes later (just short of 20 minutes into the game), both Caith and MF disconnected and didn't come back for the rest of the game. Brand, Garen and me were still dominating the other team for about 15 more minutes in a 3v5, we even managed to pugh three of their towers down. But we couldn't push enough, and since drawn-out games always give the advantage to the team with more players, we eventually lost :smallfrown:

[Eldariel]

Alistair has been improved? Yay! He's another of my favourites ^_^ What'd they do to him?

Basically, they removed his old passive (the Tower Wrecker one) and instead gained "Trample"; whenever you use an ability, you Trample for 3 seconds dealing AoE damage to everything around you and being able to walk over units (does double damage to minions and monsters). And they made his cooldowns for Headbutt and Pulverize scale down with ranks in the skills instead of remaining constant (they start a bit higher and end lower). And slight drops in the base damage of the abilities, and slightly weaker base stats.

[Neftren]

So I played Irelia for the first time today. She always seemed kinda uninteresting to me but man she's actually quite fun. I think I may get her when I get RP.

Welcome to the jungle club. :elan:

[Faulty]

I actually don't think I'm gonna buy her with RP, but I very well may save up for her with IP. I dunno. I have a lot of champs to play and already have Ren as far as competative tanky dps picks. Ah well. Killing an entire minion wave with Bladsurge is fun.

[Neftren]

I actually don't think I'm gonna buy her with RP, but I very well may save up for her with IP. I dunno. I have a lot of champs to play and already have Ren as far as competative tanky dps picks. Ah well. Killing an entire minion wave with Bladsurge is fun.

That tends to burn mana at lower levels. At high levels, I just ult-farm them since it A) heals me and B) I have a 26s cooldown on it.

The biggest mistake I see people commit while playing Irelia is overfarming with Bladesurge.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

Okay, Djinn. While I find the rest of the things slightly humorus, this has actually upset me quite a bit.:smallmad:

Apologies. :smalleek:

I didn't mean to offend. We were all just sort of amused by the timing of, admittedly, circumstance beyond your control. And to be honest, that was the one thing in the game that wasn't one of our faults (and to be frank, we all messed up big-time). I still can't believe I tried to Ult Kennen with the wrong keybinds...:smalltongue:

[toasty]

The fact that alistair is now a really effective jungler is amazing, I gotta say. :smallbiggrin:

[Qwertystop]

What was his old passive? And have abilities ever been completely changed like this before?

[toasty]

What was his old passive? And have abilities ever been completely changed like this before?

Basically everything is the same except his passive is better. his old one deals extra damage to towers.

[Silverraptor]

Apologies. :smalleek:

I didn't mean to offend. We were all just sort of amused by the timing of, admittedly, circumstance beyond your control. And to be honest, that was the one thing in the game that wasn't one of our faults (and to be frank, we all messed up big-time). I still can't believe I tried to Ult Kennen with the wrong keybinds...:smalltongue:

Alright, I forgive you.

I'm sorry if I got angered so easily. But just minutes before that post, you were angrily criticising everyone while having alot of stress in your voice. So as I was reading the list, that particular voice sort of carried over to be read that way. Meaning I sort of read it as if you were saying it was my fault, purely by the tense situation earlier.

[Master_Rahl22]

What was his old passive? And have abilities ever been completely changed like this before?

Yes a few characters have had their abilities reworked before this.

[Silverraptor]

Yes a few characters have had their abilities reworked before this.

Like Kayle. One of the most useless passives ever before they reworked it. It made her slightly better, but now she needs another rework.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

I'm sorry if I got angered so easily. But just minutes before that post, you were angrily criticising everyone while having alot of stress in your voice. So as I was reading the list, that particular voice sort of carried over to be read that way. Meaning I sort of read it as if you were saying it was my fault, purely by the tense situation earlier.

Nope. You'll notice I put my own mistakes (of which there were several, including me not saying "Let's get the HELL away from Baron") in there as well.

It was more of a tongue-in-cheek poke at all of us, and pointing out that we still won the damn game.

But perhaps it didn't carry over the way I had wanted it to. :smallfrown:

[Silverraptor]

Nope. You'll notice I put my own mistakes (of which there were several, including me not saying "Let's get the HELL away from Baron") in there as well.

It was more of a tongue-in-cheek poke at all of us, and pointing out that we still won the damn game.

But perhaps it didn't carry over the way I had wanted it to. :smallfrown:

Well, maybe if you had waited a little longer before posting that, it would've sounded better. I was also not feeling very good about my performance that game either.:smallfrown:

[Dogmantra]

What was his old passive? And have abilities ever been completely changed like this before?
Ryze was recently redone in a similar way, though not quite as drastic, it did change him an awful lot.


Basically, they removed his old passive (the Tower Wrecker one) and instead gained "Trample"; whenever you use an ability, you Trample for 3 seconds dealing AoE damage to everything around you and being able to walk over units (does double damage to minions and monsters). And they made his cooldowns for Headbutt and Pulverize scale down with ranks in the skills instead of remaining constant (they start a bit higher and end lower). And slight drops in the base damage of the abilities, and slightly weaker base stats.

A friend of mine (who is pretty dang good, but also quite quick to judge) says "they gave him all the CC of old Cow but with more damage". Considering he's become a lot more popular recently... I think he might be even more so.

[Eldariel]

Ryze was recently redone in a similar way, though not quite as drastic, it did change him an awful lot.

Well, Ryze's rework was even more drastic in my books; tying his abilities primarily to mana instead of AP basically changed the whole role of the champion. And then removing his nuke-capabilities but instead giving him carry-style spammability also changes his style entirely, from a ranged nuke to a sustained damage. Overall, I feel that's the biggest rework since Beta.

[Khaeta]

Hey Riot! Let's take one of the game's best roamers, increase his damage, and make him able to jungle!

:smalltongue:

[toasty]

Hey Riot! Let's take one of the game's best roamers, increase his damage, and make him able to jungle!

:smalltongue:

I'm love, why aren't you?:smalltongue:

[Faulty]

That tends to burn mana at lower levels. At high levels, I just ult-farm them since it A) heals me and B) I have a 26s cooldown on it.

The biggest mistake I see people commit while playing Irelia is overfarming with Bladesurge.

I was doing it at like 17 and 18. It was more a "whee this is fun thing".

On the this is fun note, I've actually been playing some Nidalee lately and gee she is a blast. If only she could contribute more late game with stuff other than split pushing, which Shen and TF do better. :smallfrown:

[toasty]

Faulty, we should just mimic CLG and run Nid, Lux, Corki. Poke all day, never actually team fight. :smallbiggrin:

[Astrella]

Faulty, we should just mimic CLG and run Nid, Lux, Corki. Poke all day, never actually team fight. :smallbiggrin:

But Faulty can't play Nidalee and Corki at the same time, silly Toasty. :smallwink:

[Arbitrarity]

Dagger/Longsword starts are amusing on jungle Xin post-patch, even though they're probably totally nonviable. I haven't tried starting him at blue yet, and I also haven't tried Smiting blue wraith instead of a small golem. I bet Vamp Scepter's similarly fun-but-ineffective.

EDIT: What I did try was Dagger-start, golems-wraiths-wolves, Smiting a small golem. I cleared the small camps tremendously fast, but didn't have enough health to take blue; too, I didn't have enough gold to buy anything when I recalled--my own speed worked against me.

EDIT2: Dagger definitely isn't viable for starting at blue. I finished golem with under 80 health and wolves put me down to 10 or thereabouts.

Oh, checked my runes. That's probably not helping. I only have 7 armor from seals; picked up some AS seals for some godawful reason. I have a mix of AS and Apen reds; a mix of Armor and AS seals; CDR blues; a movespeed quint; and two Apen quints. Total stats are:
15 Apen
9.8% AS
7 Armor
5.9% CDR
1.5% MS

Of course, a better rune page won't make Dagger Xin significantly better.

Straight ArPen reds/quints, CDR blues, armor yellows with Vamp Scepter lets me run Golems->Wraiths->Wolves->Blue->Golems->Red->Wraiths->Wolves to level 5 without going back once. Takes 6 minutes though. Sloooow :/

[Eldariel]

On the this is fun note, I've actually been playing some Nidalee lately and gee she is a blast. If only she could contribute more late game with stuff other than split pushing, which Shen and TF do better. :smallfrown:

You have like 1k heals, insane pokes and superb single target damage; she's be pretty OP if she had some AoE pain and/or survivability to unleash into teamfights too :smallwink: Really, she's probably the best poking champ in the game; abuse that.

[toasty]

But Faulty can't play Nidalee and Corki at the same time, silly Toasty. :smallwink:

Hmm... we need a mage player who can play nidalee. :smallwink:

Edit: Failing that, I can play Ashe (who has... good poke? She has good kiting at least) and we find a replacement tank/jungler. I'm not sure which I idea I like better... :smalltongue:

[term1nally s1ck]

There's only one thing I hate about new Ali. His passive basically stuns him briefly every time he casts. Argh.

[Astrella]

There's only one thing I hate about new Ali. His passive basically stuns him briefly every time he casts. Argh.

Hm hm. Loss of Headbut -> Pulverize combo is sad. :smallfrown:

[Math_Mage]

Straight ArPen reds/quints, CDR blues, armor yellows with Vamp Scepter lets me run Golems->Wraiths->Wolves->Blue->Golems->Red->Wraiths->Wolves to level 5 without going back once. Takes 6 minutes though. Sloooow :/

What skill order? I've been going WQWE, though that's probably completely suboptimal.

[Arcanoi]

The biggest mistake I see people commit while playing Irelia is overfarming with Bladesurge.

But it's so fun! Irelia easily as the most satisfying farming in the game, except maybe Sion. Even if it's not good or efficient it's just that awesome.

EDIT:

What skill order? I've been going WQWE, though that's probably completely suboptimal.

I'd probably run something like EWQE from my limited experience with Xin. E would help you clear small camps even faster, and your W isn't really good until you have a cooldown to refresh.

[ZombyWoof]

With Xin I imagine it being EQWEEREQE etc.

[Dallas-Dakota]

Y'know, I've come to the conclusion that I'm a pretty good player, just a stupid/inattentive good player.

[Neftren]

But it's so fun! Irelia easily as the most satisfying farming in the game, except maybe Sion. Even if it's not good or efficient it's just that awesome.

Eh, I guess it's different when all you (I) ever play is Irelia (or to be more specific, if I want to win a game, I'll pick Irelia).


Y'know, I've come to the conclusion that I'm a pretty good player, just a stupid/inattentive good player.

Aren't those mutually exclusive things? A good player learns to not be stupid/inattentive...

[Daverin]

Although it seems several people on this board are not big fans of Elementz tier list, I still look at it just... because, I guess. At any rate, his site seems to be down, does anyone have any idea what happened?

[Eldariel]

Although it seems several people on this board are not big fans of Elementz tier list, I still look at it just... because, I guess. At any rate, his site seems to be down, does anyone have any idea what happened?

Nope. Nobody on the forums and no people on the CLG chat either. I'd wager he just forgot to pay for it monthly or something and it was taken down. As soon as he gets on he'll prolly make a statement about it somewhere. Or slam it back up. It's also plausible the server is effin' something up, in which case it should be fine with time.

[Arbitrarity]

QWEEE

Q helps clear early camps with better health, but I'm not sure it's needed. I suspect using W would be faster. Let's test it out. E burns too much mana, really.

Hm. Mini-test of W. Didn't check the time carefully, but it was probably a second or two faster. The difference is minimal, honestly.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

Characters (based on recent games) that I need to write guides for...

Nocturne
Vlad
AD Poppy
Cassiopeia
Malphite


Any particular interest in any of these, so I know where to start?

[pilvento]

Characters (based on recent games) that I need to write guides for...

Nocturne
Vlad
AD Poppy
Cassiopeia
Malphite


Any particular interest in any of these, so I know where to start?

Vlad please, i remember playing him in free weeks a long time ago and it was awesome, now that I own him I can really feel all his nerfs.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

Vlad please, i remember playing him in free weeks a long time ago and it was awesome, now that I own him I can really feel all his nerfs.

I'll write one up later tonight.

Strangely, if anything, I've gotten better with Vlad post-nerf. Can't explain it. Same with Twitch, and a bunch of other characters.

[Nargan]

Characters (based on recent games) that I need to write guides for...

Nocturne
Vlad
AD Poppy
Cassiopeia
Malphite


Any particular interest in any of these, so I know where to start?

Start with Malphite, he's the most interesting :smalltongue:

Also, with regards to Nu Alistar:


http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/3311/nualistar2.th.png (http://img193.imageshack.us/i/nualistar2.png/)
http://img852.imageshack.us/img852/9638/nualistar.th.png (http://img852.imageshack.us/i/nualistar.png/)


[img=http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/3311/nualistar2.th.png] (http://img193.imageshack.us/i/nualistar2.png/)
[img=http://img852.imageshack.us/img852/9638/nualistar.th.png] (http://img852.imageshack.us/i/nualistar.png/)

Not had so much fun in LoL games in a long time. Even when I was on my Ezreal spree, I didn't have this much fun, stomping around the map with mobility boots listening to 1812 Overture.

[Faulty]

Hmm... we need a mage player who can play nidalee. :smallwink:

Edit: Failing that, I can play Ashe (who has... good poke? She has good kiting at least) and we find a replacement tank/jungler. I'm not sure which I idea I like better... :smalltongue:

I am our mage player. :smalltongue:

[toasty]

I am our mage player. :smalltongue:

I prefer it when you play Ashe or Corki. :smallbiggrin:

[Faulty]

I prefer it when you play Ashe or Corki. :smallbiggrin:

But my Anivia and Sion and Akali and Kassadin and Twisted Fate are good. :(

[toasty]

But my Anivia and Sion and Akali and Kassadin and Twisted Fate are good. :(

I like Ashe better. Anivia is cool though. :smallsmile:

[Faulty]

I like Ashe better. Anivia is cool though. :smallsmile:

I see what you did there.

[ZombyWoof]

Characters (based on recent games) that I need to write guides for...

Nocturne
Vlad
AD Poppy
Cassiopeia
Malphite


Any particular interest in any of these, so I know where to start?
Please start with vlad, I am so annoyed that people don't know how to a) use trollpool or b) counter trollpool.

[toasty]

I see what you did there.

I did not even think about that, honestly.

[Dogmantra]

But my Anivia and Sion and Akali and Kassadin and Twisted Fate are good. :(

so is my tank teemo and you still don't want me to play him :((((((((((((((

[Qwertystop]

I see what you did there.

Both of them are :smallsmile:

[Maeglin_Dubh]

Characters (based on recent games) that I need to write guides for...

Nocturne
Vlad
AD Poppy
Cassiopeia
Malphite


Any particular interest in any of these, so I know where to start?

AD Poppy. I was originally taught AP, but I want to know if/how she bulds differently from most other carries.

[Eldariel]

Why is it that every game I play Jarvan, something stupid happens :smallfrown:

I've got 1 win and 5 horrible losses with him thus far; two of the losses involved a permanent DC on our team, the other 3 involved losing 3 lanes (with us having jungle and them not in one; just fair Losing All Lanes in another) and team's unwillingness to actually fight/do anything with or without initiation in the last one. It's just...how did he become a Trouble Magnet for me?

EDIT: Alright, seems I've finally gotten the curse lifted; played with a team where lanes weren't randomly dying all the time and even one with a Janna who knew how to counter Eve (pretty awesome). Then again, I played Jungle Jarvan that game so that may affect things. Iono. Btw, we had a Pirate. My impression of his ultimate seemed accurate; whenever I was able to CC someone for even a short period of time, the ultimate was devastatingly efficient. We also had an AP Kog, which of course works well with Jarvan so overall, our team was pretty damn synergistic.

[Faulty]

so is my tank teemo and you still don't want me to play him :((((((((((((((

That's because Teemo is a monster.

[Inhuman Bot]

Aren't those mutually exclusive things? A good player learns to not be stupid/inattentive...

Pretty much.

[Brother Oni]

Aren't those mutually exclusive things? A good player learns to not be stupid/inattentive...

It depends. I'm a competent player, but I have consistency issues.

Unless Dallas means he's good at being stupid/inattentive. :smalltongue:

[Silverraptor]

Characters (based on recent games) that I need to write guides for...

Nocturne
Vlad
AD Poppy
Cassiopeia
Malphite


Any particular interest in any of these, so I know where to start?

All Of Them! Do It! NOW!!!

[Winthur]

Hmm... we need a mage player who can play nidalee. :smallwink:

Edit: Failing that, I can play Ashe (who has... good poke? She has good kiting at least) and we find a replacement tank/jungler. I'm not sure which I idea I like better... :smalltongue:

Can't read the entire thread right now, but, ahem, ahem, AHEM! :smallwink:

[Math_Mage]

With Xin I imagine it being EQWEEREQE etc.


QWEEE

Q helps clear early camps with better health, but I'm not sure it's needed. I suspect using W would be faster. Let's test it out. E burns too much mana, really.

Hm. Mini-test of W. Didn't check the time carefully, but it was probably a second or two faster. The difference is minimal, honestly.

Hm. Analysis time.
Level Q first = get an extra attack (AA reset) and 45 dmg every 10 seconds
Level W first = get 0.13 attacks/second (about 2 extra attacks every 15 seconds; damage output varies depending on build) and an additional 0.13 attacks/second for 5 seconds
Level E first = get 70 AOE damage every 16 seconds

Q gives you the most damage against a camp with 1-2 targets you want to take down (small golems, blue buff)--unless you have some serious bonus attack damage, in which case W is your best bet (for example, if you're doing a Longsword clear of the mini-camps before going to golem, you can try W first). E is only good if you're starting by Smiting blue wraith.

At level 2, WQ maximizes your damage output on a single target. WE gives you minor AOE. QE is just bad.

However, E is still the skill you want to max first, much like Rammus' Taunt. So I would agree with Arb that QWEEE (or sometimes WQEEE) is the way to go strictly considering damage output. On the other hand, QWQEE is worth considering if you reach level 3 without blue buff, as E is a much bigger drain on Xin's mana than the other skills.

Stonewall hits level 5 at 5 minutes (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Jq1R090Uxg) doing a golems-to-Golem clear with Vamp Scepter start. I think a different route that achieves a little more speed with somewhat less sustainability is Longsword + HP pot, wolves-to-minis, back for Cloth Armor + pot, standard clear.


Although it seems several people on this board are not big fans of Elementz tier list, I still look at it just... because, I guess. At any rate, his site seems to be down, does anyone have any idea what happened?

Elementz claims it was hacked--at least, that's what I just saw on stream.


Characters (based on recent games) that I need to write guides for...

Nocturne
Vlad
AD Poppy
Cassiopeia
Malphite


Any particular interest in any of these, so I know where to start?

Poppy is definitely the guide I'm interested in. Of course, I'm a little biased, since I don't own any of the others except Malphite. But I don't understand why people want a Vlad guide. He's at least the second-easiest-to-use champion on the list, and I'm probably being unfair to Malphite.

[Dienekes]

Well, I've lost 9 out of my last 10 games and am always paired with ********s. Not noobs, I'm ok with noobs, we all suck some days, but jackasses are another matter.

I think it's time to put this game down for awhile.

[Faulty]

So I'm gonna be out of town for like 5 days. If I'm on LoL after before Tuesday evening (EST) then it's probably just me on my netbook using an RP card or fiddling with runes. My last game for the week was great though. I played kitty again and did really well. I taught a Trundle a lesson as to why you don't chase Nidalee, too. It was hilarious.

Lesson Part 1: I was solo pushing bot while everyone else skirmished mid. I got up to the inhib tower and Trundle came. He jumps at me and I heal myself before popping into cat form and taking him on. Things start going his way so I flash/ghost away. He starts chasing so I go human, chuck a spear at him and peel away some of his help. He keeps chasing, I go cat again, hit Q, turn around, pounce on him and hit him with a Q + Lich Bane proc that did like 500-600 damage and took him out instantly.

Lesson Part 2: Apparently bitter from the last engagement, next time we were alone he started chasing me. I was really hurt and ghosted. He popped ghost too. I managed to stay ahead of him barely using brush and pounce. I healed myself a few times. He chased me through a tower, and I just kept going. Next thing Lux and Karthus show up, and I turn around. We end up almost chasing him down before Karthus just ult kills him.

Troll got trolled.

[Neftren]

Well, I've lost 9 out of my last 10 games and am always paired with ********s. Not noobs, I'm ok with noobs, we all suck some days, but jackasses are another matter.

I think it's time to put this game down for awhile.

I take it you're solo queuing then? Have you tried hopping on Mumble to raise a few teammates?


For Anyone Curious...
If you see me on Mumble (generally sitting in Lounge or Lounge B) then I'm online and present, but sending me an invite or a message in client won't get my attention, since I'm probably logged in the client, but playing another game while waiting for an invite. If you need another player, or for some reason want me to play, send me a message on Steam (you can friend me via my sig), or physically come into my channel, and say something to me. If I don't respond after a minute or two, then I'm probably afk.

[Dogmantra]

Lesson Part 2: Apparently bitter from the last engagement, next time we were alone he started chasing me. I was really hurt and ghosted. He popped ghost too. I managed to stay ahead of him barely using brush and pounce. I healed myself a few times. He chased me through a tower, and I just kept going. Next thing Lux and Karthus show up, and I turn around. We end up almost chasing him down before Karthus just ult kills him.

Troll got trolled.

While he was doing this, I was sat there as the rest of his team came and 1v1ed me in order.

I was Lee Sin.
The Blind Monk.

[Zeful]

So random grievance:

Wards, why does nobody buy them? Seriously I play in games with you guys and almost none of you buy wards unless it's a Wriggle's. Why is this? They're cheap and in laning you only ever need two. This is worse for games where we are obviously being outmaneuvered and wards would fix that issue by allowing us to outmaneuver them.

[toasty]

So random grievance:

Wards, why does nobody buy them? Seriously I play in games with you guys and almost none of you buy wards unless it's a Wriggle's. Why is this? They're cheap and in laning you only ever need two. This is worse for games where we are obviously being outmaneuvered and wards would fix that issue by allowing us to outmaneuver them.

I buy wards. :smallsigh:

Of course, I don't really ever play with you Zeful. :smalltongue:

[Volatar]

So random grievance:

Wards, why does nobody buy them? Seriously I play in games with you guys and almost none of you buy wards unless it's a Wriggle's. Why is this? They're cheap and in laning you only ever need two. This is worse for games where we are obviously being outmaneuvered and wards would fix that issue by allowing us to outmaneuver them.

I buy wards every single game. Even when I am playing Annie or Ashe, I spam wards. No one else seems to buy them in a lot of games. It makes me sad :smallfrown:

[Neftren]

I buy wards every single game. Even when I am playing Annie or Ashe, I spam wards. No one else seems to buy them in a lot of games. It makes me sad :smallfrown:

I buy wards if I can afford it on the first trip back after getting Sheen (and Boots). I also buy wards to ward baron after I hit level 15 or so, depending on whether or not other people are buying them. I still haven't decided whether the extra jungle wards really help all that much. Certain places are great to ward, but I think it really comes down to whether you're ahead or behind.

[Arcanoi]

So random grievance:

Wards, why does nobody buy them? Seriously I play in games with you guys and almost none of you buy wards unless it's a Wriggle's. Why is this? They're cheap and in laning you only ever need two. This is worse for games where we are obviously being outmaneuvered and wards would fix that issue by allowing us to outmaneuver them.

I buy wards when I feed super tryhard. I am rarely super tryhard.

[Volatar]

Certain places are great to ward, but I think it really comes down to whether you're ahead or behind.

Wrong. Wards are always good in any situation. Winning or losing.

[Inhuman Bot]

Vlad please, i remember playing him in free weeks a long time ago and it was awesome, now that I own him I can really feel all his nerfs.

Vlad guide;

build ap

qqeeqqeeqqqqqqqqqrqqqqqqqwqqqq

- From, the best Vlad player on this forum. :smalltongue:



I buy wards every single game. Even when I am playing Annie or Ashe, I spam wards. No one else seems to buy them in a lot of games. It makes me sad :smallfrown:


The problem with LoL Vs DotA/HoN is, there's no real support characters aside from Janna. Janna's core items are wards, though.

[Math_Mage]

I buy wards if I can afford it on the first trip back after getting Sheen (and Boots). I also buy wards to ward baron after I hit level 15 or so, depending on whether or not other people are buying them. I still haven't decided whether the extra jungle wards really help all that much. Certain places are great to ward, but I think it really comes down to whether you're ahead or behind.

Whether you're ahead or behind changes the appropriate ward locations, but doesn't change the fact that there should be wards down besides dragon/baron.

[Mtg_player_zach]

I tend to buy wards more or less depending on who I am playing and the situation. Depends on enemy team comp as well. If they have no jungler and I'm mid, I don't need to buy wards really. Paying attention to your own position and other lanes while listening for mia calls is effective. If they have a jungler I usually ward their red side bush when I'm pushed. If the enemy is being aggressive and playing at my tower I'll buy a ward and only place it when I'm pushed. If I'm not pushed and overextended they can't really gank me and the ward is unnecessary. So in summary, yes buying wards is good. But placing them intelligently is also key. Holding them in inventory until you need them is smarter than buying them ever 3 minutes.

[toasty]

I buy wards if I can afford it on the first trip back after getting Sheen (and Boots). I also buy wards to ward baron after I hit level 15 or so, depending on whether or not other people are buying them. I still haven't decided whether the extra jungle wards really help all that much. Certain places are great to ward, but I think it really comes down to whether you're ahead or behind.

Wards in the enemy jungle are good at different times in the game. Basic river wards are good, but later in the game there are other positions to put them (entrance to baron, etc). Early game a ward at golem right before it respawns means you can gank their jungler and kill him, its very rewarding when that works. :smallbiggrin:


The problem with LoL Vs DotA/HoN is, there's no real support characters aside from Janna. Janna's core items are wards, though.

Lies. If Soraka, Sona and Karma are not support I don't know what they are. They are BAD support, but they are support. Taric is basically a support hero/aura bot. Zilean is played as a support hero (he has his ult, after all). Alistair isn't exactly support, but i mean, he has a heal that is pretty good in the lane and if Janna is all about positioning and defensive disables, then alistair is the opposite: offensive abilities that put the enemy in a good position to attack, rather than run away.. Just unlike most tanks he doesn't have much real damage. (Consider Shen and Amumu, they actually have some damage)

[Math_Mage]

Vlad guide;

build ap

qqeeqqeeqqqqqqqqqrqqqqqqqwqqqq

- From, the best Vlad player on this forum. :smalltongue:

Careful there, we've got a number of players on the forum who would dispute that statement. :smallwink:


The problem with LoL Vs DotA/HoN is, there's no real support characters aside from Janna. Janna's core items are wards, though.

Soraka, Sona, Taric, Karma, Zilean? How are you defining a support to exclude these guys?

[Suedars]

I keep seeing people referencing that Shen does good damage for a tank. Whenever I play him I do minimal damage. How are people building him? I normally just get a bunch of defensive items. Should I be building some damage in on him too?

[Math_Mage]

I keep seeing people referencing that Shen does good damage for a tank. Whenever I play him I do minimal damage. How are people building him? I normally just get a bunch of defensive items. Should I be building some damage in on him too?

Sunfire Cape is core, and does solid sustained DPS; that combined with Ki Strike and Vorpal Blade gives him surprisingly good damage in a fight. A late Madred's Bloodrazor or Atma's Impaler does wonders for his offense, without really hurting his tankiness.

[toasty]

I keep seeing people referencing that Shen does good damage for a tank. Whenever I play him I do minimal damage. How are people building him? I normally just get a bunch of defensive items. Should I be building some damage in on him too?

Well you can get some offesnive items, but my current build is this:

Boots+3 health pots
Aegis
Heart of Gold
Sunfires/Force of Nature (built interchangeably)

I've considered getting a Wriggles in there for split push shenanigans, I admit. :smalltongue:

Here is the thing. With a sunfire cape, and your passive, plus ki strike, you're hitting for a lot in terms of single target burst. 40 damage a second+ki strike+passive that builds off of health? Yeah, you'll do a lot of damage.

Or you could build AP and see how that works. its a quirky build that should work, but its suboptimal, obviously.

I know Eld gets a Bloodrazor as a final item on Shen, it makes sense, sorta. :smallbiggrin: I'd rather get a starks or Frozen Mallet.

[TechnOkami]

...what's a good strategy to playing as Renekton? I really want to be better with him, but I think I'm playing him wrong. My build is solid, it's how to play him which is what I'm really looking for.

[Math_Mage]

...what's a good strategy to playing as Renekton? I really want to be better with him, but I think I'm playing him wrong. My build is solid, it's how to play him which is what I'm really looking for.

Slice in, stun, spin, Dice out or to kill. Ult if you're in danger of dying. Youmuu's-Sunfire is core on him.

There isn't that much to playing any given champion. A few tips and tricks, maybe, but beyond that it's just a matter of being used to handling your champion and understanding where he fits in the team. In this case, Renekton's a solo top laner who wins his lane, farmfarmfarms, and comes down to beast teamfights when needed.

[TechnOkami]

Slice in, stun, spin, Dice out or to kill. Ult if you're in danger of dying. Youmuu's-Sunfire is core on him.

There isn't that much to playing any given champion. A few tips and tricks, maybe, but beyond that it's just a matter of being used to handling your champion and understanding where he fits in the team. In this case, Renekton's a solo top laner who wins his lane, farmfarmfarms, and comes down to beast teamfights when needed.

I also heard he was somewhat of a tanky dps, with emphasis on the dps I believe. Of course, when I played as him during one of my matches, I was targeted and taken out first. Amusingly, everyone focusing on me enabled the rest of my team to kill them. This happened at least 7 times. :smallsigh:

[Math_Mage]

I also heard he was somewhat of a tanky dps, with emphasis on the dps I believe. Of course, when I played as him during one of my matches, I was targeted and taken out first. Amusingly, everyone focusing on me enabled the rest of my team to kill them. This happened at least 7 times. :smallsigh:

The more they focus you, the more tanky you build. Even Warmog's isn't out of the question; but, say, Ghostblade-Sunfire-Mallet-Veil-Atma's would be a solid complete build if you're getting focused.

Guardsman Bob plays Renekton sometimes on stream, and he's pretty solid. He also plays like 90% tanky DPS in general, so you can learn even if he's not playing Renekton.

[TechnOkami]

The more they focus you, the more tanky you build. Even Warmog's isn't out of the question; but, say, Ghostblade-Sunfire-Mallet-Veil-Atma's would be a solid complete build if you're getting focused.

Guardsman Bob plays Renekton sometimes on stream, and he's pretty solid. He also plays like 90% tanky DPS in general, so you can learn even if he's not playing Renekton.

Interesting. I'll have to follow him around as Mundo (the character I'm best with so far) when he plays Renekton. I could learn a thing or twelve.

P.S. I discovered that Mumble makes League of Legends lag for me. Therefore if I'm gonna play with anyone, I'll do it solely through League of Legends. I'll sign out before the fight begins and sign back in when we're done.

[Daverin]

I daresay, you were either doing it VERY right, or your opponents were all doing it VERY wrong! :smalltongue:

Although to be fair, there is something to Renekton's gameplay style that I think other offtanks, and even certain tanks, lack; the sheer "in your face"ness of him. Sure, tanks and tanky dps, for the most part, will be up there in melee (since so many are, of course, melee! :P) But Renekton has something to him. Between low cooldowns, a simple in your face aoe that does small healing, a double dash, and an avatar that makes him look uber, Renekton just acts like someone who you cannot ignore, acting in a way that you would expect someone who could rip you to shreds if left unattended would act (it also helps that, as I understand it, he IS one of the higher dps of the tanky dps champs.) Now, I am sure that pro players can get past this, but I think that the average player, like myself, is going to be hit by a small game of psychological warfare by that, and not want to have to deal with what looks so threatening.

... This, or I have one massive case of Renekton fanboyism! :smallbiggrin:

Also, def looking forward to playing Alistar this weekend.

[TechnOkami]

That's... pretty much the reason I bought him. :smallbiggrin:

Although, when we get to who I enjoy playing the most/do the best with, by far it's Dr. Mundo. I'm sad about his nerfed cleavers, but overall it affected me very little.

[Silverraptor]

I like Brand.
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt255/silverraptor_photo/Screenshots/024.png

I got legendary that game. What is this?! I NEVER GET LEGENDARY IN GAMES?!:smalleek: This is an increadibly new and... good feeling. So this is what it feels like to play a carry.:smallbiggrin:

[Math_Mage]

TSM vs. HKEGG (http://solomid.net/livestream.php?s=34046#33356:SoloMid.LoL) scrim happening now.

Bans: Ryze Zilean Blitz Shen Nunu Alistar
TSM: Janna / Malzahar Jarvan / Warwick Ashe
HK: Irelia Nocturne / Taric Corki / Twisted Fate

Feels pretty even. I might give the advantage to HK slightly, because it feels like TSM's lineup is a little gank-vulnerable, and HK has two gank ults plus a roaming Taric stun.

EDIT: Soooo frustrating when the stream lags but the audio doesn't.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

So this is what it feels like to play a carry.:smallbiggrin:

Correction...that is what it feels like to play a carry and be awesome.

Also, if we apply the kill counter...I was GODLIKE, but on buildings. :smallbiggrin:

[toasty]

Most hilarious idea ever:

Play shen against nocturne. Rush QSS. Noc ults. QSS+Ult = trollface. :smalltongue:

[Arbitrarity]

Most hilarious idea ever:

Play shen against nocturne. Rush QSS. Noc ults. QSS+Ult = trollface. :smalltongue:

Or get BV. It gets popped by Noct ult, but blocks it.

[Dallas-Dakota]

Aren't those mutually exclusive things? A good player learns to not be stupid/inattentive...
Not really, I'l be awesome, and then make some form of stupid mistake which ends up with Djinn, Seyruun or somebody yelling at me because I gave them a killing spree bonus or ruined a team combat.:smalleek::smallfrown:

I don't mind though, because if they yell at me, it usually means I HAVE done something pretty stupid. ><

It's just so hard continually being awesome.:smalltongue:



Unless Dallas means he's good at being stupid/inattentive. :smalltongue:

That too:smalltongue:

[Legoshrimp]

Or get BV. It gets popped by Noct ult, but blocks it.

And doesn't involve rushing a QSS :smalltongue:

[ZombyWoof]

I keep seeing people referencing that Shen does good damage for a tank. Whenever I play him I do minimal damage. How are people building him? I normally just get a bunch of defensive items. Should I be building some damage in on him too?
The trick to Shen's damage is this:

Your passive is awesome. Like five kinds of awesome. It adds like 300 damage to your autoattack... which already deals 100 damage! "But Woof," you say, "it only trigers every few seconds!" It triggers faster if they're autoattacking you. And how can we get them to autoattack you? Well if they're Ashe they're screwed unless they have their +speed item. If they're Miss Fortune they're just screwed. But what if they're Annie? Simple! *someone* gave Shen a taunt!

Honestly Shen beast modes with Merc's, Sunfire, and FoN. That is, imo, the core of your Shen build. Aegis is also pretty blooming amazing but it isn't any more or less amazing on Shen than it is on anyone else. Frankly, those four items are non-negotiable in my Shen builds. They give you everything you need: a bonus 700 HP (you're SHEN), a bonus 120 MR and a bonus 80 AR.

This gives you two items to play around with. I know people say "tank items are situational!" but I will be very honest with you: I have found very little reason to think there is a set of items that is better than Atma's/Warmog's. Sometimes if they're very heavy on the magic burst I will go Banshee's/Atma's instead, and I can see Banshee's/Wit's End being good. If they're heavy on AD I will gladly go Atma's/Randuin's. Sometimes if I'm feeling spunky I'll get a Frozen Mallet with the Atma's since it's even MORE damage than Warmog's.

But really Atma's and Warmog's are catch-alls for what you need Shen to do: beast mode. He needs to be the guy they can't kill, and the guy who's going to bash their face in all at once. They need to see you dive into a fight and think, "Ah, crap. We're gonna get aced." They need to know that when you're walking away if they even THINK about chasing you'll turn around and stick your swords where the sun don't shine.

And let's think about it: Shen has built-in protection from bursty champions. He has a 1.5 second taunt as well as his shield ability which can block some of the burst. He also, with Warmog's, has an extra 1400 HP, and against bursty champions bonus HP is just awesome. Especially when that 1400 HP translates to 28 more attack damage (from Atma's) and 49 more damage from your passive.

Oh and there's nothing funnier than leaving from a teamfight to split push and find that you're back to full health by the time you get to the next lane XD

[Math_Mage]

HK's globals carried the day. On to game 2. I feel like The Rain Man doesn't fit on TSM personality-wise; he needs a team where he can call the shots, and Regi isn't going to let him do that, so there's infighting.

Game 2 Bans: Shen Ryze Alistar Blitzcrank Taric Zilean
HK: Nunu / Corki Malzahar / Singed Evelynn
TSM: TF Nocturne / Jarvan Ashe / Taric

Huh. Well, anyone who gets caught is pretty much dead. Both teams have a lot of damage. I feel HK has more burst, however. That's going to make 4v5 tower defense difficult, which may limit TF's split push. Interesting matchup.

EDIT: I don't know what happened, but they called off this match. TSM won't be using Rain Man in the tourney, either.

[Arcanoi]

Chaox, voice of reason. Rainman, voice of Rainman.

EDIT: Also, I called that Ashe pick by TSM so hard. I am now a high-ELO player. Clearly.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

Mario and/or Raven...mind PMing me the location of the mac client for LoL? My PC side just up and died completely, and I had to remove the partition.

[Inhuman Bot]

Careful there, we've got a number of players on the forum who would dispute that statement. :smallwink:


I'm going to be blunt and say that I'm way better then most people give me credit for. :colbert:




Soraka, Sona, Taric, Karma, Zilean? How are you defining a support to exclude these guys?

They need items before they can be vaguely effective. Janna isn't so item dependent.

[Astrella]

They need items before they can be vaguely effective. Janna isn't so item dependent.

Zilean and Taric are about as item dependent as Janna. They all really want max CDR as soon as possible though.

[Spartacus]

So it turns out when I play Teemo, I only ever get surprised by enemies pre-level 6.

I love my wards-that-kill-people. My kills-while-dead in the last game was 3. All were the enemy Ashe.

[Nargan]

So it turns out when I play Teemo, I only ever get surprised by enemies pre-level 6.

I love my wards-that-kill-people. My kills-while-dead in the last game was 3. All were the enemy Ashe.

It's Karthus free week. You should play him.

Even if I do terribly, I always enjoy it, just because of trollface ult, kill people, and annoy them to hell.

I'm a terrible person ^.^

[Eldariel]

Or you could build AP and see how that works. its a quirky build that should work, but its suboptimal, obviously.

I know Eld gets a Bloodrazor as a final item on Shen, it makes sense, sorta. :smallbiggrin: I'd rather get a starks or Frozen Mallet.

I actually tend to build Bloodrazor third. I've tried Stark's and Frozen Mallet but the amount of damage isn't on the same planet as BR; also, BR does mostly magical damage which enables Voidstaff if enemy is stacking MR (since Ki Strike, Vorpal Blade and Sunfire are all magical sources anyways). You can, of course, build him Tanky DPS with just one-two dedicated defense items and rest stuff like Wit's End, Frozen Mallet and BR. That works too.

But yeah, much of his damage is Ki Strike; just keep attacking. Especially in big fights where you taunt multiple opponents, Ki Strike is up constantly. You can cause a whole lot of pain with it.

[Master_Rahl22]

@Silverraptor: What was the order you bought those items? Rylai's, Zhonya, Boots, Abyssal, Deathcap, BV was the final build, I'm just curious which came first. I've been looking for a good Brand guide but haven't been happy with what I've found. I feel like he could really use a rushed Tear into Archangels, and a quick Catalyst into Rod of Ages or BV would help with his squishiness.

[Faulty]

For Brand I'd suggest something like:

Blue Crystal + pots
Catalyst
Sorc's Shoes
Rylai's
Deathcap
BVeil
Void Staff

Catalyst gives strong laning, Sorc's Shoes syncs with his passive, Rylai's is good on him, then Deathcap for AP boost, BVeil for survivability, and Void Staff for MPen because his ratios suck and his passive scales off MPen.

[Neftren]

Mario and/or Raven...mind PMing me the location of the mac client for LoL? My PC side just up and died completely, and I had to remove the partition.

What went wrong with your Windows Partition? Mayhaps I can helpeth thou fixeth thy problemme?

[Master_Rahl22]

For Brand I'd suggest something like:

Blue Crystal + pots
Catalyst
Sorc's Shoes
Rylai's
Deathcap
BVeil
Void Staff

Catalyst gives strong laning, Sorc's Shoes syncs with his passive, Rylai's is good on him, then Deathcap for AP boost, BVeil for survivability, and Void Staff for MPen because his ratios suck and his passive scales off MPen.

I'll give these a try, but first I'm a bit confused. .65, .6, .55, and .5 AP ratios for Brand's abilities suck? Assuming you use all 4 abilities, each point of AP gives you 2.3 damage. What kind of AP ratios wouldn't suck?

Also, it seems like Spell Vamp might be handy on him slinging that much damage around, especially since Blaze damage procs it. If I were to replace one of those items with a Will of the Ancients which would it be?

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

What went wrong with your Windows Partition? Mayhaps I can helpeth thou fixeth thy problemme?

Doubtful, as I removed it.

However, I was BSOD'ing every time I booted up, even in safe mode. There was a corrupt registry error, and, without an actual windows disc to run repair from, there wasn't much I could do.

[Dogmantra]

And doesn't involve rushing a QSS :smalltongue:

Rushing a Quicksilver Sash is always the best strategy.
On anyone.

Ever.

[Faulty]

So Riot will be revisiting Gangplank's new kit soon to spruce it up a bit more. (http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?p=8340356#post8340356)


I'll give these a try, but first I'm a bit confused. .65, .6, .55, and .5 AP ratios for Brand's abilities suck? Assuming you use all 4 abilities, each point of AP gives you 2.3 damage. What kind of AP ratios wouldn't suck?

Also, it seems like Spell Vamp might be handy on him slinging that much damage around, especially since Blaze damage procs it. If I were to replace one of those items with a Will of the Ancients which would it be?

Those are terrible ratios. Compare to:

Sion: two 1:1 AP ratios
Malzahar: two .8 AP ratios and a 1.5 AP ratio
Kassadin: two .7 AP ratios and a .5 AP ratio on his ult that deals increased damage everytime it's cast in succession
Ezreal: a .2, .7, .75 and .9 AP ratio
Anivia: two AoEs with CC attatched at .5 and .25 ratios and an effective 1.0 AP ratio on her E


Anyway, I'd suggest a WotA after all of those, or maybe in place of a Void Staff if they have no MR (which is unlikely). All those items are just way useful and he reeeeeeeally wants to maximize his early damage, esp. his MPen or else he slides into irrelevency as the game passes 30 mins. He's like Annie in that respect, but with worse CC.

[Penguinizer]

Yay GP buffs. :smallbiggrin:

I don't think the problem is in his teamfighting, but his laning phase. It could use a minor buff with the removal of the laning capability denying gave him. The removal of that hurt his laning a lot. His damage as it stands isn't bad.

[Dogmantra]

Those are terrible ratios. Compare to:
Sion: two 1:1 AP ratios

(except that if you add all of the ratios together Sion has less AP > damage and also more single target damage, comparing ratios isn't fair as the only comparison)

[Neftren]

Doubtful, as I removed it.

However, I was BSOD'ing every time I booted up, even in safe mode. There was a corrupt registry error, and, without an actual windows disc to run repair from, there wasn't much I could do.

Ah, well, that sucks. Also, Safe Mode does nothing. You need to boot in 'Last Known Good Configuration' or use the internal repair option.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

Ah, well, that sucks. Also, Safe Mode does nothing. You need to boot in 'Last Known Good Configuration' or use the internal repair option.

Safemode, in my experience, has saved me from virus-related BSODs before.

Last Known Good Configuration crashed everything as well. :smallbiggrin:

[Silverraptor]

@Silverraptor: What was the order you bought those items? Rylai's, Zhonya, Boots, Abyssal, Deathcap, BV was the final build, I'm just curious which came first. I've been looking for a good Brand guide but haven't been happy with what I've found. I feel like he could really use a rushed Tear into Archangels, and a quick Catalyst into Rod of Ages or BV would help with his squishiness.

How I built him that game is Doran's Ring, Rylai's/Boots (Whichever compenents I could afford each time I backed.), Abyssal (Since they were mainly magic damage. Probably would've gotten void staff after deathcap if that wasn't the case.), Deathcap, BV, and then I finally sold my ring for the Hourglass. I tend to move my active items over to "2" because W was the skill I use the most when playing champions who like hourglass.

And that was my first time playing Brand, but I don't think spell vamp is what you need. He's a ranged type caster, very similar to Lux, and you want to be behind your meatshields and not get caught in the first place.

[Astrella]

And that was my first time playing Brand, but I don't think spell vamp is what you need. He's a ranged type caster, very similar to Lux, and you want to be behind your meatshields and not get caught in the first place.

Well, the point is that's he's far shorter ranged then Lux, so he needs some sustainability to survive teamfights.

On another note, I've been really fond of Maokai lately. I've been running him like this:

Skills:
WEQ then R > W > Q > E

Items:
Doran's Ring
Boots
Catalyst
Merc Threads
Sheen
Rod Of Ages
Sunfire Cape
Lichebane
Banshees Veil

Any remarks, comments?

[Dogmantra]

Any remarks, comments?

If you can, get more AP. Abyssal, Hourglass, Hat if you can afford to. You want to be as squishy as you can get away with just to maximise your damage potential.

(also I know I've mentioned this before, I prefer maxing Arcane Smash, apart from anything else it lets you farm really nicely)

[Volatar]

Doubtful, as I removed it.

However, I was BSOD'ing every time I booted up, even in safe mode. There was a corrupt registry error, and, without an actual windows disc to run repair from, there wasn't much I could do.

If you still have the license key I can get you a disc legally.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

If you still have the license key I can get you a disc legally.

Sadly, I misplaced that long ago. I'll let you know if I find it again (it's written down somewhere), but, in the meantime, I'll just live without Bootcamp. League was pretty much the only reason I booted into Windows, and, thanks to Neftren (Mario, your link was dead, but I appreciate the effort), I should have that working in Mac now.

[Inhuman Bot]

http://lol.zone.gamebase.com.tw/zone/lol/skin_view/mordekaiser_destroyer#mordekaiser_destroyer

Lordekaiser's ingame model is sort of neat.

[toasty]

I'm going to go ahead and say that Jungle alistair is freaking OP as hell. Your ganks are INSANE.

[Joran]

I'm going to go ahead and say that Jungle alistair is freaking OP as hell. Your ganks are INSANE.

Any tips for Jungle Alistar?

I played Lane Cow for awhile and enjoy the heck out of my favorite bovine. I played him back before Elementz had a tier list and was considered the best tank in the game, then garbage, then back to best roamer in the game.

[toasty]

Any tips for Jungle Alistar?

Hmm... I play him with my Jungle Runesheet (you're friends with me on LoL, right? Its called... Jungle). Standard route. I start with my heal because it has the lowest cooldown. 5 Health Pots and Cloth Armor, smite at Blue, Wraiths (IIRC), Lizard. Route is Blue, Wolves, Wraiths, Golems, Lizard. Recall after red, gank wherever.

Counter-jungling, I haven't tried, he would probably be not amazingly strong since he doesn't have the damage output of Nunu or Olaf and he isn't as sticky as Warwick, Shaco or Nunu, but I did steal blue and kill olaf when olaf was stupid because he tried to do his blue without his smite up, and then didn't run away when I smite stole it. :smallbiggrin:

I also find that in a teamfight Alistair is best as a secondary initiator. Like, If you can have Ashe start a team fight and then you follow it up with a stun+headbutt in the enemy carry thats soooo strong.

I want to experiment build Off-tanky/AP. I really feel frozen heart is a great item for alistair for CDR, but I want to see how getting, say, a Hourglass and Scepter (hourglass+ult = ultimate trollface) works.

Or you could follow stonewall:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sFmAhLDjMKk

[Neftren]

Sadly, I misplaced that long ago. I'll let you know if I find it again (it's written down somewhere), but, in the meantime, I'll just live without Bootcamp. League was pretty much the only reason I booted into Windows, and, thanks to Neftren (Mario, your link was dead, but I appreciate the effort), I should have that working in Mac now.

If you need to activate Windows, I can help you with that. *Cough*

League of Legends working for you? Drop me a PM if you have any more issues, or if you want/need help with Windows again. :smallbiggrin:

[Nargan]

So: a new "game".

You know you play League of Legends too much when: (I'll start)

You have the following chain of thought:

-Learning about event horizon's in physics.
-VEIGAR!
-I wonder if I should play him
-Nah, alistar
-That game yesterday, though....so many feeders
-Maybe league of legends is like life?
-Don't try too hard, or you'll fail and feed them
-Who's "them"?
-Humanoids. Curse them.

(This actually happened)

[toasty]

I know I have a minor addiction to this game when its basically all I think about. Everyone goes back to LoL, everyday, all day.

[Winthur]

http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/5136/rankedendurance.jpg (http://img140.imageshack.us/i/rankedendurance.jpg/)

Tristana Falls In The Last Teamfight feat. Seyruun, Her Loyal Protector Who In The End Failed On His Post (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AKlhcJvSvU8&feature=related)

(559 CS PEOPLE! 559 CS ON TRISTANA! :smalleek:)

[Math_Mage]

There are so many 4800/6300 champions I want...and then there are Karma/Sona, who are the only champions from 3150-or-below that I haven't bought yet but am still interested in. I know their basic roles, playstyle, and rough competitive viability. I'm interested in seeing:
-Which the community has found more fun to play
-Which the community would rather see me play with them in games

(If you want to see me play with you in games--I mean, it's like I go into failure mode whenever I 5-queue with GitPers...argh, so frustrating.)

[toasty]

@Math:

Play what you are good at, but play good heroes, says I. That is to say, if you like mages, play Sion, Annie, Karthus, Ryze, Vlad, Anivia. If you like Carries play Ashe and Corki. If you like tanks play Maokai, Amumu, Shen, Jarvan, Alistair. If you like Support play Taric, Janna, Zilean. If you like Tanky DPS play Jarvan, Renekton, Trundle, Olaf, Warwick.

Thats a lot of heroes, and I'm leaving out good ones. But they all are awesome.

[Dogmantra]

@Math:

Play what you are good at, but play good heroes, says I.
(note that this doesn't specify you have to build them well, go go AP Lanewick!)

[Joran]

So: a new "game".

You know you play League of Legends too much when: (I'll start)

You have the following chain of thought:

-Learning about event horizon's in physics.
-VEIGAR!
-I wonder if I should play him
-Nah, alistar
-That game yesterday, though....so many feeders
-Maybe league of legends is like life?
-Don't try too hard, or you'll fail and feed them
-Who's "them"?
-Humanoids. Curse them.

(This actually happened)

When I start playing with my daughter, I say in a really bad, squeaky Annie voice, "Ya wanna play too? It'll be fun!"

Whenever someone says the word "shoot", I say in another really bad Tristana voice "I wanna shoot something!"

Whenever asks me to do something, I say "Ok" in my best Rammus voice.

My daughter's middle name is Xin...

[Inhuman Bot]

(except that if you add all of the ratios together Sion has less AP > damage and also more single target damage, comparing ratios isn't fair as the only comparison)

It doesn't work by just adding ratios together, though. Brand has to factor MR more.

[Math_Mage]

It doesn't work by just adding ratios together, though. Brand has to factor MR more.

Why? I don't see any mechanics that lead to that conclusion.

[Eldariel]

Those are terrible ratios. Compare to:

Anivia: two AoEs with CC attatched at .5 and .25 ratios and an effective 1.0 AP ratio on her E


Actually, Q hits twice; it's effective 1.0 also. Anivia has two 1.0s and a constant damage .25 (effectively at least .5) so at least 2.5; constant damage effects always scale a bit differently since they're expected to hit multiple times.

[Nargan]

When I start playing with my daughter, I say in a really bad, squeaky Annie voice, "Ya wanna play too? It'll be fun!"

Whenever someone says the word "shoot", I say in another really bad Tristana voice "I wanna shoot something!"

Whenever asks me to do something, I say "Ok" in my best Rammus voice.

My daughter's middle name is Xin...

I think you may have me beaten.

[Suedars]

Why? I don't see any mechanics that lead to that conclusion.

It should be the same since MR functions as a % reduction rather than a flat reduction. If your opponent has 25% reduction and you're dealing 500 magic damage you'll deal 375 regardless of whether that comes from 2 skills or 4. It would matter if MR just subtracted itself from damage dealt (like armor in SC2 for example), since -25 damage would have the 2 skills dealing 450 but the 4 dealing 400.

Actually I suppose Brand does get hit a bit harder than Sion by MR since he'll be doing more damage thanks to his better AP ratios, so will have more damage to be reduced, but he's still doing more damage anyways.

[Arbitrarity]

It should be the same since MR functions as a % reduction rather than a flat reduction. If your opponent has 25% reduction and you're dealing 500 magic damage you'll deal 375 regardless of whether that comes from 2 skills or 4. It would matter if MR just subtracted itself from damage dealt (like armor in SC2 for example), since -25 damage would have the 2 skills dealing 450 but the 4 dealing 400.

Actually I suppose Brand does get hit a bit harder than Sion by MR since he'll be doing more damage thanks to his better AP ratios, so will have more damage to be reduced, but he's still doing more damage anyways.

Sion's two-spell (no ult) combo does a combined 2.0 ratio, the same as Brand landing EWQ, and stuns similarly.
However, it does not rely on landing a slow skillshot line that hits a single target for a third of its damage and stun.

[Penguinizer]

Kayle is a ton of fun. Although imagining how she would look holding all the items in her build is hilarious.

Boots (Zerkers or Mercs), Rageblade, Nashor's Tooth, 3 Gunblades. Masteries are at 9/0/21 (and CDR blues) so I hit 40% CDR with just Nashor's.

[ZombyWoof]

Why? I don't see any mechanics that lead to that conclusion.

His passive deals magic damage and isn't based off of damage ratios would be my guess. It's just like why a lot of Warwick builds call for sorc's boots: even though he's not building AP, most of his damage comes from hungering strike, infinite duress, and madred's bloodrazors all of which are magic damage.

EDIT: The first time I ever played Kayle with my friend his comment after was, "I didn't know she was a carry, I thought she was support!" :smallbiggrin::smalltongue:

[Suedars]

Sion's two-spell (no ult) combo does a combined 2.0 ratio, the same as Brand landing EWQ, and stuns similarly.
However, it does not rely on landing a slow skillshot line that hits a single target for a third of its damage and stun.

And Sion can get stunned/silenced and have his shield popped before it fires off.

Both have their flaws, but off the raw numbers Brand scales better off of AP regardless of MR.

[ZombyWoof]

Can someone pop me a quick Jungle Akali guide? I want to start playing that.

[Faulty]

(except that if you add all of the ratios together Sion has less AP > damage and also more single target damage, comparing ratios isn't fair as the only comparison)

I'm just saying that there are better ratios.


I know I have a minor addiction to this game when its basically all I think about. Everyone goes back to LoL, everyday, all day.

Yeah I think about it a lot too. @_@ Basically what are better builds and runes I could use, who to buy, what characters make a good comp, how I can improve my game, etc.

On a related note I now have 9 rune pages. An attack speed carry, a magic resist carry, an armor carry, a CDR mage, an AP mage, a magic pen tanky, an armor pen tanky, an Akali and a rolling page that I change based on whatever niche thing I'm into (at present it's a Nidalee page).


Actually, Q hits twice; it's effective 1.0 also. Anivia has two 1.0s and a constant damage .25 (effectively at least .5) so at least 2.5; constant damage effects always scale a bit differently since they're expected to hit multiple times.

Derp, of course. My Anivia-fu is weak.

I actually once hit someone three times with it. A Nidalee was running from me, I launched a Q, it hit her, she pounces ahead of it, it hits her again, and then hits her a third time with the explosion. I lol'd. Got a flash frost off, too.