LGBTAI+ 51: Lay That Hammer Down!

[Jaycemonde]

Title courtesy of SiuiS, since nobody else suggested one (that I saw).


Hello, hello, welcome, one and all, to the Fifty-First(!) iteration of our thread, the humble LGBTAI in the playground thread!

Notice: This is mostly a support thread. There is an LGBTAI+ Q&A Thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?356522-LGBTAI-Questions-Information-and-Discussion-thread!) right here.

The AI is for All-Inclusive, because we have only so much space but everyone, regardless of orientation, direction, letter, acronym or chosen astrological symbol is welcome here!

We do, unfortunately, have a few rules. We are not an anarchical state! Or, we weren't until they voted we were? But shush.

1. We are primarily a support thread.
This means that the primary focus should be in helping people here feel better; about themselves, about their lives, about their problems. We are also an education thread, but when helping someone learn involves not supporting, we will default to support - Mostly. We are only mostly human, after all.

All of the other rules are basically precisions of rule #1.

2. If you want answers to triggering topics, spoiler-box or ask them privately.
Triggering topics are those which are likely to make other people feel bad, in any way whatsoever: for instance, rape, violence, bullying and many others may be triggering to some people. If someone, even just that one individual person, has a problem with a topic because it stirs demons best left in their pit, Do. Not. Bring. It. Up. Publically. Use a spoilerbox, and think carefully about whether this is the place to broach the topic at all (see rule #1: "We are primarily a support thread.")

If you have questions or need help on something that involves triggering topics, please use spoiler tags and label your spoilers for trigger warnings. When in doubt, put trigger warnings.

3. Avoid discussing politics or religion.
It doesn't matter how much these two topics intersect with our forum topic, they are verboten. Sometimes, hints are... Looked over, such as "man, in my countery being gay sucks", but detail is right out, and even that could be considered willful disregard. Be Careful. As the moderators themselves often say, if you aren't sure, Don't.

4. Do not discuss moral justification.
No one here is going to discuss whether or not it's Right" or "Okay" to be LGBTAEIOUsometimesY or anything else. It's not topical, it's not relevant. We are, and we are here to cope with that and with the stresses it causes.
And no, my joking acronym doesn't constitute considering this rule less important.

5. Do not opst sexually explicit content.
It's against forum rules, it's against decorum, and it will get us shut down pretty fast. What adults do behind closed doors is cool, and allusion is fine. Anything that could involve a diagram, though? No.

6. Avoid unfriendly debates.
Several topics of conversation have created huge arguments that made several people uncomfortable and defied our goal of being a support thread. This is especially true debates of definition. These do not always end well, and are best avoided.

This thread has a past of traumatic experiences which we would rather not repeat, and some topics which have created (in)famous rows include:
- the precise distinction between bi- and pansexual;
- what is or isn't a polyamorous relationship;
- whether transgender is more correct than transgendered.
(Other topics may be added to the list.)
Unless you need support or help about this, please refrain from bringing up these topics.

Also, if a conversation that is not about support runs long, spoiler it if possible, even if it is polite.

Glossary of Common Terms

And, for reference, here is a list of commonly used words and definitions by our community. Please understand that this list is currently undergoing construction right now. Any contributions to the list are appreciated.
LGBT: Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Trans*

LGBTAI: LGBT+Asexual/Allies+Intersex+All Inclusive

Lagerbeta: A fine brewski to be drunk by all - the name comes from the above abbreviation.

QUILTBAG:
Q - Queer and Questioning
U - Unidentified
I - Intersex
L - Lesbian
T - Transgender, Transexual
B - Bisexual
A - Asexual
G - Gay, Genderqueer

Where a word below is in italics, that means it has it's own entry on the list.

A note on labels: many of these labels are seemingly interchangeable, and for some people they are. However, please do not presume to correct or judge another person's use of a label. Bisexual and Pansexual are especially tricky in this regard, as are transgender and transsexual to a lesser degree.
Often the difference in why one person feels one label is appropriate and not another is deeply personal. If you wish to know more it is probably a topic to seek private advice on, from one of the people listed in the next section.


AFAB/AMAB: Assigned Female/Male at Birth

Agendered: Someone who lacks a gender.

Androgyne: Gender Identity with male and female aspects.

Androsexual: A person who is attracted to men.

Asexual: A person who does not feel any/some sexual attraction.

Binary, The: See: Gender Binary.

Bisexual: 1. attracted to two genders; 2. attracted to one's own gender and another gender; 3. attracted to various genders; 4. attracted to people regardless of gender; 5. ask the person who says they're bi what exactly they mean by that. See also Pansexual

Cis: See: Cisgender

Cisgender (CG): Somebody whose gender and sex align.

Demisexual: A person who is sexually attracted to someone(s) only after they have formed an intense emotional relationship with.

Dysphoria: The disassociation Trans* people feel with their own body.

Male-to-Female (MtF): Someone who was assigned male at birth, but is female. (AKA: trans woman)

Female: See: Woman

Female-to-Male (FtM): Someone who was assigned female at birth, but is male. (AKA: trans man)

FAAB: Female Assigned at Birth.

Feminine: Something generally associated by society with women.

FFS: Facial Feminization Surgery: Surgery to reduce chin/nose/cheekbones. Associated primarily with MAAB Trans people

FtM: See: Female to Male

Gay: A man who is attracted to men.

Gender Binary: The commonly held notion that there are only men and women on two extremes, with nothing in between.

Gender Expression (GE): How one expresses their Gender Identity to society.

Gender Identity (GI): How one feels inside society's idea of "man, woman, or other".

Genderfluid: Someone who fluctuates between different genders.

Genderqueer (GQ): Someone who is not of a binary gender; someone who is not male or female.

Gynosexual: A person who is attracted to women.

Heterosexual: A person who is attracted to members of the opposite gender.

Homosexual: A person who is attracted to members of their gender.

HRT: Hormone replacement therapy. MtF's tend to progestrogens, oestrogens and androgen blockers, while FtM's take testosterone almost exculsively.

Lesbian: A woman who is attracted to women.

MAAB: Male Assigned at Birth.

Male-to-Female (MtF): Someone who was assigned male at birth, but is female. (AKA: trans woman)

Man/men: A cis man or trans man. Male.

Masculine: Something generally associated by society with men.

Pansexual: A person who is attracted to people regardless of gender. See also Bisexual

Polyamorous: A person who is interested in a relationship with more than one person.

Presenting: Trans* shorthand for appearing as their preferred gender, regardless of any HRT, SRS or other changes.

Trans*: Transsexual and Transgender primarily, with the asterisk denoting that the trans- prefix could be followed by any number of appropriate words. It also includes other labels, and is a catch-all term for people who identify as something other than their biological sex at birth.

Transgender: Used in reference to a person whose sex(body) and gender(mind) are at odds or do not match. A transgender person can also identify as genderqueer, transsexual, or may use transgender as their only identity.

Transitioning: The process a Trans* person undergoes to move to their preferred gender. Often includes HRT, SRS, FFS.

Transsexual: In common terms the same as transgender above. In medical terms refers specifically to people who wish to transition from male to female or female to male, not accommodating any other options.

SRS: Sex Reassignment Surgery: Surgery to replace/transform a vagina into a penis, or vice versa. Mastectomies or plastic surgery may be used on breasts.

Sexual Orientation (SO): How one identifies who they are attracted to.

Significant Other(s) (SO): Person(s) you are in a relationship with.

Third-gendered: Someone who fits in a local society's third gender, usually male performing female tasks, occasionally vice versa. Also a person who feels they do not identify with any other gender identity.

Woman: A cis woman or trans woman. Female.

Allies: Hetereosexual-Cisgender people who support equality for sexual, gender, and romantic minorities.


Private Consultation.

We have a list of people whoa re willing and able to discuss topics that may not be thread-appropriate but are still topical. They can be reached by Personal Message (PM), thought they may not respond immediately, or may be on sabbatical.


Name: Especially familiar with the topic(s) of
Absol197: Gender identity issues.
Asteron Questar: Relationships, depression.
Astrella: GSRM rights, feminism, trans stuff, Skype.
Chess435: Skype.
Eirala: Trans stuff (esp emotional issues), Skype(no voice or video, however).
Eldest: General/basics, bisexuality, polyamory, pansexuality will Skype(voice if needed, no video).
Enrico Dandolo (Caroline): Trans stuff, mental health, feminism, asexuality, hugs, make-up advice. PM first, Skype chat if asked.
HMS Sophia: Trans stuff (esp hormones).
inuyasha: Shoulder on which to cry, someone to listen.
Irish Musician: PM, Rants/Venting.
KenderWizard: General/basics, gender and feminism, bisexuality.
Kesnit: Trans stuff (FtM), legal issues.
Lea Plath: Genderfluidity.
Lentrax: General/basics, depression, bullying.
Lix Lorn: General/basics.
Lycunadari: Genderqueer and agendered.
Metditto: PM/Skype for L, T, GQ, BDSM(Off-thread or Spoiler Triggered), demisexual, feminism, therapy, depression, dissociative identities.
Musashi: General/basics, asexuality/demisexuality, depression.
Mystic Muse: Skype-y goodness.
noparlpf: General/basics, asexuality, greysexuality, biology, Skype.
Partysan: PM/Skype, polyamory, pansexuality, BDSM(Off-thread or Spoiler Triggered), Rants/Venting.
Socratov: Skype-ness.
TaiLiu: General Transgender information, transphobia.
Warkitty: Academic/technical discussions, Make-up advice.
Wormwood74: Transgender legal issues, transgender outside contacts.

Some people are also willing to talk off-board, through Skype or email or other means; this is especially useful if your question involves board-forbidden topics such as religion or politics. Also, we can't (and ethically shouldn't!) give medical advice. If you need medical advice, please see a professional!

And as a parting note, I will say that even though moderators do not read PMs, they are still part of the forum and still subject to forums rules. Non-allowed topics and discussion should NOT be conducted via PM.


Previous Incarnations

Like the Glorious and Unconquered Sun, we have risen, lived, died, and risen anew, with many faces, many voices, many hearts. In this past, much can be found, both good, and bad, should one be brave or perhaps, foolish, enough to seek it.


LGBT people in the playground

LGBT people in the playground - part II

LGBTitp - part III

LGBTitp 4: We are a family?

LGBTitp - Part Five

LGBTitp - Part Six

LGBTitp - Part Seven

LGBTitp - Part Eight

LGBTitp - Part Nine

LGBTAitp - Part Ten

LGBTAitp - Part Eleven

LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

LGBTAitp - Part Thirteen

LGBTAitp - Part Fourteen

LGBTAitp - Part Fifteen

LGBTAitp - Part Sixteen

LGBTAitp - Part Seventeen

LGBTAitp - Part Eighteen!

LGBTAitp - Part Nineteen

LGBTAitp - Part Twenty - Critical Hit!

LGBTAitp - Part Twenty-One - BLACKJACK!

LGBTAitP Part 22: The Best There Is

LGBTAitP Part 23: Et tu, ~Bianca?

LGBTAitP: Alphabet Soup-with 24 different Vitamins!

LGBTAitP part 25: Doing Away With Subtitles

LGBTAitP 26: No Time For Snappy Titles

LGBTAitP 27: Of Shoes, and Ships, and Sealing Wax

LGBTAitP #28: Come Taste the Rainbow!

LGBTAitP #29: The Rainbow Outreach Program

LGBTAitP 30: Free Cuddles (Enquire Within)

LGBTAitP #31: Cuddles Are On Back Order. Have Some Snuggles!

LGBTAitp #32: The Great Plushie Invasion!

LGBTAitp #33: The Thread at the End of the Rainbow!

LGTAitP #34: <3!!

LGBTAitp #35: What Midlife Crisis? :3

LGBTAitp #36: May Contain Bites!

LGBTAitP #37: Once upon a time...

LGBTAitP #38: Once More With Feeling!!

LGBTAitP #38: Making Your Way in the World Today....

LGBTAitP #40: Technicolour Partyboat

LGBTAitp #41 - Imprecise Terminology Supercenter

LGBTAitp #42: Better Than Skittles/The Meaning of Life!

LGBTAitp #43 [Insert snappy subtitle here]

LGBTAIitP #44: Quick, We Need To Vote A New Title!

LGBTAIitP #45: Rainbow Anarchy

LGBTAitP #46: I Cast Prismatic Hugs

LGBTAIitp #47: Weather Control Central

LGBTAIitp #48: For a Cuddly Tomorrow!

LGBTAIitp #49: Please check all baggage before boarding the Rainbow Rail Road

LGBTAI+ #50: Warning: This Thread Has Exceeded its Maximum Awesome Level






Webcomics that touch on... Well, everything related to the thread.
Venus Envy. (http://www.venusenvycomic.com/) Long dead webcomic. The creator has chosen not to continue it and move forward in life.
Rain. (http://rain.thecomicseries.com/comics/first/) A story of a MtF girl in high school.
Khaos Komix. (http://www.khaoskomix.com/)As the creator puts it(from his site): "A complete GLBTWTFBBQ comic about gender and sexuality. (Trigger warnings for EVERYTHING and nothing is safe for work.)"
Always Raining Here. (http://alwaysraininghere.com/index.php/first-page/) "Adrian is heartsick, Carter is horny. This is a story about their misadventures as awkward teenagers as they fumble through unrequited romances."
Tripping over you. (http://trippingoveryou.com/comic/gmorning-sunshine/)An awkward blind date leads to better options.
Questionable Content. (http://www.questionablecontent.net/) The LGBTA characters are well done, and not stereotypes.
What's normal anyway. (http://whatsnormalanyway.net/?p=93) "What’s Normal Anyway? is a comic that discusses the trans male experience through the story of Mel, who takes the big risk of being himself and transitioning from female to male."
Princess. (http://the-princess.funonthe.net/) A webcomic.
Twokinds. (http://twokinds.keenspot.com/) Keveak: "It generally portrays GRSM matters positively and is quite a nice tale overall."
Misfile (Misfile.com) The Rose Dragon: "Ash is a young boy who, as a result of a screw-up in Heaven, gets stuck in a girl's body in a life he doesn't recognize, and has to deal with the changes and challenges of his new body while trying to get back his old life. Supernatural hijinks and car racing are involved."
I know I missed a few webcomics, and if anyone finds more, feel free to PM them to me with a brief description, and I will add them.


The Brand New LGBTA Arts & Crafts Thread! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=288941)

[Philemonite]

*Signs the attendance sheet*

Yay, a new thread.:smallbiggrin:

[SiuiS]

So I'm having a conversation across three or four threads that are all various incarnations of "don't be a jerk" and how and why that works, and it feels thread-relevant but I can't pinpoint exactly why or how. Not enough to link to an exact thing.

Maybe we should get our resident schrdondingendered linguist to write up a small blurb on respectful communication? I feel we as a society of Internetiness have become too used to the idea that our opinions deserve to be voiced in all places at all times, however much they sometimes can be done better.

[Jormengand]

*Floats into thread.*

Well... that's a very nice thread you've got there... would be a pity if something were to happen to it...

[Jaycemonde]

So I'm having a conversation across three or four threads that are all various incarnations of "don't be a jerk" and how and why that works, and it feels thread-relevant but I can't pinpoint exactly why or how. Not enough to link to an exact thing.

It seems to me that the relevance comes from everybody hating the fact this thread and the regulars of this thread exist and want to be treated like people and not just told to shut up, based on the three examples I've seen.
Personally, I'd just like a rule saying "spoiler all scientific or otherwise non-supportive discussions in this thread", but I get booed down when I suggest that.


Maybe we should get our resident schrdondingendered linguist to write up a small blurb on respectful communication? I feel we as a society of Internetiness have become too used to the idea that our opinions deserve to be voiced in all places at all times, however much they sometimes can be done better.

Who would that be?

Also yes. It feels weird being one of the few people that actually tries to keep fights and arguing to a minimum.

[Asta Kask]

Also yes. It feels weird being one of the few people that actually tries to keep fights and arguing to a minimum.

You probably share that feeling with more people than you think.

[Jaycemonde]

I know this is trite and unimportant to most people (who admit to not being any help whatsoever and apparently only frequent the thread because they like using it as their personal curbstomp area) but can we all please get the fighting and irrelevant blaming of each other the HELL out of here, for at least one whole iteration? Can you children all handle that? Yes? No?

[Asta Kask]

I will edit my post.

[SiuiS]

It seems to me that the relevance comes from everybody hating the fact this thread and the regulars of this thread exist and want to be treated like people and not just told to shut up, based on the three examples I've seen.
Personally, I'd just like a rule saying "spoiler all scientific or otherwise non-supportive discussions in this thread", but I get booed down when I suggest that.


Huh. I thought that was what was actually agreed on...



Who would that be?

Saint Ridley.



You probably share that feeling with more people than you think.

SiuiS, if you're behavior in the "Been challenged: baby gender release help" is your idea of respectful conversation, I'd really hate to see you when you're not being tactful. The guy used a word in a wrong way, that's no excuse for crapping all over the thread. Correct him once, politely, and then move on.

That's a funny thing to say, since I didn't say anything to the OP at all on the topic, stopped people from having an actual fight, and diverted a friend I know from exacerbating things by pointing out why something is relevant despite other people handling it with too much passion.

If you can show me where I am actually crapping on the topic in my several posts of supplying ideas to the OP, please do so. But don't call me out in a public venue, especially when facts which can be cited and dissected are on my side. One person's weariness at social justice doesn't mean another person is in the wrong for being a mediator of technical language.

[Jormengand]

I know this is trite and unimportant to most people (who admit to not being any help whatsoever and apparently only frequent the thread because they like using it as their personal curbstomp area)...Can you children all handle that? Yes? No?

You know, it would go a lot more smoothly if you didn't use it as a random excuse to insult people...

[Asta Kask]

This is not the place for this.

[Jaycemonde]

You know, it would go a lot more smoothly if you didn't use it as a random excuse to insult people...

If you don't pick random fights with people and don't clutter up the place with bull about everybody else when it's supposed to be a SAFE place for people to talk about and find help for their problems, then what I said doesn't apply to you. Simple as that.

[Philemonite]

Don't do that, please. Take it to the PMs if it's personal.

[SiuiS]

The last thread got pushed up and was a spambot response. I was so very confused for a moment, there.

I wonder, how much of a support thread is waiting to support people, versus having friendly banter to make it feel like a comfortable space? I recall back when so many people didn't want to say anything because they felt their problems weren't as big. But, I also recall when people didn't want to interrupt the friendliness and hugs and weirdly asterisk-filled Roleplay.

[Jaycemonde]

The last thread got pushed up and was a spambot response. I was so very confused for a moment, there.

Weird. That type of response actually looked mildly useful and relevant. I marked it as [potential] spambot.


I wonder, how much of a support thread is waiting to support people, versus having friendly banter to make it feel like a comfortable space? I recall back when so many people didn't want to say anything because they felt their problems weren't as big. But, I also recall when people didn't want to interrupt the friendliness and hugs and weirdly asterisk-filled Roleplay.

I can recall both, with what could be called relatively fondness. Nobody seems to like each other anymore, which sucks.
And asterisk roleplaying isn't weird, it's just the default style for things like text messaging; pretty much useless on forums and any chat client with /me commands.

[Serpentine]

I can recall both, with what could be called relatively fondness. Nobody seems to like each other anymore, which sucks.People were saying that like 2 years ago, and probably 2 years before that. It cycles.

[Jaycemonde]

People were saying that like 2 years ago, and probably 2 years before that. It cycles.

That's true. I had almost said "At this point I'm just waiting for the next batch of new faces", but that sounded too callous.

[Marnath]

The last thread got pushed up and was a spambot response. I was so very confused for a moment, there.

I wonder, how much of a support thread is waiting to support people, versus having friendly banter to make it feel like a comfortable space? I recall back when so many people didn't want to say anything because they felt their problems weren't as big. But, I also recall when people didn't want to interrupt the friendliness and hugs and weirdly asterisk-filled Roleplay.

People like me probably. I've been on these forums for a while now(four years isn't all that long, right?:smalleek:) but I only started poking my head in here a few days ago. I guess on a fundamental level I don't really think of myself as being part of the LGBT crowd since the asexuality spectrum is pretty much invisible. I don't face discrimination because no one even knows it's a thing, they just think "I've never been interested in any of that relationship stuff" is my choosing celibacy. It's also easy for me to pass since I feel just enough appreciation for pretty girls to get caught staring.

Wow, that is legitimately the first time I've thought of myself as passing for heterosexual. I've identified as grey-ace for a year or two since I knew what it was but I guess I still primarily thought of myself as just a straight guy with almost no sex drive. Does that match up with other people's experiences? I feel like I'm "doing it wrong" somehow, even though that's absurd.

[Miriel]

People like me probably. I've been on these forums for a while now(four years isn't all that long, right?:smalleek:) but I only started poking my head in here a few days ago. I guess on a fundamental level I don't really think of myself as being part of the LGBT crowd since the asexuality spectrum is pretty much invisible. I don't face discrimination because no one even knows it's a thing, they just think "I've never been interested in any of that relationship stuff" is my choosing celibacy. It's also easy for me to pass since I feel just enough appreciation for pretty girls to get caught staring.

Wow, that is legitimately the first time I've thought of myself as passing for heterosexual. I've identified as grey-ace for a year or two since I knew what it was but I guess I still primarily thought of myself as just a straight guy with almost no sex drive. Does that match up with other people's experiences? I feel like I'm "doing it wrong" somehow, even though that's absurd.
We have an A in the title thread beard because asexual people are welcome. So you're welcome.

That makes sense.

Myself, it's the opposite. Most sane people seem to get the idea that I'm asexual, because it's sort of obvious, but not that I'm homoromantic. So I'm forever single, it seems...

[Serpentine]

We have an A in the title thread beard asexual people are welcome.I just wanted to preserve this typo in case you go back and edit it :smalltongue:

[Asta Kask]

Myself, it's the opposite. Most sane people seem to get the idea that I'm asexual, because it's sort of obvious, but not that I'm homoromantic. So I'm forever single, it seems...

Until you break into someone's house, cover their floor with rose petals and put on "Nothing Else Matters". :smalltongue:

[Miriel]

Until you break into someone's house, cover their floor with rose petals and put on "Nothing Else Matters". :smalltongue:
Hum... The big solo is a bit of a mood breaker. Is there something even more cheesy?


I just wanted to preserve this typo in case you go back and edit it :smalltongue:
... I have the weirdest typos, haha ^^

[Asta Kask]

Hum... The big solo is a bit of a mood breaker. Is there something even more cheesy?

Forever?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_RKO5ozLVo&feature=kp

[Eldest]

Jayce, there's no rule about threads going over the 50 count (look at random banter, though I think we're number two on how many we've gone through), the proposed joke was about threads not being able to hit 51 pages without causing problems.

[SiuiS]

As much as I get the joke, can we not talk about creepy stalker behavior and the finer points of guiltig people into romance via cliche? It's kinda skeevy

[Asta Kask]

Ok, I'll stop.

[Grytorm]

Annoying braibn and its sticky ideas. I've started to think about makeup and I want to wear a little when I am alone to see how it feels. I do have access to some of my sisters old makeup but I don't really know how to make sense of it. What would be a starting point if I got some makeup of my own?

[noparlpf]

People like me probably. I've been on these forums for a while now(four years isn't all that long, right?:smalleek:) but I only started poking my head in here a few days ago. I guess on a fundamental level I don't really think of myself as being part of the LGBT crowd since the asexuality spectrum is pretty much invisible. I don't face discrimination because no one even knows it's a thing, they just think "I've never been interested in any of that relationship stuff" is my choosing celibacy. It's also easy for me to pass since I feel just enough appreciation for pretty girls to get caught staring.

Wow, that is legitimately the first time I've thought of myself as passing for heterosexual. I've identified as grey-ace for a year or two since I knew what it was but I guess I still primarily thought of myself as just a straight guy with almost no sex drive. Does that match up with other people's experiences? I feel like I'm "doing it wrong" somehow, even though that's absurd.

We used to have a few asexual regulars.
And nah, for me when I learned what asexuality was it just clicked. But different people get used to words differently, so you're fine.

[Arachu]

Annoying braibn and its sticky ideas. I've started to think about makeup and I want to wear a little when I am alone to see how it feels. I do have access to some of my sisters old makeup but I don't really know how to make sense of it. What would be a starting point if I got some makeup of my own?

I've always been told to start with foundation - basically that you should get a shade that's as close to your skin color as possible and then when you've been doing that for a bit start looking into other things. I haven't quite gotten into the habit yet, though, so I don't know much aside from that.


~Bianca

[Miriel]

Annoying braibn and its sticky ideas. I've started to think about makeup and I want to wear a little when I am alone to see how it feels. I do have access to some of my sisters old makeup but I don't really know how to make sense of it. What would be a starting point if I got some makeup of my own?
It really depends what you want to achieve. Hide masculine features? Add a feminine touch? Just look better/different?

[Irish Musician]

Annoying braibn and its sticky ideas. I've started to think about makeup and I want to wear a little when I am alone to see how it feels. I do have access to some of my sisters old makeup but I don't really know how to make sense of it. What would be a starting point if I got some makeup of my own?
You want to do what Bianca said, start with a base that is as near to your skin tone as you can get. From there you apply it, but you do not want to cake it on. When it comes to make-up less is more, generally speaking anyway. Such as Caroline(I really hope I am saying the right name there sweetie :smallredface:) said, if you are looking to cover up masculine features and highlight feminine features then there are more intense techniques you can use to do that. However, as a starting point, I would just practice applying the base, and maybe doing some eye-liner. Nothing crazy to start out with, just so you get used to actually applying make-up on yourself and get your eye used to seeing make-up on yourself.

If you need any help in this, please don't hesitate to ask. As I have said before I am no expert, but I do have a good amount of knowledge about it.


Hugs and cookies all around, lovely people.

Matthew

[Grytorm]

I don't really know what I want to achieve at this point. As I said it is a sticky idea that has worked its way into my head. Probably at this point any makeup I wear will be just to look a bit different or to look a bit feminine. Which seems to me very weird because I have never particularly cared about how I look before. Now my mind is spending a lot of time thinking about how I would look as a girl. It is slightly annoying because I can't really predict where I will end up and where my mind is going.

[SiuiS]

A thing! (http://tatterdemalionvulpine.tumblr.com/post/87145322601/dannyqhantom-i-just-had-to-draw-this-because-i) A relevant one.

[HMS Sophia]

What's going on with the endo? That's weird.

I wasn't seeing them for HRT, but for my hormone problems... which sounds like the same thing, but I hope you know what I mean :smalltongue:
I'm pretty sure they ended up assuming I was taking non prescribed meds because I have such a high e level with no obvious reason. No tests gave a reason anyway. *shrugs*


What?

Your hormone doctor lost interest in your hormones seemingly self-regulating to your preferred sex out of the blue? But they didn't rule out that whole 'might be life threatening illness' thing, they just... Stopped?

Boy I hope I misunderstood your situation :f
Um... nah, pretty much yeah. It's not a tumour in my stomach or hip regions. It's probably not my thyroid (or pituitary, I forget which). Basically, Yeah, he gave up and is useless. I should really see someone up here but I'm so busy working...

[Irish Musician]

A thing! (http://tatterdemalionvulpine.tumblr.com/post/87145322601/dannyqhantom-i-just-had-to-draw-this-because-i) A relevant one.
I love that thing, and I too feel that way in crowds. Though I tend to be a little more in your face about it.

[Miriel]

News from my name change request: not accepted, I need to send proof that I'm on hormones.

Will fight.

[Grytorm]

News from my name change request: not accepted, I need to send proof that I'm on hormones.

Will fight.

Good luck to you on that. I see no reason why a name change request should be stopped the first time. At least if it isn't to something silly. People know what they are going through.

[Helanna]

People like me probably. I've been on these forums for a while now(four years isn't all that long, right?:smalleek:) but I only started poking my head in here a few days ago. I guess on a fundamental level I don't really think of myself as being part of the LGBT crowd since the asexuality spectrum is pretty much invisible. I don't face discrimination because no one even knows it's a thing, they just think "I've never been interested in any of that relationship stuff" is my choosing celibacy. It's also easy for me to pass since I feel just enough appreciation for pretty girls to get caught staring.

Wow, that is legitimately the first time I've thought of myself as passing for heterosexual. I've identified as grey-ace for a year or two since I knew what it was but I guess I still primarily thought of myself as just a straight guy with almost no sex drive. Does that match up with other people's experiences? I feel like I'm "doing it wrong" somehow, even though that's absurd.

This all matches up with my experience pretty well (including just poking my head in here recently). I generally identify as gray-A because it seems to fit well enough. I can certainly appreciate good-looking men (and women, for that matter) in an aesthetic sense and I have a libido, but I've never actually wanted to have sex with another person. Just seems creepy and awkward and way too much effort for little to no gain. Then I wonder if it would be different if I was in a relationship, but relationships are also currently too much effort and risk for me to bother with right now. And then sometimes I worry that it's all really just an effect of social anxiety or repression or something and I shouldn't really identify as ace, and how can I really tell what sexual attraction feels like anyway, and so on and so forth.

And then sometimes I just figure, eh. I don't want to have sex and I'm happy with that, so I should just quit worrying so much. The Ace community I've seen seems really open and accepting, and I don't think they'll mind if I'm still figuring parts of it out. But I also don't really consider myself part of the LGBT community for the same reasons as you. I've never told anyone I'm asexual, just because it's never come up.

[golentan]

Why won't my sexuality ever stay put long enough to present a reasonable target?

[Miriel]

Good luck to you on that. I see no reason why a name change request should be stopped the first time. At least if it isn't to something silly. People know what they are going through.
Well, they don't know what I'm going through.

*hasn't really stopped crying*

[The_Snark]

News from my name change request: not accepted, I need to send proof that I'm on hormones.

Will fight.

Sorry to hear it. I'm also a little surprised to hear that changing your name is a process that can be denied; I've worked enough record-keeping jobs to understand why governments require forms, but I don't get why they feel the need to have a say in what your name is. :smallconfused:

Best of luck in getting through.

[Miriel]

Sorry to hear it. I'm also a little surprised to hear that changing your name is a process that can be denied; I've worked enough record-keeping jobs to understand why governments require forms, but I don't get why they feel the need to have a say in what your name is. :smallconfused:

Best of luck in getting through.
Yep, it can be. Apparently, getting one letter from a professional and a declaration under oath is not enough for them. I need a diagnosis of GID AND proof that I'm on hormones. Which is pretty ridiculous. I AM on hormones, I swore an oath to that.

I'm stuck between wanting to fight them to the deah and crying my heart out (actually, I don't think I have any ears left to cry, my eyes hurt a lot).

Oh, and for added insult, the salutations: "Nous vous prions d'accepter, Monsieur [= Sir], nos salutations distinguées." It's a standard formula, but the gendering is totally useless and hurtful, especially in a rejection letter.

[Cloud Rat]

Hello!

You can call me Rain! I'm gender-fluid (slightly leaning towards female.) I didn't know this thread existed; I saw it in Friendly Banter and thought I would say hi!

...Hi? :redface:

[Miriel]

Hello!

You can call me Rain! I'm gender-fluid (slightly leaning towards female.) I didn't know this thread existed; I saw it in Friendly Banter and thought I would say hi!

...Hi? :redface:
Hi! Here are some cookies and cheesecake, and there's ice cream too if you want any!

Oooooh, Rain! Do you read the comic?

[Cloud Rat]

Hi! Here are some cookies and cheesecake, and there's ice cream too if you want any!

Oooooh, Rain! Do you read the comic?

Sadly, allergic to chocolate. :c

I would, but the art style inspires much hate in me. Also, it's not as well written as I would like.

[Saposhiente]

It is slightly annoying because I can't really predict where I will end up and where my mind is going.

Why worry? Wherever you do end up, it will be right.

[Grytorm]

Why worry? Wherever you do end up, it will be right.

I hope so. But I worry because I am uncertain. And because the idea of being feminine is filling a lot of spare mental space right now. And because I already feel slightly stressed about the idea and if I do end up pursuing it I know things will be even more stressful later.

Also I seem to have a tactile imagination of physical action. I have been touching my legs, my hair and my face a lot recently whenever I am thinking about the minor steps I am considering. It matches what I do sometimes what I do when considering self destructive behavior. But it is much more consistent with the more cheerful topic.

[SiuiS]

Um... nah, pretty much yeah. It's not a tumour in my stomach or hip regions. It's probably not my thyroid (or pituitary, I forget which). Basically, Yeah, he gave up and is useless. I should really see someone up here but I'm so busy working...

Wow.

I am going to go with 'your body finally figured out what you wanted' and chalk it up to spiritual intervention, for my own sanity.


I love that thing, and I too feel that way in crowds. Though I tend to be a little more in your face about it.

I am too, but I'm trying not to be. I don't always want to be this person. (http://24.media.tumblr.com/dd3be025b4d9246fada899adb982919f/tumblr_mi18189jLM1rd0rbzo1_r1_500.gif)


News from my name change request: not accepted, I need to send proof that I'm on hormones.

Will fight.

Fight on. If you need help, lemme know. :(


Yep, it can be. Apparently, getting one letter from a professional and a declaration under oath is not enough for them. I need a diagnosis of GID AND proof that I'm on hormones. Which is pretty ridiculous. I AM on hormones, I swore an oath to that.

I'm stuck between wanting to fight them to the deah and crying my heart out (actually, I don't think I have any ears left to cry, my eyes hurt a lot).

Oh, and for added insult, the salutations: "Nous vous prions d'accepter, Monsieur [= Sir], nos salutations distinguées." It's a standard formula, but the gendering is totally useless and hurtful, especially in a rejection letter.

That's pretty stupid...


Hello!

You can call me Rain! I'm gender-fluid (slightly leaning towards female.) I didn't know this thread existed; I saw it in Friendly Banter and thought I would say hi!

...Hi? :redface:

Hi there! I have to admit though it will be hard to come ct Rain to the Sour Bill pony. XD

Welcome!


I hope so. But I worry because I am uncertain. And because the idea of being feminine is filling a lot of spare mental space right now. And because I already feel slightly stressed about the idea and if I do end up pursuing it I know things will be even more stressful later.

Also I seem to have a tactile imagination of physical action. I have been touching my legs, my hair and my face a lot recently whenever I am thinking about the minor steps I am considering. It matches what I do sometimes what I do when considering self destructive behavior. But it is much more consistent with the more cheerful topic.

Huh. I do that too.

[HMS Sophia]

Wow.

I am going to go with 'your body finally figured out what you wanted' and chalk it up to spiritual intervention, for my own sanity.

One can certainly hope so. It'll make October 'fun'.

[lord pringle]

Hello!

You can call me Rain! I'm gender-fluid (slightly leaning towards female.) I didn't know this thread existed; I saw it in Friendly Banter and thought I would say hi!

...Hi? :redface:

Hi! I've always wanted to know someone named Rain.

[Asta Kask]

Hello!

You can call me Rain! I'm gender-fluid (slightly leaning towards female.) I didn't know this thread existed; I saw it in Friendly Banter and thought I would say hi!

...Hi? :redface:

We'll need you to weigh in on all important issues, because you will always be right as rain. :smalltongue:

Hi!

[Mina Kobold]

Why won't my sexuality ever stay put long enough to present a reasonable target?

Wish I had a good answer for that, or that I had enough of a dead glare to make it stay put indefinitely. As is, I can only offer internet hugs and candies. ;_;


Well, they don't know what I'm going through.

*hasn't really stopped crying*

*Offers all the hugs, candies, armies of penguins and votes for internet president*


Yep, it can be. Apparently, getting one letter from a professional and a declaration under oath is not enough for them. I need a diagnosis of GID AND proof that I'm on hormones. Which is pretty ridiculous. I AM on hormones, I swore an oath to that.

I'm stuck between wanting to fight them to the deah and crying my heart out (actually, I don't think I have any ears left to cry, my eyes hurt a lot).

Oh, and for added insult, the salutations: "Nous vous prions d'accepter, Monsieur [= Sir], nos salutations distinguées." It's a standard formula, but the gendering is totally useless and hurtful, especially in a rejection letter.

The fact that official forms (even in Danish, where it comes off as incredibly stilted to refer to people as hr./fr./frk. (mr./mrs./miss) even when being polite) continue to do that is and endless source of annoyance for me. Why is the bureaucracies of the world so insistant on telling you what gender and gendered title you must identify with? It's pointless, especially when it refuses to recognise that you are way too awesome for regular honorifics, even when telling you that they are being dusty-heads about accepting your name.


Hello!

You can call me Rain! I'm gender-fluid (slightly leaning towards female.) I didn't know this thread existed; I saw it in Friendly Banter and thought I would say hi!

...Hi? :redface:


Hi! ^_^

[WarKitty]

New thread: kitten request line now open.

Also, a few observations on ponytails from my project tomcat annals:
A low ponytail is an acceptable unisex style, but there are differences. For one, men almost never part their hair putting it up. Women brush their hair smooth, whether it's parted or pulled straight back, while men tend not to except with very formal things. Women also put the ponytail tight, even at the nape of the neck, using hairspray and clips and such to control and loose hair. Men tend to have looser ponytails, and stray hair is generally ignored. A male style seems to be created by simply running fingers through hair and pulling it back, while women's styles take more careful brushing.

There's a certain segment of men's styles that seem to cater to very carefully trying to look like you don't care in a specific manner. And this seems the easiest for someone like me to hit.

[Asta Kask]

http://sketchcardsaloon.files.wordpress.com/2011/12/squirrel-girl-magic.jpg

[SiuiS]

New thread: kitten request line now open.

Also, a few observations on ponytails from my project tomcat annals:
A low ponytail is an acceptable unisex style, but there are differences. For one, men almost never part their hair putting it up. Women brush their hair smooth, whether it's parted or pulled straight back, while men tend not to except with very formal things. Women also put the ponytail tight, even at the nape of the neck, using hairspray and clips and such to control and loose hair. Men tend to have looser ponytails, and stray hair is generally ignored. A male style seems to be created by simply running fingers through hair and pulling it back, while women's styles take more careful brushing.

There's a certain segment of men's styles that seem to cater to very carefully trying to look like you don't care in a specific manner. And this seems the easiest for someone like me to hit.

Yeah, masculine grooming is "grab thing, tie it down, Put Bread On Table". So much girl stuff is background radiation for the particular sex that giving instructions to a raised as girl and raised as boy will get two very different results... Because each one has a vastly different set of background assumptions.

I wish someone could figure out, break down and convey those damn background assumptions.

[Philemonite]

Hello!

You can call me Rain! I'm gender-fluid (slightly leaning towards female.) I didn't know this thread existed; I saw it in Friendly Banter and thought I would say hi!

...Hi? :redface:

Welcome new person.:smallbiggrin:
Now, where is our welcome Mat?


Sadly, allergic to chocolate. :c

We also have pie.:smallwink:

By the way, Rain (http://mortalkombat.wikia.com/wiki/Rain) is my favorite character.:smallbiggrin:

[The_Snark]

Yep, it can be. Apparently, getting one letter from a professional and a declaration under oath is not enough for them. I need a diagnosis of GID AND proof that I'm on hormones. Which is pretty ridiculous. I AM on hormones, I swore an oath to that.

Well.

That sounds needlessly complicated, and intrusive.

I don't understand why they need a justification at all, much less such stringent demands for proof; "because I feel like it" seems like a perfectly acceptable reason to change your name to me. I can't help but think they've got it backwards, and that the process ought to assume that you can change your name unless there's a specific reason to forbid it (i.e. legal issues).

I'm sorry you have to deal with that, and hope you can get it sorted out. Caroline is a lovely name.

[WarKitty]

Hello!

You can call me Rain! I'm gender-fluid (slightly leaning towards female.) I didn't know this thread existed; I saw it in Friendly Banter and thought I would say hi!

...Hi? :redface:

Hello, have a kitten!

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-b427x1yRxYI/TbsXqcY7d2I/AAAAAAAABXA/G_XnIW7YSDE/s1600/kitten_and_the_rose.jpg


Yeah, masculine grooming is "grab thing, tie it down, Put Bread On Table". So much girl stuff is background radiation for the particular sex that giving instructions to a raised as girl and raised as boy will get two very different results... Because each one has a vastly different set of background assumptions.

I wish someone could figure out, break down and convey those damn background assumptions.

Most definitely. With girl training it was hard for me to even imagine just putting my hair up in a ponytail without a brush or at least valiant attempt at smoothing. And no part! Well that's just messy.

[Miriel]

Thanks everyone.


*Offers all the hugs, candies, armies of penguins and votes for internet president*

The fact that official forms (even in Danish, where it comes off as incredibly stilted to refer to people as hr./fr./frk. (mr./mrs./miss) even when being polite) continue to do that is and endless source of annoyance for me. Why is the bureaucracies of the world so insistant on telling you what gender and gendered title you must identify with? It's pointless, especially when it refuses to recognise that you are way too awesome for regular honorifics, even when telling you that they are being dusty-heads about accepting your name.
Thanks.

Yeah, it's pretty ridiculous. Just... why?


Well.

That sounds needlessly complicated, and intrusive.

I don't understand why they need a justification at all, much less such stringent demands for proof; "because I feel like it" seems like a perfectly acceptable reason to change your name to me. I can't help but think they've got it backwards, and that the process ought to assume that you can change your name unless there's a specific reason to forbid it (i.e. legal issues).

I'm sorry you have to deal with that, and hope you can get it sorted out. Caroline is a lovely name.
I don't understand either. :smallfrown: I guess they assume that gender and name are permanent, so why could you change it? Anyway, my name and gender (well, not "mine" really) are all used in identity codes for no purpose, because they feel like it.

Paid them more than a month's worth of food for filing the demand. Just in case they thought I wasn't serious. (That's not counting what I paid to actually fill in the demand, sexologist, oath, etc. Overall, it cost me a month's rent.)

It'll get sorted. Somehow. Anyway. I have a month to sort it out, after that they close my file...

[WarKitty]

Thanks everyone.


Thanks.

Yeah, it's pretty ridiculous. Just... why?


Paid them more than a month's worth of food for filing the demand. Just in case they thought I wasn't serious. (That's not counting what I paid to actually fill in the demand, sexologist, oath, etc. Overall, it cost me a month's rent.)

It'll get sorted. Somehow. Anyway. I have a month to sort it out, after that they close my file...

Stupid peoples. Will this help?
http://www.tehcute.com/pics/201110/marshmellow-kitten-big.jpg

[Miriel]

Stupid peoples. Will this help?
http://www.tehcute.com/pics/201110/marshmellow-kitten-big.jpg
Kitty :smallsmile: Hello cat! *pets cat*

Cats always help. Cats > people.

[Philemonite]

Kitty :smallsmile: Hello cat! *pets cat*

Cats always help. Cats > people.

Then have some more, this are my last year's kittens. I still have the white one.

http://th06.deviantart.net/fs70/200H/f/2014/151/a/3/kittens_by_asteronquestar-d7kfxdp.jpg

I can't find any other picture at the moment.

[Astrella]

Yep, it can be. Apparently, getting one letter from a professional and a declaration under oath is not enough for them. I need a diagnosis of GID AND proof that I'm on hormones. Which is pretty ridiculous. I AM on hormones, I swore an oath to that.

I'm stuck between wanting to fight them to the deah and crying my heart out (actually, I don't think I have any ears left to cry, my eyes hurt a lot).

Oh, and for added insult, the salutations: "Nous vous prions d'accepter, Monsieur [= Sir], nos salutations distinguées." It's a standard formula, but the gendering is totally useless and hurtful, especially in a rejection letter.

Offers pile of hugs. It's absolutely ridiculous, I needed both of those two and a whole bunch of other stuff like proof of nationality, crime register, etc...

And yeah, the gendered thing really hurts... I'm not looking forward to getting letters addressed to "mister" Lena lastname when my name change is done.

*hugs again*

Hope you can resolve it in time. :s

[Marnath]

Most definitely. With girl training it was hard for me to even imagine just putting my hair up in a ponytail without a brush or at least valiant attempt at smoothing. And no part! Well that's just messy.

There are some words that will never steer you wrong when you want to use male hygiene techniques.

"Eh, that's close enough."

[Themrys]

And yeah, the gendered thing really hurts... I'm not looking forward to getting letters addressed to "mister" Lena lastname when my name change is done.

It happens to all women. It's just sexism, if that's of any comfort to you.
(I even got a letter that addressed me as Mr [lastname] when I cancelled my subscription to a feminist magazine. A feminist magazine. Just imagine that. And they had the chutzpah to ask why I didn't want to read that magazine anymore.In that very same letter. And my first name is very obviously female. :smallfurious:)

[SiuiS]

Most definitely. With girl training it was hard for me to even imagine just putting my hair up in a ponytail without a brush or at least valiant attempt at smoothing. And no part! Well that's just messy.

Eh. Parting depends on the hair. Slick it all back, it looks suave or severe, both of which are tones that get more effect on the other side of the gender spectrum. Whether my hair was back in a loose braid (with part) or pulled into a severe, Mitsurugi style dear-god-large puff, is the difference between being seen as a concerned party or an authority figure respectively.


Stupid peoples. Will this help?
http://www.tehcute.com/pics/201110/marshmellow-kitten-big.jpg

Oh spirits, a kitten in medium as soft! I am undone


It happens to all women. It's just sexism, if that's of any comfort to you.
(I even got a letter that addressed me as Mr [lastname] when I cancelled my subscription to a feminist magazine. A feminist magazine. Just imagine that. And they had the chutzpah to ask why I didn't want to read that magazine anymore.:smallfurious:)

I signed up for a free magazine sample. The sign-up email asked me for my payment method, which I listed as 'payments' instead of credit card (because if I write 'cancel' on the payment stub, I get my free magazines but no subscription). The confirmation email asked me for my credit card info to guarantee fast delivery. Just this week I got an invoice asking for payment or payment information.

I have yet to recieve my free magazine...


Capitalism. n.n

[Miriel]

Offers pile of hugs. It's absolutely ridiculous, I needed both of those two and a whole bunch of other stuff like proof of nationality, crime register, etc...

And yeah, the gendered thing really hurts... I'm not looking forward to getting letters addressed to "mister" Lena lastname when my name change is done.

*hugs again*

Hope you can resolve it in time. :s
I'm glad I didn't have to send all of that... I did have to give ID and a proof of citizenship, I think. And a proof that I'm using that name. I don't remember really, it's a bit of a blur. But yeah, no crime register.

On the gender thing... much awkwardness to come. :smallsigh: (Why can't they let you choose how you want to be called? It's like if they checked marital status to settle on Miss/Mrs.)


It happens to all women. It's just sexism, if that's of any comfort to you.
(I even got a letter that addressed me as Mr [lastname] when I cancelled my subscription to a feminist magazine. A feminist magazine. Just imagine that. And they had the chutzpah to ask why I didn't want to read that magazine anymore.In that very same letter. And my first name is very obviously female. :smallfurious:)
... that's pretty horrible and typical. :smallannoyed:

[Heliomance]

Well.

That sounds needlessly complicated, and intrusive.

I don't understand why they need a justification at all, much less such stringent demands for proof; "because I feel like it" seems like a perfectly acceptable reason to change your name to me. I can't help but think they've got it backwards, and that the process ought to assume that you can change your name unless there's a specific reason to forbid it (i.e. legal issues).

I'm sorry you have to deal with that, and hope you can get it sorted out. Caroline is a lovely name.

It is so much easier in England. To legally change your name, you have to... start using a different name. That's it.

Various places may want proof of your name change, in which case you need to write a declaration, sign it, and get it witnessed by two people. There is no Central place you have to register it with, and it's up to you to inform everywhere that needs to know of your new name. Most places will also change your title on request (though not all - I think the department for work and pensions has me on file as Mr Tamsin <last name>).

[HMS Sophia]

It is so much easier in England. To legally change your name, you have to... start using a different name. That's it.

Various places may want proof of your name change, in which case you need to write a declaration, sign it, and get it witnessed by two people. There is no Central place you have to register it with, and it's up to you to inform everywhere that needs to know of your new name. Most places will also change your title on request (though not all - I think the department for work and pensions has me on file as Mr Tamsin <last name>).

The DWP is a joke though, so that's hardly a surprise.

As for all of the above that is accurate, for the most part. Sometimes, and especially, i believe, for a GRC (gender recognition certificate) a change of details has to be witnessed by a legal professional, such as a solicitor or magistrate. (Magistrates aren't legally trained but they count).

However, if a court system has you involved, as a witness, apellant, accused or anything, then they will change gender references, pronoun usage, and titles upon request.

Sources: I work in an appeals tribunal, and have previously worked in a magistrates court. :smalltongue:

[Astrella]

Found this (http://philome.la/inurashii/cis-gaze/play) little story game about what it can be like to be outside and trans. (warning: transphobia)

[Serpentine]

Also, a few observations on ponytails from my project tomcat annals:
A low ponytail is an acceptable unisex style, but there are differences. For one, men almost never part their hair putting it up. Women brush their hair smooth, whether it's parted or pulled straight back, while men tend not to except with very formal things. Women also put the ponytail tight, even at the nape of the neck, using hairspray and clips and such to control and loose hair. Men tend to have looser ponytails, and stray hair is generally ignored. A male style seems to be created by simply running fingers through hair and pulling it back, while women's styles take more careful brushing.

There's a certain segment of men's styles that seem to cater to very carefully trying to look like you don't care in a specific manner. And this seems the easiest for someone like me to hit.Thaaaaat... actually really, really annoys me. The messy-headed ponytails on guys, I mean. I desperately want to go at them with a hairbrush.

This turned up in my facebook feed: a photoshoot of non-binary people (http://www.policymic.com/articles/90003/intimate-photos-challenge-what-it-means-to-be-born-a-boy-or-girl), including that kid who got set on fire a while ago.
(would it be really, really bad for me to say "unf, that Rain person"?)

[Miriel]

Found this (http://philome.la/inurashii/cis-gaze/play) little story game about what it can be like to be outside and trans. (warning: transphobia)
Very true content.

[Eldest]

Thaaaaat... actually really, really annoys me. The messy-headed ponytails on guys, I mean. I desperately want to go at them with a hairbrush.

This turned up in my facebook feed: a photoshoot of non-binary people (http://www.policymic.com/articles/90003/intimate-photos-challenge-what-it-means-to-be-born-a-boy-or-girl), including that kid who got set on fire a while ago.
(would it be really, really bad for me to say "unf, that Rain person"?)

Well I think most of them are attractive. I'd love to cuddle them. Also I have fairly messy hair. >.>

[Serpentine]

Well I think most of them are attractive. I'd love to cuddle them.
Same, but then I guess I do have a bit of a thing for androgynous people. Most of them look way too young for me, though. But very interesting people.

Also I have fairly messy hair. >.>*approaches menacingly, brandishing a hairbrush*

[HMS Sophia]

*approaches menacingly, brandishing a hairbrush*
I can say, with every fibre of my being, that Eldest is thinking of something else right now...

[Eldest]

*approaches menacingly, brandishing a hairbrush*

Nuuuuuuuuu! *flees*


I can say, with every fibre of my being, that Eldest is thinking of something else right now...

That's later tonight. Hopefully.

[Irish Musician]

Hello!

You can call me Rain! I'm gender-fluid (slightly leaning towards female.) I didn't know this thread existed; I saw it in Friendly Banter and thought I would say hi!

...Hi? :redface:

Welcome new person.:smallbiggrin:
Now, where is our welcome Mat?
WELCOME!!!!!!!!!!!


I am too, but I'm trying not to be. I don't always want to be this person. (http://24.media.tumblr.com/dd3be025b4d9246fada899adb982919f/tumblr_mi18189jLM1rd0rbzo1_r1_500.gif)
They should just be happy I am not mentally beating them with my words of rage :smalltongue:

New thread: kitten request line now open.

Also, a few observations on ponytails from my project tomcat annals:
A low ponytail is an acceptable unisex style, but there are differences. For one, men almost never part their hair putting it up. Women brush their hair smooth, whether it's parted or pulled straight back, while men tend not to except with very formal things. Women also put the ponytail tight, even at the nape of the neck, using hairspray and clips and such to control and loose hair. Men tend to have looser ponytails, and stray hair is generally ignored. A male style seems to be created by simply running fingers through hair and pulling it back, while women's styles take more careful brushing.

There's a certain segment of men's styles that seem to cater to very carefully trying to look like you don't care in a specific manner. And this seems the easiest for someone like me to hit.

Thaaaaat... actually really, really annoys me. The messy-headed ponytails on guys, I mean. I desperately want to go at them with a hairbrush.
As a guy with long hair, I tend to have a mix of "messy" and "neat" styling of my ponytail. As well as a mix of higher and lower placement for it. But I tend not to care if a ponytail makes me look more masculine or feminine, because so what either way, ya know? :smallwink:

Matthew

[Kindablue]

Thaaaaat... actually really, really annoys me. The messy-headed ponytails on guys, I mean. I desperately want to go at them with a hairbrush.

This turned up in my facebook feed: a photoshoot of non-binary people (http://www.policymic.com/articles/90003/intimate-photos-challenge-what-it-means-to-be-born-a-boy-or-girl), including that kid who got set on fire a while ago.
(would it be really, really bad for me to say "unf, that Rain person"?)
Gorgeous photographs, but... goddamn is that website obnoxious. It can't just be a page with some pictures and words explaining the pictures, there's always got to be all this other crap popping up and dropping down in front of it.

[Irish Musician]

Gorgeous photographs, but... goddamn is that website obnoxious. It can't just be a page with some pictures and words explaining the pictures, there's always got to be all this other crap popping up and dropping down in front of it.

1)Completely agree. Love the fact that I have no idea who is what, which just makes it all the better.

2) and yes I hate websites that do that crap. scroll *stop everything to close something*, scroll *stop everything to close something*, scroll *stop everything to close something*, scroll *stop everything to close something*........AAAAARRRRGGGGHHHHHH!!!!!!!

M

[Serpentine]

...really? I get no pop-ups, though I might've gotten one when I first opened it :smallconfused:

[Zorg]

Found this (http://philome.la/inurashii/cis-gaze/play) little story game about what it can be like to be outside and trans. (warning: transphobia)

Yeah, that was so accurate it's scary. Didn't notice I was picking at my nails through it and now my thumb's bleeding.


(would it be really, really bad for me to say "unf, that Rain person"?)

I hope not. *looks awkwardly at new person upthread's name*

And here's a couple of (kinda low res) photos my sis-in-law took when we went to the Miss Fisher costume exhibition:

http://24.media.tumblr.com/35abc2bf5a0203b8d3717d4eb8fe934c/tumblr_n64qi8kbpp1r3nwsxo1_500.jpg

http://37.media.tumblr.com/6aee3a1b97e46c976a42f704e4525b58/tumblr_n64qi8kbpp1r3nwsxo5_500.jpg

And a life update:

Still fighting depression, had a few like panic attacks and such, still not working but I'm on benefits now at least (been about 8 months since I was in hospital). My daughter moved away but she comes down and stays for a weekend every month now and a week during holidays, and she's using female pronouns with me so life's kind of going well in some ways.

Biggest problem is I sleep far too much, like 16 hours some days, just have no enthusiasm to get out of bed some days.

[Kindablue]

...really? I get no pop-ups, though I might've gotten one when I first opened it :smallconfused:

The whole screen gets covered with other news stories if you pass the cursor over any of the category boxes at the top of the screen, which on my monitor take up enough of the screen by themselves that you can't see any of the pictures completely without scrolling back up to see the top of the person's head that that box is cutting off, and when you do scroll up another larger box falls out of the category boxes telling you about other stories, and then there's the Facebook, Pinterest, whatever things on the side that move around as you scroll down the article.

[SiuiS]

I hope not. *looks awkwardly at new person upthread's name*

Hee~


And here's a couple of (kinda low res) photos my sis-in-law took when we went to the Miss Fisher costume exhibition:

http://24.media.tumblr.com/35abc2bf5a0203b8d3717d4eb8fe934c/tumblr_n64qi8kbpp1r3nwsxo1_500.jpg

http://37.media.tumblr.com/6aee3a1b97e46c976a42f704e4525b58/tumblr_n64qi8kbpp1r3nwsxo5_500.jpg

Wow, damn.


And a life update:


Biggest problem is I sleep far too much, like 16 hours some days, just have no enthusiasm to get out of bed some days.

... Yeah. Like, I follow my basic routine – I go to work, I come home, I eat – but it's... Hard. Doing anything is hard unless it's a lizard stimulus. I'll deal with things in front of me, but I won't seek them out, y'know? Music helps, though.

Here, Zorg. Have a thing. I tend to think of is because of the first line.
[Music] (http://tatterdemalionvulpine.tumblr.com/post/64889393322/robotlyra-if-you-had-told-me-earlier-today-that)

[Astrella]

Yeah, that was so accurate it's scary. Didn't notice I was picking at my nails through it and now my thumb's bleeding.

Yeah... I noticed my anxiety ticks flaring up while playing it myself. It is scarily accurate.


http://24.media.tumblr.com/35abc2bf5a0203b8d3717d4eb8fe934c/tumblr_n64qi8kbpp1r3nwsxo1_500.jpg

http://37.media.tumblr.com/6aee3a1b97e46c976a42f704e4525b58/tumblr_n64qi8kbpp1r3nwsxo5_500.jpg

Aaah, you're just so frickin' cute! And I adore that outfit, very jealous.


Still fighting depression, had a few like panic attacks and such, still not working but I'm on benefits now at least (been about 8 months since I was in hospital). My daughter moved away but she comes down and stays for a weekend every month now and a week during holidays, and she's using female pronouns with me so life's kind of going well in some ways.

Biggest problem is I sleep far too much, like 16 hours some days, just have no enthusiasm to get out of bed some days.

Yeah, I recognize the sleeping a lot, just existing feels so tiring a lot of the time.

[Zorg]

Wow, damn.

(◡‿◡✿)



... Yeah. Like, I follow my basic routine – I go to work, I come home, I eat – but it's... Hard. Doing anything is hard unless it's a lizard stimulus. I'll deal with things in front of me, but I won't seek them out, y'know? Music helps, though.

Yeah, I get up (sometimes), shower (usually), eat, computer, sleep, repeat. Been doing some drawing at least.


Here, Zorg. Have a thing. I tend to think of is because of the first line.
[Music] (http://tatterdemalionvulpine.tumblr.com/post/64889393322/robotlyra-if-you-had-told-me-earlier-today-that)

Get lucky? :smalltongue: though I presume you mean the first verse hehe :smallwink:

I am a fan of Halestorm's covers :smallsmile:



Yeah... I noticed my anxiety ticks flaring up while playing it myself. It is scarily accurate.

Think I'll send it to some people I know.



Aaah, you're just so frickin' cute! And I adore that outfit, very jealous.

All bought from here (http://www.lolitashow.com/) :smallsmile:



Yeah, I recognize the sleeping a lot, just existing feels so tiring a lot of the time.

Existing is hard >.<

[Irish Musician]

Yeah, that was so accurate it's scary. Didn't notice I was picking at my nails through it and now my thumb's bleeding.



I hope not. *looks awkwardly at new person upthread's name*

And here's a couple of (kinda low res) photos my sis-in-law took when we went to the Miss Fisher costume exhibition:

http://24.media.tumblr.com/35abc2bf5a0203b8d3717d4eb8fe934c/tumblr_n64qi8kbpp1r3nwsxo1_500.jpg

http://37.media.tumblr.com/6aee3a1b97e46c976a42f704e4525b58/tumblr_n64qi8kbpp1r3nwsxo5_500.jpg

And a life update:

Still fighting depression, had a few like panic attacks and such, still not working but I'm on benefits now at least (been about 8 months since I was in hospital). My daughter moved away but she comes down and stays for a weekend every month now and a week during holidays, and she's using female pronouns with me so life's kind of going well in some ways.

Biggest problem is I sleep far too much, like 16 hours some days, just have no enthusiasm to get out of bed some days.

Holy crap that picture Zorg!!!! I don't even want to wear feminine clothing and I want to wear that dress. Though I definitely could not pull it off anywhere near as well as you did.:smallbiggrin:

I am sorry for the negative cloud following you right now, though. Silver lining though, are the female pronouns, so maybe focus on that and it might help dissipate that storm. Hugz if you would like them (I can't ever remember who likes them and who doesn't, so please don't take offense!)

M

[SiuiS]

Aye, I've tried converting all my hobby urges into perfecting my Kung fu (currently, basic fitness) but small things, easy things, like drawing for a while, or a quick stretch or some weights for five minutes during a good, amped song, or maybe just some writing, can really help. Anything to keep the momentum going. To find the flow again.


Matt: aye. Reminds me of Bioshock infinite.

[Arachu]

*Gives Caroline big hugs*


Hello!

You can call me Rain! I'm gender-fluid (slightly leaning towards female.) I didn't know this thread existed; I saw it in Friendly Banter and thought I would say hi!

...Hi? :redface:

Hey~ :smallbiggrin:


New thread: kitten request line now open.

Also, a few observations on ponytails from my project tomcat annals:
A low ponytail is an acceptable unisex style, but there are differences. For one, men almost never part their hair putting it up. Women brush their hair smooth, whether it's parted or pulled straight back, while men tend not to except with very formal things. Women also put the ponytail tight, even at the nape of the neck, using hairspray and clips and such to control and loose hair. Men tend to have looser ponytails, and stray hair is generally ignored. A male style seems to be created by simply running fingers through hair and pulling it back, while women's styles take more careful brushing.

There's a certain segment of men's styles that seem to cater to very carefully trying to look like you don't care in a specific manner. And this seems the easiest for someone like me to hit.

Hey Kitty~ *Hugs* ^_^

Hmm... I've been kind of meeting that in the middle by brushing my hair, then pulling it back from the sides into a loose ponytail with my normal part. Sometimes a bit will stick up until I smooth it out, and there's almost always a bunch of hairs at the base of my skull that stick out that don't get entirely covered up because the tail's higher. If I'm doing it because I just feel like it, though (instead of just needing it out of my face and/or something I'm working on), I like to leave a bit loose at the front and keep it behind my ear. X3

*Wonders if you have any advice on handling those base-of-skull hairs? Has been considering laying on her bed so gravity pulls it back, isn't sure if that'd work very well* :smalltongue:


I signed up for a free magazine sample. The sign-up email asked me for my payment method, which I listed as 'payments' instead of credit card (because if I write 'cancel' on the payment stub, I get my free magazines but no subscription). The confirmation email asked me for my credit card info to guarantee fast delivery. Just this week I got an invoice asking for payment or payment information.

I have yet to recieve my free magazine...


Capitalism. n.n

:smalltongue:


And here's a couple of (kinda low res) photos my sis-in-law took when we went to the Miss Fisher costume exhibition:

http://24.media.tumblr.com/35abc2bf5a0203b8d3717d4eb8fe934c/tumblr_n64qi8kbpp1r3nwsxo1_500.jpg

http://37.media.tumblr.com/6aee3a1b97e46c976a42f704e4525b58/tumblr_n64qi8kbpp1r3nwsxo5_500.jpg

You look so fancy and cute. :D


And a life update:

Still fighting depression, had a few like panic attacks and such, still not working but I'm on benefits now at least (been about 8 months since I was in hospital). My daughter moved away but she comes down and stays for a weekend every month now and a week during holidays, and she's using female pronouns with me so life's kind of going well in some ways.

Biggest problem is I sleep far too much, like 16 hours some days, just have no enthusiasm to get out of bed some days.

*Hugs* It's good that your daughter's using the right pronouns. :smallsmile:


~Bianca

[Wasteland Exile]

Ok. This is a bit awkward to come out and ask, actually. I've made a new account just for it. This seemed like the best place for it, and I've been told that you guys are pretty knowledgeable. Just going to start it out slow.

How does one know if one is asexual?

[BladeofObliviom]

Ok. This is a bit awkward to come out and ask, actually. I've made a new account just for it. This seemed like the best place for it, and I've been told that you guys are pretty knowledgeable. Just going to start it out slow.

How does one know if one is asexual?

There's no checklist of criteria for asexuality, of course, but as someone who identifies as asexual myself, I'd recommend looking at this page (http://www.asexuality.org/home/overview.html).

[Grytorm]

Today I realized that malls are extremely creepy. I went to one today, looked around at all the stores, and saw how many clothing stores were there. It is just plain creepy. I considered getting makeup and trying to figure it out myself but I realized it is available in an overwhelming selection and is rather expensive. I might see if any of my few friends would be willing to help me try makeup. A list of people I could ask is very short. Two people definately and maybe a third person.

[Lentrax]

Just posting on here that I am still lurking about. Just have nothing to add, so I don't.

However, that being said, I am still available to receive PMs if you ever need anyone to talk to. Want to rant, rave, or slag?

Call me. I can take it. I might even be able to say something that helps.

[Wasteland Exile]

There's no checklist of criteria for asexuality, of course, but as someone who identifies as asexual myself, I'd recommend looking at this page (http://www.asexuality.org/home/overview.html).

Thank you so much. That's actually a really helpful site. I've been in the uncomfortable zone of not really being able to define things.

[WarKitty]

Thaaaaat... actually really, really annoys me. The messy-headed ponytails on guys, I mean. I desperately want to go at them with a hairbrush.

It's a bit annoying, but the real realization for me is that even what I see as a "neat" ponytail on a man is much messier than the every-hair-in-place style I'd normally wear as a girl.



Hmm... I've been kind of meeting that in the middle by brushing my hair, then pulling it back from the sides into a loose ponytail with my normal part. Sometimes a bit will stick up until I smooth it out, and there's almost always a bunch of hairs at the base of my skull that stick out that don't get entirely covered up because the tail's higher. If I'm doing it because I just feel like it, though (instead of just needing it out of my face and/or something I'm working on), I like to leave a bit loose at the front and keep it behind my ear. X3

*Wonders if you have any advice on handling those base-of-skull hairs? Has been considering laying on her bed so gravity pulls it back, isn't sure if that'd work very well* :smalltongue:


My default girl ponytail uses a pair of clips (this kind (http://thumbs.dreamstime.com/z/brown-hair-clips-11054037.jpg)) at the back to hold things in. Plus hairspray or gel to control the frizz. There's also the little half-ponytail a lot of women wear as an acceptably messy style. This is formed by simply not pulling the ponytail all the way through on the last loop, instead leaving it as a little loop with the top sticking up. I'm not finding pictures for some reason, but it's a nice little messy girl's style.

[SiuiS]

It's a bit annoying, but the real realization for me is that even what I see as a "neat" ponytail on a man is much messier than the every-hair-in-place style I'd normally wear as a girl.


Oh, that's actually a symptom of men not having nearly the same standards of care for their hair. Not only are they not taught to manage it as well as women, they aren't held as accountable. That messiness is damaged hair poking out untamed and untrained, not just beig messy.



My default girl ponytail uses a pair of clips (this kind (http://thumbs.dreamstime.com/z/brown-hair-clips-11054037.jpg)) at the back to hold things in. Plus hairspray or gel to control the frizz. There's also the little half-ponytail a lot of women wear as an acceptably messy style. This is formed by simply not pulling the ponytail all the way through on the last loop, instead leaving it as a little loop with the top sticking up. I'm not finding pictures for some reason, but it's a nice little messy girl's style.

That half loop is my default style, since I'm usually at work or asleep. The position of best comfort ends up with the loop being completely overtaken by the hair popping up, so my hair looks much shorter (you see hair tie and the top hangig down, that's it).

[Arachu]

My default girl ponytail uses a pair of clips (this kind (http://thumbs.dreamstime.com/z/brown-hair-clips-11054037.jpg)) at the back to hold things in. Plus hairspray or gel to control the frizz. There's also the little half-ponytail a lot of women wear as an acceptably messy style. This is formed by simply not pulling the ponytail all the way through on the last loop, instead leaving it as a little loop with the top sticking up. I'm not finding pictures for some reason, but it's a nice little messy girl's style.

Hm hm. I don't really like using gel or hairspray that much, but I do have some clips around somewhere~

You mean like not pulling your hair all the way through? *Always has to loop hers three times or it slowly loosens over the course of the day - lost a holder that one time* DXD


Oh, that's actually a symptom of men not having nearly the same standards of care for their hair. Not only are they not taught to manage it as well as women, they aren't held as accountable. That messiness is damaged hair poking out untamed and untrained, not just beig messy.

It doesn't help that a lot of males are expected to keep their hair short - it'd at least be possible to learn how to take care of longer hair if you had it, but if you just sorta grow it out for the first time there's... Quite a bit of trial-and-error (much like growing your nails out for the first time). @.@


~Bianca

[Cloud Rat]

So, I'm a girl today.

Question- are there any explicitly male outfit/hair choices that are inherently male that I should be wary of? My hair goes down to my back- I usually just tie it up for girl days, but I'm thinking of trying some new things, and I wanna avoid certain choices made for only one gender.

[Arkhosia]

'Hello guys, 'sup?
I just got back from a field trip to DC!
Also, think I might just be genderfluid or androgynous

[ArlEammon]

Can I talk to Metditto?
I have some um. . . triggeresque questions.

[Coidzor]

So, I'm a girl today.

Question- are there any explicitly male outfit/hair choices that are inherently male that I should be wary of? My hair goes down to my back- I usually just tie it up for girl days, but I'm thinking of trying some new things, and I wanna avoid certain choices made for only one gender.

Well, I suppose you probably wouldn't want to dress up as a leatherman(leather man?) then, but other than similarly very specific examples that you should probably already know about, nothing really comes to mind as far as traps or pitfalls. I suppose if you pulled out a Femme Tuxedo, or boring old regular Tuxedo, then you would get some second glances, but that would mainly depend upon how well you were passing and if a tuxedo was ridiculously overdressed for where you were.

As far as hair goes... unless you're a fan of going bald, buzzed, looking like Skrillex, or with a glorious Pompadour, you're probably good. I suppose a chonmage (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chonmage)top knot would also draw a mixture of confusion & male coding, but you're not likely to want to wear one of those. Assuming some base level cultural awareness, it seems unlikely that one would accidentally male-coded hair. Or at least, wracking my brain, I can't think of anything that wouldn't be obvious before one had one's hair made up in that manner. :smallconfused: Especially if you're not getting a massive length reduction, since the only male hairstyle with length like that would be the cue/queue. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queue_%28hairstyle%29)

[WarKitty]

So, I'm a girl today.

Question- are there any explicitly male outfit/hair choices that are inherently male that I should be wary of? My hair goes down to my back- I usually just tie it up for girl days, but I'm thinking of trying some new things, and I wanna avoid certain choices made for only one gender.

My main advice would be to keep it as neat as you can. Brush it smooth, pull back, and brush it all back into your hand so it's as smooth as you can make it before you tie it up.

[Grytorm]

What would "blended face powder" be? In my sisters makeup box thing I have found a reasonably large round of it. I have tried putting it on a few times but it doesn't look right. At least partially because I don't have the brush that goes with it and have used tissue. Would it be foundation?

Also I tries on lipstick today. It feels interesting but I do not know if I actively like it. I don't actively dislike it. But I am the kind of person who often doesn't care what people look like so I have a hard time forming an active opinion about myself. However I have realized I don't particularly like my eyes.

[Coidzor]

What would "blended face powder" be? In my sisters makeup box thing I have found a reasonably large round of it. I have tried putting it on a few times but it doesn't look right. At least partially because I don't have the brush that goes with it and have used tissue. Would it be foundation?

Also I tries on lipstick today. It feels interesting but I do not know if I actively like it. I don't actively dislike it. But I am the kind of person who often doesn't care what people look like so I have a hard time forming an active opinion about myself. However I have realized I don't particularly like my eyes.

It seems (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Face_powder)to be a "setting powder (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3HOFtWPhZs)" whatever that means (http://accidentalbeauty.com/makeup/setting-powder-101/). I think it's supposed to seal your foundation/wet makeup so that it's more protected/lasts longer/is "sealed." :smallconfused:

I wouldn't like lipstick in my eyes either. So why don't you like your eyes?

[Irish Musician]

Just posting on here that I am still lurking about. Just have nothing to add, so I don't.

However, that being said, I am still available to receive PMs if you ever need anyone to talk to. Want to rant, rave, or slag?

Call me. I can take it. I might even be able to say something that helps.

*hugs* :smallsmile:

[Grytorm]

I don't like my eyes because they are to far back, perhaps because I am not getting enough sleep. And it doesn't look like the area around me eyes are very big. Not a lot of space above them before I reach my eyebrows. This is made worse by somewhat long bangs.

[ArlEammon]

Is anyone in here willing to answer some adult questions I have?

[SiuiS]

I can try to help, but be aware that I am me. Some people find me opaque, some people find me disrespectful or mean apparently, and some people find me too detached from things to be helpful.

[Miriel]

*Gives Caroline big hugs*

Thank you :smallsmile: I'll need them.


And here's a couple of (kinda low res) photos my sis-in-law took when we went to the Miss Fisher costume exhibition:

http://24.media.tumblr.com/35abc2bf5a0203b8d3717d4eb8fe934c/tumblr_n64qi8kbpp1r3nwsxo1_500.jpg

http://37.media.tumblr.com/6aee3a1b97e46c976a42f704e4525b58/tumblr_n64qi8kbpp1r3nwsxo5_500.jpg
You're just so pretty...


And a life update:

Still fighting depression, had a few like panic attacks and such, still not working but I'm on benefits now at least (been about 8 months since I was in hospital). My daughter moved away but she comes down and stays for a weekend every month now and a week during holidays, and she's using female pronouns with me so life's kind of going well in some ways.

Biggest problem is I sleep far too much, like 16 hours some days, just have no enthusiasm to get out of bed some days.
Like others, I understand the "no enthusiasm" thing, etc. *hug offer* I'm doing sort of okay on my good days, + I'm kept alive by all the work (pleasant or not) I have to do. I rarely actually "sleep" because insomnia, anxiety, stuff. Even so, I'm sort of functional about 8 hours a day, starting around 2 p.m., including the time I spend doing my makeup and stuff. And after that, I spend the evening crying and being depressed until I'm so tired I fall asleep. And after a few days of being functional, I crash completely for a couple of days. Eating is a problem.

Hum. Sorry I answered your post by complaining randomly...

It's nice that your daughter uses the right pronouns though :smallsmile:


Today I realized that malls are extremely creepy. I went to one today, looked around at all the stores, and saw how many clothing stores were there. It is just plain creepy. I considered getting makeup and trying to figure it out myself but I realized it is available in an overwhelming selection and is rather expensive. I might see if any of my few friends would be willing to help me try makeup. A list of people I could ask is very short. Two people definately and maybe a third person.
You can buy it online, it's less scary that way. But yeah, it's never free. But to start/try out, it may be best to buy cheap brands.


What would "blended face powder" be? In my sisters makeup box thing I have found a reasonably large round of it. I have tried putting it on a few times but it doesn't look right. At least partially because I don't have the brush that goes with it and have used tissue. Would it be foundation?

Also I tries on lipstick today. It feels interesting but I do not know if I actively like it. I don't actively dislike it. But I am the kind of person who often doesn't care what people look like so I have a hard time forming an active opinion about myself. However I have realized I don't particularly like my eyes.
It's what it says -- powder. You put it over your foundation, or you can put it without foundation too, but it's not foundation. And yeah, powder without anything, it won't work very well... Video on how to apply powder (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-9lyg9DNfsY).

For eyes, you will need eyeliner (prefereably a pen marker). You can do many things and it's relatively easy.

[HMS Sophia]

Is anyone in here willing to answer some adult questions I have?

I would be if you're still around, but I can be pretty blunt.

[Lycunadari]

Yeah, that was so accurate it's scary. Didn't notice I was picking at my nails through it and now my thumb's bleeding.



I hope not. *looks awkwardly at new person upthread's name*

And here's a couple of (kinda low res) photos my sis-in-law took when we went to the Miss Fisher costume exhibition:

http://24.media.tumblr.com/35abc2bf5a0203b8d3717d4eb8fe934c/tumblr_n64qi8kbpp1r3nwsxo1_500.jpg

http://37.media.tumblr.com/6aee3a1b97e46c976a42f704e4525b58/tumblr_n64qi8kbpp1r3nwsxo5_500.jpg

And a life update:

Still fighting depression, had a few like panic attacks and such, still not working but I'm on benefits now at least (been about 8 months since I was in hospital). My daughter moved away but she comes down and stays for a weekend every month now and a week during holidays, and she's using female pronouns with me so life's kind of going well in some ways.

Biggest problem is I sleep far too much, like 16 hours some days, just have no enthusiasm to get out of bed some days.
Zorg, you are so pretty, and you have such lovely clothes! :smallsmile: And I hope things get better for you, depression really sucks. I wish I could do more to help you than just write here...


---
I hate my chest so much these days. It's getting hot outside and I'm so envious of the guys who can just take of their shirts and go topless. But even if it was socially acceptable for people with breasts to go topless, I still couldn't do it because it would make every attempt at passing futile (not that I pass as anything other than female if I wear clothes, but I can at least try).
I can't wear tight or thin shirts without a binder if I don't want to get stares because my nipples show through my clothes, and I still have to wear a binder with all clothes if I don't want to get dysphoric every time I look into a mirror because it's getting to warm to just hide under several layers of clothes. But binding sucks, it's hot and it hurts, and my binder tends to roll up or down, or doesn't stay in place. :smallsigh:
I really want top surgery but I'd probably have to pay for it myself because I'm not a trans guy and I don't even know if there are any places that offer it for non-medical reasons. :smallfrown:

– Juniper

[SiuiS]

Oof. First real brush with Baby Won't Stop Crying. Turned that from a nap to an exhausted sleep. >_<



I hate my chest so much these days. It's getting hot outside and I'm so envious of the guys who can just take of their shirts and go topless. But even if it was socially acceptable for people with breasts to go topless, I still couldn't do it because it would make every attempt at passing futile (not that I pass as anything other than female if I wear clothes, but I can at least try).
I can't wear tight or thin shirts without a binder if I don't want to get stares because my nipples show through my clothes, and I still have to wear a binder with all clothes if I don't want to get dysphoric every time I look into a mirror because it's getting to warm to just hide under several layers of clothes. But binding sucks, it's hot and it hurts, and my binder tends to roll up or down, or doesn't stay in place. :smallsigh:
I really want top surgery but I'd probably have to pay for it myself because I'm not a trans guy and I don't even know if there are any places that offer it for non-medical reasons. :smallfrown:


Mm. I understand. I do think you pass, though, at least visually.
I'm not sure on the surgery, actually. Worth looking into.

[HMS Sophia]

Oof. First real brush with Baby Won't Stop Crying. Turned that from a nap to an exhausted sleep. >_<

SiuiS has a wee one? Quick, we must share horror stories of child rearing to scare all the non parents :smalltongue:

[Asta Kask]

SiuiS has a wee one? Quick, we must share horror stories of child rearing to scare all the non parents :smalltongue:

I hear Brazen Shield has one too. :smallwink:

[Kindablue]

I hear Brazen Shield has one too. :smallwink:

They should share parenting tips or something.

[HMS Sophia]

I hear Brazen Shield has one too. :smallwink:
What is this madness? People? Breeding? crazy...


They should share parenting tips or something.
That's something that never causes arguments :smallamused:

[Asta Kask]

Well, apparently they've met in real life so maybe they can get on without too many arguments.

[Kindablue]

Well, apparently they've met in real life so maybe they can get on without too many arguments.

Huh, that's weird. Small world.

[Philemonite]

Asta, stop messing with people, even if it is fun.:smallbiggrin:

Si and Braz have a baby together.

[SiuiS]

They should share parenting tips or something.

Oooh no! That's how this whole thing got started! No more tips for her.

[Kindablue]

Oooh no! That's how this whole thing got started! No more tips for her.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uXILNncQwH4

[HMS Sophia]

I wonder if I'm allowed to share...
Shameless self promotion here:
http://www.drivethrufiction.com/product/130545/The-Gorgons-Mirror
LGBT friendly sci-fi/fantasy amateur writers magazine! (Showcasing the work of several people here, though I wont name names :smallamused:)

[Asta Kask]

I've heard that ships are always female... but I wonder if there are transgender ships out there... roaming the sea... maybe that's why there are accidents?

[Turnips]

Oh hi thread.

Anyway how is your sex life.

[Lentrax]

Oooh no! That's how this whole thing got started! No more tips for her.

*rimshot.*

[Asta Kask]

Oooh no! That's how this whole thing got started! No more tips for her.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-nbYe_SMFFOs/TyTbkeB2MDI/AAAAAAAAAJw/2gc8XDCGSJI/s1600/Reservoir-Dogs-Mr-Pink-Tip-Percent.jpg

[Lentrax]

Mr. Pink.

You've convinced me. Gimme my dollar back!

[noparlpf]

Ok. This is a bit awkward to come out and ask, actually. I've made a new account just for it. This seemed like the best place for it, and I've been told that you guys are pretty knowledgeable. Just going to start it out slow.

How does one know if one is asexual?

AVEN has some good info but you already got linked that. Basically, everybody's experience will be slightly different. In general, if you generally don't find people sexually attractive and/or have a low or nonexistent sex drive, you might be on the asexual spectrum. (Super simple version.)

[Kesnit]

Question- are there any explicitly male outfit/hair choices that are inherently male that I should be wary of? My hair goes down to my back- I usually just tie it up for girl days, but I'm thinking of trying some new things, and I wanna avoid certain choices made for only one gender.

In general, when wearing a ponytail, women usually tie it in the middle-back of the skull. Men usually tie it at the base of the skull.


Also I tries on lipstick today. It feels interesting but I do not know if I actively like it.

There is no requirement to wear it if you don't like it. I know a lot of women who despise lipstick and refuse to wear it. (It also tastes nasty, and there is a trick to learning to eat without eating your lipstick.




In other news, I finally got back on hormones. My insurance company refused to pay for the gel, even though it's on their approved list. (If I am reading the denial right, the denial was because I did not document the fact that I've used injectable t and the patch in the past, but prefer the gel.) My doctor filed an appeal mid-May, but I was told I would not have an answer until the end of June. To tide me over, I got the doctor to write a prescription for injectable t, which I thought my insurance would cover. Turns out insurance will only cover a 1 month supply - 2mL - and the t only comes in 5 mL and 10 mL vials. But it isn't too expensive out of pocket. So I'm good for 2.5 months, which should get me through until I get word back from insurance on whether or not they'll pay for the gel.

Not that I expect anyone cares. I posted about the original rejection for the gel and asked if anyone had suggestions, but no one bothered to acknowledge what I had written.

[Lycunadari]

Oof. First real brush with Baby Won't Stop Crying. Turned that from a nap to an exhausted sleep. >_<



Mm. I understand. I do think you pass, though, at least visually.
I'm not sure on the surgery, actually. Worth looking into.
Thanks. It's difficult, I might pass if I don't speak and wear only strictly male-coded clothes, but I don't have many of them and I don't particularly like them (I just like my colours and flower patterns :smalltongue: ). And my body language is still very feminine, I think.
Surgery is interesting, I looked it up and then suddenly I was like "would I still be able to breast feed?". I really, really don't want to get pregnant and/or give birth, but somehow the thought of not being able to breast feed was scary. My gender is strange.



In other news, I finally got back on hormones. My insurance company refused to pay for the gel, even though it's on their approved list. (If I am reading the denial right, the denial was because I did not document the fact that I've used injectable t and the patch in the past, but prefer the gel.) My doctor filed an appeal mid-May, but I was told I would not have an answer until the end of June. To tide me over, I got the doctor to write a prescription for injectable t, which I thought my insurance would cover. Turns out insurance will only cover a 1 month supply - 2mL - and the t only comes in 5 mL and 10 mL vials. But it isn't too expensive out of pocket. So I'm good for 2.5 months, which should get me through until I get word back from insurance on whether or not they'll pay for the gel.

Not that I expect anyone cares. I posted about the original rejection for the gel and asked if anyone had suggestions, but no one bothered to acknowledge what I had written.
Glad to hear you got your hormones back and I hope your insurance will pay for it!
I read about your problems to get them, but I didn't have any suggestions so I didn't write anything. Sorry. *offers hugs*

---

Just came out to two friends who asked why I was listed as Juniper on Sophia's magazine and they reacted both well. :smallsmile:

[bladequeen420]

Today's my birthday

[Lentrax]

snipped.[/spoiler]

I also apologize for not acknowledging this. It was rude of me. I will now redeem my la ck of honor by committing thread seppuku!

[bladequeen420]

Also any advice for clothing stores that are punk grunge alt style

[HMS Sophia]

Also any advice for clothing stores that are punk grunge alt style

Happy Birthday.
Also, Let me be the first to be super sarcastic and say Hot Topic?
You're a yank right? I'm afraid I have no serious suggestions, sorry :smalltongue:

And yes, It seems I outed Juniper :smallredface: whoops

[Delusion]

In general, when wearing a ponytail, women usually tie it in the middle-back of the skull. Men usually tie it at the base of the skull.



There is no requirement to wear it if you don't like it. I know a lot of women who despise lipstick and refuse to wear it. (It also tastes nasty, and there is a trick to learning to eat without eating your lipstick.




In other news, I finally got back on hormones. My insurance company refused to pay for the gel, even though it's on their approved list. (If I am reading the denial right, the denial was because I did not document the fact that I've used injectable t and the patch in the past, but prefer the gel.) My doctor filed an appeal mid-May, but I was told I would not have an answer until the end of June. To tide me over, I got the doctor to write a prescription for injectable t, which I thought my insurance would cover. Turns out insurance will only cover a 1 month supply - 2mL - and the t only comes in 5 mL and 10 mL vials. But it isn't too expensive out of pocket. So I'm good for 2.5 months, which should get me through until I get word back from insurance on whether or not they'll pay for the gel.

Not that I expect anyone cares. I posted about the original rejection for the gel and asked if anyone had suggestions, but no one bothered to acknowledge what I had written.

Is good that you got them again ^^

Btw, bit of stupid guestion, but since trans women get anti-androgens do trans men get anything similar? like anti-estrogen?

[Miriel]

In other news, I finally got back on hormones. My insurance company refused to pay for the gel, even though it's on their approved list. (If I am reading the denial right, the denial was because I did not document the fact that I've used injectable t and the patch in the past, but prefer the gel.) My doctor filed an appeal mid-May, but I was told I would not have an answer until the end of June. To tide me over, I got the doctor to write a prescription for injectable t, which I thought my insurance would cover. Turns out insurance will only cover a 1 month supply - 2mL - and the t only comes in 5 mL and 10 mL vials. But it isn't too expensive out of pocket. So I'm good for 2.5 months, which should get me through until I get word back from insurance on whether or not they'll pay for the gel.

Not that I expect anyone cares. I posted about the original rejection for the gel and asked if anyone had suggestions, but no one bothered to acknowledge what I had written.
Yay :smallsmile: It's better than nothing.

Like Juniper, I read about your problems, but I didn't know what suggestion to give.


Today's my birthday
Happy birthday!

[Axinian]

Oh hi thread.

Anyway how is your sex life.

Do you understand lief?! DO YOU!?

[ArlEammon]

Oh hi thread.

Anyway how is your sex life.

Tommy Wisseau, is that you?

[Mina Kobold]

There is no requirement to wear it if you don't like it. I know a lot of women who despise lipstick and refuse to wear it. (It also tastes nasty, and there is a trick to learning to eat without eating your lipstick.

Sounds like a reason to invent tastier lipstick to me. :3

That, or get cuttlefish superpowers and change my lips' colour with those. Could also learn to eat without eating lipstick, but I like superpowers. X3


In other news, I finally got back on hormones. My insurance company refused to pay for the gel, even though it's on their approved list. (If I am reading the denial right, the denial was because I did not document the fact that I've used injectable t and the patch in the past, but prefer the gel.) My doctor filed an appeal mid-May, but I was told I would not have an answer until the end of June. To tide me over, I got the doctor to write a prescription for injectable t, which I thought my insurance would cover. Turns out insurance will only cover a 1 month supply - 2mL - and the t only comes in 5 mL and 10 mL vials. But it isn't too expensive out of pocket. So I'm good for 2.5 months, which should get me through until I get word back from insurance on whether or not they'll pay for the gel.

Not that I expect anyone cares. I posted about the original rejection for the gel and asked if anyone had suggestions, but no one bothered to acknowledge what I had written.

That sounds like an awful bureaucracy. Why not just allow people to get the equivalent of a month's supply, but in bigger vials? 2ml is not a magical size that saves you money, nor should that be the first priority when helping people meet their needs. >_<

Also don't see why they don't want to provide gel. Needles are scary and even if they weren't, it's quite cruel to force people to use a method they're not comfortable with if there is equally useful ones that they are comfortable with. It's like providing someone who don't like spices with only extra-spicy food, which is mean.

I couldn't think of anything to say, since I still am nowhere near even beginning HRT yet. Then the thread got several more pages of posts before I could think of anything and it felt awkward to reply to stuff several pages ago and... Sorry! m(_ _)m


Today's my birthday

Happy birthday! ^_^

[Asta Kask]

AVEN has some good info but you already got linked that. Basically, everybody's experience will be slightly different. In general, if you generally don't find people sexually attractive and/or have a low or nonexistent sex drive, you might be on the asexual spectrum. (Super simple version.)

And it shouldn't be because of some medication or other condition.

[noparlpf]

And it shouldn't be because of some medication or other condition.

Oh yeah, there's that. If you're on like, SSRIs or have been castrated &c., low sex drive probably isn't related to asexuality.

[Asta Kask]

Today's my birthday


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uo_TRFXh5XI

[KerfuffleMach2]

In general, when wearing a ponytail, women usually tie it in the middle-back of the skull. Men usually tie it at the base of the skull.

I can confirm that men tie theirs low, because that's how I tie my hair.

Other than that...The only male/female thing I can think of for hair is that the more work you have to put into getting and maintaining the style, the more likely it is to be a female style.

Anyways, what's up people? Been a while since I posted in this thread.

[Asta Kask]

Oh yeah, there's that. If you're on like, SSRIs or have been castrated &c., low sex drive probably isn't related to asexuality.

It's a standard thing they have on all ICD/DSM diagnoses. Asexuality shouldn't be treated as an illness, but it still pays to look at the official systems to see if they've got any tips.

[Karen Lynn]

So... Uhh (http://i.imgur.com/OlQA3rf.jpg)... I have a moderately poor pic of an outfit I just bought... If ya wanna see it and stuff, you just need to click the second word.

[Lex-Kat]

Yep, it can be. Apparently, getting one letter from a professional and a declaration under oath is not enough for them. I need a diagnosis of GID AND proof that I'm on hormones. Which is pretty ridiculous. I AM on hormones, I swore an oath to that.

I'm stuck between wanting to fight them to the deah and crying my heart out (actually, I don't think I have any ears left to cry, my eyes hurt a lot).

Oh, and for added insult, the salutations: "Nous vous prions d'accepter, Monsieur [= Sir], nos salutations distinguées." It's a standard formula, but the gendering is totally useless and hurtful, especially in a rejection letter.

Thanks everyone.

Thanks.

Yeah, it's pretty ridiculous. Just... why?

I don't understand either. :smallfrown: I guess they assume that gender and name are permanent, so why could you change it? Anyway, my name and gender (well, not "mine" really) are all used in identity codes for no purpose, because they feel like it.

Paid them more than a month's worth of food for filing the demand. Just in case they thought I wasn't serious. (That's not counting what I paid to actually fill in the demand, sexologist, oath, etc. Overall, it cost me a month's rent.)

It'll get sorted. Somehow. Anyway. I have a month to sort it out, after that they close my file...
*Hugs* They close your file? As in you can't request a name-change ever again? :smallconfused:

Sorry I haven't been here. I didn't notice the new thread. :smalleek:


Today I realized that malls are extremely creepy. I went to one today, looked around at all the stores, and saw how many clothing stores were there. It is just plain creepy. I considered getting makeup and trying to figure it out myself but I realized it is available in an overwhelming selection and is rather expensive. I might see if any of my few friends would be willing to help me try makeup. A list of people I could ask is very short. Two people definately and maybe a third person.
A co-worker of mine suggested the M.A.C. counter. I don't know if there is one near where you live. But I went, and they were super friendly. Also Super-Expensive. But you can get a free make-over and learn how to apply it. I learned a little, but I was just so excited to having it done at all...

I bought a lot, and I still haven't tried to put it on myself. I'm kinda afraid to do it wrong. But I did finally buy some cheaper foundation, to practice with. I really need to work on this.

I love lipstick. I'm lucky, I think, in that I seem to be able to apply it rather well without looking like clown-lips. :smallyuk:

[Miriel]

*Hugs* They close your file? As in you can't request a name-change ever again? :smallconfused:
No, but they'll send back all my papers and I'll have to do it again from the start :smallsigh:

But I think it should work. I sent my rejection-ish letter to the local leading trans activist, who was looking for that kind of thing exactly to fight for the possibly to change names without medical notes, etc. She talked to someone in the bureaucracy, who said it should be fine. But then, when I talked to the bureaucracy, I received only more confusion.

It's probably par for the course for bureaucracy.

[Lex-Kat]

I hope it works out for you. :smallsmile:

[Miriel]

I hope it works out for you. :smallsmile:

It will. I'll fight. It'll work. And if it doesn't, I'll appeal in court, and it will work there.

I mean, it's pretty horrible, all of this, I think, but having something to fight about right now is good for me. It gives me purpose, which is otherwise lacking in my life at the moment.

[Grytorm]

It will. I'll fight. It'll work. And if it doesn't, I'll appeal in court, and it will work there.

I mean, it's pretty horrible, all of this, I think, but having something to fight about right now is good for me. It gives me purpose, which is otherwise lacking in my life at the moment.

I am thinking that this might be the reason why I am interested in transgenderism currently. That and some sort of coping mechanism for depression and loneliness. Also maybe some legitimate curiosity about being female. But I don't know. I probably will still experiment though. And it could actually go somewhere.

Edit: Interesting. My dislike of my own life can exploit doubts about my own gender identity. Not in a way that says it is wrong but instead it is attacking through the idea of not wanting to be feminine. To not want to explore myself. To give up. Minor experimentation with makeup and fantasizing about being female has been at least mildly pleasant. I still feel down though. I have no idea if finding this thread has been a net positive or negative.

[Miriel]

I should be getting my name :smallsmile: After much fighting, it was agreed that I would only need a letter from my pharmacist.

Oh, and I had some free time and answered frequent Google questions on trans stuff (http://lucreziacontarini.wordpress.com/2014/06/03/a-trans-faq-lets-help-google/).

[Astrella]

I should be getting my name :smallsmile: After much fighting, it was agreed that I would only need a letter from my pharmacist.

Oh, and I had some free time and answered frequent Google questions on trans stuff (http://lucreziacontarini.wordpress.com/2014/06/03/a-trans-faq-lets-help-google/).

That's good. :)

[Philemonite]

I should be getting my name :smallsmile: After much fighting, it was agreed that I would only need a letter from my pharmacist.

Oh, and I had some free time and answered frequent Google questions on trans stuff (http://lucreziacontarini.wordpress.com/2014/06/03/a-trans-faq-lets-help-google/).

You are so awesome.:smallredface:

[Comrade]

I should be getting my name :smallsmile: After much fighting, it was agreed that I would only need a letter from my pharmacist.

Oh, and I had some free time and answered frequent Google questions on trans stuff (http://lucreziacontarini.wordpress.com/2014/06/03/a-trans-faq-lets-help-google/).

Nice article! And good luck with your name.

[Marnath]

I should be getting my name :smallsmile: After much fighting, it was agreed that I would only need a letter from my pharmacist.

Oh, and I had some free time and answered frequent Google questions on trans stuff (http://lucreziacontarini.wordpress.com/2014/06/03/a-trans-faq-lets-help-google/).

Nice! :smallsmile:

Why a pharmacist, though? Don't they only hand out the medications that Doctors tell them you can have?

[Axinian]

I should be getting my name :smallsmile: After much fighting, it was agreed that I would only need a letter from my pharmacist.

Oh, and I had some free time and answered frequent Google questions on trans stuff (http://lucreziacontarini.wordpress.com/2014/06/03/a-trans-faq-lets-help-google/).

Yay!

And I love reading your articles. The stuff you talk about is very important and true, and really needs more attention.


after all, if you're "a woman in a man's body," you always were a woman, you just "received the wrong body. (This topos is not one that is used by all trans people to describe their experience. I don't like it, for one

This actually made me feel really good. I've been feeling down lately because I've been reaching out and reading trans literature and the like recently in the hopes finding someone to relate to in this. Oddly, I've felt MORE alone since I've been doing this, because I haven't been able to find someone who's narrative really syncs up with mine. The "feeling wrong since childhood and I'm born in the wrong body" thing, I feel, is a sort of general, or "Hollywood-ized" experience. This is not to disparage those for whom this experience is true, but I feel people tend to take this story and assume it's the case for everyone (even some trans people do this). Like this is the plot they would use to make a movie about a transgender person without even considering other possible experiences. Seeing someone else critical of this description made me feel not as alone :smallsmile:

Me, I've come to feel that I am transexual, but not necessarily transgender in the assumed sense. I'm waffling between agender and gender fluid, but I definitely want a female body. I don't feel that my "spirit" is necessarily female all the time (or necessarily gendered) but I am still at odds with my body for some reason. I haven't really asked around here, but I've been unable to find people who feel the same. I'm not presuming that you feel the same either, but this short phrase helped a lot.

[KerfuffleMach2]

Yay!

And I love reading your articles. The stuff you talk about is very important and true, and really needs more attention.



This actually made me feel really good. I've been feeling down lately because I've been reaching out and reading trans literature and the like recently in the hopes finding someone to relate to in this. Oddly, I've felt MORE alone since I've been doing this, because I haven't been able to find someone who's narrative really syncs up with mine. The "feeling wrong since childhood and I'm born in the wrong body" thing, I feel, is a sort of general, or "Hollywood-ized" experience. This is not to disparage those for whom this experience is true, but I feel people tend to take this story and assume it's the case for everyone (even some trans people do this). Like this is the plot they would use to make a movie about a transgender person without even considering other possible experiences. Seeing someone else critical of this description made me feel not as alone :smallsmile:

Me, I've come to feel that I am transexual, but not necessarily transgender in the assumed sense. I'm waffling between agender and gender fluid, but I definitely want a female body. I don't feel that my "spirit" is necessarily female all the time (or necessarily gendered) but I am still at odds with my body for some reason. I haven't really asked around here, but I've been unable to find people who feel the same. I'm not presuming that you feel the same either, but this short phrase helped a lot.

My opinion on that stuff is that you are who you are. Screw labels. Don't need them. You're just whoever you are.

[Lex-Kat]

I should be getting my name :smallsmile: After much fighting, it was agreed that I would only need a letter from my pharmacist.
Awesome! :smallbiggrin:


Oh, and I had some free time and answered frequent Google questions on trans stuff (http://lucreziacontarini.wordpress.com/2014/06/03/a-trans-faq-lets-help-google/).
Cool. I'll read it in a while. :smallcool:


Why a pharmacist, though? Don't they only hand out the medications that Doctors tell them you can have?
I could be wrong, but I think the question answers itself. Their records can show that Caroline does indeed buy and take the hormones they want proof of.

[Asta Kask]

My opinion on that stuff is that you are who you are. Screw labels. Don't need them. You're just whoever you are.

I don't know. Labels save a lot of work (provided both people use them the same way). By saying something like "I'm Jewish" you've spared everyone involved a long conversation of dietary practices. Very handy.

[KerfuffleMach2]

I don't know. Labels save a lot of work (provided both people use them the same way). By saying something like "I'm Jewish" you've spared everyone involved a long conversation of dietary practices. Very handy.

Well, I guess I meant more on how you see yourself.

[Mono Vertigo]

Hi.
I'm thinking of starting a parallel LGBT+ thread, meant for education rather than support, and with a different tone. If I go through with the project and post it, anyone who would like to participate and answer questions, LGBT or ally, is very welcome.
I have a draft for the OP. Hopefully, I haven't made any glaring mistake.
Hello!
Welcome to the LGBT+ questions thread. This thread is meant to answer all sorts of questions one may have about the community, and have a casual atmosphere.
As such, this is an education thread, not a support thread (which you can conveniently find [there] instead). Why the split? Because the main thread is mostly populated by LGBT people who are seeking, well, support, and some questions or misunderstandings can be causes of additional stress. You can ask these questions here instead, and receive answers from LGBT people or allies. They can be as general or as narrow as you want.

A couple things you need to know before browsing the rest of this thread:
- if you are LGBT+ but do not wish to educate people, or are likely to be offended by the lack of knowledge of some people, you're probably better off not reading this thread.
- if you have questions, go ahead! But try to stay polite and open-minded. Also, before asking here, I suggest you read the first post of the [main LGBT thread]; there's a useful glossary there and some specific information that might answer your question. If your question has an element of support (like “I think I might be transgender, how do I know for sure?” or “my LGBT friend has problems with their parents, how could I help?”), it can also be posted over there.
- avoid misinformation. If you intentionally pull stuff out of your backside repeatedly, I will track you down, and force you to play in a game where the GMPCs are Drizz't and a Kender. (Theoretically unenforceable? You can never be 100% sure. Don't tempt your luck.)
- mind the forum rules and avoid the subjects of politics or religion (or sexually-explicit content for that matter). Otherwise, there is no subject that is preemptively banned, and we'd like it to stay this way; therefore, if a discussion upsets or angers you, report the offending posts (if a forum rule has actually been infringed) and/or step away from the computer until you calm down, instead of starting a flame war. This is the Internet. We're physically stuck behind your screen. The worst we can do is send stupid PMs until the inbox is full – and you don't even have to acknowledge their content before deleting them! We can't follow you and force you to keep arguing.
- no one here should be shunned here for unfortunately lacking some knowledge but desiring to learn. Nothing is self-evident, and that's even more true where gender and sexuality are concerned. (Now, if you request to be educated but act deliberately obtuse when replied to, you're gonna have a bad time. Don't be deliberately obtuse. Nobody likes morons.)


Last thing: knowledge is power. You step in as a kobold, and leave as a dragon - that's the general idea anyway.
I'll check back for feedback, but still avoid participating to other discussions here for the time being.

[Irish Musician]

I'll support the community in any way I can, Mus, so if you start it, I'll help in any way I can :smallsmile:

Matthew

[Astrella]

This actually made me feel really good. I've been feeling down lately because I've been reaching out and reading trans literature and the like recently in the hopes finding someone to relate to in this. Oddly, I've felt MORE alone since I've been doing this, because I haven't been able to find someone who's narrative really syncs up with mine. The "feeling wrong since childhood and I'm born in the wrong body" thing, I feel, is a sort of general, or "Hollywood-ized" experience. This is not to disparage those for whom this experience is true, but I feel people tend to take this story and assume it's the case for everyone (even some trans people do this). Like this is the plot they would use to make a movie about a transgender person without even considering other possible experiences. Seeing someone else critical of this description made me feel not as alone :smallsmile:ople who feel the same. I'm not presuming that you feel the same either, but this short phrase helped a lot.

A big contributor to it is also that up until recently and in a lot of places still medical professionals require it. Like, originally not being straight or having had sex or whatever wasn't required. You even had to pass to receive medical help with transitioning. So cause of all this a lot of trans women wised up and just, starting playing along the narrative to actually get help. It's something people did to actually survive and explains why the concept is so prevalent, because of how strong gatekeeping is and how much power it has over us.

[Philemonite]

Hi.
I'm thinking of starting a parallel LGBT+ thread, meant for education rather than support, and with a different tone. If I go through with the project and post it, anyone who would like to participate and answer questions, LGBT or ally, is very welcome.
I have a draft for the OP. Hopefully, I haven't made any glaring mistake.
Hello!
Welcome to the LGBT+ questions thread. This thread is meant to answer all sorts of questions one may have about the community, and have a casual atmosphere.
As such, this is an education thread, not a support thread (which you can conveniently find [there] instead). Why the split? Because the main thread is mostly populated by LGBT people who are seeking, well, support, and some questions or misunderstandings can be causes of additional stress. You can ask these questions here instead, and receive answers from LGBT people or allies. They can be as general or as narrow as you want.

A couple things you need to know before browsing the rest of this thread:
- if you are LGBT+ but do not wish to educate people, or are likely to be offended by the lack of knowledge of some people, you're probably better off not reading this thread.
- if you have questions, go ahead! But try to stay polite and open-minded. Also, before asking here, I suggest you read the first post of the [main LGBT thread]; there's a useful glossary there and some specific information that might answer your question. If your question has an element of support (like “I think I might be transgender, how do I know for sure?” or “my LGBT friend has problems with their parents, how could I help?”), it can also be posted over there.
- avoid misinformation. If you intentionally pull stuff out of your backside repeatedly, I will track you down, and force you to play in a game where the GMPCs are Drizz't and a Kender. (Theoretically unenforceable? You can never be 100% sure. Don't tempt your luck.)
- mind the forum rules and avoid the subjects of politics or religion (or sexually-explicit content for that matter). Otherwise, there is no subject that is preemptively banned, and we'd like it to stay this way; therefore, if a discussion upsets or angers you, report the offending posts (if a forum rule has actually been infringed) and/or step away from the computer until you calm down, instead of starting a flame war. This is the Internet. We're physically stuck behind your screen. The worst we can do is send stupid PMs until the inbox is full – and you don't even have to acknowledge their content before deleting them! We can't follow you and force you to keep arguing.
- no one here should be shunned here for unfortunately lacking some knowledge but desiring to learn. Nothing is self-evident, and that's even more true where gender and sexuality are concerned. (Now, if you request to be educated but act deliberately obtuse when replied to, you're gonna have a bad time. Don't be deliberately obtuse. Nobody likes morons.)


Last thing: knowledge is power. You step in as a kobold, and leave as a dragon - that's the general idea anyway.
I'll check back for feedback, but still avoid participating to other discussions here for the time being.

Sounds good to me. I noticed that G is not too present in this thread, so I will volunteer what little knowledge I have.:smallwink:

[Miriel]

That's good. :)

You are so awesome.:smallredface:

Nice article! And good luck with your name.

Yay!

And I love reading your articles. The stuff you talk about is very important and true, and really needs more attention.

Awesome! :smallbiggrin:

Cool. I'll read it in a while. :smallcool:

Nice! :smallsmile:
Thanks everyone :smallsmile: :smallredface:


Why a pharmacist, though? Don't they only hand out the medications that Doctors tell them you can have?
What Lex-Kat said, I guess. But whatever they do is completely beyond my understand. They said I could also ask something from the sexologist who gave me my diagnosis, which is very strange. What would they want from her? Anyway.


A big contributor to it is also that up until recently and in a lot of places still medical professionals require it. Like, originally not being straight or having had sex or whatever wasn't required. You even had to pass to receive medical help with transitioning. So cause of all this a lot of trans women wised up and just, starting playing along the narrative to actually get help. It's something people did to actually survive and explains why the concept is so prevalent, because of how strong gatekeeping is and how much power it has over us.
And even not-exactly-normative trans people have it easy, when compared to genderqueer people requesting hormones. The sexologist I was, who was specifically trained for this stuff, said that if you weren't a man or a woman, you were confused/you had not decided yet. :smallsigh:


This actually made me feel really good. I've been feeling down lately because I've been reaching out and reading trans literature and the like recently in the hopes finding someone to relate to in this. Oddly, I've felt MORE alone since I've been doing this, because I haven't been able to find someone who's narrative really syncs up with mine. The "feeling wrong since childhood and I'm born in the wrong body" thing, I feel, is a sort of general, or "Hollywood-ized" experience. This is not to disparage those for whom this experience is true, but I feel people tend to take this story and assume it's the case for everyone (even some trans people do this). Like this is the plot they would use to make a movie about a transgender person without even considering other possible experiences. Seeing someone else critical of this description made me feel not as alone :smallsmile:

Me, I've come to feel that I am transexual, but not necessarily transgender in the assumed sense. I'm waffling between agender and gender fluid, but I definitely want a female body. I don't feel that my "spirit" is necessarily female all the time (or necessarily gendered) but I am still at odds with my body for some reason. I haven't really asked around here, but I've been unable to find people who feel the same. I'm not presuming that you feel the same either, but this short phrase helped a lot.
:smallsmile: I'm glad it helped.

If you google "transnormativity", I'm sure you will find things that match better with your experience, or at least that don't fit the classic narrative. I don't fit it either. Although I see clues now, I never "knew" I was a woman. I have few memories from my childhood. Going to an all-male high school didn't help. Anyway, I still don't know what "being a woman" means. Yet I'm obviously a girl, I'm more girly than most cis girls.

[Asta Kask]

Well, I guess I meant more on how you see yourself.

Oh. A misunderstanding then. :smallredface:

Yeah, you have access to all information (well, ideally anyway) and therefore there's no need for a label.

[KerfuffleMach2]

And even not-exactly-normative trans people have it easy, when compared to genderqueer people requesting hormones. The sexologist I was, who was specifically trained for this stuff, said that if you weren't a man or a woman, you were confused/you had not decided yet. :smallsigh:

Eh, I don't agree with your sexologist. Well, actually, I can see people having some confusion over it. But definitely not the decision part. Can't decide that sort of thing. I just see it more as maybe you just don't know. Lots of people don't really know who they are. Especially when they're younger.



:smallsmile: I'm glad it helped.

If you google "transnormativity", I'm sure you will find things that match better with your experience, or at least that don't fit the classic narrative. I don't fit it either. Although I see clues now, I never "knew" I was a woman. I have few memories from my childhood. Going to an all-male high school didn't help. Anyway, I still don't know what "being a woman" means. Yet I'm obviously a girl, I'm more girly than most cis girls.

Like I said earlier, I don't think you should worry too much about you're label. "Being a woman" is mostly based on opinions, anyways.

[Astrella]

Eh, I don't agree with your sexologist. Well, actually, I can see people having some confusion over it. But definitely not the decision part. Can't decide that sort of thing. I just see it more as maybe you just don't know. Lots of people don't really know who they are. Especially when they're younger.

That's the thing though, non-binary people are still a group that's very badly recognized by specialist. The medical field is at least a decade and probably more behind on actual trans people in most cases.

[KerfuffleMach2]

That's the thing though, non-binary people are still a group that's very badly recognized by specialist. The medical field is at least a decade and probably more behind on actual trans people in most cases.

I think part of the reason for that is that humans seem to have a need to categorize stuff, and sexuality and identity can't easily be categorized.

And the need to categorize seems to increase in applications like medicine. Especially since a lot of things are specific to each gender. I mean, you can't have ovarian issues if you don't have ovaries, no matter what you feel you are.

So, in those areas, the need to be a specific category makes some sense, but from a biological standppint.

[Comrade]

Me, I've come to feel that I am transexual, but not necessarily transgender in the assumed sense. I'm waffling between agender and gender fluid, but I definitely want a female body. I don't feel that my "spirit" is necessarily female all the time (or necessarily gendered) but I am still at odds with my body for some reason. I haven't really asked around here, but I've been unable to find people who feel the same. I'm not presuming that you feel the same either, but this short phrase helped a lot.

As an agender person experiencing something similar to this, I can definitely sympathise with you here!

[SiuiS]

My opinion on that stuff is that you are who you are. Screw labels. Don't need them. You're just whoever you are.

That's much easier to say when you aren't constantly under psychic assault because of it. A label is a shield. It's a way to say 'this is real, it has a name, I am not alone'. Names have power. And every now and then...



Like I said earlier, I don't think you should worry too much about you're label. "Being a woman" is mostly based on opinions, anyways.

Every now and then, we all need a little validation. No human is an island. You require human connection. Your body will sicken and either without caring touch. Your mind will lock into a downward spiral without considerate attention.

Being a woman is based on deeper things than opinion. Even if the label "woman" did not exist, the difference in the person still would. They would just lack an easy word to use to tell others. We name things to know them, but it's as much discovery as invention. Much like math, the words and terms may be invented English (or other language), but the concept exists despite humanity, not because of it.

Who and what we are is not because of our labels, but it is made easier by them.


Hi.
I'm thinking of starting a parallel LGBT+ thread, meant for education rather than support, and with a different tone. If I go through with the project and post it, anyone who would like to participate and answer questions, LGBT or ally, is very welcome.
I have a draft for the OP. Hopefully, I haven't made any glaring mistake.
Hello!
Welcome to the LGBT+ questions thread. This thread is meant to answer all sorts of questions one may have about the community, and have a casual atmosphere.
As such, this is an education thread, not a support thread (which you can conveniently find [there] instead). Why the split? Because the main thread is mostly populated by LGBT people who are seeking, well, support, and some questions or misunderstandings can be causes of additional stress. You can ask these questions here instead, and receive answers from LGBT people or allies. They can be as general or as narrow as you want.

A couple things you need to know before browsing the rest of this thread:
- if you are LGBT+ but do not wish to educate people, or are likely to be offended by the lack of knowledge of some people, you're probably better off not reading this thread.
- if you have questions, go ahead! But try to stay polite and open-minded. Also, before asking here, I suggest you read the first post of the [main LGBT thread]; there's a useful glossary there and some specific information that might answer your question. If your question has an element of support (like “I think I might be transgender, how do I know for sure?” or “my LGBT friend has problems with their parents, how could I help?”), it can also be posted over there.
- avoid misinformation. If you intentionally pull stuff out of your backside repeatedly, I will track you down, and force you to play in a game where the GMPCs are Drizz't and a Kender. (Theoretically unenforceable? You can never be 100% sure. Don't tempt your luck.)
- mind the forum rules and avoid the subjects of politics or religion (or sexually-explicit content for that matter). Otherwise, there is no subject that is preemptively banned, and we'd like it to stay this way; therefore, if a discussion upsets or angers you, report the offending posts (if a forum rule has actually been infringed) and/or step away from the computer until you calm down, instead of starting a flame war. This is the Internet. We're physically stuck behind your screen. The worst we can do is send stupid PMs until the inbox is full – and you don't even have to acknowledge their content before deleting them! We can't follow you and force you to keep arguing.
- no one here should be shunned here for unfortunately lacking some knowledge but desiring to learn. Nothing is self-evident, and that's even more true where gender and sexuality are concerned. (Now, if you request to be educated but act deliberately obtuse when replied to, you're gonna have a bad time. Don't be deliberately obtuse. Nobody likes morons.)


Last thing: knowledge is power. You step in as a kobold, and leave as a dragon - that's the general idea anyway.
I'll check back for feedback, but still avoid participating to other discussions here for the time being.

Rock on!

[Astrella]

@Axinian, Comrade; I don't specifically feel female, most of my need to transition was very body driven. It just happens that I'm comfortable enough with the label woman to not really reject it, and I find that I feel affected by misogyny and such and am often targeted by it, so it's also the label that matches my experiences the most. And I identify strongly with other women, especially trans women.

And the label also gives me a sense of identity and stability, so it's helpful like that too.


I think part of the reason for that is that humans seem to have a need to categorize stuff, and sexuality and identity can't easily be categorized.

And the need to categorize seems to increase in applications like medicine. Especially since a lot of things are specific to each gender. I mean, you can't have ovarian issues if you don't have ovaries, no matter what you feel you are.

So, in those areas, the need to be a specific category makes some sense, but from a biological standppint.

The thing is though that the way we often approach sex and gender biologically is inaccurate too, like, tons of factors influence how vulnerable you are to certain conditions. Treating me as male on a medical level for example is inaccurate, cause my hormone levels for example influence certain gendered conditions I'm vulnerable too. I also have breasts so I need breast exams, etc... In a medical case you need to know the specific details anyway so overly simplifying is counterproductive.

[Kesnit]

Btw, bit of stupid guestion, but since trans women get anti-androgens do trans men get anything similar? like anti-estrogen?

No. However, it's a lot easier for us to get our primary sex-hormone-producing organs ripped out. (There are a lot of reasons cis-women would want their ovaries removed. For example, my wife has cysts growing on hers that make periods extremely painful and screw up her hormones.) I got all my parts removed about 9 months after starting t.


That sounds like an awful bureaucracy. Why not just allow people to get the equivalent of a month's supply, but in bigger vials?

5mL is the more normal monthly dose. For reasons I've never figured out, a "normal" dose of t sends my free testosterone levels into dangerous levels. I found that out while seeing a doctor in Florida while I was in law school. She dropped me to half the normal dose, and my free t levels went to "normal." When I moved back here after school and got a new doctor, I think he thought my old one was a quack when I told him what dose I was on. (His words were "I have biological men on higher doses than that!") Until, of course, he did bloodwork and found my old doctor was right.

Since I take a half-dose, when my doctor wrote the prescription for a 1-month supply, he wrote it for 2 mL. Since that's a weird amount, the pharmacist didn't have that amount on-hand. (I was told they could order it.) However, since I was getting a more-than-one-month supply, my insurance wouldn't cover the larger amount. (If 5 mL was a monthly amount for me, I think they would have covered it.)

Confused yet? :smallbiggrin:


Also don't see why they don't want to provide gel.

Cost. The injectable is generic. The gel is brand-name only. So while the gel is $100 for a 2.5 month dose (at my dosage level), the gel is $300 for 2 months.

There is a third alternative, but that one I know I can't use. It's an adhesive patch that you put on your upper arm for 24-hours, then change. The adhesive breaks me out in a rash.



I should be getting my name :smallsmile:

YEAH!!!

Now you get to have the fun of changing all your credit cards, school records, bank accounts, etc... :smallbiggrin:


Hi.
I'm thinking of starting a parallel LGBT+ thread, meant for education rather than support, and with a different tone. If I go through with the project and post it, anyone who would like to participate and answer questions, LGBT or ally, is very welcome.

Sounds like a great idea.



I have a draft for the OP. Hopefully, I haven't made any glaring mistake.
Hello!
Welcome to the LGBT+ questions thread. This thread is meant to answer all sorts of questions one may have about the community, and have a casual atmosphere.
As such, this is an education thread, not a support thread (which you can conveniently find [there] instead). Why the split? Because the main thread is mostly populated by LGBT people who are seeking, well, support, and some questions or misunderstandings can be causes of additional stress. You can ask these questions here instead, and receive answers from LGBT people or allies. They can be as general or as narrow as you want.

A couple things you need to know before browsing the rest of this thread:
- if you are LGBT+ but do not wish to educate people, or are likely to be offended by the lack of knowledge of some people, you're probably better off not reading this thread.

A very good point.

- avoid misinformation. If you intentionally pull stuff out of your backside repeatedly, I will track you down, and force you to play in a game where the GMPCs are Drizz't and a Kender. (Theoretically unenforceable? You can never be 100% sure. Don't tempt your luck.)

*chuckle*

My comments are in bold

[KerfuffleMach2]

That's much easier to say when you aren't constantly under psychic assault because of it. A label is a shield. It's a way to say 'this is real, it has a name, I am not alone'. Names have power. And every now and then...

Every now and then, we all need a little validation. No human is an island. You require human connection. Your body will sicken and either without caring touch. Your mind will lock into a downward spiral without considerate attention.

Being a woman is based on deeper things than opinion. Even if the label "woman" did not exist, the difference in the person still would. They would just lack an easy word to use to tell others. We name things to know them, but it's as much discovery as invention. Much like math, the words and terms may be invented English (or other language), but the concept exists despite humanity, not because of it.

Who and what we are is not because of our labels, but it is made easier by them.

That is all true. I guess I'm just trying to say that as long as you like who and what you are, you shouldn't care too much about what others think. Especially people you don't really know. And people you are close to shouldn't really care about the labels either.

Of course, that is all my own opinion, and if you do feel better with the labels and stuff, then have at it.


The thing is though that the way we often approach sex and gender biologically is inaccurate too, like, tons of factors influence how vulnerable you are to certain conditions. Treating me as male on a medical level for example is inaccurate, cause my hormone levels for example influence certain gendered conditions I'm vulnerable too. I also have breasts so I need breast exams, etc... In a medical case you need to know the specific details anyway so overly simplifying is counterproductive.


That...is a good point.

Eh, I guess the best thing would be to just go by what the patient's body is like in each specific case.

[SiuiS]

That is all true. I guess I'm just trying to say that as long as you like who and what you are, you shouldn't care too much about what others think. Especially people you don't really know. And people you are close to shouldn't really care about the labels either.

Of course, that is all my own opinion, and if you do feel better with the labels and stuff, then have at it.

Oh, I agree. But a case for the importance of names needs must be made on occasion. I like making sure the complete details are present. :smallsmile:

[Miriel]

YEAH!!!

Now you get to have the fun of changing all your credit cards, school records, bank accounts, etc... :smallbiggrin:
Haha, don't worry, I still have a few months of pure bureaucracy before it's in effect ^^

[Grytorm]

I've realized that probably my thought related to my gender identity are not particularly well founded. I am fairly certain that they mostly emerged from a weird desire to fit in here because this thread is very supportive and nice. I broke down crying on the bus from this realization because I am much more alone again. I might be wrong about my conclusions though, I don't really know.

[Miriel]

I've realized that probably my thought related to my gender identity are not particularly well founded. I am fairly certain that they mostly emerged from a weird desire to fit in here because this thread is very supportive and nice. I broke down crying on the bus from this realization because I am much more alone again. I might be wrong about my conclusions though, I don't really know.
That's okay. Everyone is welcome here. You seem to need support, gender or no. So yeah. You don't have to try to fit in. "Be yourself" is our motto.

[Arachu]

Today's my birthday

Happy birthday~


I should be getting my name :smallsmile: After much fighting, it was agreed that I would only need a letter from my pharmacist.

That's great! :smallbiggrin:


This actually made me feel really good. I've been feeling down lately because I've been reaching out and reading trans literature and the like recently in the hopes finding someone to relate to in this. Oddly, I've felt MORE alone since I've been doing this, because I haven't been able to find someone who's narrative really syncs up with mine. The "feeling wrong since childhood and I'm born in the wrong body" thing, I feel, is a sort of general, or "Hollywood-ized" experience. This is not to disparage those for whom this experience is true, but I feel people tend to take this story and assume it's the case for everyone (even some trans people do this). Like this is the plot they would use to make a movie about a transgender person without even considering other possible experiences. Seeing someone else critical of this description made me feel not as alone :smallsmile:

Yeah, there's people whose experiences fit that narrative but it's applied way too broadly. Like, I remember never not feeling at least vaguely dysphoric (even in my really early memories) so I'm pretty sure that if I wasn't born trans*, it didn't take me long to grow into it. But I also didn't know that I was a girl until I was like 20 because I was never able to figure out exactly why I felt so weird (I did notice that I wasn't a guy during puberty, but I couldn't make it much further than that because of other stuff). So, according to that old scale thing I both am and am not really transsexual. And that's without factoring other stuff like my pansexuality. :smallconfused:

Also, what Lena said.


Hi.
I'm thinking of starting a parallel LGBT+ thread, meant for education rather than support, and with a different tone. If I go through with the project and post it, anyone who would like to participate and answer questions, LGBT or ally, is very welcome.
I have a draft for the OP. Hopefully, I haven't made any glaring mistake.
Hello!
Welcome to the LGBT+ questions thread. This thread is meant to answer all sorts of questions one may have about the community, and have a casual atmosphere.
As such, this is an education thread, not a support thread (which you can conveniently find [there] instead). Why the split? Because the main thread is mostly populated by LGBT people who are seeking, well, support, and some questions or misunderstandings can be causes of additional stress. You can ask these questions here instead, and receive answers from LGBT people or allies. They can be as general or as narrow as you want.

A couple things you need to know before browsing the rest of this thread:
- if you are LGBT+ but do not wish to educate people, or are likely to be offended by the lack of knowledge of some people, you're probably better off not reading this thread.
- if you have questions, go ahead! But try to stay polite and open-minded. Also, before asking here, I suggest you read the first post of the [main LGBT thread]; there's a useful glossary there and some specific information that might answer your question. If your question has an element of support (like “I think I might be transgender, how do I know for sure?” or “my LGBT friend has problems with their parents, how could I help?”), it can also be posted over there.
- avoid misinformation. If you intentionally pull stuff out of your backside repeatedly, I will track you down, and force you to play in a game where the GMPCs are Drizz't and a Kender. (Theoretically unenforceable? You can never be 100% sure. Don't tempt your luck.)
- mind the forum rules and avoid the subjects of politics or religion (or sexually-explicit content for that matter). Otherwise, there is no subject that is preemptively banned, and we'd like it to stay this way; therefore, if a discussion upsets or angers you, report the offending posts (if a forum rule has actually been infringed) and/or step away from the computer until you calm down, instead of starting a flame war. This is the Internet. We're physically stuck behind your screen. The worst we can do is send stupid PMs until the inbox is full – and you don't even have to acknowledge their content before deleting them! We can't follow you and force you to keep arguing.
- no one here should be shunned here for unfortunately lacking some knowledge but desiring to learn. Nothing is self-evident, and that's even more true where gender and sexuality are concerned. (Now, if you request to be educated but act deliberately obtuse when replied to, you're gonna have a bad time. Don't be deliberately obtuse. Nobody likes morons.)


Last thing: knowledge is power. You step in as a kobold, and leave as a dragon - that's the general idea anyway.
I'll check back for feedback, but still avoid participating to other discussions here for the time being.

I'll help answer questions and stuff~


That's okay. Everyone is welcome here. You seem to need support, gender or no. So yeah. You don't have to try to fit in. "Be yourself" is our motto.

This. ^_^


~Bianca

[Grytorm]

That's okay. Everyone is welcome here. You seem to need support, gender or no. So yeah. You don't have to try to fit in. "Be yourself" is our motto.

Yeah that's nice to know. But it would feel weird to look for support for something not related to the thread. Especially because most of what I go through seems so vaguely defined. But this thread is great.

I can see what I why I might unconsciously try to fit in. Because one of my main problems right now is loneliness combined with difficulty in describing my problems as fixable things if I can focus on a problem that might not exist it becomes something I can use to deal with depression. It becomes a source of success which is untouched by vague feelings that I am a failure because ultimately the topic matters the most to myself. I can't fail somebody else.

The annoying thing is that I go between thinking that I only am questioning my gender identity to deal with loneliness and thinking I might actually have a legitimate uncertainty in my gender identity. Right now I am wearing lipstick again and I spent 10 minutes looking at a mirror smiling at it just to see what I looked like in lipstick. I think my smile looks nicer in it. (Also, I practiced saying, "Hi, my names August"). So if anything is really happening that is what is happening.

[Lex-Kat]

*Hugs* I believe depression is something a lot of us deal with here. A few of us even feel very much alone in this great big world. This thread on this site helps us feel closer to someone. No, to a lot of people. Good, loving, not always agreeing, but still comforting people.

I believe I can safely say that you are welcome here. You seem to still be questioning. My advice is to not think too hard on it. Let it come to you.

[KerfuffleMach2]

I'm gonna go ahead and second everything Lex said. Especially the part about letting it come to you. Don't spend so much time worrying about it.

[Heliomance]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XV5w8OFrm6U

I'll just leave this here.

[Lentrax]

I'll just leave this here.

...

But Link said I was the only player in his life...

[Zorg]

...

But Link said I was the only player in his life...

But really he was playing you.

[Heliomance]

My legs are hairless! My new epilator is so much better than my old one. Feels so nice, I'm wearing a nightie to bed for the first time in aaages!

[golentan]

My dad acknowledged yesterday that guys were folks I might want to date. It feels nice, because while my folks have been supportive they've been more sort of quietly supportive if you know what I mean, and when talking about potential romantic partners my dad has a tendency to default to ladies.

[Heliomance]

My dad acknowledged yesterday that guys were folks I might want to date. It feels nice, because while my folks have been supportive they've been more sort of quietly supportive if you know what I mean, and when talking about potential romantic partners my dad has a tendency to default to ladies.

:o you want to date guys? But they have cooties!

[Lex-Kat]

And hairy legs. :smallyuk: :smalltongue:

[golentan]

:o you want to date guys? But they have cooties!

I want to fall in love with someone who loves me back, who will hug me and comfort me when I cry, who's smart and friendly and funny and will help me raise kids who hopefully won't turn out to be monsters. Geekiness a huge plus.

What part of that is disqualified by having cooties? Besides which, I got immunized when I was a kid.

Also, not all guys have hairy legs...

[The Succubus]

:o you want to date guys? But they have cooties!

No, we *are* cooties, if you pronounce the "oo" as "u". =3

[KerfuffleMach2]

:o you want to date guys? But they have cooties!


And hairy legs. :smallyuk: :smalltongue:

Excuse me, but my cooties are very well behaved and don't attack others.

Also...don't have anything to counter the hairy legs.

Anyways, mom is pretty cool about my brother and his boyfriend. When Jacob first came out, she freaked out a bit, but that was because every gay guy she's known, including her brother, has had issues with drugs and/oor alcohol. By now, though, she's calmed down about it enough to recognize that she did a good job of raising us and that Jacob won't have those issues.

We do make fun of him and his boyfriend a bit. But only because his boyfriend has the same first name as him. And, really, could we let that pass without having fun?

[noparlpf]

How do you date somebody with the same name as you? Wouldn't that be super weird?

[Coidzor]

:o you want to date guys? But they have cooties!


And hairy legs. :smallyuk: :smalltongue:

http://data1.whicdn.com/images/64061746/original.jpg

[KerfuffleMach2]

How do you date somebody with the same name as you? Wouldn't that be super weird?

I've decided that I'm going to call him 2.0.

[Coidzor]

I've decided that I'm going to call him 2.0.

so bro'll be "[KerfuffleMach2's Bro]" and the boyfrand'll be "2.0," eh? Good luck getting others to start using that nickname, though I suppose the first time they both mosey on over when their name is called would help reinforce that...

[KerfuffleMach2]

so bro'll be "[KerfuffleMach2's Bro]" and the boyfrand'll be "2.0," eh? Good luck getting others to start using that nickname, though I suppose the first time they both mosey on over when their name is called would help reinforce that...

Well...ya see...I've gotten nicknames to stick on both of my brothers. One is now called Beard. The other, who is dating 2.0, is known as Shorty.

[golentan]

How do you date somebody with the same name as you? Wouldn't that be super weird?

Hah! It gets really weird when people start using your first name like a last name. "Remember, we're having dinner with the Sharons tonight."

And then you get married and one of you takes the last name of the other if you hold to that custom, at which point a hole tears itself open in space time and Nyarlathotep crawls forth, pleased by the offering of confusion you've laid at his feet, and blesses you by merging you into a single creature with two heads.

[Eldest]

And hairy legs. :smallyuk: :smalltongue:

Not all of us. :smalltongue:

[KerfuffleMach2]

Hah! It gets really weird when people start using your first name like a last name. "Remember, we're having dinner with the Sharons tonight."

And then you get married and one of you takes the last name of the other if you hold to that custom, at which point a hole tears itself open in space time and Nyarlathotep crawls forth, pleased by the offering of confusion you've laid at his feet, and blesses you by merging you into a single creature with two heads.

Two solutions. Middle names, or nicknames.

[Coidzor]

Two solutions. Middle names, or nicknames.

Or two different hyphenations of the last-names.

[Miriel]

My legs are hairless! My new epilator is so much better than my old one. Feels so nice, I'm wearing a nightie to bed for the first time in aaages!
I request brand and model.

[golentan]

Two solutions. Middle names, or nicknames.

Nah, I like the solution involving an Outer God...

[Cloud Rat]

Yay for massages!

Yay for massage places that don't have gender bias when you're nude!

Yay for sexy playgrounders!

*envelops everyone in sexy hugs*

*is feeling sexy*

:smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin::smallbi ggrin::smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin::s mallbiggrin:

[golentan]

Yay for massages!

Yay for massage places that don't have gender bias when you're nude!

Yay for sexy playgrounders!

*envelops everyone in sexy hugs*

*is feeling sexy*

:smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin::smallbi ggrin::smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin::s mallbiggrin:

There is a story here. Color me intrigued.

[KerfuffleMach2]

Yay for massages!

Yay for massage places that don't have gender bias when you're nude!

Yay for sexy playgrounders!

*envelops everyone in sexy hugs*

*is feeling sexy*

:smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin::smallbi ggrin::smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin::s mallbiggrin:

I want a massage now.

[golentan]

I want a massage now.

Sidenote: There are schools that offer masseuse/masseur training, and to provide a stream of practice opportunities offer massages free to people. My school is one of these places. I have yet to be disappointed.

<.<
>.>

It's what I imagine it's like to be a cat. Pure creature comfort. Not particularly sexy, though.

[KerfuffleMach2]

Sidenote: There are schools that offer masseuse/masseur training, and to provide a stream of practice opportunities offer massages free to people. My school is one of these places. I have yet to be disappointed.

<.<
>.>

It's what I imagine it's like to be a cat. Pure creature comfort. Not particularly sexy, though.

Might have to look into that sometime.

And I ain't looking for a sexy massage right now. That'll have to wait till I get to dating, whenever that'll happen.

[SiuiS]

Hah! It gets really weird when people start using your first name like a last name. "Remember, we're having dinner with the Sharons tonight."

And then you get married and one of you takes the last name of the other if you hold to that custom, at which point a hole tears itself open in space time and Nyarlathotep crawls forth, pleased by the offering of confusion you've laid at his feet, and blesses you by merging you into a single creature with two heads.

Man, that would kill the sex life though.


Yay for massages!

Yay for massage places that don't have gender bias when you're nude!

Yay for sexy playgrounders!

*envelops everyone in sexy hugs*

*is feeling sexy*

:smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin::smallbi ggrin::smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin::s mallbiggrin:

Neat! Gender bias in the industry is a thing, all around. Only thing worse than being a male MT is being a transsexual MT. :smallsigh:


Sidenote: There are schools that offer masseuse/masseur training, and to provide a stream of practice opportunities offer massages free to people. My school is one of these places. I have yet to be disappointed.

<.<
>.>

It's what I imagine it's like to be a cat. Pure creature comfort. Not particularly sexy, though.

Massage Therapist is preferred over the French terms to differentiate between the untrained and prostitutes.

And yeah, they train the sexy out of you. It requires dubious Internet corses or natural suavity to put that back in. Jazz music optional. :smalltongue:

[golentan]

Massage Therapist is preferred over the French terms to differentiate between the untrained and prostitutes.

Yeah... I just prefer the french version, for reasons that only make sense in my little head. I love the feel of romance languages in my mouth, and I don't like splitting into multiple words a concept for which we already have a single word, and lastly it feels weird to refer to a massage I get recreationally as in any way therapeutic. I get that it can be, but I'm in it entirely for the creature comfort, and I don't want to claim some medical status that isn't there to justify the fact I enjoy getting touched in a pleasurable way.*


And yeah, they train the sexy out of you. It requires dubious Internet corses or natural suavity to put that back in. Jazz music optional. :smalltongue:

Well, yeah... Sexy is overrated in this sort of thing. Again, creature comfort... I just thought I'd specify because I was pointing out the option in a conversation that began with a sexy nude massage...

*oh god, there's no way that I can describe my love of being touched without sounding dirty, that's like my 5th version of that sentence... I like the give and play of someone paying attention to my body, finding the points of tension and using contact to disperse them, paying attention to my reactions and the way my muscles respond, and hitting the pleasure centers I've got associated with just touch... It lets me live in my own body without hurting, which is not a sensation I'm used to. People always tell me I should practice body mindfulness, that I should let my mind live more in my body, but when I do all it does is hurt. I've always got the sensation of pain in my mind, when I relax my mind into my body it becomes physical as well, and pain gets wrapped up in every little action even though there's nothing wrong with the physical half of things... Touch lets me relax into awareness of my body, let all that pain be expressed, and then someone else takes it away from me... it's an amazing thing, and I love just... not feeling that constant twinge. But when it's over I'm like memory plastic: take an hour to undo all the knots and kinks, and within 5 minutes it's all snapping back into place. But for that hour it's great...

The hierarchy for me as far as these things go is: Sexy times involve massage > Loving Cuddles by Sentient Being > Loving Cuddles by Nonsentient Being > Nonsexy massage > Nonloving Cuddles > Hot shower > Pillow Cuddling > Lying in the dark feeling horribly lonely. Top 2 are not things that can (or in my opinion should for me) be outsourced to a professional, and everything from hot shower down leaves me feeling sad and empty inside, but nonsexy massages are pretty much awesome.

[Asta Kask]

Two solutions. Middle names, or nicknames.

My cousin is dating a guy with the same first name and middle name as her ex-husband. We have yet to devise a non-confusing, non-insulting solution.

[Coidzor]

My cousin is dating a guy with the same first name and middle name as her ex-husband. We have yet to devise a non-confusing, non-insulting solution.

[Name] versus [The Ex] or [The Ex-Husband] didn't work?

[SiuiS]

Yeah... I just prefer the french version, for reasons that only make sense in my little head. I love the feel of romance languages in my mouth, and I don't like splitting into multiple words a concept for which we already have a single word, and lastly it feels weird to refer to a massage I get recreationally as in any way therapeutic. I get that it can be, but I'm in it entirely for the creature comfort, and I don't want to claim some medical status that isn't there to justify the fact I enjoy getting touched in a pleasurable way.*

Therapeutic isn't a misnomer, though. Soaking in a nice bath is therapeutic. That's the upshot of professional training; there are health benefits for certain, and different ways to apply them. It is definitely in the ounce of prevention category, but saying 'pound of cure' is the only real medicine is how the American healthcare system got so bad in the first place! :P

I prefer the french as well (and completely get why you like it!) but it's hard enough to get employment as is. Many districts require licensing to practice, and many of those districts require massage therapists to be licensed as adult entertainment. Add that to the fetishization of transsexuals and suddenly calling myself by a term known to mean 'prostitute' isn't just career suicide, it's career suicide bombing. Everyone gets taken down with me just for being too close. :smallfrown:

Insisting on the professional title is just a way of being respectful, like calling someone who practices medicine a doctor instead of mister or missus or Madame or whatnot. Well, for me at least. The public can say what they like. If I use the wrong word it's a professional insult, I found out. People with degrees are weird.



*oh god, there's no way that I can describe my love of being touched without sounding dirty, that's like my 5th version of that sentence... I like the give and play of someone paying attention to my body, finding the points of tension and using contact to disperse them, paying attention to my reactions and the way my muscles respond, and hitting the pleasure centers I've got associated with just touch... It lets me live in my own body without hurting, which is not a sensation I'm used to. People always tell me I should practice body mindfulness, that I should let my mind live more in my body, but when I do all it does is hurt. I've always got the sensation of pain in my mind, when I relax my mind into my body it becomes physical as well, and pain gets wrapped up in every little action even though there's nothing wrong with the physical half of things... Touch lets me relax into awareness of my body, let all that pain be expressed, and then someone else takes it away from me... it's an amazing thing, and I love just... not feeling that constant twinge. But when it's over I'm like memory plastic: take an hour to undo all the knots and kinks, and within 5 minutes it's all snapping back into place. But for that hour it's great...

That's why we do it. :)

That memory plastic but sucks though. I assume for you it's a form of body dysphoria? Otherwise I would suggest structural realignment. It's session intensive but let's you reprogram a lot of the muscle memory stuff that keeps you in pain or bad posture or whatnot.

[Asta Kask]

We're trying that, but since we all know the ex-husband very well it feels wrong to dismiss him like that.

[Heliomance]

I request brand and model.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=33bXhp3vy3g

That one. I confess, the advert was a large part of the reason I went for it!

[Togath]

romance languages.
Am I the only one who always hears "Roman's Languages"?
I have sometimes wonder if the term did in fact originate from a term like that...
If I remember correctly, many of the cultures which nowadays have "Romance" languages were indeed at one point part of the Roman empire, making me wonder if it started out as simply an accurate description rather than one that described "Romantic" languages.

[noparlpf]

Am I the only one who always hears "Roman's Languages"?
I have sometimes wonder if the term did in fact originate from a term like that...
If I remember correctly, many of the cultures which nowadays have "Romance" languages were indeed at one point part of the Roman empire, making me wonder if it started out as simply an accurate description rather than one that described "Romantic" languages.

It does come from "Romanic"; they're all derived from Latin.

[Philemonite]

And then you get married and one of you takes the last name of the other if you hold to that custom, at which point a hole tears itself open in space time and Nyarlathotep crawls forth, pleased by the offering of confusion you've laid at his feet, and blesses you by merging you into a single creature with two heads.

No problem, I have a group of persona users ready to stop him.:smallbiggrin::smalltongue::smallwink:

[Kesnit]

We do make fun of him and his boyfriend a bit. But only because his boyfriend has the same first name as him. And, really, could we let that pass without having fun?

That has got to be confusing when you call them. "Can I talk to [name]. No, the other [name]."


And then you get married and one of you takes the last name of the other if you hold to that custom, at which point a hole tears itself open in space time and Nyarlathotep crawls forth, pleased by the offering of confusion you've laid at his feet, and blesses you by merging you into a single creature with two heads.

*splort*


Sidenote: There are schools that offer masseuse/masseur training, and to provide a stream of practice opportunities offer massages free to people. My school is one of these places. I have yet to be disappointed.

There's one of those not far from where we live. I went there a few times before I went to law school, but since I went to seldom, I could never remember where it was when I would want to go again.

My wife and I have gone once since we moved back. She had a good experience. Mine was so-so. I don't know if I had gotten spoiled because we would go to a place with fully-trained MT's, or if the student I had was just not good (or really new).


Insisting on the professional title is just a way of being respectful, like calling someone who practices medicine a doctor instead of mister or missus or Madame or whatnot.

I have a doctorate. It was really funny the day one of the administrators at my law school commented that PhD's get really annoyed if a J.D. refers to him/herself as "doctor." It's even funnier because we aren't supposed to refer to ourselves as "Esquire" (except on something like a client letter or business card). However, other lawyers are supposed to address letters and such to us as "[Name], Esq."

[Jaycemonde]

My cousin is dating a guy with the same first name and middle name as her ex-husband. We have yet to devise a non-confusing, non-insulting solution.

Old-[Name] versus New-[Name], or maybe BadName versus GoodName if the ex was particularly bad.

[Asta Kask]

They don't like being called Old-x and New-x. It makes it seem like she's trying for the full set.

It's slightly more complicated than an ordinary love story. You see, my mother is (and my father was) part of a friend-group who have spent a lot of time together all back to the 50's. They all know each other and they're close friends. My aunt is also part of that friend-group, and so are the parents of the ex-husband. This makes avoiding insensitivity important. So there are complications.

[Zorg]

Original Recipe Dave vs Hot 'n' Spicy Dave?

[Mina Kobold]

Am I the only one who always hears "Roman's Languages"?
I have sometimes wonder if the term did in fact originate from a term like that...
If I remember correctly, many of the cultures which nowadays have "Romance" languages were indeed at one point part of the Roman empire, making me wonder if it started out as simply an accurate description rather than one that described "Romantic" languages.

That's what it means, actually, that the language is Roman. "Romantic" and "Romance" got their current meanings much later, originally referring to works in French, then to works that shared certain adventurous qualities associated with the French stories, then to love stories*.

This has been your Kobold's Etymological trivia of the day, provided by me having neither any idea about anything related to massage (other than not liking to be touched) and sadly having no advice for anybody else. >_<'


*http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=romance&allowed_in_frame=0

[KerfuffleMach2]

I prefer the french as well (and completely get why you like it!) but it's hard enough to get employment as is. Many districts require licensing to practice, and many of those districts require massage therapists to be licensed as adult entertainment. Add that to the fetishization of transsexuals and suddenly calling myself by a term known to mean 'prostitute' isn't just career suicide, it's career suicide bombing. Everyone gets taken down with me just for being too close. :smallfrown:

I have never heard of that being a requirement before. Maybe that's just specific to your area? Just sounds weird and not needed to me.


That has got to be confusing when you call them. "Can I talk to [name]. No, the other [name]."

I have a doctorate. It was really funny the day one of the administrators at my law school commented that PhD's get really annoyed if a J.D. refers to him/herself as "doctor." It's even funnier because we aren't supposed to refer to ourselves as "Esquire" (except on something like a client letter or business card). However, other lawyers are supposed to address letters and such to us as "[Name], Esq."

I've only met 2.0 a couple times so far, so it hasn't been a big deal for the family yet. Shorty has been away at college, and that's where they met. He's home for the summer now, though.


Original Recipe Dave vs Hot 'n' Spicy Dave?

Heh...what, no Extra Crispy?

[Miriel]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=33bXhp3vy3g

That one. I confess, the advert was a large part of the reason I went for it!
Oooooh, great.

I'll wait until money is something I have, though.

[Lex-Kat]

Sounds like a good investment. I wonder if using it on my beard would help thin it out, making the laser zapping more effective. :smallconfused: Something to think about.

[golentan]

That's why we do it. :)

That memory plastic but sucks though. I assume for you it's a form of body dysphoria? Otherwise I would suggest structural realignment. It's session intensive but let's you reprogram a lot of the muscle memory stuff that keeps you in pain or bad posture or whatnot.

It's all mental, yeah. I'm never one to say "it's all in your head" like that makes it any less real. Part of it... is dysphoria, yeah. I constantly find myself attempting to pick things up with limbs that aren't there, rub comforting body parts that I haven't had in millennia, express emotions in ways that entirely aren't compatible with my body, and that's a source of frustration and anguish. But the bigger part is just that my mind hurts. Thinking hurts, memories hurt, hopes for the future hurt. Being me hurts, and when my mind and my body act in concert, that pain that is basically a part of me-ness gets translated into physical pain, where it's harder to ignore.

[Miriel]

Sounds like a good investment. I wonder if using it on my beard would help thin it out, making the laser zapping more effective. :smallconfused: Something to think about.
In my case, they requested that I should not do any such thing.

However, it probably wouldn't work very well on the beard in the first place. Or it would be super painful.

[Astrella]

Sounds like a good investment. I wonder if using it on my beard would help thin it out, making the laser zapping more effective. :smallconfused: Something to think about.

I wouldn't. It'll make laser less effective and using it on your face is generally a bad idea anyway.

[SiuiS]

There's one of those not far from where we live. I went there a few times before I went to law school, but since I went to seldom, I could never remember where it was when I would want to go again.

My wife and I have gone once since we moved back. She had a good experience. Mine was so-so. I don't know if I had gotten spoiled because we would go to a place with fully-trained MT's, or if the student I had was just not good (or really new).


Could be anything, really. But I definitely think that if the person isn't a tactile sort, well, there's no amount of cerebral focus that can make up for having a feel for it.



I have a doctorate. It was really funny the day one of the administrators at my law school commented that PhD's get really annoyed if a J.D. refers to him/herself as "doctor." It's even funnier because we aren't supposed to refer to ourselves as "Esquire" (except on something like a client letter or business card). However, other lawyers are supposed to address letters and such to us as "[Name], Esq."

Yeah. I don't go in for technicalities. If you train to be a doctor you get called doctor XD
But I didn't know that! So you're not allowed to refer to yourself as esquire. I've seen folks do that, but only in fiction.


I have never heard of that being a requirement before. Maybe that's just specific to your area? Just sounds weird and not needed to me.


Licensing. In the states you sort of generally want certification and training, which is what lets you officially call yourself a massage therapist, they are working on or have passed a national standards test and you also need a business license. The business license is different based on where you operate. Some places it's recreational, some places it's like running a tarot shop, some places it's adult entertainment.

Regardless of where, there's a general bias in the industry against male practitioners and there's a lot of randomly interspersed prejudice against nonconfomity of gender, even in places where it's not considered adult entertainment.


Sounds like a good investment. I wonder if using it on my beard would help thin it out, making the laser zapping more effective. :smallconfused: Something to think about.

You don't want to epilate facial hair. It's of a different root construction than body hair.

[Heliomance]

Sounds like a good investment. I wonder if using it on my beard would help thin it out, making the laser zapping more effective. :smallconfused: Something to think about.

Adding my voice to the crowd. You do not want to use an epilator on your face. There will be blood. There will be pain. There will be bad things. Beard hair is very thick and securely rooted.

One time I went to IPL, and the person doing it decided to epilate my face after the zapping. It wasn't terribly effective, and resulted in angry red patches and scabbing on my face that were murder to hide with makeup. Not letting them do that again.

[KerfuffleMach2]

Licensing. In the states you sort of generally want certification and training, which is what lets you officially call yourself a massage therapist, they are working on or have passed a national standards test and you also need a business license. The business license is different based on where you operate. Some places it's recreational, some places it's like running a tarot shop, some places it's adult entertainment.

Regardless of where, there's a general bias in the industry against male practitioners and there's a lot of randomly interspersed prejudice against nonconfomity of gender, even in places where it's not considered adult entertainment.

Yeah, it was the adult entertainment part that confused me. I didn't know it was considered that in the business world.

I get needing a license and training. That makes perfect sense.

Also, if I were to go somewhere to get a massage, while I would prefer a woman doing it, I really wouldn't care touch if a guy did it. As long as they do a good job of it.

[SiuiS]

I don't get it either, but three counties out of four I can work in right now process it that way. It's bizarre. I suspect it's the bathhouse association.

And while you're fine, some folks do seem to care. I've seen one walk out, I've heard of more, and it was a serious business suggestion to have any secretarial staff alert clients to having only a male therapist on hand for any given appointment slot. *shrug* I live in California where we care less, and I haven't really kept up on it since '09. I hope is changed a little by now.

[KerfuffleMach2]

Ah. I live in Michigan. I've seen commercials for schools that offer MT training, so I'm guessing it isn't seen as adult entertainment here.

Also, people that walk out because of that are overly picky and should probably be slapped.

[Kesnit]

So you're not allowed to refer to yourself as esquire. I've seen folks do that, but only in fiction.

There's no law or rule against it. It just "isn't done." I have no idea why, but that's the way it is.


Also, if I were to go somewhere to get a massage, while I would prefer a woman doing it, I really wouldn't care touch if a guy did it. As long as they do a good job of it.

I've had men and women MT's. Honestly, I don't care. So long as I come out of there relaxed, I'd let a trained monkey give me a massage!


Also, people that walk out because of that are overly picky and should probably be slapped.

Agreed.

[Asta Kask]

I've had men and women MT's. Honestly, I don't care. So long as I come out of there relaxed, I'd let a trained monkey give me a massage!

Would you consider kitten therapy?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=598IdFlOXcQ

[SiuiS]

Ah. I live in Michigan. I've seen commercials for schools that offer MT training, so I'm guessing it isn't seen as adult entertainment here.

Also, people that walk out because of that are overly picky and should probably be slapped.

Oh, we have schools for it here too. I went to one. We just also have outdated legislature. Most of the states do.

Related thought because in nitpicky: 00:00, midnight, is officially "the next day". So the law floating around that's no alcohol sold after midnight on Sunday but okay on Monday means that the last minute you can buy alcohol is 23:59 Saturday, and makes perfect sense.

Because that's topical, right? Not a jump of topics at all!



I've had men and women MT's. Honestly, I don't care. So long as I come out of there relaxed, I'd let a trained monkey give me a massage.

You're in luck!


Would you consider kitten therapy?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=598IdFlOXcQ

Punkin has not learned how not to claws when he does that >__>

[Grytorm]

Yay for massages!

Yay for massage places that don't have gender bias when you're nude!

Yay for sexy playgrounders!

*envelops everyone in sexy hugs*

*is feeling sexy*

:smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin::smallbi ggrin::smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin::s mallbiggrin:

Good for you. Now to why I am quoting this.

I have realized that I have absolutely no idea what it means to feel sexy.

[KerfuffleMach2]

Good for you. Now to why I am quoting this.

I have realized that I have absolutely no idea what it means to feel sexy.

Yeah, I don't recall ever having that feeling, either.

[golentan]

Yeah, I don't recall ever having that feeling, either.

I would describe it as "languorous + acute awareness of the body (esp. genitals/erogenous zones) of yourself/someone else and a desire to use that awareness for pleasure."

Which, I feel I need to point out, is like the direct antithesis of some forms of arousal I've seen which looked angry and violent and decidedly unsexy.

[Coidzor]

Good for you. Now to why I am quoting this.

I have realized that I have absolutely no idea what it means to feel sexy.

Well, I'd describe it as a sort of thrumming vitality or energy through one's body, but, really, it's mostly just one of those je ne sais quois that one will know when one experiences it. And some never do.

[KerfuffleMach2]

I would describe it as "languorous + acute awareness of the body (esp. genitals/erogenous zones) of yourself/someone else and a desire to use that awareness for pleasure."

Which, I feel I need to point out, is like the direct antithesis of some forms of arousal I've seen which looked angry and violent and decidedly unsexy.


Now, see, to me, that sounds more like feeling horny. I know that feeling.

I would attribute feeling sexy to knowing that somebody is looking at me and thinking sexy thoughts about me. And I have never felt that way.

[Grytorm]

Okay now that the primary point is somewhat discussed I have also had a realization that ties into that. I think the fundamental reason tying how I am thinking about my gender right now together is that I don't care what I look like. So what is most appealing in trying on makeup and other things is that I am actively thinking about my appearance instead of passively accepting myself. I am trying to figure out how I feel about what I look like. And I don't feel much about what I look like.

[KerfuffleMach2]

Okay now that the primary point is somewhat discussed I have also had a realization that ties into that. I think the fundamental reason tying how I am thinking about my gender right now together is that I don't care what I look like. So what is most appealing in trying on makeup and other things is that I am actively thinking about my appearance instead of passively accepting myself. I am trying to figure out how I feel about what I look like. And I don't feel much about what I look like.

Well, figuring out how you feel about how you look is a good thing to do.

And yeah, passively accepting yourself isn't good. Actively accept yourself. Much better.

[Coidzor]

Now, see, to me, that sounds more like feeling horny. I know that feeling.

I would attribute feeling sexy to knowing that somebody is looking at me and thinking sexy thoughts about me. And I have never felt that way.

People can feel sexy without another person necessarily being there/involved. I've encountered this personally and have encountered reports of others having experienced this.

[Grytorm]

Well, figuring out how you feel about how you look is a good thing to do.

And yeah, passively accepting yourself isn't good. Actively accept yourself. Much better.

Ah but I'm not certain if I can really actively like what I look like because I don't think I care enough.

[KerfuffleMach2]

People can feel sexy without another person necessarily being there/involved. I've encountered this personally and have encountered reports of others having experienced this.

Ah, well, my knowledge in that area is quite lacking. Like I said, I have no recollection of ever feeling sexy.


Ah but I'm not certain if I can really actively like what I look like because I don't think I care enough.

Well, if you really didn't care, then trying on makeup probably wouldn't appeal to you. So you do care on some level, you just don't really know what that level is yet. So, you're trying stuff out to see what will make you like the way you look.

That's all speculation on my part, really, but it makes sense in my head.

[golentan]

I mostly only feel sexy when I'm by myself.

[noparlpf]

Look! A random me!
What do you guys think of my "fashion sense"?
http://i1204.photobucket.com/albums/bb416/noparlpf/10356398_673744712694346_7473588911854864621_n_zps 455dded6.jpg

[KerfuffleMach2]

The lack of Eeveelutions on your shirt is disappointing.

[noparlpf]

The lack of Eeveelutions on your shirt is disappointing.

People who make merchandise probably never heard of the later generations. Also, it was free (for me) so I don't mind.