The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

[Resileaf]

1% Dispel on Self. Cheap and easy and now you're on the ground.

What does 1% even mean?
I've always found it weird that it was a percentage.

[The Jack]

See, Being able to do everything's dumb.

But needing to be able to do everything's the real crime.

Every player in skyrim knows lockpicking, Nobody's ever Kicked down the door regardless of how munchkin they were, because you just can't kick down the door. Heck, one of the old lore books said the Thum was used to blow apart castle-freaking-walls, but you're helpless to a door or wooden chest if you don't know how to lockpick.


I never felt like a real character in skyrim cause I just couldn't do the things I wanted to do. I couldn't kill Maven, I could only escort Serena, I couldn't properly loot a shop without finding a secret invisible chest under the map. I was pushed through the dumbest of stories with the worst of choices.

and to me, RPGs are about being someone else of your choice and doing things you wanna do.

[Rynjin]

What does 1% even mean?
I've always found it weird that it was a percentage.

It's the chance of working. 100% Dispel always works, 1% Dispel works...1% of the time.

If you put it on an item though as a Constant effect it apparently ticks pretty rapidly, so it will remove any spell effect in under a second most times.

Source: UESP Wiki

[LibraryOgre]

What does 1% even mean?
I've always found it weird that it was a percentage.


It's the chance of working. 100% Dispel always works, 1% Dispel works...1% of the time.

If you put it on an item though as a Constant effect it apparently ticks pretty rapidly, so it will remove any spell effect in under a second most times.

Source: UESP Wiki

But, IIRC, the 1% chance on self ALWAYS worked.

[Vinyadan]

Skyrim's four big guilds: Companions, College of Winterhold, Thieves' Guild and Dark Brotherhood.

My personal complaints are:

1. That most of the Guilds were unappealing to me. The Thieves Guild asks you to start out a protection racket. The Companions ask you to turn into a wolf (??? why not to simply make a Hircine cult guild then? What's the point of the Skyforge, if you end up fighting naked? And why force you to be a wolf to go forward?). The Brotherhood is justified in that you know what you are getting into, but it's weird that you need to perform a murder before you can destroy them. And, if you find the other Sithis door, you can't tell the Penitus Oculatus.

2. That the Mages Guild ending is weird. "Oh look, you are a powerful mage! You study magic all day! Pfff, you guys will never be as cool as us PSJJJJ anyway. We grown ups are taking the eye now. Bye!"



The thing is, with the story-based questlines of the various guilds, it wouldn't really make sense for it to be locked behind skill requirements. "Oh no, Ancano has unleashed magical entities all over Winterfell! But wait, you have to go level up one of your magical skills to 50 before we can let you take them out." "Cicero betrayed the Dark Brotherhood and took the Night Mother! But your Sneak isn't good enough, so we can't do anything about it."

The solution I've personally thought of is to separate the storyline from the guild progression. The former would be like Skyrim- your missions are related to the guild, but don't require that you use magic, or sneak around, or use melee weapons. Even if you don't know a single spell, maybe the Mage's Guild just needs a convenient mercenary who ends up getting caught up in a magical adventure. The latter would be more like Morrowind, having skill requirements to climb the ranks, and having missions that are closer to the purpose of the guilds, like the radiant quests. Maybe some parts of the latter could be locked behind the former; you can't become the guildmaster until they die in the storyline.

In Morrowind, the quests were gated by rank. Before you got the quest, you needed the rank. So you could simply have the story on standby, and have the event trigger when or after you get the rank.

[factotum]

Now, are these tradeoffs worth it? For me, absolutely; I value story far more than I do customization. If customization is your thing, though, Witcher 3 won't do the trick. You might value the tradeoff enough to want the game, but it's not really fair to sit there and say the tradeoff isn't there.

The thing is, I really can't think of any reason why you couldn't have the multiple branching quests without also offering decent character customisation. CD Projekt Red *had* to have their main character be mostly fixed because of the story they based him on, not because that was a requirement for setting up the quests just so--in fact, a lot of the choices in the quests were based on customising the *character* of Geralt as you wanted, even if you couldn't change his appearance.

I guess there's also a Bethesda example which proves this point: have you ever played the Far Harbor DLC for Fallout 4? That DLC had a huge variety of ways to play and possible outcomes, yet it's a Bethesda game with Bethesda customisation. If they could only maintain that level for a whole game (e.g. ES6) then I'd have no complaints whatsoever.

[Lord Raziere]

currently I'm trying to play Skyrim mod inverse jenga, a game where you take skyrim Special edition, add a bunch of new mods, start up skyrim only to find it doesn't start, then you constantly switch around mods until you the one jenga mod that when put in, makes the whole thing collapse. FNIS, skyrim UI and skyrim script extender doesn't seem to want to work properly even when the game runs, so.....yeah.

[Triaxx]

Are you remembering to start the game through Script Extender's launcher?

[Rynjin]

Are you remembering you need to run FNIS every time you install a new mod?

[Lord Raziere]

On Scrip Extender Launcher: do you mean that thing I was told to create a shortcut for after downloading the script extender? not always, I guess its that important to always do it through that then. learning experience.

as for FNIS: you mean literally every single one? well I tried sometimes, but every time it doesn't change what it actually says so I'm not sure if its actually picking anything up? its weird.

so I just disabled FNIS and Script extender and the mods that supposedly require them I've been using without them just fine, turns out the not starting problem was me getting the wrong version of a mod, I play special edition and the mod was previously for classic, so I fixed that and its working fine. still not sure how to solve the FNIS and script extender problems though, they're just not as bad as I thought.

[Rynjin]

Yeah if you don't run SKSE through the SKSE launcher, SKSE doesn't work, so all of the SKSE mods break.

[Triaxx]

Yeah, the Script Extender Launcher loads an extra .dll that Script Extender uses to... extend the scripts, startlingly enough.

FNIS... I don't know about, but I'd assume that it has to rebuild a mod registry, so it's got to be run to recognize new mods.

[Lord Raziere]

okay so, rejiggered everything and now everything works now that I know to not use the skyrim launcher to launch it ever, thanks. I'm basically adding a lot more customization, more options and variability to my experience so that I can do all sorts of neat things. also some silly fun things.

[Mando Knight]

FNIS... I don't know about, but I'd assume that it has to rebuild a mod registry, so it's got to be run to recognize new mods.

That said, if the mod doesn't add a new animation, you don't need to run FNIS after installing it.

[DigoDragon]

After a couple hours of messing with mods I got a stable list going. Huzzah! So I'm playing SE now and I am enjoying the perk and magic overhauls. Wary of the Frostfall mod. Seems like you can easily freeze to death. Will have to figure out how to safely set myself on fire. :smalltongue:

[veti]

After a couple hours of messing with mods I got a stable list going. Huzzah! So I'm playing SE now and I am enjoying the perk and magic overhauls. Wary of the Frostfall mod. Seems like you can easily freeze to death. Will have to figure out how to safely set myself on fire. :smalltongue:

Frostfall does have a "wuss" setting, where you don't freeze to death but are always rescued by a convenient passer by. You can use that for training wheels.

I took against Frostfall when I passed out on the very doorstep of a house, just because the courier wouldn't take "sod off" for an answer. Frostfall was interesting for a while, but then just tiresome.

I feel similarly about other "needs" mods.
I think the timescale in Skyrim is just too compressed - if I iinsert needs, they end up taking over far too much of my playing time.

[DigoDragon]

Frostfall does have a "wuss" setting, where you don't freeze to death but are always rescued by a convenient passer by. You can use that for training wheels.

Aye, I have it set to wuss Rescue if I pass out from the cold. I'm sure I'll get through the learning curve with a few hours playing. So far a quick way to warm up is go to any of the forges to do business. The heat quickly resets the cold meters back to good standing. If the mod gets old hat after a bit, I can turn it off safely. Just wanted the experience to try.



I took against Frostfall when I passed out on the very doorstep of a house, just because the courier wouldn't take "sod off" for an answer.

I had a courier interrupt the scene where you capture a dragon in Dragonsreach. I'm like "Yes I bloody well know I used my voice now get your head down before you loose it!"



I think the timescale in Skyrim is just too compressed - if I iinsert needs, they end up taking over far too much of my playing time.

I'm using the Dynamic Timescale (https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/18922) mod (SE edition), setting everything to run between a scale of 6 to 8. You can adjust how fast time flows in different areas of the game (Indoors, outdoors, combat, etc.) and it has an optional autosave feature. So far it works well to expand the length of my adventuring day.

[Triaxx]

Set Frostfall to pause exposure during conversation.

[DigoDragon]

Set Frostfall to pause exposure during conversation.

Yup! Got that option on.

I did find out why Frostfall seemed so unforgiving--my Papyrus Script Utility mod wasn't up to date! It was version 3.6 and I needed 3.7 for Frostfall to apply warmth bonuses from my worn gear. so as far as the mod thought, I was running around naked. :smallbiggrin: Now that I have that updated, things work correctly and I can last a few hours in the snow wearing light leather armor and not freeze off my furry behind.

Now I just have to re-learn the arcing when firing bows long range (currently 1/10 at long range), but still got the mojo firing in melee (yeah, I'm that brand of crazy).

Edit--
Okay, I think I got the groove again on using a bow. Now gotta figure out how not to get Contra one-shot'd by the first dragon. :smallredface:

[veti]

Yup! Got that option on.

I did find out why Frostfall seemed so unforgiving--my Papyrus Script Utility mod wasn't up to date! It was version 3.6 and I needed 3.7 for Frostfall to apply warmth bonuses from my worn gear.

Wait, what - you have to upgrade Papyrus manually? How do you even do that?

[Ogremindes]

Wait, what - you have to upgrade Papyrus manually? How do you even do that?

It's not Papyrus, but PapyrusUtil. An old version is bundled with Frostfall et al, but it needs to be updated whenever Skyrim does.

[DigoDragon]

Yes, what Ogremindes said. Specifically this mod (https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/13048) was out of date and needed the most recent version installed.

I figured out that my deadly dragons mod was making dragons too deadly. I eased back a bit on the power and survived my first dragon fight at the south watch tower. Yay. ^^; Wish I had recorded it, because it was a good fight, ending with the dragon and my khajiit shooting each other at the same time and triggering an amazing "arrow cam" flying through the fire breath into the dragon's mouth. Dang, that shot isn't gonna happen again. :smallbiggrin:

[Lord Raziere]

by the Nine Divines.

I just realized! they missed a golden opportunity to put someone in the soul cairn or Sovngarde:
A ghostly guard that only says:
"I once a living person like you, but then I took an arrow in the head."

[factotum]

That would have required them to know that the "arrow in the knee" thing was going to become a meme, and I doubt they did.

[veti]

That became a meme within weeks of release, so they could have managed it for the Soul Cairn if they'd really wanted.

But I daresay they had other priorities in mind.

That's what mods are for. If you want it, make it!

[DigoDragon]

I've gotten the hang of the Frostfall mod and it's a pretty interesting experience. I have the exposure rate set a bit low so that it doesn't get tedious on me. I can make decent trips without freezing my tail off, but couldn't just waste time running in circles. A little planning is needed, which also helps determine which quests to do, as when I reach a place, I attempt to do all the quests in that area, before I run off across the map to the next locale. I'm doing my best to not use Fast Travel.

I should seriously buy a couple horses. >.>

I'm enjoying the new Ordinator perk system and the Apocalypse spells too. Bound pick axes definitely save on weight (I can craft backpacks that give you additional carry capacity. I think that's from the Camping mod). I tried to start off with the main quest, but after visiting the Graybeards I been getting side-tracked fighting bandits for fun & profit. XD

I seriously need to record these play sessions for the amusing accidents and mistakes I make. I'm sure they'd get some chuckles.

[Lord Raziere]

That became a meme within weeks of release, so they could have managed it for the Soul Cairn if they'd really wanted.

But I daresay they had other priorities in mind.

That's what mods are for. If you want it, make it!

Heh, I'd sooner rather try to converting oldrim mods to skyrim se, there are a few that I'd want to have, but even the for dummies process looks dauntingly tedious, though considering the computer wizardry I'm learning just by figuring how to handle mods, it might be a little educational. mostly I just want to convert the Sheogorath shout mod at the moment, so I can put it on my Wabbajack character, which is basically modded to have an infinite use wabbajack and a khajit race resembling katia managan for maximum crazy fun. the goal of such a game of course, being to complete the game while leveling as LITTLE as possible, because your using the wabbajack for everything. (though if I recall there are some level requirements for some quests, so thats not actually happening)

Edit: encountered new novel problem: two mods. one for increasing carry weight, the other to replace werewolf appearance with dragonman. when I place one at the end of the load order, the other doesn't work. how in the frell does carry weight have anything to do with a werewolves appearance? how would they conflict? it makes very little sense to me.

[DigoDragon]

Just survived my third dragon fight and apparently the dragon put attacking chickens as a higher priority than attacking me. Good thing the Run For Your Lives mod worked or all the farmers would of been cooked like the chickens. So yeah, I got ignored due to fowl play. On the one hand, the distraction gave me time to heal up and load poison onto my arrows.

On the other hand, I feel slighted here. :smalltongue:

[Aeson]

Just survived my third dragon fight and apparently the dragon put attacking chickens as a higher priority than attacking me. Good thing the Run For Your Lives mod worked or all the farmers would of been cooked like the chickens. So yeah, I got ignored due to fowl play. On the one hand, the distraction gave me time to heal up and load poison onto my arrows.

On the other hand, I feel slighted here. :smalltongue:
Well, I mean, chickens and other avians are modern-day dinosaurs, and obviously a dinosaur is a much bigger threat to a dragon than some puny human so clearly the dragons had their priorities straight.

[DigoDragon]

Well, I mean, chickens and other avians are modern-day dinosaurs, and obviously a dinosaur is a much bigger threat to a dragon than some puny human so clearly the dragons had their priorities straight.

...that makes too much sense. I cannot fault you. :smalltongue:


So! Either my Vivid Weather mod is stuck on rain/snow days or I had forgotten that Skyrim mimics Florida summers because wow it rains every other day like clockwork (or snow if I'm far enough up north). And since I am using Frostfell, that means I was only able to snipe two of the 6-7 defenders at Northwatch Keep before my fighters started to freeze. So this one did what any sensible khajiit would do when faced with freezing their tail off--they sneak attacked the front gate guard and when the defenders came out to fight, khajiit used Whirlwind Sprint to get past them and force a bottle-necked pincer fight with my follower. :smalltongue:

[Rynjin]

Edit: encountered new novel problem: two mods. one for increasing carry weight, the other to replace werewolf appearance with dragonman. when I place one at the end of the load order, the other doesn't work. how in the frell does carry weight have anything to do with a werewolves appearance? how would they conflict? it makes very little sense to me.

Link the two mods?

[Lord Raziere]

Link the two mods?

Eh, too late to solve my problem. I got rid of the carry weight for another, and the carry weight mod I have now works fine with my werewolf appearance replacer. bit more carry than I wanted, but its mostly just so I don't have to do inventory management anyways.

but if your curious about it anyways here is the carry weight mod I was using:
https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/2176

and here is the werewolf appearance replacer mod I am using:
https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/3924

I was using the x10 carry weight and dragonman ones respectively. each one has multiple files for your preferences.

[veti]

Either my Vivid Weather mod is stuck on rain/snow days or I had forgotten that Skyrim mimics Florida summers because wow it rains every other day like clockwork (or snow if I'm far enough up north).

I have a similar perception of Vivid Weather. It's beautiful, but by Kyne it pours down so much. I've spent significant time in three countries that are all famous for their rain, but I swear not one of them gets a tenth as much as Whiterun.

Take London, for instance. I happen to know that, averaged over the year, it rains about 6% of the time in London. And that includes light drizzle. Whiterun, with Vivid Weather, gets torrential thunderstorms that last literally for days on end. And it gets them at least once a week.

[Caelestion]

London is perhaps not the best place to quote - it's notably warmer than much of the rest of the UK and there's hardly hardly high land around to catch rain with.

[Kareeah_Indaga]

I have a similar perception of Vivid Weather. It's beautiful, but by Kyne it pours down so much. I've spent significant time in three countries that are all famous for their rain, but I swear not one of them gets a tenth as much as Whiterun.

Take London, for instance. I happen to know that, averaged over the year, it rains about 6% of the time in London. And that includes light drizzle. Whiterun, with Vivid Weather, gets torrential thunderstorms that last literally for days on end. And it gets them at least once a week.

Kynareth is a storm goddess among other things. Possibly it's a sign of her favor. Or she's really mad at you, hard to tell with that one. :smalltongue:

Or maybe she's like half the player base and that's her way of shouting "You're supposed to be fighting the Thalmor not each other you stupid mortals!!!"

[Vinyadan]

Well, I mean, chickens and other avians are modern-day dinosaurs, and obviously a dinosaur is a much bigger threat to a dragon than some puny human so clearly the dragons had their priorities straight.

Fun fact: chickens used to report crimes in Skyrim. It was noticed about one month before release.

[Triaxx]

Used to? I'm pretty sure they still do.

[DigoDragon]

Kynareth is a storm goddess among other things. Possibly it's a sign of her favor. Or she's really mad at you, hard to tell with that one. :smalltongue:

I assumed she was drinking too much with Sanguine or something.



Used to? I'm pretty sure they still do.

I'll just have to put buckets on top of all the chickens! Or just wait for another dragon to attack the farm.

[veti]

Or maybe she's like half the player base and that's her way of shouting "You're supposed to be fighting the Thalmor not each other you stupid mortals!!!"

If that's the message, wouldn't it be more to the point for her to be applying this treatment to Summerset?

Between the two versions of Skyrim, I must have played 30 different characters. And only two of those have ever picked a side in the civil war - one each way - because they're both utterly indefensible.

[Lord Raziere]

so any advice on how to fix a mod that uses UNP face textures that it supposed to be set to CBBE thus making the light face/darker body mismatch problem occur? because I use CBBE, but somehow this timelost Dwemer mod which I really want to play is working but is distracting with how the head is practically one color but the body is another, because I've looked and it has UNP texture files in it for some reason. I'm not sure how to fix this other than not playing the dwemer mod, which I don't want to do.

Edit: turns out the problem was the werewolf appearance replacer. AGAIN. yeah I'm not using that werewolf replacer mod anymore. but now in the process of figuring that out, I've introduced problems with immersive armors and my carry weight mod, one is giving me far more available carry weight than usual and the other seems to be giving me the same message that the armors are finished configuring over and over again, ad looking at the mod descriptions they seem to imply that I've screwed up permanently :/ apparently both give you problems if you remove them midgame.

[Kareeah_Indaga]

If that's the message, wouldn't it be more to the point for her to be applying this treatment to Summerset?

Given that Summerset regularly fends of the storm-causing Maormer they probably wouldn't notice.

[DigoDragon]

Given that Summerset regularly fends of the storm-causing Maormer they probably wouldn't notice.

I mean, happens all the time in Florida and we don't really notice. :smalltongue:


Dunno if this is the Ordinator Perk system or I'm just neglecting the forge, but seems like my Smithing skill is lagging really badly behind my other skills. Might have to go around collecting cheap materials and forging stuff to train up the skill.

[Triaxx]

Smithing is just like that post 1.5. Best I can suggest is raid Dwemer ruins and make Battleaxes.

[Keltest]

Smithing is just like that post 1.5. Best I can suggest is raid Dwemer ruins and make Battleaxes.

If you have access to that transmutation spell and a decent magicka pool, you can also turn iron ingots into silver and gold ingots and smith jewelry for relatively little investment as well.

[Rynjin]

You could also just player.advskill to the desired level. Grinding crafting skills is meaningless busy work, none more so than Smithing since most of what you make isn't usable for yourself. Consoling the skill up is the same effective task with the same reward, only taking less time.

[veti]

Provided you have enough skill to make dwemer gear, then dwemer ruins are the place to go to beef up your smithing. Sure you can't use all the output, but that's true of everything you collect in the game.

[DigoDragon]

Smithing is just like that post 1.5. Best I can suggest is raid Dwemer ruins and make Battleaxes.

If you have access to that transmutation spell and a decent magicka pool, you can also turn iron ingots into silver and gold ingots and smith jewelry for relatively little investment as well.

Currently I'm sitting on a pile of some 100+ iron ores, so I did get the Transmutation spell to start spinning gold rings (bonus is having a necromancer robe that gives a 75% boost to Magika regen). This method has the added benefit of increasing my speech skill, which I want because the new Ordinator perks for Speech have a few interesting options for shouts I'd like to try out. But it is a slow, grindy process overall, I admit that. I been taking some ores with me when I travel and transmuting them on the go to save some time. :smallbiggrin:

Oh, and adding gems to the crafted jewelry helps as I believe your exp is still based on the value of the object created?



You could also just player.advskill to the desired level. Grinding crafting skills is meaningless busy work, none more so than Smithing since most of what you make isn't usable for yourself. Consoling the skill up is the same effective task with the same reward, only taking less time.

I could cheat, yeah. I just didn't want to this time. I haven't even Fast Traveled yet, which I'm amazed at myself for having the willpower to avoid it (not counting carriage rides, those are fair game).



Provided you have enough skill to make dwemer gear, then dwemer ruins are the place to go to beef up your smithing. Sure you can't use all the output, but that's true of everything you collect in the game.

My skill is not that good just yet, but it is definitely the thing to do once I level up my skill to that point. Should be soonish?

[Ogremindes]

Dunno if this is the Ordinator Perk system or I'm just neglecting the forge, but seems like my Smithing skill is lagging really badly behind my other skills. Might have to go around collecting cheap materials and forging stuff to train up the skill.

Since your running modded, perhaps pick up Arthmoor's Ars Metallica. It's a bit late now, but it does help smithing keep pace by making mining advance the skill.

[DigoDragon]

Since your running modded, perhaps pick up Arthmoor's Ars Metallica. It's a bit late now, but it does help smithing keep pace by making mining advance the skill.

Thanks for the tip. I've gotten Smithing up to 32 skill by way of forging jewelry. Ideally I'd like to hit 40 so I can deal with enchanting gear and still be able to improve it that second step later.



I was on a Companion quest to go kill some wolves at Shor's Stone. I took a carriage to Riften and then jogged on foot toward the village. Fort Greenwall got in my way however, a small detail I had forgotten. A detail loaded with bandits. Well, I figure I could sneak up on them and take them out for easy profits. Thus, I snuck up close to the fort wall, nice and silent-like. The sun was going down, so the cover of darkness was perfect. I got up close enough to line up my first arrow with a bandit standing up on the rampart.

*Dragon power-lands right in front of me outta nowhere*

Blood Dragon: "SURPRISE, DRAGONDORK!!" :smallfurious:


So now I'm on fire and all the bandits collectively wet themselves, firing arrows at the dragon. I drink a potion of invisibility and run for cover, trying to heal my wounds. The dragon sets fire to Everything! Bandits? On fire! Random deer in the area? On fire! My khajiit partner Shiira? On fire! My plan to take this fort by stealth for easy profits? Kicked over. Stomped on. Then Set On fire!

I don't know who got the final blow on the dragon. It died halfway through the fight and I was too busy trying to see past my absorbing-it's-soul effect while blocking a bandit trying to cave in my skull with a warhammer. And the bandit decided to stop swinging for a moment to admire the amazement of dragon-soul-absorption.

Bandit: "That's incredible!"
Me: "Come here, your kidneys need a pointy friend!" XD


So that happened. I did take the fort, but I spent way more arrows and potions than I planned on. Ah well, at least the dragon gave me three scales. That's where the real loot is once my Smithing skill is high enough to craft dragon armor. I will say though--when that dragon landed right in my face, I actually jumped in my chair because there was *NO* warning for that. No roar, no music shift, nothing. I guess this dragon was part troll. :smalltongue:

[LibraryOgre]

So, I've been having an urge to complete Oblivion.

What mods would y'all suggest?

[Balmas]

So, I've been having an urge to complete Oblivion.

What mods would y'all suggest?

Are you starting a new character, or would the mods be added to an existing save file? Most of the overhaul mods require a new game to work properly, I think.

[LibraryOgre]

Are you starting a new character, or would the mods be added to an existing save file? Most of the overhaul mods require a new game to work properly, I think.

I'd start new. I know my most recent attempt is in the Shivering Isles, but I can't remember what she's doing, and usually like to start fresh, anyway.

[veti]

I was on a Companion quest to go kill some wolves at Shor's Stone. I took a carriage to Riften and then jogged on foot toward the village. Fort Greenwall got in my way however, a small detail I had forgotten.

Suggestion: Complete Fast Travel Overhaul would let you tell the carriage driver to drop you off in Shor's Stone. (He must have driven you straight through it, and Fort Greenwall.) Saves quite a lot of walking, when you're avoiding fast travel.

You'd still get to loot, sorry I mean "encounter", the fort on your way back, since CFTO annoyingly doesn't put carts in the small settlements.

Love the story, but what happened to your feline pack mule?

[Ailurus]

So, I've been having an urge to complete Oblivion.

What mods would y'all suggest?

Been a while since I played Oblivion, but the three ones I recall the most are:

Francescos Creatures and Items (https://www.nexusmods.com/oblivion/mods/40190) - dramatically changes (improves IMO) the whole everything "levels with player" aspect of the game
OblivionXP (https://www.nexusmods.com/oblivion/mods/35333) - swaps out the usual elder scrolls leveling system for an XP-based one. Purely a matter of taste, obviously, but I found it helpful in Oblivion because it ensures you don't have to worry about running and jumping too much leveling you up.
Midas Magic (https://www.nexusmods.com/oblivion/mods/9562) - adds a lot of new and very different spells.

[Caelestion]

I always play with Oscuro's oblivion Overhaul, AlienSlof's Better Vampires and Enhanced Economy. Other highlights include various mods by Arthmoor and of course the Unofficial Patches and the Refurbished DLC patches.

[Triaxx]

Not sure if you can still get it, but I really liked the Abecan Lighthouse mod. Was good for letting non-mage characters make spells without faffing around in the guild.

[Rynjin]

Not sure if you can still get it, but I really liked the Abecan Lighthouse mod. Was good for letting non-mage characters make spells without faffing around in the guild.

I mean the official DLC provides plenty of that.

[The Jack]

See, I feel like my TES problem at the moment is that you just need too many damn mods for skyrim/oblivion (I haven't conquered most of morrowind yet, so it can last)


Why can't they just release a good game
with in-built gambling
and nudity

I've matured a bit, but when I was younger, I really wanted them to do TES's base with more sex; a bit more than fallout, a lot less than most mods. Of course, that'd be a financial mess, but there's a pit of quality around that kind of modding and I'd rather something more official.

Skyrim, to play it, I feel like you need to mod out the skyrimness of it all; replace the UI, replace the perks, replace the crafting, the models, questlines, homes, spells... it's literally hours of un-****ifying skyrim. I can do that once or twice when I'm fresh to the game and want to change a few things as they appear, but when you've played a while you've got an almost mandatory list you need to install.

[Triaxx]

To be honest Rynjin, I haven't actually played with the official DLC before. So I know nothing about it.

The Jack... Steam is already full of games like that. If you want that, Witcher is a thing that exists. Bethesda wouldn't get it right.

[Spore]

I've matured a bit, but when I was younger, I really wanted them to do TES's base with more sex; a bit more than fallout, a lot less than most mods. Of course, that'd be a financial mess, but there's a pit of quality around that kind of modding and I'd rather something more official.

Skyrim, to play it, I feel like you need to mod out the skyrimness of it all; replace the UI, replace the perks, replace the crafting, the models, questlines, homes, spells... it's literally hours of un-****ifying skyrim. I can do that once or twice when I'm fresh to the game and want to change a few things as they appear, but when you've played a while you've got an almost mandatory list you need to install.

I am of the opinion that if you can lob someone's head off (or in Fallout games dismember their lifeless corpse) you should be able to display graphic nudity. But TES was always about heroic fantasy. To be fair, sexuality is strictly not necessary for the game to work.

But personally I would prefer a few more involving companions that have side quests and a few that are romancable. I really liked Benor and married him in one game, because he is a no nonsense guy even though he is basically one of the worst choices statwise for a follower. He had so much potential. He is from the backwater hold Morthal (I always felt the hold was the dumpster of Skyrim imho), he dislikes the jarl (which could have been twisted into a cool quest) he is straight up and he is daddy a strong man.

[Vinyadan]

Skyrim, to play it, I feel like you need to mod out the skyrimness of it all; replace the UI, replace the perks, replace the crafting, the models, questlines, homes, spells... it's literally hours of un-****ifying skyrim. I can do that once or twice when I'm fresh to the game and want to change a few things as they appear, but when you've played a while you've got an almost mandatory list you need to install.

Daggfall did have nudity, IIRC... and Morrowind had gambling, maybe in the Solstheim expansion (it wasn't native. You could play the three shells game with an Argonian, I believe).

About the Skyrim UI, it's incredibly bad. I have no idea of why they couldn't put some more effort into it. The Morrowind interface was also quite bad, but it was saved by being meant to be used with a mouse. Skyrim, instead of letting you interact directly with your body slots (as in, choose from a list of items that you get by clicking on a certain slot), went for showing a 3d portrait of the items in your inventory, which probably was only useful for the dragon claws.

The monochrome style didn't help, either.

[The Jack]

Daggerfall had full nudity or near enough. Maybe not genitals.
Morrowind had dancers
Oblivion had...
Skyrim has revealing outfits.
They've all had a few references,stories and such.

I too am of the opinion that, if you can decapitate someone, you can see people ****. I imagine this whole cultural aversion to nudity was spearheaded by some very insecure people and everyone else is just following suit. But hey, I don't have the proudest body in the world, I'm lazy and unlikely to work on it very seriously; Maybe I benefit from this sheltering. Unless the dutch get really into game development or the indies go mad with it we're unlikely to see the goods soon. (also, bethesda are kinda cowardly)

[LibraryOgre]

Morrowind, I played happily with DLC and one, very simple, mod (it set Cliff Racers to 0 aggression, so they left me alone unless I bothered them).

Oblivion, I'm looking at mods before I start it again, though I could play it vanilla (though I'd have to work around the leveling issue by simply never sleeping).

Skyrim? The PC UI is so awful that I stopped playing until someone suggested SkyUI, which made it tolerable.

[Resileaf]

Every single game has the Lusty Argonian Maid.


Morrowind, I played happily with DLC and one, very simple, mod (it set Cliff Racers to 0 aggression, so they left me alone unless I bothered them).


THIS IS THE BEST MOD EVER!!!

[factotum]

I think switching off Cliff Racers entirely is a bit extreme--pretty sure I remember a mod which made regular ones leave you alone, with only the corrupted ones chasing you down, which makes a lot more sense to me.

[halfeye]

I am of the opinion that if you can lob someone's head off (or in Fallout games dismember their lifeless corpse) you should be able to display graphic nudity. But TES was always about heroic fantasy. To be fair, sexuality is strictly not necessary for the game to work.

This comes from film censorship. People can be killed in kids films, but not messily, or at least it used to be that way. Sex was totally out for kids films, all the way up to the 18 years old age limit. But once they were 18, then Psycho was allowed (barely, it got cut). So extreme violence is equal to mild sex, in terms of film censorship, and that carries over into games.

[veti]

Morrowind, I played happily with DLC and one, very simple, mod (it set Cliff Racers to 0 aggression, so they left me alone unless I bothered them).

Oblivion, I'm looking at mods before I start it again, though I could play it vanilla (though I'd have to work around the leveling issue by simply never sleeping).

Skyrim? The PC UI is so awful that I stopped playing until someone suggested SkyUI, which made it tolerable.

For Morrowind, I don't think I'd play it again without the graphics enhancement overhaul, whatever it's called.

Oblivion - yeah. I've tried replaying that unmodded, and barely made it through tutorial before adding mods. It's just awful.

Skyrim - I played quite contentedly with the vanilla UI for many weeks before realising I could change it. Granted, the change is a huge improvement. But in Skyrim - it's the first time I've really enjoyed modding, rather than seeing it as a rather tedious chore to make the gameplay fun.

[halfeye]

I play games unmodded. Haven't modded one yet.

[DigoDragon]

Suggestion: Complete Fast Travel Overhaul would let you tell the carriage driver to drop you off in Shor's Stone. (He must have driven you straight through it, and Fort Greenwall.) Saves quite a lot of walking, when you're avoiding fast travel.
You'd still get to loot, sorry I mean "encounter", the fort on your way back, since CFTO annoyingly doesn't put carts in the small settlements.

Eh, if I'm encountering the fort either way, then I'm fine just assaulting it now than later. The dragon was an unexpected twist, however, and taking a carriage to Shor's might of meant I'd have to fight the dragon there. They always pick the worst timing possible. :smalltongue:



Love the story, but what happened to your feline pack mule?

Shiira? I caught up with her after the last of the bandits were taken care of. She was inside the fort grounds running against a wall trying to path-find back to me.

[Caelestion]

For Morrowind, I don't think I'd play it again without the graphics enhancement overhaul, whatever it's called.

MGSO is now massively outdated. The MGG (https://wiki.nexusmods.com/index.php/Morrowind_graphics_guide) is what people should use these days.

[Vinyadan]

For future reference, does anyone know if old edition Skyrim saves are compatible with the special edition?

[Caelestion]

Unmodded LE saves should be compatible with SE saves, but not modded LE saves.

[LibraryOgre]

I am not sure which mod is doing it, but all the containers have been replaced with yellow fields.

[Rynjin]

I am not sure which mod is doing it, but all the containers have been replaced with yellow fields.

Oscuro's, probably. I had a lot of issues with it so I stopped using it.

I made an article for work about Oblivion mods yesterday since your post reminded me it was in the backlog but I'm not sure how kosher it is to post stuff from other websites in that context here and I'm too lazy to retype all of them.

[Balmas]

Hmm. After watching the latest video from Mitten Squad, I'm kinda considering doing a runthrough of Skyrim with shouts as my only source of damage. It'd be almost a pure mage playthrough; besides Speech for more powerful shouts, he'd be focused on Alteration and Illusion, with enchanting and alchemy to help him survive. Don't know how I'd roleplay it; maybe a Breton clothes horse who simply refuses to get blood on his clothes?

The only issue is that I still have the Chadwick playthrough hanging over my head; while I want to give him a resolution, he's hit the point in the Skyrim power curve where it's no longer fun to play him. He's a steamroller in human form.

[Caelestion]

I am not sure which mod is doing it, but all the containers have been replaced with yellow fields.

That means you're missing meshes for some things (or that the meshes have been misnamed).

[Triaxx]

If I recall correctly there are one of two reasons for the Yellow Triangles. First is that Oscuro's didn't install quite correctly, and it's fairly likely. That's an annoying procress. Second is that you might need to toggle archive invalidation off and then back on. Oblivion was more sensitive to that than later games.

[DigoDragon]

My adopted daughter Lucia somehow got herself stuck inside a weapon case. I couldn't get her out, so I just closed the case and she sank through the floor. About 3 minutes later she fased through the wall in the basement and is totally fine again. Um... not sure if proud, concerned... maybe both...?

(I love the little glitches in this game) :smallbiggrin:

[LibraryOgre]

So, according to a thing on Tumblr (which I can't access from work), the settlment creation system from Fallout 4 was originally slated for Skyrim.

[Rynjin]

That makes sense; Skyrim had a LOT of planned content cut (most notably the Civil War was meant to be the biggest and most important questline). IIRC Hearthfire is a DLC made of unfinished content that was meant to be in the base game.

[Divayth Fyr]

Not really. Hearthfire is largely packing up and polishing what some of the devs did as a part of the Game Jam (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8PedZazWQ48).

[Resileaf]

It's so sad they could never make the civil war work out and that it was just too buggy and ended up having to gut it and make it what we got instead. What could have been...

[halfeye]

It's so sad they could never make the civil war work out and that it was just too buggy and ended up having to gut it and make it what we got instead. What could have been...

Sounds horrible. I hated the Sid Meier's Civilisation lite aspect of Fallout 4.

[veti]

It's so sad they could never make the civil war work out and that it was just too buggy and ended up having to gut it and make it what we got instead. What could have been...

I'm quite glad of it, myself. I detest both sides in the Civil War, and would resent having to support one in order to get the most out of the game.

[Resileaf]

I'm quite glad of it, myself. I detest both sides in the Civil War, and would resent having to support one in order to get the most out of the game.

Well that's a story problem, not a gameplay one.

[Rynjin]

I'm quite glad of it, myself. I detest both sides in the Civil War, and would resent having to support one in order to get the most out of the game.

I mean part of the cut content were options that ensured both/neither sides would win, so not an issue.

[Vinyadan]

Unmodded LE saves should be compatible with SE saves, but not modded LE saves.

OK, thanks!


That makes sense; Skyrim had a LOT of planned content cut (most notably the Civil War was meant to be the biggest and most important questline). IIRC Hearthfire is a DLC made of unfinished content that was meant to be in the base game.

That explains why it felt so weird. For a while, I was convinced I was playing a mod. And it didn't have any effect, anyway, because no king was elected: we were still waiting for that council in the end. From a narrative point of view, it left me really puzzled. Zero payback. Even the crown -- actually a pretty good helm -- was never seen again. And the new jarls didn't have the decency to dress like one.

[Balmas]

Well, I've started a new playthrough. Mercury ventures forth into Mundus with magicks magnificent, finery fantastic, alchemy to astound... and the rough musculature of a twig. As such, he can cast with the best of them, but asking him to wear armor or swing sharp metal sticks is just not in the cards.

I have to say, playing a pure mage is a very different experience than I'm accustomed to, especially on master difficulty. Normally, by level 5, I can tank a few hits, and sword-and-board means I can usually whittle enemies into submission with no problem. As a mage, though, any hit will knacker my health, so I've been playing keep-away with summons, Fus-ing enemies as needed to summon more. It's a very different playstyle, and I'm kinda digging being a total glass cannon.

[DigoDragon]

I'm quite glad of it, myself. I detest both sides in the Civil War, and would resent having to support one in order to get the most out of the game.

Hmm, an independent third option would be neat. Worked for New Vegas quite well. Who would be our "Yes Man" for Skyrim tho...?

[Lord Raziere]

Hmm, an independent third option would be neat. Worked for New Vegas quite well. Who would be our "Yes Man" for Skyrim tho...?

Hm.

well just to spitball.....

the Greybeards or Paarthurnax since they're not political guys, could be good ones. after all, first emperor like, went to the greybeards or something as well, and they're just concerned with you using your power responsibly and if your objection to both factions is that neither is morally right and both should shape up, I don't see the Greybeards being against you. I don't see them helping you other than advice, but Paarthurnax and his dragons could be your robot army.

I could see Miraak being our checkered suit man, some Thalmor head honcho being the evil corporation guy,which you give you two completely evil options to join as well.

or the College of Winterhold using that Ol' Eye of Magnus to do something, maybe say screw the Psijic Order to actually use the Eye for something?

or just take the Blades, and like, go on a quest to like, repurpose those stupid Dwemer ruins lying about eternally producing new automatons for themselves to like, kick out the Thalmor and such.

Balgruuf strikes me as a relatively neutral guy who was like, chill with the Dragonborn doing crazy things and actually solving that dragon problem, so it doesn't seem out of bounds to me that some really persuasive dragonborn could persuade him to become some third faction for a more reasonable Skyrim.

maybe you can get the option of sparing Alduin and he like, becomes okay with you as long as like, he gets to cause destruction and takes names like a badass or something while you command him to get rid of whatever you want.

[Vinyadan]

Been a while since I played Oblivion, but the three ones I recall the most are:

Francescos Creatures and Items (https://www.nexusmods.com/oblivion/mods/40190) - dramatically changes (improves IMO) the whole everything "levels with player" aspect of the game
OblivionXP (https://www.nexusmods.com/oblivion/mods/35333) - swaps out the usual elder scrolls leveling system for an XP-based one. Purely a matter of taste, obviously, but I found it helpful in Oblivion because it ensures you don't have to worry about running and jumping too much leveling you up.
Midas Magic (https://www.nexusmods.com/oblivion/mods/9562) - adds a lot of new and very different spells.

Make sure to give the watermelon atronach (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLrb_9GXX0Q) a spin!


Hmm, an independent third option would be neat. Worked for New Vegas quite well. Who would be our "Yes Man" for Skyrim tho...?

Paarthurnax. Take that, Dumb Blades!

Or Potema. Or that priest of the Vomiting Church of Peryite.

Or Randy Savage. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QlJULk0f9xA)

[Keltest]

Hmm, an independent third option would be neat. Worked for New Vegas quite well. Who would be our "Yes Man" for Skyrim tho...?

I could see Balgruuf heading up a "lets stop being bloody morons for two minutes please" faction in the civil war if the Dragonborn offered their support.

Having said that, ultimately I think that faction would end up largely indistinguishable from an Imperial victory anyway. As much as the Imperials can be nasty at times, anything short of unity with them leaves both the Empire and Skyrim isolated and vulnerable to a Dominion invasion.

I'd take it every time though if it let me kill Maven Blackbriar.

[veti]

I could see Balgruuf heading up a "lets stop being bloody morons for two minutes please" faction in the civil war if the Dragonborn offered their support.

Having said that, ultimately I think that faction would end up largely indistinguishable from an Imperial victory anyway.

Possibly, but I'd have no problem with the imperials if they weren't bloody morons.

My personal resolution to the Civil War would be to use my own authority as Dragonborn, Harbinger and Archmage, allied to the Greybeards if that's not enough already, to call a moot and have it elect a new king. And Tullius and Elenwen don't get invited.

[Keltest]

Possibly, but I'd have no problem with the imperials if they weren't bloody morons.

My personal resolution to the Civil War would be to use my own authority as Dragonborn, Harbinger and Archmage, allied to the Greybeards if that's not enough already, to call a moot and have it elect a new king. And Tullius and Elenwen don't get invited.

Ulfric's legitimacy as a jarl is a big problem there. Most of the imperial-siding jarls don't recognize him or his authority after he murdered Torygg, and Ulfric knows it. Without resolving that one way or another, the moot is a largely meaningless gesture as the losing side simply wont recognize the proceedings. Heck, he specifically calls out that the moot would be more or less deadlocked until one side's jarls are removed.

[veti]

Ulfric's legitimacy as a jarl is a big problem there. Most of the imperial-siding jarls don't recognize him or his authority after he murdered Torygg, and Ulfric knows it.

They don't accept his authority as king, but I don't hear anyone disputing his position as jarl of Windhelm. Heck, even Tullius allows him that. And as far as I know, there's no allowance in Skyrim law for jarls to interfere in the internal affairs of holds other than their own. If they don't want him to be king, that's easy - all they have to do is put up a candidate of their own who would attract enough votes to win.

It wouldn't be Elisif. But the jarl of Whiterun could probably swing it.

[Triaxx]

Trouble is... by Skyrim's standards Ulfric is not a murderer for killing Torygg. Only by imperial measure.

As for a civil war resolution alternative? Balgruuf accepts Ulfric's Axe, and the war becomes a diplomatic event, with you flipping cities once you become Thane. (Or rather having the option to do so.) There's still a grand assault on Solitude, but Elisif intervene's to save Tullius.

In exchange for a peaceful withdrawal of excess forces, Skyrim get's status similar to Morrowind. It's own laws and leadership, and religion, in exchange for continuing to send troops to the legion. And because I like the Thought, Elenwen turns up whine about it, and Riika cuts her head off.

[factotum]

so I've been playing keep-away with summons, Fus-ing enemies as needed to summon more. It's a very different playstyle, and I'm kinda digging being a total glass cannon.

Well, unless you're playing modded, that will rapidly turn into a total glass pea-shooter, given the way magic doesn't scale in vanilla Skyrim. :smallwink:

[Triaxx]

I vanilla you just let your summons tank, while you sit and use Impact to perma-stun everything.

[Keltest]

Trouble is... by Skyrim's standards Ulfric is not a murderer for killing Torygg. Only by imperial measure.

As for a civil war resolution alternative? Balgruuf accepts Ulfric's Axe, and the war becomes a diplomatic event, with you flipping cities once you become Thane. (Or rather having the option to do so.) There's still a grand assault on Solitude, but Elisif intervene's to save Tullius.

In exchange for a peaceful withdrawal of excess forces, Skyrim get's status similar to Morrowind. It's own laws and leadership, and religion, in exchange for continuing to send troops to the legion. And because I like the Thought, Elenwen turns up whine about it, and Riika cuts her head off.

The fact that half the jarls sided with the imperials would suggest that he is a murderer and traitor by Skyrim's standards as well.

[Vinyadan]

This kind of cultural difference between Skyrim and the Empire is rather odd, though. The Empire ruled Skyrim for what, 500 years? And Imperial values would have bled into Nord society through many sources, like priests and those who served in the Emperor's army.

Although I assume that defunct traditions can be revived (or semi-invented) by a political leader if they fit his interest.

[Spore]

Hmm, an independent third option would be neat. Worked for New Vegas quite well. Who would be our "Yes Man" for Skyrim tho...?

Maybe Amaund Motierre? Many DB quests have a redeeming quality for murder, why not "we murder the emperor and the resulting power vacuum allows you to win the civil war". Of course one needs to remove the raging racist Ulfric too.

With both leaders gone, you can unite Skyrim to go against the Thalmor.

[DigoDragon]

I don't see them helping you other than advice, but Paarthurnax and his dragons could be your robot army.

Probably too few dragons in that pot, but the imagery of the Dragonborn atop a fleet of dragons landing in Solitude to declare themselves the occupying force is a juicy one to imagine. :3



or just take the Blades, and like, go on a quest to like, repurpose those stupid Dwemer ruins lying about eternally producing new automatons for themselves to like, kick out the Thalmor and such.

The Blades were in service to the former Dragonborn emperor of long ago, weren't they? I could see them being your inner circle.



Having said that, ultimately I think that faction would end up largely indistinguishable from an Imperial victory anyway. As much as the Imperials can be nasty at times, anything short of unity with them leaves both the Empire and Skyrim isolated and vulnerable to a Dominion invasion.

I'd take it every time though if it let me kill Maven Blackbriar.

That's a good point. Ultimately I prefer Skyrim remaining united with the empire, I just think some of the Imperial leadership does need replacement.

I'll agree on the Maven point. :3

[Balmas]

Well, unless you're playing modded, that will rapidly turn into a total glass pea-shooter, given the way magic doesn't scale in vanilla Skyrim. :smallwink:

I'm playing with Ordinator, which allows spell and shout effectiveness to scale with skill, as well as some mods that add enchantments for spell efficacy. It makes it so that by the high levels, I can actually keep pace with enemy health, but still have to keep on top of mana management.

[Resileaf]

I'm playing with Ordinator, which allows spell and shout effectiveness to scale with skill, as well as some mods that add enchantments for spell efficacy. It makes it so that by the high levels, I can actually keep pace with enemy health, but still have to keep on top of mana management.

Always hated how magic didn't scale, and unlike Oblivion and Morrowind, you can't create new spells to keep up with enemy health. This is a lifesaving mod.

[Ogremindes]

On the subject of Ordinator, EnaiSiaion (author of Ordinator) recently released Vokrii - Minimalistic Perks of Skyrim (https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/26176). As the name suggests, it has a much lighter touch than Ordinator.

I'm not sure what I feel about it. If it was available when I started modding Skyrim I probably would have used it over Ordinator, but at this point I have no idea what the vanilla perks even are.

[Kareeah_Indaga]

I am going to second backing Balgruuf; he's a sensible fellow, and even Ulfric admits he's a True Nord. IIRC most of the rest are either crazy, racist, corrupt or stupid anyway.

[LibraryOgre]

Hmmm... what if you had a council of Jarls as a witan (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Witenagemot), and could throw your weight (as multi-thane Harbinger Archmage Guild Master Whisperer Dovahkiin) behind any one of them, with differing results? Baalgruuf would be an obvious choice, but Maven Blackbriar would be angling for her pet jarl, Tullius would support Elsif, and the Stormcloak-aligned Jarls might be behind Ulfric, etc. Your job would be to find the Jarls who aren't terribly committed one way or another and bring them to your side. The Thalmor would want to attend; the Stormcloaks (and some of the others) would object that it was a Nord matter, not subject to the Thalmor's interference, and the Thalmor would say that, if they were disinvited, why was the legion there, etc.

[The Jack]

{{Scrubbed}}

[Kantaki]

The Thalmor would want to attend; the Stormcloaks (and some of the others) would object that it was a Nord matter, not subject to the Thalmor's interference, and the Thalmor would say that, if they were disinvited, why was the legion there, etc.

"That's actually quite simple: No one likes you.":smalltongue: is what my altmer character would say.

No seriously, some of the greatest moments she had were walking up to some of those Thalmor thugs on the road- wearing Thalor robes -and basically shouting "Talos rules" at the top of her lungs.:smallbiggrin:

I think by now they might be onto her though...
The last group tried to kill her before she even got a word out.:smallbiggrin:

No, really, I literally walked up to a random patrol and they immediatly got aggressive.
Not that Stormcloaks and Imperials are any better...:smallsigh:

[Vinyadan]

Not letting the player make war against the Thalmor also was super weird. I get that it's a bigger deal than Skyrim, but still. Is it in a DLC?

[Resileaf]

Not letting the player make war against the Thalmor also was super weird. I get that it's a bigger deal than Skyrim, but still. Is it in a DLC?

It's not. Chances are that war against the Thalmor will be part of a future game.

[Keltest]

It's not. Chances are that war against the Thalmor will be part of a future game.

The Thalmor are mostly a token presence in Skyrim anyway. You could burn down all of their holdings and kill, like, a few dozen elves at most. That's less a war and more Saturday relaxation for the Dragonborn.

Actually, come to think of it, its entirely possible to invade both Thalmor forts and kill everyone inside.

[factotum]

You can't kill the most annoying Thalmor in the game, though, because Ancano is marked plot critical. My assassin mage killed him but good with a backstab when he mouthed off to her, but he just went down on his knee and wouldn't die! :smallannoyed:

[Kareeah_Indaga]

"That's actually quite simple: No one likes you.":smalltongue: is what my altmer character would say.

No seriously, some of the greatest moments she had were walking up to some of those Thalmor thugs on the road- wearing Thalor robes -and basically shouting "Talos rules" at the top of her lungs.:smallbiggrin:

I think by now they might be onto her though...
The last group tried to kill her before she even got a word out.:smallbiggrin:

No, really, I literally walked up to a random patrol and they immediatly got aggressive.
Not that Stormcloaks and Imperials are any better...:smallsigh:

Was it a normal patrol or one of the death squad random encounters?


It's not. Chances are that war against the Thalmor will be part of a future game.

One hopes so. If they resolve it off-screen I'm going to be annoyed. :smallannoyed:

[Triaxx]

It's probably been resolved off-screen. They usually do. Middle of a war isn't conducive to the way Bethesda games are designed. Big open world don't work well when constrained by battle lines.

[Kantaki]

Was it a normal patrol or one of the death squad random encounters?

No idea.
They were a bit unusual in that all three of them were wearing armor, but I could initiate the usual dialogue tree.
It's just that they turned hostile before I actually picked a option.

Well, and they did that thing where they drew their swords because I was standing near them.
But that happens with the patrols of other factions too.

Which makes it a shame there isn't a „You're all morons. I'm running the show now.” option.
I mean I wouldn't trust most of those guys to run a lemonade stall, much less to run a country.
And getting antagonized on the road for no reason doesn't help.
Especially if the guys in the military camps are perfectly fine with me walking around.:smallsigh:

[Lord Raziere]

Hey guys, what do you do when your modded skyrim se game keeps CTD when you try to exit to other areas or save? I've been trying to look up solutions but getting some better answers from asking myself just to make sure.

[Keltest]

Hey guys, what do you do when your modded skyrim se game keeps CTD when you try to exit to other areas or save? I've been trying to look up solutions but getting some better answers from asking myself just to make sure.

First I check if it does this on all saves or just this specific one. If the former, I start disabling and re-enabling mods until I find the one causing the crash and then I banish it from my computer. If the latter, I cry because its probably a corrupted save file and I don't usually make enough backups to keep me from losing several hours of playtime.

[Lord Raziere]

First I check if it does this on all saves or just this specific one. If the former, I start disabling and re-enabling mods until I find the one causing the crash and then I banish it from my computer. If the latter, I cry because its probably a corrupted save file and I don't usually make enough backups to keep me from losing several hours of playtime.

well I tried with a slightly earlier save and that CTD when I opened a door as well, so its probably a mod then. according to LOOT, its Undeath Remastered that has all these ITMs and Wild edits, but so its probably that even though it hasn't done that before, I've got a lot of mods so I'm not surprised if one of my more recent ones caused it to screw up though. its the only one I'm getting errors for, so....

[Keltest]

well I tried with a slightly earlier save and that CTD when I opened a door as well, so its probably a mod then. according to LOOT, its Undeath Remastered that has all these ITMs and Wild edits, but so its probably that even though it hasn't done that before, I've got a lot of mods so I'm not surprised if one of my more recent ones caused it to screw up though. its the only one I'm getting errors for, so....

how much earlier? If it was only one or two zone transitions ago, it could conceivably have become corrupted as well. Try making a new game or loading a different character.

[Lord Raziere]

how much earlier? If it was only one or two zone transitions ago, it could conceivably have become corrupted as well. Try making a new game or loading a different character.

.....tried a different character. worked fine. dammit. my last save before the autos and the current save on that character is three levels ago.

[Keltest]

.....tried a different character. worked fine. dammit. my last save before the autos and the current save on that character is three levels ago.

I guess if you really want to procrastinate on reloading this save, you could run the other character to the same zone transition and see if that's whats broken.

[Lord Raziere]

I guess if you really want to procrastinate on reloading this save, you could run the other character to the same zone transition and see if that's whats broken.

well I tried the three levels lower save and tried to enter the inn of winterhold, since I was outside the college rather than inside, but when I did it CTD as well. ....can I just....not do anything with winter hold?

[Keltest]

well I tried the three levels lower save and tried to enter the inn of winterhold, since I was outside the college rather than inside, but when I did it CTD as well. ....can I just....not do anything with winter hold?

As long as you don't care about the college or the house, sure.

Having said that, at this point I think its safe to say its a mod causing some horrible issue when you load Winterhold, so you may want to try and isolate it to make sure it isn't causing issues anywhere else.

[Lord Raziere]

As long as you don't care about the college or the house, sure.

Having said that, at this point I think its safe to say its a mod causing some horrible issue when you load Winterhold, so you may want to try and isolate it to make sure it isn't causing issues anywhere else.

good news I found the horrible mod, my character can step outside the college again.

bad news, I won't get to cast poison spells unless it was just the version of the mod that didn't add perks that was doing it.

Edit: nope nope nope, poison spells just won't work, nope.....

[Keltest]

Im always deeply curious what it is about mods that do things like add spells which cause entire areas to crap out.

[Lord Raziere]

Im always deeply curious what it is about mods that do things like add spells which cause entire areas to crap out.

I got like, a few other add spell mods that are far more extensive than the one that was causing me problems, even adding more than just spells, and they don't do that. heck, I even got one mod that gives me a few poison spells anyways without it, I just didn't find the vendor that sold them until after. it has nothing to do with size, just whether the person made the mod well enough, apparently according to a guide about cleaning dirty plugins.

[Triaxx]

xEdit can actually clean plug-in's for you.

Do you have other things that alter Winterhold?

[Lord Raziere]

xEdit can actually clean plug-in's for you.

Do you have other things that alter Winterhold?

I mean if you count a legend of zelda mod that places a thing thats apart of a scavenger hunt for skulltula tokens, yes....or that mod that places book describing the infinity stones in skyrim...or colorful magic.... but those are big mods that covers all of skyrim pretty much.

I don't have any mods that focus SPECIFICALLY on changing the college, just things that are kind of everywhere and just so happen to put something in the college, like the above, but they don't cause any problems.

[Lord Raziere]

Uuuh, another, different problem came up? I've tried googling it but it doesn't take...

my saves aren't being sorted by character anymore in skyrim se. normally it sorts by character so that they aren't mixed up here and there, but for some reason my saves of my latest session are in the general save part when I show all saves, but not the character specific saves, everything else still works though. can anyone tell me whats going on?

[Cygnia]

After 2 years on the PS3, I finally finished Skyrim (technically).

I'm already trying to figure out what my next character should be/go for the next time around...

[Spore]

Is anyone here playing ESO, specifically on the EU server? Though it would help if I had someone to ask dumb newb questions to :)

[Caelestion]

I am, yes, but I haven't been playing that long. What's your @name?

[Keltest]

I do play, but on the American server. If you post questions here, I might be able to answer them.

[Kareeah_Indaga]

I do play, but on the American server. If you post questions here, I might be able to answer them.

Same here; I play but on the US side.

[Spore]

I am, yes, but I haven't been playing that long. What's your @name?

I play @sp0reegg.

I have a 29 Sorc and a 32 Templar and I am kinda burning out on both specs. I'm looking for something similar to WoW hunters (physical ranged attacks, pets, utility) that can also heal. People tell me Templar is the one and only best healer, and I can kinda see why since I had good success. Sorcerer unites many of my preferences with in a hybrid spec (playing magicka pet sorc with a few healing spells, just enough to get through random dungeons). Tbh on Templars I kinda enjoyed tanking more but Magicka DPS with a few healing spells strewn in works so well in dungeons.

I'm kinda strapped for motivation, and I am not even sure what ESO endgame has for me. The questing is okay, the stories are even kinda nice but at their core they're still MMO quests. Not as bad as "collect 8 bear butts" but you get the gist. I feel there is no cohesive gameplay in each class (mostly because skills are free form and form fits function) and I need as many skill trees on my bars to level as many different **** (even though I read that skills level insanely quickly on 50 anyway?).

Most bummed I am because the Dominion questline on my Khajiit Sorcerer is engaging and fun (you start off preventing a cult from killing a settlement and go on to save the fricking queen, how cool is that) while the Ebonheart Pact questline on my Argonian Templar really hasn't picked up for me (save island from bandits, boooooring! and then stop a gigantic bone atronach...uhm idk, I like politics RP more). Yes I know you can quest as any race with any questline but it feels weird to save the queen of the opposing faction.

So a few questions:

1) Is healing sorc viable in random PvP/dungeons?

2) How important are racials? Redguard as stam DPS read as very OP for example, or is this a 5% increase?

3) Can a templar perform all three roles adequately?

4) How is Zenimax' nerf/buff policy?

5) Should I level one main with all professions or make one/a few profession alts?

6) How impactful is the cash shop? I feels borderline predatory to me (CS for carry capacity, mount speed, insane potions), like a korean grinder in which you have to use the shop in order to compete with others and still have a life and work.

[Keltest]

I play @sp0reegg.

I have a 29 Sorc and a 32 Templar and I am kinda burning out on both specs. I'm looking for something similar to WoW hunters (physical ranged attacks, pets, utility) that can also heal. People tell me Templar is the one and only best healer, and I can kinda see why since I had good success. Sorcerer unites many of my preferences with in a hybrid spec (playing magicka pet sorc with a few healing spells, just enough to get through random dungeons). Tbh on Templars I kinda enjoyed tanking more but Magicka DPS with a few healing spells strewn in works so well in dungeons.

I'm kinda strapped for motivation, and I am not even sure what ESO endgame has for me. The questing is okay, the stories are even kinda nice but at their core they're still MMO quests. Not as bad as "collect 8 bear butts" but you get the gist. I feel there is no cohesive gameplay in each class (mostly because skills are free form and form fits function) and I need as many skill trees on my bars to level as many different **** (even though I read that skills level insanely quickly on 50 anyway?).

Most bummed I am because the Dominion questline on my Khajiit Sorcerer is engaging and fun (you start off preventing a cult from killing a settlement and go on to save the fricking queen, how cool is that) while the Ebonheart Pact questline on my Argonian Templar really hasn't picked up for me (save island from bandits, boooooring! and then stop a gigantic bone atronach...uhm idk, I like politics RP more). Yes I know you can quest as any race with any questline but it feels weird to save the queen of the opposing faction.

So a few questions:

1) Is healing sorc viable in random PvP/dungeons?

2) How important are racials? Redguard as stam DPS read as very OP for example, or is this a 5% increase?

3) Can a templar perform all three roles adequately?

4) How is Zenimax' nerf/buff policy?

5) Should I level one main with all professions or make one/a few profession alts?

6) How impactful is the cash shop? I feels borderline predatory to me (CS for carry capacity, mount speed, insane potions), like a korean grinder in which you have to use the shop in order to compete with others and still have a life and work.

Sounds like you want a Warden. They get a lovely bear pet for an ult which, while it cant tank, does do respectable damage and looks cool. As to your questions.

1: depends on what you consider viable to be. Its certainly possible to build one that performs adequately in public dungeons, but it wouldn't be my first choice for the super top tier dungeons.

2: Pick whatever race you want to play. Racials help, but they don't really make or break a build until the super top tier of min-maxing.

3: Sure. Any class can be built to just about any role with some thought, at least enough to run dungeons. Templars in particular do especially well at healing, but they aren't bad at tanking or DPS by any definition.

4: depends on who you ask. Personally I don't think theyre terribly extreme, but everybody will get salty when their main gets nerfed for overperforming.

5: There isn't any real advantage to having all the crafting skills on one character besides convenience. There are enough skill points in the game through quests and levels that you can get all your important skills and passives for actually playing the game and still have enough left over for crafting skills.

6: its not pay to win at all. Items can basically be split into cosmetics and "do this if youre impatient/lazy and want to finish crafting research faster" style bonuses. There are some potions and stuff, but they're comparable to player made potions that you can just buy for gold at guild stores. I've never felt compelled to buy anything from it that wasn't cosmetic.

[LibraryOgre]

So ****ing sick of Oblivion and trying to get that piece of **** to work.

If I load up Oscuros, it runs fine, but doesn't have the meshes to allow for CONTAINERS.

If I DON'T load up Oscuros, it crashes just after the word Bethesda appears (which is really appropriate).

Firk ding blast.

[Caelestion]

If it's crashing directly after the Bethesda logo, that may mean that you have a font issue. Try deleting your user settings file and then loading without Oscuro.

[LibraryOgre]

If it's crashing directly after the Bethesda logo, that may mean that you have a font issue. Try deleting your user settings file and then loading without Oscuro.

I deleted EVERYTHING.

[Triaxx]

Toggle Archive Invalidation. If not you might have a bad Oscuro's install.

[Caelestion]

I deleted EVERYTHING.

If you deleted that much, you're better off with a fresh install so that problems like this can't happen.

[veti]

If you deleted that much, you're better off with a fresh install so that problems like this can't happen.

Yep, and remember there's a whole procedure to uninstall Oblivion. It's not just a matter of clicking Uninstall.

[Caelestion]

I don't recall ever uninstalling Oblivion. :smalltongue:

[veti]

I don't recall ever uninstalling Oblivion. :smalltongue:

Heh. Well, if you played it more than once, I think that puts you in the lucky minority.

For me, it was plagued by fatal bugs that could only be cured by a complete removal and reinstall.

[factotum]

For me, it was plagued by fatal bugs that could only be cured by a complete removal and reinstall.

For me, it was the plague of the clod-handed level scaling that stopped my play...it just beat my suspension of disbelief into a pulp.

[Caelestion]

I've installed the game multiple times over the years, but I've usually buried the vanilla game under an avalanche of mods, so I think it's fair to say that I haven't played the base game in probably ten years.

[Triaxx]

I have, it's just as frustrating as I remember, getting weaker as you go unless you take optimal level ups.

[Kesnit]

I have, it's just as frustrating as I remember, getting weaker as you go unless you take optimal level ups.

I never understood this complaint. If leveling worked like Skyrim (where every skill contributed to leveling), then I would agree. But that isn't how it works. You think Athletics levels too fast? OK, don't make it a major skill. You can level it as much as you want and it doesn't affect your character level.

Pick skills that you are going to use. Don't pick multiple weapon skills (Blade, Blunt, or Unarmed. Pick one and use it.) Pick one armor weight. Beyond those, you are in direct control of how quickly a skill levels. If you take Speechcraft as a major and think it is going up too fast, stop playing the minigame. One school of magic going up too fast? Switch to another for a while.

[veti]

I never understood this complaint. If leveling worked like Skyrim (where every skill contributed to leveling), then I would agree. But that isn't how it works. You think Athletics levels too fast? OK, don't make it a major skill. You can level it as much as you want and it doesn't affect your character level.

Pick skills that you are going to use. Don't pick multiple weapon skills (Blade, Blunt, or Unarmed. Pick one and use it.) Pick one armor weight. Beyond those, you are in direct control of how quickly a skill levels. If you take Speechcraft as a major and think it is going up too fast, stop playing the minigame. One school of magic going up too fast? Switch to another for a while.
The complaint is that it leads to a constrained and artificial play style. By far the commonest recommendation for Oblivion is to pick primary skills that you are not going to use. That way, you can grow your own power without everyone else overtaking you.

I still have the notebook I used to use for tracking my level ups. At each level up, I'd sum the total of my skill points in skills associated with each of the seven base stats, and then I knew that I had to gain ten points - precisely ten, no more or less- in either two or three of those groups before I could afford to level.

Which, I'm pretty sure, is not what I was supposed to be thinking about as I played. It's certainly not what I was imagining when I bought it.

[Keltest]

I never understood this complaint. If leveling worked like Skyrim (where every skill contributed to leveling), then I would agree. But that isn't how it works. You think Athletics levels too fast? OK, don't make it a major skill. You can level it as much as you want and it doesn't affect your character level.

Pick skills that you are going to use. Don't pick multiple weapon skills (Blade, Blunt, or Unarmed. Pick one and use it.) Pick one armor weight. Beyond those, you are in direct control of how quickly a skill levels. If you take Speechcraft as a major and think it is going up too fast, stop playing the minigame. One school of magic going up too fast? Switch to another for a while.

Theres more to it than that. You raise your stats by leveling all your skills, but if you have all of the skills that raise a stat as a main skill, you actually lose a chunk of the potential leveling for that stat, because the skills stop counting for stat increase once you hit the XP to level, and it takes fewer skill ups to level than to max out a stat increase for that level.

[Kesnit]

The complaint is that it leads to a constrained and artificial play style. By far the commonest recommendation for Oblivion is to pick primary skills that you are not going to use. That way, you can grow your own power without everyone else overtaking you.

I still have the notebook I used to use for tracking my level ups. At each level up, I'd sum the total of my skill points in skills associated with each of the seven base stats, and then I knew that I had to gain ten points - precisely ten, no more or less- in either two or three of those groups before I could afford to level.

Which, I'm pretty sure, is not what I was supposed to be thinking about as I played. It's certainly not what I was imagining when I bought it.


Theres more to it than that. You raise your stats by leveling all your skills, but if you have all of the skills that raise a stat as a main skill, you actually lose a chunk of the potential leveling for that stat, because the skills stop counting for stat increase once you hit the XP to level, and it takes fewer skill ups to level than to max out a stat increase for that level.

Yeah, except if you just play the game and use the skills, you are going to stay ahead of the curve. No, you don't have to get every point exactly placed correctly. It is possible to play the game just - playing. Pick your skills. Use those skills. Level as level happens. And in the end, you will still be able to win fights and complete the game. (I did it that way playing on the 360 - so without mods. It works. I promise.)

If you feel the need to min-max Oblivion, that's fine; it's your choice. But that is the point - you are choosing to do that. You are choosing to make things that much harder/more annoying, then blaming the game for being hard/annoying.

[Caelestion]

Vanilla Oblivion is certainly playable, but the ferocious level scaling really is one of its biggest weaknesses.

[Kesnit]

Vanilla Oblivion is certainly playable, but the ferocious level scaling really is one of its biggest weaknesses.

I went through the game several times with different builds on the 360 and never saw that. That's why I said to pick skills you plan to use and then actually use them. Sure, the game is going to scale poorly if you pick your skills wrong. (If someone tries to play with the standard classes, the game is not going to scale well, that is true. So don't do that.) It does require some preplanning ("OK, this time I want light armor and unarmed, with stealth and...") , but once that is done, there is no need to min-max every level unless you want to. But as I said before, that is a choice you are choosing to make. That isn't the game becoming difficult (it's really not). That is you saying you cannot be happy unless you min-max the game so much you forget to enjoy it.

[Triaxx]

That would have been true, but since level scaling of enemies was by chunks. So you'd spend levels 1-5 dealing with Wolves, then when you got to the point you could reasonably fight them and survive most of the time, then at level 6 the game upped them all to Timberwolves, which were twice as tough, faster, stronger, and hit vastly harder. And suddenly you'd feel like you were doing worse than when you first started.

[veti]

Yeah, except if you just play the game and use the skills, you are going to stay ahead of the curve. No, you don't have to get every point exactly placed correctly. It is possible to play the game just - playing. Pick your skills. Use those skills. Level as level happens. And in the end, you will still be able to win fights and complete the game. (I did it that way playing on the 360 - so without mods. It works. I promise.)

Believe it or not, I tried that. I didn't go in to the game planning to make it a bookkeeping exercise. That was a reaction to what I found in the game. And when I looked up various discussions online, I found it was a very common experience.

When I start a new RPG, I expect to spend the first few levels running and hiding from most things. But by the time I reach level 20 or so, I expect to see a payoff in the form of being able to swat bandits and random wildlife with ease. That happens in Morrowind and in Skyrim, it even happens in Fallout 3 which is contemporary with Oblivion. Oblivion is an outlier here.

[factotum]

Yeah, except if you just play the game and use the skills, you are going to stay ahead of the curve.

Only if the skills you picked for levelling are combat related. If you picked stuff not directly related to combat, such as lockpicking or alchemy, then the monsters would scale up in power while you did not. Same applied to stuff like stealth, so if you played a sneaky thief type you'd rapidly find monsters outscaling your ability to kill them.

[Spore]

Oh I certainly had that feeling on an alchemy using thief after 10 levels. Bandits were managable but dungeons....oh my god.

Going vs a lich and a minotaur when your best weapon skill is light blades 23 with a shock dagger its difficult.

At least I had good stamina and was quickly running away since half my levels were from Acrobatics and Athletics.

But honestly that can be a good thing in RP not being automatically able to deal with any encounter.

[Caelestion]

I went through the game several times with different builds on the 360 and never saw that.

You never saw bandits in full glass or Daedric shaking you down on the road for 100 septims? You were never concerned that it didn't matter than anywhere you went, you would only find creatures and treasures carefully scaled for your level (and nothing else)? If it was just playing silly tricks like placing the skills you actually want to use as minors (which is just as silly and un-immersive as the min-maxing you're decrying), then that might be something, but it wasn't and it never will be.

[Kareeah_Indaga]

I went through the game several times with different builds on the 360 and never saw that. That's why I said to pick skills you plan to use and then actually use them. Sure, the game is going to scale poorly if you pick your skills wrong. (If someone tries to play with the standard classes, the game is not going to scale well, that is true. So don't do that.) It does require some preplanning ("OK, this time I want light armor and unarmed, with stealth and...") , but once that is done, there is no need to min-max every level unless you want to. But as I said before, that is a choice you are choosing to make. That isn't the game becoming difficult (it's really not). That is you saying you cannot be happy unless you min-max the game so much you forget to enjoy it.

The problem is, picking your skills wrong and/or playing an out of the box class is going to be a frequent occurance for anyone new to the game. Knowing which skills are going to be useless requires foreknowledge of the system, gameworld, and possibly the player's own playstyle that the player won't have yet - I know I've had instances where I fully intended to play (EX: ) a thiefy-type with daggers and then found a comparitively-awesome mace, or I wanted to play an illusionist and found out it wasn't working out so switched to conjuration. And a new player is less likely to roll up a new class when they don't know what they're going to use anyway.

Then, once they've learned how the system works, there are more optimal ways to level up without getting curb-stomped, namely the pick-skills-you-won't-use method others have mentioned.

[halfeye]

Believe it or not, I tried that. I didn't go in to the game planning to make it a bookkeeping exercise. That was a reaction to what I found in the game. And when I looked up various discussions online, I found it was a very common experience.

When I start a new RPG, I expect to spend the first few levels running and hiding from most things. But by the time I reach level 20 or so, I expect to see a payoff in the form of being able to swat bandits and random wildlife with ease. That happens in Morrowind and in Skyrim, it even happens in Fallout 3 which is contemporary with Oblivion. Oblivion is an outlier here.

Morrowind uses exactly the same levelling system as Oblivion, but with a lot more skills, and middle skills as well as major and minor, not that the middle skills have any effect on levelling (I think, I haven't played Morrowind much).

What (PC, I never used any other version) Oblivion got wrong was reducing the number of skills, which had a presumably unexpected effect on levelling.

The thing on using skills you don't normally use is that they need to be skills you can use at will, but normally don't, so you can level up as soon as you need to.

[Keltest]

Morrowind uses exactly the same levelling system as Oblivion, but with a lot more skills, and middle skills as well as major and minor, not that the middle skills have any effect on levelling (I think, I haven't played Morrowind much).

What (PC, I never used any other version) Oblivion got wrong was reducing the number of skills, which had a presumably unexpected effect on levelling.

The thing on using skills you don't normally use is that they need to be skills you can use at will, but normally don't, so you can level up as soon as you need to.

Morrowind also didn't have scaling content to the same degree that Oblivion did. Random Bandit #217 isn't going to be accosting you with glass equipment and a bunch of high level fighting skills.

[Kesnit]

Only if the skills you picked for levelling are combat related.

I did say to pick a combat style and armor weight.


If you picked stuff not directly related to combat, such as lockpicking or alchemy, then the monsters would scale up in power while you did not.

You can pick those as well. I pretty much always had stealth, lockpicking, and armorer as class skills.

If you run dungeons, your combat and armor skills are going to go up - probably faster than your others. (If you use magic, that will go up as well.) If you spend your early levels doing nothing but selling and doing alchemy, yes, your levels are going to fall behind your ability to fight.


Same applied to stuff like stealth, so if you played a sneaky thief type you'd rapidly find monsters outscaling your ability to kill them.

I played sneak thief and could still kill monsters.


You never saw bandits in full glass or Daedric shaking you down on the road for 100 septims?

I did. They died pretty quick because I had the combat skills to kill them. As the game leveled, so I did - sometimes faster than the game, sometimes in time with the game.


You were never concerned that it didn't matter than anywhere you went, you would only find creatures and treasures carefully scaled for your level (and nothing else)?

One thing I find boring about Skyrim is how once I get a few levels under me, most everything that drops is just vendor trash (once I improve it to raise my smithing). I like the idea of actually getting good things from drops.

[Morty]

I've honestly never understood the complaint about skills in Oblivion. I disliked most everything there, but the supposedly wonky levelling just didn't seem to apply to me. I kept myself pretty much exclusively to magic skills, for the record.

[Caelestion]

I like the idea of actually getting good things from drops.

Except that you didn't get "good" things: you got aggressively average things, even if they were unique quest rewards. Did they level up with you if you got them at low level? No. Did you have to delay doing quests with unique rewards if you actually wanted them at a reasonable level? Yes. I quickly dumped the vanilla levelling system and found several other mods to replace it with.

[Keltest]

Except that you didn't get "good" things: you got aggressively average things, even if they were unique quest rewards. Did they level up with you if you got them at low level? No. Did you have to delay doing quests with unique rewards if you actually wanted them at a reasonable level? Yes. I quickly dumped the vanilla levelling system and found several other mods to replace it with.

One of the first things I did with Skyrim and Oblivion was hunt for a mod that disables unique item scaling. Give me the best possible version of a daedric artifact or otherwise allegedly masterwork item, thank you. Getting a cool looking glass short sword that's barely better than silver is embarrassing.

[Resileaf]

I got a mod that lets you level unique items so they remain relevant.

[veti]

Morrowind uses exactly the same levelling system as Oblivion, but with a lot more skills, and middle skills as well as major and minor, not that the middle skills have any effect on levelling (I think, I haven't played Morrowind much).

Not exactly. There were some important differences.

One, a lot more skills, made it harder to gimp yourself by inadvertently picking all the skills associated with one stat. If you played a mage in Oblivion, it was virtually impossible to get a +5 increase to Int or Wil. I found that kinda counterintuitive.

Two, when you levelled up, the rest of the world didn't level with you. True that some harder encounters would be unlocked, but not *everydamnthing* on the map.

Three, the stat improvement counter didn't stop when you got the level up notification. If you really wanted to improve a stat, and you got the level up notice before you were ready, you still had options. Like, go to a town and buy more training before you go to bed. In Oblivion that didn't work, meaning significantly less control over levelling.

And four, training was unlimited. Again, this plays to the number of skills available, and the non-scaling world. Because it was quite feasible to find a piece of glass or ebony gear at low level, you could sell that and buy practically unlimited training in some skill you'd never even thought about before. (hence cheap because you were starting from skill 5.)

OK, so the last thing is almost as gamey and implausible as Oblivion, but all these differences militate the same way: they give the player more options. Those are all things that Oblivion took away. OK, I can see the case for simplifying the number of skills, and the level scaling was an obvious if misguided experiment - but the other two changes seem quite pointless except to irritate the player.

Bethesda, it should be noted, recognised their error, and didn't repeat the level scaling nonsense. They learned that lesson quickly enough to avoid repeating it in Fallout 3, and by Skyrim they'd got the balance about right, at least for the first 20-30 levels (after which you start to run out of challenges, but no worries - you can start on the higher level DLC, or simply start a new character).

[Vinyadan]

I think that there are different things to consider. I found my first piece of Daedric Armour in Skyrim after 200 hours. That's way too much, because it forces the player to grind a skill if you want to wear daedric armour. In Oblivion, I probably had a full daedric armour around level 20 (that's what my post-Bruma statue looked like). They were so trivially found, that I discarded them when they were damaged, instead of repairing them. In Morrowind, I never had a complete daedric armour, but you could get some parts as reward, and there were phenomenally OP artefacts that beat daedric anyway. (also, Morrowind armour had 8-9 pieces, Oblivion 5-6, and Skyrim just 4-5).

Morrowind was the one that gave the most satisfaction, but that's because all those items were skilfully hand-placed. Same thing with hostile NPCs, those in Morrowind were cooler because they were hand-made. I think that this is the actual problem with levelled enemies, it means a bunch of enemies that are automatically generated and all look the same, and loot that suddenly becomes too frequent and loses its charm.
Of course, the other side is that in Morrowind you quickly turned into an engine of destruction. At level 7, you already were one of the toughest things around. At level 20, you were effectively immortal. Skyrim probably handed this pretty well by making you slightly weaker, but leaving room for huge changes in gameplay when you hit certain milestones -- Impact for Destruction, or reaching 100 enchanting and casting spells from one or two schools completely for free.

Also, I remember fights in Oblivion as extremely chaotic. Something about the enemies charging my horse and my horse charging back or running away, and people dispersing on the plains and never coming back. But something I didn't like in scaling in Oblivion was how zombies became constantly worse HP sacks that couldn't really damage me, but took a lot to take down and you would often fight one on one.

EDIT: Also, IIRC, Skyrim has a hidden cap for armour rating.

[Keltest]

Worth pointing out, Morrowind only had one complete suit of Daedric Armor in the base game, and it was being worn by Divayth Fyr. You could come close, but would be missing a couple pieces. I believe it was Mournhold that added enough of the missing pieces for a second full suit.

[Triaxx]

80% damage reduction is the armor cap.

[veti]

Of course, the other side is that in Morrowind you quickly turned into an engine of destruction. At level 7, you already were one of the toughest things around. At level 20, you were effectively immortal.

And then you went to Mournhold or Solstheim, and discovered things that could still kick your butt clean back to Vvardenfell if you were cocky enough to tackle them head on.

Level 20 in Morrowind was epic level. By then I'd finished the main quest, and as you say there was nothing to fear - until the expansions.

Level 20 in Skyrim is kinda mid-level. Equivalent to maybe level 10 in Morrowind.


Skyrim probably handed this pretty well by making you slightly weaker, but leaving room for huge changes in gameplay when you hit certain milestones -- Impact for Destruction, or reaching 100 enchanting and casting spells from one or two schools completely for free.

Arcane smithing for me.

The actual armour calculation in Skyrim is maddeningly opaque. As well as the cap, there's also a hidden bonus per item worn. And the value of items can vary depending on what else you're wearing. And then you add mods, and it starts to get messy.

[factotum]

Two, when you levelled up, the rest of the world didn't level with you. True that some harder encounters would be unlocked, but not *everydamnthing* on the map.


I played around with the editor supplied with Morrowind a bit--you know, just adding a pair of boots with ridiculous bonuses to Athletics so I could do a single jump from the north gate of Balmora to the south gate of Caldera, that sort of thing. One thing I noticed is that the dungeons in the game have a level *range* associated with them, which affects the level scaling within them. So, you could have a dungeon with a level range of 10-25, and the game would scale the monsters inside to match your level within that range. If you went in at level 5 you'd be facing level 10 opponents and would have a bad time of it. Go in at level 40 and everything would be level 25 and a breeze to defeat. I never understood why they didn't implement a similar system for Oblivion. Of course, the fact the level scaling was also handled in a brain-dead way didn't help--the description of a Dremora Caitiff in the game says they lead groups of weaker Dremora, but if you're of the appropriate level when you go into an Oblivion Gate you'll find nothing but Caitiffs in there because anything else is too low level as far as the level scaling goes.

[Divayth Fyr]

Worth pointing out, Morrowind only had one complete suit of Daedric Armor in the base game, and it was being worn by Divayth Fyr. You could come close, but would be missing a couple pieces. I believe it was Mournhold that added enough of the missing pieces for a second full suit.
Mournhold and Solstheim - each added a pauldron.


I never understood why they didn't implement a similar system for Oblivion.
Oblivion's thing was "fixing" things people complained about for Morrowind, just in a bad way. Medium armor and Spear were axed (while people complained that they were sub-par compared to the alternatives), ditto for Enchant as a skill (which was both underpowered when you wanted to use it normally and op as heck when you abused it), and since they were complaints about how the level scaling worked, they went ahead to "improve" it.

[Aeson]

Worth pointing out, Morrowind only had one complete suit of Daedric Armor in the base game, and it was being worn by Divayth Fyr. You could come close, but would be missing a couple pieces. I believe it was Mournhold that added enough of the missing pieces for a second full suit.
Technically speaking, Divayth Fyr's set of Daedric armor is incomplete - he doesn't have a helmet either on him or in his tower. It's still easily the most complete and in some sense readily-available set in the game, of course.


Of course, the other side is that in Morrowind you quickly turned into an engine of destruction. At level 7, you already were one of the toughest things around. At level 20, you were effectively immortal.
Depends a bit on how you leveled. I played through the game as an Imperial merchant prince once without leveling a single skill directly related to combat until the mid-teens or so - just Alchemy to quickly turn a massive profit and Speechcraft/Mercantile to further increase the margins, and while I did not do so you could theoretically hit level 18 before hitting the normal skill caps for Alchemy, Speechcraft, and Mercantile even if all three of those started as major skills and Speechcraft/Mercantile were specialized. That character was neither one of the toughest things around at level 7 nor effectively immortal by level 20, though I suppose it probably could have been if I'd chosen to spend the fortune I was accumulating on training rather than on accumulating an even bigger fortune, but it was a fun character to play, at least for a while.

[Morty]

Back when I was active on a Polish TES board, I think there were a number of people who had killed Divath Fyr to get his armor and then found themselves unable to progress the plot. Though probably not as numerous as those who had killed some of the infected under his tower, which caused him to refuse to speak with them.

[Keltest]

Back when I was active on a Polish TES board, I think there were a number of people who had killed Divath Fyr to get his armor and then found themselves unable to progress the plot. Though probably not as numerous as those who had killed some of the infected under his tower, which caused him to refuse to speak with them.

Theoretically, I think the only thing that totally stops the plot is losing access to Sunder and Keening somehow. Even the otherwise lethal damage they inflict without a functional wrathguard (which you normally get from Vivec, or jury-rig from Yagrum) can be overcome with enough cheese, or just a crap ton of HP.

But yes, ticking off the residents of that tower and/or killing Vivec are the fastest ways to bring the plot to a sudden halt if you don't have Wrathguard.

[Caelestion]

Even killing Vivec isn't a hard brake on the main plot, as you can take the false Wraithguard to Yagrum Bagarn and have him activate it himself.

[Morty]

Well, yes. A player who knows what to do can wreck a lot and still finish the game. Not so much a player who doesn't know the game inside out and doesn't read the dialogue carefully enough to notice that Divath Fyr tells you not to kill his patients.

On another note that's been discussed, it's certainly true that whether or not you become powerful in Morrowind really depends on what you do. And it's easy to do the wrong thing. I tried to play a "pure" mage when I started and it was miserable. I never felt like I was very powerful at all. Playing the optimal warrior/mage hybrid is a different story.

[Caelestion]

Magic simply isn't that powerful in Morrowind. Your magicka doesn't recover naturally, you have the stupid jazz hands problem and the spells you can make for yourself are explicitly less efficient than the default ones. Of course, the spell-making is pretty awesome, but it does have its limitations.

[Resileaf]

Well, yes. A player who knows what to do can wreck a lot and still finish the game. Not so much a player who doesn't know the game inside out and doesn't read the dialogue carefully enough to notice that Divath Fyr tells you not to kill his patients.


If you're playing Morrowind and not reading quest text, you only have yourself to blame.

[Kantaki]

If you're playing Morrowind and not reading quest text, you only have yourself to blame.

Isn't that true for most games? Don't pay attention to the dialogue/exposition and you can only blame yourself when your character gets eaten by pillows.:smallamused:

[Vinyadan]

On another note that's been discussed, it's certainly true that whether or not you become powerful in Morrowind really depends on what you do. And it's easy to do the wrong thing. I tried to play a "pure" mage when I started and it was miserable. I never felt like I was very powerful at all. Playing the optimal warrior/mage hybrid is a different story.

That funny feeling when you try to kill a flame atronach with your spells, and realise they have reflect...

[Rodin]

That funny feeling when you try to kill a flame atronach with your spells, and realise they have reflect...

My first character that I really got invested in was an Altmer mage with the birthsign that gave you extra magic damage but doubled your weakness to magic. So I could deal an insane amount of magic damage, but if anything hit me with a spell I was toast.

That reflect ability was so infuriating that I outright modded it out. If they'd made it so that the spell rebounded and I had to dodge a fireball with a 50 foot radius that would be one thing. If it was a spell they cast with a graphic to warn you they had a shield up it would be fair. But no, the reflect ability was a passive that just instantly transmitted the damage. That meant that if I fired my fancy custom spell at one of the enemies with reflect I just had a 50% chance of instant death. Even if I wasn't shooting at them and they just happened to be around a corner and got caught in the blast radius.

It really wasn't very fun.

[veti]

Magic simply isn't that powerful in Morrowind. Your magicka doesn't recover naturally, you have the stupid jazz hands problem and the spells you can make for yourself are explicitly less efficient than the default ones. Of course, the spell-making is pretty awesome, but it does have its limitations.

The single spell I cast most was homemade, and way more efficient than the default. Bound Longbow, 15 seconds duration.

The vanilla version of Bound Longbow gives you 60 seconds for 6 magicka. But why would you need it that long anyway? Any creature that can survive two or three hits from that thing - would be right up in your face long before the spell gives out. Mine gives 15 seconds for 1 magicka, so it's cheap, easy to cast, and gives enough time to take out up to three cliff racers for a single point. (And also quite enough to take down an ogrim or a golden saint, if that's your current need.)

[Morty]

Self-made spells were less efficient, but I found that I basically had to create them, because the pre-made spells were just impractical. The damage ones didn't really scale with level and shield spells lasting for a minute or half were too difficult to cast. It was all a mess, really.

I remember making damage spells that lasted 2 seconds rather than 1 - because a spell that does 35 damage/second for two seconds is easier and cheaper than one that just deals 70 damage once. It seemed to work well.

[Caelestion]

Well, yes, you can design spells to be more useful, but as I understand it, if you try remaking the default spells in the spellmaker, they are always more expensive.

[Morty]

Well, yes, you can design spells to be more useful, but as I understand it, if you try remaking the default spells in the spellmaker, they are always more expensive.

That is correct, but in my experience a moot point. You're going to need to design spells anyway, as the default ones are impractical.

[Vinyadan]

In Morrowind, while your magicka didn't reload, the charges of your magic items did. So you could, for example, create a belt of water breathing that would completely recharge itself by the time the effect ran out. It was a nice way to spare magicka. It also didn't mesh very well with your carefully picked standard equipment, though. 8 armour pieces, 1 shield, 2 rings, 1 amulet, 1 cloak, 1 shirt = 14 slots to keep an eye on, plus your weapon.

No doubt, interface-wise, playing as a wizard in Morrowind was a pain. You had few shots, a good chance of failure because of fatigue and running, long animations, and the problem of reflect/absorb. I think Oblivion was the best one, simply because of how immediate it was. Just push the button, no need to put your sword away. Skyrim decided to go for a style that would emphasize pushing a lot of buttons, which was less boring than Oblivion, but also was pretty messy. That you fired from the left hand with the right button also didn't exactly help. However, Skyrim actually kept Oblivion's spellcasting approach, but tweaked it and used it for shouts instead.

A problem that came up with magicka regen was that fights turned into running around while waiting for your bar to replenish while casting healing spells, to then run around a little more so that you had the magicka to cast your damaging spells.

[Aeson]

Your magicka doesn't recover naturally, you have the stupid jazz hands problem and the spells you can make for yourself are explicitly less efficient than the default ones.
I don't mind the lack of continuous magicka regeneration in Morrowind - what else are Restore/Fortify Magicka potions for, if not to give me magicka when I need it, and it also alleviates too-good-to-use syndrome because playing keep-away for a few seconds while waiting for enough magicka to cast that last fireball or whatever isn't an option. The problem Morrowind's magicka has is more that if you want to be a 'pure' spellcaster you almost have to take both a race and a birthsign that boost maximum magica - 1xInt simply wasn't enough if you were going to rely almost exclusively on spellcasting in combat and made it almost a waste to drink a potion since a Standard Restore Magicka potion would probably restore more magicka than your maximum.

As to Morrowind's 'jazz hands,' I mind it less than I mind Oblivion's "your spells suck if you're wearing armor - especially if they're spells that affect things based on level." I'd rather wait a second or two to draw my sword than further weaken spells that weren't all that good in the first place if you weren't doing something like stacking Weakness to Magicka on the target, especially since raising the skills that reduced the spell efficiency penalty has always been a bit of a pain because you have to get hit or pay for training in order to advance them, you don't really want to do either of those, and in Oblivion training was capped at five trained skill levels across all skills per character level, losing unused training levels each time you advance your character level.

[Caelestion]

Oh yes, being a 'Batman' wizard in Morrowind was ridiculously easy, given the sheer amount of magical doodads that one would accrue. I just found it much easier to be a pure mage (and an archer, for that matter) in OB than I did MW, even though the actual mage play in MW was more rewarding.

[veti]

Mages in Morrowind do rely heavily on items and potions - that's simply understood as what the word means in that world. Complaining about non-regenerating magicka makes about as much sense to me as complaining about the lack of machine guns.

[Spore]

Complaining about non-regenerating magicka makes about as much sense to me as complaining about the lack of machine guns.

I disagree. People can have their gameplay preferences. Though I wished Morrowind gave mages enough Magicka so they had a bit of freedom choosing their birthsign.

And please, don't come up with the moot mod argument. I played Morrowind on the Xbox back in the day for one, and the balance of the base game should be so you don't have to heavily skew your build towards magicka to have a decent caster.

I was lucky I wanted a Dunmer Mageblade (yea, like many teenagers back then I had my "drow phase") so I could supplement my lacking magicka with blades (and robes, and heavy armor).

[veti]

I disagree. People can have their gameplay preferences.

Right. Like machine guns - you can "prefer" anything you like. You can choose whether to play the game, and you can decide how much you enjoy it, but neither of these decisions puts any obligation on the game designer to accommodate your preferences.

Edit: Sorry, that was unnecessarily confrontational. Let me rephrase. The game developers created a world in which that is the way magic works. Maybe it's not the way you would have created it, or I, but it's what they came up with. And unlike us, they had the talent and the tools and the resources to develop their concept into - the game they made. I'm sure we can all come up with ways in which we wish it had worked differently, although I think we should also acknowledge the hindsight at play in those suggestions - but none of that means there was anything "wrong" with the game as published, or that they "should" have done it differently.

Mages in Morrowind use items. And carry weapons, and very likely armour as well. That's just how magic works in that world. It's not just the PC, every NPC mage faces the same situation, and it shows in their equipment and fighting styles as well. Why is that so hard to accept?

[DigoDragon]

Isn't that true for most games? Don't pay attention to the dialogue/exposition and you can only blame yourself when your character gets eaten by pillows.:smallamused:

Where can I get a hold of these killer pillows? :3




(yea, like many teenagers back then I had my "drow phase")

I had more of a King Arthur kind of phase in my teen years playing these kind of games and D&D. Many of my friends had the Drow phase though, so teaming up was... interesting.

[Talion]

Where can I get a hold of these killer pillows? :3

Try asking Drarayne Thelas in Balmora. If anyone knows anything about pillows, it's her.

[Spore]

I had more of a King Arthur kind of phase in my teen years playing these kind of games and D&D. Many of my friends had the Drow phase though, so teaming up was... interesting.

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/oots/images/5/5e/Zz'dtri.png You don't understand the suffering I've gone through, white knight!

Joking aside, I had a very emotional phase where I felt very misunderstood as a teenager. Naturally I was happy to find characters in my hobby of RPGs, who could defeat their enemies just by their minds alone. I played a sorcerer in Baldur's Gate and a wizard in Neverwinter Nights. But Morrowind put you as a Dunmer as a default (Jiub is the first person you see and he is a dark elf, your default race is on dark elves, and they get boni to Destruction and Blades). I wasn't even that emotionally and edgy but I knew a few people like that over early MMOs.

When I got over my issues, my preferences shifted to support characters, healers and knights too. In multiplayer I often go the healer route but in singleplayer this means often clerics, paladins and knights too. Who else would be so mad as to risk their lives for the better of mankind?

[Vinyadan]

Where can I get a hold of these killer pillows? :3


That reminds me of when I tried to sell Clagius Clanler his own pillow. "Hey, that's my pillow!". :smallbiggrin:

[Caelestion]

Given how vanilla MW works, it's entirely possible that you were selling him one of Drarayne Thelas's pillows, but he couldn't tell the difference (as neither can the game).

[factotum]

Given how vanilla MW works, it's entirely possible that you were selling him one of Drarayne Thelas's pillows, but he couldn't tell the difference (as neither can the game).

Yeah, I remember encountering that little issue when I tried to sell some diamonds I'd stolen from an entirely different shop to a shopkeep and got accused of stealing them from her!

[Caelestion]

I'm told that OpenMW has fixed the issue, but it is possible to clear out the STLN tags from a vanilla savefile, though it does take a bunch of work to do so.

[Balmas]

So, apropos of nothing:

It's been a bit over two years since I played Enderal, the awesome total-overhaul mod for Skyrim. It recently got a Steam release, which prompted a lovely burst of nostalgia. But, not wanting to play Skyrim, I said to myself, "Hey, wasn't there a comparable mod for Oblivion?" And yeah, there is! Same universe as Enderal, called Nehrim.

So, after a bit of faffing about, I got it installed.

So, it turns out that following notes that random strangers leave on your bakery porch may, in fact, be a bad idea. In my defense, when you read a note with themes like "You're in danger, sorry about that, and ignoring won't make it better" kind of grabs your attention.

That doesn't mean my situation is any better. Stuck in the bottom of a mine, bumped on the head by who-knows-what, and now this stranger--Calemno? Corpero? Some C-name, I didn't ask twice--and I need to escape.

Which would be a lot easier if it weren't for the trolls. Over the course of the mine, Cormero becomes Corpse-ro at the hands of a troll that's bigger, stronger, more aggressive. Even with my little trick, I can only barely run away. Thankfully, the former inhabitants of the mine knew about the troll and its weaknesses to nearby fire sources--set up a few torches in its nest, and it'll just melt. Which means I just have to, you know, run around a troll's nest while it chases me and hope that the people running the mine were right. Given the number of skeletons here, I'm not too hopeful.

...Huh. It worked.

Too many trolls later, I'm finally close to the surface when a wall of flame descends from the ceiling. A blue-robed man tells me that he's the one who called me, Corpse-ro, and the others here. Whoops, didn't think there'd be trolls here, so sad that everyone but you is dead, and oh, yeah, we know you can do magic. Yeah, magic's illegal, big whoops, we're part of a secret mage society, and this is your recruitment. Please say yes, because if you say no, you now know about the order and therefore can't be allowed to leave here alive.

So, I say yes. Not many other options, but nothing says I actually have to go and do what they say: visit this tower in the middle of nowhere and sign up for the army as a cover for me being an illegal mage of the Order? I guess?

Seems like a lot of hassle when all I wanted this morning was to bake croissants.

[LibraryOgre]

Got Oblivion to work (I think the issue was Darnified, and I miss it). First thing I did? Switch the attack and block keys. I now attack with my right mouse button, which swings my right hand. I block with my left mouse button, which raises my left hand. I am content.

I DO wish Skyrim had implemented the "Casting Key", rather than binding it to the hand. It makes a sword-and-board or two-handed character more viable.

[Caelestion]

If DarN is the culprit, it's a font issue (as I thought). That can be sidestepped by manually setting the desired fonts in your user file.

[LibraryOgre]

If DarN is the culprit, it's a font issue (as I thought). That can be sidestepped by manually setting the desired fonts in your user file.

Just got rid of Darnified. I figure I'll get Martin to Cloud Ruler temple then slow the game down and do everything else.

[Caelestion]

Well, if you don't know how to fix it, that is your best bet, yes.

[LibraryOgre]

So, been playing a bit of Oblivion as my concept character (Cana, Altmer who is sort of a Healer, who, in theory, was the hero of Arena, Daggerfall, and Morrowind).

I REALLY wish I could sort alchemical reagents by known effects. There's simply a ton of Restore Fatigue items, and when you're looking for that secondary or tertiary effect, it's annoying to scroll through them and check everything. I really HATE console-first design.

I'm also holding off levelling until I get wifi back at home. I decided, rather than fight it, I'm just going to download a mod that makes every level up give me an option of 5s in all three, rather than try to strategically level. I want to play the game, not the game system.

[Lord Raziere]

hey does anyone else get CTD's around Skyborn Altar? it just seems like every time I go there, it randomly just closes and kicks me back to desktop out of nowhere, and I have to be careful not to get too close or it just can't work for some reason. despite two different quests sending me there.

also, I've had some freezing up issues recently, particularly after my character started using Vampire Lord form, but it seems to also happen when facing a lot of enemies?

I'm not sure if these are mod problems or a skyrim in general problem, I might have to go hunting for a mod that causing this, but there are some that I'm reluctant to get rid of because they are actually vital to make sure this or that works well.

[veti]

hey does anyone else get CTD's around Skyborn Altar? it just seems like every time I go there, it randomly just closes and kicks me back to desktop out of nowhere, and I have to be careful not to get too close or it just can't work for some reason. despite two different quests sending me there.

That usually, though not always, means one or more mods have changed the terrain around that area. Last time I had an issue like that, I solved it by disabling the mod in my load order that I knew made the most terrain changes. (Wintersun, in that case.)

But on the same theme of "does anyone else..." - Does anyone else find that as you travel into the mountains south of Helgen, there's a place on the road where your vision goes all blurry - as if spat at by a frostbite spider - for no obvious reason? It clears after a minute or so, but the sheer inexplicability of it gets to me.

[Lord Raziere]

That usually, though not always, means one or more mods have changed the terrain around that area. Last time I had an issue like that, I solved it by disabling the mod in my load order that I knew made the most terrain changes. (Wintersun, in that case.)


Unfortunately, my problem is different: I'm pretty sure its mod called Colorful Magic I have downloaded, given that it doesn't crash around Skyborn Altar or Mehrunes shines when its not activated, but does when it does, but I can't just get rid of colorful Magic because its too fun and gives me too many cool spells and artifacts to play with, so I kind of have to just hope that by wandering off and doing something else for a while I can come back and try again without the crash or use console commands to bypass the stuff involved so I don't have to go back there ever again. stupid Gamecrash Mountain.

(don't ask me how the "wander off for a while then try again" method works, it just does.)

[NEO|Phyte]

(don't ask me how the "wander off for a while then try again" method works, it just does.)

IIRC what's going on there is that if you leave a map cell alone for long enough, it resets, so if the crash was from a corrupt spawn of some sort, that'll clear it.

[Keltest]

That usually, though not always, means one or more mods have changed the terrain around that area. Last time I had an issue like that, I solved it by disabling the mod in my load order that I knew made the most terrain changes. (Wintersun, in that case.)

But on the same theme of "does anyone else..." - Does anyone else find that as you travel into the mountains south of Helgen, there's a place on the road where your vision goes all blurry - as if spat at by a frostbite spider - for no obvious reason? It clears after a minute or so, but the sheer inexplicability of it gets to me.

Do you have some sort of alternate start mod? Doesn't the vanilla game start on the road south of helgen with a vision blur effect of some kind?

[veti]

Do you have some sort of alternate start mod? Doesn't the vanilla game start on the road south of helgen with a vision blur effect of some kind?

By Akatosh, you're right. That makes perfect sense. (Well, except for the bit where someone put a trigger on the road to cause that blindness, rather than simply forcing it as part of the scene, but who knows, perhaps it really was the simplest way.)

[Kesnit]

I just reinstalled Skyrim and all of my mods. (My old HD died and I had to download everything again.) Since then, I've run into a weird bug. Some creatures (mostly wolves, though it happens occasionally with NPCs) are immune to damage. I see it most often with wolves, but it's happened occasionally with bears, bandits, and (weirdly enough) Grelod the Kind. It doesn't affect all wolves/bears/bandits (though I haven't been able to hurt Grelod with either PC that I'm playing), but sometimes a creature will get a pale green glow, and nothing I do to it will hurt it. (Any creature affected can be killed using the console.) Grelod does not get the pale green glow until I draw my hands out to attack her. (I can crawl around her room and she looks normal. But when I pull a weapon or magic, she starts glowing. If I put my hands away, the glow goes away.)

It's happening with 2 separate saves using different (though similar) mod set-ups. I have other saves, but have not played them enough to see if they have the same problem.

[Lord Raziere]

I just reinstalled Skyrim and all of my mods. (My old HD died and I had to download everything again.) Since then, I've run into a weird bug. Some creatures (mostly wolves, though it happens occasionally with NPCs) are immune to damage. I see it most often with wolves, but it's happened occasionally with bears, bandits, and (weirdly enough) Grelod the Kind. It doesn't affect all wolves/bears/bandits (though I haven't been able to hurt Grelod with either PC that I'm playing), but sometimes a creature will get a pale green glow, and nothing I do to it will hurt it. (Any creature affected can be killed using the console.) Grelod does not get the pale green glow until I draw my hands out to attack her. (I can crawl around her room and she looks normal. But when I pull a weapon or magic, she starts glowing. If I put my hands away, the glow goes away.)

It's happening with 2 separate saves using different (though similar) mod set-ups. I have other saves, but have not played them enough to see if they have the same problem.

thats weird, I've never heard of that.

okay step one: did you sort load order?

Step two: have you tried googling your problem?

step three: is there a mod that has something to do with alteration armor spells or enemies? because that sounds as if its randomly casting some powerful armor spell on enemies when it happens, it might be the cause.

Step four: if all else fails, start disabling one mod at a time, if problem persists with mod turned off, its not the culprit and you can turn it back on again and disable another, if problem goes away you've found your problem mod. generally start with the most recent mods you got and work your way down.

[Rynjin]

Yeah, what's your load order and mod list? We can't really help without specifics like that.

[Kesnit]

thats weird, I've never heard of that.

okay step one: did you sort load order?

Yes, I had.


Step two: have you tried googling your problem?

I just did. I found a lot of threads on a lot of forums. One even described my exact problem - except that was determined to be a mod I don't use. However, I think I did find the problem. One person wrote about script lag, and said if you don't let Alternate Start fully run when you start the game, it can cause script lag and cause enemies that cannot be damaged. Given that the saves that are having problems are new ones I made after reinstalling and I was anxious to get into them*, it would make sense that I didn't let everything load. That kind of glitch is not fixable.

For now, the glitch is annoying but not game-breaking. I'm willing to run from wolves or use the console to kill enemies if I have to. If it ever becomes a major issue, I can ditch the saves.


* Both saves are based on PCs I made and played a lot before my HD died. I loved the way they played, and wanted to rebuild them and get back to playing them.

[Yuki Akuma]

So in the Andromeda mod by EnaiSiaion, the Ritual stone has three powers that function automatically:

The Ritual Listens stores a copy of any corpse within a few feet of you.
The Ritual Avenges summons a spectral copy of any corpse the Ritual Listens has scanned when you enter combat.
The Ritual Remembers ocassionally will summon a corpse you've slain in combat. This can recharge The Ritual Listens and is also useful for necromancer builds.

Today, I was visiting High Hrothgar. The Ritual Listened to the corpse of the frost troll I had to kill on the way. While talking with the Greybeards, the Ritual Remembers summoned a... naked bandit corpse next to me. Then, a few minutes later, the bandit was joined by the corpse of a frost troll.

What must the Greybeards think of me...

[Spore]

What must the Greybeards think of me...

I actually like the idea of star signs not necessarily being a blessing but a curse. Imagine a character with the Snake sign kissing someone only for them to fall to the floor unconscious. And you pop out undead if you are stressed (i.e. in battle).

It's actually the drawbacks of star signs but with more story emphasis and less mechanical disadvantage. I like it.

[veti]

So, I just finished playing Rigmor of Cyrodiil.

While the author undoubtedly has a talent for storytelling, and the sheer amount of work that goes into this piece of worldbuilding is pretty breathtaking - it's still sadly flawed.

I have no problem with playing second fiddle to the title character most of the time. I can ignore the huge volume of typos. I can live with the extreme linearity of the story, and the thinness of the world. (Indeed, once you get used to the fact that money and materials have no use in Cyrodiil, it's very liberating. No more looting, no more encumbrance.) I can get over the occasional bug and CTD. For the sake of the story, I can even forgive the way the mod completely takes over my character and the world, making everything else seem simply impossible.

No, my deeper issue is with Rigmor herself. Unfortunately, to explain why, I'm going to need...
Fans of this mod - and for the record, I can completely see where they're coming from, there is a lot to love about it - like to talk about the depth of Rigmor's character, the strength of her relationship with the DB. But it seems to me that this is, in fact, alarmingly weak.

First, there's the sheer inconsistency of her character. One minute she's surlier than a hungry teenager, next she's utterly submissive. I get that she's a vulnerable young woman putting on a brave face - but the private mood swings, from devoted to suspicious to independent, are extreme and with no apparent causes. Pick a personality, girl.

This could be intentional, in which case it's just a rather disappointing "feminine volatility" trope. But I get the feeling it's more about careless writing.

What's more - I can treat her the same way.

Whenever a dialogue gives me any choice about what to say, there's usually an option labelled "(lover)". At first I thought this was a somewhat simplistic way to signpost the route to pursue a romantic relationship. But the truth is much more disturbing:

If I choose the (lover) option, she'll respond as a lover. If l choose another option, she won't. And that choice has absolutely no repercussions beyond the present dialogue. She literally has no memory of our relationship - it gets redefined every time we speak.

Even the one decision that really feels like being offered a significant choice - concerning, of all trivia, her hair - has no actual effect. Whether I choose to do the sidequest or not, the next time it's mentioned - it turns out, I did.

So through this epic adventure, while rewriting the history of Tamriel itself, battling armies and daedra and ancient evil, I actually have no impact on the one person who's closest to me. She changes, and so does the world - but it's hard to persuade myself that these changes have anything to do with me.

Which makes it all the more annoying, the extent to which the girl has gotten under my skin. Without her, my new character feels lonely. I know there are many fine companions to choose from, many of them better written and nearly all of them more consistent than Rigmor - and yet I miss her. And I'm downright eager to play the promised final instalment of her story, if it ever gets released.

[LibraryOgre]

So, what happened in the roughly 40 years between Arena and Morrowind to cause a population explosion of Cliff Racers?

[Lord Raziere]

So, what happened in the roughly 40 years between Arena and Morrowind to cause a population explosion of Cliff Racers?

I don't know, The Anti-Jiub. Buij? Buij totally chimmed after doing something awesome and was a fan of cliff racers so he modified morrowind to have more cliff racers in it, and you'll totally find that information in Apocrypha in Skyrim, there is a very obscure book from the point view of a wizard biologist studying them about it, only findable if you look really hard, its really easy to miss. am I doing Elder Scrolls lore correctly yet? :smalltongue:

[Resileaf]

I blame Dagoth Ur.

[veti]

Have you noticed, there are hardly any cliff racers at the beginning of Morrowind? The population density grows steadily as you level up, they only become a major pest once you're past level 10 or so.

So whatever is happening to them, it's happening very fast.

I reckon Buij is a rogue Telvanni who wants to undermine her own House by making it easier for any random adventurer to make Levitate potions.

[Resileaf]

I reckon Buij is a rogue Telvanni who wants to undermine her own House by making it easier for any random adventurer to make Levitate potions.

Huh. That actually makes a lot of sense in a gameplay design kind of way. As you get further into the game, you need to levitate more and more often, and so you need the means to do so. The easiest way to make it work is to ensure the drop of mats with levitate effects.

[factotum]

Have you noticed, there are hardly any cliff racers at the beginning of Morrowind? The population density grows steadily as you level up, they only become a major pest once you're past level 10 or so.

Is that because you generally spend your first few levels in Morrowind in the Seyda Neen area, though, where there don't seem to be many Cliff Racers whatever level you are? If you were to make your way to Ald'ruhn at level 1, would the road be scattered with the things?

[veti]

Is that because you generally spend your first few levels in Morrowind in the Seyda Neen area, though, where there don't seem to be many Cliff Racers whatever level you are? If you were to make your way to Ald'ruhn at level 1, would the road be scattered with the things?

I've done that. And as I said, there are very few cliff racers when you're low level. There's a placed one on each of the roads north of Pelagiad and Balmora, and another one or possibly two west of Ald'ruhn, but that's about it.

[Aeson]

Is that because you generally spend your first few levels in Morrowind in the Seyda Neen area, though, where there don't seem to be many Cliff Racers whatever level you are? If you were to make your way to Ald'ruhn at level 1, would the road be scattered with the things?
I usually leave the Seyda Neen area before hitting level 2 and have occasionally escorted the annoying pilgrim outside Ald'ruhn to the Ghostgate Shrine at level 1. My recollection is that there are many more cliff racers in the Ashlands - and in the world in general - at higher levels than at lower levels.

[Spore]

Odd. It seemed to me the Icarus mage was an incentive to get you to Balmora as soon as possible as it is basically one (lethal) hope ahead. Once you see how close it is, you go there and see Cosades.

THEN, a majority of MY playtime is spent in Balmora. First encounters with Cliffracers for me are usually during Fighter and Mage's guild quests involving gathering alchemy herbs or doing that one quest in the kwama mine.

[Talion]

So, what happened in the roughly 40 years between Arena and Morrowind to cause a population explosion of Cliff Racers?

My crackpot theory: The Camonna Tong is speed breeding them 1. As part of their ploys to drive the outlanders from Morrowind and force untold annoyance and suffering upon those that remain and 2. as part of a (as of now largely hypothetical) rapid transit, airborne delivery service for various illegal goods, particularly that sweet moon sugar and skooma.

[Kareeah_Indaga]

So, what happened in the roughly 40 years between Arena and Morrowind to cause a population explosion of Cliff Racers?

The Blight killed off all their natural predators? And possibly most of their competition as well?

[LibraryOgre]

The Blight killed off all their natural predators? And possibly most of their competition as well?

Oh, I like that. The Blight kicks up with the stirring of Dagoth Ur. Their natural predators and competition for resources start to die off. Population boom.

Really good option there.

[Keltest]

Isnt it even explicit that the Cliff Racers were specifically carrying the blight (and, I think, Corprus) beyond the Ghostfence?

[Resileaf]

All animals affected by the Blight spread it further away from Dagoth Ur. It just so happens that cliff racers are the primary flying predators of the island, so it's really easy for them to spread Blight diseases.

Corprus, to my knowledge, needs to be specifically afflicted by a servant of Dagoth.

[Aeson]

Corprus, to my knowledge, needs to be specifically afflicted by a servant of Dagoth.
Lore-wise, I'm pretty sure that Corprus is considered to be a contagious disease - there's a Temple quest in Morrowind to get someone to leave Vivec because she's infected with it and the Temple doesn't want her to spread the disease around. If you kill her and loot her corpse there's chance that you'll contract Corprus from her, too, which is a problem because you're not supposed to get Corprus until the Sixth House Base quest and Divayth Fyr can't cure you if you have the buggy version of the disease.

Also pretty sure that there's dialogue in the game warning about contracting Corprus from fighting things afflicted by it and from Blight Storms.

[Kareeah_Indaga]

Isnt it even explicit that the Cliff Racers were specifically carrying the blight (and, I think, Corprus) beyond the Ghostfence?

IIRC yes for the Blight, and the ash storms were supposed to spread it too I think. Not sure about Corprus specifically.

[factotum]

As I recall you could find both blighted and non-blighted Cliff Racers...in fact, there was a mod that made them a lot less annoying by making it that only the blighted ones would randomly attack you, while regular ones would leave you alone.

[Resileaf]

Lore-wise, I'm pretty sure that Corprus is considered to be a contagious disease - there's a Temple quest in Morrowind to get someone to leave Vivec because she's infected with it and the Temple doesn't want her to spread the disease around. If you kill her and loot her corpse there's chance that you'll contract Corprus from her, too, which is a problem because you're not supposed to get Corprus until the Sixth House Base quest and Divayth Fyr can't cure you if you have the buggy version of the disease.

Also pretty sure that there's dialogue in the game warning about contracting Corprus from fighting things afflicted by it and from Blight Storms.

I consider Corprus-infected people to be servants of Dagoth (even if unwillingly), they can spread the disease.

But animals aren't infected with Corprus, but with Blight diseases, which they do spread. Don't think Blight storms actually infect you with Blight diseases though. At least, in all the time I've played the game, I've never had that happen to me.

[veti]

Don't think Blight storms actually infect you with Blight diseases though. At least, in all the time I've played the game, I've never had that happen to me.

I have. Though that may have been a mod effect.

[Keltest]

I have. Though that may have been a mod effect.

I think that must be a mod, ive never been hit with a disease in a blight storm unless an animal bit me.

Anyway, while Resileaf's redefinition may be accurate, it also becomes a meaningless distinction (and also wrong, I think) given that Corprus is naturally contagious.

The reason I think its wrong is because the sleepers are also unwilling minions of Dagoth, but cannot to my knowledge infect people with Corprus. That seems limited to people who are already infected, with some of them having greater ability to deliberately infect somebody than others.

I think all of Dagoth's formal minions (as opposed to the sleepers) have it anyway, so frankly nobody was going to stop Dagoth Ur without an immunity anyway.

[DigoDragon]

I just finished the GoldenGlow estate quest in the thieves guild (probably the closest one gets to a quest that feels thievery) and I succeeded in getting through it killing only the target dude you're supposed to rob (in my defense, he attacked first).

Well, it's been a long time since I did this quest, so I didn't remember that Aringoth had a bow in his inventory. I also forgot to equip my sword. So here we are, two ready to fight to the death in melee and... we both pull out bows... And both fire... And both miss...

...Alright, we'll call it a draw.

[Spore]

Well, it's been a long time since I did this quest, so I didn't remember that Aringoth had a bow in his inventory.


Befitting his status, Aringoth wears fine clothes and boots. He is armed with a leveled dagger, leveled bow, and up to 144 arrows of various qualities up to daedric, all limited by your level. He also carries a key to his cellar, a key to his safe and up to 45 gold coins

His ingame class is ranger, with a stat weight of 3 in archery and only 2 in onehanded. With his pitiful dagger and his powerful arrows, I assume he only switches to bows when the player is of a high enough level. NPCs default to the most damage attack unless you are really up close.

Well, that is all from me overanalyzing a trivial Skyrim encounter. Have a sunday!

[DigoDragon]

His ingame class is ranger, with a stat weight of 3 in archery and only 2 in onehanded. With his pitiful dagger and his powerful arrows, I assume he only switches to bows when the player is of a high enough level. NPCs default to the most damage attack unless you are really up close.

I suppose that would explain what happened. Bonus amusement is that the guard posted outside his room didn't get up to check on the noise we made in the fight. A good thing, because the game doesn't really have any inherent non-lethal way to deal with enemies other than to run and hide until they just give up on locating you. :smalltongue:


The next morning in-game I turned in that quest and completed a couple minor side-quests, one being getting Shadr out of his debt. And just as I talked to him in the stables to tell him the good news, a dragon attacks. Had to click through the dialog boxes quickly so I could go slay it. My rapid shooting skills are good, if a bit off target at times. Amusing moment was this succession of three crits in a row fired semi-blindly through trees:

Critical strike on frost dragon
Critical strike on frost dragon
Critical strike on horse

Whoops.

Luckily I didn't aggro anyone with that. The horse lived too. >.>

[Divayth Fyr]

I have. Though that may have been a mod effect.
Yeah, there are (unsurprisingly) mods for that. Although you could get hit with a blight disease in the vanilla game in the storms - just it wouldn't show in your effects list, be uncurable and forever trigger disease-related dialogue from npcs. All things considered, not that surprising for a Bethesda product.

[Triaxx]

Yeah, if you can't paralyze a target in Skyrim, you really have to book it.

[DigoDragon]

Yeah, if you can't paralyze a target in Skyrim, you really have to book it.

Ordinator has a really useful perk in the Sneak tree that makes everyone within a certain radius give up on looking for you after 8 seconds if you hide and keep still.

I'm making a lot of use with that one now.

[Triaxx]

Yeah, I quit using stealth mostly. Makes the game too easy.

[Lord Raziere]

the only real defense I have on my ultimate power mage character against some enemies is a modded ward called Absolute Barrier that makes me immune to damage as long as its up, its the only useful ward spell I've ever had. I even have enchanted items to reduce all my mana costs to zero, and Ocatos recital to throw up an armor spell stronger than any vanilla one, slow time spell and a regeneration spell every time I get into battle without costing me any mana. I have spells to take out dragons in a couple hits and deals hundreds of damage to enemies over big areas. I can even cast wabbajack effects from my hands. and hundreds of other spells to do his or that.

I STILL sometimes die when I'm too careless, despite this character theoretically being so unbalanced and overpowered that it should never happen. mostly because this character is so squishy that I've seen them die to bandits or draugr hitting them once with their melee weapons.

[Spore]

the only real defense I have [...] makes me immune to damage

Spoken like a true mage.

:vaarsuvius: "The only thing keeping me from dying is that thing that makes me invincible."

[Lord Raziere]

Spoken like a true mage.

:vaarsuvius: "The only thing keeping me from dying is that thing that makes me invincible."

yeah, mages are generally a very binary playstyle in many videogames: your either good at it and thus unbeatable, or suck at it and thus die a lot, its the "difficult but awesome" style of play.

Skyrim is just particularly fun because of the mods allowing you to do a lot things you wouldn't normally be able to do in other games.