Villainous Competition XXX: One Feat to Rule Them ALL

[jdizzlean]

Welcome to Round 30 of the Villainous Competition!

Previous Competitions
Round One: Leader of Armies (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?395046)
Round Two: Nature's Revenger (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?400517)
Round Three: Double Agent (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?406015)
Round Four: Grave Keeper (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?413480)
Round Five: Crime Lord (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?420704)
Round Six: Ultimate Predator (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?430650)
Round Seven: Wicked Witch (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?444478)
Round Eight: Master of the Tundra (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?461482)
Round Nine: The Power of Villainous Thinking (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?474230)
Round Ten: Henchman Are Villains Too (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?478068)
Round Eleven: The Higher They Rise The Harder They Fall (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?483052)
Round Twelve: Power Comes at a Price (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?488846)
Round Thirteen: The Gadgeteer - You Are Not Batman (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?491932)
Round Fourteen: The Thing That Should Not Be (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?496091)
Round Fifteen: The Horsemen Are Drawing Nearer (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?500829)
Round Sixteen: Burn Baby Burn (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?503974)
Round Seventeen: It's Alive! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?507768)
Round Eighteen: This is Heresy (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?511933)
Round Nineteen: He Slimed Me! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?516535)
Round Twenty: Elder Evil (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?521560)
Round Twenty-One: Yarr! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?527415-Villainous-Competition-XXI-Yarr!)
Round Twenty-Two: I Am The Night! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?531199-Villainous-Competition-XXII-I-Am-The-Night!)
Round Twenty-Three: Two Heads Are Better Than One! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?535437-Villainous-Competition-XXIII-Two-Heads-Are-Better-Than-One)
Round Twenty-Four: Wrong For The Right Reasons! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?541650-Villainous-Competition-XXIV-Wrong-For-The-Right-Reasons)
Round Twenty-Five: Keeper of the Gate (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?550139-Villainous-Competition-XXV-No-Solicitors!)
Round Twenty-Six: Get In MY BELLY (Swallow Whole) (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?556705-Villainous-Competition-XXVI-Swallow-Whole!)
Round Twenty-Seven: Multiple Personality Disorder (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?559748-Villainous-Competition-XXVII-Multiple-Personality-Disorder)
Round Twenty-Eight: Tiny Only! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?565176-Villainous-Competition-XXVIII-Bad-Things-Come-in-Small-Packages)
Round Twenty-Nine: Halloween Special (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?573496-Villainous-Competition-XXIX-A-Halloween-Special)

We're a little different than most of the optimization threads. We run on CR instead of ECL.

Contestants:
You will need to present a write-up of your build with at least one of the following points: 5 CR, 10 CR 15 CR, 20 CR, and a "sweet spot" that you feel is the high point of the build, as well as presenting a fully-fleshed out 20 CR build in the table below. Feel free to present as many of these as you like, and please give a rundown of the build's abilities and playability at all of the levels you didn't show. The rules are as follows:

Secret Laboratory:
Competitors will be free to use any official 1st party (WotC) 3.5 rulebook in constructing their builds. Dragon Compendium is allowed, but Dragon magazine is disallowed. Unearthed Arcana is allowed. Unupdated 3.0 materials, as well as web exclusives by WotC are expressly allowed, but take care to verify that an updated version did not appear in print elsewhere, as this may cause an Elegance deduction at the judges' discretion. Alternate rule systems from UA such as gestalt or Generic Classes are not allowed, as they create a different playing field. Item Familiars and Taint are also banned from the competition. Leadership and all similar abilities are banned for sanity reasons.
Builds that are fully monstrous are allowed at no penalty. All class levels are to be added on as associated class levels.

Elite array (15, 14, 13, 12, 10, 8) is the assumed ability score generation method.
Some monstrous characters can technically qualify for Epic feats as soon as their ECL is over 20. While regular Epic feats will be allowed, Epic Spellcasting and all other Epic feats that affect spells, psionic powers, or item creation are not permitted. Including these would give an unfair advantage over standard characters. For Incarnum characters, Epic Open Chakra feats are allowed; other Epic Incarnum feats are not. The Essentia Capacity increases for Epic capacity as described on p. 212. For all characters, please note that Racial Hit Dice do not count towards Epic Progression; use the regular progression even if the BAB ends up higher than 20.

Deadlines:
Contestants will have until 23:59 MST Monday February 4th to create their builds and PM them to the Supreme Chancellor. Builds will then be posted simultaneously, to avoid copying. Judges will have until 23:59 MST two weeks after whenever the reveal is.. to judge the builds and submit their scores. If no judges have scored by that point, only the scores of the first judge to submit will be counted. Deadlines are subject to extension as/if required.

Judging:
Judging will be based on the following criteria, with each build rated on a scale from 1 (very poor) to 5 (exemplary) in each area: Originality, Build Elegance, Competence and Power, Memorable Villainy.
Keep these questions in mind when judging each category:
Originality - Is it unexpected?
Build Elegance - Is it mechanically pretty?
Competence and Power - Can it do what the concept asks of it? Is this a powerfully-built character?
Memorable Villainy - Is this a villain with style? Will it be the BBEG players long to finally kill and then talk about for weeks?
Unearthed Arcana can be penalized for elegance if the specific feature seems unnecessary or makes the playing field unfair (In this case, you can give a 1 if it makes the field unfair.)
Power level is up to you. Cheese is acceptable, but should be kept to a sane level unless you're showcasing a new TO build you've discovered. As the Iron Chef competition states, a little cheddar can be nice, but avoid the mature Gruyere unless you're making a cheese fondue.
You may not judge if you entered the contest, unless you withdraw your submission.

Presentation:
Builds will be posted anonymously, in order to avoid the potential of bias towards a particular competitor. For this reason, please don't put your name in the build, as I'm likely to miss it when reviewing the entries!

Note:
There is now a hard limit on two (2) entries per competitor.

Using the table below, the easiest way to use it is to go to the top left of the private message, and click the little a/A icon. It allows you to see what you're writing.
Due to concerns about standardizing entry format, I'd like everyone to try to use the following table for their entry.[/SPOILER]
You can use the table below for Spells.

Spells per Day/Spells Known
Spells per Day/Spells Known


Level
0lvl
1st
2nd
3rd
4th
5th
6th
7th
8th
9th


1st
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


2nd
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


3rd
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


4th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


5th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


6th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


7th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


8th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


9th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


10th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


11th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


12th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


13th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


14th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


15th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


16th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


17th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


18th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


19th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


20th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


Code Immediately Below,
Spells per Day/Spells Known
Spells per Day/Spells Known


Level
0lvl
1st
2nd
3rd
4th
5th
6th
7th
8th
9th


1st
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


2nd
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


3rd
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


4th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


5th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


6th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


7th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


8th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


9th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


10th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


11th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


12th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


13th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


14th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


15th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


16th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


17th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


18th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


19th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


20th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-



Speculation:
Please don’t post or speculate on possible builds until the reveal, in order to avoid spoiling the surprise if a particular competitor is producing a build along those lines.
Once builds are revealed, please do not comment on errors or rules issues on entries unless you are a judge. If you have such a comment, wait until the final reveal to post it.

Get ready to share those Evil thoughts. This edition’s villain is:


One Feat to Rule Them ALL!




Limitations

READ THIS CAREFULLY!!!


POWER will be judged on a 10 point scale for this round
use only 1 feat for your entire build
for the purposes of this round, all references of a feat not stacking or not applying to the same thing more than once are irrelevant.
you must still meet the pre-reqs for the feat you choose
you can choose to NOT take a feat at any levels (1, 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, 18) prior to when you take it first in order to meet pre-reqs, if you choose to NOT take a feat at any level for this purpose, you can choose any of the following benefits instead (list your choice in the feat field of your build table):

gain 2 extra skill points per level until you take the feat (2 at 1st, 4 at 3rd, 6 at each successive option)
gain +1 to BAB
gain +1 CL/ML/IL

Once you have taken your feat, you can NOT benefit from these options again
You must use at least 1 actual feat
Bonus feats from any source must still comply with being your only feat choice
Bonus feats not taken grant no benefit
EDIT: Alright, if you wish it, bonus feats can be taken to qualify for your feat of choice, but they grant no specific value to the build beyond that. it must be a specific bonus feat, not a "choose from x amount of feats" as a bonus feat.
racial feats may be used to qualify for your feat choice, but grant you no other benefit unless it is also your chosen feat for this round
Wild Talent and Hidden Talent are banned


We will award 1st through 3rd places, and a possible Honorable Mention.
So, start your evil plotting!


Entry
Competitor
Description
Score 1
Total
Placing


BABY Sweetkiss (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=23697249&postcount=89)
ben-zayb
CE Male Firre Eladrin Bard 4 / Sublime Chord 1 / Mystic Theurge 5
20
20
Gold


Zara Faertith (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=23697256&postcount=92)
AvatarVecna
?? Drider Cleric 13
19.755
19.755
Silver


Tepel The Godclaw (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=23697258&postcount=93)
Lionheart
?? 3-Headed Leskylor Half-Farspawn Warshaper 2/Crusader 6
18.5
18.5
Bronze


Crud (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=23697248&postcount=88)
Mike Miller
LE Half-Orc Crusader 20
17.25
17.25
4th


The DECAPITATOR! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=23697251&postcount=90)
Hackulator
NE? Spellwarped Advanced Razor Boar
16.75
16.75
5th


Igor the Fleshy (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=23697261&postcount=94)
GrayDeath
LE Winged Incarnate Greater Stone Golem Crusader 1/Swordsage 1/Warblade 9
16.25
16.25
6th


Jaas Kraal (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=23697254&postcount=91)
Thurbane
Male LE Large Elemental Immoth Sorcerer 1/Paladin of Tyranny 2/Eldritch Knight 8
15.75
15.75
7th
Honorable Mention



The Drowned Captain (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=23697244&postcount=87)
Falontani
CE Drowned Paragon
14.5
14.5
8th



Submission:
To standardize Entries, please use this format when sending it in:

PM: Jdizzlean
Subject: Villainous Competition 30, Name of your Entry
For Revisions and disputes, do the same thing. It makes it easier for me finding the entries in my mail box.
More questions? PM me with Villainous Competition 30 Questions in the header.

Tips for submitting your entry, provided by Weaselguy:


- Use capitalization and punctuation, correctly.
- Make good use of Spoilers, for cleanliness.
- Don't forget your sources. If it's something that can be found in the contents section, then book title seems to be fine. Obscure stuff, may want to include page number too.
- DeviantArt has about 9 billion pictures that you can reference, I can almost guarantee you can find one there to fit your character.
- Make good use of tables. In addition to the Build table and the Spells table, I like doing on e for my Ability Scores, just to keep it neat.
- Do a build stub at the top of your Build Table, something like Wizard 2/Fighter 3/Abjurant Champion 5/Eldritch Knight 10



As always: let's keep it nice.

I'll mention that again - LET'S KEEP IT NICE! Bickering, name calling and nasty comments on the entries or other forum members are not tolerated.

New competition rule: if I feel an individual has been overly disruptive during the course of competition discussion, I will not be accepting and revealing any entries from that individual, and they will also not be allowed to judge. Any judging they enter will not be taken into account for the final tally.

It's sad that it had to come to this, but here's a list of permanently banned (from this Villainous Competition) members:

Novolin (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/member.php?148361-Novolin)
Yklikt (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/member.php?133435-Yklikt)

[jdizzlean]

Clarifications

Unearthed Arcana variant rules are limited: The variant character options (such as Wildshape Ranger and Thug Fighter) should not be penalized. Flaws and traits may be penalized by judges, whereas item familiars, gestalt, alternate skill systems, alternate magic systems, alternate crafting rules, generic base classes, LA buyoff, fractional saves/BAB, and bloodlines are banned. Anything not mentioned here is up to individual judges.

d20 Rokugan is not allowed material.

The Dragon Magazine update for Oriental Adventures is in use.

Leadership is banned. Any material that grants you leadership without you specifically taking it should be ignored and may not be traded away for another feat or ACF. Undead Leadership and Dragon Cohort are likewise banned. Wild Cohort and Obtain Familiar are allowed. If you are not sure if a specific feat violates the 'no leadership' rule, err on the side of caution, or ask me.

However, Leadership may be taken to qualify for another feat or class (such as the Great Captain feat or Legendary Leader prestige class), though a character still doesn't get its usual benefit in those cases. This is to allow characters to access unproblematic material that'd otherwise be made unavailable because of the Leadership ban.

On the subject of messaging the chair (me), a few guidelines:
- I am not here to give critiques on your build or guess how the judges might score it!
- For entries, please keep the entry to no more than 2 message, if at all possible.
- For entries, don't expect me to search through your entry and edit in or out material. Entries should be sent to me complete - if there is a later revision, re-submit the full build. PLEASE DON'T INCLUDE TEXT IN YOUR SUBMISSION YOU WANT ME TO EDIT OUT FOR THE POST - SUBMIT IT TO ME EXACTLY HOW I WILL POST THE FINISHED PRODUCT.
- Please make sure the name of your entry is clearly present in the message.

https://static1.fjcdn.com/comments/Blank+_f9dc57d79f116360fec82904c0537f3a.jpg


Everyone, have fun!

[Thurbane]

This is...unusual, to say the least.

I'm not sure if I can do anything with this or not. I'll have a think.

[ben-zayb]

Not sure if I'm getting this correctly

if THE FEAT has other feat prerequisites, you can only get those feats from bonus feats and can't choose them as your feats for levels 1, 3, 6, etc.
for this round, you can take THE FEAT multiple times, and its numerical benefits, if any, will stack
the villain's schtick must focus on or revolve around THE FEAT

[Falontani]

This is.. Interesting

[zlefin]

if a feat has another feat as a prerequisite, does that mean it's essentially ineligible for this, because to take it you'd have to have two feats?

[Segev]

So, just to help me wrap my head around this, the idea here is that you would take, say, every feat slot filled with Signature Spell, or with Vow of Poverty, or something like that, and you could stack it so that you're piling on the bonuses from Vow or casting wish from 1st level spell slots or something?

[GrayDeath]

That is a weird concept.....intruiging, but weird.

Luckily Leadership is banned, or some thing swould ... be really insane. ^^

But yeah, the above questions are important: I assume if The Feat has prereqs you may take these, but you gain no benefit from them, they only allow you to qualify, correct?

And as for stacking: So everything that normally would prevent multiple iterations from stacking is ignored, or ONLY if its numerical stuff (say +2 to saves, or a Bonus maneuver or somesuch, not, say, Vow of Poverty or Craven or....)

[Zaq]

I'll be honest: I genuinely do not understand what this round's unique rules are. At all.

It's perhaps a moot point because I won't have time to enter, but if there's one thing I've learned while going back to school, it's that if I don't get something, there's at least a handful of other people involved who don't get it either, so it's worth piping up and getting clarification.

You pick one feat and take it over and over, even if it doesn't let you normally do that? But you can skip taking a feat prior to when you take The Feat and gain benefits to meet prereqs (?), but they go away when you take The Feat? I truly do not understand where this is going.

So for the benefit of everyone watching, can you please elaborate on just how this is intended to work?

[PrismCat21]

Not sure if I'm getting this correctly

if THE FEAT has other feat prerequisites, you can only get those feats from bonus feats and can't choose them as your feats for levels 1, 3, 6, etc.
for this round, you can take THE FEAT multiple times, and its numerical benefits, if any, will stack
the villain's schtick must focus on or revolve around THE FEAT


You're not even allowed the bonus feats. "Bonus feats from any source must still comply with being your only feat choice"
If you receive a bonus feat from somewhere, that 'must' be your only feat. It seems o imply right after that line that you can 'choose' to not accept bonus feats, but it's only implication, not stated.

Seems like taking THE FEAT multiple times does indeed stack with itself.


if a feat has another feat as a prerequisite, does that mean it's essentially ineligible for this, because to take it you'd have to have two feats?

Certainly seems like it.


So, just to help me wrap my head around this, the idea here is that you would take, say, every feat slot filled with Signature Spell, or with Vow of Poverty, or something like that, and you could stack it so that you're piling on the bonuses from Vow or casting wish from 1st level spell slots or something?

Certainly seems like it.


I'll be honest: I genuinely do not understand what this round's unique rules are. At all.
~snip~
You pick one feat and take it over and over, even if it doesn't let you normally do that? But you can skip taking a feat prior to when you take The Feat and gain benefits to meet prereqs (?), but they go away when you take The Feat? I truly do not understand where this is going.

Agreed on the unique rules. I don't even bother trying to build anymore because I want to 'not' deal with them.

Judging by jdizzlean's language patterns, I believe he 'means' to say that once you take your feat, you cannot gain 'additional' bonuses by deciding to not the the feat again. You'd still keep any previous bonuses you took by forgoing the feat.
What it actually says however... *sigh*

[Falontani]

Perhaps it would be easier to do this (although I could be far from what the chair actually wants) at the beginning of the build you choose one feat that is what the SI is. The SI can be chosen multiple times and stacks with itself if applicable (power attack I don't think would be, however I'm not the judge here, and even if I was you might be able to argue it; vs mobility, pretty easy to see how it would stack) even if you normally could not take the feat multiple times. That'd be the only "unique" rule I'd do. Too many classes/races/etc grant too many feats or require feats to actually be made to shine.

However, I do enjoy these concepts, as they help me think in different ways to come up with a dish. It's less add power attack, improved bull rush, shock trooper, and have fun with your bruiser of the day, and more, what can I use to make something fun and unique.

[jdizzlean]

Not sure if I'm getting this correctly

if THE FEAT has other feat prerequisites, you can only get those feats from bonus feats and can't choose them as your feats for levels 1, 3, 6, etc.
for this round, you can take THE FEAT multiple times, and its numerical benefits, if any, will stack
the villain's schtick must focus on or revolve around THE FEAT



if a feat has another feat as a prerequisite, does that mean it's essentially ineligible for this, because to take it you'd have to have two feats?

Yes, my intention was to eliminate the massive feat chains so prelevant in all these optimization build competitions, and instead focus on the "beginning" feats. You can't take feats as pre-reqs, because you can only take 1 feat period.




And as for stacking: So everything that normally would prevent multiple iterations from stacking is ignored, or ONLY if its numerical stuff (say +2 to saves, or a Bonus maneuver or somesuch, not, say, Vow of Poverty or Craven or....)

every aspect of a feats wording can apply for as many times as you take that feat. so let's say for example that you want to use Skill Focus: appraise for that sweet +3 bonus, in this round you could take it say 8 times potentially, for a +24 to that skill, making you really great at it. And of course you could take craven X amount of times, and each use of it adds +1 to your damage/char level, but the -2 to your fear saves would stack as well.




You pick one feat and take it over and over, even if it doesn't let you normally do that? But you can skip taking a feat prior to when you take The Feat and gain benefits to meet prereqs (?), but they go away when you take The Feat? I truly do not understand where this is going.

So for the benefit of everyone watching, can you please elaborate on just how this is intended to work?


You're not even allowed the bonus feats. "Bonus feats from any source must still comply with being your only feat choice"
If you receive a bonus feat from somewhere, that 'must' be your only feat. It seems o imply right after that line that you can 'choose' to not accept bonus feats, but it's only implication, not stated.

Seems like taking THE FEAT multiple times does indeed stack with itself.

Judging by jdizzlean's language patterns, I believe he 'means' to say that once you take your feat, you cannot gain 'additional' bonuses by deciding to not the the feat again. You'd still keep any previous bonuses you took by forgoing the feat.
What it actually says however... *sigh*

so here's a sample based on the skill focus appraise above.
human fighter 1 - (feats) +1 BAB, +1 BAB (you lose the fighter bonus feat)
fighter 2 - lose the bonus feat
fighter 3 - +1 BAB
fighter 4 - lose the bonus feat
fighter 5
fighter 6 - skill focus appraise, lose bonus feat
fighter 9 - skill focus appraise
fighter 12 -skill focus appraise
fighter 15- skill focus appraise
fighter 18- skill focus appraise

you still retain whatever bonus's you chose to take in lieu of a feat in the beginning, you simply can't choose to go back and take them again after you've opted to finally take a feat, so in the example you can't say take skill focus at 6th, and then go back to taking +1 BAB on successive levels.


as it's still early enough in this round, and it seems to be a much bigger sticking contention point than i thought, perhaps the ruling on bonus feats could be relaxed. if the chef's wish it, bonus feats could be used as pre-reqs (but still grant no other abilities). I would rather that it be a specific bonus feat that is spelled out in a class, rather then say the fighter that could pick from 20+ feats. I was really hoping not to have say multiple uses of whirlwind attack as that is a feat heavy chain to get to, but to highlight more interesting uses of "base feats".

[Lionheart]

Very interesting indeed... I already have a couple of different ideas for this!

[zlefin]

ok, I'll pass; I prefer setups that make things that would be legal to play in games. It seems atypical for this competition to make explicitly non-raw stuff, but I don't follow this series that closely so maybe I just haven't noticed.

[daremetoidareyo]

ok, I'll pass; I prefer setups that make things that would be legal to play in games. It seems atypical for this competition to make explicitly non-raw stuff, but I don't follow this series that closely so maybe I just haven't noticed.

It's a bit of a deviation. Usually it's a theme that we build towards.

[GrayDeath]

Ah, so everything stacks, and you can simply take the aforementioned bonuses until you qualify.##Seems simple to me, and actually I ahve a few ideas already.

I for one really prefer the Special Rounds we had the last fe times, it makes one think in totally different ways than the normal Optimization.


One question I ahve remaining: Say your Feat grants you +1 Other Ressource" (be it a Spell, Invocation, Maneuver or whatever), I assume in this case it does not ahve to be the SAME again and again, but you simply can take it as often as you like (Say extras Invocation Beguiling Influence, followed by Baleful Utteranc, yes?)?


Yeah, got some NICE Ideas.^^

[Thurbane]

ok, I'll pass; I prefer setups that make things that would be legal to play in games.

Same here.

Although I have one or two ideas that would still be RAW legal...

[unseenmage]

Same here.

Although I have one or two ideas that would still be RAW legal...

Would that earn one any actual points though?

[Thurbane]

Would that earn one any actual points though?

Unsure, but I'd feel better about it.

[unseenmage]

Unsure, but I'd feel better about it.

I apologize if it seemed as though I were disparaging the idea. I think it'd be cool to see something that was both RAW legal snd competition legal.

I'm just not familiar enough with competition judging to know if such could/would earn points.

[Thurbane]

I apologize if it seemed as though I were disparaging the idea. I think it'd be cool to see something that was both RAW legal snd competition legal.

I'm just not familiar enough with competition judging to know if such could/would earn points.

No offense taken at all. :smallsmile:

[GrayDeath]

Well, there are ways to do it legally (after all there are multiple choice feats that are the same feat every time) so that alone should not keep one from participating.

WHat it will cost you in Power it would (were I to judge) be rewarded in Elegance. So why not simply try, if you have the time? ^^

[ben-zayb]

If the chef's wish it, bonus feats could be used as pre-reqs (but still grant no other abilities). I would rather that it be a specific bonus feat that is spelled out in a class, rather then say the fighter that could pick from 20+ feats.On one hand, having more than one feat might be against the spirit of the round. On the other hand, relaxing the rules this way would open up more feasible concepts for showcasing any specific feat (instead of just showcasing a "base feat", as you put it).

What I fear is a possibly lower turnout due to the restrictions, and, to a lesser degree, character builds that are already pretty competent* even without feats, but would be mechanically and/or thematically stronger with the addition of the feat.

*stapling a powerful build to a theme isn't unique to this round, though, as even I am guilty of having done this before

[jdizzlean]

One question I ahve remaining: Say your Feat grants you +1 Other Ressource" (be it a Spell, Invocation, Maneuver or whatever), I assume in this case it does not ahve to be the SAME again and again, but you simply can take it as often as you like (Say extras Invocation Beguiling Influence, followed by Baleful Utteranc, yes?)?


Yeah, got some NICE Ideas.^^

Yes, unless the feat you're using specifically spells out something, you can select whatever from it, so for example, extra invocation would mean that you could pick a different invocation each time, or because of this rounds stipulation that it can apply to the same thing more then once, you could say take beguiling influence multiple times and each time would net another +6 to those skills.


On one hand, having more than one feat might be against the spirit of the round. On the other hand, relaxing the rules this way would open up more feasible concepts for showcasing any specific feat (instead of just showcasing a "base feat", as you put it).

What I fear is a possibly lower turnout due to the restrictions, and, to a lesser degree, character builds that are already pretty competent* even without feats, but would be mechanically and/or thematically stronger with the addition of the feat.

*stapling a powerful build to a theme isn't unique to this round, though, as even I am guilty of having done this before

i'm willing to give it until friday this week for an unofficial vote. should one not take place, the original restriction will stand

[Falontani]

The only reason I would want the proposed change is to meet prerequisites. If I wanted to showcase a feat, I would want to take prestige classes, or feats, that enhance that specific feat. Power attack is nearly impossible to showcase, unless you take the prestige classes that boost it, or the feats that help it out. At least being able to select other feats and let them not do anything would allow us prestige classes.

[PrismCat21]

Would that earn one any actual points though?

It certainly would from me.

[Thurbane]

I've found something I can work with, and the build is coming along nicely. :smallsmile:

[jdizzlean]

Alright, if you wish it, bonus feats can be taken to qualify for your feat of choice, but they grant no specific value to the build beyond that. it must be a specific bonus feat, not a "choose from x amount of feats" as a bonus feat.

[GrayDeath]

Well, got 2 Ideas, one of which is waiting for a clear yes or no answer regarding its viability with the very specific limitations of this round from the Chair, the other is ticking along nicely so far.

[daremetoidareyo]

Quick question, is the OA 3.5 update in dragon 318 allowed as a source?

[jdizzlean]

Quick question, is the OA 3.5 update in dragon 318 allowed as a source?

yes, it's pretty standard across all comps, no need to rock the boat

[daremetoidareyo]

yes, it's pretty standard across all comps, no need to rock the boat

It wasn't itemized in the opening post, so i thought that i would clarify.

[Falontani]

I could not find a way to get my primary build to work without an Otyugh Hole, and even if I DO use it the wording on several abilities is tenuous at best, and outright restricted at worst. So I'm going to go with a build that I've been saving.

[GrayDeath]

Well, thats that. My crazy idea is not workable, as the Prerequ Feat is never gained as a specified Bonus feat, and choosing it via more open onus Feats does not work.

Ah well, was rather mad anyway, back to the boring but workable build it is. ^^

[ben-zayb]

Well, thats that. My crazy idea is not workable, as the Prerequ Feat is never gained as a specified Bonus feat, and choosing it via more open onus Feats does not work.

Ah well, was rather mad anyway, back to the boring but workable build it is. ^^
Aside from class bonus feats, some monsters also get crrtains feats as bonus. Could be an alternative if yours doesn't rely on the char's race.

[Thurbane]

I don't want to create any spoilers or speculation, but I'm very curious to know the feat in question, and see if I could find a source for it as a bonus feat.

[jdizzlean]

It wasn't itemized in the opening post, so i thought that i would clarify.
having recently attempted a build based on that same reasoning, no problem at all :)


Well, thats that. My crazy idea is not workable, as the Prerequ Feat is never gained as a specified Bonus feat, and choosing it via more open onus Feats does not work.

Ah well, was rather mad anyway, back to the boring but workable build it is. ^^

I checked the "list of stuff" (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?454553-Lists-of-Stuff-(saved-from-Wizards-Community-Forums))and have an option for you, i'll pm you it....

actually, that doesn't work either, sorry bud

[GrayDeath]

Well, for all who are interested (it does not work any way after all) the Feat(s) in Question were:

DELETED. Just to be sure.


Sigh, it wasnt doable anyway, so I thought nothing of it. Sorry.

[PrismCat21]

Quick question, is the OA 3.5 update in dragon 318 allowed as a source?

It wasn't itemized in the opening post, so i thought that i would clarify.
*ahem*

The Dragon Magazine update for Oriental Adventures is in use.



Well, for all who are interested (it does not work any way after all) the Feat(s) in Question were:
~snip~


Speculation:
Please don’t post or speculate on possible builds until the reveal, in order to avoid spoiling the surprise if a particular competitor is producing a build along those lines.
Once builds are revealed, please do not comment on errors or rules issues on entries unless you are a judge. If you have such a comment, wait until the final reveal to post it.

Might be a good idea to delete your planned build until later on in the comp.

[AvatarVecna]

I was super-excited to put together a "it's just you and me and my GUARDS!" character until I remembered that Leadership is banned. The problem I keep coming to is that most things tend to be either "this small thing you normally couldn't self-stack can be stacked now, which is worse than more standard feat combos", or "this awesome thing can be stacked now, but not that much", or "this can be self-stacked to a ridiculous degree and is quite broken", none of which are...interesting to build.

...still got a couple ideas worth looking into, though.

[jdizzlean]

could you imagine the horror if you could take leadership 5+ times in one build?

[unseenmage]

could you imagine the horror if you could take leadership 5+ times in one build?

So basically a Thrallherd with Leadership chaining other Thrallherds...

[ben-zayb]

could you imagine the horror if you could take leadership 5+ times in one build?Normally, nothing stops a cohort and/or followers from taking Leadership once qualified, so I believe we're long crossed the exponential ridiculousness of the feat.

[danielxcutter]

...so is Leadership broken because of the abuse potential, or is it broken right out of the gate? :smallconfused:

[ben-zayb]

...so is Leadership broken because of the abuse potential, or is it broken right out of the gate? :smallconfused:
Yes.:smallwink:

[3SecondCultist]

Hmmm, I have an idea for a build, but it's not exactly interesting. I could make it work, but it would definitely be more of a 'lore' than mechanics thing.

I wonder if this round might be more interesting if instead of having only 1 Feat, we make builds that clearly showcase and revolve around the use of said Feat. There can still be a limit on how many Feats are allowed in total (it can be like 5 or something), but each build has to meaningfully use a single Feat as the core of its function on all levels, including fluff and things.

To me as an optimizer, I could see that being less restrictive but gives us all more room to be creative and make distinct builds. For instance, if I were to make an entire build revolving around Robilar's Gambit and making people hit my monster (which I know has been done before, it's just an example), the entire strategy and story of the entry would need to revolve around the use of that feat. The round's Judge(s) would be able to mark Elegance and Power for how much / how well the Feat is being used.

[AvatarVecna]

...so is Leadership broken because of the abuse potential, or is it broken right out of the gate? :smallconfused:

Leadership is broken as a feat because there's basically no realistic way to use it that isn't a gigantic advantage that outweighs most every other feat. The normal way to use it is to just ignore that you have followers and only care about the cohort; even if the cohort is commoner whose only purpose is to be a meat shield for other party members so they don't have to take damage, that commoner is adding at least {your ECL -2}d4 HP. Compare this to feats like Improved Toughness, which increase the group's total HP pool by {your ECL}, and you realize that even at the lowest level you could take Leadership, you're comparing "+4d4 HP" to "+6 HP", which isn't a contest. And that's the absolute dumbest way to use your cohort; if your cohort is, say, a more seasoned bodyguard with a decent Con score, not only are they adding {your ECL -2} * {1d10+2} HP, they're also increasing the group's DPR by a not-insignificant amount, and adding a solid frontliner so the rogue has a flanking buddy more frequently. And Fighter is still an awful way to use your cohort, but at least it's contributing to the combat now.

Like, let's say your 20th level character has Leadership, but your cohort and followers only have NPC classes, their builds are focused around being good mundane craftsmen, and they spend their days just making stuff and selling it to make your "company" a profit.

All members have the following feats.

Feats:
HD 1: Skill Focus (Craft: Weaponsmithing)
GS 1: Mercantile Background
Human: Apprentice (Craftsman)


Feats past 1st lvl are not focused on crafting.

Now, onto the members.

Venerable Human
Generic Spellcaster 10/Exemplar 8

Stats (lvl 1): 7/6/8/18/13/11
Stats (lvl 18, no items): 7/6/8/22/13/11
Stats (lvl 18, items): 7/6/8/28/13/11

Items (126100/130000):
Headband Of Intellect +6 (36000)
Necklace Of Ultimate Craftsmanship +30 (90000)
Masterwork "Craft: Weaponsmithing" Tool (100)

Skill Bonus (+59):
+21 Ranks
+9 Int Mod
+3 Skill Focus
+2 Mercantile Background
+2 Masterwork Tool
+30 Necklace
-8 Lend Talent

Venerable Human
Generic Spellcaster 6

Stats: 7/6/8/18/13/11

Items: Masterwork "Craft: Weaponsmithing" Tool (100)

Skill Bonus (+28):
+9 ranks
+4 Int Mod
+3 Skill Focus
+2 Mercantile Background
+2 Masterwork Tool
+8 Lend Talent

Venerable Human
Generic Spellcaster 5

Stats: 7/6/8/18/13/11

Items: Masterwork "Craft: Weaponsmithing" Tool (100)

Skill Bonus (+27):
+8 ranks
+4 Int Mod
+3 Skill Focus
+2 Mercantile Background
+2 Masterwork Tool
+8 Lend Talent

Venerable Human
Generic Spellcaster 4

Stats: 7/6/8/18/13/11

Items: Masterwork "Craft: Weaponsmithing" Tool (100)

Skill Bonus (+26):
+7 ranks
+4 Int Mod
+3 Skill Focus
+2 Mercantile Background
+2 Masterwork Tool
+8 Lend Talent

Venerable Human
Generic Spellcaster 3

Stats: 7/6/8/18/13/11

Items: Masterwork "Craft: Weaponsmithing" Tool (100)

Skill Bonus (+25):
+6 ranks
+4 Int Mod
+3 Skill Focus
+2 Mercantile Background
+2 Masterwork Tool
+8 Lend Talent

Venerable Human
Generic Spellcaster 2

Stats: 7/6/8/18/13/11

Items: Masterwork "Craft: Weaponsmithing" Tool (100)

Skill Bonus (+24):
+5 ranks
+4 Int Mod
+3 Skill Focus
+2 Mercantile Background
+2 Masterwork Tool
+8 Lend Talent

Venerable Human
Generic Spellcaster 1

Stats: 7/6/8/18/13/11

Items: Masterwork "Craft: Weaponsmithing" Tool (100)

Skill Bonus (+23):
+4 ranks
+4 Int Mod
+3 Skill Focus
+2 Mercantile Background
+2 Masterwork Tool
+8 Lend Talent

Alright, so whenever one of these guys starts working on a weapon, they spend 90% of 1/3 of the base price on materials (so 30% of the price). The level 1s do Accelerated Crafting work on simple melee/thrown weapons, the level 2-4s will do Accelerated Crafting work on martial melee/thrown weapons and crossbows, and the level 5-6s will do Accelerated Crafting work on exotic melee/thrown weapons. The cohort, meanwhile, is doing Quadruply-Accelerated Crafting on exotic melee/thrown weapons. All of these guys beat/match the DC on a nat 1, so they'll never fail, so it's just a question of their average progress made. Here is the progress made by a person of that level:

(135) Lvl 1: 737 sp/week
(13) Lvl 2: 862.5 sp/week
(7) Lvl 3: 887.5 sp/week
(4) Lvl 4: 912.5 sp/week
(2) Lvl 5: 1050 sp/week
(2) Lvl 6: 1078 sp/week
(1) Lvl 18: 4031 sp/week

Now, this 128857 sp/week is the worth of the total product produced, but we only make 70% of that as profit because of having to pay for base materials. So we knock that down to 90199.9 sp profit per week (9019.99 gp/week). Now, if we put these 164 people into Good Inns with Good Meals every day, that reduces the per-week profit by 2870 gp...leaving you with a well-fed, well-rested following that's still making you 6149.99 gp profit per week.

This is an objectively simple and dumb way to use your followers and cohort, and it still makes you 878.57 gp per day after all expenses.

EDIT: Hell, at just level 6, assuming Cha 14 and +8 misc bonuses to Leadership score from the feat, you're looking at (1) lvl 4 cohort, (1) lvl 3 follower, (2) lvl 2 followers, and (25) lvl 1 followers. Using the same builds (adjusted for missing the Lend Talent bonus, and using Magecraft instead), you'd be looking at the lvl 1s making exotic melee/thrown and the rest making Accelerated simple melee/thrown. That's total worth of 1656.3 gp/week (1159.41 gp/week after base materials, or 651.91 gp/week after good room and food). If there was a feat you could take at 6th level that just read "every single day for the rest of your life, you receive a check for 93.13 gp, and this will increase every time you level up", that feat would be ludicrous. And that's just a super-dumb way of using Leadership.

[daremetoidareyo]

Is the prohibition from Feats that can only be taken at first level lifted?

[PrismCat21]

Is the prohibition from Feats that can only be taken at first level lifted?

What prohibition? I don't recall seeing anything prohibiting those Feats. Where was it at?

[AvatarVecna]

What prohibition? I don't recall seeing anything prohibiting those Feats. Where was it at?

I think what they mean is "this feat can normally only be taken at 1st level" is a thing that shows up now and again in feat descriptions, and they're asking if that is waived for this contest as part of the "you can stack this feat even if you normally couldn't" rules change.

[daremetoidareyo]

I think what they mean is "this feat can normally only be taken at 1st level" is a thing that shows up now and again in feat descriptions, and they're asking if that is waived for this contest as part of the "you can stack this feat even if you normally couldn't" rules change.

Thank you for translating. You're right, that is what I was inquiring about

[PrismCat21]

I think what they mean is "this feat can normally only be taken at 1st level" is a thing that shows up now and again in feat descriptions, and they're asking if that is waived for this contest as part of the "you can stack this feat even if you normally couldn't" rules change.

That's what I figured. I wanted the question to be clear.
Saying there was a prohibition makes it sound like a contest rule, when it's only a simple prerequisite for a feat.

[jdizzlean]

Is the prohibition from Feats that can only be taken at first level lifted?

sure, why not

[Thurbane]

Next Monday is a public holiday here: any chance for an extension to 28th?

[jdizzlean]

Next Monday is a public holiday here: any chance for an extension to 28th?

sure, same bat time

[jdizzlean]

how's everyone doing, 5 days left now, only a single entry submitted

[Thurbane]

how's everyone doing, 5 days left now, only a single entry submitted

I'm about 80% done, hoping to use the long weekend to finish up my entry...

[GrayDeath]

I'm about 80% done, hoping to use the long weekend to finish up my entry...

Around the same.

[Mike Miller]

I have a well fleshed out idea. I am getting it on paper now. The hard part will be finding time to put it on my computer. Hopefully I will make the deadline...

[ben-zayb]

I just scrapped a ridiculous idea because, upon reading the specific rules more closely, the gimmick doesn't work the way I thought it would. I'd post it after the reveal.

[GrayDeath]

Been sick (fever, Head and other pain, extreme tiredness) since friday.
My build is mecanically done, but I dont have the head and concentation to do a write up atm.

Might we get an extension till enxt weekend? If not at elast Iw ont be able to finish (at elast not with anything approaching my normal standards or good formation I am afradi....).

[Thurbane]

Been sick (fever, Head and other pain, extreme tiredness) since friday.
My build is mecanically done, but I dont have the head and concentation to do a write up atm.

Might we get an extension till enxt weekend? If not at elast Iw ont be able to finish (at elast not with anything approaching my normal standards or good formation I am afradi....).

More entries generally makes for a better comp.

I'd be happy for an additional extension (my entry needs formatting neatened up)...

[jdizzlean]

ok, have another week

[AvatarVecna]

I've been struck by inspiration, and will madly rush to get an entry in.

[GrayDeath]

Finally fully healthy again. A bit of rest today, will finish it tomorrow.

And lets hope every entry goes for a different feat. Really looking forward to this one! :smallcool:

[Thurbane]

Real-life is kicking my butt. Hope to have an entry in before the extended deadline, but if not, I volunteer to judge.

My entry is still about 80% complete (and has been for over a week), but work has been insane, and we've been having a heat-wave in my area (my home PC is in the hottest room in the house, with no air-con).

[GrayDeath]

Well, as I just got home (and wanted to do it today but am too tired now to be sure to do it without mistakes, last check, tables and formation and all, I am in the same boat.

Likely getting it in tomorrow evening. I hope. ^^

[jdizzlean]

i have 3 entries, i'd like to have a few more, but i also don't want to drag it out to long, have a few extra days, we'll see what it looks like wed, and i'll either call it and post then, or extend to the end of this week one final time.

[Hackulator]

I have a very simple, somewhat silly, quite amusing build that is pretty much already finished in my head. I'll get it to you in the next day or so. My main fear is it the possibility of someone else doing the same thing, given the highly restrictive (though interesting) nature of this challenge.

[jdizzlean]

I have a very simple, somewhat silly, quite amusing build that is pretty much already finished in my head. I'll get it to you in the next day or so. My main fear is it the possibility of someone else doing the same thing, given the highly restrictive (though interesting) nature of this challenge.

the first rule of fight club VC is that you do not talk of Vizzini!

[danielxcutter]

the first rule of fight club VC is that you do not talk of Vizzini!

Who was Vizzini again?

[jdizzlean]

https://princessbride.fandom.com/wiki/Vizzini



"But it’s so simple. All I have to do is divine from what I know of you. Are you the sort of man who would put the poison into his own goblet, or his enemy’s? Now, a clever man would put the poison into his own goblet, because he would know that only a great fool would reach for what he was given. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of me."


clearly no one will do it because it is obvious, but just as clearly everyone will do it because it is obvious. this is known as the vizzini effect.

[Hackulator]

https://princessbride.fandom.com/wiki/Vizzini



clearly no one will do it because it is obvious, but just as clearly everyone will do it because it is obvious. this is known as the vizzini effect.

Interesting to note, while in the movie Wesley acts like he thinks Vizzini is kind of an idiot, in the book he's actually kind of scared of him.

[GrayDeath]

Thanks, that means I dont have to finish now, after being out for 13 hours......;)

[Lionheart]

Yeah, thanks for the extension, RL has gotten in the way of my build but should be able to finish in time now!

[Hackulator]

What's the current count on entries, and when are we likely to call it at this point?

[jdizzlean]

i have 5, w/ 2 more saying they should be done by wed. so at this point there's roughly 25 hours or so left until the cutoff and reveal

[AvatarVecna]

i have 5, w/ 2 more saying they should be done by wed. so at this point there's roughly 25 hours or so left until the cutoff and reveal

Make that three. I'm putting on some finishing touches tonight now that I'm home. Many thanks for all of the extra time. :smallsmile:

[GrayDeath]

Well sadly, I seem to be out of luck then.

I jsut had the third 12+ hour day in a row (yesterday also spending over an hour waiting for the Train tracks te be cleared, at -3 degrees, ah well), so I am sedly unable to get it in today.

If somebodey else could also do with mroe time to liekly get it in, I am TOTALLY free on the coming weekend, so unless I am unable to see my screen (not jinxing it or anything) I WILL be done then.

But I dont want to slow it down if its ONLY for me either. YOur decision, Jidizzlean.

[AvatarVecna]

I lost a few hours of solid build research from the forum timing out. I'm rushing to redo my work right now, and I might have something in time, but we'll see. If I end up being late, I'll post what I have as a "what could've been" rather than an official contest submission.

EDIT: Submitted.

[Lionheart]

So, as builds haven't been posted yet, is there still time to submit? I've got almost everything sorted, so shouldn't take me more than a couple of hours!

[Falontani]

So, as builds haven't been posted yet, is there still time to submit? I've got almost everything sorted, so shouldn't take me more than a couple of hours!
You can submit until the builds roll, however you should be fast

[Lionheart]

You can submit until the builds roll, however you should be fast

Cheers! Managed to get it in a couple of hours ago.

[GrayDeath]

Yess, got it in!

Dang, that was hard given my amount of work.

Can hardly wait for the reveal and Judging. :D

[Hackulator]

Jdizzlean everything ok? Haven't heard from you in a while, last thing you said was the reveal would be Wednesday.

[jdizzlean]

i was draggin my feet so Gray could finish up. builds incoming

[jdizzlean]

1. The Drowned Captain

The Drowned Captain Chaotic Evil Paragon Drowned



25
40


13
28


-
-


9
24


10
25


12
27







CR


Class


Base Attack Bonus


Fort Save


Ref Save


Will Save


Skills


Feats


Class Features



8
Drowned
12
6
6
12
Hide +23, Move Silently +23, Spot +23
+1 BAB, +1 BAB, Improved Toughness, Improved Toughness, Improved Toughness, Improved Toughness, Improved Toughness,
20 RHD, +8 natural armor, 2 slam attacks dealing 1d8, Drowning Aura, Undead Traits, Darkvision 60 ft, Fast Healing 5, Unholy Toughness, +8 racial bonus to swim


20
Paragon
12
6
6
12
Hide +23, Move Silently +23, Spot +23, Listen +23, Knowledge Arcana +11, Knowledge Religion +11, Spellcraft +11, Psicraft +11, Use Magic Device +11, Use Psionic Device +11, Autohypnosis +11, Knowledge Nature +3.5
Improved Toughness(B), Improved Toughness(B)
Max out HD+12/HD, Triple Movement Speed, +12 insight bonus to AC, +12 luck bonus to AC, +25 luck bonus to hit, +20 luck bonus to damage on melee/thrown attacks, +13 to Drowning Aura’s DC, Fire Resistance 10, Cold Resistance 10, 33 spell resistance, Fast Healing 20, +10 insight bonus to all saves, +15 to all stats, +10 to all skills, Treasure as a CR 20, Greater Dispel Magic, Haste, See Invisibility






Paragon Drowned
Size/Type: Medium Undead
Hit Dice: 20d12+240+140+160 (780 hp)
Initiative: +9
Speed: 90 ft., 90 ft swim (18 squares)
Armor Class: 51 (+8 Natural, +9 Dex, +12 Insight, +12 Luck), touch 43, flat-footed 44
Base Attack/Grapple: +12/+27
Attack: Slam +52 (1d8+35)
Full Attack: 2 Slams +52 (1d8+35)
Space/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft.
Special Attacks: Drowning Aura
Special Qualities: Fast Healing 20, Spell Resistance 33, Fire Resistance 10, Cold Resistance 10, Darkvision 60 ft, Undead Traits, Unholy Toughness
Saves: Fort +16, Ref +25, Will +29
Abilities: Str 40, Dex 28, Con -, Int 24, Wis 25, Cha 27
Skills: Hide +41, Move Silently +41, Spot +40, Listen +40, Knowledge Arcana +28, Knowledge Religion +28, Spellcraft +28, Psicraft +28, Use Magic Device +29, Use Psionic Device +29, Autohypnosis +28, Knowledge Nature +20, Swim +33, Jump +25(+49 with increases based on speed)
Feats: Improved Toughness*7
CR 20

Drowning Aura (Su): A drowned gives off a 30-foot radius emanation of suffocating drowning, imbuing its surroundings with a watery glint and deadly threat for creatures that breathe. All breathing creatures within 30 feet of a drowned are treated as if beneath water in terms of being able to breath. The drowning aura accelerates the process of drowning.
Normally a creature can hold its breath for a number of rounds equal to twice its con score before it begins to drown. Within the drowning aura, a creature can only hold its breath if it makes a DC 23 Constitution check every round. Each round, the DC increases by 1. When the character finally fails its con check, it begins to drown. In the first round, it falls unconscious (0 hit points). In the following round, it drops to -1 hit points and is dying. In the third round, if still in the drowning aura, it drowns.

Spell Like Abilities: CL 15
Greater Dispel Magic 3/day
Haste 3/day
See Invisibility 3/day

Well your a fast and dangerous beat stick with a ton of health and fast healing. Oh and your aura will incapacitate and kill anyone with a low con score that needs to breathe (read most living creatures) within 30 ft. With your 90 movement speed, 120 with haste you are a fast land based creature, able to keep up with most mounted combatants and non fliers. Heavy investment into spellcraft/psicraft and UMD/UPD alongside the specifically called out feature of Paragon template of having wealth equal to a creature of your CR (regardless of what wealth you should have possessed before) allows us to arm ourselves with magic. Wands, Dorjes, Staves, and Psicrowns are within our grasp, along with scrolls. And being a captain we sure had plunder to use! Using your natural 33 spell resistance you should be flinging spells into your area and their own with abandon. However I believe most battles with the Drowned Captain will end in a stalemate, a battle of attrition, or as the captain being a guard for a more powerful entity. You see as intelligent as the Drowned Captain is, he lacks… ambition.
“I am.. Err I was the great captain... What was my name again? No matter, a captain I was, of a valiant ship that hunted down many a pirate. Or was I the pirate..? I can’t recall. Damned ye, must have messed with me memories.. Or have ye? Everything is so fuzzy. Drunk! Must be it, drowned in alcohol I was. Must’ve been. All I remember was being drowned. Mutiny it must have been… On guard with ye, I don’t stand here for me own health. ...And that is such a pretty bauble.”

Drowned: MM 3
Paragon Creature Template: Epic Player’s Handbook
Improved Toughness: Libris Mortis

[jdizzlean]

2. Aww Crud!@

Crud, the Half-Orc Crusader
I don't have a 20 level class table, because it is basically just the crusader table. It didn't seem like a good idea to copy that. The big change is skipping feats and just taking +1 IL at levels 1, 3, 6, and 9. Then, taking Extra Granted Maneuver at levels 12, 15, and 18. That way Crud gets all his readied maneuvers every round at level 18+.

Crud is not a particularly intelligent half-orc. He certainly isn't gaining the people's trust. He doesn't dance or sing or make people laugh. However, he knows how to fight. Crud learned his discipline through the combat teachings of the crusader. His strange tendencies kept him apart from people. He became a misanthrope and focused on one thing: killing. Crud didn't care who or how or why, just as long as he could keep killing. It was his mantra. Everything needed to die. If it was living, he would make it dead. Crud's passion for fighting was so great that he mastered his combat maneuvers faster than anyone before him.

As for combat, Crud makes use of all the Crusader's abilities. Steely Resolve will add quite the damage threshold. Mettle helps his saves and his stance, Immortal Fortitude, keeps him alive even longer. It is worth noting his early access to maneuvers will be noticeable right up until end game levels. Once he reaches level 18, he gets to use whatever maneuver he wants every round.

The only source is Tome of Battle.


Crud, Half-Orc level 20 Crusader (CR 20)
HD: 20d10+40
INI: +1
AC: 11 (+1 dex)
BAB/Grapple: +20/+26
Saves: Fort +14/ Ref +7/ Will +6
Speed: 30 ft
Alignment: LE
Abilities: STR 22/DEX 12/ CON 14/ INT 11/ WIS 10/ CHA 6
Special: IL 24 (+4 from +1 IL 4 times before taking a feat)




Ability
Base
Racial
Level 5
Level 10
Level 15
Level 20


Strength
15
+2
18
19
20
22


Dexterity
12
-
12
12
12
12


Constitution
14
-
14
14
14
14


Intelligence
13
-2
11
11
11
11


Wisdom
10
-
10
10
10
10


Charisma
8
-2
6
6
6
6




IL 7
Maneuvers Readied: 5(2)
Maneuvers Known: 7
Devoted Spirit: Crusader's Strike, Revitalizing Strike
Stone Dragon: Charging Minotaur, Stone Dragon's Fury
White Raven: Douse the Flames, Leading the Attack, Covering Strike
Stances: Martial Spirit, Bolstering Voice

At this point, Crud has already made his prowess in battle well known. He has access to 4th level maneuvers, which should be quite the surprise to anyone who hasn't met him. However, still requiring normal maneuver recovery means he hasn't set himself apart completely yet. Crud will use Martial Spirit to keep his health up, unless he feels his enemies can affect him with will saves. Then his bolstering voice will be better. Appropriate maneuver usage is key for his tactics. Opening with charges and using support maneuvers as needed.


IL 14
Maneuvers Readied: 6(3)
Maneuvers Known: 9
Devoted Spirit: Revitalizing Strike, Doom Charge, Shield Counter
Stone Dragon: Stone Dragon's Fury, Elder Mountain Hammer, Ancient Mountain Hammer
White Raven: Leading the Attack, Covering Strike, War Leader's Charge
Stances: Martial Spirit, Bolstering Voice, Aura of Perfect Order

Gaining Aura of Perfect Order early is excellent. This basically ensures he succeeds at whatever maneuver he is using, which can be devastating for opponents. He still has normal recovery, although he has access to 7th level maneuvers. Things start picking up soon once he gets access to his extra granted maneuver feat.


IL 19
Maneuvers Readied: 6(5)
Maneuvers Known: 12
Devoted Spirit: Shield Counter, Divine Surge (Greater), Castigating Strike, Strike of Righteous Vitality
Stone Dragon: Stone Dragon's Fury, Elder Mountain Hammer, Ancient Mountain Hammer
White Raven: Leading the Attack, Covering Strike, War Leader's Charge, White Raven Hammer, War Master's Charge
Stances: Martial Spirit, Bolstering Voice, Aura of Perfect Order, Immortal Fortitude

He can almost use any maneuver every round. Five of the six are available to him at the outset of combat, which is quite nice. This means every other round he has a refresh of maneuvers. At this point, Crud has an array of maneuvers to choose from that can deal damage or help with support. He has already reached 9th level maneuvers and has all his stances. This is probably the pinnacle for Crud. The only two things he is missing are a single point of BAB and his final extra granted maneuver feat. He is hitting above his weight now with 9th level maneuvers and the continued use of Aura of Perfect Order ensure they reach maximum effect. No 5% miss chance with a rolled “1” here.


IL 24
Maneuvers Readied: 7(7)
Maneuver's Known: 14
Devoted Spirit: Shield Counter, Divine Surge (Greater), Castigating Strike, Strike of Righteous Vitality
Stone Dragon: Elder Mountain Hammer, Ancient Mountain Hammer, Colossus Strike, Earthquake Strike, Mountain Tombstone Strike
White Raven: Leading the Attack, Covering Strike, War Leader's Charge, White Raven Hammer, War Master's Charge
Stances: Martial Spirit, Bolstering Voice, Aura of Perfect Order, Immortal Fortitude

Crud finally can use any maneuver every round guaranteed because he has all his readied maneuvers granted. This can be quite devastating with the highest level maneuvers.

[jdizzlean]

3. oh baby baby


If you all are with me...
Make some noise!!!

https://dw9to29mmj727.cloudfront.net/promo/2016/5897-SeriesHeaders_DMC_2000x800.jpg
from Detroit Metal City (https://www.viz.com/detroit-metal-city), original art by Kiminori Wakasugi, © Shueisha Inc. 2019



BABY
Sweetkiss1. Firre Eladrin
2. Doomspeak
3. Sublime Chord
4. Inspirational Boost
5. Improvisation
6. Harmonize
7. Lesser Celerity
8. Amplify
9. Celerity
10. Fugue
11. Protege
12. Epic Perform
13. Divine Insight
14. Bacchae
15. Corpse Creature
16. Sonorous Hum
17. Body Outside Body

BOOK OF EXALTED DEEDS
CHAMPIONS OF RUIN
COMPLETE ARCANE
SPELL COMPENDIUM
SPELL COMPENDIUM
RACES OF STONE
PLAYER'S HANDBOOK II
SPELL COMPENDIUM
PLAYER'S HANDBOOK II
SPELL COMPENDIUM
SPELL COMPENDIUM
SRD
SPELL COMPENDIUM
FIEND FOLIO
BOOK OF VILE DARKNESS
SPELL COMPENDIUM
COMPLETE ARCANE



BABY Sweetkiss
Male Firre Eladrin Bard 4 / Sublime Chord 1 / Mystic Theurge 5

Alignment: Chaotic Evil with (Chaotic) and (Good) subtypes
> Any effect that depends on alignment affects BABY as if he has a chaotic good alignment, no matter what his alignment actually is.

Elite Array: STR 8, DEX 10, CON 12, INT 14, WIS 13, CHA 15
Racial Adjustment: STR +10, DEX +4, CON +2, INT +6, WIS +6, CHA +8
HD Increase Adjustment: WIS +3 (@8/12/16), CHA +1 (@4)
Ability Score: STR 18 (+4), DEX 14 (+2), CON 14 (+2), INT 20 (+5), WIS 22 (+3), CHA 24 (+7)[/QUOTE]

CR
Class
BAB
Fort
Ref
Will
Skills
Feats
Special

10
Firre1 8HD
Medium Outsider
(Chaotic, Good, Eladrin, Extraplanar)
8
6
6
6
Balance 5cc, Bluff 11, Concentration 11, Disguise 11, Intimidate 11, Knowledge(Arcana) 5cc, Knowledge(Dungeoneering) 0.5cc, Knowledge(History) 5cc, Knowledge(Local) 0.5cc, Knowledge(Nature) 0.5cc, Knowledge(Religion) 5cc, Knowledge(thePlanes) 1, Perform(Oratory) 11, Perform(Sing) 11, Perform(StringInstruments) 11, Sense Motive 11, Spellcraft 11[/td]
+1CL, +1CL, +1CL
Gaze, Alternate Form, Magic Circle Againt Evil (CL11), Song, Spells (CL15, 12th level cleric, Chaos/Good/Fire/Magic Domain), SLA (CL13, at will, Detect Thoughts, Firebal, Greater Invisibility, Persistent Image, Polymorph, See Invisibility, Wall of Fire)

11
Bard 1
8
6
8
8
Bluff 12(+1), Concentration 12(+1), Disguise 12(+1), Listen 3, Knowledge(Religion) 6(+1), Perform(Sing) 12(+1), Spellcraft 12(+1), Tumble 1, Use Magic Device 1
Doomspeak2
Bardic Music, Bardic Knowledge, Countersong, Fascinate, Inspire Courage +1

12
Bard 2
9
6
9
9
Bluff 13(+1), Concentration 13(+1), Disguise 13(+1), Perform(Sing) 13(+1), Knowledge(Arcana) 11(+6), Spellcraft 13(+1)



13
Bard 3
10
7
9
9
Bluff 14(+1), Concentration 14(+1), Disguise 14(+1), Listen 9(+6), Perform(Sing) 14(+1), Spellcraft 14(+1)

Inspire Competence

14
Bard 4
11
7
10
10
Bluff 15(+1), Concentration 15(+1), Disguise 15(+1), Listen 15(+6), Perform(Sing) 15(+1), Spellcraft 15(+1)
Doomspeak


15
Mystic Theurge 1
11
7
10
12
Knowledge(Arcana) 13(+2), Sense Motive 16(+5)

+1 bard casting
+1 cleric casting

16
Mystic Theurge 2
12
7
10
13
Profession Astrologer 6, Sense Motive 17(+1)

+1 bard casting
+1 cleric casting

17
Mystic Theurge 3
12
8
10
13
Concentration 18(+3), Sense Motive 18(+1), Spellcraft 18(+3)
Doomspeak
+1 bard casting
+1 cleric casting

18
Sublime Chord3 1
12
8
10
15
Concentration 19(+1), Listen 19(+4), Perform(Sing) 19(+4)

Bardic Lore, Bardic Music

19
Mystic Theurge 4
13
8
10
16
Concentration 20(+1), Knowledge(Arcana) 15(+2), Sense Motive 20(+2), Spellcraft 20(+2)

+1 sublime chord casting
+1 cleric casting

20
Mystic Theurge 5
13
8
10
16
Concentration 21(+1), Perform(Sing) 21(+2cc), Sense Motive 21(+1), Spellcraft 21(+1)
Doomspeak
+1 sublime chord casting
+1 cleric casting

Cleric


CR
CL
0
1st
2nd
3rd
4th
5th
6th
7th
8th
9th

10
15
6
5+1
4+1
4+1
3+1
3+1
2+1
-
-
-

15
16
6
5+1
5+1
4+1
4+1
3+1
2+1
1+1
-
-

16
17
6
5+1
5+1
4+1
4+1
3+1
3+1
2+1
-
-

17
18
6
5+1
5+1
5+1
4+1
4+1
3+1
2+1
1+1
-

19
19
6
5+1
5+1
5+1
4+1
4+1
3+1
3+1
2+1
-

20
20
6
5+1
5+1
5+1
5+1
4+1
4+1
3+1
2+1
1+1


Bard + Sublime Chord


CR
CL
Spells Per Day
Spells Known


0
1st
2nd
3rd
4th
5th
6th
0
1st
2nd
3rd
4th
5th
6th


11
4
2
-
-
-
-
-
-
4
-
-
-
-
-
-
Message, Open/Close, Prestidigitation, Summon Instrument

12
5
3
0
-
-
-
-
-
5
2
-
-
-
-
-
Ghost Sound, Amplify, Inspirational Boost4

13
6
3
1
-
-
-
-
-
6
3
-
-
-
-
-
Lullaby, Improvisation5

14
7
3
2
0
-
-
-
-
6
3
2
-
-
-
-
Harmonize6, Lesser Celerity7

15
8
3
3
1
-
-
-
-
6
4
3
-
-
-
-
Glitterdust, Amplify8

16
9
3
3
2
-
-
-
-
6
4
3
-
-
-
-


17
10
3
3
2
0
-
-
-
6
4
4
2
-
-
-
Mirror Image, Good Hope, Haste

18
11
3
3
2
0
2
1
-
6
4
4
2
3
1
-
Celerity9, Fugue10, Shadow Conjuration, Teleport

19
12
3
3
2
0
2
2
-
6
4
4
2
4
2
-
Protege11, Mage's Private Sanctum

20
13
3
3
2
0
3
2
1
6
4
4
2
4
2
1
Contingency


Note: Caster Level above includes +3 CL increase by skipping the feats at 1st, 3rd, and 6th level.
Despite the unbearable pain threatening to overtake his consciousness, BABY Sweetkiss pushed himself to his feet and hobbled his way towards the trail of corpses near the river bank. It's been hours since his crowd got ambushed by a party of cunning murderers, but he's still holding out hope that he would find a fellow survivor.

Over here, Johan!, a voice murmured. He turned around, frantically searching for the source of the disembodied voice. Nobody there except some of his fans' lifeless bodies--Calia, Brevin the Blacksmith, Old Terek, Signy, and what little remained of Boris.

Pascorel has been annexed!, another echoed. The otherworldly voice's sudden disappearance made him realize just how alone he was for close to nine hours now, bereft of cheerful and lively noises to accompany him. Without warning, panic hit him. He felt a tightness in his chest that made breathing difficult. He felt closed in. All of a sudden, he's back in the crimson landscape, the nauseating stench of death, the deafening roaring and rumbling, the maddening nightmare of the Abyss.

"Over here, Johan!", signaled one of his allies as they fought back against the tide of fiends. His former self was that of a formidable warrior, an instrument of righteous destruction who inspires valiance in his fellow celestials. The first few years of ambitious campaign to rescue their kin in the Abyssal layer Androlynne had been fairly successful for the eladrin elites. A few more months passed, however, and it became clear that the initial spark of hope is but a faint light in the eternal reaches of darkness.

Pascorel has been annexed by the fiends. Hordes of tan'nari and ancient obyriths kept pouring into Androlynne like a rushing flood. For each eladrin returned to the safety of their native plane, plenty more have sacrificed their lives to make it so. Supplies and reinforcements sharply dwindle, and there's only so much resources to revive fallen comrades.

In the precious moments outside the battlefield, he traveled back to Arborea to tell families their spouse, child, parent, or sibling will not be coming back home. The look in some of these eyes reflected the pure anger and despair in the very atmosphere he left, especially with them knowing he himself had been given the privilege to stay alive. BABY Sweetkiss actually lost count on the number of times he had been raised because of his needed abilities, but one can only go through so much deaths. Last time, he remembered being captured, tortured for months for information, and the image of that balor driving its vorpal sword down his neck, and then nothing...

BABY Sweetkiss woke up covered in sweat. He instinctively cursed out in frustration, but this feeling was quickly replaced by relief as he noticed the light peek from the horizon. Divine energy can now be felt coursing back to his soul as he prayed. It's a new day to gather friends.BABY Sweetkiss doesn't have a "master plan", per se, rather he just wants to live a simple life of freedom. However, his past haunts him whenever he isn't drowned by lively and festive background noise for a long period of time, so he sought the company of people that are in a loud, festive mood 99% of the time. He finds it completely justified to "convert" more people from the general populace into Bacchae because, to him, that just translates to letting more people have fun. In return, he vows to protect his new friends and provide them with entertainment.

Due to the nature of this villain's "gimmick", it can be applied to different scales, from a tavern that doesn't close, to a city with missing people, to an entire kingdom neglecting its responsibility to its people.BABY Sweetkiss is an entertainer, first and foremost, who tries his best not to endanger his fans. To this end, he deceives, distracts, misdirects, pacifies, intimidates, and diplomances. His social skills, mainly his Epic Perform12, which unlike Diplomacy isn't restricted to NPCs, are fairly good and can be further boosted by spells such as Improvisation and Divine Insight13 when needed. More often than not, combat is avoided entirely by turning enemies to allies/fans.

In combat, BABY Sweetkiss will still try changing attitudes if possible. Failing that, he jams to Support Character's Greatest Hits: cleric spell list, bardic music, bard spell list, and wizard partial spell list. His preferred actions are debuffing enemies and buffing fans.Core to his character and playstyle is the integration of the Bacchae14, which comprise majority of his fans. Their lives basically revolve around frolicking and attacking most creatures who decline their invitations.

Calling and getting services from the Bacchae than from any other outsiders is easier for BABY Sweetkiss, as their goals lining up with what BABY Sweetkiss does best means he doesn't even necessarily need to pay them gold. BABY Sweetkiss can also get Bacchae via Summon Monster III-V and by his existing Bacchae forces converting normal populace. Dead Bacchae is still useful when raised via Create Undead as a Corpse Creature15.

Each Bacchae has Debauch (Su), so potential converts are up against a scaling amount of required saves to pass (1 per Bacchae), against abilities with a scaling DC (DC 10 + 1 per 3 Bacchae; DC 20 max). BABY Sweetkiss himself doesn't join debaucheries, and keeps himself busy by providing the best musical entertainment.

Lastly, while these Bacchae mobs will die to the weakest PC attacks, the PC party's goal should generally be rescue-based; that is, restoring the individual Bacchae to its former self by casting Heal, Limited Wish, Wish, or Miracle, on it, and then returning the person back to its family and friends.Depending on how much BABY Sweetkiss will be integrated on your own campaign, quests from this level range could include aiding him and/or his fellow eladrin in the Abyss. BABY Sweetkiss himself can be the quest giver in these quests.

Since the military campaign in Androlynne is primarily a rescue mission, PCs can contribute via scouting, infiltrating, intelligence gathering, and minor skirmish with demonic forces. Outside of a good knowledge check, this experience could also provide the PCs with better insight on how BABY Sweetkiss was before as a noble warrior, and how the failed campaign in the Abyss led him down to the path of an escapist who rely on loud music, habitual cursing, and the noise of the crowd, as coping mechanisms to drown out the memories of his past.BABY Sweetkiss has 6th-level cleric spells, unlimited inspire courage, countersong, fascinate, inspire competence, Detect Thoughts, Fireball, Wall of Fire, Polymorph, Greater Invisibility, and See Invisibility. Sonorous Hum16 provides concentration support. He protects his fans with standard cleric buffs, like Resist Energy, and debuffs like Dispel Magic against PCs.

Doomspeak: DC26 for a -10 penalty to attack rolls, skill checks, saves, and ability checks, making PCs less likely to resist Debauch and less likely to hit your fans. Divide and conquer can be implemented by focusing attacks or charm attempts on the Doomspeak victim.

Perform Modifier: 12 ranks + 2 MW instrument + 7 CHA + 2 per successful Aid Another from a fan + 15 when using Divine Insight. Easy DC40 turns Unfriendly to Helpful and Hostile to Friendly, and with enough aid from Bacchae DC50 turns Helpful to Fanatic and Hostile to Helpful.Inspirational Boost for better inspire courage, Improvisation for luck bonus to near anything (including Perform checks), and Harmonize to start Bardic Music effects (including Bardic feats) as a move action.

Doomspeak: Penalty is increased to -20, at DC29. Harmonize allows up to 2 attempts per round, resulting at best case in either 2 PCs having -20 penalty (i.e. half the party) or 1 PC having a -20 penalty and likely failing your standard action save-based offense in the same round. If warranted to seal victory, Lesser Celerity allows a 3rd attempt.

Perform Modifier: 15 ranks + 2 MW instrument + 7 CHA + 2 per successful Aid Another from a fan + 15 when using Divine Insight + 3 when using Improvisation.BABY Sweetkiss lags with 8th-level cleric spells and 3rd-level bard spells, but even low-levels buffs improve Bacchae's pathetic stats. Amplify significantly increases the range that people can hear him and thus be affected by his epic Perform checks.

Doomspeak: Penalty is increased to -30, at DC32. More spells aid in divide and conquer tactics, such as crowd control from Glitterdust and CL18 Word of Chaos spells.

Perform Modifier: 18 ranks + 2 MW instrument + 7 CHA + 2 per successful Aid Another from a fan + 15 when using Divine Insight + 5 when using Improvisation. DC50 is easy unaided.BABY Sweetkiss's finishes with 9th-level cleric spells and 6th-level bard/sorc spells. BABY Sweetkiss has new emergency button with Contingency (Celerity). He gets better action economy courtesy of Protege spell cast on a Bacchae, and, if needed, Miracle can emulate Body Outside Body17 to make 4 clones for spamming SLAs and Bardic Music effects.

Doomspeak: Penalty is increased to -40, at DC35. More divide and conquer tactics via Fugue debuffs and Shadow Conjuration BFC. Clones can also attempt Doomspeak.

Perform Modifier: 21 ranks + 2 MW instrument + 7 CHA + 2 per successful Aid Another from a fan + 15 when using Divine Insight + 6 when using Improvisation +2 when using Protege on a Bacchae. DC50 autosucceeds.

[jdizzlean]

4. I will Crit you until you die from it!



THE DECAPITATOR!

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_zgfkCtuYc4E/TExHUJo6kfI/AAAAAAAAAAM/BkdnhrhiDcs/s1600/razorboar.png
THE DECAPITATOR! (always all caps, always with an exclamation mark, no exceptions) is the creation of a slightly (slightly?) crazed epic druid. Finally driven to the point of insanity by a group of rowdy elementalist sorcerers from the nearby city who would not stop burning, freezing, melting, shattering, and disintegrating his forest whenever they got a little too much mead in them, he hatched his plan for revenge. Taking a young Razor Boar, he raised it exclusively on Psilocybin Mushrooms, human flesh and Quinoa (it's a superfood!). Growing to immense size and taught to hate humans and arcane magic, it developed a resistance to that very magic. Thus was THE DECAPITATOR! born. Sent out to protect the forest, he has since wandered far and wide, slaying any who would destroy the wilderness, abuse arcane magic, get near him when he was hungry, get near him when he was not hungry, or get anywhere within the radius of his fairly good spot or listen check. If you didn't notice, he's a jerk.

So just remember, if YOU decide to use THE DECAPITATOR! in your game....

HEADS

WILL

ROLL!

THE DECAPITATOR!



THE DECAPITATOR!
Spellwarped Advanced Razor Boar


Size/Type (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/intro.htm#sizeAndType):
Large (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/movementPositionAndDistance.htm#bigandLittleCreatu resInCombat) Magical Beast (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/typesSubtypes.htm#magicalBeastType)


Hit Dice (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/intro.htm#hitDice):

39d10+273 (487 hp)



Initiative (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/intro.htm#initiative):
+4



Speed (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/intro.htm#speed):
50 ft. (10 squares)


Armor Class (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/intro.htm#armorClass):
30 (-1 size, +4 Dex, +17 natural), touch 13, flat-footed (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/conditionSummary.htm#flatFooted) 26



Base Attack/Grapple (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/intro.htm#baseAttackGrapple):
+41/+61



Attack (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/intro.htm#attack):
Tusk slash +57 melee (1d8+16, 8-20)



Full Attack (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/intro.htm#fullAttack):
Tusk slash +57 melee (1d8+16, 8-20) and 2 hooves +52 melee (1d4+8)



Space/Reach (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/intro.htm#spaceReach):
10 ft./5 ft.


Special Attacks (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/intro.htm#specialAttacksAndSpecialQualities):
Trample (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#trample) 2d6+24, vorpal tusks (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/razorBoar.htm#vorpalTusks)



Special Qualities (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/intro.htm#specialAttacksAndSpecialQualities):
Damage reduction (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#damageReduction) 5/-, darkvision (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#darkvision) 60 ft., fast healing (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#fastHealing) 10,
low-light vision (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#lowLightVision), scent (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#scent), spell resistance (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#spellResistance) 50



Saves (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/intro.htm#saves):
Fort +28, Ref +25, Will +16



Abilities (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/intro.htm#abilities):
Str 42, Dex 18, Con 24, Int 6, Wis 16, Cha 6



Skills (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/intro.htm#skills):
Listen (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/listen.htm) +33, Spot (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/spot.htm) +33, Survival (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/survival.htm) +9, Jump +30



Feats (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/intro.htm#feats):

Improved Critical x 12



Environment (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/intro.htm#environment):

Wherever it wants to go



Organization (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/intro.htm#organization):
Solitary


Challenge Rating (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/intro.htm#challengeRating):
20



Treasure (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/intro.htm#treasure):
None


Alignment (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/intro.htm#alignment):
Always neutral










So yeah, he like, cuts your fricking head off on a roll of 8 or better. Unlike a Vorpal Sword which decapitates only on a 20, Vorpal Tusks Decapitate on a successful crit. His Attack bonus is 57 so he's pretty good at confirming.

He has Spell resistance of 50 so at least some casters will have a problem.

Did I mention he cuts your fricking head off?



THE DECAPITATOR!
Please note these are base saves cause I am way too lazy to figure it out at every level With the stat bumps. Full final save numbers in the stats above, this build is for CR 20 only otherwise why bother.



CR/HD
Class
Base Attack Bonus
Fort Save
Ref Save
Will Save
Skills
Feats
Class Features


10/15
Razor Boar
Base Creature
+17

+9
+9
+5
Skills

BAB +2
Improved Critical Strike x 4

Vorpal Tusks,Damage reduction (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#damageReduction) 5/-, darkvision (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#darkvision) 60 ft., fast healing (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#fastHealing) 10,
low-light vision (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#lowLightVision), scent (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#scent),



12/15

Spellwarped Template

+17

+11
+11
+6
Skills


SR 11+HD, Spell Absorption



13/18

Magical Beast
+20

+12
+12
+7
Skills
Improved Critical Strike

New Class Abilities


14/21

Magical Beast
+23

+14
+14
+8
Skills
Improved Critical Strike

New Class Abilities


15/24

Magical Beast
+26

+15
+15
+9
Skills
Improved Critical Strike

New Class Abilities


16/27

Magical Beast
+29

+17
+17
+10
Skills
Improved Critical Strike
New Class Abilities


17/30

Magical Beast
+32

+18
+18
+11
Skills
Improved Critical Strike

New Class Abilities


18/33

Magical Beast
+35

+20
+20
+12
Skills
Improved Critical Strike
New Class Abilities


19/36

Magical Beast
+38

+21
+21
+13
Skills
Improved Critical Strike
New Class Abilities


20/39
Magical Beast

+41

+21

+21

+13

Skills
Improved Critical Strike

New Class Abilities





The SRD (Razor Boar, Improving Monsters, Improved Critical)
MM 3 (Spellwarped)



THE DECAPITATOR!

[jdizzlean]

5. I always thought of elementals as sexless..


-=Jaas Kraal=-
http://i66.tinypic.com/34splqs.jpg


Male Lawful Evil Large Elemental (Air, Cold, Water)
Immoth Sorcerer 1/Paladin of Tyranny 2/Eldritch Knight 8
HD: 10d8+1d4+2d10+8d6+126 (216 hp)
Racial traits: fly 30 ft (perfect), swim 30 ft; +6 natural armor bonus; 2 claws 1d4+1d6 cold, tail slap 1d6+1d6 cold



Ability
Array
Racial
12 HD
16 HD
20 HD
Final


Str
8
+8
-
-
+1
17


Dex
10
+6
-
-
-
16


Con
14
+8
-
-
-
22


Int
12
+4
-
-
-
16


Wis
13
+2
-
+1
-
16


Cha
15
+10
+1
-
-
26






CR
Class
Base Attack Bonus
Fort Save
Ref Save
Will Save
Skill Ranks
Feats
Class Features


9
Elemental 10
+7
+7
+7
+3
Balance 5, Concentration 7, Hide 13, Listen 5, Spot 15, Tumble 5
1. Extra Spell (Boreal Wind); 3. Extra Spell (Cone of Cold); 6. Extra Spell (Gelid Blood); 9. Extra Spell (Ice Shape)
Cold subtype, DR 5/magic, elemental traits, ice runes, icewalking, immunities, poison, spells, SR 23


10
Sorcerer 1
+7
+7
+7
+5
Balance 5, Bluff 5, Concentration 7, Hide 13, Listen 5, Spot 15, Tumble 5
-
Summon familiar (penguin)


11
Paladin of Tyranny 1
+8
+9
+7
+5
Balance 5, Bluff 5, Concentration 12, Hide 13, Listen 5, Spot 15, Tumble 5
Extra Spell (Mass Fire Shield)
Aura of evil, detect good, smite good 1/day


12
Paladin of Tyranny 2
+9
+10
+7
+5
Balance 5, Bluff 5, Concentration 16, Hide 13, Listen 5, Sense Motive 1, Spot 15, Tumble 5
-
Divine grace, deadly touch


13
Eldritch Knight 1
+10
+12
+7
+5
Balance 5, Bluff 5, Concentration 17, Hide 13, Listen 5, Sense Motive 5, Spot 15, Tumble 5
-
Bonus feat (Improved Initiative)


14
Eldritch Knight 2
+11
+13
+7
+5
Balance 5, Bluff 5, Concentration 18, Hide 13, Listen 5, Sense Motive 10, Spot 15, Tumble 5
Extra Spell (Freezing Glance)
-


15
Eldritch Knight 3
+12
+13
+8
+6
Balance 5, Bluff 5, Concentration 19, Hide 13, Listen 5, Sense Motive 15, Spot 15, Tumble 5
-
-


16
Eldritch Knight 4
+13
+14
+8
+6
Balance 5, Bluff 5, Concentration 20, Hide 13, Listen 5, Sense Motive 20, Spot 15, Tumble 5
-
-


17
Eldritch Knight 5
+14
+14
+8
+6
Balance 5, Bluff 5, Concentration 21, Hide 13, Listen 5, Sense Motive 21, Spellcraft 3, Spot 15, Tumble 5
Extra Spell (Ice Castle)
-


18
Eldritch Knight 6
+15
+15
+9
+7
Balance 5, Bluff 5, Concentration 22, Hide 13, Listen 5, Sense Motive 22, Spellcraft 6, Spot 15, Tumble 5
-
-


19
Eldritch Knight 7
+16
+15
+9
+7
Balance 5, Bluff 5, Concentration 23, Hide 13, Listen 5, Sense Motive 23, Spellcraft 9, Spot 15, Tumble 5
-
-


20
Eldritch Knight 8
+17
+16
+9
+7
Balance 5, Bluff 5, Concentration 24, Hide 13, Listen 5, Sense Motive 24, Spellcraft 12, Spot 15, Tumble 5
Extra Spell (Fimbulwinter)
-




Spell Per Day (including bonus spells from Charisma):


CR
CL
0lvl
1st
2nd
3rd
4th
5th
6th
7th
8th
9th


9
12th
6
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+1)
5 (+1)
3 (+1)
-
-
-


10
13th
6
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+1)
6 (+1)
4 (+1)
-
-
-


11
13th
6
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+1)
4 (+1)
-
-
-


12
13th
6
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+1)
4 (+1)
-
-
-


13
13th
6
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+1)
4 (+1)
-
-
-


14
14th
6
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+1)
5 (+1)
3 (+1)
-
-


15
15th
6
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+1)
6 (+1)
4 (+1)
-
-


16
16th
6
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+1)
6 (+1)
3 (+1)
5 (+1)
-


17
17th
6
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+1)
6 (+1)
6 (+1)
4 (+1)
-


18
18th
6
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+1)
6 (+1)
6 (+1)
5 (+1)
3


19
19th
6
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+1)
6 (+1)
6 (+1)
6 (+1)
4


20
20th
6
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+2)
6 (+1)
6 (+1)
6 (+1)
6 (+1)
6



Spells Known:
0 - Arcane Mark, Caltrops, Detect Magic, Mage Hand, Message, Prestidigitation, Ray of Frost, Read Magic, Touch of Fatigue
1st - Blockade, Magic Missile, Expeditious Retreat, Mage Armor, Shield
2nd - Alter Self, Augment Familiar, Eagle's Splendor, Whispercast, Wings of Cover
3rd - Energy Aegis, Halt, Haste, Slow
4th - Assay Spell Resistance, Celerity, Ice Storm, Orb of Cold
5th - Arcane Fusion, Necrotic Skull Bomb, Swift Etherealness, Teleport; Boreal WindB, Cone of ColdB, Gelid BloodB, Ice ShapeB, Mass Fire Shield (cold version only)B
6th - Dispel Magic (Greater), Greater Energy Surge, True Seeing; Freezing GlanceB
7th - Forcecage, Limited Wish, Spell Turning; Ice CastleB
8th - Mind Blank, Polymorph Any Object, Shadow Evocation; FimbulwinterB
9th - Gate, Shades, Shapechange


Short version: Jaas Kraal is a full caster (Sorcerer 20), Cha to saves (PoT), hitting +16 BAB by CR 20, with all of the racial goodies that an Immoth gets.

Word of Waring for DMs: The Ice Rune ability is an example of 3.0 dysfunction at it's finest. As written, it only works for prepared spells, and so is useless for a creature with innate Sorcerer casting (unless they take a feat like Arcane Preparation). The intention seems to have been for it work with spontaneous spells. If allowed to work, this gives the creature the ability to cast up to 14 spells as a free action! For the sake of sanity, I would recommend changing this to allow it to work as a swift action instead. Even then, it's an extremely powerful ability.

As to the rest, I ran out of time - mea culpa. Have this instead:



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_qyK4A8mV7w&list=PLQwY60JdlLwQI17haxPI-j-vvR48u7HLr&index=5


CAr - Extra Spell
CM - Arcane Fusion
CoR - Necrotic Skull Bomb
CS - Blockade
Fr - Penguin familiar; spells (Boreal Wind, Fimbulwinter, Freezing Glance, Gelid Blood, Ice Castle, Ice Shape)
LoM - Whispercast
MM2 - Immoth
PHB2 - Celerity, Energy Aegis, Greater Energy Surge, Halt, Swift Etherealness
RotD - Wings of Cover
SC - Assay Spell Resistance, Augment Familiar, Caltrops, Mass Fire Shield, Orb of Cold
UA - Paladin of Tyranny (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#paladinofTyrannyClassF eatures)

[jdizzlean]

6. My, what big undead you have there

Zara Faertith

Drider Cleric 13

Drider gives Cleric casting, as well as the Evil and Trickery domains, as a "gift" from Lolth to her failures. Cleric levels advance that casting via Kiaransalee, who provides me with the Deathbound and Pride domains (the former with some slight handwaving on the DM's part).

Attributes (lvl 1): 17/12/18/18/21/16. All HD increases go into Wisdom.

While this contest tends not to take magic gear into account, I'll be operating on the assumption that the character possesses a set of Large Mithril Full Plate, a Large masterwork heavy steel shield, a Large masterwork Morningstar, and a Large masterwork Composite Shortbow (mighty 3), although only the shortbow is possessed prior to gaining cleric levels.. I'll also make some magic item recommendations here and there, but mostly they're not super-necessary for making the build work.



CR
Class
BAB
Fort
Ref
Will
Skill Ranks
Feats
Class Features


1
-









2
-









3
-









4
-









5
-









6
-









7
Drider
+4
+2
+2
+5
Climb +9
Concentration +9
K: Arcana +1
K: Dungeoneering +1
K: Local +1
K: Nature +1
K: Religion +4
K: The Planes +1
Listen +9
Spot +9
Corpsecrafter
Corpsecrafter
Corpsecrafter



8
Drider Cleric 1
+4
+4
+2
+7
Concentration +1
K: Religion +1
Listen +1
Spot +1

Aura (Chaotic Evil)
Domains
Spontaneous Inflict Casting
Rebuke Undead (6/day)


9
Drider Cleric 2
+5
+5
+2
+8
Concentration +1
K: Religion +1
Listen +1
Spot +1




10
Drider Cleric 3
+6
+5
+3
+8
Concentration +1
K: Religion +1
Listen +1
Spot +1
Corpsecrafter



11
Drider Cleric 4
+7
+6
+3
+9
Concentration +1
K: Religion +1
Listen +1
Spot +1




12
Drider Cleric 5
+7
+6
+3
+9
Concentration +1
K: Religion +1
Listen +1
Spot +1




13
Drider Cleric 6
+8
+7
+4
+10
Concentration +1
K: Religion +1
Listen +1
Spot +1
Corpsecrafter



14
Drider Cleric 7
+9
+7
+4
+10
Concentration +1
K: Religion +1
Listen +1
Spot +1




15
Drider Cleric 8
+10
+8
+4
+11
Concentration +1
K: Religion +1
Listen +1
Spot +1




16
Drider Cleric 9
+10
+8
+5
+11
Concentration +1
K: Religion +1
Listen +1
Spot +1
Corpsecrafter



17
Drider Cleric 10
+11
+9
+5
+12
Concentration +1
K: Religion +1
Listen +1
Spot +1




18
Drider Cleric 11
+12
+9
+5
+12
Concentration +1
K: Religion +1
Listen +1
Spot +1




19
Drider Cleric 12
+13
+10
+6
+13
Concentration +1
K: Religion +1
Listen +1
Spot +1
Corpsecrafter



20
Drider Cleric 13
+13
+10
+6
+13
Concentration +1
K: Religion +1
Listen +1
Spot +1





Cleric Spells per Day


Level
0th
1st
2nd
3rd
4th
5th
6th
7th
8th
9th


1st
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


2nd
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


3rd
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


4th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


5th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


6th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


7th
5
3+1
3+1
2+1
-
-
-
-
-
-


8th
6
4+1
3+1
2+1
1+1
-
-
-
-
-


9th
6
4+1
3+1
3+1
2+1
-
-
-
-
-


10th
6
4+1
4+1
3+1
2+1
1+1
-
-
-
-


11th
6
4+1
4+1
3+1
3+1
2+1
-
-
-
-


12th
6
5+1
4+1
4+1
3+1
2+1
1+1
-
-
-


13th
6
5+1
4+1
4+1
3+1
3+1
2+1
-
-
-


14th
6
5+1
5+1
4+1
4+1
3+1
2+1
1+1
-
-


15th
6
5+1
5+1
4+1
4+1
3+1
3+1
2+1
-
-


16th
6
5+1
5+1
5+1
4+1
4+1
3+1
2+1
1+1
-


17th
6
5+1
5+1
5+1
4+1
4+1
3+1
3+1
2+1
-


18th
6
5+1
5+1
5+1
5+1
4+1
4+1
3+1
2+1
1+1


19th
6
5+1
5+1
5+1
5+1
4+1
4+1
3+1
3+1
2+1


20th
6
5+1
5+1
5+1
5+1
5+1
4+1
4+1
3+1
3+1





Each undead you raise or create with any necromancy spell gains a +4 enhancement bonus to Strength and +2 hit points per Hit Die.


An enhancement bonus represents an increase in the sturdiness and/or effectiveness of armor or natural armor, or the effectiveness of a weapon, or a general bonus to an ability score. Multiple enhancement bonuses on the same object (in the case of armor and weapons), creature (in the case of natural armor), or ability score do not stack. Only the highest enhancement bonus applies. Since enhancement bonuses to armor or natural armor effectively increase the armor or natural armor's bonus to AC, they don't apply against touch attacks.


For the purposes of this round, all references of a feat not stacking or not applying to the same thing more than once are irrelevant.

...well then. Let's see what can be done with that.

Because it makes things nice and simple for me, I'll be making a snapshot and statblock outline for each level where you gain a new iteration of Corpsecrafter; this also quite neatly begins with CR 7. For each spell level, while the cleric list is vast and useful, I'll mostly stick to mentioning a few standouts that are either particularly useful or combo well with Zara's build and approach to combat.

"Legends in the Underdark tell of a dark elf spurned by Lolth, cursed with a twisted body and mind. They say she turned to darker powers, and unlocked secrets of necromancy never seen before or since. The corpses of her enemies became monstrous undead with the strength and vitality of ten men combined! Countless bodies littered the alter she erected to the drow goddess of undeath, and the stones ran with the blood of her fallen foes. Her fell powers overturned the common assumptions of undead warfare and shook the bones of the earth. Zara Faertith is a name that's gone down in history, and the mere possibility that the powers she wielded may resurface is the fuel of nightmares for many old enough to remember."

"You want proof? Then go! Go far from the cities where the dwarves and gnomes and drow hid from her wrath! Go, where the veins of onyx run so thick that the darkness of the Underdark grows yet deeper! Go, where the veins twist and turn as if mined by madmen who walked on the ceilings! Go, where the stone is still stained scarlet even hundreds years after her defeat! Go, where a pillar of bones remain fused in place, immovable even after all these years! Go, if you dare...and be ready for any minions that might still be lurking about..."

Zara Faertith
Large Aberration
Hit Dice: 6d8+24 (51 hp)
Initiative: +1
Speed: 20 ft, climb 10 ft
Armor Class: 16 (-1 size, +1 Dex, +6 natural), touch 10, flat-footed 15
Base Attack/Grapple: +4/+11
Attack: Morningstar +7 (2d6+3, x2) or Bite +7 (1d4+1 plus poison) or Shortbow +5 (1d8+3, x3)
Space/Reach: 10 ft/10 ft
Special Attacks: Spells, Spell-Like Abilities, Poison
Special Qualities: Darkvision 60 ft, spell resistance 17
Saves: Fort +6, Ref +3, Will +10
Abiities: Str 17, Dex 12, Con 18, Int 18, Wis 21, Cha 16
Skills: Climb +15, Concentration +13, Knowledge (Arcana) +5, Knowledge (Dungeoneering) +5, Knowledge (Local) +5, Knowledge (Nature) +5, Knowledge (Religion) +8, Knowledge (The Planes) +5, Listen +14, Spot +14
Feats: Corpsecrafter x 3
Environment: Underground
Organization: Solitary
Challenge Rating: 7
Treasure: Double Standard
Alignment: Chaotic Evil
Advancement: By class level
Level Adjustment: +4

At this point in her career, Zara is just a Drider with cleric casting, the elite array, and three iterations of the Corpsecrafter feat. Fortunately, she is already capable of pulling off this build's trick, since Animate Dead is a 3rd lvl spell for the cleric list. But first, we need a lair, a place to set up an alter-shrine to Kiaransalee where we have plentiful access to both onyx gems and dead bodies. My preference, as is made clear in the Background section, is to have a cave system in the Underdark that is relatively close to the surface but not really near any settlements above or below ground (but near some common trade routes perhaps). Once the place of worship has been sufficiently established, Zara can set aside two 2nd lvl slots a day for keeping Desecrate up 24/7, and can begin hunting for creatures to murder and animate; once she's got at least one Small or Medium humanoid-ish minion, she can have it ride her around and can deploy it to make her fights easier (since +12 Str and +8 HP/HD is going to let even super-weak 1 HD skeletons or 2 HD zombies punch way above their normal weight class), and she can collect more minions in this manner. 1st and 2nd lvl slots while hunting should focus around debuffs and healing if necessary, with 3rd lvl slots reserved for animation, but your superior stats should be enough to physically overwhelm a 1 HD wanderer and from there you've got a pretty solid melee beatstick to flank with.

Once she's got a solid fighting force under her control, she can start recruiting the fodder - slaughtering anybody she comes across and making them into particularly strong low-HD skeletons and zombies, and setting them loose out onto the world. This primary army is the dependable defenders and caretakers of the church (wherever she's set up her lair), and mining for onyx when she's resting and preparing spells, so that she's well-supplied for any animation she gets up to that day. Beyond that is going to be the animated masses - those she animates for her personal defense but can't directly control via the animation process, so she keeps them out of the important places by using tricky cave design so that she can travel by walls and ceilings but the super-undead can't get in at her. From there. On to the spell support:

Animate Dead: At this point in Zara's career, everything else is icing on the cake.

Blindsight: A solid self-buff that will make it much harder to sneak up on you or mess with your targeting.

Boneblade: This spell doesn't specify the size of the weapon created; if you end up making a Large or Huge minion that can wield weapons, like a Giant Skeleton, give this appropriately-sized weapon to them and watch them wreck face.

Corona Of Cold: This damage/debuff aura won't affect your skeletal minions, so feel free to wade into melee with them at your side.

Crown Of The Grave: Good when facing enemy necromancers or clerics trying to make your life difficult.

Dispel Magic: Just generally useful.

Favorable Sacrifice: This spell is a good way to buff up your primary force, or potentially a One Big Zombie if you go that route and have the prep time.

Footsteps Of The Divine: Before and especially after you don your armor, you're gonna be pretty slow and wanting to get into melee; casting and immediately ending this spell is a great way to get a nice boost for charging in.

Hand Of The Faithful: This is a good spell to protect your alter with, just make sure your undead minions are supplied with holy symbols (well, unholy symbols).

Hide From Undead: This is a good way to sneak past the uncontrolled masses when wall-crawling isn't feasible or preferable.

Magic Circle Against Good: A solid way to protect your allies from tricky enemy mages.

Magic Vestment: Good for turning your future armor and shield into more formidable defenses.

Meld Into Stone: A good way to get the drop on enemies not expecting you to be in the floor.

Nauseating Breath: An AoE debuff that won't affect your minions, solid fight start.

Portal Beacon: This spell isn't particularly useful, but because it doesn't target the people who get the information (and thus doesn't allow a Save or SR), it's a fun way to draw player attention to a particular portal as a way for Zara to tweak their noses on something or other. I'm sure you can think of fascinating ways to work this in if you put your mind to it.

Prayer: A buff spell that isn't a morale bonus, so it can boost your undead minions. Even better, it's an AoE, and penalizes enemies.

Sticks And Stones: A broken spell from Shining South, say it ain't so! This spell creates a skeleton for Corpsecrafter stacking, and it also gives out negative levels like a wight does. Now, it doesn't auto-wight them if they die from those negative levels (that's a separate wight ability), but "becoming a wight" is still what happens to things that die from negative levels, it just happens more slowly if those negative levels weren't caused by a wight - and the wight from those negative levels, unlike the spell's skeleton, is going to be permanent (although not super-strong, sad).

Stone Shape: Use this to remake your cave lair however you please, be it to make it more difficult for your uncontrolled minions to get to you, or to make it difficult for the PCs to get around.

Summon Undead III: I'm mentioning this spell line because while they're on-brand for Zara, they're not particularly effective for her (that is to say, no more effective than normal), because it's a Conjuration spell unaffected by Corpsecrafter. If you're the kind of DM who'd be willing to let that technicality slide and consider Summon Undead to be the kind of spell Corpsecrafter was supposed to apply to, this becomes much more powerful, but that's not the default state of the game so it's a bad assumption. This spell line is best used for gaining access to types of undead you can't create via the more standard animation spells - which, for this CR, is just Ghouls with SU3.

Unliving Weapon: Turn a small animal into a zombie. Turn that zombie into a living weapon. Order it to go pester somebody you don't like that you know is coming. Laugh at the thought of them getting blown up for picking fights with rotting pigeons and rats. Particularly at higher CRs when you're using Create (Greater) Undead more than Animate Dead, this is a wonderful way to screw over the PCs without Zara even having to be anywhere particularly close.

Venomfire: Use it on yourself to make your bite competitive.

Wave Of Grief: A solid AoE debuff that can't affect your minions.

"Day seventeen. At long last, my companions and I have located what we believe to have been the final resting place - indeed, the primary lair - of the powerful necromancer who enhanced undead beyond what was ever possible. I can only hope that I can fine some evidence of her notes still remaining, though given that she was rumored to be a mad drider priestess, the best I can hope for is the ramblings of a zealot written out as gospel, possibly some instructions buried in layers of rhetoric and metaphor. If nothing else, there may well be treasure remaining hidden somewhere in this complex, and the site is flush with onyx veins so we could mine it as long as we don't inform any historical societies..."

"Day nineteen. I'm starting to get a feel for the layout of this place, despite the initial confusion: if it helps, imagine it like a spider-web got wrapped around an hourglass, with rooms wherever the strands meet. Damn three-dimensional dungeon complexes...anyway, now that we're getting better at navigating, we're closing in one what I believe to be her personal chambers, her throne room, her alter, or possibly any two or all three in combination. It's quite secluded and difficult to reach, which has everybody excited for what we'll find. I count us fortunate that we haven't had to encounter any undead as of yet - while I'm sure we can handle whatever comes our way, I'd rather not risk the injury, or the additional pay for significant threats faced...

"Day twenty. It seems in the span of just a few minutes the priest we brought along saved my life thrice over. We found the throne room today, complete with the pillar of fused bones right in the center, with red stains in the bedrock, just like the old elf said. Everybody was rather unnerved - seasoned spelunkers and delvers all of them, but there's something about this place that just sets you on edge by default. Lots of dark magick has been done here, that's for sure...but that's when it found us. It was just a rat, like a million others we've seen exploring on our way here. But this one lunged at me from the shadows as soon as I approached the alter, and its tiny teeth tore right through my armor, enchantments and all! Everyone was so shocked, it started tearing into me for another few seconds; at some in that, I blacked out. I later learned the others managed to kill it, with the dwarf holy man striking the final blow, at which point it exploded on my chest and nearly killed me. The old dwarf spent the next few hours using magic and medicine to keep me from following the rat into death."

"There are no furnishings in here, or indeed much of anything besides the alter and several faded banners. This is the center of the entire complex, the very foundation of her power, and yet still we find nothing of her personal affects - no notes, no magic items, no onyx hoard, nothing but bones and dried blood and a godforsaken zombie rat. There must be more, there must be..."

Zara Faertith
Large Aberration
Hit Dice: 9d8+36 (76 hp)
Initiative: +1
Speed: 20 ft, climb 10 ft
Armor Class: 26 (-1 size, +1 Dex, +6 natural, +8 armor, +2 shield), touch 10, flat-footed 25
Base Attack/Grapple: +6/+13
Attack: Morningstar +9 (2d6+3, x2) or Bite +9 (1d4+1 plus poison) or Shortbow +7 (1d8+3, x3)
Full Attack: Morningstar +9/+4 (2d6+3, x2) or Shortbow +7/+2 (1d8+3, x3)
Space/Reach: 10 ft/10 ft
Special Attacks: Spells, Spell-Like Abilities, Poison
Special Qualities: Darkvision 60 ft, spell resistance 17
Saves: Fort +9, Ref +4, Will +13
Abiities: Str 17, Dex 12, Con 18, Int 18, Wis 21, Cha 16
Skills: Climb +15, Concentration +16, Knowledge (Arcana) +5, Knowledge (Dungeoneering) +5, Knowledge (Local) +5, Knowledge (Nature) +5, Knowledge (Religion) +11, Knowledge (The Planes) +5, Listen +17, Spot +17
Feats: Corpsecrafter x 4
Environment: Underground
Organization: Solitary
Challenge Rating: 10
Treasure: Double Standard
Alignment: Chaotic Evil
Advancement: By class level
Level Adjustment: +4

This is the sweet spot because those cleric levels just add so much: better weapon and armor proficiencies, a new iterative attack, a much better Fort and Will save, Rebuke undead, two new domains (particularly Pride, letting me reroll nat 1s on saves), and of course 4th and 5th level cleric spells.

Animate Legion: A good way to turn a nearby stack of bodies into a serious threat to the PCs, albeit temporarily. Good for making a quick escape deeper into the Underdark while they're busy fighting off undead and protecting innocents.

Divine Agility: A solid buff for any single big skeleton minion.

Divine Power: This makes Zara into more of a melee powerhouse, although her primary focus in that department should be her minions.

Fire In The Blood: Punish your enemies for hurting you, up to a potential 10d6 acid damage each (one could take 15d6, but then the spell ends).

Freedom Of Movement: A solid buff to have on-hand if Zara's not in her alter room.

Greater Magic Weapon: Hit 'em where it hurts.

Legion's Curse Of Petty Failing: No-save penalty to attack and saves for the whole party.

Mass Inflict {X} Wounds: I'm only mentioning these spells once, but it applies from here on out. This is a good way to heal your minions and hurt your enemies with a single action. The "Light" version isn't exactly the greatest thing in the world, but later when you get "Critical", you'll be affecting 16 targets for 4d8+16 damage/healing each, which is a much bigger deal.

Necrotic Skull Bomb: An AoE that gives your allies temp HP and your enemies negative levels. Fantastic, but don't use it in melee range.

Negative Energy Aura: A solid AoE damage/heal effect. Not the greatest thing in the world, but worth considering.

Plane Shift: Combine with Portal Beacon for nose-tweaking...or just use it to travel around the multiverse finding fun corpses.

Righteous Might: The other half of the typical Cleric Beatstick Combo.

Seed Of Undeath: On days when you have spare 4th lvl slots, find somebody weak and plot-relevant and use this spell on them in their sleep (so they don't know, and count as willing), then send an undead bird bomb to bother them when the PCs are talking with them about plot stuff.

Spell Resistance: Good for keeping enemy mages from screwing Zara or her One Big Minion over.

Summon Undead V: Use this to get a Shadow or Wight for a few rounds. Use that undead to make somebody else into a permanent spawn. Lose the temporary, control the permanent, and now you're ready to kick off a proper undead apocalypse. Shame they won't be super-strong though.

True Seeing: Most of your money should go to animation, but this isn't a bad investment.

Unhallow: Lots of fun options for making your alter room even better for allies or worse for enemies. Freedom Of Movement, Dispel Magic, Resist Energy, and Silence all seem pretty fun.

Wrack: Used against PCs, this spell can be effective but unfun. Use only if your players really deserve the chance to be helpless for the whole fight.

Yochlol Blessing: This is another buff for turning Zara into a melee threat, and it's also on-brand (in the drow sense, this time) and terrifying.

"Day twenty-two. Last night, we had given up exploring the room for possible hidden compartments or secret doors - accepting that if this place had secrets remaining after all these years, that they were beyond our ability to find. But this morning, I woke up with the most peculiar feeling, as if I had missed something and my subconscious mind knew it but couldn't articulate it. The others were convinced there's nothing but solid stone surrounding the chamber save for the tunnel leading in, but I wasn't so sure. I found myself drawn to a section of ceiling just above the alter, and after significant study found a barely-visible seam in the stonework. This was enough to convince the old priest to work his mojo and convince the stone to move out of our way. Behind it was a portal buried just deep enough beneath the rock to avoid magical detection, a portal that either to some extradimensional location or possibly even another plane entirely!"

"Inside is exactly the kind of things we've spent weeks searching for: an enormous lavish bed fitting for a powerful mage, several chests sealed by magic that no doubt contain treasures beyond our wildest dreams, a small library full of tomes written in her hand...and if there were any doubt, right in the center of the room, there's a stone statue of a drider labeled with her name and death date. We have found the final resting place of Zara Faertith, infamous necromancer, and with any luck I can decipher her notes and take my place among the greats."

Zara Faertith
Large Aberration
Hit Dice: 12d8+48 (102 hp)
Initiative: +1
Speed: 20 ft, climb 10 ft
Armor Class: 26 (-1 size, +1 Dex, +6 natural, +8 armor, +2 shield), touch 10, flat-footed 25
Base Attack/Grapple: +8/+15
Attack: Morningstar +11 (2d6+3, x2) or Bite +11 (1d4+1 plus poison) or Shortbow +9 (1d8+3, x3)
Full Attack: Morningstar +11/+6 (2d6+3, x2) or Shortbow +9/+4 (1d8+3, x3)
Space/Reach: 10 ft/10 ft
Special Attacks: Spells, Spell-Like Abilities, Poison
Special Qualities: Darkvision 60 ft, spell resistance 17
Saves: Fort +11, Ref +5, Will +16
Abiities: Str 17, Dex 12, Con 18, Int 18, Wis 22, Cha 16
Skills: Climb +15, Concentration +19, Knowledge (Arcana) +5, Knowledge (Dungeoneering) +5, Knowledge (Local) +5, Knowledge (Nature) +5, Knowledge (Religion) +14, Knowledge (The Planes) +5, Listen +21, Spot +21
Feats: Corpsecrafter x 5
Environment: Underground
Organization: Solitary
Challenge Rating: 13
Treasure: Double Standard
Alignment: Chaotic Evil
Advancement: By class level
Level Adjustment: +4

6th and 7th spells are now an option, and your Wis mod has improved.

Awaken Undead: Use this to make your mindless undead smarter (to be more tactical and not as screwed over by lots of anti-undead tactics) and more effective (by giving them Ex stuff back, and giving them feats). Probably one of the better uses here is giving hydra undead their Fast Healing back, which makes them even more of a damage sponge than they already were.

Blasphemy: Use this to seriously debuff the party starting out; it probably won't kill anybody important, but it'll give you a solid start in any head-to-head fight.

Create Undead: This is the other important spell you get at this CR, giving you the option of super-strong Ghouls/Ghasts (now) or Mummies/Mohrgs (later).

Desecrate Battlefield: useful for setting up a Desecrate that lasts much longer and is much bigger, giving you more room when fighting in your lair.

Evil Glare: Unless you're pretty focused on Zara's personal melee capabilities, this is a good way for her to help prolong fights: using her standard actions to force a save vs 1d8 rounds of Paralyzed. Of course, this is an unfun spell for PCs, so only use it if they deserve it, or if they should know what they're doing and should be prepared to face stuff like this and just weren't.

Greater Consumptive Field: This boosts your CL, your Str score, and your temp HP, and it combos fantastically with Animate Legion, the above Desecrate Battlefield, the below Greater Seed Of Undeath, and (later) Plague Of Undead.

Greater Dispel Magic: Always worth keeping in your back pocket.

Greater Seed Of Undeath: Fantastic way to turn a battlefield of corpses into permanent super-strong undead. Bonus points if they died from GCF and fueled Zara's strength too.

Leech Undeath: This is a good way for your ghouls and ghasts and Awakened Undead to help you not die prematurely in a fight. Besides, at this point they've got tons of extra HP from your Corpsecrafter stacking, they'll be fine probably.

Mass Spell Resistance: Yeah, you're gonna need this for protecting your honor guard for ******* wizards and clerics.

Pulse Of Hate: A friendly AoE damage-per-turn effect. It has a will save but it's not MA, so it's good that it's friendly. Damage isn't fantastic but you can put up with that.

Ravenous Darkness: An AoE that heals your minions, while blinding and damaging your enemies. Sweet.

Undeath After Death: This spell is optimal, a classic villain move, and the first thing anybody will think of when they see the corpsecrafter stacking: "there's gotta be some way for Zara to get those sweet bonuses". And yes, while most methods of becoming intelligent undead don't involve just a simple spell, this is one. The "Crypt Spawn" template is lackluster but serves our purposes, and if Zara thinks she's gonna die, this is a good way for her to turn her death into becoming More Powerful Than You Can Possibly Imagine because This Isn't Even My Final Form (you don't have to use either of those references in combination with this spell...but I'm just saying, you could). Important note, this template increases your CR and will give Zara a massive buff so it's either going to alter her CR at later showings or require her to get rezzed later to set things back to normal

Vigorous Circle: Another solid way of healing your allies during a fight.

Word Of Recall: Great for when you need to get away.

"Just as you requested, so have I done. The foolish boy was so eager to plunder Zara's tomb for his own gain, he didn't question my knowledge, and his companions were too incompetent to notice my stalking. After some prodding, they located her chambers and have begun the process of freeing the chains, just as you have foreseen. In a few days time, the blood moon will rise and the chains will loosen...and this time, there will be a sacrifice on hand to make her return permanent."

"Enclosed is all the information I have collected over three decades on the 'heroes' who trapped her in the first place, a copy of which is hidden within the supplies our sacrificial lamb purchased from me, that She may know of their trangressions as well. May her revenge bear the chill of the grave."

Zara Faertith
Large Aberration
Hit Dice: 15d8+60 (127 hp)
Initiative: +1
Speed: 20 ft, climb 10 ft
Armor Class: 26 (-1 size, +1 Dex, +6 natural, +8 armor, +2 shield), touch 10, flat-footed 25
Base Attack/Grapple: +10/+17
Attack: Morningstar +13 (2d6+3, x2) or Bite +13 (1d4+1 plus poison) or Shortbow +11 (1d8+3, x3)
Full Attack: Morningstar +13/+8 (2d6+3, x2) or Shortbow +11/+6 (1d8+3, x3)
Space/Reach: 10 ft/10 ft
Special Attacks: Spells, Spell-Like Abilities, Poison
Special Qualities: Darkvision 60 ft, spell resistance 17
Saves: Fort +12, Ref +6, Will +17
Abiities: Str 17, Dex 12, Con 18, Int 18, Wis 23, Cha 16
Skills: Climb +15, Concentration +22, Knowledge (Arcana) +5, Knowledge (Dungeoneering) +5, Knowledge (Local) +5, Knowledge (Nature) +5, Knowledge (Religion) +17, Knowledge (The Planes) +5, Listen +24, Spot +24
Feats: Corpsecrafter x 6
Environment: Underground
Organization: Solitary
Challenge Rating: 16
Treasure: Double Standard
Alignment: Chaotic Evil
Advancement: By class level
Level Adjustment: +4

Oh boy, 8th level spells! Now we're getting into some really fun options.

Bodak's Glare: An expensive SoD, so stack up the save penalties before using it, or use it on some helpless commoner. The end result will be a 9d12+84 HP, Str 37, self-propagating undead. Let him loose on the world to have fun.

General Of Undeath: Ways of increasing your total HD controlled is always welcome.

Unholy Aura: A solid buff to you and your minions.

"I-I-I have b-brought you these f-f-fod-der as...as a sacrifice! A sacrifice to your greatness. Please, I beseech you, spare this humble servant, that I may assist you in your rise!"

"Humble servant..."

"Yes! Of course! Your wish is my command, O lady of darkness!"

"Priestess."

"Yes! Yes, O priestess of...of..."

"Kiaransalee."

"..."

"Nothing more to say? Then you understand. That's good, very good...you're one step closer to being a proper servant. But don't worry, I know just how to fix that..."

Zara Faertith
Large Aberration
Hit Dice: 18d8+72 (153 hp)
Initiative: +1
Speed: 20 ft, climb 10 ft
Armor Class: 26 (-1 size, +1 Dex, +6 natural, +8 armor, +2 shield), touch 10, flat-footed 25
Base Attack/Grapple: +13/+20
Attack: Morningstar +16 (2d6+3, x2) or Bite +16 (1d4+1 plus poison) or Shortbow +14 (1d8+3, x3)
Full Attack: Morningstar +16/+11/+6 (2d6+3, x2) or Shortbow +14/+9/+4 (1d8+3, x3)
Space/Reach: 10 ft/10 ft
Special Attacks: Spells, Spell-Like Abilities, Poison
Special Qualities: Darkvision 60 ft, spell resistance 17
Saves: Fort +14, Ref +7, Will +20
Abiities: Str 17, Dex 12, Con 18, Int 18, Wis 24, Cha 16
Skills: Climb +15, Concentration +25, Knowledge (Arcana) +5, Knowledge (Dungeoneering) +5, Knowledge (Local) +5, Knowledge (Nature) +5, Knowledge (Religion) +20, Knowledge (The Planes) +5, Listen +28, Spot +28
Feats: Corpsecrafter x 7
Environment: Underground
Organization: Solitary
Challenge Rating: 19
Treasure: Double Standard
Alignment: Chaotic Evil
Advancement: By class level
Level Adjustment: +4

Wisdom has upgraded again, but more importantly, we have 9th level spells now.

Gate: ...yeah.

Miracle: ...yeah.

Plague Of Undead: This CR is named after this spell because this spell is fantastic for you. With that being said, this spell is basically identical to Animate Dead, with two major exceptions: one, it can affect corpses out to Close Range, which makes animating a permanent army easier, and two, it has a flat 100 gp material component cost regardless of the HD being animated. Greater Seed Of Undeath has similar advantages, but the range is a flat 40 ft, and the material cost is 5000 gp. This is much better and combos just as easily as that did with several other spells.

Very generally speaking, you wanna always be making skeletons unless you have a particular reason to want fleshy minions (such as wings for a flying mount). This is because skeleton has a higher pre-template HD limit, so it's gonna have access to better beatsticks with higher base stats...and also because where zombie gets more Str and HP which isn't a concern for you, skeleton gets more actions, better Dex, and higher Init, which is fantastic. Now, lets move past the general rules and onto what you're capable of animating and when!

Second general rule: you have an HD limit, not a CR limit, and CR and HD aren't quite so tightly tied. Higher CR means more HD (usually) and higher stats/better abilities, so the best animation targets are creatures that get very few HD per CR increase. Additionally, Skeletal Dragons and Zombie Dragons (both in the Draconomicon) are phenomenally better than the regular Skeleton/Zombie templates. So here's an approximate chain of command: dragons>outsiders>magical beasts>monstrous humanoids>animals>giants>everything else. However, because the stuff you create via Create Undead and its Greater version are stock creatures rather than templates, the above only really matters for Animate Dead, and when us CU or GCU, you should use whatever's plentiful (probably humanoids and animals).

In regards to outsiders, the zombie template stacks natural armor on top of existing NA, which can make for some surprisingly difficult to hit zombies. Unfortunately outsiders also tend to have lots of weird abilities that won't transfer over, so be wary about picking targets that aren't inherently beatsticks themselves. Beyond that, just work on minimizing what your targets lose - usually by finding targets with solid stats that are already basically beatsticks anyway, like most animals, magical beasts, or monstrous humanoids, or some dragons and outsiders.

Barghests and Hydras make good zombies (especially the latter when awakened), while most animals and dinosaurs make fantastic skeletons.

I've bolded some things about these templates that are rather different from the base templates, but here's something I can't bold because it's the absence of something from both of them: unlike the Skeleton and Zombie templates, Skeletal Dragon and Zombie Dragon have no HD limit for application. That alone would make these templates amazing for making a One Big Minion that goes right up to your animation/control limit, except it's even better:


Size and Type: The creature's type changes to undead. Do not recalculate the creature's base attack bonus, saves, or skill points. Size is unchanged.

...

Hit Dice: The base dragon's Hit Dice remain the same, but it loses any Constitution bonus to its hit points (see Abilities, below). However, a skeletal dragon gains bonus hit points equal to its HD.

...

Special Attacks: A skeletal dragon loses all supernatural and spell-like special attacks possessed by the base dragon. It retains any exceptional special attacks (such as frightful presence or improved grab).

...

Special Qualities: A skeletal dragon loses all supernatural and spell-like special qualities possessed by the base dragon. It retains any exceptional special qualities (such as immunities or blindsense). It loses any subtypes it had, though if the base dragon had any immunities based on its subtype (such as immunity to fire for the fire subtype), it keeps those immunities despite losing the subtype. It also gains additional special qualities as noted below.




Size and Type: The creature's type changes to undead, and it loses any subtypes it had in life. Do not recalculate the creature's base attack bonus, saves, or skill points. Size is unchanged.

...

Hit Dice: The base dragon's Hit Dice remain the same, but it loses any Constitution bonus to its hit points (see Abilities, below). However, a zombie dragon gains bonus hit points equal to twice its HD.

...

Special Attacks: A zombie dragon retains any exceptional special attacks of the base dragon (such as improved grab), except for special attacks with a save DC based on the base dragon's Charisma (such as frightful presence). It loses all supernatural and spell-like special attacks possessed by the base dragon, except for any breath weapon attack, which is altered as noted below.

...

Special Qualities: A zombie dragon loses all supernatural and spell-like special qualities possessed by the base dragon. It retains any exceptional special qualities (such as immunities or blindsense). It loses any subtypes it had, though if the base dragon had any immunities based on its subtype (such as immunity to fire for the fire subtype), it keeps those immunities despite losing the subtype. It also gains additional special qualities as noted below.

[jdizzlean]

7. This build is an improvement in progress...


Tephel - The Godclaw (Half Farspawn/Three Headed Leskylor Warshaper/Crusader)

https://images-wixmp-ed30a86b8c4ca887773594c2.wixmp.com/intermediary/f/1020f669-d2aa-48f9-90d0-673de1066ccc/d81xgr9-e12c6f84-fd59-463d-8faa-8f49adcf82eb.jpg

Elite Array: Str 15, Dex 12, Con 14, Int 8, Wis 10, Cha 13
(CR10)+Leskylor: Str 27, Dex 12, Con 24, Int 12, Wis 12, Cha 17
(CR12)+Half Farspawn: Str 29, Dex 14, Con 30, Int 12, Wis 16, Cha 19
(CR14)+Morphic Body, +1 from HD: Str 34, Dex 14, Con 34, Int 12, Wis 16, Cha 19
(CR16)+1 from HD: Str 34, Dex 14, Con 34, Int 12, Wis 16, Cha 20


Tephel served the heavens in a similar capacity to most Leskylors, a long range scout and defender of the spaces between the heavens and the far realm.

Unlike his brethren though, Tephel ventured too far, too curious about the protean darkness at the edge of his vision. The young Leskylor disappeared from his post, and wasn't seen there again for many a long century.

When he did return, it was as a champion of the Lords of Madness. Something in the Far-Realm had touched him, and forever changed him. Where once his three heads harmonised their praise of the creator, now they spout contradictory madness and curse in tongues that never were. Corrupted by the farspawn, Tephel was renamed the Godclaw, and still believes himself a holy warrior battling on the side of the heavens.



CR
Class
Base Attack Bonus
Fort Save
Ref Save
Will Save
Skills
Feats
Class Features


10
3-Headed Leskylor (10HD)
+9
+7
+7
+3
N/A
Improved Natural Attack (Bite 3d6), Improved Natural Attack (Bite 4d6), Improved Natural Attack (Claws 2d6), Improved Natural Attack (Claws 3d6)
+12 Natural Armour, Frost Breath, Improved Grab, Pounce, Rake, Spell Like Abilities, Darkvision 90ft, Immunity to Cold, Multiple Heads


12
Half-Farspawn
+0 (+9)
+0(+7)
+0(+7)
+0(+3)
Hide +10, Listen +10, Move Silently +10, Search +10, Spot +10, Swim +10, Concentration +6, Intimidate +6, Knowledge Religion +4


+3 Natural Armour, 2 tentacles (1d6, 10ft), True Strike, Spell Like Abilities, Blindsight 60ft, Immunity to Poison, Resist Acid+Electricity 10, DR 5/magic, SR 20, Change Shape, Magic Weapons


13
Warshaper 1 (11HD)
+0 (+9)
+2 (+9)
+0 (+7)
+0 (+3)
Concentration +3 (+9 total)

Morphic Immunities, Morphic Weapons, DR increases to 10/magic (Half-farspawn template)


14
Warshaper 2 (12HD)
+1 (+10)
+1 (+10)
+1 (+8)
+1 (+4)
Concentration +3 (+10 total)
Improved Natural Attack (Tentacles 1d8)
Morphic Body


15
Crusader 1 (13HD)
+1 (+11)
+2 (+12)
+0 (+8)
+0 (+4)
Concentration +1 (+11 total), Intimidate +4 (+10 total)

Maneuvers, Furious Counterstrike, Steely Resolve 5,


16
Crusader 2 (14HD)
+1 (+12)
+1 (+13)
+0 (+8)
+0 (+4)
Concentration +1 (+12), Intimidate +2 (+12), Knowledge Religion +2 (+6)
Improved Natural Attack (Tentacles 2d6)
Indomitable Soul,


17
Crusader 3 (15HD)
+1 (+13)
+0 (+13)
+1 (+9)
+1 (+5)
Concentration +1 (+13), Intimidate +1 (+13), Knowledge Religion +3 (+9)

Zealous Surge


18
Crusader 4 (16HD)
+1 (+14)
+1 (+14)
+0 (+9)
+0 (+5)
Concentration +1 (+14), Intimidate +1 (+14), Knowledge Religion +3 (+12)

Steely Resolve 10


19
Crusader 5 (17HD)
+1 (+15)
+0 (+14)
+0 (+9)
+0 (+5)
Concentration +1 (+15), Intimidate +1 (+15), Knowledge Religion +3 (+15)
Improved Natural Attack (Tentacles 3d6)



20
Crusader 6 (18HD)
+1 (+16)
+1 (15)
+1 (+10)
+1 (+6)
Concentration +1 (+16), Intimidate +1 (+16), Knowledge Religion +1 (+16), Sense Motive +2

Smite 1/day



CR15: Half-Farspawn, Three-headed, Leskylor Warshaper 2/Crusader 1
Large CE Outsider
HD: 11d10+2d8+154
Initiative: +2
Speed: 40ft, Fly 80ft (average)
Armor Class: 26(-1size+2Dex+15natural)
BAB/Grapple: +12/+22
Attack: Claw +23 (4d6+18)
Full Attack: 2 Claws + 23 (4d6+18), 3 Bites +18 (4d6+12), 2 Tentacles +18 (1d6+12)
Space/Reach: 10ft/10ft (20ft with tentacles)
Special Attacks: Frost Breath (3d6 damage DC26), Improved Grab, Pounce, Rake, Spell Like Abilities (1/day Blessed Sight, Cause Fear (DC13), Cure Moderate Wounds (dc14), Eyes of the Avoral, Hold Person (dc14), Obscuring Mist, Vision of Heaven, Touch of Idiocy (DC16), Stinking Cloud (DC17), Greater Invisibility, Telekinesis. 3/day blur, blink, Ethereal Jaunt), True Strike.
Special Qualities: Darkvision 90ft, Blindsight 60ft, Cold Immunity, Resistance Acid+Electricity 10, Multiple Heads, Poison Immunity, SR20, DR5/magic, Magic Weapons, Change Shape, Morphic Immunities, Morphic Weapons, Morphic Body, Furious Counterstrike, Steely Resolve 5, Maneuvers Known 5 (Stone Bones, Crusader’s Strike, Charging Minotaur, Vanguard Strike), Readied 5, Stances 1 Martial Spirit
Fort +24 Ref +10 Wil +7
Str 34, Dex 14, Con 34, Int 12, Wis 16, Cha 19
Skills: Hide +12, Listen +13, Move Silently +12, Search +11, Spot +13, Swim +22, Concentration +23, Intimidate +14 Knowledge Religion +5
Feats: Improved Natural Attack (Bite 3d6), Improved Natural Attack (Bite 4d6), Improved Natural Attack (Claws 2d6), Improved Natural Attack (Claws 3d6), Improved Natural Attack (Claws 4d6)


CR20: Half-Farspawn, Three-headed, Leskylor Warshaper 2/Crusader 6
Large CE Outsider
HD: 16d10+2d8+214
Initiative: +2
Speed: 40ft, Fly 80ft (average)
Armor Class: 26(-1size+2Dex+15natural)
BAB/Grapple: +17/+27
Attack: Claw +28 (8d6+18)
Full Attack: 2 Claws + 28 (8d6+18), 3 Bites +23 (4d6+12), 2 Tentacles +23 (1d6+12)
Space/Reach: 10ft/10ft (20ft with tentacles)
Special Attacks: Frost Breath (3d6 damage DC26), Improved Grab, Pounce, Rake, Spell Like Abilities (1/day Blessed Sight, Cause Fear (DC13), Cure Moderate Wounds (dc14), Eyes of the Avoral, Hold Person (dc14), Obscuring Mist, Vision of Heaven, Touch of Idiocy (DC17), Stinking Cloud (DC18), Greater Invisibility, Telekinesis, Scintillating Pattern (DC 23), Summon Monster IX. 3/day blur, blink, Ethereal Jaunt), True Strike.
Special Qualities: Darkvision 90ft, Blindsight 60ft, Cold Immunity, Resistance Acid+Electricity 10, Multiple Heads, Poison Immunity, SR20, DR5/magic, Magic Weapons, Change Shape, Morphic Immunities, Morphic Weapons, Morphic Body, Furious Counterstrike, Steely Resolve 5, Maneuvers Known 7 ((Lose Crusader’s Strike, Charging Minotaur) Stone Bones, Vanguard Strike, Bonecrusher, Defensive Rebuke, Overwhelming Mountain Strike, Divine Surge), Readied 5 Stances 2 Martial Spirit, Crushing Weight of the Mountain
Fort +24 Ref +10 Wil +7
Str 34, Dex 14, Con 34, Int 12, Wis 16, Cha 20
Skills: Hide +12, Listen +13, Move Silently +12, Search +11, Spot +13, Swim +22, Concentration +23, Intimidate +14 Knowledge Religion +5
Feats: Improved Natural Attack (Bite 3d6), Improved Natural Attack (Bite 4d6), Improved Natural Attack (Claws 2d6), Improved Natural Attack (Claws 3d6), Improved Natural Attack (Claws (4d6), Improved Natural Attack (Claws 6d6), Improved Natural Attack (Claws 8d6)


The Godclaw's tactics remain fairly static between CR15 and 20, preferring to open up any combat by targeting the biggest threat and pounce/raking them to death with 12d6 damage dealing claws. Natural flight and large number of natural attacks (some with reach), make the Godclaw extremely dangerous to engage up close, and its various SLAs and manoeuvres give it some flexibility if that doesn't work.
There's a few alternate builds of this that would still fit the fluff, and be possibly more effective. Splitting the Improved Natural Attack feats between the different weapons might give a bit better all round coverage. Also trading out some Crusader levels for additional Warshaper (for more natural attack goodies) or Paladin of Slaughter (for a second smite and Cha to saves) could work.



Tome of Battle: Crusader
Complete Warrior: Warshaper
Book of Exalted Deeds: Three-Headed Leskylor
Lords of Madness: Half-Farspawn Template

[jdizzlean]

8. this guy's gonna need a lot of breaks..


Igor the Fleshy

Lawful Evil Winged Incarnate Greater Stone Golem Crusader 1, Swordsage 1, Warblade 9.

https://img.buzzfeed.com/buzzfeed-static/static/enhanced/webdr02/2013/4/30/11/enhanced-buzz-8646-1367336329-3.jpg?downsize=800:*&output-format=auto&output-quality=auto




Martial Study (a total of 17 times over the course of 53 HD)
Level 1 Feat instead +1 BAB, due to nonexistant Initiator level.

All Maneuvers taken via Martial Study (all but 3 which go to the Warblades Progression are hence once per turn):

Distracting Ember, Mind over Body, Burning Brand, Crusaders Strike, Steel Wind, Flashing Sun Strike, Emerald Razor, Disrupting Blow, Moment of Alacrity, Charging Minotaur, Bonecrusher Strike, Fan the FLames, Searing Charge, Diamond Nightmare Blade,


Crusader: Revitalizing Strike, Entangling BLade, Castigating Strike, Strike of Righteous Vitality, Doom Charge.

Swordsage: Shadow Jaunt, Shadow JStride, Shadow Blink, One with Shadow, Five Shadow Creeping Ice Enervation Strike, Cloak of Deception

Warblade: Wall of Blades, Moment of the Perfect Mind, Actiopn before Thought., Greater Insightful Strike, Iron heart Surge, Time Stands Still,Avalanche of BLades, Adamantine Hurricane Strike.


Stances: Child of Shadow, Aura of perfect Order, Thicket of BLades, Stre4ngth of Stone.

All in all more than enough Options for any battle.







Igor, the Fleshy


Level
Base Attack Bonus
Fort Save
Ref Save
Will Save
Special


[tr]


CR 9: Winged Incarnated Greater Iron Golem,

+38/+33/+28/+23

+26

+14

+15
14 times Martial Study (See Maneuvers List), one +1 BAB (a t 1st HD)


Crusader 1

+39/+34/+29/+24

+28

+14

+15
Crusader Maneuvers, Fursious Counterstrike, Steely Resolve 5, 5 Manveurs, 1 Stance


Swordsage 1

+39/+34/+29/+24

+28

+16

+17
Quick to Act +1, Discipline Focus (WF), 6 Maneuvers, one Stance


Warblade 1

+40/+35/+30/+25

+30

+16

+17
Battle Clarity (Reflex Saves) Weapon Aptitude, 3 Maneuvers, one Stance, Martial Study


Warblade 2

+41/+36/+31/+26

+31

+16

+17
Uncanny Dodge, +1 M known


Warblade 3

+42/+37/+32/+27

+31

+17

+18
Battle Ardor (Crit Confirmation), +1 M known


Warblade 4

+43/+38/+33+28

+32

+17

+18
+1 M readied, +1 Stance, Martial Study


Warblade 5

+44/+39/+34/+29

+31

+17

+18
+1 M. known


Warblade 6

+45/+40/+35/+30

+32

+18

+19
Improved Uncanny Dodge


Warblade 7

+46/+41/+36/+31

+32

+18

+19
+1 M. Known, Martial Study


Warblade 8

+47/+42/+37/+32

+33

+18

+19



Warblade 9

+48/+43/+38/+33

+33

+19

+20
+1 M. Known,



Bonuses include Attributes.


Stats at Level 20: Strength 42, Dex 14, Con 14, Intelligence 14, Wisdom 16, Charisma 8.

HP: 366

AC (assuming regular +4 Plate):: 10+2 Dex -2 Size +9 natural +12 Armor equals minimum of 31, usually around 5 to 7 more given items, ergo 31-38.

Huge, Movement Speed 20 (40 ft good fly).

With a huge Pole Weapon he has 20ft reach and deals at least 4d6+4+22 damage per attack.










The Sweet Spot is CR 12, where he has 45 HD, massive amounts of Maneuvers, soem of the m recoverable, and insane amounts of HP and attack Bonuses given the opposition. At this jucntion, nothing but VERY well prepared Groups can beat him without being vastly overlevelled.

While he stays a valid threat until CR 20, this is where he truly shines.

Tactics: His maneuvers, Ability to fly, and insane amounts of resilience and Attack Bonuses make him close to the ideal "Bruiser".
Its hard to impossible to immobilize, Control or otherwise "Non HP Defeat" him, and he has lots and lots of HP.

Should he need to escape, he can teleport and hide as well.

In short: Aside from lacking Social Skills and not being a Caster, he ahs no weaknesses.

Try to terrify your group with him, its easy!










Once the Greater Stone Golem who should become Ior had a simple existance.

Obey. Guard. Exist.


Then one day, a rival of his Master and Creator SOMEHOW managed to circumvent the Golems Magic Immunity to Incarnate him. And in the Process also gave him Wings!

Igor was both elated about his new Freedom, and disgusted by his fleshy softness. Sadly, his master upon return did not recognize Igor and tried to kill him.

Igor, somehow now in possession of quite a few of the Secrets of the Nine Swords, managed to crush his unprepared Master, and escape before said masters contingency leveleled the Tower he used to work in.

Now without anything to guard, and truly disgusted with the fickleness of Wizards, Igor decided to wander the area in search of greater Power.

Being huge, musclebound, and strangely familiar with many techniques of the Sublime way already, he found 3 Martial masters willing to further educate him.

Sadly he did not find any more patience after his first had started his training, and in a fit of anger, crushed them.

Only when encountering the Epic Warblade Trubal Subharshar, also known as the Eternal Scourge, he found a Master worth following. Learning from him both better self Control and the true depths of law and Evil, he now serves him as the tallest Warblade on the Continent.

Woe to any thinking him a simple brute!




Sources: SRD, Tome of Battle, Savage Species.

[jdizzlean]

that's a good turnout, any judge out there willing to take a stab at this?

[Thurbane]

Nice work to everyone who got a build in. http://www.giantitp.com/forums/images/sand/icons/icon_thumbsup.png

Some very interesting stuff in here. Some people have used the contest specific rules in ways I would not have foreseen. :smallsmile:

Now, as always...what is often the biggest hurdle. Awaiting a judge...

[GrayDeath]

Wow, only one other Entry was something I thought about doing. Kudos for quite some creativity there!!

Great Variety too, even if more humorous in all than most Comps. ^^

[Unavenger]

So I was going to make a constructor with Boost Construct, but I couldn't justify why doing so was actually interesting beyond just spamming Astral Constructs until you're blue in the face - it just seemed not worth doing to make the entire build, when I knew it was "Shaper/Constructor with Boost Construct" and that was about all it did.

Similar hax with Greenbound Summoning struck me, but again I couldn't justify it as being anything particularly interesting beyond the one feat that I'd chosen.

[Hackulator]

So 2 things. One, any judges please be aware of the special rules for this challenge, not just the single feat that stacks even if rules say it doesn't but the bonuses you can get for skipping feats, which someone could reasonably forget about and might make a difference.

Second, given the fact that finding judges often seems to be difficult, have we ever considered having the entrants be the judges? They would simply not judge their own entry and would send judgement to the person running the competition who would then post all the judgements at the same time. If someone does not do their judgements by some defined time, no judgement of their character would be posted.

As to any response of "someone could do X to try to sway the competition in their favor" (ie judging everyone else real low because they're not judging their own) I would say that if someone needs to cheat to try to win an online monster building competition with no rewards, they clearly have some stuff going on in their life and maybe we should just let them have it.

[AvatarVecna]

So 2 things. One, any judges please be aware of the special rules for this challenge, not just the single feat that stacks even if rules say it doesn't but the bonuses you can get for skipping feats, which someone could reasonably forget about and might make a difference.

Second, given the fact that finding judges often seems to be difficult, have we ever considered having the entrants be the judges? They would simply not judge their own entry and would send judgement to the person running the competition who would then post all the judgements at the same time. If someone does not do their judgements by some defined time, no judgement of their character would be posted.

As to any response of "someone could do X to try to sway the competition in their favor" (ie judging everyone else real low because they're not judging their own) I would say that if someone needs to cheat to try to win an online monster building competition with no rewards, they clearly have some stuff going on in their life and maybe we should just let them have it.

I can't say I'm excited at the prospect of judging. Beyond the possibility of being unfair and voting builds lower than they probably deserve (intentionally or unconsciously), I'm kinda lazy.

[Hackulator]

I can't say I'm excited at the prospect of judging. Beyond the possibility of being unfair and voting builds lower than they probably deserve (intentionally or unconsciously), I'm kinda lazy.

Well as I said, you wouldn't judge your own entry, and then any shenanigans beyond that I discussed. As for laziness, well that's kind of why we have issues finding judges, except for someone who isn't in the contest it is far more reasonable for them to be "lazy" and not to want to go through the effort of judging for our enjoyment.

[Mike Miller]

A different competition used the method of all entrants are judges, no? Personally, I feel that method of judging should have been decided before starting the competition. I wouldn't have even considered making an entry as I know I don't have time for judging.

[AvatarVecna]

Well as I said, you wouldn't judge your own entry, and then any shenanigans beyond that I discussed. As for laziness, well that's kind of why we have issues finding judges, except for someone who isn't in the contest it is far more reasonable for them to be "lazy" and not to want to go through the effort of judging for our enjoyment.

Requiring me to judge everybody else's builds and re-judge based on things other judges point out (and contestants responding to judgements) if I wanna be allowed to not have wasted all that time building...does not inspire me to put a good deal of effort into my judgements. And I'm not talking about people intentionally sabotaging, just unintentionally giving others less credit than they deserve. Case in point, I saw something in one of the builds that legitimately annoys me rules-wise, but how much it matters for the purposes of this contest could be argued - and having a stake in the contest makes me untrusting of my own opinion on how much it matters. Am I objectively annoyed at an objectively important problem that makes that build run afoul of the premise of the general contest, or am I annoyed at a relatively small technical error that barely matters and I need to get over it?

Those things combined aren't exactly inspiring A+ judging in me. And that leads to debates on which judges should be counted and who's going to judge the judgements as fair or unfair and blah blah blah this gets easier if the judging is just double-blind like it is by default.

Additionally (and I realize there's problems with this change to the proposal), I'd actually be interested in seeing how people judged their own builds as well. It might give a better contrast for seeing how biased they ended up being if the scores they give themselves differ that much from other peoples, and it also would mean each contestant could have a chance to rant and whine about the things in their build that they're maybe not satisfied with, or that didn't quite work out the way they'd hoped going in.


A different competition used the method of all entrants are judges, no? Personally, I feel that method of judging should have been decided before starting the competition. I wouldn't have even considered making an entry as I know I don't have time for judging.

Seconded.

[ben-zayb]

Interesting feat choices up there.

In my case, I had a case of choice paralysis, as there are plenty of fun concepts that wouldn't be possible in normal rounds. First idea was utilizing Extraordinary Trapsmith to 100% reduce cost/time to create craptons of otherwise-weak mechanical traps out of nowhere in no time--except upon further reading of trapmaking, it would still have minimum cost (and thus minimum creation time).

Second idea was Involuntary Rage using Monk or Barbarian to gain ToughnessB, which at a certain point will let you gain hundreds more HP for every 50 damage you take. Problems were 1. consistently making the save for or being immune to massive damage, and 2. getting out-of-the-box usage of high STR/CON. Solution for the first leads to either being undead/construct with alternate form to gain CON score, getting Moment of Perfect Mind, or getting the Pride domain, while solution for the second leads to options such as Aeshkrau Illumian caster, LVL10 Dwarf Sorcerer substitution, or having access to the Sadism spell or extraordinary ability of the same.

Third idea was "Project Kronos", a neo-noir psiberpunkTM-flavored Changeling Egoist synergizing 12x Psicrystal Affinity feats and the Everchanging Psicrystal (Ex) from the LVL3 Changeling Egoist substitution. It's basically a versatile skill-gish that can switch specialization primarily via Everchanging Psicrystal (+36 skill bonus) and Metamorphosis, and plenty more tricks on its sleeve. Psychic Reformation to give each psicrystal its own x6 Psicrystal Affinity, use Feat Leech or Fusion to get your psicrystals' own psicrystals, Share Power to nest Vigor+Share Pain on your psicrystals, etc. Naturally, the psicrystals themselves are named after Saturn's moons.

Fourth idea was a Changeling Rogue 1 / Wizard 19 with Morphic Familiar and 6x Obtain Familiar. Less skill bonus than the 3rd idea, but more Share Spells option. Plus, gaining up to 6 familiars as you progress is a Pokemon reference just begging to be made.

[Thurbane]

Yeah, I'm also not a fan of having entrants judge other entries; although, at the end of the day, I would endorse it as an absolutely last option if no one came forward to judge after a few weeks...

[jdizzlean]

on one hand, having entrants judge each other is good as you're obviously familiar w/ the ingredient. on the other, everyone is pretty much predisposed to lean towards their own build subconsciously. plus, it's a ton of work just putting together a build most of the time, now multiply that by upwards of 10 entries depending on the round and it can get out of control.

i've said it before, but i'd much prefer in every comp, that people simply take turns judging rather than beg for one for weeks on end. it's much easier to just volunteer at the end of any given round for the next round sight unseen, then to have to resort to judging if you either don't like the ingredient, nor can do anything with it. plus, the chef's would know ahead of time what the judging criteria is and be able to cook appropriately.

we'll see what the next week or two brings.

[remetagross]

Alright guys I'll judge :)

This time, in order not to reiterate the mistakes of the past, I'll fully judge one entry before advancing to the next one.

[Hackulator]

Alright guys I'll judge :)

This time, in order not to reiterate the mistakes of the past, I'll fully judge one entry before advancing to the next one.

Cool, thanks for your time!

[Mike Miller]

Alright guys I'll judge :)

This time, in order not to reiterate the mistakes of the past, I'll fully judge one entry before advancing to the next one.

Thanks are in order!

[GrayDeath]

Thanks.

And yes, please do. You overworking yourself for weeks without the judging ovewrall improving is very much not what we want (its hard enough to find the time doing it the "normal" way anyway ^^).

[Thurbane]

Alright guys I'll judge :)

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/27/d8/76/27d876fd92b14093dcab38e7a1a0420a.jpg

[GrayDeath]

Yess, 2 Judges! :elan:

[Thurbane]

Yess, 2 Judges! :elan:

Remetagross, and who was the other? I may have missed it?

[remetagross]

Judging update: I'm halfway done :smallsmile:

[NontheistCleric]

Remetagross, and who was the other? I may have missed it?

Actually, I think he mistook you for a judge.

[weckar]

Oh boy, sad I missed this. Oh well, can still hand out popcorn.

[daremetoidareyo]

Oh boy, sad I missed this. Oh well, can still hand out popcorn.

Careful popcorn kills birds

[Hackulator]

Careful popcorn kills birds

So do these villains. Well, some of them.

[3SecondCultist]

Awww, now I am genuinely sad that I didn't try my hand at the Font of Inspiration Factotum build I was working on! I believe that the stub was Spell-Warped Changeling Rogue 1 / Factotum X, all the way to CR 20. It sounds boring, but when you consider all of the fun shenanigans you can effectively pull off with the sheer amount of Inspiration at your fingertips, it would have been a good time. There were also lots of cool story hooks in there, since the villain would have grown into a nearly imperceptible master manipulator. RAI for judge interpretation, but since Font of Inspiration already stacks with itself in a unique way, I wonder how the interaction would have worked for the contest...

My other ideas were simply playing a natural pounce monster (maybe an Awakened Fleshraker) Warshaper and stacking a whole bunch of Improved Natural Weapon onto its dozens of claws for absolutely tons of damage, and playing a Changeling Egoist and taking Metamorphic Transfer each time. Neither of those were as interesting to me, though.

[AvatarVecna]

Oh man, had so many dumb ideas for this. Factotum 20/FoI was an obvious if simple one that I rejected cuz any way of taking advantage of the self-stacking contest rules ended up with more inspiration than I could ever reasonably spend. Here's a few other builds I ended up rejecting...

Human Monk 1 (Overwhelming Attack)/Humanoid HD 76. The feat: Roundabout Kick.


If you score a critical hit on an unarmed attack, you can immediately make an additional unarmed attack against the same opponent, using the same attack bonus that you used for the critical hit roll. For example, Ember the 15th-level monk can make three unarmed attacks in a round, at base attack bonuses of+11, +6, and +1. If she scores a critical hit on her second attack, she can make an additional attack using her +6 base attack bonus. She then makes her third attack (at +l) as normal.

This was a silly idea that was more or less turning the "flurry of misses" complaint about monks into an actual strategy. The build gets both pre-req feats as Bonus feats from Monk 1 and can start with Str 15/Con 14, which means every HD feat and the human feat can be Roundabout Kick (and all your stat increases can be Str cuz why not). Just make sure to get a Necklace Of Natural Weapons with Impact and Speed as quickly as you can (so, CR 8 and 15 respectively, but more likely at CR 10/17) and maybe a Monk's Belt, or friendly allies who can buff your fists for lots of stuff.

The basic idea here is that every round, you flail your little heart out making as many attacks as you possibly can. Most of them will probably miss, but that doesn't matter because - since we can only benefit from Unarmed Strike or Power Attack for prereq purposes - we're only dealing 1d6+Str nonlethal per attack anyway. No, the goal here is to spam so much that we roll crits often, and every crit explodes into more attacks, which can explode into more attacks as your level increases. Have a chart that assumes no items or buff spells:



CR
HP
Atk
Dmg (NL)
RKs


1
6
+0/+0
1d6+2
1


2
32
+4/+4
1d6+3
2


3
58
+7/+7/+2
1d6+3
4


4
84
+11/+11/+6
1d6+4
5


5
110
+14/+14/+9/+4
1d6+4
6


6
136
+19/+19/+14/+9
1d6+5
8


7
162
+21/+21/+16/+11
1d6+5
9


8
188
+24/+24/+19/+14
1d6+6
10


9
214
+26/+26/+21/+16
1d6+6
12


10
240
+29/+29/+24/+19
1d6+7
13


11
266
+31/+31/+26/+21
1d6+7
14


12
292
+34/+34/+29/+24
1d6+8
16


13
318
+36/+36/+31/+26
1d6+8
17


14
344
+39/+39/+34/+29
1d6+9
18


15
370
+41/+41/+36/+31
1d6+9
20


16
396
+44/+44/+39/+34
1d6+10
21


17
422
+46/+46/+41/+36
1d6+10
22


18
448
+49/+49/+44/+39
1d6+11
24


19
474
+51/+51/+46/+41
1d6+11
25


20
500
+54/+54/+49/+44
1d6+12
26



The end result is a pile of hit points who could really use some buffs (allies, spells, items) so that he's actually good at anything. I mean, even with some solid spell support, he's not gonna be great at unarmed combat. He's got a great attack routine, but his damage is always going to be mediocre...unless this particular round of flailing happens to include a crit, in which case his DPR skyrockets and he either has a really good chance of knocking the PCs out quickly (at low levels), or is basically guaranteed to knock any PC in melee range unconscious (at higher levels). But if you can pick up immunity to nonlethal damage, or immunity to crits and decent DR, he just straight-up won't be able to take you out with nonlethal damage, and that's the only thing he's got going for him.

I ended up ditching this build because it turned into a giant balancing act trying to find a way to make him a consistent melee threat from the low levels without utterly gimping him against the kind of tactics that show up in the end-game, and most of that involved around getting more class levels - becoming a Monk/Cleric/Sacred Fist in order to give him spell support at the cost of having far fewer iterations of Roundabout Kick...and what's more, making what was already a simplistic "Chuck Norris meme" build into kung-fu super-Jesus was getting a bit too much, even for me.

Aasimar Cleric X. The feat: Infernal Bargainer.


Whenever you cast commune, contact other plane, legend lore, or vision, you gain +2 caster level because you are known to the entities answering your entreaties. Whenever you cast any planar binding or planar ally spell, you can call an evil creature 2 HD higher than normally allowed. Any evil creature caught in a planar binding trap you create has a -2 penalty on all attempts to escape.

...yeah. That's up to 12 HD for Lesser Planar Ally at CR 7, up to 20/22 HD for Planar Ally at CR 11/12, and up to 30/32 HD with Greater Planar Ally at CR 15/18. I could summon an Arcanaloth (https://www.realmshelps.net/monsters/block/Arcanaloth) when I'm CR 7, summon a Balor or a Pit Fiend or Zargon The Returner when I'm CR 12. I could summon an abomination, another elder evil, any Demon Lord, or an aspect of basically any Archdevil at CR 15 (and I can summon the remaining aspect, Asmodeus, at CR 18).

"What if you forget to summon it into a trap, it won't do the villain's bidding then!" Ignoring for a moment that Planar Ally is your deity sending you a friend to help out...yeah, it's a possible way to interpret the narrative, even in a "summoning help from a higher power" - a high priest offering up their own life for a great servant of the deity to kick these scrub's asses is also fun. And in a story where the dumb/fanatic summoner reaches to make a deal with an evil planar being beyond their ability to control, what generally happens next is the evil planar being destroys the summoner and starts fulfilling their own plans without the fragile mortal holding them back anymore, which is oftentimes far far worse for the heroes than if they'd merely had to fight a full caster with a couple levels on them. :smalltongue: And of course, the more powerful the original caster was, the more proportionally powerful the summon is going to be. Case in point: the plot of Hordes Of The Underdark, where a high-level drow caster binds Mephistopheles, and it almost up-ends the entire planar cosmology, multiple times, kind of by accident and then mostly on purpose.

...so why didn't I do this? The answer is kinda obvious if you think about it: this is supposed to be about the villain I make. It wouldn't matter if I wrote a 200 page backstory for my villain explaining how they've wormed their way into the planar cosmology, because the second the called forth an elder evil, or an abomination, or a demon lord, or an archdevil aspect, they are no longer the real villain here. And my entry essentially playing second fiddle to their own summon not just in combat but in the scope of their plans overall is...not ideal.

Human Cleric 5/Divine Oracle 10/Cleric +5. The feat: Skill Focus (Knowledge: Religion).

...so, this one is pretty simple in why it's a versatile and powerful build:

1) It's a core full caster 1-20 build, which has spell/domain support in basically every splat ever.

2) It gets to really break the sacrifice rules from BoVD.

The ability to attempt multiple sacrifices per day to get the best possible sacrifice reward once per day, we can probably assume "taking 20". This lets us summon a Planar Ally for 1 hour per HD of the sacrifice at CR 1 without any other modifiers on the check (and thus, greater rewards easily within reach). By CR 6, we're regularly getting a Limited Wish every day without much effort, and can bust out a Greater Planar Ally if we need to. By CR 12, the gods will grant us a Wish for a fairly mundane sacrifice.

If any of my builds were going to take one of the alternative feat options offered by the contest rules, this would be it just so I could delay the above effects by a half-dozen levels or something - probably take the CL increase for stronger casting in general, with super-sacrifice in my back pocket if I need it.

This one was ditched mostly because leaning on the broken sacrifice rules felt kinda cheap, and more to the point Skill Focus felt like a boring feat to highlight with these contest rules.

[remetagross]

Wow AvatarVecna you come up with some crazy stuff. That Monk 1/Humanoid 79 is hilariously borked :smallbiggrin:

Only one build left, guys. I'll finish and post all of this by tomorrow evening :smallsmile:

[jdizzlean]

i didn't think you could really abuse skill focus at all, (beyond trying to do the epic escape artist thing that's been done to death aka arseplomancer) but that's hillarious.

[remetagross]

Alright folks, here we go:


As the trope says, Ninja Pirate Robot Zombies (https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/NinjaPirateZombieRobot) are awesome, though well-trodden, and the Captain abides by this trope. I’d say that’s a so-so for the fluff. Mechanically, the feat chosen is quite surprising, as it, at first look, appears very bland within the confines of this competition. But you did make that choice, and made it shine as shown in the Power section. All in all, I raised an eyebrow here and there, but was not blown out of the water (heh) by your audacity.
It appears you did not use the updated Paragon Creature template that can be found in the SRD. This last one is up to date with 3.5, while the one in the Epic Level Handbook is still 3.0, and as such superseded. This is important, because while the one in the ELH did at 12 to the CR of a creature of at least 16 HDs, the one in the SRD add a flat 15. As such, the Drowned Captain reaches a CR of 23, and is an illegal entry. Sorry lad, but this has to be a 0.

Apart from this, some minor nitpicks: you did not use the Elite array to generate the ability scores of the Captain, and just took the base ability scores right off the bat from MMIII. This means the Captain’s ability scores are slightly lower than what they should be. You put down its Ref save to be +6 at CR 8, but it should be +7. At CR 20, you didn’t add the +10 bonus to saves, and you gave two bonus feats (instead of one as per the 3.5 version of the template) to the Captain. Since the Captain has not gained any HDs from the template, and since by default Int boni do not retroactively give more skill points, the Captain cannot buy these extra skills at CR 20.
You picked a famously powerful monster for the base. However, tour choice of feats at CR 8 cleverly makes the Captain an even more threatening opponent than a run-of-the-mill Drowned is, because its HPs soar from 150 to 250, making it extra durable. Because of the Drowning Aura, extra durability means extra Con checks for the PCs. Excellent choice here! Though I have to wonder why you picked these 2 points of BAB rather than more Improved Toughnesses.

At CR 20, the Cap is a really tough nut to crack, be it on the HP front, when it comes to saves, SR, and his AC is respectable as well. Add Fast Healing to that. On the offensive side, Drowning Aura is an interesting ability in that it is not one to which a party of high-level PCs will have a counter for in its routine session of buffs. Two things here. Either the PCs are caught off-guard by the Captain, maybe because it used its WBL (good catch on it, by the way; I noticed the usual Drowned has none) to buy some anti-divining stuff. Then, on the off chance a PC has some water-breathing item, 3/day targeted Greater Dispel Magic can shut that down for 1d4 rounds, which might be long enough to outright incapacitate said PC. The great speed of the Captain allows it to put itself to the middle of the party in one turn. And a DC 23 Con check is such a difficult check to achieve that the integrity of the party is likely screwed. Especially because even a single failed check is enough to put someone inconscious. This somewhat mitigates its lack of flight, since the PCs will not even get the chance to flee or fly past it if they fail even once.

On the other hand, if the PCs are aware of what’s in store, or if they encounter the Captain for the second time, then the Captain is utterly powerless. His CL 15 GDM is not likely to get rid of a simpe CL 20+ Water Breathing spell. In that case, its bulkiness serves little purpose. All in all, a devastating encounter at CR 8, and a toss-up between a dangerous fight and an easily bypassed obstacle at CR 20.
As the trope says, Ninja Pirate robot Zombies are well-trodden, though awesome, and the Captain abides by this trope. The players will probably chuckle when they first encounter it, if for the sheer bravado of the DM that actually invokes this trope on them. They will most likely stop chuckling and start cursing after the first few Con checks start coming. Once the Captain is behind them, they’ll most likely remember the evil bastard, clearly a Monster of the Week, for that more than for its swagger. I’d say it’s a middle ground here.


Seeing a single base class from levels 1 to 20 is something one sees less often than not on this comp. Crusader is reasonably well-trodden terrain, but the trick you used surprised me, in using not only the focus feat, but also the +1 IL, both in a very clever way. You pulled off a not idiot Idiot Crusader. This way of using the focus feat, by accomplishing a specific goal with a limited number of iterations needed, instead of simply stacking numbers on top of numbers, has me nod appreciatively.
All in all, not slack-jawing, but not yawn-jawing either.
For your future participations, please indicate which maneuver was gained at which level, it currently is quite a pain to try and make that out myself 😉 .
There are no skills listed. The absence of a table also makes it more difficult to picture the saves, especially since they’re not simply what can be read on the Crusader table: one must add ability modifiers. I would have liked a table, for this as well as for better understanding when each maneuver is acquired.
Besides all this, the build is clean and simple. One base class taken up to level 20, no fuss.
First off, what seem to me strange choices of maneuvers. Stone Hammer is almost always preferrable to Stone Dragon’s Fury, given that the latter does not ignore hardness, and that the former also negate damage reduction. Castigating Strike asks for a Cha-based save DC, which seems odd given Crud’s Cha of 6. A maneuver like Order Forged from Chaos, to take advantage of these move actions you don’t know what to do with when you’re already in melee and using a standard action maneuver, would have been in my opinion a better choice.

Now, that said, Crud is a very good beatstick. He has far less sheer power than the typical bruiser from the MM that packs twice as much HD as its CR, with high ability scores to boot. He more than counters this by his added versatility. Being able to use Heal or deal 2d6 points of Con damage every turn is a darn powerful ability, as is inflicting an extra 12d6 damage at CR 10 while rolling an 11 on the attack roll for sure.

But Crud can only do one of these at a time. Crusaders need squishy casters to defend and to shore up their weaknesses. It would have been a good idea to summarily describe ho Crud might interact with a retinue of mooks assisting him, or assisting himself a warlord of some sort. As is, I am left to imagine how Crud might overcome his really poor AC and saves (what with that negative Cha mod preventing him from benefitting from Indomitable Soul. If you wanted to pick Half-Orc over Human for a little more origiality here, you might have preferred something along a Desert Half-Orc, with no Cha penalty, and choosing not to take the associated Run bonus feat as per the chairman’s stipulations), his lack of abilities in the way of detection, social interactions or most anything skill-related (a minor offense given thee non-skill focus of the villain, but still a net loss compared to a villain that invested a little in Sense Motive so as not to let the PCs bamboozle their way past the fight), his poor mobility. As far as ToB-using bruisers go, Crud fares OK but is not top-notch.
Well, there isn’t much in the way of fleshing out that would allow the PCs to picture Crud as something more than a stab-happy Half-Orc. His particular trick might raise the eyebrows of the players most versed in the intricacies of ToB, but it is not likely to reach further than that.


A rocker/band leader/metal player villain is a reasonably well-trodden trope that, while one does not see one every other day, it does not have me wow when I see one. A rocker accompanied by by-the-book mooks that perfectly fit the trope is something more! More specifically, I have never encountered the spell Protégé earlier, and it works well here. Doomspeak was an excellent choice for the focus feat, as it is both thematic and very effective when stacked with itself.

The backstory was nice, connecting him to an existing anecdote about Eladrins in the Abyss helps justify his weird occupation (for a Celestial) in a way that is more “this dude loves music but is evil!”
On the other hand, going the Sublime Chord route is far from unseen, as is the majority of the spell routine you picked for your Bard spell known nor is picking one of these monsters with racial casting and tack some more on the top. You come out slighlty above the average here.
I’m seeing the CL increase you picked thrice affect both your SLA’s CL and your Cleric/Bard CL. I have to admit that the way the Chairman worded the bonus is generic enough that it'd allow for that...alright. You also picked Amplify as a spell known twice.
I’m counting 133 skill points spent at CR 8, while BABY is eligible to (8+5)*(8+3)=143 skill points. No penalty here, just too bad. I appreciate the effort you put in formatting the skill points, it always is appreciated 🙂 . I think your logic for bolding certain skills has been lost at some point, though. And we have the obnoxious 6 ranks in Profession (Astrologer), heh. I wonder if there’s a single Astrologer out there that has more than 6 ranks, or if each and everyone of them is planning to become or is currently a Sublime Chord ^^.
You did not add the ability modifiers to the relevant saves on your table, it’s no big deal but it would have made things easier to parse.

Your build features the ever popular Sublime Chord dip before picking a casting-advancing PrC, mixing that up with Mystic Theurge. While this could have docked you some points for being a clunky and powergrabbing combination, it actually meshes very well with the fluff of the Firre, both for the Bard and the divine casting part, so well done here!
Neat source formatting too.
I’m not understanding where that line about any effect depending on alignment considers BABY to be Chaotic Good is coming from.

Mystic Theurge adds a “level of existing divine spellcasting class”. BABY Sweetkiss has none; which means that, while he perfectly qualifies for Mystic Theurge, his racial Cleric spellcasting is not advanced by the PrC. What you should have done is to first take a level of Cleric (which would have granted a buff in saves, and two domain powers, so not a bad dip), whose casting stacks with your racial casting, and then Mystic Theurge would have applied to that casting. This means losing access to one level of Sublime Chord casting, including 6th level spells. As such, this error is not insignificant. Though this is the sole offender, it is a meaningful one. Since it can be fixed relatively harmlessly, I won’t qualify this as flat-out illegal.
For one, I appreciate you mentioned potential minions in the form of the Bacchae (rather nice monsters, by the way). I do not compute their own power in your Power score (meaning their Debauch ability brings no points to you), but I do appreciate having a clear example of how exactly BABY could use his supporting abilities.
Doomspeak is the first time I see a save-based ability for which the save DC is based on your full character level, rather than half of it. Well done for tacking it on a creature that has an unlimited number of bardic musics. A DC 26 save is going to be quite challenging for the Cleric, and nigh impossible to pass for anyone else. That –10 to saves could turn the save DC 18 vs blindness of the fire gaze to a devastating save DC 28, without using any limited use resources. Or maybe a Slay Living, or...I would have enjoyed more details about what these Doomspeak penalties could be used for.

Spell Compendium says on page 66: “Certain skills allow you persuade, fool, and otherwise influence others in the game world. Some of these skills can be used against player characters as well, but players decide what their characters do unless those characters are magically compelled to do otherwise.”. Since Perform is explicitely called out as non magical, even Epic Perform (from the SRD: “ Since it is nonmagical, it can’t be dispelled”), it cannot compel PCs to play their characters as friendly or fanatic towards BABY. Sorry. However, that could still work on cohorts, special mounts, animal companions, etc, so that’s not useless either. More generally, BABY having a ton of social skills means he gives a chance for the party face to flex these muscles in a direct confronting way, which is not an occurrence that happens often, and BABY will likely give the face a run for its money, what with Improvisation, etc.

BABY is mobile, has some perception abilities, some immunities provided by his type and subtype. He has DR, and Magic Circle Against Evil (as hilarious as that is on an evil creature) vs mind control, at-will Greater Invisibility and Persistent Image, and even at-will Polymorph. His only defensive weakness is direct damage. He has very very low HPs for his CR, most likely an okaysih AC, and mediocre saves.

BABY is incredibly powerful., more so than an ordinary advanced Firre. I appreciate how Lesser Celerity combines with Harmonize and Doomspeak. Doomspeak isn’t even a death effect, meaning no Death Ward to block it. There’s even Amplify to counter Silence. BABY can successively bring down the PCSs one save or die/suck at a time. He does not need mooks for this, though mooks would greatly benefit from his presence. In turn, he’d make good use of those meathshields, given his frailty. He has all these SLAs in addition to 9th level Cleric and 6th level Bard casting...and darn, that Miracle-emulated BoB for Doomspeaks all around is a neat trick. from CR 11 to CR 20, in all situations, he will provide the PCs with a serious challenge. The thing preventing him from having a perfect score here is how frail he is.
This guy is great.
From the PCs accompanying him in Androlynne in a search and rescue mission, to later have them face a crazied and disheveled Eladrin, slowly turning the world into a horde of those Bacchae...there’s a lot in the way of plot hooks here, at a variety of levels as you aplty mentioned. BABY has enough built-in drama for the PCs to remember for his fluff , and represents a challenge daunting enough for the PCs to remember him for his sheer power level.

Though he lacks a little in the way of motivations and personality after he has crossed the red line, and is maybe a little too goofy to be completely taken at face level by the party. All in all, he earns his place in the Hall of Fame.


Having picked Improved Critical is a powergamer’s fancy. Who hasn’t ever dreamt of stacking that feat? *Disciples of Dispater all raise their hands* You took a rather innocuous feat and combined it with a monster that makes a devastatingly good use of it. You did not choose a feat that has more obvious stacked value, like Extra Invocation, or Expanded Knowledge. Kudos here. You also managed to do something usable out of a monster that I find both awesome and unusable. That is the first time I ever see the Razor Boar presented as more than a funny but crappy monster. More kudos for choosing such a niche base creature for more than just its niche aspect.
All in all, your build does not do anything completely mind-blowingly crazy (well, head-blowingly at the very least) in the magnitudes of a Gazebo Jones, but well done all the same.
You forgot to add the +2 to NA from the Spellwarped template, as well as the Spell Absorption ability. You did not explicit how the DECAPITATOR!’s ability scores come about, between the increases provided by the template, the natural increases every four levels and the elite array. This is rather annoying. The table could have been cleaned off of the “new class abilities” and “skills” that remained there when you pasted it. A minor nitpick, your allignment should be evil, you should have changed that in the statblock.

A bigger problem is the fact that Spellwarped turns you into an Aberration. As such, when you advance by HD from CR 13 onward, you gain Aberration, not Magical Beast, HDs. There are several implications. First, your CR gets increased by 1 every 4 HDs, rather than evey three. Since Aberration HDs have the same BAB progression as the Cleric, it ends up with +3 BAB each time anyway. However, Aberrations have good Will saves, instead of Ref and Fort for Magical Beasts. All in all over the course of 8 HDs advancements, you should have gained saves of +10/+10/+18 instead of +14/+14/+8, 92 extra HPs and 32 skill points instead of 24. Its SR gets bumped to 58 (not that different from SR 50, mind you). It does not change that much of the DECAPITATOR!’s statblock, all in all, and it’s a mistake for the worse rather than for the better, but it’s a mistake nonetheless.

That said, your build is extremely clean. Pick one monster, apply a template, advance it to full, increase logical skills for an animal. It all makes perfect sense.
Alright, so let’s consider this guy right at CR 20, as you mentioned. How does he fare as a melee bruiser? He has a mountain of HPs, an impassable SR with a rider effect that will prove a nasty surprise for the party casters, some FH, some minimal detection abilities. He also is reasonably fast. His AC and saves are average. His vorpal tusks are incredibly potent, as 60% of the time that’ll be a OHKO for the PCs, no save, no SR, no reroll, no nothing. For a melee bruiser, he’s a competent melee bruiser.

Now, on the other hand, THE DECAPITATOR! Is utterly and completely shut down by any Heavy Fortification armor, Surelife spell, Talisman of Undead Fortitude...there are a great deal many ways of preserving oneself from critical hits. Granted, the PCs might be taken by surprise against him, as a single roll means death, and lose one guy before retreating and preparing counters. That is worth something. Besides, only the frontliners need those: the ranged casters and hitters, who will be flying at level 20, can outright bypass THE DECAPITATOR!. The particularity of this round is that all entries are forced to sacrifice versatility in exchange for more focused power, but that means said focused power must be sufficient to overcome the otherwise lack of other options of the creature. I think THE DECAPITATOR! falls a little short here. He’s an easily neutralized melee bruiser. That somewhat evens out with his sheer prowess.
Well, you did try to inject some backstory to the creature. We have enough material to make THE DECAPITATOR! just a little more than a Villain of the Week, describing how he routinely devastates the surroundings because a Druid set it up because there was that band of Sorcerers...there’s some plot hook potential. And when the PCs face the guy, they’ll go “WTF” after the first death, but I do not think that’d be much different than when they go “WTF” facing a by the book monster with an exotic modus operandi, like a Living Spell.
I’d say this guy is just memorable enough.


He’s an Immoth. Uncommon but not unheard of. He’s a Sorcadin. That’s not terribly original. He’s good a penguin familiar. OK that’s funny. The feat you picked for the round is of the kind that I find rather obvious for the rules of this particular round. There’s no backstory to help me flesh him out and understand his motives and/or modus operandi. Maybe he’s got a super creative motivation to be a villain. I’d like his fluff be provided after the round is completely over!
Jaas Kraal does not have the proper number of skill points. At CR 10, he is allowed to a max of 13 ranks in class skills, or 6.5 in cross-class skills. Also, he totals 67 skill points instead of 65. Meaning he cannot have 15 ranks in Spot. I think, however, that this is a mere typo, because resetting that to 13 corrects both the total number of skill points and the skill ranks cap. He should only have 6.5 ranks in Concentration, rather than 7. Also, at CR 14 to 16, Jaas gained 6 skill points instead of 5. It would have been handy for me to see at once which skills were increased, and which were cross-class. Also, pressed by time, you did not specify a Sweet Spot, nor did you describe his usual strategies, which complicates my task of assessing his power...I’ll dock you points here rather than in the Power category. Finally, you did not include ability modifiers nor Dark Blessing in your saves, which makes it more difficult to assess how good they are. All of the above are small nitpicks, but they add up.

There’s something rather ambiguous about the legalness of taking Extra Spell at HD 1, 3, 6 and 9 to pick spells of 5th level, as you did. Of course, at 10 HDs, Jaas can cast up to 6th level spells, and he is allowed to take Extra Spell in that fashion. Now, would a 1-HD Immoth be able to cast 6th level spells too? We do not know. Striclty RAW, you absolutely had the right to do what you did, and I’m not going to dock you any points for this...it was just an odd remark I am making aloud.
You created a monstrous Sorcadin, and you did it cleanly. Sorcerer spellcasting monster, Sorcerer level, Paladin (of Tyranny to account for the Evil alignment), and then Eldritch Knight. I appreciate you picked only [Cold] spells with your Extra spell feat, it furthers the theme and prevents that feat from being a powergrabbing-only strategy. The penguin familiar is cute and thematic, and I like to imagine it on the picture you showed utterly terrified and standing very still under the hand that strokes it ^^. All in all, good job.
I think you should have increased Cha at HDs 12 and 16, instead of Wis and Str once each. That would have netted Jaas one extra 1st and 5th level spells per day, and more importantly, an extra 9th level spell! It would also have bumped all of his saves by 1. I’m not too sure your skill selection was optimal either: Balance makes little sense on a flying, unslipping creature. Tumble needs to be maxed out to be effective, unless you just wanted the Jump and Balance synergy and the bonus on fighting defensively? Improving Spellcraft further rather than Sense Motive, or maybe a Knowledge skill, seems a better idea to me. Also, since you seemed intent on having Jaas fight in melee, it would have been a good idea to have him know Blood Wind, to make it easier for him to nab full attacks.
Anyway, just passing remarks. About Ice Runes: darn, I knew about the Immoth but not about the borkedness of that ability. I’m in agreement here to not consider the ability as-written. Your suggestion of turning the activation into a swift action is a reasonable one, it represents a severe downgrade to the original ability’s power, but said ability was so unbelievably powerful that the nerfed version is still nothing to scoff at. By the way, MMII says “Each Immoth has at least 3d4+2 ice runes embedded on its body”. So, it’s not up to 14 spells at a free action, as you said, but at least 14 spells as a free action. Gahh!

Now, about the monster proper. You made a Sorcadin that manages to nab 9th level spells as early as CR 18, thanks to the advanced racial casting of Immoths. That makes you more a regular caster that happens to have full BAB than the other way around. Immoths are crazy strong, and at CR 10 Jaas is a 12th level Sorcerer (enough to put him to CR 12 as per the regular rules of this comp) but with a fly speed, natural armor, super high SR, DR, and he takes half damage from piercing and slashing weapons. And he has ice runes. That’s the recipe for a TPK. Advancing to CR 15, our dude’s spellcasting abilities have reduced to a more manageable 7th level Sorcerer casting, but now he has super high saves. And you picke some top-notch Sorcerer spells too. Freezing Glance, Forcecage, Limited Wish, Necrotic Skull Bomb, Wings of Cover, buffing spells for the Gish part like Haste...and CR 20 Jaas is much the same, with all the big guns known. I appreciate Whispercast to give him greater versatility in case of a grapple as a cheaper Swift Etherealness.

There’s one odd thing, however. You took a bunch of spells with a swift/immediate action casting time. I understand that was so Jaas can use full attacks, etc. However, it comes to a point where there’s simply too much things he might be wanting to cast at once, and too little he’ll end up casting. It further clashes with the ruling according to which ices runes is a swift action to activate. I think Jaas is about to crave for more swift action, and to not know what to do with some standard actions some time...some long-term buff spells might have been wiser , like Greater Mage Armor, or Hoard Life. there’s a bit of unforesight here in spell selection I feel.

Apart from that, our Jaas is quite frail. When stuff like Shapechange comes into play, AC, attack routines, special abilities, etc can be arbitrarily adjusted upwards, and Jaas has enough in the way of defensive spells to hold his own before that. But he only got 216 HPs, and that’s too low for a Gish. He could get OHKO’d by even a moderately optimized Ubercharger.
His strategies are not exotic enough to have him remembered by the party. And there’s no motives here to provide memorable plot hooks or adventures. I don’t see the party ever remembering him...ok, yes “that guy with a penguin familiar”. Or maybe it’s just me, but I find this particular detail hilarious ^^


I didn’t see the Corpsecrafter stacking coming. That said, Zara is pretty much the iconic DnD villain: the evil Cleric, Necromancer, Undead making, and she’s even a Drider, close to a Drow, the iconic villain race. Here we stick very close to what’s known. Okay, she’s a Drider, which does not come up that often.
You did not list your sources, which is a tad annoying. Swapping one domain for another, as you did, is not ironclad RAW. You could say that Zara actually reveres the ideals of Pride and Deathbound, but then she couldn’t be a priestess of Kiaransalee (which doesn’t change her fluff that much, but still). Also, the way by which gaining levels of Cleric got you two extra domains, for a total of four domains, seems ambiguous. One might argue that Zara already has her two Cleric domains, and would not gain two more...I would also have appreciated if you had indicated which skills were bought as cross-class and which were not. Also, Undeath After Death is not on the Cleric spell list, but the Initiate of Bane one only, so that’s a no-go. Though well done for the references.
That said, those are fairly minor, and apart from that your build is as elegant as it gets. Drider Cleric of a Drown goddess, taking more levels in Cleric. Having an underground lair.

First off, congrats for the effort you put into developping Zara’s strategies at each level, including a rundown of useful prepared spells. I have come across this hurdle myself, detailing the spells used by a caster with limited spells known is rather easy, but the same thing for a caster that know every spell of its list is quite the chore. Now, let’s see in detail.

The undeads you create are powerful beatsticks. Looking at a Skeletal Troll, enhanced by all you can do, the beast has a lot of HPs and hits hard. The Desecrate area somewhat protects the big ones against turning. Boneblade is a neat find for dealing with PCs, all the more that at low levels they won’t have the mobility to dictate how the encounter happens (while Zara can, climbing up walls and ceilings). Portal Beacon seems indeed suited to mess with the PCs in some fashion, though Zara needs to know them beforehand. After the first encounter, then. I can see Unliving Weapon giving some jump scare to the PCs...All in all, you provided some interesting spells out there, to better help a DM that’d want to borrow your villain. The PCs will have to fight their way through hords of buffed-up undead, all with various nasty tricks that make them more unpredictable than run-of-the-mill skeletons and zombies, and hold against the sustained fire of Zara’s spells and debuffs in the meantime. At CR 10, wow, Seed of Undeath is a good way to put a timer on the PCs, as Zara can spread that out to her heart’s content as lon as noone comes to stop her. The best thing is that the material component for Animate Dead and its variations is cheap enought that enven keeping a full undead horde worth 4 times her CL, it remains small change when compared to her NPC WBL. General of Undeath is a fantastic spell that allows Zara to reach a whole new level of power, and to make the encountes scale up in size and epicness accordingly. Plague of Undead, wow And it gives max HPs to your undead to boot. Yeah, that’s what neded to singlehandedly turn the tide against the C and their mook helpers in a very cinematic (and effective) way. The Zombie and Skeletal Dragon templates are nice finds, and the fact that they allow minions both way more versatile than un-of-the-mill Animate Dead fodder, what with Frightful Presence, flight and breath weapons, and way tougher than what Create (Greater) Undead can churn out, allows for Zara’s mionionmancy to remain relevant even at higher levels.

The limits, however, are that Zara is somewhat frail, what with moderate to poor AC and saves, and very low HPs. She can hide behind her undead, but she still can get sniped, all the more so given she’s a Large creature. She has to devolve a fair bit of her spell slots to preparation before the encounter can happen. Desecrate x2, Animate Dead, Crown of Undeath, Unliving Weapon...it leaves her with little in the way of generally-useful spells to adapt on the fly to what the PCs will do. By the way, she cannot naturally fly to compound her frailty, either. Also, given how fragile she is, she has no business entering melee, not when she has minions with twice as much HPs and much better to-hit boni that can do it for her. As such, I’m not a fan of the various Gish spells you suggested, like Divine Might. There is also the fact that Zara is somewhat stuck to her HQ, as it is the centre of her desecrated altar, and her reservoir of dead bodies. Outside that place, she will create undeads a little weaker (in particular, that’ll get Turned much more easily) and she does not necessarily have all the corpses at hand of stuff like Animate Legion., particularly those Dragon corpses. This makes it easier for the PCs to take their time approaching her lair and whittling her down, dungeon-crawl fashion. Finally, there’s only so much souped-up bruisers can do at very high levels. effects like Undeath to Death or (greater) turning, that do not check for HPs, enter the fray. PCs can spam Hide from Undead to bypasse the majority of the mindless mass, etc.
The tail end of the coin, though: she’s plain awesome. Your backstory gives us a plot hook right here, right now, Blair Witch Project-way, with the PCs recovering a bloodstained journal. Dungeon crawls have always the potential to be fun, and subterranean undead-filled ones even more so. What I particularly enjoy here is the attention you gave to how the PCs might relate to her abilities. The nastiest save-or-suck that make the game, well, suck for the paralysed PC. But also the large-scale undead raising ones, like General of Undeath or Plague of Undead, that allow Zara to send dozens of monsters razing hamlets to the ground. What more epic than the PCs rushing to confront a mother****ing Zombie Dragon-riding Zara, herself ridden by a Zombie Kobold, while her small elite guard of Dread Wraiths and Mummies assail the Royal Guard, but at the same time her legion of mooks face the spooked militia down in the street, and some nasty exploding Zombie Rats pop from behind by using the sewers, killing off scared peasants that raise at once as their Seed of Undeath activate? Maybe that. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0300.html)


We have a bruiser monster enhanced by a template and a couple of melee-oriented classes. Quite a classical structure here. Both Warshaper and Crusader are classic enough in this comp, while Leskylor and the Half-Farspawn template are less so. It more or less balances out. A servant of good that went once too far and came back covered in tentacles is nothing to write home about, though. So I was going to write “home about”, but I won’t.
You missed 1 BAB at CR 10, it should be 10 and not 9. Improved Natural Attack requires a BAB of +4 to qualify for, and thus Tephel could not qualify to select the feat when at 1 and 3 HDs. However, that’s more or less the same problem as with Jaas Kraal, since nowhere it is said that monsters that have naturally 10 HDs even at the time of creation still have to qualify for their feats as if they had taken them at lower levels...no penalty here. I also want to point out that you did not add the ability modifiers to your saves...but checking back I realize no one did. Whoops. Must be a pet peeve of mine. Also, Tephel has too many skill points. At CR 12, since he has not gained HDs since CR 10, he must have the same skill points array. But I’m counting 92, while he should be entitled to (10+3)*(2+1)=39. There may be a misunderstanding here as you seemed to have copied the skills the by-the-book three-headed Leskylor has (which is already too much, by the way, 63 where 52 are expected) and then added some more. You also gave only a little indication about which maneuver was gained when and swapped against what, though since you have no more than a smattering of them it’s not too difficult to parse.

In the statblocks, you indicated the tentacles as having a reach of 20ft, but as I read the Half-Farspawn template, the reach described for the tentacles is not an added reach compared to what the creature can normally do, but is the standalone reach of these natural attacks. You can see this in the statblock of the Gray Render given as an example. You also did not update his saves between CR 15 and 20.
In the build table there’s also some incoherence, given as Improved Natural Attack is indicated for tentacles twice at CR 16 and 19, but in the statblocks it is the claws that see their HD improve. I also clashes with what’s written on the Tactics spoiler. I’m going by text trumps table here.
Apart from this, your 2-level dip into Warshaper is quite inelegant, it somewhat sticks out as a power move here.

On the other hand, you cleverly qualified for this same Warshaper class with the Change Shape ability of the Half-Farspawn template, well done for this. I also appreciate your effort to not have dumped all of you Improved Natural Attacks onto the same one, but spread them out a little across all the ones you’ve got.
On the whole, you end up slightly docked compared to a top mark.
The Godclaw is an ubercharger. He is a quite effective one at that. If he manages to get a pounce on any PC, there’s a very high chance that’ll be a OHKO. Blindsight and Greater Invisibility greatly assist him on doing that. The strategy you highlighted rightly points to his various SLAs to give him added versatility, like Touch of Idiocy being a no-save-just-suck to any caster, or Blink and Ethereal Jaunt adding to his maneuverability. He can also grab with a respectably high check, with Improved Grab to boot. His energy resistance, high HPs, immunity to crits and precision damage and Crusader ability give him great resilience. At CR 20, Scintillating Pattern is a no-save way to clear off mooks the PCs might have. The Godclaw’s maneuvers give him things to do when he is not allowed a charge nor a full attack.
As a bruiser, what could he really ask for? The one thing that springs to mind is better saves. In that regard, I appreciate your suggestion for Paladin of Tyranny. All the more so than given that in his alternate form, Tephel is already immune to crits, I find that investing two levels of Warshaper and the loss of one point of BAB to reap in return a size increase in one natural attack and a +4 to Str and Con is a little too high a price. By RAW, Paladin of Slaughter’s Dark Blessing does not interfere with Crusader’s Indomitable Soul the way Divine Grace does. I’d have docked you some in Elegance, but there’d be quite the benefit in Power. Picking Hexblade would have netted the same effect (more or less) without the RAW fuss and with a bump in Will rather than Fort saves.

About maneuvers, I think you could have picked some better ones. Leading the Charge as a 1st level stance to enhance further your uberchargerness, Doom Charge (since you qualify for up to 6th level maneuvers at the end of your career), Covering Strike to help you move away from melee to put yourself in position to charge again without taking AoOs...all the more so than the Godclaw is unlikely to ever make use of his Stone Dragon maneuvers, given that he fights airborn (as iwill the PCs at these ECLs) and that they require the initiator to touch ground.
The most memorable thing here is if the DM asks the PCs if they think the three heads came before or because of the template. I, for one, would be hard-pressed to answer ^^. Getting pounced by a flying, invisible, deformed, tentacled, three-headed lion is quite disconcerting as far as exotic DnD monsters go. However, there’s not much more than that. Given the good mental stats of the Godclaw, he would have deserved some more personality and backstory here, because there’s room for interacting with the PCs other than by mauling each other’s face.


Using the Incarnate Construct template to get a bruiser with a bazillion HDs relatively to its CR is not a flamboyantly new idea, though still one does not see one that often. The trick of slapping initiator classes on monters withs piles of HDs to take advantage of the subsequent initiator level boost is not novel as well. Taking a multi-choice feat like Martial Study was what I expected most for the focus feat in this comp. Your backstory is quite conventional too (though good catch on that Incarnate Construct issue! ^^ maybe the caster used Stone to Flesh on the Stone Golem first?)
The Winged template, on the other hand, is a bit rarer, and makes sense here as it is a relatively cheap way to give flight no-strings-attached to an earthbound creature.
As far as I can tell, Igor has no feat when he is a regular Greater Stone Golem, by dint of being a Construct. Then, upon acquiring the Incarnate template and being turned into an intelligent creature, capable of gaining feats, “An incarnate construct has no feats when it becomes a living creature”. Meaning Igor cannot gain these 14 first Martial Study feats. This deals a huge blow to your build (which however remains legal as a whole, thus avoiding a 0 here).
Apart from that, you did not specify how your ability scores came to be. In particular, how did you handle the Incarnate Construct granting 4d6b3 in both Int and Con. I know there’s been a ruling in the past about that kind of situation, but I can’t recall what was decided. Chairman, if you wouldn’t mind?

You did not specify the skills you picked. Even for a frontliner, they can prove useful, all the more so that your humongous amount of HDs allows you very high skill point ceilings, even for cross-class skills. Skill tricks, Tumble, social skills...
Dipping int Swordsage and Crusader, while quite funny, is supremely inelegant.

I’ not following how Igor ended up with +38 BAB at CR 9. If I’m calculating correctly, he has 42 giant HDs, thus providing him with +31 BAB. We then add 1 for the +1 BAB you picked at HD 1. What gives? Similarly, I’m not making out how his CR 9 saves come out, and since I don’t have his abiliy scores at that level I’m not sure I can conclude the calculus.
First off, some remarks. Picking Stone Dragon maneuvers does not seem wise to me given Igor is airborne and as such not likely to be fighting while touching ground. Getting Charging Minotaur and Bonecrusher out of the way would have allowed you to pick Time Stands Still or other goodies as soon as CR 9! Getting rid of Stance of Stone would have meant getting the awesome Stance of Alacrity, for better action economy and putting all these counters he has to use. Castigating Strike seems a poor choice given his piss poor Charisma, instead of, say, (Greater) Divine Surge. On the whole, Igor would have benefitted of Tiger Claw maneuvers as well, especially those asking for a Jump check given his immense modifier (Swooping Dragon Claw, Feral Death Blow), maybe while getting rid of some of the Diamond Mind maneuvers like Emerald Razor (not really needed, given his to-hit bonus). I can see your point about wanting to get the best maneuvers when you can recover them during encounters, but you still could have filled your Martial Study feats with prereqs only and take a bunch of 7th, 8th and 9th level maneuvers at each class level. Also, since Igor has no skill ranks, he has no Concentration ranks, which means all his maneuvers from Damond Mind that ask for a Concentration check are wasted.

That said, Igor is a mix between the Godclaw’s maneuverability and toughness, and Crud’s sheer amount of options. He pretty much auto-hits regardless of the opponent’s AC given his BAB and Str modifiers. Oddly enough, a CR 9, he doesn’t hit that hard, given his maneuvers are mostly defensive, but with a save DC upwards of 30 to resist Disrupting strike, he’s sure to make someone lose their turn at least once. Acquiring Crusader levels only makes him buffer, not that much stronger. He’s hard to take down, but actually not that threatening. Swordsage finally gives him Five Shadow Creeping Ice Enervating Strike, which is solid damage and debuffing stuff. Come the sweet spot, there. Avalanche of Blades is ridiculously good when one has upwards of +50 on one’s to-hit roll. Time Stands Still is to the martial initiator what Shapechange is to the spellcaster. Now, Igor really becomes a slaughterer. He could have become one ealrier, though. After CR 12 has arrived, Igor is this flying pile of rocks, super mobile, with good saves, who can play two turns in a row , Heal himself, etc etc.
Igor does have a few shortcomings. He has no detection abilities (you could have picked Hearing the Air or Hunter’s Sense as stances for that), and no ranks in Listen and Spot. Meaning if the PCs can afford to avoid him instead of rushing head-on, they will. is only use is to be a pure bruiser, and he has no social capabilities. Also, his regular attack, while painful, is not extremely threatening. 40 damage on average a CR 20 is not going to scare a summoned Elder Air Elemental. That means Igor has to use maeuvers every round to be threatening. Given that maneuvers obtained through Martial Study or Swordsage levels do not (really) refresh, and that Warblade one need to sacrifice a standard action (a painful thing to do when the action economy is as lopsided against you as it gets when facing 4 or more PCs), Igor can sort of be slowly ground out of maneuvers by PCs maneuvering through summon, cohorts, healed beasticks, etc.
As the bodyguard of an evil Warblade, we have some backstory we can work with here. A 25ft-tall winged “fleshy” warrior makes for an unusual enough martial adept for the PCs, all the more if the DM has the balls to show the players the picture you linked to describe him! 😀 The first fight will prbably be long and arduous, giving the escaping PCs food for thought to devise a way to beat him the next time. Attrition battles are kind of rare in DnD, and Igor can pose that kind of challenge to the PCs I can see it work here, and the players remembering that guy after the campaign, for that crunch reason and for the “fleshy” fluff reason.
Too bad the personality and goals of Igor are so bare bone, there could have been room for more here, like his relationship to the mage that awakened him, etc.

[Mike Miller]

I feel pretty good about 4th place for my first contest entry. I'll have you all know that planning 20 levels of maneuvers with all the switches at even levels is a real pain. XD
Hail Crud!

[AvatarVecna]

If I might make a slight suggestion, please turn the judgement post into paragraphs. Got a bad case of "wall o text" going on, and the doctor prescribes line breaks.


*picks a whole bushel of oopsy-daisies*

Judgement period isn't over yet; others can jump in, this guys scores can change based on responses from contestants picking issues with parts of the judging, or he could even just change his mind on things. All of that just generally means things aren't over and announcing yourself isn't necessarily wise, at least in principle. Don't want potential second judges showing up who happen to have a grudge against you for something stupid from three years ago or whatever. :smalltongue:

[Thurbane]

My HM goes to BABY Sweetkiss: such an amazing amount of work has obviously gone into this entry!

As much as I enjoyed this "special rules" round, I always like rounds that follow normal RAW, so I can yoink the interesting ones for use in games where I DM.

Actually, that reminds me: has anyone used any VC entries in their own games? Would be very interested to hear...

[ben-zayb]

Jaas Kraal
It's a scarily accurate Ice King! I hope you enjoyed making him.


Thanks for the judging, remetagross. I appreciate just how detailed you went with the Elegance and Power categories of each entry. :smalleek:

[NontheistCleric]

Actually, that reminds me: has anyone used any VC entries in their own games? Would be very interested to hear...

Daremetoidareyo did that with some of the entries in the Wrong for the Right Reasons round, if I recall correctly.

[jdizzlean]

judgements in, disputes out


First of all, the judging is very much appreciated!


He’s an Immoth. Uncommon but not unheard of. He’s a Sorcadin. That’s not terribly original. He’s good a penguin familiar. OK that’s funny. The feat you picked for the round is of the kind that I find rather obvious for the rules of this particular round. There’s no backstory to help me flesh him out and understand his motives and/or modus operandi. Maybe he’s got a super creative motivation to be a villain. I’d like his fluff be provided after the round is completely over!
Will do. In short, he was supposed to be a pastiche of the Ice King from adventure time.

The feat choice was selected specifically because it works, by RAW, without needing the special rules for the comp to allow it to be taken multiple times. I hoped this might help me in elegenace...

Jaas Kraal does not have the proper number of skill points. At CR 10, he is allowed to a max of 13 ranks in class skills, or 6.5 in cross-class skills. Also, he totals 67 skill points instead of 65. Meaning he cannot have 15 ranks in Spot. I think, however, that this is a mere typo, because resetting that to 13 corrects both the total number of skill points and the skill ranks cap. He should only have 6.5 ranks in Concentration, rather than 7. Also, at CR 14 to 16, Jaas gained 6 skill points instead of 5. It would have been handy for me to see at once which skills were increased, and which were cross-class. Also, pressed by time, you did not specify a Sweet Spot, nor did you describe his usual strategies, which complicates my task of assessing his power...I’ll dock you points here rather than in the Power category. Finally, you did not include ability modifiers nor Dark Blessing in your saves, which makes it more difficult to assess how good they are. All of the above are small nitpicks, but they add up.
There’s something rather ambiguous about the legalness of taking Extra Spell at HD 1, 3, 6 and 9 to pick spells of 5th level, as you did. Of course, at 10 HDs, Jaas can cast up to 6th level spells, and he is allowed to take Extra Spell in that fashion. Now, would a 1-HD Immoth be able to cast 6th level spells too? We do not know. Striclty RAW, you absolutely had the right to do what you did, and I’m not going to dock you any points for this...it was just an odd remark I am making aloud.
You created a monstrous Sorcadin, and you did it cleanly. Sorcerer spellcasting monster, Sorcerer level, Paladin (of Tyranny to account for the Evil alignment), and then Eldritch Knight. I appreciate you picked only [Cold] spells with your Extra spell feat, it furthers the theme and prevents that feat from being a powergrabbing-only strategy. The penguin familiar is cute and thematic, and I like to imagine it on the picture you showed utterly terrified and standing very still under the hand that strokes it ^^. All in all, good job.
The 15 ranks in Spot was a simple typo. I did notify the chair before any judging was posted to see if this could be corrected (which he can confirm if required). I'm hoping a simple typo which i was already aware of might earn some leniency?

The second point, I had anticipated as a possible issue in judging. As there is no racial progression class for an Immoth, I don't think there should be any RAW issues. As presented in MM2, Immoths are "born" with their full 12th level Sorcerer casting, and meet the reqs of the feat.


I think you should have increased Cha at HDs 12 and 16, instead of Wis and Str once each. That would have netted Jaas one extra 1st and 5th level spells per day, and more importantly, an extra 9th level spell! It would also have bumped all of his saves by 1. I’m not too sure your skill selection was optimal either: Balance makes little sense on a flying, unslipping creature. Tumble needs to be maxed out to be effective, unless you just wanted the Jump and Balance synergy and the bonus on fighting defensively? Improving Spellcraft further rather than Sense Motive, or maybe a Knowledge skill, seems a better idea to me. Also, since you seemed intent on having Jaas fight in melee, it would have been a good idea to have him know Blood Wind, to make it easier for him to nab full attacks.
Anyway, just passing remarks. About Ice Runes: darn, I knew about the Immoth but not about the borkedness of that ability. I’m in agreement here to not consider the ability as-written. Your suggestion of turning the activation into a swift action is a reasonable one, it represents a severe downgrade to the original ability’s power, but said ability was so unbelievably powerful that the nerfed version is still nothing to scoff at. By the way, MMII says “Each Immoth has at least 3d4+2 ice runes embedded on its body”. So, it’s not up to 14 spells at a free action, as you said, but at least 14 spells as a free action. Gahh!
Now, about the monster proper. You made a Sorcadin that manages to nab 9th level spells as early as CR 18, thanks to the advanced racial casting of Immoths. That makes you more a regular caster that happens to have full BAB than the other way around. Immoths are crazy strong, and at CR 10 Jaas is a 12th level Sorcerer (enough to put him to CR 12 as per the regular rules of this comp) but with a fly speed, natural armor, super high SR, DR, and he takes half damage from piercing and slashing weapons. And he has ice runes. That’s the recipe for a TPK. Advancing to CR 15, our dude’s spellcasting abilities have reduced to a more manageable 7th level Sorcerer casting, but now he has super high saves. And you picke some top-notch Sorcerer spells too. Freezing Glance, Forcecage, Limited Wish, Necrotic Skull Bomb, Wings of Cover, buffing spells for the Gish part like Haste...and CR 20 Jaas is much the same, with all the big guns known. I appreciate Whispercast to give him greater versatility in case of a grapple as a cheaper Swift Etherealness.
There’s one odd thing, however. You took a bunch of spells with a swift/immediate action casting time. I understand that was so Jaas can use full attacks, etc. However, it comes to a point where there’s simply too much things he might be wanting to cast at once, and too little he’ll end up casting. It further clashes with the ruling according to which ices runes is a swift action to activate. I think Jaas is about to crave for more swift action, and to not know what to do with some standard actions some time...some long-term buff spells might have been wiser , like Greater Mage Armor, or Hoard Life. there’s a bit of unforesight here in spell selection I feel.
Apart from that, our Jaas is quite frail. When stuff like Shapechange comes into play, AC, attack routines, special abilities, etc can be arbitrarily adjusted upwards, and Jaas has enough in the way of defensive spells to hold his own before that. But he only got 216 HPs, and that’s too low for a Gish. He could get OHKO’d by even a moderately optimized Ubercharger.
I'll take all of that on board. He was intended more as a full caster than a gish, but I can see that wasn't really apparent from my choices. Still, I feel he is a very resilient full caster, with an innate fly speed and other goodies to boot.

His strategies are not exotic enough to have him remembered by the party. And there’s no motives here to provide memorable plot hooks or adventures. I don’t see the party ever remembering him...ok, yes “that guy with a penguin familiar”. Or maybe it’s just me, but I find this particular detail hilarious ^^
Glad you liked the familiar (the ice King in Adventure Time has a penguin companion called Gunther).

I'll freely admit this ended up being a rushed entry: the full version would have had a more details backstory, tips, tactics and CR breakdown.

I'll take my lumps from the low overall score, and try to allow myself more time next time around.

[Thurbane]

Daremetoidareyo did that with some of the entries in the Wrong for the Right Reasons round, if I recall correctly.

Cool. :smallsmile:

Also, in answer to my own question, I definitely intend to use a version of In, The Undead Laboratory (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=23166274&postcount=62) for my campaign (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=23261727&postcount=131) at some point.

[remetagross]

Alright, let's answer our Ice King here! :smallsmile:



The feat choice was selected specifically because it works, by RAW, without needing the special rules for the comp to allow it to be taken multiple times. I hoped this might help me in elegenace...

I catch your drift, but no, that would be unfair towards the other entries to (on the whole) penalize them compared to you because they have followed the rules set out for this round.


The 15 ranks in Spot was a simple typo. I did notify the chair before any judging was posted to see if this could be corrected (which he can confirm if required). I'm hoping a simple typo which i was already aware of might earn some leniency?

The second point, I had anticipated as a possible issue in judging. As there is no racial progression class for an Immoth, I don't think there should be any RAW issues. As presented in MM2, Immoths are "born" with their full 12th level Sorcerer casting, and meet the reqs of the feat.

As I mentioned, I didn't dock you points for the spellcasting issue, and for that matter, neither did I for the 15/13 skill ranks thing.


I'll take all of that on board. He was intended more as a full caster than a gish, but I can see that wasn't really apparent from my choices. Still, I feel he is a very resilient full caster, with an innate fly speed and other goodies to boot.
Fair point about the Gish. He's going to be at the frontline a bit less often, and he won't have his standard actions tied up by attack actions to prevent him from casting. He's still tied up by the fact he wish he had more than one swift action per round, though. +0.25 in Power.



Glad you liked the familiar (the ice King in Adventure Time has a penguin companion called Gunther).

I'm so sorry. I had to look up what Adventure Time is. There's Nothing quite so dismaying as writing an entry as being an hommage to some pop culture thing and having the guy across not catching the reference. I have been that guy today.

[jdizzlean]

here's another batch


Thanks for stepping up to judge!

I doubt these would raise my score, but I would just attempt to clarify some things.
I’m counting 133 skill points spent at CR 8, while BABY is eligible to (8+5)*(8+3)=143 skill points. No penalty here, just too bad.I was sure skill points added to 143. The breakdown I have is:
10 Balan
11 Bluff
11 Concentration
11 Disguise
11 Intimidate
10 K:Arcana
01 K:Dungeoneering
10 K:History
01 K:Local
01 K:Nature
10 K:Religion
01 K:thePlanes
11 P:Oratory
11 P:Sing
11 P:StringedInstrument
11 Sense Motive
11 Spellcraft
I think your logic for bolding certain skills has been lost at some point, though.My bad. I forgot to state that a boldfaced rank means it's the final/max rank for that skill.
I’m not understanding where that line about any effect depending on alignment considers BABY to be Chaotic Good is coming from.BABY has the Chaotic and Good subtypes, and that line is derived from their (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/typesSubtypes.htm) description. Spells treat him as though he is Chaotic and Good, instead of Chaotic and Evil. Basically, Detect Evil won't work on him, but Detect Good will. Most importantly, Sanctify the Wicked will not work on him.
Since Perform is explicitely called out as non magical, even Epic Perform (from the SRD: “ Since it is nonmagical, it can’t be dispelled”), it cannot compel PCs to play their characters as friendly or fanatic towards BABY.I missed that bit about magical compulsion being the only way to control PC actions. On the bright side, epic Perform in general isn't as ridiculous as I thought it would be.



So my entry, the decapitator, got dinged in elegance for the issue of not advancing as an aberration, which he technically is because of the Spellwarped Template. However, since the template application rules for Spellwarped say not to recalculate hit dice, skills, saves, BAB etc, I think that the way I ended up doing it was the way it is intended to be done and at worst I just made it a bit confusing by putting the template early in the build table instead of at the end.

[remetagross]

Let's quickly answer this one first:


So my entry, the decapitator, got dinged in elegance for the issue of not advancing as an aberration, which he technically is because of the Spellwarped Template. However, since the template application rules for Spellwarped say not to recalculate hit dice, skills, saves, BAB etc, I think that the way I ended up doing it was the way it is intended to be done and at worst I just made it a bit confusing by putting the template early in the build table instead of at the end.

Indeed, the Spellwarped Template does specify that. However, it has no bearing on the evaluation of any future HDs the templated monster would gain. Very few templates do so, and when they do this is explicitely called out. This most often happens with templates turning the creature into an undead. Compare:



Hit Dice: Increase all current and future Hit Dice to d12s.

That kind of specific mention being absent on the Spellwarped Creature template, you do have to advance your boar as an aberration, rather than as a magical animal. Now, you are entirely right by stating that this could be corrected by simply adding the Spellwarped template after having added racial HDs rather than before. But that would not be completely neutral for the build. The most important thing is that The DECAPITATOR! would lose its spell resistance for most of 20 levels. Said spell resistance being, at its lowest, equal to (party level +14) at CR 12, and at its most (party level +28) at CR 19, it makes for a non negligible boost in your boar's survivability. On the other hand, with these 8 extra HDs it would have picked, that would have meant 2 extra Improved Critical and two more ability score increases, etc. I think the DECAPITATOR!' still comes out with a net loss here, as past a certain point auto-killing on 6-20 or 8-20 doesn't make that much of a difference, while being able to no-sell Enervation and gaining a boost in speed in the process is extremely useful.


Since that proposed fix would not be costless to your boar, no change.

I'll wrap my head around the other dispute tomorrow.

[jdizzlean]

and yet, there is of course more :)

Zara Faertith


I didn’t see the Corpsecrafter stacking coming. That said, Zara is pretty much the iconic DnD villain: the evil Cleric, Necromancer, Undead making, and she’s even a Drider, close to a Drow, the iconic villain race. Here we stick very close to what’s known. Okay, she’s a Drider, which does not come up that often.

Alas, the eternal tradeoff: if you want good variety for your power rating, you need to use something that has lots of support. But if you use something with lots of support, it's because it's iconic so it's unoriginal. I mostly can't really disagree with this scoring, although I do have a few minor qualms:

1) I feel like drow goddesses other than Lolth come up approximately "never", and that putting together a villain revering Kiaransalee puts a spotlight on a kind of cleric that doesn't come up very often. Mind you, not that much - while most players won't have heard of this goddess, particularly among optimizers, the few that do probably know her from the Yathrinshee, a dual-caster-progression PrC focused around necromancy. I feel the goddess is weird enough to warrant a slight bump here, but I also feel it can't be too big a bump when her lore is strong enough to warrant an accompanying prestige class.

2) I feel like some of the spell suggestions are esoteric enough to make Zara stand out a bit more from the crowd of drow necromancers. It might be because I haven't looked too deeply into necromancy before, but I was surprised and intrigued by some of the spell effects I found along the way.

3) While it always feels weird to me bringing up other entries in regards to my own, I noticed that a villain using an infamously-powerful monster with an infamously-powerful template made for a character exemplifying the trope you mentioned got a 3.5. The point of that trope is that examples of it look original because "who combines these things" when it's really like button-mashing a keyboard with a list of common descriptors - that is to say, original, but in a "1000 monkeys banging on typewriters" kind of way that doesn't seem that much more "out there" than a particularly iconic villain. If that's enough for a 2-point lead in this category, then...I guess that's that, but it strikes me as odd.


You did not list your sources, which is a tad annoying.

Apologies, was a bit rushed to get this in on time. Not a real excuse, I know.


Swapping one domain for another, as you did, is not ironclad RAW. You could say that Zara actually reveres the ideals of Pride and Deathbound, but then she couldn’t be a priestess of Kiaransalee (which doesn’t change her fluff that much, but still).

I feel like a contest for NPCs has a bit more wiggle room in RAW vs RAI, since the DM can more easily count on getting DM approval, but even then I'm leery to go outside RAW unless it's pretty clear, and in this case it seemed fairly clear to me. It is legitimately really weird that a goddess whose gospel includes a distrust for servants that can think for themselves doesn't grant the domain that makes it easier to have more unthinking servants. That she instead has the Pride domain is also really weird to me - Envy I can see, but Pride is weird. A ding here for going outside RAW is perhaps deserved, but I feel that this is the kind of "going outside RAW" that is more reasonable than some - I can't see too many DMs that aren't deadset on RAW denying this if a player asked, for instance.

Of course, then there's this complaint:


Also, the way by which gaining levels of Cleric got you two extra domains, for a total of four domains, seems ambiguous. One might argue that Zara already has her two Cleric domains, and would not gain two more.


There is no rule saying you can only have two domains, it's just that ways of getting more than two are relatively rare. Cloistered Cleric can get a third domain from first level relatively easy, and there's more than a couple Cleric PrCs that grant additional domains, and there's an epic feat for it as well. My racial casting comes with two domains that come from Lolth's list regardless of if I worship Lolth or not, and then when I take levels in cleric, I gain two more based on who/what I worship.

A bit more to the point, dinging me on Elegance for going a bit outside of RAW, and dinging me on Elegance for using RAW in a weird way to gain advantage, are both individually fair things to ding me on, but side-by-side they start looking weird. Do you want me to follow the rules or not?


I would also have appreciated if you had indicated which skills were bought as cross-class and which were not. Also, Undeath After Death is not on the Cleric spell list, but the Initiate of Bane one only, so that’s a no-go. Though well done for the references.

Hmm...Undeath After Death is still available via Miracle, buuuuuut that just means it's still an option that can affect my late-game power but is still worthy of an Elegance ding. I guess if the ding was for not being able to use it at all, it should be undone a bit since I can use it, but it still definitely warrants a ding.


First off, congrats for the effort you put into developping Zara’s strategies at each level, including a rundown of useful prepared spells. I have come across this hurdle myself, detailing the spells used by a caster with limited spells known is rather easy, but the same thing for a caster that know every spell of its list is quite the chore. Now, let’s see in detail.

I looked over just about every cleric spells whose name/basic description caught my eye. There's probably some I missed in the higher levels just cuz I was glazing over near the end, but hopefully I found enough fun tricks to make it worthwhile.


The undeads you create are powerful beatsticks. Looking at a Skeletal Troll, enhanced by all you can do, the beast has a lot of HPs and hits hard. The Desecrate area somewhat protects the big ones against turning.

It also helps against turning that Zara can rebuke undead. Of course, the main way she'll avoid her favoritest pets from getting turned is by having the PCs have to work their way through the uncontrolled fodder to even reach her lair.


The best thing is that the material component for Animate Dead and its variations is cheap enought that enven keeping a full undead horde worth 4 times her CL, it remains small change when compared to her NPC WBL.

This is part of why she's set up inside a weird onyx mine, to increase access. Granted, most DMs that would run a villain like this would handwave the costs in some fashion, or make her gaining access to a horde of onyx a plot point the PCs have to deal with, but even if she's just paying for it out of pocket, it's never a gigantic problem since she can go "solo adventuring" to steal some loot.


The limits, however, are that Zara is somewhat frail, what with moderate to poor AC and saves, and very low HPs. She can hide behind her undead, but she still can get sniped, all the more so given she’s a Large creature. She has to devolve a fair bit of her spell slots to preparation before the encounter can happen. Desecrate x2, Animate Dead, Crown of Undeath, Unliving Weapon...it leaves her with little in the way of generally-useful spells to adapt on the fly to what the PCs will do. By the way, she cannot naturally fly to compound her frailty, either. Also, given how fragile she is, she has no business entering melee, not when she has minions with twice as much HPs and much better to-hit boni that can do it for her. As such, I’m not a fan of the various Gish spells you suggested, like Divine Might.

Discounting gish spells because she's too weak to enter melee when those gish spells are what would enable her to get in close without getting her butt handed to her feels like double jeopardy - her basic stats don't include the alterations those spells would make, but if they did she'd look a lot more formidable.

Of course, the gish spells are mostly on there for a different purpose: that is, giving Zara a flexible level of optimization, which is an option Zara and a few of the other caster villains have, but less so the non-caster villains. Zara has options available that will allow her to be played at a level that's challenging for the PCs no matter how optimal they may be (outside of some edge cases where the PCs are particularly well-built). Mind you, I don't think the ease with which she can be played with a handicap should affect her Power rating, but it feels like it should affect something for making it easier for DMs to adapt Zara for their games and players.


There is also the fact that Zara is somewhat stuck to her HQ, as it is the centre of her desecrated altar, and her reservoir of dead bodies. Outside that place, she will create undeads a little weaker (in particular, that’ll get Turned much more easily) and she does not necessarily have all the corpses at hand of stuff like Animate Legion., particularly those Dragon corpses.

Zara's lair is where she keeps safe while sleeping and worships the goddess, but she strays from it to go find more powerful foes to murder and animate - those dragon corpses didn't just appear in her lair, she had to go get them. Yes, the ones she creates outside of her HQ have slightly fewer HP, but while for most necromancers Desecrate is what makes their minions truly useful, for Zara it's more icing on the cake when she's defending her lair. Most of her more useful servants are either in the desecration area with Zara, or are outside of it with Zara, and she can keep them safe-ish with Rebuke Undead, if it's even necessary.


This makes it easier for the PCs to take their time approaching her lair and whittling her down, dungeon-crawl fashion. Finally, there’s only so much souped-up bruisers can do at very high levels. effects like Undeath to Death or (greater) turning, that do not check for HPs, enter the fray. PCs can spam Hide from Undead to bypasse the majority of the mindless mass, etc.

Hide From Undead against mindless undead, but even from CR 7 Zara has intelligent undead she gets to play around with that can self-propagate: Sticks And Stones can give her access to a wight a day after casting, while Summon Undead V can give you shadow/wight access for a few rounds - just long enough for them to get a kill and cause the kill to rise as a permanent spawn. Awaken Undead can turn my skeletons and zombies into smarties again, and Create (Greater) Undead only gives intelligent minions, some of which can self-propagate. The self-propagation is important because while I can control just one undead, they can auto-control any that they spawned. Which isn't to say that Hide From Undead can't be useful, as much as to say that Zara has minions it's not going to immediately screw over available for the entirety of her career.

Turning attempts are going to be slim pickings by the time they reach the inner sanctum - undead turned before then are fodder intended to drain resources before the PCs can reach the true threat, so them being more vulnerable isn't too big an issue. Undeath To Death is a fine enough effect, but can't affect undead with 9 or more HD, and grants a Will save besides. It also has a costly material component, which will make the PCs leery about spamming it. A particularly fun defense against these kinds of tactics, at least within my sanctum, is putting Dispel Magic inside the Unhallow effect.


The tail end of the coin, though: she’s plain awesome. Your backstory gives us a plot hook right here, right now, Blair Witch Project-way, with the PCs recovering a bloodstained journal. Dungeon crawls have always the potential to be fun, and subterranean undead-filled ones even more so. What I particularly enjoy here is the attention you gave to how the PCs might relate to her abilities. The nastiest save-or-suck that make the game, well, suck for the paralysed PC. But also the large-scale undead raising ones, like General of Undeath or Plague of Undead, that allow Zara to send dozens of monsters razing hamlets to the ground. What more epic than the PCs rushing to confront a mother****ing Zombie Dragon-riding Zara, herself ridden by a Zombie Kobold, while her small elite guard of Dread Wraiths and Mummies assail the Royal Guard, but at the same time her legion of mooks face the spooked militia down in the street, and some nasty exploding Zombie Rats pop from behind by using the sewers, killing off scared peasants that raise at once as their Seed of Undeath activate? Maybe that. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0300.html)

https://media.giphy.com/media/D16XHdsB1PBxm/giphy.gif

[remetagross]

I was sure skill points added to 143. The breakdown I have is:
10 Balan
11 Bluff
11 Concentration
11 Disguise
11 Intimidate
10 K:Arcana
01 K:Dungeoneering
10 K:History
01 K:Local
01 K:Nature
10 K:Religion
01 K:thePlanes
11 P:Oratory
11 P:Sing
11 P:StringedInstrument
11 Sense Motive
11 Spellcraft
You're entirely correct, and I'm a moron :smallredface: I hadn't deducted points for that though.


BABY has the Chaotic and Good subtypes, and that line is derived from their description. Spells treat him as though he is Chaotic and Good, instead of Chaotic and Evil. Basically, Detect Evil won't work on him, but Detect Good will. Most importantly, Sanctify the Wicked will not work on him.
Wow, I absolutely didn't know that. Good to know. Though I didn't ding you for that either, I was just wondering out loud.

No change.

I'll tackle Zara's dispute tomorrow.

EDIT: Sorry folks, won't be able to get to it before tomorrow evening

[jdizzlean]

one more for you


First let me thank you for judging.

My dispute consists of 2 parts, the first me saying how angry I am about myself that I did forget to send my (very well thought out and hence taking a long time) skills.
In case it changes things to at least mention that I maxxed out concentration at 34 ranks, and put more than 20 each also into listen, spot and fly.
Completely my fault to not have rechecked it, I was truly strapped for time.

Part 2: actual dispute.
I have no problems at all with theow originalityy or the power score.

For the elegance rating of 1: incarnated constructs do gain feats and skillpts as if they had as many hit dice of their new race, in this case giant.
That is not totally undisputed, but also not as clear cut not the case as you put it. There are conflicting sources. I agree that this interpretation does deserve a reduced elegance, but disagree with giving only one point.
For the missing skillpts see above. Just a reminder: judges are not supposed to penalize multiple areas for the same thing.

Regarding power, more of a clarification than a dispute: I went for stone dragon maneuvers and only reaching penultimate bruiser ess at cr 12 for fluff reasons. Yes, I could have cheeses more powerful maneuvers in earlier but didn't do so due to thinking it more elegant.

Overall I would very much appreciate a less full dunk of my elegance, but again I admit it's a point of Contention. However only a single one. Maybe a total of 2.5 to 3 would be more fair?


As for the incarnate: of course I used the rules as they are in the book. I rolled for int and con, which in case of int resulted in the Stat as is, and in case of con one lower and received plus one via pts.

As for the attack and save stats: as I wrote below, I already figured in all attribute bonuses. Hence the higher numbers.

Thanks.

[jdizzlean]

a non-dispute :)

Godclaw

No disputes from me really, I was already aware of a lot of the issues (particularly around the fluff, that was a definite rush job!

Completely understand the points dinged from Originality, if I'd put a bit more time into planning an organic build with proper supporting fluff I feel I could have done a lot better here and in Memorable Villainy.

Also completely derped on the Stone Dragon manoeuvres. This is my first time using ToB, so probably should have read the text a bit closer xD. I think I would probably swap out Crusader for further Warshaper and Hexblade/Paladin of Slaughter levels if I had it again.

Thanks for your judgement, very much appreciate your hard work!

[remetagross]

a non-dispute :)

Godclaw

No disputes from me really, I was already aware of a lot of the issues (particularly around the fluff, that was a definite rush job!

Completely understand the points dinged from Originality, if I'd put a bit more time into planning an organic build with proper supporting fluff I feel I could have done a lot better here and in Memorable Villainy.

Also completely derped on the Stone Dragon manoeuvres. This is my first time using ToB, so probably should have read the text a bit closer xD. I think I would probably swap out Crusader for further Warshaper and Hexblade/Paladin of Slaughter levels if I had it again.

Thanks for your judgement, very much appreciate your hard work!

:smallsmile: you're welcome!



Alas, the eternal tradeoff: if you want good variety for your power rating, you need to use something that has lots of support. But if you use something with lots of support, it's because it's iconic so it's unoriginal. I mostly can't really disagree with this scoring, although I do have a few minor qualms:

1) I feel like drow goddesses other than Lolth come up approximately "never", and that putting together a villain revering Kiaransalee puts a spotlight on a kind of cleric that doesn't come up very often. Mind you, not that much - while most players won't have heard of this goddess, particularly among optimizers, the few that do probably know her from the Yathrinshee, a dual-caster-progression PrC focused around necromancy. I feel the goddess is weird enough to warrant a slight bump here, but I also feel it can't be too big a bump when her lore is strong enough to warrant an accompanying prestige class.

2) I feel like some of the spell suggestions are esoteric enough to make Zara stand out a bit more from the crowd of drow necromancers. It might be because I haven't looked too deeply into necromancy before, but I was surprised and intrigued by some of the spell effects I found along the way.

3) While it always feels weird to me bringing up other entries in regards to my own, I noticed that a villain using an infamously-powerful monster with an infamously-powerful template made for a character exemplifying the trope you mentioned got a 3.5. The point of that trope is that examples of it look original because "who combines these things" when it's really like button-mashing a keyboard with a list of common descriptors - that is to say, original, but in a "1000 monkeys banging on typewriters" kind of way that doesn't seem that much more "out there" than a particularly iconic villain. If that's enough for a 2-point lead in this category, then...I guess that's that, but it strikes me as odd.


1) Well, Kiaransalee isn't really a choice one can purposefully make to be original about a Drider/Drow Cleric necromancer: going this route means you're pretty much stuck with whatever death god your race worships, and you end up with Kiaransalee. OK, you could have picked a general death god instead, like Wee Jas or Nerull, but in the end that would have been somewhat more original than going the racial deity route. The deity choice comes rolled up in the "Drider Necromancer" package you decided to go with.

3) There's a difference between a monster tucked somewhere in the MMIII and which is infamously known on a forum of optimizers, with a template infamously known from the same select number of people (me excluded, I didn't know about that one before chancing upon it during that competition), and a monster accessible on the SRD, picking a character archetype generic enough that there are two whole base classes dedicated to achieving it (Dread Necromancer and Death Master) in addition to the already two different ways of doing it Core-only (Wizard and Cleric), and for which there is an entire rulebook (Libris Mortis).

2) Alright, this one is a completely legitimate point, and you do well to raise it, all the more that doing so for a prepared caster is more of a hassle than for a spontaneous one. I did have to read up on a number of spells of which I had no knowledge prior to judging your entry.+0.25 in Originality.




I feel like a contest for NPCs has a bit more wiggle room in RAW vs RAI, since the DM can more easily count on getting DM approval, but even then I'm leery to go outside RAW unless it's pretty clear, and in this case it seemed fairly clear to me. It is legitimately really weird that a goddess whose gospel includes a distrust for servants that can think for themselves doesn't grant the domain that makes it easier to have more unthinking servants. That she instead has the Pride domain is also really weird to me - Envy I can see, but Pride is weird. A ding here for going outside RAW is perhaps deserved, but I feel that this is the kind of "going outside RAW" that is more reasonable than some - I can't see too many DMs that aren't deadset on RAW denying this if a player asked, for instance.

I see your point about DMs having more leeway than players, but not in the purpose of this comp. It wouldn't be fair to the other entries if I accepted to overlook your (very reasonable) breach from RAW there.



There is no rule saying you can only have two domains, it's just that ways of getting more than two are relatively rare. Cloistered Cleric can get a third domain from first level relatively easy, and there's more than a couple Cleric PrCs that grant additional domains, and there's an epic feat for it as well. My racial casting comes with two domains that come from Lolth's list regardless of if I worship Lolth or not, and then when I take levels in cleric, I gain two more based on who/what I worship.

A bit more to the point, dinging me on Elegance for going a bit outside of RAW, and dinging me on Elegance for using RAW in a weird way to gain advantage, are both individually fair things to ding me on, but side-by-side they start looking weird. Do you want me to follow the rules or not?


Fair point here as well about the "follow the rules or not" here. However, I did not deduct you any points for the matter of having four domains instead of two. I was simply musing aloud, because I have never encountered that particular situation before. Also, to clarify what I found weird: there definitely is no rule preventing a Cleric from having more than two domains, as you underlined. However, the way the racial spellcasting of the Drow is worded, it seems that the various domains to which Drows are entitled to as part of their racial spellcasting come essentially from the same mechanics that grants two domains to a 1st level Cleric. As such, I had a sort of a "bonuses from the same source Don't stack" reflex when I read your entry.



Hmm...Undeath After Death is still available via Miracle, buuuuuut that just means it's still an option that can affect my late-game power but is still worthy of an Elegance ding. I guess if the ding was for not being able to use it at all, it should be undone a bit since I can use it, but it still definitely warrants a ding.


...alright, given that for that one particular RAW issue I have dinged you 0.01 points, the penalty is halved and the ding is now 0.005 points. Elegance raised by 0.005 :smallamused:



This is part of why she's set up inside a weird onyx mine, to increase access. Granted, most DMs that would run a villain like this would handwave the costs in some fashion, or make her gaining access to a horde of onyx a plot point the PCs have to deal with, but even if she's just paying for it out of pocket, it's never a gigantic problem since she can go "solo adventuring" to steal some loot.
That's a no, either. In order to be fair with regard to the other entries, I cannot dismiss any extra WBL expenses your monster might have. Say, your whole strategy is focused aroud spamming Forcecage. That 1.500gp cost is going to eat into your resources at some point, while other entries might buy an Amulet of Health in the meantime.


Discounting gish spells because she's too weak to enter melee when those gish spells are what would enable her to get in close without getting her butt handed to her feels like double jeopardy - her basic stats don't include the alterations those spells would make, but if they did she'd look a lot more formidable.

Of course, the gish spells are mostly on there for a different purpose: that is, giving Zara a flexible level of optimization, which is an option Zara and a few of the other caster villains have, but less so the non-caster villains. Zara has options available that will allow her to be played at a level that's challenging for the PCs no matter how optimal they may be (outside of some edge cases where the PCs are particularly well-built). Mind you, I don't think the ease with which she can be played with a handicap should affect her Power rating, but it feels like it should affect something for making it easier for DMs to adapt Zara for their games and players.[/QUOTE]
If she's a Gish, then her frailty becomes even more of a weakness, as she will be put in the frontline all the more. And Gish spells means that much more preparation time needed before the encounter begins, compounding a weakness I have already stated, and that much less ability to react should she be caught with her pants down. (What would spider pants look like, anyway?). If she's not a Gish, she has no point preparing these spells. The argument of having a villain with an adjustable threat level is more reasonable, but you'll note that I have already accounted for it in reaction to the spells you have pointed at as being somewhat unfair to the PCs.



Zara's lair is where she keeps safe while sleeping and worships the goddess, but she strays from it to go find more powerful foes to murder and animate - those dragon corpses didn't just appear in her lair, she had to go get them. Yes, the ones she creates outside of her HQ have slightly fewer HP, but while for most necromancers Desecrate is what makes their minions truly useful, for Zara it's more icing on the cake when she's defending her lair. Most of her more useful servants are either in the desecration area with Zara, or are outside of it with Zara, and she can keep them safe-ish with Rebuke Undead, if it's even necessary.

That is pretty much what I said.


Hide From Undead against mindless undead, but even from CR 7 Zara has intelligent undead she gets to play around with that can self-propagate: Sticks And Stones can give her access to a wight a day after casting, while Summon Undead V can give you shadow/wight access for a few rounds - just long enough for them to get a kill and cause the kill to rise as a permanent spawn. Awaken Undead can turn my skeletons and zombies into smarties again, and Create (Greater) Undead only gives intelligent minions, some of which can self-propagate. The self-propagation is important because while I can control just one undead, they can auto-control any that they spawned. Which isn't to say that Hide From Undead can't be useful, as much as to say that Zara has minions it's not going to immediately screw over available for the entirety of her career.

Turning attempts are going to be slim pickings by the time they reach the inner sanctum - undead turned before then are fodder intended to drain resources before the PCs can reach the true threat, so them being more vulnerable isn't too big an issue. Undeath To Death is a fine enough effect, but can't affect undead with 9 or more HD, and grants a Will save besides. It also has a costly material component, which will make the PCs leery about spamming it. A particularly fun defense against these kinds of tactics, at least within my sanctum, is putting Dispel Magic inside the Unhallow effect.

There's a bazillion anti-undead spells other than Hide from Undead and Undeath to Death. Off the top of my head, Sunburst, Sunbeam, Searing Light...that don't all have a costly material component. Which don't check for the opponent being intelligent either - and mind you, Awaken Undead has an exp component, meaning it's not free-spammable. About the fodder waves - high level PCs can simply mow through them without expanding any resources, a high-level martial initiator can singlehandedly take on a horde of mindless grounded foes with relative ease. Besides, the PCs can also fly over the horde, and entirely bypass them with no harm done. So you can't expect high level PCs to be drained of resources in any meaningful fashion by the time they reach the sanctum - at least, no unless Zara expends resources of her own, in the form of intelligent minions or reanimated dragons.

[ben-zayb]

@remetagross In case you just accidentally missed it, there's one more pending dispute (for Igor)

@jdizzlean Do you already have a villain theme for the next round in mind, or is the floor open for suggestions?

[AvatarVecna]

Anyone else willing to step up to the plate and judge?

[remetagross]

@remetagross In case you just accidentally missed it, there's one more pending dispute (for Igor)


Yeah, I'd seen it, but I haven't had the time to get around it yet :smallsmile:

[remetagross]

My dispute consists of 2 parts, the first me saying how angry I am about myself that I did forget to send my (very well thought out and hence taking a long time) skills.
In case it changes things to at least mention that I maxxed out concentration at 34 ranks, and put more than 20 each also into listen, spot and fly.
Completely my fault to not have rechecked it, I was truly strapped for time.

It happens :smallsmile: better get a half-finished entry in than no entry at all!



For the elegance rating of 1: incarnated constructs do gain feats and skillpts as if they had as many hit dice of their new race, in this case giant.
That is not totally undisputed, but also not as clear cut not the case as you put it. There are conflicting sources. I agree that this interpretation does deserve a reduced elegance, but disagree with giving only one point.

Do they? As far as I know, there is no version of the Incarnate Construct Template more recent than the one in Savage Species, and no 3.5 update for Savage Species has been given out. I'm having the book open before me as I type, and there's that line, written as clearly as it can get:




Feats: An incarnate construct has no feats when it becomes a living creature, but if later gains levels, it acquires feats normally.





Feats: An incarnate construct has no skill points when it becomes a living creature, but if later gains levels, it acquires skill points normally.


So, sorry, but yes, that is as clear cut as I put it. Now, I am totally open to any source that would contradict that, but I haven't found any.




For the missing skillpts see above. Just a reminder: judges are not supposed to penalize multiple areas for the same thing.

That is entirely correct, and my bad for having overlooked that I dinged your build on the matter of skill points both in Elegance and in Power. +0.5 in Elegance.


Regarding power, more of a clarification than a dispute: I went for stone dragon maneuvers and only reaching penultimate bruiser ess at cr 12 for fluff reasons. Yes, I could have cheeses more powerful maneuvers in earlier but didn't do so due to thinking it more elegant.
Your choice, but less power is less power, and (an Incarnate Construct Greater Stone Golem that dips in Crusader and Swordsage before going Warblade with maneuver array A) is only marginally more elegant than (an Incarnate Construct Greater Stone Golem that dips in Crusader and Swordsage before going Warblade with maneuver array B), if at all! :smalltongue:




As for the incarnate: of course I used the rules as they are in the book. I rolled for int and con, which in case of int resulted in the Stat as is, and in case of con one lower and received plus one via pts.
Yes, of course, but I have this nagging feeling that at some point in a past comp it was ruled to generate such ability scores in the case of an Awakened Something precisely not by the rules as they are in the book. If that rings a bell to any Playgrounder, I'd gladly take their input. But it's not a big deal either way.



As for the attack and save stats: as I wrote below, I already figured in all attribute bonuses. Hence the higher numbers.

That's a fairly unusual thing to do...anyway, sorry for having missed it in your text. All the same, a bog standard Greater Stone Golem has a BAB of +31 and a Str of 37, meaning a to-hit bonus of +44, and not +38 as you wrote it. There's still a snag somewhere.

[jdizzlean]

i do have something, but suggestions are always welcome for future rounds


if no one else is judging, and no further disputes, i'll post reveal and new round sunday night sometime

[unseenmage]

Though I cannot participate I would adore reading something Construct related.

Finding a way to make Golems fight able instead of a frustrating slog of hp and immunities would be neat.

But that's just me.

[daremetoidareyo]

Kaiju monsters!!

[Thurbane]

Though I cannot participate I would adore reading something Construct related.

Finding a way to make Golems fight able instead of a frustrating slog of hp and immunities would be neat.

But that's just me.

There were a few constructs in this round: Villainous Competition XVII: It's Alive! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?507768)


Kaiju monsters!!

That's another one that seems a popular request. I'd be down for that!

I think there's also been requests for a yin/yan round (a creature that embodies two opposite ideals).

I'm always up to complete, time permitting.

[ben-zayb]

Not sure if it's possible as a proper D&D antagonist, but a morally corrupt Official/Executive/Royalty. Basically, that guy who abusively leverages his rank within the system to attain his goals.

[remetagross]

Not sure if it's possible as a proper D&D antagonist, but a morally corrupt Official/Executive/Royalty. Basically, that guy who abusively leverages his rank within the system to attain his goals.

This one'd be nice! :smallsmile:

And as always I'll put forward my McGuffin villain: think Sauron and the One Ring, Voldemort and his Horcruxes...a villain that either depends on a McGuffin for its power, or that can only be defeated if the McGuffin is used against him, or...

[jdizzlean]

i've been working on a mcguffin one, it's finding limitations i'm happy w/ that are proving difficult, it is coming however in the future

here's a rebuttal for now


Indeed, there are other sources than SS for the spell.

More specifically the spell compendium which unlike SS is a real 3.5 book, and supercedes it. It changed the rolling method to 3d6 and made them gain feats and skills for the gained hd. And made me consider this build at all.

Now some people argue that that was a misprint, hence why I said there are possible disputes, and would be OK with a small elegance reduction for using it, but again, your main Contention with my builds elegance should be sufficiently removed by that, yes?

[remetagross]

Indeed, there are other sources than SS for the spell.

More specifically the spell compendium which unlike SS is a real 3.5 book, and supercedes it. It changed the rolling method to 3d6 and made them gain feats and skills for the gained hd. And made me consider this build at all.

Now some people argue that that was a misprint, hence why I said there are possible disputes, and would be OK with a small elegance reduction for using it, but again, your main Contention with my builds elegance should be sufficiently removed by that, yes?


...I think I'm seeing it now. You are actually referring to the Awaken Construct spell, aren't you? This spell is indeed present both in SS and in the SpC. And indeed the text of the spell more or less ambiguously describes the way the Awakened creature gains skills and feats. Alright here.

However, Igor is not an Awakened Construct but an Incarnate Construct, which is entirely different. For one, the Awaken Construct spell (SS p.63) is different from the Incarnate Construct spell (SS p.67). The former has been updated in 3.5 while the latter has not. The Awaken Construct spell does not provide the construct with the Incarnate Construct template: only the Incarnate Construct spell does so.

The thing is, there is a major difference between the Awaken Construct and the Incarnate Construct spell, that makes it so that I cannot just assume we can swap one for the other in your build and ding you a minor amount in Elegance for that. Using the Incarnate Construct spell gives Igor the Incarnate Construct template which halves his CR and does not gives neither feats nor skill points. Using the Awaken Construct spell does not give Igor any template, gives him feats and skill points and lets his CR at 16. So this is one of two things. Either Igor works off of the Incarnate Construct spell, and all his feats and skill points are illegal. Or he works off of the Awaken Construct spell, and he is in excess of 8 class levels. Either way, the elegance penalty remains the same.

[jdizzlean]

this has been asked, answered, and beaten to death. at this point, its your call if you want to entertain further discussion on it

generally speaking, it's one dispute, and 1 rebuttal



Well, that's what I get for not recheck Ing my entry again. Dang.

Igor is an awakened incarnate winged greater stone golem.

So he does get feats, skillpts and such, and I a smaller dunk in elegance for cheese, or will you insist on judging a slight rush job in the harshest way possible regarding that part?

As I agree, he does not work as intended with only incarnated. But then again, such mistakes happen when one is building a monster in fits of 15 minutes over a few weeks.

Sorry for the inconvenience.

[remetagross]

Ok, my final answer on the matter.

1. Igor is supposed to be an Awakened Golem, or an Incarnate Golem, but cannot be an Awakened Incarnate Golem as you just said, because Incarnate turns Igor into a Giant creature, not a Construct, and as such is not eligible to be Awakened. He could not be an Incarnate Awakened Golem either because the Incarnate template would then supersede the feats provided by the Awaken Construct spell and leave Igor featless all the same.

2. I thus repeat my prior stance: either Igor is an Awakened Golem, his actual CR is 26, and his elegance should be 0 as I did for the Captain (who has a CR of 23). Or he is an Incarnate Construct, and he does not have these 14 Martial Study feats. I am sticking with the last one, and conserving the Elegance penalty.

I do empathize with the issues that come with rushed entries or entries on which you work little by little over an extended period of time, that make you miss details and prerequisites. But I have to be fair, and I have dinged similarly harshly the Ice King for the same issue.

[Falontani]

I have no arguments for the judge.

[jdizzlean]

Entry
Competitor
Description
Score 1
Total
Placing


BABY Sweetkiss (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=23697249&postcount=89)
ben-zayb
CE Male Firre Eladrin Bard 4 / Sublime Chord 1 / Mystic Theurge 5
20
20
Gold


Zara Faertith (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=23697256&postcount=92)
AvatarVecna
?? Drider Cleric 13
19.755
19.755
Silver


Tepel The Godclaw (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=23697258&postcount=93)
Lionheart
?? 3-Headed Leskylor Half-Farspawn Warshaper 2/Crusader 6
18.5
18.5
Bronze


Crud (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=23697248&postcount=88)
Mike Miller
LE Half-Orc Crusader 20
17.25
17.25
4th


The DECAPITATOR! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=23697251&postcount=90)
Hackulator
NE? Spellwarped Advanced Razor Boar
16.75
16.75
5th


Igor the Fleshy (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=23697261&postcount=94)
GrayDeath
LE Winged Incarnate Greater Stone Golem Crusader 1/Swordsage 1/Warblade 9
16.25
16.25
6th


Jaas Kraal (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=23697254&postcount=91)
Thurbane
Male LE Large Elemental Immoth Sorcerer 1/Paladin of Tyranny 2/Eldritch Knight 8
15.75
15.75
7th
Honorable Mention



The Drowned Captain (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=23697244&postcount=87)
Falontani
CE Drowned Paragon
14.5
14.5
8th

[jdizzlean]

congrats all, this round really came together in the final day! (Stop doing that, my heart can't take it lol)

i have an observation on The DECAPITATOR!

this rounds stipulation that every aspect of a given feat applies multiple times means that Improved Critical was actually calculated wrongly in my opinion. Each application in the build only granted another 1 to the threat range, however the feat doubles the threat range when it's applied, meaning:

1st use: 19-20
2nd use: 16-20
3rd use: 12-20
4th use: 4-20
5th use: automatic

meaning you could've taken 7 more stacks of BAB +1 if you wanted to and then auto crit everything in sight. It's only to bad you couldn't great cleave to your hearts content as well :D

[jdizzlean]

new round up

[Thurbane]

Congrats all!

Yeah, really wish I'd allowed myself more time to write up the fluff and CR breakdowns and play tips for Jaas Kraal, the Ice King.

Oh well, pretty happy for the honorable mention. :smallsmile:

[ben-zayb]

Congrats to everyone, especially fellow medalists/hm! Finally being able to incorporate Androlynne into one of my entries was fun.

[remetagross]

congrats all, this round really came together in the final day! (Stop doing that, my heart can't take it lol)

i have an observation on The DECAPITATOR!

this rounds stipulation that every aspect of a given feat applies multiple times means that Improved Critical was actually calculated wrongly in my opinion. Each application in the build only granted another 1 to the threat range, however the feat doubles the threat range when it's applied, meaning:

1st use: 19-20
2nd use: 16-20
3rd use: 12-20
4th use: 4-20
5th use: automatic

meaning you could've taken 7 more stacks of BAB +1 if you wanted to and then auto crit everything in sight. It's only to bad you couldn't great cleave to your hearts content as well :D

An interesting take on it! I've assumed it was a case of regular DnD multiplication though, but maybe there's some leeway somewhere around the proper definition of what a "DnD multiplication" is...either way, I enjoyed judging as well, diving deep into the builds really helps to appreciaate all the nooks and crannies that've been polished everywhere. Like with these obscure spells of Zara Faertith!

[Lionheart]

Yeah, thanks and congrats to all! After seeing all the other entries I was sure that mine wasn't going to get very far, but happy to be surprised!

See you all in the next round ;)

[jdizzlean]

An interesting take on it! I've assumed it was a case of regular DnD multiplication though, but maybe there's some leeway somewhere around the proper definition of what a "DnD multiplication" is...either way, I enjoyed judging as well, diving deep into the builds really helps to appreciaate all the nooks and crannies that've been polished everywhere. Like with these obscure spells of Zara Faertith!

it gets even better.

if every attack is an automatic critical, and every critical is automatically confirmed, what do you do w/ rolling a 1? It's a critical failure, but at the same time, an automatic critical success.... have you gone and erased that rule from the book? Chew on that.

[AvatarVecna]

it gets even better.

if every attack is an automatic critical, and every critical is automatically confirmed, what do you do w/ rolling a 1? It's a critical failure, but at the same time, an automatic critical success.... have you gone and erased that rule from the book? Chew on that.

A critical threat is not an automatic hit unless it is a nat 20. If you roll a critical threat but you.missed....you still missed.

[jdizzlean]

A critical threat is not an automatic hit unless it is a nat 20. If you roll a critical threat but you.missed....you still missed.

except improved critical expands that threat range beyond a nat 20. I don't know, i never got on board when the rules changed and you had to "confirm criticals". I felt that was a serious nerf to players in general.

if you threaten a critical on a roll of 0-20, then every attack is a critical hit as you will also automatically confirm those critical hits.

[AvatarVecna]

except improved critical expands that threat range beyond a nat 20.

You know what else expands the threat range beyond a nat 20? A weapon with a naturally higher critical threat chance. But that still doesn't change the rules: before you determine whether an attack roll is a critical threat, you have to determine whether it is a hit or not. If you roll a 19 while wielding a greatsword, but 19 + your attack bonus would not hit their AC, you don't threaten a critical, you miss. This is the basic function of how attack rolls work: d20 + your bonus vs a DC. Nat 1s and Nat 20s are exceptions to the rule, but in 3.5, the specific rules for a nat 20 do not extend to "any weapon with a wider critical range"; if you have a whatever-20 critical threat range, you still have to hit if you want to crit.

And a nat 1 is an automatic miss, regardless of how big your attack bonus is, regardless of how big your critical threat range is. This has nothing to do with "confirming criticals", and everything to do with "confirming hits in the first place".


I don't know, i never got on board when the rules changed and you had to "confirm criticals". I felt that was a serious nerf to players in general.

if you threaten a critical on a roll of 0-20, then every attack is a critical hit as you will also automatically confirm those critical hits.

Your feelings on what the rules should be does not change what the rules are. Making affirmations about RAW that are really "rules as I want them to be" is misleading.

EDIT:


When you make an attack roll and get a natural 20 (the d20 shows 20), you hit regardless of your target’s Armor Class, and you have scored a threat. The hit might be a critical hit (or "crit"). To find out if it’s a critical hit, you immediately make a critical roll—another attack roll with all the same modifiers as the attack roll you just made. If the critical roll also results in a hit against the target’s AC, your original hit is a critical hit. (The critical roll just needs to hit to give you a crit. It doesn’t need to come up 20 again.) If the critical roll is a miss, then your hit is just a regular hit.

A critical hit means that you roll your damage more than once, with all your usual bonuses, and add the rolls together. Unless otherwise specified, the threat range for a critical hit on an attack roll is 20, and the multiplier is ×2.

Exception: Extra damage dice over and above a weapon’s normal damage is not multiplied when you score a critical hit.

Increased Threat Range
Sometimes your threat range is greater than 20. That is, you can score a threat on a lower number. In such cases, a roll of lower than 20 is not an automatic hit. Any attack roll that doesn’t result in a hit is not a threat.

Increased Critical Multiplier
Some weapons deal better than double damage on a critical hit.

Spells and Critical Hits
A spell that requires an attack roll can score a critical hit. A spell attack that requires no attack roll cannot score a critical hit.

[PrismCat21]

I came to basically say what AvatarVecna said. Thank you AvatarVecna. :)
So remetagross, you were absolutely correct.

[jdizzlean]

excuse me.

let us go with Post As Intended, over Past As Written, and replace attack with hit, or attacks that hit,. then everything else i said still stands. this would also be a great example of RAI over RAW being stupid lol