OOTS #513 - The Discussion Thread

[The Giant]

New comic is up.

[Animefunkmaster]

That was awesome. Loved the buffed up ?vampires?. Totally forgot she was apart of team evil. Great as always.

[TRM]

Dun! Dun! Dun!
Great comic Giant.

Hmm... I wonder what those things with Tsukiko are. Did they cast their own buff spells? Or did Tsukiko do it?

[Querzis]

Are those Vampires? I guess the rift blocking out the sun is really usefull for them then.

[Amon Hen]

Awesome strip! Sounds like Tsukiko did a good job planning this out.:smallbiggrin:

"Remember we're using the buddy system" LOL!

[Guildorn Tanaleth]

Quite good! So, we see that Tsukiko is working nicely as a member of Team Evil. Exactly what kind of undead are those that she's created?

[Shades of Gray]

I think so... maybe dominated vampires.

And Tsukiko seems so nice about it. wait doesn't she LOVE undead:smallyuk:

[Shishnarfne]

Well, this looks like a bad day to be a Rogue in Azure City...

...but it's good to see that Haley still remembers the standard OotS plan A: Run away!

[Kish]

Deathly pallor, black clothing with capes, fangs: Vampires.

[Aidan305]

Hmmm. Vampires?

[PirateMonk]

Undead with safety whistles? :smallbiggrin:

Though if they don't breathe, they may have a hard time blowing...

[Lyinginbedmon]

Black Squadron is absolutely wonderful! I love their near-child-like submission to Tsukiko and her organisation system. :smallbiggrin:

[TRM]

I think so... maybe dominated vampires.

And Tsukiko seems so nice about it. wait doesn't she LOVE undead:smallyuk:

Aren't, as undead, vampires immune to domination? Maybe, friendly vampires. They just love Tsukiko so much they want to help her out.

[Heritage]

Undead with safety whistles? :smallbiggrin:

Though if they don't breathe, they may have a hard time blowing...

Can they maybe use their lungs to just blow anyway, or have they withered away inside their torsos? Hmm....(scratch scratch)

[Laurellien]

What are the white thingies?

Cool comic.

[Antamar]

I love the double punchline comic. Especially the PC chances:smallbiggrin:.

[Caledonian]

Wow! Those undead monstrosities are simultaneously lame and awesome.

[Sundog]

I love bad guys with BRAINS! A response force, a signal system - I am so using this against my PCs!

[Pantler]

Well, now we know that Tsukiko is at least level 12 (Teleport: 9th level of Wizard + 3 levels of Cleric to be a Mystic Theurge).
Also, this once again raises the question: who is considered a PC?

[Lord Iames Osari]

Somebody's been reading the Evil Overlord List (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/EvilOverlordList). :smallamused:

[PirateMonk]

Huh, a comic was posted ten minutes ago and yet the forum is loading if anything better than normal.

Too early for the big rush?

[Strengfellow]

Well she has to keep her boys safe for the post slayage party (orgy) which is also another use for the safty whistle (word)

In a word I'm all sticky and naked, did I miss somthing fun?

[Rhyeira]

What are the white thingies?

The ones they wear around their necks? Their safety whistles, most likely...

[OverWilliam]

I am still dieing laughing at that Hobgoblin's reaction at seeing the red level. :smallbiggrin:

[Falconer]

Love it! Great work, Giant.

"And if you see a Good cleric, what do you do?"

"Blow our safety whistles."


Excellent stuff.

[El_Frenchie]

Awesome comic, I loved the "safety whistle" part, hahaha.

[SteveMB]

"Let me look it up on the chart" -- LOL!

[Quinsar]

ha ha buddy systen saftey whistle
pure genius

[heroe_de_leyenda]

I do think they are vampires, can't think of anything similar right now.

Great comic, btw!



Made it to the first page, I thought this day would never come! My life is complete :P :smalltongue:

[Bayar]

Most likely they are vampires created from hobgoblin corpses...

And it is nice to see some funny stuff again (well that explains the red dancing lights...in my mind there was only yellow dancing lights...)

[Dervag]

The only thing I hate more than Lawful Competent enemies is... lots of Lawful Competent enemies.


Undead with safety whistles? :smallbiggrin:

Though if they don't breathe, they may have a hard time blowing...Aha! A flaw in her vile scheme!

[sihnfahl]

And Tsukiko seems so nice about it. wait doesn't she LOVE undead:smallyuk:
It's been assumed Tsukiko took the Lich Loved feat (which involves some rather unnatural acts with the undead).

[the_tick_rules]

poor DHS, someone worked really hard on that system.

[Green Bean]

Aren't, as undead, vampires immune to domination? Maybe, friendly vampires. They just love Tsukiko so much they want to help her out.

Command Undead (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/commandUndead.htm) would certainly do the trick.

[Zythran]

*BAMF*

nightcrawler rulez :D

[menkent]

i was thinking vampires would be out of her league, but the little goth capes kinda seals it :p

[Wych]

Never thought Tsukkiko would be the motherly type...

oh and awesome comic as usual.

[Marelt Ekiran]

Well, now we know that Tsukiko is at least level 12 (Teleport: 9th level of Wizard + 3 levels of Cleric to be a Mystic Theurge).
Also, this once again raises the question: who is considered a PC?

Well, if you read the description of the Teleport spell, it states that it can only take one medium creature per 3 levels along with the caster. So in order to take six vampires with her, she must have had a caster level of 18. So even assuming that she took Practised Spellcaster (which is not a core feat), that would put her at an 18th level character, meaning almost on par with Xykon himself and likely well past Redcloak.... I find that somewhat unlikely.

[otakuryoga]

yay Tsukiko...was hoping we would see her again

still playin with team evil...wonder if :redcloak: is getting along any better with her now....he didnt exactly play well with her on first meeting

[Krytha]

Noooo brown-cloak! Why did you have to dieeee?!

[Yendor]

Well, if you read the description of the Teleport spell, it states that it can only take one medium creature per 3 levels along with the caster. So in order to take six vampires with her, she must have had a caster level of 18. So even assuming that she took Practised Spellcaster (which is not a core feat), that would put her at an 18th level character, meaning almost on par with Xykon himself and likely well past Redcloak.... I find that somewhat unlikely.

We also saw Wizard Guy (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0340.html) teleport six creatures with him. And it doesn't appear they're going strictly to the description (they're not in contact with the caster).

[WarriorTribble]

Huh, another teleport that doesn't work with establised rules. Is this a subtle comment on the spell :smalltongue: ?

I wonder how the hob goblin mage was able to estimate Haley's level.

[otakuryoga]

hmmmm, can i be Tsukiko's "buddy"?

[Faltenin]

Really excellent comic - and so much more believable than most campaigns / books / movies that I've seen.

It does raise the question of evil motives though - why the occupation of the city so efficiently (instead of going after other gates)? What is Xykon doing? (with his ADD, I'm assuming he lets Redcloak organize defense)

Now all they need is an AWACS-like creature flying overhead and spamming "Detect Good".:smallwink:

[Sc00by]

Hmmm. Interesting undead at last. Zombies might be easy to make, but vampires are more fun and a nice?! way of stopping, Haley at least, from getting too many levels above Roy! :wink:

[otakuryoga]

Huh, another teleport that doesn't work with establised rules. Is this a subtle comment on the spell :smalltongue: ?

I wonder how the hob goblin mage was able to estimate Haley's level.

he didnt have to...red diamond level refers to "high chance of pc's"
browncloak saw a pc so set off the red diamond alert

[Irbis]

Are they really Vampires? The single vampire we have seen so far looked completely different than those. Also, what is a 'buddy system'?

By the way - why they aren't [if they are vampires] polimorphed to bats? That way, hey could've searched bigger area and turn to their humanoid form if needed, along with another signal. :smallsigh:

[mockingbyrd7]

I think Rich just uses a different form of teleport. "I wanna be evil too!" and "I am so telling Xykon about this!" just doesn't seem like the kind of attitude someone who can cast 9th level spells would take, but I could be wrong. Personally, I think it's stupid that you have to be level 18 to teleport a six-man party to a given location, but that's just me. (Uh-oh for The Resistance if Tsukiko really is that high-level.)

Awesome comic, by the way. Reminds me of fourth grade.

[HOLEkevin]

I figured them for wights. (You know, 'cuz they're white…)

Anyway, this is an excellent display of why I love this strip. Good storytelling, good pacing, good funny.

[SteveMB]

he didnt have to...red diamond level refers to "high chance of pc's"
browncloak saw a pc so set off the red diamond alert

The chart is also calibrated in "Encounter Level" ratings. (Given how well organized the hobgoblin army is, they might have coordinated survivors' accounts of previous brushes with Haley, gotten what intel they could, and briefed the troops, so Browncloak recognized her as a red-level threat.)

[Xandias]

I don't really think that they were vampires. though they were pale and had sharp teeeth.... ah well.

Great as always Rich




:thog:

[carabaldo]

Ehm sorry but I didn't understand this last comic.
language barrier, probably
What's a BUddy System?
And what's a security whistle?
?_?

[Boodi]

Wow, team evil are looking more and more organized.

...teehee "blow on our whistle"



Ehm sorry but I didn't understand this last comic.
language barrier, probably
What's a BUddy System?
And what's a security whistle?
?_?

A buddy system is where you have 2 people who are buddies. It is so that people are never separated.

And the whistle probably means that if there's a good cleric they'd get turned, so blowing the whistle would call Tsukiko

....I think

[Freelance Henchman]

AHAHA love the color-coded security system!!

Tsukiko and her childish vampires are also fantastic, so cute and goofy.

[Yendor]

It's quite possible that Redcloak has guessed Haley is still in the city, and given his officers a description of her just in case.

[Woot Spitum]

Noooo brown-cloak! Why did you have to dieeee?!Because he didn't have a name. A name would have saved him.

It would seem that in the OOTS, brown cloak=red shirt, red cloak=mauve shirt.

[The_Hunting_Enemy]

When I first saw them I thought they might be ghasts, but they can't be, based on previous ones. Maybe Wights?

Vampires wouldn't be as dumb as that, or fall prey to Tsukiko's weird mind-control effect-thingies, would they?

(Also, they have two sets of teeth... Do Hobgoblin vampires keep both sets?)

[Viperion]

If Rich is going by D&D Monsters, my money is on Vampire Spawn. Look like Vampires, fight like Vampires, can be created by "Create (Greater?) Undead" spell, are under control of the person that created them, can't create their own spawn.

But it could be nearly anything. Hobgoblins have pointy teeth, so the teeth don't really mean anything. I think the Wight (White, heh) is probably more on the mark.

Viperion

[nooblade]

I was expecting worse when the signal went up. Like someone would incinerate an entire section of the city or something. But if they had grain and a huge army to feed I guess it wouldn't make much sense.

And I have no clue if "Lich Loved" is a real feat or just a joke.

[Icewalker]

She's baaaaaaaaaack!

Awesome.

[jmaccabeus]

The bad guys (and girl) really do have their act together. It's a big change; I suppose you could call it a nice one, though it's certainly not good for the PCs...

I also don't think I've ever heard "resistant" being used as an adjectival form of "resistance" when the latter refers to a group of people. It's interesting what the English language can do when you give it a bit of a chance... :smallwink:

[Megalomaniac2]

Loved: Tsukiko's not just useful on Team Evil, she's Special Ops! Love it and the BAMF! Wonder if she's still hating on Redcloak and vice versa...

Hate: Browncloak! NOOO! Also, I fear that the RL parallels in the threat-warning system and insurgency are going to char-broil the forums like Miko never did.

[Mad Scientist]

Wow, does this mean that Redcloak is a "real" badguy in his own right? Now he has a fortress, at least one underling, and PC's dedicated to thwarting his plans!

[The Tygre]

This latest one was great! Tsukiko's back, and it looks like she has a promotion. Are those vampire spawn she's controlling, or wights? Guess we'll know in a strip or two.

Gotta' admire the hob security system, on a side note.

Keep up the good work, Giant!

[Kami2awa]

I think so... maybe dominated vampires.

And Tsukiko seems so nice about it. wait doesn't she LOVE undead:smallyuk:

Well, among undead that you could reasonably fine attractive, vampires are often portrayed as sexy and charismatic e.g. Dracula, Underworld, Anne Rice...

I'm wondering if there will be a scene reminiscent of this one:

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/erf0030.html

between Tsukiko and Haley...

[Heroic]

Totally awesome comic, as expected :smallwink:

[Manticore]

I suddenly have the sneaking suspicion that Belkar is about to make his reappearance. Presumably he still has the mark of justice on him, so he would have been useless against hobgoblins. However, these guys are undead, so...:belkar:

[explanetpluto]

BAMF! Undead Boy Scouts!!

[shylocxs]

*BAMF*

nightcrawler rulez :D

Wow, it took 36 posts before that got mentioned! I thought that was damn funny!

Nightcrawler indeed does rulez!

[mause]

Awsome Haley gained a few levels

[ishnar]

Ehm sorry but I didn't understand this last comic.
language barrier, probably
What's a BUddy System?
And what's a security whistle?
?_?

When kids go on a field trip. They are told to stick together at all times. > the buddy system. And, sometimes they are given a whistle to blow in an emergency.

It's funny that shes basically acting like a chaperon to a bunch of small children on a field trip :)

Which is probably the answer to the teleport question. They are small vampires, not medium. :)

[Oslecamo]

Ehm sorry but I didn't understand this last comic.
language barrier, probably
What's a BUddy System?
And what's a security whistle?
?_?

Buddy system and security whistle are stuff that many real life american little kids are taugh to use when they go in school excursions, especially in wilderness.

Buddy system:everybody give hands to a partner so they don't easily get lost. It's used in a lot of countries actually.

Security whistle:normal whistle actually, but kids like big names, meh. Blow it if something wrong happens. A good whistle can be heard in a bigger distance than a normal scream.

My guess is that this comic intended to show Tsukiko "motherly" love for undeads. These vampires were probably raised only a few months ago so they are technically undead "childs", so Tsukiko treats them like a normal women would treat little living children.

My guess it's that she's only truly atracted by "older" stronger undead. Xykon, all old and bony must look to her as a Leonardo de Caprio. These hobgoblin vampires are still too green for her to lust.

[dakiwiboid]

Roll out that Belkar! He's perfect for giving the undead a smackdown! I must admit that it's good to see Tsukiko, though.

I hope that she escapes to bring on more amusing evil.

[Cade]

Wow, it took 36 posts before that got mentioned! I thought that was damn funny!

Nightcrawler indeed does rulez!

I hope Rich knows it's been copyrighted....

Bamf, that is.

[PaladinFreak]

I'm betting that they are full-blown Vampires, considering they were sent after a EL 13+ encounter.

*snnnrk* Vampire buddy system...

[Cuddly]

Were those half-orc vampires?

[Kelly]

Well, among undead that you could reasonably fine attractive, vampires are often portrayed as sexy and charismatic e.g. Dracula, Underworld, Anne Rice...

I'm wondering if there will be a scene reminiscent of this one:

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/erf0030.html

between Tsukiko and Haley...
It might be just me, but I'd draw vampires with top fangs showing when mouth is closed, not bottom ones.

Somehow, I don't think that the evil hoyay would be quite so sexy between stick figures. OotS's art is good for comedy and getting the story told, but it does render that sort of fanservice a trifle moot. Also, it doesn't seem like something Tsukiko would do of her own accord, and how would she know about Haley's Latent Bisexuality?

[Duke Malagigi]

And I have no clue if "Lich Loved" is a real feat or just a joke.

Yes, it's a real feat. It exists and is found in the 3rd edition Book of Vile Darkness.

[PhallicWarrior]

Well, that cannot be good.

[Duke Malagigi]

Well, that cannot be good.

What can't be good?

[Huckminster]

You know what this means: Long lines at security in the Azure City airport.

I hope everybody has plastic wrap and duct tape at home.

[yoshi927]

Tsukiko seems to be a better small-group strategist than Redcloak. Great comic.

[Irbis]

Were those half-orc vampires?

They are Therklas, actually. :smallsigh:

[BURNhollywoodBURN]

LOL the buddy system that was so funny. The terrorist signal thing was hilarious. Great as always.

[Ithekro]

Undead...yep Belkar fodder. At least he will not be completely bored and start growing more and more psy....wait this is Belkar.

[Fozzie]

Nice comic!! Tsukiko seems more character-elaborated now.
Thanks!

[fractal]

Yep, Tsukiko appears to be the Azure City antagonist, even as Kubota is Elan's group's opponent. Just as predicted:

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3655219&postcount=80

This way each group can win or lose, while waiting for Roy's return, without affecting the main plot. That said, this is a couple levels more than we knew Tsukiko had before. As a spellcaster, she may be more than a match for Haley and Belkar together, at least as long as she always takes time to prepare. On the other hand... Belkar is sneaky.

[EvilElitest]

Wow! Those undead monstrosities are simultaneously lame and awesome.

Ah, OOTS, what isn't new
from,
EE

[David Argall]

3.5 vampires are variable in power. Assuming these are vampires [likely] and were made from generic hobgoblins [also likely], they are not a serious match for Haley. Now these apparently are buffed up and are backed up the mystic thurge. So they are likely a serious problem.

Now Haley is quite possibly backed up by Belkar, who will be eager to kill something. We may well see him coming to the rescue of Haley and friends shortly.

[Balkash]

AHHH that scary chick with the bowie eyes!

[Particle_Man]

Interesting that Belkar can take on the undead, but not the MT.

Haley might take on the MT (risky) but is crap vs. undead.

[Dark Wolf]

I like how lawful the badguys are. The Browncloak knew he was about to be killed but his last action was still to summon reinforcements. Of course he could be rewarded by being raised.

[ref]

OK, level codes severity. I can only assume they have other kinds of signals other than Diamond. That is an awesome system, I'd love to see it fully developed somewhere. :smallsmile:

Yay Tsukiko!! We'll see what happens now...

[AyuVince]

hmmmm, can i be Tsukiko's "buddy"?

Sure, but you'd have to be an animated corpse first. Winning Tsukiko's "friendship" has some harsh prerequisites. So what would you pick? Zombie? Ghoul? Ghast? Vampire? Incorporeal undead do not count, since they lack the proper.. um.. organs.

Great comic. I loved the pun on the Homeland Security chart.

[HUMVEE Driver]

I'm pretty sure they're not vampires. Wouldn't a vampire's fangs point down?

I think they are hobgoblin wights, with their skin color being a play on the name. Though the fangs do seem a little small for a hobgob...

HUMVEE Driver

[vivi]

The buddy system does NOT work! Me and my friend were buddies, we both wondered away nobody noticed for an hour!

Oh and good comic Giant

[Devoured_Dude]

Undead with safety whistles? :smallbiggrin:

Though if they don't breathe, they may have a hard time blowing...

Plausible with Vampires. If they can suck, they can blow. :smallwink:

[Arbitrarity]

Plausible with Vampires. If they can suck, they can blow. :smallwink:

That... I hope... was unintentional. Otherwise, excuse me, while I get some HCl.

[Bitzeralisis]

I liked the reference.

[SteveMB]

Somehow, I don't think that the evil hoyay would be quite so sexy between stick figures. OotS's art is good for comedy and getting the story told, but it does render that sort of fanservice a trifle moot. Also, it doesn't seem like something Tsukiko would do of her own accord, and how would she know about Haley's Latent Bisexuality?

And besides, Haley has the disadvantage of being alive (though Tsukiko is apparently trying to fix that...).

[Maerok]

I guess there's more than one way to get Lichloved... Does motherly count?

[Signmaker]

Xykon's been reading from Peter's Evil Overlord List, I bet.

[Covenantwgw]

Ha! I love it...I love it till it hurts. I was wondering if we would see that chick again....ok Belker....it's your time bud...let's see that sexy shoeless god of war gut some vamp/whatever the heck those things are butt!

[JazzManJim]

That Threat Warning System has got to make it to either a small poster of a T-Shirt really, really soon.

[Superglucose]

Xykon's been reading from Peter's Evil Overlord List, I bet.

It was prolly redcloak's idea. While Xykon is amazingly powerful in one on one battles, Redcloak is the strategy man, and the girl is much better in small-group tactics. All three combined make a great team.

As for the MT's level: could she have used a magic item? I'm not particuarly well versed in D&D but I'm sure there's a magic item that can up your effective caster level. All we really know about her level is that she is at least level 7 (3 wizard, 3 cleric, 1 mt). Hell, for all we know, she could've used a scroll of Teleport.

[Healer Hobo]

Can they maybe use their lungs to just blow anyway, or have they withered away inside their torsos? Hmm....(scratch scratch)


Hmm... you pose a good question... I propose dissection! for science!


Great comic Giant. Heheh. Blow our safty whistles... Good vampire scouts are always prepared!

[Blaznak]

Safety Whistle.

Ha!

Now that's comedy folks... :)

[Kelly]

And besides, Haley has the disadvantage of being alive (though Tsukiko is apparently trying to fix that...).
That's what I meant by it not seeming like something Tsukiko would do of her own accord.

[Tordek]

If the undead can talk, they can blow a whistle. Its just taking in and expelling air.

Not rocket surgery, guys.

[Mr Teufel]

The Black Squadron is actually the Wight Squadron! :smallbiggrin:

[Warlord JK]

Brings back memories of grade school field trips *sigh*

[Fabio_MP]

New comic is up.


and a lovely one :)
a flying lovely one

I also liked the last 3-4 comics but didn't got the chance to thank you

so

thank you for all the comic goodness :)

[AtomicKitKat]

Actually, the buddy system is a way to make sure that at least 1 of you will still be able to alert the rest of the team.

From here (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/EvilOverlordList):


70 When my guards split up to search for intruders, they will always travel in groups of at least two. They will be trained so that if one of them disappears mysteriously while on patrol, the other will immediately initiate an alert and call for backup, instead of quizzically peering around a corner.

[fractal]

It was prolly redcloak's idea. While Xykon is amazingly powerful in one on one battles, Redcloak is the strategy man, and the girl is much better in small-group tactics. All three combined make a great team.
Plus Tsukiko is expendable and has nothing better to do. Perfect for the challenging and probably fruitless task of hunting down adventurers.

As for the MT's level: could she have used a magic item? I'm not particuarly well versed in D&D but I'm sure there's a magic item that can up your effective caster level. All we really know about her level is that she is at least level 7 (3 wizard, 3 cleric, 1 mt). Hell, for all we know, she could've used a scroll of Teleport.
She has also cast Shout, a level 4 spell, so she had to be at least level 10 (Wizard CL 7, plus 3 Cleric levels).

[LtNOWIS]

It might be just me, but I'd draw vampires with top fangs showing when mouth is closed, not bottom ones.

Yeah, I'd say that's a pretty good assumption (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0474.html).

[FoE]

Oh, that was awesome. Equating PCs with terrorists and vampires with Kindergarteners — I love it! :smallbiggrin:

Umm, anyone else want to see Haley vampified so we can get a sexy vampire version of Haley? I don't want this myself, of course, because I, umm, got this weird friend who is totally into vampire chicks.

(Looks both ways nervously)

[ysp]

Great way to get Belkar in to play. I can so see him standing on the ashes of the vamp's and yelling "-" well we all know what he'll yell I don't really need to quot him do I !?

[vegetalss4]

Xykon's been reading from Peter's Evil Overlord List, I bet.

HA, xykon would never do that. he would have to pass up so much fun for it..
i bet on Redcloak

[happyturtle]

The buddy system does NOT work! Me and my friend were buddies, we both wondered away nobody noticed for an hour!

It should be accompanied by the count-off. Every buddy pair has a number, and at random intervals the teacher/ scoutmaster/ lifeguard will blow a whistle signalling everyone to pair up and count off. Then the missing pair of buddies will be noticed when there's a gap in the numbers.

[dish]

Umm, anyone else want to see Haley vampified so we can get a sexy vampire version of Haley?

Umm....

No. Not really. In fact, I'd go as far as to say 'most definitely not'.

[SnowballMan]

Brings back memories of grade school field trips *sigh*

On your grade school field trips you were chased by goth chicks leading numerous undead?

What school did you go to?!?

And since when did anyone actually pay attention to encumbrance rules?

[battleburn]

Can they maybe use their lungs to just blow anyway, or have they withered away inside their torsos? Hmm....(scratch scratch)

Of course they can blow a whistle. You have seen them talk already. They don't need to breath, it doesn't mean they can't.

Get some Vampire; The Masquerade books. It's all explained there.

-Battleburn

Edit:

Umm, anyone else want to see Haley vampified so we can get a sexy vampire version of Haley?

You should take this to the House of Horrors thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=34493&page=40)

[Bendal]

I don't think they're vampires; creating them requires both expensive components and a very high level spell, and you don't get a lot of them at one time. Plus they are sentient and have enough intelligence to perform functions on their own as NPC's. I think they're wights; they are low enough level to create a batch at one time, semi-intelligent and run around in packs anyway.

Either way, Haley's little band had better be getting out of the area, at least until Belkar shows up!

[rickvoid]

Aww, it's like she's their mommy, or kindergarden teacher. Seriously, this little scene was actually kinda cute. :smallbiggrin:

[Milandros]

I like how lawful the badguys are. The Browncloak knew he was about to be killed but his last action was still to summon reinforcements. Of course he could be rewarded by being raised.

Why? He's done his job, and is of little further use.

In addition, he was weak enough to fall. He does not deserve better.

Though it could be funny to raise him and then slowly gut him like a fish for his failure, it's too expensive fot a moment's petty amusement.

Evil, remember? Not Neutral or Good. Evil is nasty. That's kind of the point.

[Milandros]

And since when did anyone actually pay attention to encumbrance rules?

We do - all the time.

It ruins the vermisilitude to have the scrawny halfling wizard carrying thirty suits of plate mail, a hundred and twenty-six assorted weapons, a ladder, a portable ram, a boat, a cart, a large seige tower, three of everything else listed in the PHB, two of everything in the Arms and Equipment Guide, and sixteen tons of coins. Not to mention makes it harder to come up with interesting challenges that aren't just a bigger monster. Walls closing in? No bother, I'll prop them with my mining supports. Large weight to lift? I have three ten-foot poles and a block and tackle. Enemy encampment at the bottom of the cliff? No problem, I'll roll down those thirty barrels of alchemist's fire I'm carrying.

Beyond a certain point, bags of holding etc can be used to make this a non-issue, if you want, but I'm always cautious about handing out too many of those.

In addition, several class features are based on minimal encumberance, it's part of the balancing factor. Faster battlefield movement is an incredible advantage sometimes. A swashbuckler I played often carried a sack in one hand with his less-vital equipment. When a fight began he'd drop it immediately to go back to full movement and abilities. If we'd have had to run, he'd have been seriously out of pocket.

Last of all, have you ever seen the look on a bunch of PC faces when they see a dragon's horde of treasure, then realise that they can only carry a few thousand coins and will have to leave the rest? :smallbiggrin:
That's a fantasy staple too - the enormous treasure chamber that the heroes can't strip bare, but have to make do with a single item or sack full of loot. Even The Mummy did that.

[Tundar]

As if:
Cantrips as alarms
Instant teleporting wizard with a S&D team of vampires.
Alarmwhistles
weren't enough, they are using the buddy system!

This is going into my next AD&D campaing :smallbiggrin:

[Calmness]

BAMF! Lovely sound effect Mr. Giant :smallbiggrin:

Vampires? I sure hope they aren't otherwise Belkar is getting dominated.

[Forealms]

In any case of what those are, wights or vampires, aren't they undead? If that's the case then I see no reason why, once TR gets back to their base, they can't unleash the sexy shoeless god of war upon them. He probably enjoys these little moments in life that allow him to destroy the life of a sentient.

[chibibar]

Remember there are TWO other epic level villains can make undead too :) Xykon and Redcloak.

That is sooo cute and makes a lot of sense too. She doesn't want to lose any of her undead minions :)

[Holammer]

Awwwww! How cute, Tsukiko treats those undeads as her own children. So touching :D

[Fitzclowningham]

Does the vampirization (?) of hobgoblins causes their ears to fall off?

Maybe they were humans.

[Epinephrine]

We do - all the time.

It ruins the vermisilitude to have the scrawny halfling wizard carrying thirty suits of plate mail, a hundred and twenty-six assorted weapons, a ladder, a portable ram, a boat, a cart, a large seige tower, three of everything else listed in the PHB, two of everything in the Arms and Equipment Guide, and sixteen tons of coins.

So sorry, but I LOLed ;)

I suspect you meant verisimilitude, but I had to wonder at the root of the word you posted -
vermi worms
sili silly?
tude 'tude? Like attitude?

Silly worm-itude indeed!

[Sequinox]

hahahahahahahahahahaha! :smallbiggrin:

[Faramir]

I like how lawful the badguys are. The Browncloak knew he was about to be killed but his last action was still to summon reinforcements. Of course he could be rewarded by being raised.

Let's not go crazy, here.

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0112.html

[Kilbia]

A couple of folks were asking how the hobgoblin was able to gauge Haley's level.

The 3.5 splat book Complete Adventurer lists an alternate use of Sense Motive: you roll a Sense Motive check versus the creature's Bluff check, and if you succeed, you get a sense of its power relative to yours. (If any folks out there have ever played Diku-based MUDs, it's similar to using the "consider" command on a monster.)

[lord_khaine]

i doubt belkar would like to play with that many wights, negative levels sucks, especaly if you dont have a cleric around to remove them again before they become permanent.

not to mention they actualy might be able to kill him if his AC isnt high enough.

[Doopliss]

In addition, he was weak enough to fall. He does not deserve better.

Though it could be funny to raise him and then slowly gut him like a fish for his failure, it's too expensive fot a moment's petty amusement.

Evil, remember? Not Neutral or Good. Evil is nasty. That's kind of the point.
Well, A: Redcloak obviously cares about Hobgoblin lives now, B: He couldn't really have been expected to defeat a PC, and C: Evil can be fair/rewarding to followers, particularly Lawful Evil. Voldemort, for example, was pretty good about rewarding (evil) service. Sometimes. Other times his paranoia ended up directed at loyal followers, but that doesn't really apply here.

That said, I don't really think he's liable to get raised. I just don't think it's as bad as you'd suggest unless Xykon starting dealing with the minions instead of Redcloak for some reason.

[silvadel]

You know tsuikiko always reminds me of a twisted version of gaia -- you see the mothering instincts(the mature), the spring form when she tries to make it with xykon, and the crone pops out here and there.

[dani_carip]

*enthusiastically applauds the Nightcrawler reference* :smalltongue:

[dutch508]

Run Away! Ryun Away! Run Away!


*will we get to see the holy hand grenade?*

[maus]

Congratulations Rich, on making 3 posts this week. Each of them was AWESOME!!

Now, hopefully you aren't over doing it.

[Hood]

Is the diamond color chart a reference to the US terrorism warning level system? That was my first thought.

[Keri Thornwood]

Looks like a pretty tough place to be right about now. Lots of challenges though, one thing for certain, Haley's not getting bored waiting to be rescued.

[SteveMB]

It should be accompanied by the count-off. Every buddy pair has a number, and at random intervals the teacher/ scoutmaster/ lifeguard will blow a whistle signalling everyone to pair up and count off. Then the missing pair of buddies will be noticed when there's a gap in the numbers.

Depends on just how smart these undead are -- they're clearly not total automatons, but they might not be bright enough to know how to count.

[LtNOWIS]

Why? He's done his job, and is of little further use.

In addition, he was weak enough to fall. He does not deserve better.

The new, sensitive Redcloak would probably disagree. And, they've probably got a lot of spellcasters with nothing better to do.


Great way to get Belkar in to play. I can so see him standing on the ashes of the vamp's and yelling "-" well we all know what he'll yell I don't really need to quot him do I !?
Oh, good point! Yeah, I totally forgot that Belkar can stab to his heart's content when dealing with undead. He's actually rather lucky to get such challenging, sentient foes to destroy.


Is the diamond color chart a reference to the US terrorism warning level system? That was my first thought.
Yes, it is.

[Axl_Rose]

Before I didn't care much for Tsuikiko but it's pretty cool how she'd have to be brave enough to stand up to a PC, which usually spells out death.

It's gonna be quasi-sad when she gets perforated by Haley.

[Neftren]

Actually, I think Tsukiko may be a semi-major plot character... the fact that she has lasted what... 5 comics now? She also commands a large section of what are believed to be something along the lines of a Wight.

Haley is also noted to be running away from Tsukiko...

[Ephir]

... And since when did anyone actually pay attention to encumbrance rules?

I guess that's why everyone who ventured in my worlds didn't like me so much. I am very annal when it comes to that kind of stuff. :smallwink:

[Superglucose]

Before I didn't care much for Tsuikiko but it's pretty cool how she'd have to be brave enough to stand up to a PC, which usually spells out death.

It's gonna be quasi-sad when she gets perforated by Haley.

I think the guerilla warriors of Sapphire City escaped.

[Abjurer]

I am ever so fond of Rich's conveniently-spelled sound effects. :smallsmile:

[fractal]

A couple of folks were asking how the hobgoblin was able to gauge Haley's level.

The 3.5 splat book Complete Adventurer lists an alternate use of Sense Motive: you roll a Sense Motive check versus the creature's Bluff check, and if you succeed, you get a sense of its power relative to yours. (If any folks out there have ever played Diku-based MUDs, it's similar to using the "consider" command on a monster.)
Not that consider was very reliable most of the time; there's a pretty wide range of power within a given level on most MUDs. Mostly just useful to avoid attacking anything that would one-punch you.

Anyway, I highly doubt that the Hobgoblin had a Sense Motive comparable to Haley's Bluff skill, so that's probably not the explanation.

For those who think the Hobgoblin Wizard ought to be Raised, don't forget that a. that costs him a level, and b. costs the Cleric 5000 gold. There's no way that anyone, even Redcloak, is going to shell that out for a random low level guy.

Speaking of which, I just realized that Belkar is probably off the hook for paying to get that nameless soldier Raised. After all, it was a deal with Shojo (now deceased), and the body's almost certainly lost at this point.

[DrivinAllNight]

I really like Tsukiko's little band of whatever they are, too bad they seem like kids going out for candy, not as special forces looking for some PC's. But in Haley's favor, judging by the last two panels, four of the six are headed away from Haley and her bunch, so lets hope they escape, would hate to see a undead sentient Haley controlled by Tsukiko.

[fractal]

I really like Tsukiko's little band of whatever they are, too bad they seem like kids going out for candy, not as special forces looking for some PC's.
For soul-sucking undead, innocent humans are candy.

But in Haley's favor, judging by the last two panels, four of the six are headed away from Haley and her bunch, so lets hope they escape, would hate to see a undead sentient Haley controlled by Tsukiko.
Assuming they still have their rivalry, so would Redcloak.

[Dark Wolf]

Let's not go crazy, here.

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0112.html

Hmm, I guess not then. Still it's admirable that he considered the future defeat of his killer more important than possibly managing to escape.

[1Winterborn]

YES! The return of Tsukiko! And she's still pretty much a butt-kicker! 'Black Squadron' indeed. *snicker*
Haley's expression is priceless - "I'm not expecting more hobgoblins." Priceless!
And since I work for the federal government, the threat level chart? Funny as all get-out!!!
That was incredibly awesome work, Giant. Excellently played.

[JazzManJim]

BAMF! Lovely sound effect Mr. Giant :smallbiggrin:


Is there some other sound an arriving teleport is supposed to make? They've always gone "BAMF" to me.

[docstrange]

I hope Rich knows it's been copyrighted....

Bamf, that is.

I'd love to see the rules lawyers return then... and have Belker slay em' with a *SNIKT*

[docstrange]

You know what this means: Long lines at security in the Azure City airport.

I hope everybody has plastic wrap and duct tape at home.

Now that would be funny: D&D characters on an ocean voyage in a strange land forced to pack their equipment per our world's airline rules. All weapons declared and stowed in the hold of the ship. All potions, philters, phials limited to 3 oz... How many HP does 3 oz of potion cure anyway?

P:"I take off my gauntlets and try to pass through the Portal again... {roll} 16?"

DM: "The portal gong sounds."

P:"Crap. OK, I put my Holy Symbol in the tray and try again."

[Niknokitueu]

Is there some other sound an arriving teleport is supposed to make? They've always gone "BAMF" to me.
I prefer the Douglas Adams/Terry Pratchett approach, whereupon you feel reality rip under the thaumatic imperative to displace several hundreds of pounds of mass a distance of several kilometers.

Sounds more accurate in a 'defying the laws of reality'-type of way.

So IMO more of a more fundamental version of the sound of paper tearing... (and a lot louder)

Have Fun!
Niknokitueu

[sihnfahl]

Hmm, I guess not then. Still it's admirable that he considered the future defeat of his killer more important than possibly managing to escape.
But, even if he cast expeditious retreat, he'd still be in range of Haley's bow.

And since he's low level, what few defensive spells he has are negated by her high level, health, damage output and saves...

[Mystyco]

Now that would be funny: D&D characters on an ocean voyage in a strange land forced to pack their equipment per our world's airline rules. All weapons declared and stowed in the hold of the ship. All potions, philters, phials limited to 3 oz... How many HP does 3 oz of potion cure anyway?

P:"I take off my gauntlets and try to pass through the Portal again... {roll} 16?"

DM: "The portal gong sounds."

P:"Crap. OK, I put my Holy Symbol in the tray and try again."

i lol'd

however, Level 13+...interesting

[David Argall]

Hmm, I guess not then. Still it's admirable that he considered the future defeat of his killer more important than possibly managing to escape.

Definitely admirable. Of course we do have to keep in mind that he is ultimately working for a lich who enjoys acid spitting beetles in the face of underlings who have done their duty. What he would do to someone who cravenly ran away.... At worst, Haley will be quick about it.

[Oslecamo]

I don't know if this was discussed, but:

Does Haley has ANY way of fighting undeads? Arrows won't get past the DR, and undead immunnities make rogue and ninja sneack attack/sudden strike cry. No bluffing either. I guess Haley will have no other choice but to call Belkar to help (wich I suspect is tied up in the rebel hideout, half mad for not killing someting for months now). The little guy already proved himself able to severly hurt undeads.

[Mr. Mud]

I don't know if this was discussed, but:

Does Haley has ANY way of fighting undeads? Arrows won't get past the DR, and undead immunnities make rogue and ninja sneack attack/sudden strike cry. No bluffing either. I guess Haley will have no other choice but to call Belkar to help (wich I suspect is tied up in the rebel hideout, half mad for not killing someting for months now). The little guy already proved himself able to severly hurt undeads.

If I've ever played Nethack, and I've palyed Nethack, she'd use "Arrows of Undead Slaying" of some variation of that will get past the DR. Also can't arrows be enchanted to slay undead? :smallredface:

[Oslecamo]

If I've ever played Nethack, and I've palyed Nethack, she'd use "Arrows of Undead Slaying" of some variation of that will get past the DR. Also can't arrows be enchanted to slay undead? :smallredface:

Wow wow calm down here. We're talking about the OOTS here, the king of unoptimization. And Haley especially. One would expect that with so much gold she would have equiped herself decently, but no, we haven't seen a single magic item in her hands. Even her bow isn't magic, because it was sundered by Miko's horse in the giant's description of the fight.

Arrows can be enchanted to slay undeads, but unless Haley managed to loot the Magic shops of the city before the hobgoblins, I really don't see where she could get a supply now.

She didn't have them when Xykon apeared in his undead dragon, in comic 429. She even coments she hates DR. So, she really hasn't an out against the undeads.

[Heroic]

Wow wow calm down here. We're talking about the OOTS here, the king of unoptimization. And Haley especially. One would expect that with so much gold she would have equiped herself decently, but no, we haven't seen a single magic item in her hands. Even her bow isn't magic, because it was sundered by Miko's horse in the giant's description of the fight.

Arrows can be enchanted to slay undeads, but unless Haley managed to loot the Magic shops of the city before the hobgoblins, I really don't see where she could get a supply now.

She didn't have them when Xykon apeared in his undead dragon, in comic 429. She even coments she hates DR. So, she really hasn't an out against the undeads.


Hehehe, the king of unoptimization, that is entirely true! :smallbiggrin:

[Yareth]

Awesome comic.

I do not think they are undead goblins as they lack ears.

[Milandros]

So sorry, but I LOLed ;)

I suspect you meant verisimilitude, but I had to wonder at the root of the word you posted -
vermi worms
sili silly?
tude 'tude? Like attitude?

Silly worm-itude indeed!

Yup, oops, bad typo... I need to proof-read and edit more.
I typed "dragon's horde" instead of "dragon's hoard" as well... not my best day for typing.
I normally go back and edit my posts for spelling and grammar after I spot things like that - but I can't now you've pointed it out, can I? :smallsmile:

[mregecko]

I am ever so fond of Rich's conveniently-spelled sound effects. :smallsmile:

Hah, exactly!

"Bamf" was often used in MUD's for teleport effects also... I used to run a text-based MUD in the early 90's, avatars had their "Bamfin" and "Bamfout" messages.

-- Gecko

[SteveDJ]

Is there some other sound an arriving teleport is supposed to make? They've always gone "BAMF" to me.

I suppose an alternative sound might be the basic "Pop!" - didn't V's familiar use that sound to appear/disappear? (I'll have to go back now and check).

And, my vote for the undead guys are wights ('cause, well, they're WHITE :smallbiggrin: )

[Zimmia]

Fantastic comic! I'm very pleased to see Tsukiko making another appearance. Such a wonderfully warped addition to Team Evil.

[foil_fedora]

Undead with safety whistles? :smallbiggrin:

Though if they don't breathe, they may have a hard time blowing...

Technically, vampires suck...

(I know, cheap and easy... but that's a combination I've never been able to resist).

[warmachine]

If Haley knows what's coming, rather than more hobgoblins, she's got some inside information. Pretty neat trick considering hobgoblins hate humans and the chance of finding an insider are virtually nil. I can't see any humans being allowed anywhere near hobgoblin HQ precisely because they'll spy and pass information to the resistance. We'll have to wait and see how she gets her intelligence info.

[Surfing HalfOrc]

If Haley knows what's coming, rather than more hobgoblins, she's got some inside information. Pretty neat trick considering hobgoblins hate humans and the chance of finding an insider are virtually nil. I can't see any humans being allowed anywhere near hobgoblin HQ precisely because they'll spy and pass information to the resistance. We'll have to wait and see how she gets her intelligence info.

She doesn't know specifically WHAT is coming, she just knows that it will be tougher than common hobgoblins.

It's part of the "breaking the fourth wall" thinking that the OOTS does all the time. She knows she's a high level character, so she knows that she will be attacked by someone or something that will be a challenge to her. Which also means that her companions will probably be overwhelmed.

I'm assuming that the rest of the NPCs she was with are about 4-6th level, with Haley at 13th. Tsukiko and the whatevers (wights as far as I can tell, no proof, but it seems to be the general concensus of the board) are more than enough to mop the floor with Haley's team, plus the possibility that Tsukiko MAY be able to call on Xykon and/or Redcloak if she gets in over her head.

[sihnfahl]

If Haley knows what's coming, rather than more hobgoblins, she's got some inside information. Pretty neat trick considering hobgoblins hate humans and the chance of finding an insider are virtually nil. I can't see any humans being allowed anywhere near hobgoblin HQ precisely because they'll spy and pass information to the resistance. We'll have to wait and see how she gets her intelligence info.

Alternatively, Haley is a rogue. What is is rogues do? Hide (and what did Haley say? "Hiding's my best skill.")

[SteveMB]

She doesn't know specifically WHAT is coming, she just knows that it will be tougher than common hobgoblins.

It's part of the "breaking the fourth wall" thinking that the OOTS does all the time. She knows she's a high level character, so she knows that she will be attacked by someone or something that will be a challenge to her. Which also means that her companions will probably be overwhelmed.

I'm assuming that the rest of the NPCs she was with are about 4-6th level, with Haley at 13th. Tsukiko and the whatevers (wights as far as I can tell, no proof, but it seems to be the general concensus of the board) are more than enough to mop the floor with Haley's team, plus the possibility that Tsukiko MAY be able to call on Xykon and/or Redcloak if she gets in over her head.

She might have assumed that Xykon would show up in person (since she doesn't know what a lazy sack of bones he is). Right after your opponenet gets off a distress signal is one of those times when it's prudent to assume the worst.

As the old military saying goes:
Q: What's the most powerful weapon carried by your squad?
A: The radio. You can use it to call in an airstrike.

[Pfooti]

It's worth noting that in order to teleport in six additional creatures, Tsukiko has to be at least caster-level 18 (one additional per three caster levels). So, Bamf indeed.

EDIT - I guess it was pointed out on page two or so. Still, I'm worried for our little rogue who can't sneak attack the vampires.

[David Argall]

I can't see any humans being allowed anywhere near hobgoblin HQ precisely because they'll spy and pass information to the resistance.

If no human slaves are allowed near hobgoblin HQ, hobgoblins will have to do a lot of !@#$ jobs.
Let's see. I can get off my chair and clean up the mess, or I can call in a slave to do it while I loaf, thus risking the lives of people I have never met. And I'm evil. ... I really need to think about this choice?

In real life, POWs are routinely used for labor and do make their way into sensitive areas for just such reasons.

[Faramir]

Just since everyone is assuming that it was a terrorism alert reference I'll mention that I was first reminded of the old fire danger alert ratings.

Found a reference here:
http://scofmp.org/danger_rating.html

[BobTheFerret]

Just since everyone is assuming that it was a terrorism alert reference I'll mention that I was first reminded of the old fire danger alert ratings.

Found a reference here:
http://scofmp.org/danger_rating.html

The fire alerts are moderately similar.

The terrorism alerts have the same layout, names, colors, descriptions, yadda yadda yadda...