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    Bugbear in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2009

    Default Re: A fundamental mechanical problem I have with d20/D&D/PF

    Quote Originally Posted by Grinner View Post
    From your perspective, these things may be true.

    Personally, I have trouble justifying $20 for a single book, and I'm certainly not accustomed to paying full retail. I suppose getting PDFs with the PirateBay discount is an option, but that's not one I prefer.

    Personally, getting players together on a different system is a chore. Homebrewing rules is also a chore, but less so.

    Your assertions may be true for you, but they're certainly not true for me.
    I think you're missing the point that these days there are more free rule systems than you can shake a stick at. If you want D&D, there's the entire retro-clone industry, then there's Dungeon World, Basic Fantasy, Eclipse Phase, Stars Without Number, everything here, the last few years around the holidays Classic Traveller has been free on RPGNow.com, then there's the entire free and pay what you want section on RPGNow.com (which includes all the old WEG d6 systems). In this day and age, if you have a computer or an ebook reader that can display PDFs (or access to someone who will print it out for you) you could game for your entire life playing a new system entirely every campaign, without ever paying one cent for a rule book and do it all perfectly legal.

    Now, getting other players might be an issue, but if your players are as frustrated as you are with the failings of a given system, then getting them to switch shouldn't be an issue with the free games because it requires no outlays.


    Edit
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    As to the OP

    Now you could make up reasons why Hiro lost those matches: he got cocky, he felt like giving a free win, he suddenly lost focus, whatever. We as players and GMs are expected to do that, and we do. And again it doesn't have to be an arm wrestle, it could be any basic contest pitting one stat against another stat. Still, the number of times Hiro loses doesn't add up to me, he should be winning almost 100% of the time, especially against teenagers or even adolescents.
    One thing you could try is to bring in the idea that failure on a contested roll doesn't necessarily mean failure of the immediate action but it means there are consequences for the action. For example, your arm wrestler might still win the match, but maybe got a little carried away and broke their opponent's arm in the process. Turns out their opponent was the son of a petty lord looking to score political points...

    Or maybe the local guard shows up at the tavern to bust up the gambling, turns out arm wrestling is considered gabling in this town and now the players are under arrest...

    Obviously stuff like this requires a lot of trust in your DM to be fair, and isn't applicable to every situation, but it can certainly help turn the swinginess of the game into a positive instead of a negative.
    Last edited by 1337 b4k4; 2014-05-16 at 10:23 AM.