View Single Post

Thread: What alignment is Oona?

  1. - Top - End - #425
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Grey_Wolf_c's Avatar

    Join Date
    Aug 2007

    Default Re: What alignment is Oona?

    Quote Originally Posted by Metastachydium View Post
    Yes, the dwarven Council of Clans, consisting of the dwarven elders. Hel's vampires are not dwarves, and have no business basically voting in the Council's stead.
    1) Yes, they are dwarves. They are able to enter the first barrier, therefore they are dwarves.

    2) The vampires where not the ones voting, the heads of the clans are voting. Sure, they used magic to compel a vote rather than political favour, or bribery, or blackmail, or impassioned speeches, or whatever else other people used to use to compel a vote, but if a vote compelled ceases to be valid, then no vote has ever taken place in any context, anywhere.

    3) Dvalin is not privy to any of this. He doesn't know, he can't know, and he is likely physically incapable of knowing what happens in the chamber, because he is the god of obeying oaths and if he swore to not interfere with the council, he will be physically incapable of doing so. He has a priest that tells him the way the vote goes and, as far as Dvalin is concerned, that vote is the Will of the Council, regardless of how the members voted or how they decided what to vote for.

    Quote Originally Posted by Metastachydium View Post
    The Exarch does speculate that the antechamber was designed to allow for that, but that doesn't mean such practices were not frowned at or they were exempted from the rules. Quite on the contrary, the voting chamber enforces the dwarven law as written and it does not allow dominations.
    Further, even if the Exarch is right, there's the thing that
    You seem to think you are making some kind of point, but you are not. None of this in any way affects that to Dvalin, the will of the council is the result of the vote. The vote takes place in a procedural manner, in a chamber defended by 3 separate rings of defences. If the procedures are all followed, then the vote is definitionally the will of the council.

    Quote Originally Posted by Metastachydium View Post
    1. Dvalin did not design the chamber;
    That is a bold claim, one you have no way to substantiate. When you have to resort to inventing your own canon so you can substantiate your original claim that the actual canon is stupid, you've effectively admitted out that you don't actually have a point. Or, as Rich put it:
    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    But really, the important lesson here is this: Rather than making assumptions that don't fit with the text and then complaining about the text being wrong, why not just choose different assumptions that DO fit with the text?
    Quote Originally Posted by Metastachydium View Post
    2. dwarves meddling with dwarven affairs and vampires meddling with dwarven affairs are two drastically different things.
    Not from the perspective of whomever built that chamber. Nor from Dvalin's perspective, who does not care who meddled with the vote.

    Grey Wolf
    Last edited by Grey_Wolf_c; 2020-10-29 at 08:18 AM.
    Interested in MitD? Join us in MitD's thread.
    There is a world of imagination
    Deep in the corners of your mind
    Where reality is an intruder
    And myth and legend thrive
    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    But really, the important lesson here is this: Rather than making assumptions that don't fit with the text and then complaining about the text being wrong, why not just choose different assumptions that DO fit with the text?
    Ceterum autem censeo Hilgya malefica est