Quote Originally Posted by Morty View Post
The idea that fighters' or barbarians' job is combat so it's okay if they don't do much outside it comes up a lot, but is flimsy. Other classes can contribute fully to combat while having a lot more tools outside it. Fighters' and barbarians' combat skills just aren't good enough to justify their lack of capability outside it. It only sort of works when you compare them to rogues, who have more skills but need to rely on sneak attacks. Otherwise not really.
This was touched upon in a previous thread of hypothetical 6E. In 5E a fighter and barbarian can do things out of combat. Through their background, class offering, and race they can choose skill proficiencies that make it easier for them to succeed on tasks as well as a background power. There's also the factor that not everything needs a roll or DCs are low enough proficiency isn't as needed, though there is a lack of guideline as I like to gripe about in another subject. What the fighter and barbarian lack is a class specific button power to Solve The Problem that isn't combat. (It's changing. The PsiWarrior can use his abilities out of combat.) The issue is some people want the fighter to be given a class specific power button for an out of combat thing. They are upset spellcasters get them, namely spells. Other people don't want that but are happy the fighter can do out of combat things via character non-class specific game mechanics and aren't bothered spellcasters also get class specific button powers to do out of combat things. They whole heartedly objected to the idea of a fighter being given a button power to do an out of combat thing. I told them if that's what they want they need to stop complaining fighters can't do things out of combat.

I'd be happy for a fighter to be given a class specific button power for an out of combat thing. It was also suggested that getting such a button power should not be in competition of a combat power button, i.e. choosing one at a given level means not getting the other. The character instead gets a choice from among several non-combat button powers and a choice from among several combat button powers, accepting if necessary each choice is made at a different character level.