OOTS #1298 - The Discussion Thread

[gbaji]

This was exactly my point about the kobold on his tail. We agree.

If that was your intended meaning, then you stepped on your own answer:

Calder is in the AMF, so if he has an active buff spell or magic item on his person it is currently turned off. Suppose he has a magic item which grants a +5 Enhancement Bonus to Natural Weapons Attacks. It will not grant its bonus if Calder attacks with his tail, which is outside the AMF, even if the item is worn on his tail. If he had a kobold riding on his tail wielding magic repeating crossbows, the kobold and his magic items would be fine.

The part I bolded is you talking about an item in Calder's possession. In this case, you specifically said that it would not function even if the item was outside the AMF and the attack it is applying a bonus to is also outside the AMF. Which, in response to Bunsen's question, would suggest that AMF does, in fact, extend to cover the entire creature with regard to magic items worn/held by said creature.

You then contrasted that to a kobold riding on the dragon's tail, and that kobold and items it was holding not being affected.

Which is precisely why bunsen made the response about Roy's sword being sentient being the key difference, since your response made that seem to be the actual difference (magic item on the dragon's tail is considered to be in the AMF, while a seperate sentient creature riding on the same tail is not). But the actual difference isn't about the source of the magic, but the target of the magic. The ring on Calder's tail doesn't boost Calder, despite being ouside the AMF because Calder is inside the AMF. The Kobold riding on Calder's tail is just as unable to cast an enhancement spell on Calder as the ring. Both are treated exactly the same if they are doing the same thing.


Your response was correct, but not actually relevant to the question, which was about whether the sword could be affected by magic, if it was held outside of an AMF by a creature that is otherwise within the AMF.

The answer is: Yes. That ring you mentioned above? If someone cast disjunction, it would be affected and could be destroyed, even though it's being worn by a creature that is inside an AMF, since it's physically located outside that AMF. You responded by talking about whether the ring could affect Calder, but the question was about whether magic outside the AMF could affect the ring.

One could even argue that magic items on a creature inside an AMF can generate effects outside the AMF if the item is not in the AMF. I'd rule that the creature within could not activate or cast/use the item (the creature is in the AMF), but if you had some item that had some kind of permanent or continuous effect, and you were inside an AMF, you could affect folks with that affect by holding the item outside the area of the AMF (which is an interesting, if rare, potential use of such things).

A simple example would be a magic lantern that simply glows magically all the time. Inside an AMF, it goes dark. You extend your arm and hold the lantern outside the AMF, and it will glow again. It has nothing at all to do with the item being sentient, nor who is holding it. It's the magic itself, and what it does, and who it affects. Items and creatures inside the AMF can't generate magic effects. Magic effects generated outside the AMF can't affect anything inside. The more interesting question in this example is "does the light generated by the lantern illuminate the area inside the AMF?" (I would argue it does, but some might disagree).

Since Magic Fang affects a creature, not a claw, it would cease to operate as long as some of Calder is within an AMF.

I'm actually with you on this one. The spell lists the target as "living creature touched". The spell is on the creature, not one part of the creature (which would be strange anyway). The effect is to make one natural weapon get a bonus, but the spell itself is on the creature, just like any other spell. I would similarly agrue that true seeing would not work, even if the person's head was outside the AMF. Same thinking. The spell is on the creature/person, not on their hand, or their eyes.