Half-dragon duergar help

[Froogleyboy]

Half-dragons have wings if they are large or bigger. but what about duergars? They can become large once per day. what then?

[ShadowFighter15]

I get the feeling that doesn't count; true dragons can turn into illithids, but that doesn't mean they get their psionic abilities 24/7.

[Froogleyboy]

I get the feeling that doesn't count; true dragons can turn into illithids, but that doesn't mean they get their psionic abilities 24/7.

I mean when they go large.

[ShadowFighter15]

I don't know; if that was the case then all medium half-dragons would get wings whenever they were hit with Enlarge Person.

[Quietus]

I don't know; if that was the case then all medium half-dragons would get wings whenever they were hit with Enlarge Person.

Well, they could HAVE wings at all sizes, and simply only have the proper size:muscle mass ratio at Large+ sizes..

[ShadowFighter15]

Well, they could HAVE wings at all sizes, and simply only have the proper size:muscle mass ratio at Large+ sizes..

Huh, hadn't thought of that. Doesn't Races of the Dragon or something mention that some half-dragons have vestigal wings?

[Thurbane]

I would assume that since the duergar's natural size is medium, they would not gain wings, even when enlarged...

[ShadowFighter15]

I would assume that since the duergar's natural size is medium, they would not gain wings, even when enlarged...

Well that was my original thinking, but Quietus had a point in his post and, as I said right after his, I remember reading something about half-dragons sometimes having vestigial wings.

[BlueWizard]

Perhaps they grow wings. DM choice.

[Olo Demonsbane]

That would be awesome.

"He raises his arms up into the air and spits words of ancient Draconic Power. He starts shooting up to 10ft tall, wings unfolding from his back. Now who's the short one?"

[The Glyphstone]

It's only really a problem with Duregar or Psychic Warriors using Expansion (or Goliath Barbarians with the substitution level), because Half-Dragons aren't a legal target for Enlarge Person. Assuming that, though, I'm pretty sure that template abilities are dependent on the base creature, minus the effects of any ongoing spells or abilities.

[Lord Lorac Silvanos]

Half-dragons have wings if they are large or bigger. but what about duergars? They can become large once per day. what then?

Assuming they are legal targets, they become large wingless half-dragon Duergars as mentioned.

Templates are not changed based on changes to the creature at a later stage even if it is as an innate ability.

[Lapak]

Well, they could HAVE wings at all sizes, and simply only have the proper size:muscle mass ratio at Large+ sizes..

Though I am hesitant to introduce logic into a question revolving around magical dragon wings, it would make more sense for the weight:power ratio to be better at small sizes than larger ones.

As for this question, I'd probably rule that they do not have wings, any more than they would if they had no racial power but got hit with Enlarge Person.

[Starbuck_II]

Though I am hesitant to introduce logic into a question revolving around magical dragon wings, it would make more sense for the weight:power ratio to be better at small sizes than larger ones.

As for this question, I'd probably rule that they do not have wings, any more than they would if they had no racial power but got hit with Enlarge Person.

Dragons aren't persons. They are dragons. Only psionic people can be enlarged if they aren't a person.

[Sstoopidtallkid]

Templates are not changed based on changes to the creature at a later stage even if it is as an innate ability.

The issue I find with that is things like Half-Fiendish, where power is based off of HD, the rule seems to be constantly re-figure to see what you qualify for now, as is the rule for things like Power Attack.

[Lord Lorac Silvanos]

I will grant that Half-Fiend is a little special in this regard, but power attacks is not really connected with your basic physical shaped based on race/type.

The RAW is what it is, but I would not recommend strongly against house ruling that all half-dragons have wings and can fly.