Choker Quickness

[arkol]

Do chokers get 2 actions in the surprise round?

[Frog Dragon]

Just to note. I don't see the quickness ability anywhere in the MM. At least not in the choker entry (Page 34-35 3.5 Monster Manual) So does it by RAW even have that ability? It appears in SRD, but not in MM

Also I wouldn't give chokers two standards in suprise.

[arkol]

Maybe it was errated? Not sure actually...

[LOLC2k]

Just to note. I don't see the quickness ability anywhere in the MM. At least not in the choker entry (Page 34-35 3.5 Monster Manual) So does it by RAW even have that ability? It appears in SRD, but not in MM

Also I wouldn't give chokers two standards in suprise.

O_o I see quickness as an ability (Ex) in the 3.5 MM under Choker...

[Belial_the_Leveler]

Polymorph! Polymorph! Polymorph!

[arkol]

I feel like Pandora now....

[Frog Dragon]

O_o I see quickness as an ability (Ex) in the 3.5 MM under Choker...

My monster manual doesn't even have a mention... WTF??

[Starscream]

My monster manual doesn't even have a mention... WTF??

Mine does.

"Quickness (Su)

Although not particularly dexterous, a choker is supernaturally quick. It can take an extra standard action or move action during its turn each round. "

The SRD has it as well. Were there different printings? I assume my version is up to date because it matches the SRD.

Edit:
Just checked my roommate's copy. His has it as well.

[Frog Dragon]

It doesn't make sense since my copy is quite recent. I got it last autumn from a semi-local roleplaying/miniatures store. It should be up to date.

[BobVosh]

It doesn't make sense since my copy is quite recent. I got it last autumn from a semi-local roleplaying/miniatures store. It should be up to date.

O.o I'm quoted.


Anyway, per raw he would have an extra action. I wouldn't really allow it, but then again I'm againist anyone ever having extra actions. Dirty chokers.

P.S. Mine also has it. I would say see if its 3.5, but its kinda obvious to anyone who hangs out on this board.

[kamikasei]

Try checking the ISBN?

[appending_doom]

I'll confirm that the errata don't take out Quickness, so it's not a matter of later editions not having the ability.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

The Choker entry starts on page 34, and continues on page 35 where the Quickness ability is described. If your Monster Manual goes from Choker to Cockatrice, then you're missing a page. If that's the case, check the SRD.

An Elan can Alter Self into one, though you'd need Metamorphic Transfer or Assume Supernatural Ability to get Quickness.

[kamikasei]

Responding to the OP, by the way, no I wouldn't allow a Choker to take two standard actions in the surprise round.

Quickness (Su)

Although not particularly dexterous, a choker is supernaturally quick. It can take an extra standard action or move action during its turn each round.

The Surprise Round

If some but not all of the combatants are aware of their opponents, a surprise round happens before regular rounds begin. Any combatants aware of the opponents can act in the surprise round, so they roll for initiative. In initiative order (highest to lowest), combatants who started the battle aware of their opponents each take a standard action during the surprise round. You can also take free actions during the surprise round. If no one or everyone is surprised, no surprise round occurs.

I would read the surprise round text as a more specific case than the general "round" that the Choker's ability applies to. The type of actions available in the surprise round are explicitly laid out. By this reading, you couldn't take a swift action either (though you could take an immediate).

(The surprise round is rather odd in its wording, not referring to turns, which is the basis of my ruling. If it said "during a surprise round, only those who are aware of their opponents can act, and they're limited to a single standard action on their turn", I'd probably allow Quickness to apply.)

[Epinephrine]

I'd allow the choker the extra standard action. The text says that it gets the extra action "during its turn each round," and the surprise round is indeed a "round." While I agree that it is specific about the types of actions allowed in a surprise round, standard actions are indeed allowed.

Thought exercise - you and one opponent get to act in the surprise round. You cast a spell, stunning him for one round. When does he get to act? If the answer is, "during the first non-surprise round," I'm pretty sure that you are counting the surprise round as a "round".

[Frog Dragon]

The Choker entry starts on page 34, and continues on page 35 where the Quickness ability is described. If your Monster Manual goes from Choker to Cockatrice, then you're missing a page. If that's the case, check the SRD.

An Elan can Alter Self into one, though you'd need Metamorphic Transfer or Assume Supernatural Ability to get Quickness.

I'm not missing a page either. I just don't have the description. There's no weird blank spaces either.

[Jokes]

Just so you know you aren't going crazy, my MM doesn't have quickness either, neither in the stats block or descriptive text. Though mine has an extra paragraph that isn't in the srd-

Combat

...

Chokers are greedy. Quick thinking characters who spot one before it attacks might be able to bribe a choker with food and question it about the area around it's lair.

Constrict (ex) ...

Mines a fairly new copy, so maybe quickness was taken out and that little paragraph was put in to make up for white space.

[LOLC2k]

I too would give it the extra action, because it allows things to grab two creatures in the surprise round, which feels thematic. If you did something stupid like made it a caster, then I'd just disallow it for thematic, not mechanical, reasons.

[LOLC2k]

I'm not missing a page either. I just don't have the description. There's no weird blank spaces either.

Check it's not 4e. Then 2nd. Then 1st. The Red Book/Blue Book (BD&D). Finally, and this would be rare, make sure it's not OD&D... ah the pure days. Before rogue was a class.

[Zeful]

Check it's not 4e. Then 2nd. Then 1st. The Red Book/Blue Book (BD&D). Finally, and this would be rare, make sure it's not OD&D... ah the pure days. Before rogue was a class.

My 3.5 monster manual has the same paragraph in it Jokes is talking about, but I'll have to doublecheck when I get home to see if it has the quickness entry in it.

[Starscream]

Just so you know you aren't going crazy, my MM doesn't have quickness either, neither in the stats block or descriptive text. Though mine has an extra paragraph that isn't in the srd-

Mine has this, AND the Quickness thing, so it's not an either/or situation.

[Frog Dragon]

Ok. This is getting seriouly weird. Also It is the 3.5 MM. It even says so on the front cover. It's This one

[RTGoodman]

I checked out both the 3.0 and the 3.5 MM. The 3.0 version doesn't have Quickness, it has Haste, which says it gets an extra partial action each turn as if affected by the haste spell. The 3.5 version, in my MM, has the Quickness ability exactly as in the SRD, and has the paragraph about them being greedy.


Either way, I've allowed it before. They're not particularly nasty, so I don't think it'd ever really threaten a TPK.

[Jokes]

My copy is a fifth printing (Printers Key 98765 on the front page) and contains all the errata'd material.

I found a first print pdf version which has Quickness. The Chimera text is spaced out more in my copy (breath weapon starts on the new column), so that's where the spacing has been changed.

So yeah, strange that it isn't mentioned in the errata (if it should be there or not)

[Dark_Scary]

The greedy paragraph is in all MM 3.5s.

It's just not in the SRD, like most fluff.

[RTGoodman]

My copy is a fifth printing (Printers Key 98765 on the front page) and contains all the errata'd material.

I found a first print pdf version which has Quickness. The Chimera text is spaced out more in my copy (breath weapon starts on the new column), so that's where the spacing has been changed.

I did not know about that Printer's Key thing. If that's so, then my 3.5 MM is first printing (it says 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 1 on the title page), and like I said, it has everything that some people claim to be missing. But, my Chimera entry ISN'T spaces out like you say - the Breath Weapon write-up is split in half by the column break, rather than starting at the top of the next column.

[Frog Dragon]

Mine read 98765

[Jokes]

Sorry, I said my copy was spaced out, so we are both right. Your BW text should wrap around the chimera pic. I could have phrased that better.

[Tsotha-lanti]

My 3.5 monster manual has the same paragraph in it Jokes is talking about, but I'll have to doublecheck when I get home to see if it has the quickness entry in it.

It's not an extra paragraph. SRD entries have most of the fluff text taken out.

[kamikasei]

Ha! Mine is also a fifth printing and missing the Quickness entry. I'd never noticed. Bloody hell, Wizards.