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Thread: 4e Modern

  1. - Top - End - #1
    Dwarf in the Playground
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    4e Modern Homebrew

    http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showt...22#post6765222

    I have continued this thread in a totally different thread


    Designers Notes

    This is an attempt to modify 4e rules to allow for modern settings.
    -4e is a very combat focused game. Balance between melee weapon-using, missile weapon-using and non-weapon classes would be heavily impacted by the introduction of firearms to the 4e world. We need to redesign character classes, weapons and armor to make this work.

    -Modern campaigns will require many new skills or uses of skills than 4e. For science fiction settings, we also have to discuss the issue of skill obsolescence across technology levels and culture. We need to know whether or not a high-tech engineer marooned in a low tech environment performs on skill checks with low tech equipment..

    -The roles will be Defender, Striker, Leader and Controller with some changes. Every class will have some facility with firearms. Firearms often form a significant of combat in modern settings and every class should have class features that will allow the class to participate in some way.

    -Controllers will often depend on arcane or psionic power sources. In some settings without arcane, psionic or other fantastic power sources, controllers will be unavailable.

    -Science fiction settings vary greatly. Some campaigns may only wish to introduce selected equipment from the rule set and this will have balance impact. Where possible we include guidance that will allow players to customize their campaigns and be prepared for changes to balance.

    -Weapons and armor will be grouped into progress levels. After the introduction of firearms, missile weapons will be considerably more effective. Campaigns may wish to introduce technology selectively however doing so will have impact on balance. For example, introducing energy weapons into a campaign without introducing energy-proof armor would favor characters that use energy weapons. Campaign designers should consider balance between missile weapon-using and non missile weapon-using characters and between armor using and non-armor using characters when introducing equipment into a campaign.
    Last edited by gnownek; 2009-12-14 at 11:01 PM.

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    Suggested Settings

    Campaigns can be set to include various combinations of technology and magic.

    The ‘They Among Us’ Campaign

    This setting resembles the present day except that several unpredictable alien species are present on earth and coexist with humanity. Governments and alien organizations conspire to conceal the truth from the public.
    Technology is similar to the present day however small amounts of superior alien technology are available. Several alien organizations are involved in genetically altering humans and other species.On occasion, aliens have recreated creatures from their home planet as pets, guards, works of art or religious icons. Psionic abilities are infrequently found in aliens and humans associated with or descended from alien experimentation.

    Most alien species arrived on earth after WWI. However, smaller amounts of alien visitation occurred prior to WWI. A large number of mythological creatures are based on aliens that visted earth at some point in Earth’s history.

    Characters work for an alien, government or independent organization that is aware of the real truth. It may be defending human interests, promoting human/alien co-existence, maintaining the conspiracy or working for an alien faction or serve its own interests.

    The ‘Bullets and Bugbears’’ Campaign

    This is an alternate history setting where magic and fantastic creatures have always coexisted with our modern society. While humans are widespread fantastic creatures operate in the open and may control corporations or whole cities. Significant portions of the globe remain in wilderness as a result of interregional and interspecies conflict. Many non-human races have a vested interest in restrcting urbanization and have built cultures that rely more on natural and magical resources. While nations resemble those in our earth, they are often dotted with independent cities or regions.

    Development is centered around major cities.In those cities, corporations can be extremely influential. Large corporations are powerful enough to maintain private security forces and some degree of immunity from local law enforcement. A large informal economy operates alongside the corporate world. Corporate warfare, regional conflicts, espionage activities and crime are common.

    Characters can be freelance adventurers or operatives aligned to one of the many financial, mystical or governmental powers than rule the planet.

  3. - Top - End - #3
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    Changes to Character Creation Rules

    Several changes to character creation are necessary to update 4e to modern settings.

    Professions
    Characters may select a profession as well as a class and a race. A profession reflects the character’s profession prior to an adventuring career and modifies the character’s choice of skills. Professional paragon classes are available to characters of a specific profession or who possess many of the trained skills associated with the profession. Professions can include scientists, academics, law enforcement, criminals, businessmen, politicians, entertainers, athletes, blue collar workers, vehicle operators, socialites and military.

    Special Technology Feats

    Special technology feats may introduce daily, encounter and at will powers that characters can use in addition to their class powers.

    Modified Races

    Humans are unchanged from the PHB and are present in both worlds. Fantasy creatures are also unchanged and are present in the "Bullets and Bugbears" world.

    Enhanced are genetically enhanced human beings. Originally created by aliens as servants, many have escaped and made their own way in the world.

    Greys are a common alien race in the ‘They Among Us’. They have a variety of motivations and can be found in both human and alien organizations. Grey’s have the psionic ability to alter their appearance. It is unclear whether they or not they are a naturally occurring species or the result of experimentation.

    Modified Classes

    The following classes are introduced:
    Muscle (Martial Defender)- Completed Levels 1 to 10
    Daredevil (Martial Defender)
    Gunfighter (Martial Striker)
    Martial Artist (Martial Striker)
    Thinker (Martial Leader)
    Talker (Martial Leader)
    Empath (Psionic Leader)
    Geomancer (Arcane Leader)
    Mentalist (Psionic Controller)
    Occultist (Arcane Controller)
    Last edited by gnownek; 2009-06-30 at 10:32 PM.

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    4th July updated to reduce feat flexibility. You still have to take some defensive/speed type feats with feats that substitute for amor or shield proficiency. More flexible feat system allows muscle to be used in settings where armor is unavailable(Wild Wild West genre) as well as when it is prevalent (Certain futuristic genres)

    ------------------
    Class: Muscle (Levels 1-10)
    Role: Defender, you are very tough, contain your enemies in melee and put your enemies under pressure in missile combat.
    Power Source: Martial
    Key Abilities: Strength, Constitution, Dexterity, Wisdom
    Hp at 1st Level: 15 + Constitution score
    Armor Proficiencies:Cloth
    Weapon Proficiencies: Simple Melee, Simple Ranged
    Hit Points per Level Gained: 6
    Healing Surges per Day: 9 + Constitution modifier
    Class Features: Bonus Feats I, Bonus Feats II, Bonus Feats III, Melee Combat Challenge, Melee Combat Superiority, Ranged Challenge
    Skills: To be completed when skills and professions section is completed.

    Bonus Feats I
    Pick 2 from the following list, pre-requisites apply; Armor Proficiency (Leather), Armor Proficiency (Hide), Armor Proficiency (Chainmail), Armor Proficiency (Scalemail), Armor Proficiency (Platemail), Armor Proficiency (Power Armor)*, Armor Proficiency (Energy Fields)*, Armor Proficiency (Modern Armor)*, Alertness, Durable, Toughness, Defensive Mobility, Escape Artist, Fast Runner, Keep Close*, Brawling*, Martial Arts*, Judo*, Streetfighting*, Quick Draw

    Bonus Feats II
    Pick 3 from the following list, pre-requisites apply; Armor Proficiency (Leather), Armor Proficiency (Hide), Armor Proficiency (Chainmail), Armor Proficiency (Scalemail), Armor Proficiency (Platemail), Armor Proficiency (Power Armor)*, Armor Proficiency (Energy Fields)*, Armor Proficiency (Modern Armor)*, Alertness, Durable, Toughness, Defensive Mobility, Escape Artist, Fast Runner, Keep Close*, Brawling*, Martial Arts*, Judo*, Streetfighting*, Quick Draw, Snap Shot*, Martial Melee Mastery*, Martial Ranged Mastery*, Firearms*, Well-practised shooter*, Heavy Weapons*, Power Attack, Weapon Focus, Double Tap*, Burst Fire*, Far Shot*, Far Throw, Sniper Training*, Hi-tech Melee*

    Bonus Feats III
    Pick 2 from the following list, pre-requisites do not apply; Shield Proficiency (Light), Shield Proficiency (Heavy), Two-weapon Fighting, Two-weapon Defense, Escape Artist, Fast Runner, Keep Close*, Brawling*, MartialArts*, Judo*, Streetfighting*,
    * These are new feats

    Melee Combat Challenge
    Same as Fighter Combat Challenge class feature, but applies only to unarmed or melee weapon attacks.

    Combat Superiority
    Same as Fighter Combat Superiority class feature, but you add only half of your Wisdom bonus to your attack roll for opportunity attacks.

    Ranged Challenge
    When you make a ranged attack with a ranged weapon or a firearm you may mark the target. The target has a -2 to hit penalty to attack rolls when he makes a ranged attack that does not include you as a target. If you use the Double Tap feat, you may mark one additional target within 2 squares of the first. If you use the Burst Fire feat, you may mark one additional target within 3 squares of the first.

    Suggested Build: SWAT Officer (To be completed)
    Profession: Law Enforcement
    Feats: Armor Proficiency(Leather Armor), Armor Proficiency(Modern Armor),
    Shield Proficiency (Light), Shield Proficiency (Heavy) Firearms, Burst Fire, Sniper Training
    At Will: Combat Rush, Wild Attack
    Encounter: Pinning Fire
    Daily: Comeback Surge

    Suggested Build: Streetfighter (To be completed)
    Profession: Criminal
    Feats: Armor Proficiency(Leather), Quick Draw, Streetfighting
    ,Keep Close, Two Weapon Fighting, Firearms, Double Tap
    At Will: The Old One Two, Wild Attack
    Encounter: Passing Attack
    Daily: Villain’s Menace

    Suggested Build: Savage (To be completed)
    Profession: Primitive
    Feats: Keep Close, Two-weapon Fighting, Martial Melee Mastery, Martial Ranged Mastery, Firearms, Durable, Alertness
    At Will: Big Swing, Wild Attack
    Encounter: Trip Up
    Daily: Brutal Offensive
    Last edited by gnownek; 2009-07-04 at 08:26 AM.

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    Muscle powers
    Your powers are called exploits.

    Level 1 At Will Exploits
    Big Swing
    Same as Reaping Strike Fighter Level 1 At Will Exploit (PHB) except that you may add your full strength bonus to damage when using a Two-Handed Weapon or a Variable Weapon with both hands.

    The Old One Two
    'If I swing twice, one will hit''

    At Will, Martial, Weapon
    Standard Action, Melee Weapon.
    Requirement: You must be wielding at least one off-hand melee weapon
    Target: One Creature
    Attack: Strength vs AC (off hand weapon only), two attacks
    Hit: 1[W] damage
    Increase damage to 2[W] at 21st level.
    Special: If you are wielding two-off hand weapons, you may make one attack with each weapon.

    Sure Attack
    'Accuracy matters''

    At Will, Martial, Weapon
    Standard Action, Melee, Ranged or Modern Ranged Weapon.
    Target: One Creature
    Attack: Strength + 2 vs AC (melee) or Dexterity +2 vs AC (ranged or modern ranged)
    Hit: 1[W] damage
    Increase damage to 2 [W] at 21st level.

    Wild Attack
    'Spray it don't just say it'

    At Will, Martial, Weapon
    Standard Action, Melee or Modern Ranged Weapon.
    Target: One Creature
    Attack: Strength-1 vs AC (melee) or Dexterity vs AC (ranged)
    Hit: 1[W] + Strength modifier damage and an enemy adjacent to you takes damage equal to your Strength modifier (melee) or 1[W] + Dexterity modifier damage and an enemy adjacent to your target takes damage equal to your Dexterity modifier (ranged and modern ranged).
    Increase damage to 2[W] at 21st level.
    Special: If you are using the Burst Fire feat, you may select an enemy within 2 squares of the target instead of an enemy adjacent to the target to take damage equal to your Dexterity modifier

    Combat Rush
    'I don’t have time to bleed’'

    At Will, Martial, Weapon
    Standard Action, Melee or Ranged or Modern Ranged Weapon.
    Target: One Creature
    Attack: Strength vs AC (melee) or Dexterity vs AC (ranged and modern ranged)
    Hit: 1[W] + Strength modifier damage and you gain your Constitution bonus in temporary hit points (melee) or 1[W] + Dexterity modifier damage and you gain 2 temporary hit points (ranged and modern ranged)
    Increase damage to 2 [W] at 21st level.
    Effect: If you attack a target in melee with this exploit, the target you attacked has a +1 bonus to hit you until the end of its net turn

    Footwork Lure
    Same as Footwork Lure Fighter Level 1 At Will Exploit (Martial Power)
    Last edited by gnownek; 2009-06-30 at 03:27 PM.

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    Level 1 Encounter Exploits
    Passing Attack

    Same as Passing Attack, Fighter Level 1 Encounter Exploit (PHB).

    Low Blow
    Same as Steel Serpent Strike, Fighter Level 1 Encounter Exploit (PHB) except that the power gains the Scalable keyword. If you take this power as a Level 13 Encounter Exploit damage increases to 3[W] and if you take this power as a Level 23 Encounter Exploit damage increases to 4[W].

    Trip Up
    Same as Spinning Sweep, Fighter Level 1 Encounter Exploit (PHB) except that the power gains the Scalable keywords. If you take this power as a Level 13 Encounter Exploit damage increases to 2[W]. If you take this power as a Level 23 Encounter Exploit damage increases to 3[W]

    Pinning Fire
    'You go on the offense, pinning down your enemies'
    Encounter, Martial, Weapon, Scalable
    Standard Action, Ranged or Modern Ranged Weapon.
    Target: One Creature
    Attack: Dexterity vs AC
    Hit: 2[W] + Dexterity modifier damage and the target is slowed until the end of your next turn.
    Special: If you take this power as a Level 13 Encounter Exploit damage increases to 3[W]. If you take this power as a Level 23 Encounter Exploit damage increases to 4[W]


    Covering Fire
    'I'll cover you'

    Encounter, Martial, Weapon, Scalable
    Standard Action, Melee or Ranged or Modern Ranged Weapon.
    Target: One Creature
    Attack: Strength vs AC (melee) or Dexterity vs AC (ranged and modern ranged)
    Hit: 2[W] + Strength modifier damage and an ally adjacent to the target can shift 1 squares (melee) or 2[W] + Dexterity modifier damage and one of your allies you can see can shift 1 square (ranged and modern ranged).
    Special: If you take this power as a Level 13 Encounter Exploit damage increases to 3[W] and the ally may move 2 squares if you made a melee attack. If you take this power as a Level 23 Encounter Exploit damage increases to 4[W] and the ally may move 2 squares if you make a melee or missile attack.

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    Level 1 Daily
    Villain's Menace

    Same as Villain's Menace, Fighter Level 1 Encounter Exploit (PHB).

    Comeback Surge
    'A successful attack invigorates you'

    Daily, Healing, Martial, Weapon, Reliable, Scalable
    Standard Action, Melee or Ranged or Modern Ranged Weapon.
    Target: One Creature
    Attack: Strength vs AC (melee) or Dexterity vs AC (ranged and modern ranged)
    Hit: 2[W] + Strength modifier damage and you can spend a healing surge (melee) or 2[W] + Dexterity modifier damage and you can spend a healing surge (ranged and modern ranged)
    Special: If you take this power as a Level 9 Daily Exploit damage increases to 3[W]. If you take this power as a Level 19 Daily Exploit damage increases to 4[W]. If you take this power as a Level 25 Daily Exploit damage increases to 5[W]. If you take this power as a Level 29 Daily Exploit damage increases to 6[W].

    Brutal Offensive
    'You go for the throat''
    Daily, Martial, Weapon, Reliable, Scalable
    Standard Action, Melee or Ranged or Modern Ranged Weapon.
    Target: One Creature
    Attack: Strength vs AC (melee) or Dexterity vs AC (ranged and modern ranged)
    Hit: 3[W] + Strength modifier damage (melee) or 3[W] + Dexterity modifier damage (ranged and modern ranged)
    Special: If you take this power as a Level 9 Daily Exploit damage increases to 4[W]. If you take this power as a Level 19 Daily Exploit damage increases to 5[W]. If you take this power as a Level 25 Daily Exploit damage increases to 6[W]. If you take this power as a Level 29 Daily Exploit damage increases to 7[W].

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    Level 2 Utility
    Unstoppable

    Same as Unstoppable, Fighter Level 1 Utility Exploit (PHB).

    Get Over Here
    Same as Get Over Here, Fighter Level 1 Utility Exploit (PHB).

    No Opening
    Same as No Opening, Fighter Level 1 Utility Exploit (PHB).

    Weapon Grab
    'After taking someone down you take his weapon''

    Encounter, Martial
    Immediate Interrupt, Personal
    Trigger: An attack by you or an ally renders an adjacent opponent unconscious
    Effect: You may drop one or more weapons or items you are currently wielding. You may also grab a weapon from the unconscious opponent's hand or an easily accessible location on his person and ready it for use.

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    Level 3 Encounter
    Crushing Blow

    Same as Crushing Blow, Fighter Level 1 Encounter Exploit (PHB).

    Dance of Steel
    Same as Dance of Steel, Fighter Level 1 Encounter Exploit (PHB).

    Rain of Blows
    Same as Rain of Blows , Fighter Level 1 Encounter Exploit (PHB).

    Precision Offensive
    Daily, Martial, Weapon, Reliable, Scalable
    Standard Action, Melee or Ranged or Modern Ranged Weapon.
    Target: One Creature
    Attack: Strength+4 vs AC (melee) or Dexterity+4 vs AC (ranged and modern ranged)
    Hit: 1[W] + Strength modifier damage (melee) or 1[W] + Dexterity modifier damage (ranged and modern ranged)
    Special: If you take this power as a Level 13 Encounter Exploit damage increases to 2[W]. If you take this power as a Level 23 Encounter Exploit damage increases to 3[W]
    Last edited by gnownek; 2009-06-30 at 04:53 PM.

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    Level 5 Daily
    Dizzying Blow

    Same as Dizzying Blow, Fighter Level 5 Daily Exploit (PHB) except that the power gains the Scalable keyword. If you take this power as a Level 15 Daily Exploit damage increases to 4[W]. If you take this power as a Level 25 Daily Exploit damage increases to 5[W] and you attack using Strength+1 versus AC. If you take this power as a Level 29 Daily Exploit damage increases to 6[W] and you attack using Strength+1 versus AC.

    Rain Of Steel
    Same as Rain Of Steel, Fighter Level 5 Daily Exploit (PHB).

    Bleeding Wound
    'Laugh this off'

    Daily, Martial, Reliable, Weapon, Scalable
    Standard Action Melee Weapon, Ranged or Modern Ranged Weapon
    Target: One Creature
    Attack: Strength vs AC (melee) or Dexterity vs AC (ranged or modern ranged)
    Hit: 2[W] + Strength modifier damage (melee)or 2[W] + Dexterity modifier damage (ranged or modern ranged), and the target takes ongoing 5 damage and a -2 penalty to AC (save ends both).
    Special: If you take this power as a Level 15 Daily Exploit damage increases to 3[W]. If you take this power as a Level 19 Daily Exploit damage increases to 4[W]. If you take this power as a Level 25 Daily Exploit damage increases to 5[W]. If you take this power as a Level 29 Daily Exploit damage increases to 6[W].
    Last edited by gnownek; 2009-06-30 at 03:34 PM.

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    Level 6 Utility
    Battle Awareness
    Same as Battle Awareness, Fighter Level 6 Utility Exploit (PHB).

    Defensive Training
    Same as Defensive Training, Fighter Level 6 Utility Exploit (PHB).

    Unbreakable
    Same as Unbreakable, Fighter Level 6 Utility Exploit (PHB).

    Level 7 Encounter
    Sudden Surge

    Same as Sudden Surge, Fighter Level 7 Encounter Exploit (PHB)

    Reckless Strike
    Same as Reckless Strike, Fighter Level 7 Encounter (PHB)
    Last edited by gnownek; 2009-06-30 at 03:33 PM.

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    Level 9 Daily
    Shift the Battlefield
    Same as Shift The Battlefield, Fighter Level 9 Daily Exploit (PHB)

    Jackal Strike

    Same as Jackal Strike, Fighter Level 9 Daily Exploit (Martial power)
    Last edited by gnownek; 2009-06-30 at 03:22 PM.

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    Default Re: 4e Modern

    I think that I would prefer something closer to the more "generic" classes from D20 modern. There would be a limited number of base classes, maybe just one or two for each "role," and more specific character types and powers achievable through Paragon Paths and Epic Destinies. Say, a striker role could be filled by a Melee Striker class and a Ranged Striker class, each with a wider variety of powers than a normal D&D class.

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    I liked the 4e generic hero system too but the role and powers for each class in 4e don't mix well with total flexibility. There'll be some flexibility in choosing profession, class, a multi-class and a paragon class. You could easily be a academic by profession, muscle by class, thinker by multiclass and explorer by paragon class. Going with my gut here but the modern system had 3 combat focused classes and 3 skill focused classes which seems inconsistent with 4e where everyone has a combat role.

    ----------------------------------

    Changes to Combat Rules
    Introduction
    The 4e Modern combat rules are designed to capture cinematic modern combat, like that of a TV show or a movie. Modern cinematic combat has a different ‘look and feel’ than fantasy combat it also differs from realistic modern combat. Combat under these rules have the following characteristics:

    -Firearms are superior ranged weapons
    -Ranged combat is more deadly, a bullet can do more damage than a two-handed weapon
    -Big two-handed weapons are used less often, especially in the presence of firearms
    -Unarmed combat and smaller melee weapons do get used when opponents are very close, probably more often than in realistic combat.
    -Pistols are slightly more accurate than in realistic combat, where rifles are far deadlier and more accurate
    -In some futuristic campaigns, superior melee weapons may be very effective.

    Most of the changes made to the rules for modern firearms have been made in the feats section or the weapons section. Statistics for some existing weapons have been changed. Archaic armor and some missile weapons have been weakened.

    New Keywords
    Modern Ranged Weapon

    Firearms and energy weapons are not considered to be ranged weapons by powers that have the ranged weapon keyword. The Modern Ranged weapon keyword indicates the power can be used with a firearm or energy weapon.

    Scalable
    The power is available in higher level versions. You must retrain to get the benefit of the higher level version, the power does not automatically update itself to the improved version when you reach the appropriate level. You may have more than one version of this power, but they cannot be the same version. You could have a level 9 Encounter version of this power and the level 1 Encounter version.
    Last edited by gnownek; 2009-06-30 at 09:22 PM.

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    Default Re: 4e Modern

    couldnt a controller be an insane bomb maker the whole idea of controller is area attacks and inducing effects
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    Default Re: 4e Modern

    It's also possible to set up a no-magic modern setting without losing any of the roles, you just have to tweak it a bit.

    How about this:
    2 different leader styles- one leads from the rear, he has more abilities that can tactically affect the party (think like a general), one leads from the front and has more combat abilities but less tactical control on the party(like a medic or squad leader).
    2 different strikers- a sniper style striker that specializes in dealing precise damage to single targets, and a Rambo style striker (big machine gun) that deals massive damage but is inaccurate.
    2 different defenders- a close defender who is more heavily armored and deals higher damage, but at a shorter range (think shotgun) and one who deals lighter damage (think smg) with less armor but who has abilities that help him find better cover
    2 different controllers- a damage-only controller who has abilities to call in artillery or air strikes and one who has abilities to lay traps and control the battlefield (maybe has a grenade launcher, can use smoke & chemical weapon grenades to affect the enemy)

    Obviously this is just a rough outline, but I think it could be worked in a way that was balanced for all the classes.

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    The rules are meant to be flexible in what tech period, a bomb using martial controller is very tech level dependent so I decided to leave that one. Bear with me here.

    On classes,many ways to do this, glad to hear any ideas. I'm going to keep doing a few basic classes which are flexible on type of weapon up as a start - to test the basic rules.

    I don't want to go to specialized in case of setting changes. What does the machine gunner or sniper do in a Buffy campaign where machine guns and sniper rifles aren't part of the genre? A few guns here and there might fit not the high-firepower.
    Last edited by gnownek; 2009-06-30 at 09:20 PM.

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    Default Re: 4e Modern

    Quote Originally Posted by gnownek View Post
    I don't want to go to specialized in case of setting changes. What does the machine gunner or sniper do in a Buffy campaign where machine guns and sniper rifles aren't part of the genre? A few guns here and there might fit not the high-firepower.
    right, I see what you mean. My stuff there was more focused toward filling those roles in a current-modern setting with no magic, not as a broad spectrum for any "modern" setting. I didn't make that super-clear. Although, that seems like a hard bill to fit as each setting needs it's own unique balance for each role depending on it's tech levels and magic availabilities.
    Maybe:
    leader options: party affecting leader, battle/healing leader
    striker options: ranged striker, close striker
    defender options: ranged defender, close defender
    controller options: damage focus controller, status focused controller and then base controller abilities on science instead of magic, or add as much magic as the setting allows.
    this way "ranged" and "close" are variable with the setting, and you can adjust your controller to fit snugly into whatever tech/magic level is available (after all, a chemist from today would appear to be a mighty wizard if you took him to the 1300's)

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    Default Re: 4e Modern

    I'm doing close you what you suggest CDR_Doom except that the first set of classes I do will all have some melee and ranged ability then I may circle back and do more specialized classes with mainly melee or mainly ranged.
    The Muscle does melee and some ranged and serves as a first class up so I can assess feat and weapon balance.
    ___________________________

    Updated 7th July
    ----------

    New Feats
    Brawling (Pre-req:Strength or Constitution 13+):When unarmed your fists count as weapons with the following statistics (1d6 damage, +3 to hit, off hand).

    Martial Arts (Pre-req: Dexterity and Constitution 13+): When unarmed your fists count as weapons with the following statistics (1d6 damage, +2 to hit and improved critical, off hand).

    Judo (Pre-req: Strength 13+ or Wisdom and Constitution 13+): You have a +2 feat bonus with escape and grab attempts. When unarmed your fists count as weapons with the following statistics (1d6 damage +2 to hit, off hand weapon).

    Snap Shot: To be completed, when equipped with a readied firearm you may make an opportunity attack against an opponent who charges you when he is 2 squares away from you. You have a -2 penalty to hit with this attack.

    Martial Melee Mastery: Only for defenders and strikers, you are proficient in all martial weapons

    Martial Ranged Mastery: Only for defenders and strikers, you are proficient in all martial weapons

    Firearms: You are proficient in projectile weapons, beam weapons and grenades. When using a firearm, you can choose to fire wildly in which case you take a -2 penalty to hit for a 1d3 bonus to damage and use an additional 5 rounds of ammunition. This tactic can be combined with the double tap or burst feats for a larger penalty to hit and larger amounts of damage. Bonus damage of this type is maximised when a critical hit occurs. If an attack does damage equal to a multiple of the weapon's damage die, the bonus damage is not multiplied.

    Well-practiced shooter (pre-req: Firearms): You may use a level-dependent bonus in place of your dexterity bonus for all attacks with modern ranged weapons.

    Level 1-4 = +3
    Level 5-12 = +4
    Level 13-20 = +5
    Level 20-27 = +6
    Level 28-30 = +7

    Balance Note: This feat prevents dexterity from becoming too valuable a characteristic given the heavy emphasis on ranged combat once firearms become available.

    Heavy Weapons (pre-req: Firearms): You are proficient in heavy machine guns, rocket launchers and sprayer weapons.

    Streetfighting: (pre-req: proficient in clubs or one simple weapon with the off-hand property)
    +1 damage with simple melee axes and hammers with the off hand property
    +1 to hit with simple, melee flails, light blades and picks with the off-hand property
    +1 to damage with clubs and clubs count as an off-hand weapon

    Keep Close: You have learnt to keep close to your enemies using a close-up offense as a form of defense. If you are armed with close combat weapons, you never let them get a clear shot and use your opponents as cover against their allies. You have the following benefits.

    You have a +1 shield bonus to AC when holding a one handed melee weapon (including variable weapons held as two-handed weapons).

    Any opponent who begins his turn adjacent to you has a -2 penalty to hit with all ranged weapons until the beginning of his next turn.

    If you are armed with two-off hand melee weapons or a single off-hand melee weapon and no other melee weapons you gain an additional +2 bonus to AC against ranged attacks when you end your turn adjacent to an enemy. This bonus lasts until the end of your next turn.

    Unarmed Focus: Same as Weapon Focus but applies to unarmed attacks

    Unarmed Expertise: Same as Weapon Expertise but applies to unarmed attacks

    Unarmed Focus: Same as Weapon Focus but applies to all firearms attacks

    Unarmed Expertise: Same as Weapon Expertise but applies to all firearm attacks

    Melee Training: Same as PHB II, you may use a statistic other than strength for melee basic attacks

    Double Tap (pre-req: Firearms): -2 to hit, you do an additional 1d6 bonus damage with a firearm. You must be using a semiautomatic or revolver firearm and firing 2 shots at a single target in quick succession. You may also use a semi-automatic weapon firing a 3-shot burst with this feat. Bonus damage of this type is maximised when a critical hit occurs. If an attack does damage equal to a multiple of the weapon's damage die, the bonus damage is not multiplied.


    Burst Fire(pre-req: Firearms): -4 to hit, you do an additional 1d8 bonus damage with a firearm when firing on the burst setting. You must be using an automatic weapon firing a 5-shot burst. Bonus damage of this type is maximised when a critical hit occurs. If an attack does damage equal to a multiple of the weapon's damage die, the bonus damage is not multiplied.


    Sniper Training(pre-req: Firearms): Improved range with firearms. You are proficient with telescopic sights. More detail will be given when rules for telescopic sights are completed.

    Armor Proficiency (Heavy Modern) (pre-req: Leather Armor): In addition to proficiency with certain armors, you may use a level dependent bonus to AC in place of your intelligence or dexterity statistic. This represents the effect of training in modern combat and its emphasis on use of cover and situational awareness. The statistic is level dependent and calculated as follows:

    Level 1-4 = +2
    Level 5-12 = +3
    Level 13-20 = +4
    Level 20-27 = +5
    Level 28-30 = +6

    Balance Note: There are modern settings where heavy armors effective against the weapons of that setting are not available. The alternative bonus to AC available here is necessary to prevent dexterity being more important than other characteristics in that kind of environment.

    Armor Specialization (Heavy Modern) (pre-req: Heavy Modern): Ignore speed penalty in heavy modern armor and +1 feat bonus to AC

    Armor Specialization (Power Armor): +1 feat bonus to AC

    Armor Proficiency (Energy Fields) (pre-req: Leather Armor)

    Armor Proficiency (Power Armor) (pre-req: Heavy Modern)
    Last edited by gnownek; 2009-07-08 at 09:22 AM.

  20. - Top - End - #20
    Dwarf in the Playground
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    Default Re: 4e Modern

    Updated 7th July

    ------------
    Equipment
    -Multiple names are separated by backslashes
    -Where the equipment is identical to an existing fantasy weapon or armor the original name is also given, in some cases weapons are altered slightly
    -* indicates a change has been made to an existing fantasy weapon or armor.
    -Trained Throw: You must have Weapon Focus in this weapon or be proficient in at least one melee or ranged Martial Weapon to throw this weapon
    -Trained Versatile: You must have Weapon Focus in this weapon or be proficient in at least one melee Martial Weapon to use this weapon as a one-handed weapon
    -Rules changes slightly encourage the use of street gang and Yakuza weapons which fit the modern setting better.
    -Kusari-gama: A knife, spike or kama may be attached to one end of the chain. You can switch between wielding the spiked chain to wielding the attached weapon in one hand and a combat chain in the other using a free action. When holding the attached weapon and combat chain, you are armed with two off-hand weapons.
    -Dagger: Counts as a dagger for class abilities and feats that specify daggers
    -Special proficiency: You need a specialized weapon proficiency feat with pre-requisites to become proficient in this weapon, the normal weapon proficiency feat does not apply
    -Taser: This weapon is less lethal, if you do not roll a critical hit, this weapon cannot reduce a target’s hit points below 0.
    -Progress Level(X): This gives the progress level at which the weapon or armor can first be found. 0- archaic items that can be made without metal, 1-archaic items requiring metal, 2-musket era equipment, 3-modern era, 4-futuristic weapon


    Improvised Melee Weapons
    Improvised One Handed*
    +0 Prof, Dmg 1d4, WT 1-5lbs, Group None, PL:0

    Improvised Two Handed*
    +0 Prof, Dmg 1d6, WT 1-5lbs, Group None, PL:0

    Unarmed Attack: An unarmed attack made without training
    +0 Prof, Dmg 1d4, Wt NA, Group Unarmed, PL:0

    Knuckle Dusters/ Pistol Whip: A pistol or knuckle duster can be used to strike a melee blow
    +1 Prof, Dmg 1d4, Wt NA, Group None, PL:2

    Rifle Butt: Rifles can be used in melee as two handed weapons
    +1 Prof, Dmg 1d6, Wt NA, Group None, Two Handed, PL:2

    Simple Weapons
    Spike/Shiv/Ice Pick: A knife-like weapon with a sharpened spike instead of a blade
    +2 Prof, Dmg 1d4, Wt 1 lb, Group Pick, High Crit, Off-Hand, PL:1

    Hammer: A claw hammer normally used for construction
    +2 Prof, Dmg 1d4, Wt 2 lb, Group Hammer, Brutal 1, Off-Hand, PL:1

    Ninja Claws/Spiked Gauntlet: Gloves with deadly spikes or claws
    +2 Prof, Dmg 1d6, Wt 1 lb. Group Unarmed, Off-Hand, PL: 1

    Nunchaku/Combat Chain: A chain or pair of weighted rods connected by rope
    +3 Prof, Dmg 1d4, Wt 2 lb, Group Flail, Off-Hand, PL: 1

    Knife/Tanto/Dagger*
    +3 Prof, Dmg 1d4, Wt 1 lb. Group Light Blade, Off-hand, Range 5/10, Trained Throw ,PL:1

    Nightstick/Club: Club, can sometimes be shortened but weighted
    +2 Prof, Dmg 1d6, Wt 2-3 lb. Group Mace, PL:0

    Cleaver/Kama/Sickle*: A heavier, slashing knife or sickle-like blade
    +2 Prof, Dmg 1d6, Wt 2 lb. Group Light Blade, Off-hand, PL: 1

    Baseball Bat: Longer club
    +3 Prof, Dmg 1d6, Wt 3-4 lb. Group Mace, Versatile, PL:0

    Lead Pipe/Crowbar/Mace: Mace or very heavy, usually metallic club
    +2 Prof, Dmg 1d8, Wt 4-6 lb. Group Mace, Trained Versatile, PL:1

    Hatchet/Tomahawk/Handaxe*
    +2 Prof, Dmg 1d6, Wt 2-3 lb. Group Axe; Range 5/10, Heavy Throw, Trained Throw, Off-hand, PL:0

    Spear*
    +2 Prof, Dmg 1d8, Wt 6 lb. Group Spear; Range 3/6, Heavy Throw, Versatile, Trained Throw, Trained Versatile, PL:0

    Javelin*
    +2 Prof, Dmg 1d6, Wt 6 lb. Group Spear; Range 10/20, Heavy Throw, Trained Throw, PL:1

    Great Club
    +2 Prof, Dmg 2d4, Wt 8-10 lbs. Group Mace, Two Handed, PL:0

    Sharpened Hockey Stick/Scythe*
    +2 Prof, Dmg 2d4, Wt 6 lbs. Group Heavy Blade, Two Handed, PL:1

    Mounted Bayonet
    +2 Prof, Dmg 1d8, Wt 1lb (bayonet only) Group Spear, Two Handed, PL:2

    Pitchfork
    +2 Prof, Dmg 2d4, Wt 6 lbs., Group Spear, Two Handed, PL:1

    Staff
    +2 Prof, Dmg 1d8, Wt 4lbs. Group Staff, Two Handed, PL:0

    Taser: electrical stunning device
    +2 Prof, Dmg 1d6, Wt 1lb. Group None, Taser, PL:3

    Hot Knife**: Small knife-sized device that emits a plasma blade
    +3 Prof, Dmg 1d6, Wt 1 lb. Group Modern Weapon, Off-hand
    ** This weapon counts as a dagger for the streetfighting feat, PL:4

    Stun Baton***: Small rod that fires electrical charges on contact
    +2 Prof, Dmg 1d8, Wt 1 lb. Group Modern Weapon
    *** This weapon counts as a club for the streetfighting feat, PL:4

    Martial Weapons
    Ice Axe/Light War Pick
    +2 Prof, Dmg 1d8, Wt 3-4 lb. Group Pick, High Crit, Off-hand, PL:1

    Ninjato/Wakizashi/Short Sword
    +3 Prof, Dmg 1d6, Wt 2 lb. Group Light Blade, Off-hand, PL:1

    Machete/Butterfly Knife
    +3 Prof, Dmg 1d6, Wt 2 lb. Group Heavy Blade, Off-hand, PL:1

    Cutlass/Scimitar
    +2 Prof, Dmg 1d8, Wt 4 lb. Group Heavy Blade, High Crit, PL:1

    Fireman's Axe/Battle Axe
    +2 Prof, Dmg 1d10, Wt 6 lb. Group Axe, Versatile, PL:1

    Long Chain/Three Section Staff/Flail: A chain, flail or the three section staff which is a Shao-Lin martial arts flail made from three rods connected by rope or chain
    +2 Prof, Dmg 1d10, Wt 6 lb. Group Flail, Versatile, PL:1

    Katana/Long Sword
    +3 Prof, Dmg 1d8, Wt 4 lb. Group Heavy Blade, Versatile, PL:1

    Cavalry Sabre/Broadsword
    +2 Prof, Dmg 1d10, Wt 4 lb. Group Heavy Blade, Versatile, PL:1

    Spiked Great Club/Morning Star*
    +2 Prof, Dmg 1d10, Wt 8 lbs. Group Mace, Brutal 1, Two Handed, PL:1

    Sledgehammer/Maul
    +2 Prof, Dmg 2d6, Wt 10-12 lbs. Group Hammer, Two Handed, PL:1

    Daito/Nodachi/Two-handed Sword
    +3 Prof, Dmg 1d10, Wt 8 lb. Group Heavy Blade, Two Handed, PL:1

    Naginata/Glaive
    +2 Prof, Dmg 2d4, Wt 10lb. Group Heavy Blade/Polearm, Reach, Two Handed, PL:1

    Longspear
    +2 Prof, Dmg 1d10, Wt 8-10lbs. Group Polearm/Spear, Reach, Two Handed, PL:1

    Vibro-knife: Machete-sized weapon fitted with a vibration blade that can be used to cut through armor
    +3 Prof, Dmg 1d8, Wt 1 lb. Group Modern Weapon, Off-Hand, PL:4

    Shock Prod: Metal club that uses an electrical discharge to do additional damage.
    +2 Prof, Dmg 1d10, Wt 2 lb. Group Modern Weapon, Brutal 2, PL:4

    Vibro-Axe: Axe with an alloy blade that when fitted with a vibration generator can cut through armor.
    +2 Prof, Dmg 1d12, Wt 4 lb. Group Modern Weapon, Versatile, PL:4

    Electro-Pike: Staff-length weapon that uses electrical discharges to do additional damage.
    +2 Prof, Dmg 1d12, Wt 10lb Group Modern Weapon, Two-Hand, Brutal 3, PL:4

    Exotic Weapon Proficiency
    Dai-katana/Bastard Sword
    +3 Prof, Dmg 1d10, Wt 5-6 lb. Group Heavy Blade, Versatile, PL:1

    Meteor Hammer/Kusari-gama/Spiked Chain*: A long chain with a weight on the end and sometimes an attached dagger or spike.
    +3 Prof, Dmg 2d4, Wt 8-10 lb. Group Flail, Reach, Two Handed, Kusari-Gama, PL:1

    Sai/Parrying Dagger*,***
    +3 Prof, Dmg 1d4, Wt 1 lb. Group Light Blade, Off-hand, Range 3/6, Defensive, PL:1
    *** This weapon counts as a dagger for rogue class abilities for the streetfighting feat

    Tonfa: T-shaped Club
    +2 Prof, Dmg 1d6, Wt 2-3 lb. Group Mace, Off-Hand, Defensive, PL:1
    *** This weapon counts as a club for the streetfighting feat

    Rapier
    +3 Prof, Dmg 1d8, Wt 2 lb. Group Light Blade, PL:1

    Chainsaw: Large, heavy mechanized saw, PL:3
    +1 Prof, Dmg 1d12, Wt 10lb Group Modern Weapon, Two-Hand, Brutal 4, PL 4
    Last edited by gnownek; 2009-07-08 at 12:14 PM.

  21. - Top - End - #21
    Halfling in the Playground
     
    PaladinGuy

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    Default Re: 4e Modern

    Quote Originally Posted by gnownek View Post
    I'm doing close you what you suggest CDR_Doom except that the first set of classes I do will all have some melee and ranged ability then I may circle back and do more specialized classes with mainly melee or mainly ranged.
    yeah, I see that now. I missed reading a couple of your posts. I guess I'm just partial to specialized classes because they make players interact more, but you do need broader classes for parties of small size.
    I like the equipment you have up there, the only one I thought was strange was that the sniper rifle has the same stats as the AK, you would think that it would be inherently more accurate. Those things like laser and telescopic sights, maybe they could be the alternative to magic upgrades for firearms?

  22. - Top - End - #22
    Dwarf in the Playground
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    Default Re: 4e Modern

    Quote Originally Posted by CDR_Doom View Post
    yeah, I see that now. I missed reading a couple of your posts. I guess I'm just partial to specialized classes because they make players interact more, but you do need broader classes for parties of small size.
    I like the equipment you have up there, the only one I thought was strange was that the sniper rifle has the same stats as the AK, you would think that it would be inherently more accurate. Those things like laser and telescopic sights, maybe they could be the alternative to magic upgrades for firearms?
    Weapons are still at draft stage, still haven't gotten range/ability to fire bursts, down and on that point Sniper Rifle would be clearly superior to the AK-47

    Scopes and bullets will be non-magical. Anything that can be bought is hard to use as a magic weapon.. if not you could end up with a military campaign where you have to find a scope before you use it.

    Magical stuff, might be actual magical stuff in the fantasy + modern campaign.

    Thing is for something to take the magical role in the game it has to be rare/customized to user/hard to replicate. Anything that can be mass produced is problematic. An ancient set of hand crafted power armor (boba fett) might be fit that role. A cybernetically implanted blade in the users hand.
    An especially powerful lightsaber crystal.....If it is not in that category, someone would just ask why you need a ritual or the hi-tech equivalent to make it.
    Last edited by gnownek; 2009-07-01 at 08:46 AM.

  23. - Top - End - #23
    Dwarf in the Playground
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    Default Re: 4e Modern

    <Poot> I have a balance problem.

    Just noticed, balance between light and heavy armor is very dependent on the difference in AC. This increases as characters rise in level. 4e balances this by improving heavy armor as more powerful magic versions turn up but I have no equivalent for my ruleset. Too many settings won't have magic modern armor.

    In addition, the stronger light armor, makes Dex - Int even more valuable than Cha, Str, Con and it was already pretty valuable as is.
    Last edited by gnownek; 2009-07-01 at 11:54 AM.

  24. - Top - End - #24
    Dwarf in the Playground
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    Default Re: 4e Modern

    8 July updated------

    Armors

    -Multiple names are separated by backslashes
    -Where the equipment is identical to an existing fantasy weapon or armor the original name is also given, in some cases weapons are altered slightly
    -* indicates a change has been made to an existing fantasy weapon or armor.
    -Progress Level(X): This gives the progress level at which the weapon or armor can first be found. 0- archaic items that can be made without metal, 1-archaic items requiring metal, 2-musket era equipment, 3-modern era, 4-futuristic weapon
    -DR (+X): Damage resistance, this absorbs x damage from any attack that is resolved against AC
    -ADR (+Y,<type of attack>): Additional damage resistance, this absorbs x damage from any attack of the specified weapon group that is resolved against AC. It stacks with damage resistance from the same piece of armor.
    -Obsolete (-Z DR and/or AC,<type of attack>): The DR or AC bonus of this suit of armor is reduced by Z for the given type of attack
    -Light: This is light armor
    -Heavy: This is heavy armor
    -Shield: This is a shield, shield bonuses stack with other armor bonuses
    -Powered: Armor is effectively weightless when functioning.

    Archaic Armor
    Leather Armor*
    DR(+2), Obsolete (-2 DR, modern weapons, projectile weapons and beam weapons), Wt 15lbs, Check+0, Speed+0, Light, PL (0)

    Hide Armor*
    AC (+1), DR(+2), Obsolete (-2 DR, modern weapons, projectile weapons and beam weapons), Wt 25lbs, Check-1, Speed+0, Light, PL (0)

    Chain Armor*
    AC (+3), DR(+3), Obsolete (-2 DR, -2 AC , modern weapons, projectile weapons and beam weapons), Wt 40lbs, Check-1, Speed-1, Heavy, PL (1)

    Breastplate and Helm: Popular armor used in the musket era.
    AC (+4), DR(+2), Obsolete (-2 DR, -2 AC , modern weapons, projectile weapons and beam weapons), Wt 35lbs, Check-0, Speed-1, Uses Chain Mail Proficiency, Heavy, PL (2)

    Scale Armor*
    AC (+4), DR(+3), Obsolete (-2 DR, -2 AC , modern weapons, projectile weapons and beam

    weapons), Wt 45lbs, Check+0, Speed-1, Heavy, PL (1)

    Plate Mail Armor*
    AC (+4), DR(+4), Obsolete (-2 DR, -2 AC , modern weapons, projectile weapons and beam weapons), Wt 50lbs, Check-2, Speed-1, Heavy, PL (1)

    Light Shield*
    AC(+1), Obsolete (-1 AC, projectile weapons and beam weapons), Check+0 Speed+0, Wt 6lb, Shield

    Heavy Shield*
    AC(+2), Obsolete (-2 AC, Check+0, projectile weapons and beam weapons), Check+0, Speed+0, Wt 15lb, Shield

    Modern Armor
    Undercover Vest: Light bulletproof material worn under clothing. At higher progress levels, the armor can be made to resemble normal clothing.
    ADR(+2, projectile weapons) Wt 5 bs, Check+0, Speed+0, PL (3), Light, No proficiency required

    Bulletproof Vest: Light armor made from bulletproof material. Armor is visible and obvious.
    AC(+2), ADR(+2, projectile weapons), Wt 15 lbs, Check+0, Speed+0, PL (3), Light, Leather armor proficiency required

    Combat Armor: Heavy armor made from bulletproof material. Armor is visible and obvious.
    AC(+4) DR(+2), ADR(+2, projectile weapons), Wt 30lbs, Check-1, Speed-1, PL (3), Heavy, Modern armor proficiency required

    Blast Cloth Vest: Clothing made from energy and impact resistant material.
    ADR(+2, projectile weapons, beam weapons), Wt 4lbs, Check+0, Speed+0, PL (4), Light, No proficiency required

    Blast Armor Vest: Light armor made from energy and impact resistant material.
    AC(+1), DR(+1), ADR(+2, projectile weapons, beam weapons), Wt 12lbs, Check+0, Speed+0, PL (4), Light, Leather armor proficiency required

    Mesh Armor: Medium armor made from energy and impact resistant material. Armor is visible and obvious.
    AC(+1), DR(+2), ADR(+2, projectile weapons, beam weapons), Wt 16lbs, Check-1, Speed+0, PL (4), Light, Hide armor proficiency required

    Carapace Armor: Heavy, hi-tech plate armor.
    AC(+4) DR(+2), ADR(+2, projectile weapons, beam weapons), Wt 30lbs, Check-1, Speed-1, PL (4), Heavy, Modern armor proficiency required

    Bounty Hunter Armor: Heavy, powered, hi-tech plate armor.
    AC(+5) DR(+2), ADR(+2, projectile weapons, beam weapons), Wt 30lbs, Check-1, Speed+0, PL (4), Heavy, Powered, Powered armor proficiency required

    Riot Shield
    AC(+2), Obsolete (-2 AC, beam weapons), Check+0, Speed+0, Wt 12lb, Shield, You may use this piece of equipment with the Heavy Shield or Light Shield Proficiency. You have a -1 penalty to attacks if you use the shield without the Heavy Shield proficiency.

    Force Field,
    You have a +1 bonus to AC if you are wearing armor. If you are unarmoured, the total bonus to defense is +1 to AC and +2 DR against projectile weapons and beam weapons.

    Customized Armor - Customized versions of modern heavy or power armors are available. You may use part of your Dex or Intelligence bonus to AC with
    customized armor.

    Level 1 customised armor (typically affordable for level 4 characters), +1 dx/int bonus possible
    Level 2 customised armor (typically affordable for level 10 characters) +2 dx/int bonus possible
    Level 3 customised armor (typically affordable for level 16 characters) +3 dx/int bonus possible
    Level 4 customised armor (typically affordable for level 22 characters) +4 dx/int bonus possible
    Level 5 customised armor (typically affordable for level 28 characters) +5 dx/int bonus possible

    Balance commentary: These are the equivalent of masterwork archaic armor in fantasy campaigns. These have been added to preserve the balance between light and heavy armor users at higher levels.
    Last edited by gnownek; 2009-07-08 at 01:31 PM.

  25. - Top - End - #25
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: 4e Modern

    Quote Originally Posted by gnownek View Post
    <Poot> I have a balance problem.

    Just noticed, balance between light and heavy armor is very dependent on the difference in AC. This increases as characters rise in level. 4e balances this by improving heavy armor as more powerful magic versions turn up but I have no equivalent for my ruleset. Too many settings won't have magic modern armor.

    In addition, the stronger light armor, makes Dex - Int even more valuable than Cha, Str, Con and it was already pretty valuable as is.
    4E assumes that players gain +1 to their AC, attack, damage, and defenses through equipment every other level. You receive a +1 to these every even level regardless thus the system balances itself by expecting you to acquire equipment to make up for the odd numbered levels.

    I'll have to find it, but the suggestion for low magic campaigns is in the DMG I believe. They tell you how to handle a lack of equipment.

    Edit: You don't have to come up with anything magical or outrageous to make controllers work. My idea of a modern controler is someone who taunts and makes wild area attacks. For example

    Dangerous Leer: At-Will
    All who gaze upon your grimace have second thoughts about engaging you.
    Close 3
    Cha vs. Will
    1d6+cha push opponent one square.

    Roundhouse Kick: At-Will
    You spin around, kicking all those foolish enough to approach.
    Area burst 1
    Atk vs. Ac
    1d8+str
    Last edited by jmbrown; 2009-07-01 at 12:36 PM.

  26. - Top - End - #26
    Dwarf in the Playground
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    Default Re: 4e Modern

    I was going to put some trickster/intimidator powers in the talker class.

    I suspect more powerful, almost martial controller powers are best done in a psionic class. Just as a bard has some arcane powers that could easily be martial in nature and the monk has psionic powers that look like a martial power - but the arcane and psionic power sources makes them just a little more believable.

    You OK, with me incorporating some of those powers though? Some good ideas - they may make good talker or martial artist classes.
    Last edited by gnownek; 2009-07-01 at 02:18 PM.

  27. - Top - End - #27
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: 4e Modern

    I'm just tossing out ideas for a simple, no magic, real world mundane game idea.

  28. - Top - End - #28
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    Djinn_in_Tonic's Avatar

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    Default Re: 4e Modern

    Quote Originally Posted by jmbrown View Post
    I'm just tossing out ideas for a simple, no magic, real world mundane game idea.
    This is, I think, the best way to do it. Not all games include magic.

    With that in mind, I think it's best to do away with the Controller role entirely. Instead, fold it into the other roles. For example...

    A ranged Striker character uses Rapid Fire Assault to sweep a large area clear of foes. He then uses Covering Fire to force foes to take cover, stopping them in their tracks if they try to take a different action.

    A melee Defender uses Furious Charge to run through a group of foes, knocking them all prone. Next round he whips out a Stunning Dervish Kick, dazing everything adjacent to himself.

    A melee Leader uses Resolute Stance, causing enemies around him to back away, temporarily awed by the impressive display of courage.

    In fact, I'd personally do away with roles entirely...but that's just me.

    Ingredients

    2oz Djinn
    5oz Water
    1 Lime Wedge


    Instructions

    Pour Djinn and tonic water into a glass filled with ice cubes. Stir well. Garnish with lime wedge. Serve.

  29. - Top - End - #29
    Dwarf in the Playground
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    Default Re: 4e Modern

    Other classes are definitely going to have some awe/intimidate/distract martial powers

    ----------------------
    Modifications

    Weapon Modifcations
    Explosive ammo:-1 to hit, improved critical
    Laser Sight: To be sorted out
    Tracer Ammo: -1 to damage, +1 to hit with burst fire
    Telescopic Sight: To be sorted out
    Grenade Launcher Attachment: To be sorted out
    Shotgun Attachment: To be sorted out
    Extra Ammo: Extra large magazine
    Flechette Projectile Weapon: Rebuilds gun to fire flechettes, range reduced but can carry more ammo
    Pistol Implant: Small energy weapon added to hi-tech melee weapon

    Cybernetics
    Much like magic items, take up similar slots. Rules are to be balanced against magic items.

    Power Armor
    Basic power armor is already described. Further enhancements to be decided later and to be balanced against cybernetics.

    Heavy Weapons
    Need to have some framework for vehicles before I finish this off. Must wait so rocket launchers aren't too effective against persons or too effective against vehicles.
    Last edited by gnownek; 2009-07-08 at 01:40 PM.

  30. - Top - End - #30
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    Default Re: 4e Modern

    Quote Originally Posted by CDR_Doom View Post
    yeah, I see that now. I missed reading a couple of your posts. I guess I'm just partial to specialized classes because they make players interact more, but you do need broader classes for parties of small size.
    I like the equipment you have up there, the only one I thought was strange was that the sniper rifle has the same stats as the AK, you would think that it would be inherently more accurate. Those things like laser and telescopic sights, maybe they could be the alternative to magic upgrades for firearms?
    Thing is, a sniper rifle is not inherently more accurate than a pistol however it most definitely has a higher range increment. Perhaps there could be a rule for 'focused shots' or scopes (latter only applies bonus during focused/sighted shots)?

    Also the Ak is technically more accurate when fully automatic since when spraying, you're gauranteed to hit something, but whether or not that's the enemy is not gauranteed (you'll be hitting lots of other things like cover, particularly in a full attack action).

    Cybernetics
    Much like magic items, take up similar slots. Rules are to be balanced against magic items.
    Plenty of cybernetics belong inside the body too though. What's to stop people from creating cybernetic-dirived templates? I know you're referring to external cybernetics, unless you've already planned for what I just mentioned.
    ----

    Finally, I'm surprised that people haven't cried for the OP to do away with this and use D20 modern instead. Why can't 3.5 receive the same sort of treatment as this? I think Djinn particularly hasn't lambasted this, just becasue he hates me.
    Last edited by imp_fireball; 2009-07-01 at 07:42 PM.

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