A low WIS Character.

[Overlord Nicy]

So, last session our Dwarf Monk died. So now he had to make a new character. After going with human sorcerer, he rolled stats. Yes, we roll stats. We enjoy variety, we care nothing for balance. But anyway, after rolling two 17s and an 18, luck have it that he gets a 4. Which he dumps to wisdom. So, any advice I should give him about it, aside from the obvious things? (Or obvious things that are so obvious he'll never see it coming.)

[AstralFire]

I'm seeing low attention span and a complete lack of curiosity about anything that isn't extremely shiny. Also will fall to very simple traps or any situation that requires quick, reactive thinking.

[Mongoose87]

He gets the big picture, but he gets bogged down in the details.

[The Neoclassic]

He may also have a very poor memory. However, he's probably good at memorizing material or remembering purely factual things (if he has a good Int score), and his social graces and charm (high Cha) may win over friends who aren't too observent themselves. He's likely a bad decision maker and completely unable to tell who his real friends are.

Of course, it all depends on how he wants to play the character. Should turn out interestingly though....

[Sinfire Titan]

Shoulda put it in Str.


Hit him with a Will save effect. That'll teach him.

[The Neoclassic]

Shoulda put it in Str.


Hit him with a Will save effect. That'll teach him.

Not all DMs believe in punishing players for making non-optimal character choices. It already sounds like this DM wants to help (or at least neutrally guide) this player rather than school them for daring to pick the wrong place to put an ability roll.

[Sinfire Titan]

Not all DMs believe in punishing players for making non-optimal character choices. It already sounds like this DM wants to help (or at least neutrally guide) this player rather than school them for daring to pick the wrong place to put an ability roll.

In that case, give him a Talisman of the Disc (MIC) and tell him to dump Str instead.

[BenTheJester]

4 wisdom to me equals completely nuts.

Think mad scientist, imaginary friend, etc.

[Hat-Trick]

Make sure he has a good familiar to make the spot and listen checks for him (assuming he keeps the familiar rather than something else).

[Glyde]

The way I play my low wis character (7, so take these a bit... more extreme I guess) is like this. He's very quick to anger and brash, acting before thinking (Though he's brilliant.)

He doesn't think far in advance, though he might have a generic plan for the future. He's addled in the sense that things can go on around him and he'll either be too focused or too distracted (hah.) to notice.

He'd drift in and out of conversations, maybe thinking the planning process is a waste of time. He might end up being rude at times unintentionally, but that could be more of a charisma thing.


Its not much, but I hope it helps

[Overlord Nicy]

Maybe I should have said this. I'm not actually the DM here. Our party is only me(a drunken barbarian), my friend who plays a mute cleric, and this sorcerer.

I'm seeing low attention span and a complete lack of curiosity about anything that isn't extremely shiny. Also will fall to very simple traps or any situation that requires quick, reactive thinking.

Then I should probably convince him to change, as we're going to be fighting two more levels worth of kobolds?

And yeah, thanks for the advice guys.

[deuxhero]

Isn't "absent minded professor" the standard explanation/example of a low wisdom high int character?

[Shpadoinkle]

What are his Intelligence and Charisma scores? That could help with defining what he'd probably be like.

Anyway... a 4 wisdom is just barely higher than the minimum. He probably has poor impulse control, a short attention span, and is easily tricked, persuaded, or talked into things that he knows are bad ideas... and he might realize they're bad ideas if he'd just take the time to stop and think for a second, but his low Wisdom would make that a rare occurance.

If he has a high Intelligence, he'd probably get absorbed into reading a book or thinking about a problem and might have to be physically struck on occasion just to get his attention. If he has an average Intellience, he might just get distracted thinking about bunnies (or gold or women or whatever it is he likes).

Low Wisdom, high Charisma, and average-ish Intelligence could be represented as a pathological party animal; he loves being around lots of people and telling jokes and being the center of attention, probably, regardless of whether other people are laughing with him or at him (and he might not appreciate or even care about the difference). He might be loud and an attention whore regardless of whether it's appropriate at the time or not.

During a conversation, he'd probably be wandering from one subject to the next with every other sentance unless the other person(s) deliberately try to keep him on one subject.

A low Wisdom is sort of like ADD (NOT ADHD, there IS a difference). He'd probably focus on things that interest him and pretty much ignore everything else unless it's an emergency or something.

[imp_fireball]

He gets the big picture, but he gets bogged down in the details.

He'd also have the imagination of a doorknob unable to see beyond what his magic can do for him. You could make him a bit of a pompous fool depending on his alignment, but not enough that it breaks up the party.

Comparitively, 4 INT would be close to mild retardation.

Also, it really depends on how big the picture is. His low attention span will cause him to forget details, not due to a poor memory (memory isn't a stat that has mechanical affects in D&D unless you're thinking of something like a photographic memory, maybe).

A good way to start with creating a character like this to go with the assumption that he has no grasp of even the fundamentals of something like philosophy or the ability to ask 'good questions'.

[The Neoclassic]

Comparitively, 4 INT would be close to mild retardation.

Close to? No, it would be severe mental handicap; remember that cats have an Int of 2 and "average"/regular/default-NPC humans have an Intelligence of 10-11. So, Wisdom along the same lines... Would be pretty horrific, the more than I think about it.

[AstralFire]

Close to? No, it would be severe mental handicap; remember that cats have an Int of 2 and "average"/regular/default-NPC humans have an Intelligence of 10-11. So, Wisdom along the same lines... Would be pretty horrific, the more than I think about it.

What does this button do?

[ericgrau]

So, last session our Dwarf Monk died. So now he had to make a new character. After going with human sorcerer, he rolled stats. Yes, we roll stats. We enjoy variety, we care nothing for balance. But anyway, after rolling two 17s and an 18, luck have it that he gets a 4. Which he dumps to wisdom. So, any advice I should give him about it, aside from the obvious things? (Or obvious things that are so obvious he'll never see it coming.)

Huh? What? I kinda trailed off and forgot what you were talking about. Say that again?

In the most general sense, per the game rules, wisdom is awareness of other things around you. So you could see a tree, analyze it's bark for tanin content, and count its rings, etc. This is int. But then you take 5 steps immediately afterwards and bump into another tree because you weren't paying attention (that's a DC 0 spot check btw, or DC 5 if distracted). The PHB also describes a low wis as being absent minded. Don't go overboard and make it into a stereotype, but you get the idea.

[Kallisti]

With that low a Wisdom score, he has no sense at all. Take all of his character flaws and multiply them by like 10.

He's totally clueless. Even with a high int, he won't be able to tell the difference between a good plan and an awful one.

I really, really, really doubt 4 wis is a good idea. If he's a sorceror, it should be in Str.

Because anyone who cares enough to roleplay his mental stats will get you all killed at 4 wis.

Bear in mind, 4 wis is not somewhat impulsive like 7 wis, it's severely, severely mentally handicapped and foolish or maybe utterly, incurably insane.

[SinsI]

He'd need to have another player constantly watch over him in order not to do something stupid - i.e. become fascinated with a peculiar bug while an enemy is charging him.

[Hat-Trick]

"Remind me again what happens if I decide to press this button?"

"We die."

"Oh... Okay..."

few minutes later.

"Which button wasn't I supposed to touch? They all look the same."

"The Red one."

"Which Red one? The Dark red, the cherry red, the light red, the maroon, the orange red, the red orange?"

^maybe like that, but worse.

[Roc Ness]

Make him take notes on Elan

[quick_comment]

Someone with 4 wis basically has severe schizophrenia.

Strange affect, delusions, poor perception of reality etc.

[Jergmo]

With that low a Wisdom score, he has no sense at all. Take all of his character flaws and multiply them by like 10.

He's totally clueless. Even with a high int, he won't be able to tell the difference between a good plan and an awful one.

I really, really, really doubt 4 wis is a good idea. If he's a sorceror, it should be in Str.

Because anyone who cares enough to roleplay his mental stats will get you all killed at 4 wis.

Bear in mind, 4 wis is not somewhat impulsive like 7 wis, it's severely, severely mentally handicapped and foolish or maybe utterly, incurably insane.

There is always some madness in reason, and always some reason in madness. Folks who lose SAN don't lose wisdom. Also, if it were to be allowed by point by, one of those 18's could be reduced to 17 and it'd allow him to pump Wis up to 11. Or the 17 to a 16. *Shrug*

[imp_fireball]

Close to? No, it would be severe mental handicap; remember that cats have an Int of 2 and "average"/regular/default-NPC humans have an Intelligence of 10-11. So, Wisdom along the same lines... Would be pretty horrific, the more than I think about it.

Oh, not this again. The gap between 2 and 3 INT is massive. If 3 INT means they're walking brain dead automotons incapable of any form of logic, then how can such adventurers survive at all when not in the presence of a party? How would they grasp the ability to take up a life of adventure without intense supervision (something unavailable in the middle ages)? How would they even have any skill points at all?

3 INT is mild retardation in my book. Actual retardation is a major flaw or trait.

[Douglas]

Matching the average and standard deviation of intelligence and IQ (not that IQ is perfect, but I'm not aware of anything better that can be condensed to a single number), 3 int is equivalent to 65 IQ. According to Wikipedia, that is in the "Mild mental retardation" range.

So yes, a character with 3 int is only mildly retarded.

[Mongoose87]

Oh, not this again. The gap between 2 and 3 INT is massive. If 3 INT means they're walking brain dead automotons incapable of any form of logic, then how can such adventurers survive at all when not in the presence of a party? How would they grasp the ability to take up a life of adventure without intense supervision (something unavailable in the middle ages)? How would they even have any skill points at all?

3 INT is mild retardation in my book. Actual retardation is a major flaw or trait.

I thought you couldn't speak properly with less than 8?

[imp_fireball]

Anyone more retarded would likely die right out of the womb in the middle ages, so it's perfectly logical.

I thought you couldn't speak properly with less than 8?

Remember that education isn't very rife in the middle ages. People with average or higher are assumed to 'pick up' things, likely from the nobles, perhaps to seem more dignified themselves. It's not that people stupider lack the capacity, it's just they are of a different cultural barrier.

A lot of peasants in middle ages england spoke in uvular Rs for example until that one German king came along. 'Speaking properly' is noble perception. In the world today, there's no way to 'speak properly' except through what literary authoritarians tell you. Everyone has accents, slang, etc. And it is true that those of lower capacity tend to speak more simply and straight forward - that's probably what the books meant.

Someone with 4 wis basically has severe schizophrenia.

Either that, or they're the most ignorant buffoon you'll come across in a bar. People who could never tell a joke or recognize what actually is funny. Again, I'd argue that schizophrenia is a trait or flaw; usually reducing WIS rather than requiring rock bottom WIS as a prerequisite.

[ericgrau]

I see a lot of people expressing exactly the stereotypes I suggested avoiding. A 4 wis could be mad, but it doesn't have to be. Nor is he unable to act. Derro (which really are mad) live healthy murderous lives. And in the case of the Derro the madness causes low wis not vis versa (see: madness removal method).

[Chaelos]

Per the SRD, a 2 WIS would be roughly the equivalent of a moving fungus. 4 WIS, in my book, would be somewhere between a sack of flour and a three year old human child, for purposes of determining willpower, common sense, perception and intuition.

[imp_fireball]

Unless of course he's cool with being a lunatic. :P

"Whee!"
"Oh here we go again."
"This reminds me of merry-go-rounds!"
"What is he saying? Never mind, I won't get involved in this... you can have the loot."
"Loot a toot! Loot a toot!"