PC's building structures in a campaign

[Gaseous Anomaly]

Our party came across a huge bag of treasure, and we were thinking of building a little stronghold or fort or something similar away from the main city, because our house in the city just got leveled. My DM said that he was toying around with a castle siege idea for quite some time, and we would get a nice adventure if there is a fort involved. Is there any material out there (books/websites) that could give us some more information about how constructing and upkeeping a facility works, or am I stuck with figuring stuff out with my DM? Also, share any ideas you have about the subject, like what your party has done in the past. All help is appreciated.

[kamikasei]

You want the "Stronghold Builder's Guide", a 3.0 book (I think). Dungeonscape (3.5) may also be helpful. If you're not in 3e, they'll still have some ideas, if not actual costs.

[Cicciograna]

Stronghold Builder's Guidebook. Has anything for stronghold construction.

EDIT: curse you, Red Ninja!

[Gaseous Anomaly]

Thanks guys, I'm browsing amazon right now. We may have to adjust prices and junk because we're playing a 3.5 campaign.

[bosssmiley]

Similar, but free: download OSRIC or Labyrinth Lord. They're OGL books that have sections on castle building which use prices inspired by / scaled to the official SRD material. No official sourcebooks were harmed.

Be warned that Stronghold Builder's Guide has some completely b0rked prices. The cost of a trench or moat, for example... (this was discussed the other week)

[Milskidasith]

Borked high or borked low?

[AstralFire]

Borked high or borked low?

I'm going to guess high, since there's no amount of borking low that would actually matter for a mundane trap to anyone capable of the resources to build a castle in D&D.

[Mr.Moron]

Borked high or borked low?

Borked High. Even trivial things cost far too much money. Simple Log Cabin? That's going to run you 1,000gp+*, even in the middle of the forest.


*depending on community modifiers.


EDIT: Honestly just "Wing It". Come up with an amount of treasure you're willing to part with, and then just fiddle with designs until you have one your DM will accept. Much less headache for everyone involved.

[Cicciograna]

Similar, but free: download OSRIC or Labyrinth Lord. They're OGL books that have sections on castle building which use prices inspired by / scaled to the official SRD material. No official sourcebooks were harmed.

This looks interesting. Would you please add some link, since I'm too lazy to find myself ?

[hamishspence]

the high prices might be intended for PCs only- while I'd lower them for NPCs, maybe for PCs the high prices discourage casual buying.

[Indon]

If you're just going to have a staffed keep, my suggestion won't really apply, but if you're looking to build something like a small castle-town, or any kind of permanent community (like a village around your town), I would also recommend getting the World of Warcraft D20 book. The last chapter has the best D20 rendition of community interaction that I have ever seen.

Edit: Mind, this would be more for tracking a community through things like wars and matters of trade and such.

[RS14]

This looks interesting. Would you please add some link, since I'm too lazy to find myself ?

Dude, you can at least pretend to try.

http://www.google.com/search?q=OSRIC
http://www.google.com/search?q=Labyrinth+Lord

[Woodsman]

DMG II talks about a cleric armed with multiple move earth, wall of stone, and other such spells building the PC's a simple tower as a base as a reward for reaching a certain XP level (Shining Crusade, level 10, I believe).

If your PC's have patrons, something like this could easily be accomplished after a big mission. If not, the PC's could easily find a tower under the care of an NPC who says "Hey, why don't you take it off my hands?"

[Cicciograna]

Dude, you can at least pretend to try.

http://www.google.com/search?q=OSRIC
http://www.google.com/search?q=Labyrinth+Lord

[Dervag]

DMG II talks about a cleric armed with multiple move earth, wall of stone, and other such spells building the PC's a simple tower as a base as a reward for reaching a certain XP level (Shining Crusade, level 10, I believe).

If your PC's have patrons, something like this could easily be accomplished after a big mission. If not, the PC's could easily find a tower under the care of an NPC who says "Hey, why don't you take it off my hands?"

Our party drove a company of hobgoblins and an evil cleric out of a ruined fortress in the middle of nowhere, then came back later that year and started renovating the place. It was a wreck, and we wound up having to do quite a lot of monster-clearing, along with the odd bit of "convince the local tribe not to besiege our fort while it's still garrisoned only by us and about six guys we hired to keep watch by beating their massive burly champion in single combat." Oh, did I mention that the place was an antiquated deathtrap before we started remodeling?

But once we got things straightened out, it was pretty good. We found some actual interesting resources nearby (well, OK, copper mines aren't that interesting). We started opening up a trade route that had formerly been more or less closed. Local potentates started calling us in for backup when things got messy. Good times.

[Yahzi]

Our party drove a company of hobgoblins and an evil cleric out of a ruined fortress in the middle of nowhere,

And as soon as you moved in... there went the neighborhood.



The DMG actually has base prices for keeps, castles, and fortresses. But ya, 1000 gp for a peasant hut is crazy.

[oxinabox]

... i charged 1.5 astral gems (=15,000 gp?) for a lower end 4 room two story house in sigel.
But sigel property prices are ... intense.

[Triaxx]

Nah, what you want is an undertower. Ten levels down of death traps and random minor treasures. Entrance appears to be stairs but is really one massive teleportation circle leading to the eleventh level which is the actual living quarters. Code word the circle, and then only the party can reach the living area, and any random adventurers will have to navigate the death trap maze, which ends on the tenth floor. With instructions on how to use the teleportation circle. And explosive runes. Which resets the traps and triggers a dimensional anchor. So they have to walk back out.

[Belial_the_Leveler]

I suggest Earthquake.

[MickJay]

Example of price which was discussed here recently: average moat - 50k gold. If you hired peasants to do it, they'd each need to move less than 2 cubic feet of earth per day to eventually accumulate 50k in wages and stuff. But if you want to get your money's worth, the 50k should get you a nice acid-filled moat infested with acid-breathing sharks.

[Gorbash]

Why not just find a suitable keep and kill the inhabitants? That's what every self-respecting adventurer would do.

And I see no point in paying crazy amounts of gold for the keep when you can just employ the party wizard to cast numerous Wall of Stone, Stone Shape and Move Earth spells to construct a keep without any cost, it'd just take some time.

[Wafflecart]

the 3.0 book Sword and Fist has some strongholds in the back, and I liked them

[Dervag]

Nah, what you want is an undertower. Ten levels down of death traps and random minor treasures. Entrance appears to be stairs but is really one massive teleportation circle leading to the eleventh level which is the actual living quarters. Code word the circle, and then only the party can reach the living area, and any random adventurers will have to navigate the death trap maze, which ends on the tenth floor. With instructions on how to use the teleportation circle. And explosive runes. Which resets the traps and triggers a dimensional anchor. So they have to walk back out.

What happens if you want to order a pizza?

Seriously, though, that's a great way to make a defensible death trap that no one but you can enter... which normally isn't the point. As the Bat-Cave it works, but most people who want a stronghold don't want a Bat-Cave or the magical equivalent of Cheyenne Mountain. They want something they can build a community around, something that gives them a credible claim to the surrounding territory, not just the good-guy version of the bad-guy's dungeon.

Now, you may want to put one of these impenetrable magic bunkers under your castle/manor/whatever, but you don't want to spend all your time down there with nothing but Explosive Runes to keep you company.

[Triaxx]

Have someone go up and meet the pizza boy.

I actually used that one as a wizards tower, explaining that it didn't have to go up...

---

Two options for a community centerpiece: The above mentioned tower, with the illusion of a castle above it.

Or a truly MASSIVE wizards tower. Build it so that the ground floor is large enough for the entire town you want to live inside. With stables and underground storage, you can use it the same as you might a castle, with everyone inside to wait out possible sieges.

My favorite living quarters however, was a castle carved out of a mountain. As the castle expanded deeper into the mountain, the blocks that were pulled out, were added to the outer walls, causing a slow expansion of the courtyard, accomodating more and more buildings inside, while also expanding the main castle area.

[Dervag]

As I said, this magic Cheyenne Mountain concept makes sense as a bunker. But like a bunker, you can't govern from inside it. If you're worried enough about attack to build one of these, consider the behavior of heads of state during the Second World War: they had bunkers that they could retreat into if attack was imminent, but they spent most of their time actually working and governing above ground level.

So you need more than the illusion of a castle; you need the reality. Also, a real, physical castle provides security for civilians in the area if the area is attacked by ordinary, conventional monsters. It's bad press if an orc raiding party butchers one of the villages you claim to rule while you squat in your magically trapped basement.

[woodenbandman]

How about the DM collectively gives the PCs the Landlord feat as a gift for finishing an adventure (they save a town, they get a keep).