Core class ToB variants / Partial Pathfinder additions

**Kobold-Bard** · 2009-08-28, 01:07 PM (ISO 8601)

I have seen Tome of Battle variants for a couple of classes (Ranger and Rogue) mentioned recently, and I was wondering if anyone had the necessary links and would be willing to share them? Opinions on them would also be gratefully accepted.

I tried Google, but my search-fu is weak as of late.

I've avoided ToB because they seem to make older classes obsolete, and I didn't like that. However if these variants work I would seriously look into them.

Thanks in advance
K-B

Edit: Because starting another thread seemed wasteful: Would allowing some of the Pathfinder classes and not others be unbalancing? I'm specifically looking at the Bard, because I personally find it to be filled with creamy, yummy awesomeness (it may not be especially potent given the average defences of an opponent at that level, but Deadly Performance is something I've always wanted the Bard to have).

**Frosty** · 2009-08-28, 01:14 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Kobold-Bard

I have seen Tome of Battle variants for a couple of classes (Ranger and Rogue) mentioned recently, and I was wondering if anyone had the necessary links and would be willing to share them? Opinions on them would also be gratefully accepted.

I tried Google, but my search-fu is weak as of late.

I've avoided ToB because they seem to make older classes obsolete, and I didn't like that. However if these variants work I would seriously look into them.

Thanks in advance
K-B

They are what balanced versions of older classes SHOULD be. For example, if you have a Swordsage that focuses a lot of Setting Sun and Shadowhand and Diamond Mind, you could play it and he'd look and feel a lot like a monk, except he contributes in battle. You want to do special maneuvers like Tripping or martial arts grapples and throws? Setting Sun has PLENTY of that! you want to use your Monk's 1/day Dimension Door (Abundant Step)? Why Shadow Hand maneuvers have that...and you can do it ALL day long, not just 1/day. You want to do a Flurry of Blows? Well, Diamon mind has a maneuver called Avalanche of Blades. Very similar in flavor in that you make a lot of attacks.

**Foryn Gilnith** · 2009-08-28, 01:16 PM (ISO 8601)

This thread reckoned that all the iconics were actually ToB classes. :P

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=122403

**lsfreak** · 2009-08-28, 01:30 PM (ISO 8601)

Here's a link to a version of the monk, ranger, and bard, and several prestige classes. Here's another version of the ranger. Here's a hexblade. (Note that I haven't done more than glance over any of them, do I don't know balance or anything).

**Tempest Fennac** · 2009-08-28, 01:32 PM (ISO 8601)

http://wiki.faxcelestis.net/index.ph...e_Class_Update could help as well.

**PinkysBrain** · 2009-08-28, 01:37 PM (ISO 8601)

Don't undersell the rogue. Skills are hard to completely replace (without artificer). For instance blowing traps with summons will alert the guard whereas simply disabling them will not. Between skills, UMD and the amount of raw damage they can inflict under favourable circumstances the rogue is a decent class.

**Fax Celestis** · 2009-08-28, 01:42 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Tempest Fennac

http://wiki.faxcelestis.net/index.ph...e_Class_Update could help as well.

HAHAHA I was just about to link that.

**Kobold-Bard** · 2009-08-28, 02:09 PM (ISO 8601)

Thanks for the responses, I think Fax's one is the one I'm looking for.

One thing I would like to ask, and starting another thread seems a little wasteful: Would allowing some of the Pathfinder classes and not others be unbalancing? I'm specifically looking at the Bard, because I personally find it to be filled with creamy, yummy awesomeness.

**Foryn Gilnith** · 2009-08-28, 02:16 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Kobold-Bard

the Bard...filled with creamy, yummy awesomeness.

I failed my save vs. Gutter Mind.

Can anyone testify to which of these solutions is the best balanced?

**AstralFire** · 2009-08-28, 02:25 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Foryn Gilnith

I failed my save vs. Gutter Mind.

Can anyone testify to which of these solutions is the best balanced?

Time in a strict private school run by nuns.

**Starbuck_II** · 2009-08-28, 02:42 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Kobold-Bard

I have seen Tome of Battle variants for a couple of classes (Ranger and Rogue) mentioned recently, and I was wondering if anyone had the necessary links and would be willing to share them? Opinions on them would also be gratefully accepted.

I tried Google, but my search-fu is weak as of late.

I've avoided ToB because they seem to make older classes obsolete, and I didn't like that. However if these variants work I would seriously look into them.

Thanks in advance
K-B

Edit: Because starting another thread seemed wasteful: Would allowing some of the Pathfinder classes and not others be unbalancing? I'm specifically looking at the Bard, because I personally find it to be filled with creamy, yummy awesomeness (it may not be especially potent given the average defences of an opponent at that level, but Deadly Performance is something I've always wanted the Bard to have).

Beta Bard or Gamma Bard (Final version)?
Beta Bard was pretty good.

As long as DM is cool with it: it shoud be fine to use some and not others.

**Gnaeus** · 2009-08-28, 03:53 PM (ISO 8601)

The only PF class that is hard on balance is the Wizard. It was strongest before and got stronger. The cleric and druid got slightly weaker. Sorcerer got stronger, but needed it. All the other classes need all the help they can get.

So, for balance, I would use all the PF classes except for Wizard, use 3.5 wizard, but with the spell changes in the pathfinder book.

Thread: Core class ToB variants / Partial Pathfinder additions

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