Sneak attack everything?

[Loki Eremes]

hi there pals,
long time since i wrote down a new thread

Sneak Attack, D&D 3.5.
at the begining i thought it was only limited to flanking, but there are tons of ways to deal that extras d6s.
Even you can sneak attack things like zombies with "Death's Ruin" from Complete champion
and Razing Strike feat allows you to sneak attack constructs at the cost of one of your spells...

but

this is my question:
is there a way to sneak attack (i mean, dealing that extras d6s of damage) to formless things or immune to criticals?

Feats, spells, weapons... anything that allows this will work.

[Kylarra]

Penetrating Strike ACF from dungeonscape allows you to deal half damage to things normally immune as long as you have flanking, assuming they can be flanked.

[Eldariel]

Immune to criticals are easy. Penetrating Strike [Dungeonscape] gives up Trap Sense (useless anyways) and gives you ability to deal ½ SA damage to normally immune creatures while flanking them.

Combine this with Darkstalker [Lords of Madness] and you can flank just about anything (this stops All-Around Vision and similars from intervening with your flanking in addition to being awesome with Hide; negates Blindsense, Blindsight et al.).


The only problem are amorphous creatures...can't think of anything to help there.

[Myou]

You could ask your DM to just let precision damage work on anything. It's really not a problem.

[Loki Eremes]

The campaing is an Aberrations one. if i ask my DM for deal precise damage on everything, he will kill me for sure (not in rol xDD).
There are lots of moments for use sneak since only about only 25% of the time are formless things, but i want to make him suffer everytime i can lol.

[Gorgondantess]

Dip a level in beguiler, and pick up the unseen seer class. Take 5 levels for the 2 advanced learnings. You can now add grave strike & golem strike to your spell list to sneak attack undead and constructs, respectively, as a swift action.
You can also cast invisibility, and a bunch of other useful things for a rogue. Have fun.

[Cieyrin]

Immune to criticals are easy. Penetrating Strike [Dungeonscape] gives up Trap Sense (useless anyways) and gives you ability to deal ½ SA damage to normally immune creatures while flanking them.

Combine this with Darkstalker [Lords of Madness] and you can flank just about anything (this stops All-Around Vision and similars from intervening with your flanking in addition to being awesome with Hide; negates Blindsense, Blindsight et al.).


The only problem are amorphous creatures...can't think of anything to help there.

Don't forget Hivemind, which is prevalent in aberration types, which I can't think of a good way of overcoming.

[Loki Eremes]

soooo,
any ideas?

[Loki Eremes]

Immune to criticals are easy. Penetrating Strike [Dungeonscape] gives up Trap Sense (useless anyways) and gives you ability to deal ½ SA damage to normally immune creatures while flanking them.

Cant find Penetrating strike... T-T
where is it? (page)

[olentu]

Cant find Penetrating strike... T-T
where is it? (page)

I think it is on page 13.

[Fizban]

Penetrating Strike is by far the best and easiest even with the half damage. You can pick up wands of Gravestrike/Golemstrike/Vinestrike for full damage on undead, constructs, and plants for cheap (use Wand Chambers from Dungeonscape to use them when your hands are full of weapons). While you're at it, pick up a wand of Sniper's Eye from the Spell Compendium to let you snipe like a true sniper: from a quarter mile away. These are all first level swift action spells, so they won't disrupt you money or action-wise.

As for amorphous creatures, the best I can think of is polymorphing them into something that's not amorphous, but I'm pretty sure most amorphous creatures are immune to polymorphing. For those situations you could bring a wand of Heroics (grants a figher bonus feat- choose power attack), and a wand of Scimitar of Sand (as Flame Blade but untyped damage and auto-proficiency, both are in the Spell Compendium). Flame Blade and Scimitar of Sand are both explicitly wielded as scimitars, so you can use them two handed with power attack as a touch attack. Sure you're just exploiting low level magic tricks, but that's what rogues do when they can't just stab things to death.

[Quirinus_Obsidian]

As a scout, level dip in Ranger and Swift Hunter are your friends.

The Pathfinder rules state that anything with a discernable construction, e.g. a weak spot, can be sneak attacked. Or better yet, skirmished. Only thing is oozes and elementals cannot be critted/sneak attacked.

Pathfinder Ranger/Scout Swift Hunter build would be dominant. Take Abberations, elementals and oozes as favored enemies (one "Extra Favored Enemy" feat) and skirmish-away.

For core/vanilla DnD; Augment crystals (Magic item compendium) can get expensive, but, they do work well.

[Bayar]

Oozes are preety muchthe only things that you cannot sneak attack. Of course, using polymorph any object on them first and then killing them in cow form...

[Cieyrin]

Oozes are preety muchthe only things that you cannot sneak attack. Of course, using polymorph any object on them first and then killing them in cow form...

A transmuter with Profession(Butcher) is born...

[Person_Man]

Dragonfire Strike from Dragon Magic converts Sneak Attack to energy damage (and adds an extra d6 damage). Thus it applies to everything. Unfortunately the wording of the feat is ambiguous - it doesn't state exactly when it's converted to energy - so some DMs might not allow it to bypass Precision restrictions.

Also, the Magic Item Compendium has various spells that bypass Precision immunity. Buy wands.

[Kylarra]

Also weapon augment crystals in MiC for undead and constructs at least that I remember.

[Darrin]

Dragonfire Strike from Dragon Magic converts Sneak Attack to energy damage (and adds an extra d6 damage). Thus it applies to everything.

Not exactly. It allows you to sneak attack creatures that are normally immune to critical or precision damage, but I believe you still need some way to trigger it, usually flanking. While this works great for constructs, undead, and plants, there are other creatures that still can't be flanked, and you need some other way to deny them their Dex bonus. Oozes and Elementals, for example, can't be flanked even if you have Dragonfire Strike. Balance checks, grappling or some type of invisibility (or whatever defeats [splat]-sense the creature has) may be needed to sneak attack these creatures.

Also, the Magic Item Compendium has various spells that bypass Precision immunity. Buy wands.

Spell Compendium, but yeah. Unfortunately, no Oozestrike or Elementalstrike.

[Loki Eremes]

Thx everyone for the info, i appreciate it

[Curmudgeon]

Oozes are preety muchthe only things that you cannot sneak attack. Of course, using polymorph any object on them first and then killing them in cow form...

Quirinus_Obsidian already mentioned elementals. I'll add swarms. That's the complete list of two standard types and one subtype that can't be flanked.

[sofawall]

I thought elementals could be flanked (and oozes? Not sure) but are immune to crits, thus defeating Sneak Attack.

[olelia]

Is there any good way to bypass the sneak attack level restriction when sneak attacking another rogue with his improved uncanny dodge?

[Curmudgeon]

I thought elementals could be flanked (and oozes? Not sure) but are immune to crits, thus defeating Sneak Attack.

Nope.

Not subject to critical hits or flanking.

Not subject to critical hits or flanking.

A swarm has no clear front or back and no discernable anatomy, so it is not subject to critical hits or flanking.

Not only are they immune to critical hits, the two types and one subtype are also immune to flanking.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Is there any good way to bypass the sneak attack level restriction when sneak attacking another rogue with his improved uncanny dodge?

Yes. Have a friendly Warblade or Crusader with the Clarion Call tactical feat. DC 20 check to flat declare an opponent flanked for a minute. It overrides Improved Uncanny Dodge because it is flat declaring an opponent Flanked, you don't need to be able to actually do it.