good fighter feats?

[Mystic Muse]

okay. I may be DMing a lord of the rings based campaign for my cousins so I need some help. the three classes available are Ranger, Fighter and Rogue. They do not have access to any of the books and so I'm making their characters for them. I need to know of some good feats for the fighter, Ranger without spells and Rogue.

what books are these in that you know of?

[Paulus]

okay. I may be DMing a lord of the rings based campaign for my cousins so I need some help. the three classes available are Ranger, Fighter and Rogue. They do not have access to any of the books and so I'm making their characters for them. I need to know of some good feats for the fighter, Ranger without spells and Rogue.

what books are these in that you know of?

You can't sit down with them for a session and let them look over the books? Choosing everything for them just sounds like it's bound to cause problems.

[Shinizak]

I am reminded of this comic.this

[mem0man]

Crystalkeep has a really good pdf page that I am pretty sure can solve most if not all of yours and their problems full of a bunch of feats with errata and the citing from where they came from.

[Eldariel]

Uuuh, some toughies there, particularly the Ranger. Fighter:

All:
- Robilar's Gambit [Player's Handbook II]
- Karmic Strike [Complete Warrior]

Tripping: Combat Expertise > Improved Trip > Knock-Down [SRD]
Charging: Power Attack > Improved Bull Rush > Shock Trooper [Complete Warrior] > Leap Attack [Complete Adventurer]
Bull rushing: Improved Bull Rush > Dungeoncrasher [Dungeonscape] > Knockback [Races of Stone]
Control: Combat Reflexes > Martial Study: Anything [Tome of Battle] > Martial Stance: Thicket of Blades [Tome of Battle] > Mage Slayer [Complete Arcane] > Defensive Sweep [Player's Handbook II] > Overpowering Attack [Player's Handbook II]
Mounted Charger: Charging + Mounted Combat > Ride-By Attack > Spirited Charge
Archer: Weapon Focus > Weapon Specialization > Ranged Weapon Mastery [Player's Handbook II] + Rapid Shot
Intimidator: Zhentarim Fighter [Champions of Valor Web] > Imperious Command [Drow of the Underdark]
Two-Weapon Fighting: Two-Weapon Fighting-line > Weapon Specialization > Melee Weapon Mastery > Combat Expertise > Deadly Defense > Flay Foe [Champions of Ruin] (> Weapon Finesse + Shadow Blade [Tome of Battle])


Rogue:

All:
- Darkstalker [Lords of Madness]
- Craven [Champions of Ruin]

Crossbow Archer: Rapid Shot + Rapid Reload + Weapon Focus > Crossbow Sniper [Player's Handbook II] (without an equivalent of Crossbow Archer, standard archery doesn't really compare)
Two-Weapon Fighter: Two-Weapon Fighting-line (> Weapon Finesse + Shadow Blade [Tome of Battle])


Ranger:

Darkstalker...and no idea beyond that. Really, Ranger without Scout [Complete Adventurer] + Swift Hunter [Complete Scoundrel] just doesn't have much to pick up as all the abilities come from class features; no spells is a huge problem here as it suddenly means he's got...nothing going on for him.

4 levels of Fighter for Weapon Specialization > Ranged Weapon Mastery would help a lot. Alternatively handwave this and give the Ranger access to Weapon Spec in Longbow. Makes sense anyways.

[Mystic Muse]

You can't sit down with them for a session and let them look over the books? Choosing everything for them just sounds like it's bound to cause problems.

ages 13 and lower. Only about 3 of them will actually be able to read the books.

please no comments on that.

oh and they asked for the LOTR campaign so blame them.

[DarthCyberWolf]

There's a Ranger class variant in Complete Champion that gives a few bonus feats instead of spells. Not much but better than nothing.

[Elfin]

On an unrelated note, it might be a good idea to expand the class choices- perhaps include some or all of Bard, Barbarian, Paladin, Scout, or the like.
For people who want to be spellcasters, maybe include sorcerers, but with a different spell list, such as:

Spoiler

Show

0-Resistance, Detect Poison, Flare, Mending, Guidance, Virtue, Detect Magic, Read Magic, Light, Arcane Mark, Prestidigitation, Cure Minor Wounds

1-Cure Light Wounds, Obscuring Mist, Shield, Mage Armor, Magic Missile, Protection from Evil, Sleep, Bless, Identify, True Strike, Ventriloquism, Cause Fear, Sanctuary, Divine Favor, Command, Doom, Shield of Faith, Remove Fear

2-Aid, Align Weapon, Consecrate, Cure Moderate Wounds, Heroism, Bear's Endurance, Bull's Strength, Cat's Grace, Eagle's Splendor, Fox's Cunning, Owl's Wisdom, Delay Poison, Zone of Truth, Shield Other, Status, Spiritual Weapon, Fog Cloud, Gust of Wind, Detect Thoughts, Protection from Arrows, Knock, Continual Flame, Pyrotechnics

3-Sleet Storm, Keen Edge, Greater Magic Weapon, Daylight, Arcane Sight, Dispel Magic, Cure Serious Wounds, Magic Circle Against Evil, Prayer, Searing Light, Remove Curse, Remove Disease, Remove Blindness/Deafness, Neutralize Poison

4-Lesser Globe of Invulnerability, Solid Fog, Detect Scrying, Cure Critical Wounds, Divination, Freedom of Movement, Death Ward, Divine Power, Tongues, Control Water

5-Break Enchantment, Mass Cure Light Wounds, Commune, Spell Resistance, True Seeing, Hallow, Control Winds, Dream

6-Globe of Invulnerability, Repulsion, Greater Dispel Magic, Legend Lore, Greater Heroism, Mass Bear's Endurance, Mass Bull's Strength, Mass Cat's Grace, Mass Eagle's Splendor, Mass Fox's Cunning, Mass Owl's Wisdom, Contingency, Find the Path, Mass Cure Moderate Wounds

7-Control Weather, Greater Restoration, Holy Word, Mass Cure Serious Wounds, Vision, Heal

8-Mind Blank, Moment of Prescience, Protection from Spells, Mass Cure Critical Wounds, Shield of Law, Holy Aura, Sunburst

9-Miracle, Time Stop, Foresight, Storm of Vengeance

XP COSTS (Special):
0-0
1-0
2-0
3-0
4-200
5-500
6-1000
7-1500
8-3000
9-6000
Costs are in addition to those normally required.

Maybe with a different list for evil "magic".

[deuxhero]

Fairly sure some ACF allows you to sub favored enemy for a fighter bonus feat. Favored Enemy Humanoid:(Orc) sounds decent for the campign you describe.

[Weimann]

If these guys are 13 and lower, then I doubt you'll be needing to optimize much. I say, tack some core feats on the fighter, or anything that sounds awesome from a splat book. I don't think they will can be expected to appreciate the finer points of character building, I think they'll just want a guy who can chop arms off. And it's up to the DM (you) if that happens or not, quite independent of feats.

If I could advice, take feats that are straightforward, like Weapon Focus, Toughness or Power Attack. Power Attack isn't particularly strong at level 1, but I bet they'll love to declare it. "I use my POWER ATTACK!"

And you could always tweak it a bit if you like.

[Galileo]

A simplified Soulknife might work well for this. "Wow, I can summon swords with the power of my mind!" This also leads to being able to take Up The Walls, letting them run up the walls, oddly enough. At least one of them's bound to enjoy being able to get around lava pits by running on the wall.

[Paulus]

ages 13 and lower. Only about 3 of them will actually be able to read the books.

please no comments on that.

oh and they asked for the LOTR campaign so blame them.

Well... if they are into LoTR, I'd go for feats the mirror abilities in the films/books. and for that I would start by asking them what they would like their characters to be able to do. And thus, ask us what feats can best match that. Me thinks... after all, all this optimization is just more work for you which you will have to keep track of since I doubt they will be interested enough to learn how to use it let alone remember it.

...especially if explaining the books be a problem. <:3

[The J Pizzel]

Monkey Grip. Oh yes. I went there.

[Weimann]

That is a very good advice. You could try making them up as Aragorn, Legolas and Gimli, maybe? Legolas would be Ranger, Gimli Fighter and... Aragorn is a stretch as a Rogue, but hopefully it can be made to work.

Try finding feats that build up their (or someone else's, maybe Boromir? Frodo?) likeness, and see if they fit together in any sort of way. If they do, you win.

[Starbuck_II]

That is a very good advice. You could try making them up as Aragorn, Legolas and Gimli, maybe? Legolas would be Ranger, Gimli Fighter and... Aragorn is a stretch as a Rogue, but hopefully it can be made to work.

Try finding feats that build up their (or someone else's, maybe Boromir? Frodo?) likeness, and see if they fit together in any sort of way. If they do, you win.

Aragorn: Rogue/Fighter or Rogue/Pally.

[Weimann]

Aragorn: Rogue/Fighter or Rogue/Pally.

Granted, provided they start at level 2 ^^

[ocdscale]

If I could advice, take feats that are straightforward, like Weapon Focus, Toughness or Power Attack. Power Attack isn't particularly strong at level 1, but I bet they'll love to declare it. "I use my POWER ATTACK!"

And you could always tweak it a bit if you like.

Well... if they are into LoTR, I'd go for feats the mirror abilities in the films/books. and for that I would start by asking them what they would like their characters to be able to do. And thus, ask us what feats can best match that. Me thinks... after all, all this optimization is just more work for you which you will have to keep track of since I doubt they will be interested enough to learn how to use it let alone remember it.

These two gems struck me as very good advice.
I think there's little need to stick to the rules as written for this game.

Let them know that because this is the first game, you're going to be a little more flexible.
Give them each a few minutes to describe their characters to you, have them explain what makes their character heroic, how do they fight, what kinds of skills do they value. Make sure they understand they have to sacrifice in one area in order to be better in another. This will get them thinking about where they want to really excel in, and what areas they don't care about as much.

Make sure they all start with options beyond "I move next to the orc, I attack." Power attack is a must. Depending on the level I'd even considering given them free access to Whirlwind attack, and homebrew a +4 (or whatever) Heroic bonus to actions like trip, grapple, and disarm.
Also, I'd consider giving all of them, regardless of class, an additional 4 skill points when they level and relax the restrictions on cross-class skills.

In my mind, I think the goal should be to give them a sense of ownership in their character (even if they are not the ones putting it together), and give them more active role in the developing character.

[Elfin]

Aragorn: Rogue/Fighter or Rogue/Pally.

I'd say Aragorn is a Ranger/Paladin. I don't think he's ever exhibited roguish qualities...the hobbits, though, are definitely rogues.

[Bogardan_Mage]

Aragorn: Rogue/Fighter or Rogue/Pally.

Wasn't the Ranger class supposed to be based on Aragorn?

[Weimann]

Possibly, but what would you have Legolas as then? The "Elf" class dissapeared with the introduction of 3.0e, lest I'm mistaken.

Of course, you COULD make Gimli a melee Fighter, Legolas a bow Fighter, and Aragorn a Ranger. But then you'd miss out on a skillmonkey.

Of course (again), that can be eased by just upping skill points and taking looser on cross class skills. It's not like these guys will call you on not following RAW.

[Eldariel]

They're both Ranger Archer-base, but I'd say Legoland is more of a Ranger/Fighter (note how he leaves tracking to Aragorn; his "Rangery" feel comes from just being an elf and thus at home in woodlands), while Aragorn is sorta Ranger or Ranger/Paladin (if considering his impact as a leader).

And yeah, only the Hobbits are Rogues in that. Though both Aragorn and Legolas certainly have similar abilities as perfectly capable "snipers" and Aragorn seems quite streetsmart too.

[Aldizog]

At what level are you building the characters?

Here's how I'd do it at levels 1 and 6. No real optimization, since you're the DM why bother? You just have to increase monster difficulty. Run LotR-type monsters from the MM and these basic builds should be about the right fit:

Gimli-type (Boromir might be somewhat similar):
Dwarf Ftr1: Power Attack, Weapon Focus (Dwarven Waraxe)
Ftr6: PA, WF, Quick Draw (for throwing axes), Cleave, Weapon Specialization, Great Cleave, Combat Expertise. The last feat just so that he can get his AC high enough to rarely get hit. Alternatively, you might allow a variant of Spinning Halberd (Complete Warrior) while using the Waraxe two-handed, for a slight AC boost as well as an "off-hand" bash with the haft.

Legolas-type:
Elf Ftr1: Point-Blank Shot, Rapid Shot
Ftr6: Point-Blank Shot, Rapid Shot, Weapon Focus (Longbow), Dodge, Mobility, Shot on the Run, Weapon Specialization (Longbow). SotR to shoot while moving between cover so he rarely gets hit.

Aragorn-type:
Human Ran1: Track (B), Dodge
Ran6 (giving up the animal companion and spellcasting for 2 extra bonus feats): Track (B), Dodge, Two-Weapon Fighting (B), Endurance (B), Mobility, Improved Two-Weapon Fighting (B), Spring Attack, and then as his 2 extra bonus feats Elusive Target (Complete Warrior), and Two-Weapon Spring Attack. The last is not a feat (it's a PrC ability), but you're the DM, so make it a feat. Favored enemies maybe goblinoids and orcs? Or orcs and giants? Spring Attack so that, if he drops the enemies with his attacks, he rarely gets hit.

I tried to make these builds, while simple and mostly core, such that the fighters would not take a lot of damage from large numbers of low-level enemies. They're not relying on HP to soak damage, but on AC and mobility to avoid taking it. A case where "more cinematic" and "more realistic" seem to line up. With no casting, they're not going to be able to heal much, so defense is better than HP.

Hobbits: give them a few options.
The warrior: Rog6: Weapon Focus, Weapon Finesse, Improved Toughness (Complete Warrior), probably using a shortsword. Merry would be like this, maybe with a special weapon that let him Sneak Attack undead.
The sneak: Rog6: Stealthy, Alertness, Darkstalker (Lords of Madness).
The sniper: Rog6: Point-Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Weapon Focus (sling).

[Elfin]

They're both Ranger Archer-base, but I'd say Legoland is more of a Ranger/Fighter (note how he leaves tracking to Aragorn; his "Rangery" feel comes from just being an elf and thus at home in woodlands), while Aragorn is sorta Ranger or Ranger/Paladin (if considering his impact as a leader).

And yeah, only the Hobbits are Rogues in that. Though both Aragorn and Legolas certainly have similar abilities as perfectly capable "snipers" and Aragorn seems quite streetsmart too.

Personally, if I had to give Legolas a class, I'd say Scout.
But that's just me.

[Golden-Esque]

ages 13 and lower. Only about 3 of them will actually be able to read the books.

please no comments on that.

oh and they asked for the LOTR campaign so blame them.

How young are we talking about? As an ELED guy myself, I'd suggest asking your younger players what they want to be able to do? Ask them based on other fictional or real characters that they know. Then pre-tailor a level-up tree for the young'ens to avoid any confusion. You want to keep their attention, and book work is the worst way to do it with young players.

If this is why the question has come up, then kudos! You're doing the developmentally correct thing!