Lycanthropy is way too complicated

[AustontheGreat1]

So, I may be the only one, but I find lycanthropy to be way to complicated and I'm have trouble figuring out how it works...

Is there some type of lycanthropy for dummies guide or perhaps a homebrewed system for simplifiying the process for making one?

[kamikasei]

What specifically is giving you trouble? Lycanthropy as a disease? The lycanthrope template? Would you say you're comfortable with adding templates to monsters in general?

[Fendalus]

Which edition? 3.5 and 4th have different systems for this...

[Starbuck_II]

Have you considered the Lycantropy class instead on the website article?

You take levels in your disease instead of everything at once.

[Optimystik]

I just love that being mauled by a Wearbear means my evil character has to help old ladies cross the street every full moon.

D&D is awesome.

[cheezewizz2000]

The rules for creating a lycanthrope are set out here, but I'll summarise them for you:

Step 1: Get bitten

Step 2: Fail a fortitude save (DC 15). You can always opt to auto-fail if you so wish.

Step 3: Give yourself a hearty pat on the back and a +2 wisdom bonus (untyped). You're now a lycanthrope. You also have DR5/silver, low light vision, scent and a +4 bonus on diplomacy checks made against other lycanthropes and a +4 bonus on handle animal checks made against animals of your type.

Step 4: Go to the relevant animal in the back of the monster manual. Add their save bonuses, feats and base attack bonus to your own.

Step 5: Go to the table "common lycanthropes" on the page I linked you to. When in hybrid form or animal form, add those numbers to your abilities.

Step 6: Something about changing alignments. That's all small print, you don't need to read that. Just boring stuff about night-time rampages and killing your loved ones. Seriously, just sign here and we'll get you on your way.

[AustontheGreat1]

3.5

I am having trouple adding lycanthropy to a creature. the creature I want to add is not one of the examples used, (Were-Elephant).

What specifically is giving you trouble? Lycanthropy as a disease? The lycanthrope template? Would you say you're comfortable with adding templates to monsters in general?

Not at all

The rules for creating a lycanthrope are set out here, but I'll summarise them for you:

Step 1: Get bitten

Step 2: Fail a fortitude save (DC 15). You can always opt to auto-fail if you so wish.

Step 3: Give yourself a hearty pat on the back and a +2 wisdom bonus (untyped). You're now a lycanthrope. You also have DR5/silver, low light vision, scent and a +4 bonus on diplomacy checks made against other lycanthropes and a +4 bonus on handle animal checks made against animals of your type.

Step 4: Go to the relevant animal in the back of the monster manual. Add their save bonuses, feats and base attack bonus to your own.

Step 5: Go to the table "common lycanthropes" on the page I linked you to. When in hybrid form or animal form, add those numbers to your abilities.

Step 6: Something about changing alignments. That's all small print, you don't need to read that. Just boring stuff about night-time rampages and killing your loved ones. Seriously, just sign here and we'll get you on your way.

this is pretty helpful, actually

[kamikasei]

What's the base creature? And is this for a monster or for a player character?

[AustontheGreat1]

What's the base creature? And is this for a monster or for a player character?

Character

Were-Elephant Monk

[olelia]

Do note however that you get slapped around with level adjustment and racial hit die.

Level Adjustment
Same as the base creature +2 (afflicted) or +3 (natural). In addition, a lycanthrope’s character level is increased by the number of racial Hit Dice the base animal has.

[AustontheGreat1]

Do note however that you get slapped around with level adjustment and racial hit die.

Yeah, I was aware of that, its lame but exceptable.

Still having trouble, when im in animal form do I use the animals stats, or its added to my own. I its the latter, then animal for seems really powerful.

[cheezewizz2000]

Character

Were-Elephant Monk

Your relevant pages are:

Elephant

It's not common, or strictly legal (must be not greater than 1 size category away from base creature). But here's a run down, assuming you ignore the size restriction:

Add +8 to your BAB
Fort +6
Ref +7
Will +3
Gain Alertness, Endurance, Iron Will, Skill Focus (Listen)

Hybrid/Animal only
Str +20
Con +10

Gain a gore and trample attack while in animal form (see page for details).

Size changes to huge in animal form. Wouldn't be a stretch to say hybrid is large.

Edit: Wait a minute... Are you playing Ganesha?

[AustontheGreat1]

Your relevant pages are:

Elephant

Add +8 to your BAB
Fort +6
Ref +7
Will +3
Gain Alertness, Endurance, Iron Will, Skill Focus (Listen)

And this Applies even in base form?

[cheezewizz2000]

And this Applies even in base form?

A-yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeees!

[AustontheGreat1]

thats pretty cool, actually. Now see, why couldn't wizards have said it like that?

[Shhalahr Windrider]

Still having trouble, when im in animal form do I use the animals stats, or its added to my own. I its the latter, then animal for seems really powerful.

You use stats based on the animal form applied to your own as per the rules for the Alternate Form special ability. Note, though, that there is a specific exception to the usual use of Alternate Form regarding ability scores. Unlike the usual Alternate Form rule of assuming the Strength, Dexterity, and Constitution of an assumed form, a lycanthrope simply applies the animal’s racial bonuses to its ability scores to its own. This is outlined in the “Creating a Lycanthrope” section of the lycanthrope monster entry.

[Prime32]

Problem is, a were-elephant 1st-level human fighter is a 15th-level character (1 fighter level, 11 animal levels, +2 LA). Or 16th, if he's a natural lycanthrope. 11 of your levels are average-BAB with no class features and 2 skill points per level. Woopie.

There's a handbook on this with some better forms. I like to go for were-glidewing myself.

Note that your hybrid form always grants you claws and a bite as natural weapons, regardless of what natural weapons your animal form has.

[Lysander]

If you want a simple homebrew solution, just simplify the whole curse to be more like folklore. Get rid of the voluntary shapechanging, hybrid form, the stat adjustments, hit dice adjustment, skills, bonus feats, and all that.

Make werewolves have the same stats as a Dire Wolf but with Damage Reduction 15/silver and chaotic evil alignment. A character bitten and injured by a werewolf must make a DC15 fortitude save. If they fail, they automatically become a werewolf every full moon with no save. This basically replaces their character sheet entirely and makes them a murderous npc until dawn. At dawn they revert and have no memory (or maybe only a feeling of scattered bad dreams) of all that happened the night before. Between full moons lycanthropy wouldn't affect the character at all.

This fix is good if you want lycanthropy to be a curse instead of a superpower. You could also have two types of lycanthropy, natural lycanthropes that can change at will, and use this weaker version just as the afflication type.

[urbanpirate]

Character

Were-Elephant Monk

strictly speaking were elephant is not legal both for size reasons mentioned above and because the animal half of the lycanthrope has to be carnivore or omnivore. elephants are plant eaters.

a monk/druid gestalt could give you elephant form

the is a monsterus humanoid elephant i think in mm2 or 3

[Shhalahr Windrider]

11 of your levels are average-BAB with no class features...

With racial HD, the more powerful racial abilities stand in for class features.

What you get instead of a bunch of bonus feats:

• Trample while in alternate form
• +20 bonus to Strength and +10 bonus to Con while in alternate form
• Three high-damage natural attacks in the appropriate form.
• Increased size and all the benefits that go with it while in alternate form

Assuming the other lycanthrope abilities are accounted for by the template LA rather than the animal HD.

That these abilities only apply while in alternate form is relatively meaningless, since the form is at-will (for natural lycans anyway). Don’t know of any other class that grants a +20 bonus to Strength as an at-will ability.

Whether you find these features to be a sufficient trade for the fighter bonus feats is, of course, largely a matter of opinion and play style. Though I’m sure someone’s doing an analysis right now to decide if they’re at leas in the same ballpark from a strict mechanical basis.

…and 2 skill points per level.

Same number of skill points as a Fighter. No loss here beyond a rather restricted class-skill list. Though at least you finally have a fair chance of spotting that 16th level rogue coming at you.

[Dust]

strictly speaking were elephant is not legal both for size reasons mentioned above and because the animal half of the lycanthrope has to be carnivore or omnivore. elephants are plant eaters

Which is why you should avoid Elephant entirely and go for WHALE. Technically carnivores (sperm whales, for example, prey on large fish and other large sea creatures), Werewhale rolls off the tongue so much better, AND better bonuses if your DM doesn't care about character level.

[AustontheGreat1]

I appreciate the warnings and the suggestions but I've never really cared about optimization. my Dm is willing to ignore the size restrictions and the LA in light of the less than useful racial hit die.

[Dust]

My Dm is willing to ignore the size restrictions and the LA in light of the less than useful racial hit die.

Were.



Whale.

[Xenogears]

Were-Giraffe: http://onepiece.wikia.com/wiki/Ushi_...Model:_Giraffe

Go Were-Manta Ray or Were-Octopus? The possibilities are endless.

Actually Were-Elephant's pretty cool on it's own.

[AustontheGreat1]

Any one ever played bloody roar?

http://bloodyroar.wikia.com/wiki/Ganesha_the_Elephant

this is the character influence

[Sstoopidtallkid]

Were-Giraffe: http://onepiece.wikia.com/wiki/Ushi_...Model:_Giraffe

Go Were-Manta Ray or Were-Octopus? The possibilities are endless.

Actually Were-Elephant's pretty cool on it's own.

Were-eagle. Enter as a paladin. Fly around and be AWESOME!

[Prime32]

Were-eagle. Enter as a paladin. Fly around and be AWESOME!

Except that you can't fly in hybrid form unless you're a raptoran or something, so you won't be able to use weapons.

A were-clawfoot gets Str +6, Dex +6, Con +4, +3 natural armour, 40ft speed and four natural weapons (one of which has 1d8 base damage) as well a +8 bonus on Hide, Jump, Listen, Spot and Survival checks which apply to all forms. Were-dinos are awesome.

[Dr.Epic]

So, I may be the only one, but I find lycanthropy to be way to complicated and I'm have trouble figuring out how it works...

Is there some type of lycanthropy for dummies guide or perhaps a homebrewed system for simplifiying the process for making one?

At least they don't sparkle like a certain other type of movie monster.

[Sstoopidtallkid]

Except that you can't fly in hybrid form unless you're a raptoran or something, so you won't be able to use weapons.

A were-clawfoot gets Str +6, Dex +6, Con +4, +3 natural armour, 40ft speed and four natural weapons (one of which has 1d8 base damage) as well a +8 bonus on Hide, Jump, Listen, Spot and Survival checks which apply to all forms. Were-dinos are awesome.

You get the speed of the animal as a hybrid. :D

[Prime32]

You get the speed of the animal as a hybrid. :D

Actually, it says "hybrids use the base creature's speed", not the base animal's. So no, you don't grow wings, just finger-talons and a beak.