Looking for a very small race for a warlock (3.5)

[Barbarian MD]

I have it in mind to play a warlock, but not just any warlock. ECL is 12, and it's a gestalt game, so LA really isn't an issue.

I first thought about being a pixie, but then I realized...

I'd like to be a hummingbird riding warlock.

Picturing that in my head is just made of win; I don't care how ineffective or ridiculous it might be. So, can anyone suggest a Fine, Diminuitive, or Tiny race? You would have my gratitude.

[Dusk Eclipse]

It seems you don't mind feylocks (I do) the Petals IIRC are Diminutive but they are listed as LA +2 (cohort) so you might want to check them and ask your DM

[FishAreWet]

Flavor the Sparrow Shapshifter from OA to a hummingbird.

[CTLC]

hengeyokai sparrow
[or any small bird really!!!]
thats a wonderful idea

[Stephen_E]

Grig - Sprite
Tiny.
+3 lev adj
Str -6, Dex +8, Con +2, Wis +2, Cha +4
1-1.5 feet tall, 1lb weight.
Poor flyers.
Damage reduction 5/cold iron.
SR 17 + Class levels

Stephen E

[Vizzerdrix]

Faen into Spryte.

[Stephen_E]

U will aslo need to worl out stats for a hummingbird.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hummingbird

Interesting peice.

Stephen E

[Bosh]

Being that small will take enough LA to really weaken you a good bit. Think it over before you do it.

[Darrin]

U will aslo need to worl out stats for a hummingbird.

Dragon #323 has Hummingbird available to wizards as a familiar (+4 initiative bonus). It says use the stats for the Thrush in the DMG (p. 203), which lists it as diminuative. So you'd need a fine-sized rider. The only race that gets that small is Hengeyokai in Sparrow form (Oriental Adventures, errata removed the +1 LA). So... I guess a sparrow riding a hummingbird as a mount would still be pretty cool.

[Zaq]

Weren't there some shenanigans you can do with an Instantaneous spell in an Eberron book somewhere that reduced the size of giants (and could very well be argued to stack with itself)? I vaguely recall something like that coming up once or twice before. Just pick a low-LA giant and burn some WBL on scrolls or hired castings.

[Brock Samson]

Hm, simple polymorph wouldn't allow you to get that small would it? I know for certain Shapeshift would...

Of course, run into an anti-magic field and SPLAT! Poor hummingbird...

And yes, having it as a familiar would make it a LOT more durable. If you can manage the Improved Familiar feat or one from a class.

[sofawall]

Weren't there some shenanigans you can do with an Instantaneous spell in an Eberron book somewhere that reduced the size of giants (and could very well be argued to stack with itself)? I vaguely recall something like that coming up once or twice before. Just pick a low-LA giant and burn some WBL on scrolls or hired castings.

Bibliomancer has mentioned it pretty consistently in these types of threads. Yeah, instantaneous, and shrinks Giants. Back to Nature or something like that? I forget.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Hm, simple polymorph wouldn't allow you to get that small would it? I know for certain Shapeshift would...

Of course, run into an anti-magic field and SPLAT! Poor hummingbird...

And yes, having it as a familiar would make it a LOT more durable. If you can manage the Improved Familiar feat or one from a class.

You can get a familiar by getting Adquire Familiar (Complete Arcane) available at Warlock 3 and then improved familiar at level 9

[Barbarian MD]

Thanks for all the ideas, folks. I really appreciate the help.

Here's another question: what kind of LA adjustment comes with changing size? I mean, what would the LA be for a fine-sized "human"? How about a fine-sized pixie?

[Bibliomancer]

Yes, the spell is "Return to Nature" Druid 7 from the Eberron Campaign Setting. It technically allows you to play a Fine Half-giant. However, most DMs won't allow it, and those that do will plan to manipulate the fact that you can be grappled by an unbuffed fruit fly.

To my knowledge, there are no guidelines for changing LA. Technically, it stays constant, since a small size's advantages are offset somewhat by low Con, absurdly low Str, and very bad grapple modifiers.

[Irreverent Fool]

You could pull shrink object shenanigans. That is, die, then have someone shrink the corpse, make the spell permanent and then get resurrected.

Though few DMs will let you pull that.

obnoxious
sig

[sofawall]

Technically, it stays constant, since a small size's advantages are offset somewhat by low Con, absurdly low Str, and very bad grapple modifiers.

In theory. However, since most builds looking to take advantage of small size don't care about the str penalty, can completely avoid grapples and don't have HP as the second line of defense, it doesn't really balance very well.

Con penalty is the only part of that that would hurt.

[Darrin]

Weren't there some shenanigans you can do with an Instantaneous spell in an Eberron book somewhere that reduced the size of giants (and could very well be argued to stack with itself)? I vaguely recall something like that coming up once or twice before. Just pick a low-LA giant and burn some WBL on scrolls or hired castings.

Yes, Return to Nature (Druid 7) in ECS. That would work... start with a Half-Giant or Eneko (both LA +1).

Another idea... in the Arms & Equipment Guide, there's a magic item called Shrink Collar (10000 GP, p. 80). Put it on any creature, and its size reverts to "small", regardless of its original size. Put this on a Hummingbird, and you could use this as the mount for a tiny-sized character, such as a Muckdweller (Serpent Kingdoms, LA 0), Jermlaine (MM2, LA 0), Grig (MM, LA +3), Petal (MM3, LA +2), or Kobold (Slight Build = tiny?).

And the reason you'd want a mount as a Warlock... well, there's a quirk in the mounted combat rules. When a mount moves for you, you can only make one melee attack, regardless of how many melee attacks you normally get. However, a mount can move and the rider can still cast a spell or use a SLA (although there may be a concentration check for spellcasting on a moving mount). Eldritch Glaive is a SLA, so as long as you make the Ride check, you can have your mount move and get your full iterative attacks in the same round.