Wizard Specialization for Pathfinder

[Tanuki Tales]

Ok, we all know how it goes for 3.5, Conjuration and Transmutation are the big dogs of the junkyard while Evocation and sometimes Necromancy is better off left forgotten in the refuse bin.

But what about Pathfinder? Are the standings still true with some of the changes and nerfs this system has done to spells?

[Sinfire Titan]

Don't specialize in PF games. Free metamagic is too good to pass up.

[arguskos]

Don't specialize in PF games. Free metamagic is too good to pass up.

To be super technical, choose the Universalist wizard option in Pathfinder. /nitpick. But yes, basically what Sinfire said.

[Tanuki Tales]

So you're saying all schools are now equally good or you're ignoring that for free metamagic 7/day?

[Gralamin]

So you're saying all schools are now equally good or you're ignoring that for free metamagic 7/day?

The second one. DEFINITELY the second one.

[arguskos]

So you're saying all schools are now equally good or you're ignoring that for free metamagic 7/day?

The fact is that none of the specializations really are quite as powerful as free metamagic can be.

Of the specializations, I personally like Illusion. Of the schools themselves, nothing's changed.

[Tanuki Tales]

The fact is that none of the specializations really are quite as powerful as free metamagic can be.

Of the specializations, I personally like Illusion. Of the schools themselves, nothing's changed.

Even with some of the nerfing of Transmutation?

[AtopTheMountain]

Yes yes, free metamagic is definitely a powerful tool. BUT: taking a school with a useful attack power makes you not run out of spells almost ever, especially at low levels. In that case, then Necromancy, Conjuration, and maybe Transmutation will be your best bets. So basically, take Universalist if your game is starting above 10th level; otherwise, take one of those other ones.

[arguskos]

Even with some of the nerfing of Transmutation?

You mean the sorta-nerfing of Polymorph? Yes, even with that. Conjuration and Transmutation just still get all the toys. Conjuration is clearly the king of the castle still, Transmutation is still really pretty strong, Illusion still has shadow evocation, shadow conjuration, and shades and a ton of good buffs and defenses. Evocation didn't GAIN anything, and actually was weakened since Wall of Force and Forcecage are breakable now. The other schools are pretty much the same.

Transmutation is still amazing, but a tiny bit less amazing, since all the insanely great non-Core spells aren't around. Still though, Transmutation is pretty good.

EDIT: Oh, and Metalhead? While you make a good point... cantrips are now free in Pathfinder... meaning you can just prepare ray of frost and do that anyways. And, you can use the Universalist Hand of the Apprentice with a Greatsword or something for a better ranged attack if you want (just have proficiency).

[Kalaska'Agathas]

I like Universalists (birds fly, grass grows, sun shines, and Universalists get free metamagic).

After Universalists come Diviners. Initiative bonus and always acting in surprise rounds (and you're no longer flat footed after you act, so if you act early (and with your Init, you ought to be) surprise round no longer equals precision-damage-to-the-squishy-wizard) is very nice, as things go. And the insight bonus is a nice buff 3+int/day.

[faceroll]

You mean the sorta-nerfing of Polymorph? Yes, even with that. Conjuration and Transmutation just still get all the toys. Conjuration is clearly the king of the castle still, Transmutation is still really pretty strong, Illusion still has shadow evocation, shadow conjuration, and shades and a ton of good buffs and defenses. Evocation didn't GAIN anything, and actually was weakened since Wall of Force and Forcecage are breakable now. The other schools are pretty much the same.

Transmutation is still amazing, but a tiny bit less amazing, since all the insanely great non-Core spells aren't around. Still though, Transmutation is pretty good.

EDIT: Oh, and Metalhead? While you make a good point... cantrips are now free in Pathfinder... meaning you can just prepare ray of frost and do that anyways. And, you can use the Universalist Hand of the Apprentice with a Greatsword or something for a better ranged attack if you want (just have proficiency).

Didn't some of those conjuration spells also get nerfed? I know web isn't as awesome, calling spells disappeared, and I think glitterdust is less spectacular.

[olentu]

Didn't some of those conjuration spells also get nerfed? I know web isn't as awesome, calling spells disappeared, and I think glitterdust is less spectacular.

Planar binding and gate are still there I believe.

[GoodbyeSoberDay]

I thought the free metamagic stuff was nerfed after the beta version.

[Gametime]

Didn't some of those conjuration spells also get nerfed? I know web isn't as awesome, calling spells disappeared, and I think glitterdust is less spectacular.

Grease was also nerfed. The low level Conjuration spells have gone from devastating to merely crippling. It does little to make the school less attractive.

[BobVosh]

I thought the free metamagic stuff was nerfed after the beta version.

It is now (wiz level-8)/2 instead of flat wiz level/2

Anyway I think several of the other schools are worthwhile. Hand of the apprentice is worthless now that they removed int to damage and added range penalties.

One thing to consider is that divination is allowed to be banned, and doesn't allow you to only ban 1 school. Also banned schools aren't so banned. They take 2 spell slots instead of 1.

[Sinfire Titan]

It is now (wiz level-8)/2 instead of flat wiz level/2

Anyway I think several of the other schools are worthwhile. Hand of the apprentice is worthless now that they removed int to damage and added range penalties.

One thing to consider is that divination is allowed to be banned, and doesn't allow you to only ban 1 school. Also banned schools aren't so banned. They take 2 spell slots instead of 1.

Still worth it. Comes into play around Incanatrix level, and slowly grows in use.

[Saph]

Ok, we all know how it goes for 3.5, Conjuration and Transmutation are the big dogs of the junkyard while Evocation and sometimes Necromancy is better off left forgotten in the refuse bin.

But what about Pathfinder? Are the standings still true with some of the changes and nerfs this system has done to spells?

I did a reasonably thorough rundown of the wizard specialities in my guide here.

Short version, Illusionists probably got the nicest stuff, while Conjurers and Transmuters got average abilities that are balanced out by the power of the schools they're specialising in. Diviners and Evokers got stuff that makes them better at their specialities. Enchanters and Necromancers got a mediocre set of abilities, while Universalists got the worst.

Sinfire, Arguskos, you're out of date. Pathfinder Universalists were amazing . . . in the Beta. The final version nerfed them into the ground.

[Rixx]

Everyone harps on Hand of the Apprentice, but they always forget that you can always toss a magically enhanced weapon. The other school attack powers have a lot less growth potential.

[Saph]

Everyone harps on Hand of the Apprentice, but they always forget that you can always toss a magically enhanced weapon.

Nope, didn't forget. Problem: damage is based off your Strength score. It typically will not be impressive.

[olelia]

For specific reference.

Metamagic Mastery (Su): At 8th level, you can apply any one metamagic feat that you know to a spell you are about to cast. This does not alter the level of the spell or the casting time. You can use this ability once per day at 8th level and one additional time per day for every two wizard levels you possess beyond 8th. Any time you use this ability to apply a metamagic feat that increases the spell level by more than 1, you must use an additional daily usage for each level above 1 that the feat adds to the spell. Even though this ability does not modify the spell's actual level, you cannot use this ability to cast a spell whose modified spell level would be above the level of the highest-level spell that you are capable of casting.

[Tyndmyr]

Grease was also nerfed. The low level Conjuration spells have gone from devastating to merely crippling. It does little to make the school less attractive.

Grease is still quite powerful, and had it's duration changed from rounds/level to minutes/level, which makes it useful in entirely different situations. It's very slightly different from the old grease, but it isn't actually less powerful, imo.

Generalist is, imo, not worth it. It's nifty, but the specialist powers are pretty cool, and frankly, volume of spell slots is awesome. Specialists just gained so much power thanks to banned schools no longer being banned that there is little reason not to specialize. If your DM is under the delusion that 3.5 material works with pathfinder as is, go focused specialist. Who cares if the odd spell from a crappy school takes two spell slots when you now have two bonus spell slots per level?

[BobVosh]

Grease no longer makes things flat footed, or affect people who aren't moving. It stopped winning golem fights, and making rogues buy the wizard pretty gifts.

[Saph]

Grease no longer makes things flat footed, or affect people who aren't moving. It stopped winning golem fights, and making rogues buy the wizard pretty gifts.

Another problem with Grease that isn't immediately obvious is that Pathfinder folded the Balance skill in with Jump and Tumble to form Acrobatics . . . which means lots and lots of creatures have it. So making that DC 10 check isn't so hard anymore.

Pathfinder Grease will typically knock a target over once, but not more than once. It's still a good spell, but not quite as good as it was.

[Starbuck_II]

Another problem with Grease that isn't immediately obvious is that Pathfinder folded the Balance skill in with Jump and Tumble to form Acrobatics . . . which means lots and lots of creatures have it. So making that DC 10 check isn't so hard anymore.

Pathfinder Grease will typically knock a target over once, but not more than once. It's still a good spell, but not quite as good as it was.

Except Fighters who can't jump now.

[Tyndmyr]

Another problem with Grease that isn't immediately obvious is that Pathfinder folded the Balance skill in with Jump and Tumble to form Acrobatics . . . which means lots and lots of creatures have it. So making that DC 10 check isn't so hard anymore.

Pathfinder Grease will typically knock a target over once, but not more than once. It's still a good spell, but not quite as good as it was.

Thats a good point, and it applies to all spells that directly or indirectly target skills, as most skills now have a higher probability of being taken.

[Tiki Snakes]

Except Fighters who can't jump now.

I thought pathfinder condensed skills. Surely more fighters can jump now?

[Gnaeus]

Acrobatics (therefore jump) isn't on their list. On the other hand, they do get either an extra skill point or hp per level, so they are in slightly better position to take it cross class. Acrobatics, Stealth and Perception are the 3 great cross class skills in pathfinder.

Edit: And cross class skills don't cost double in PF, you just don't get the +3 class skill bonus. So the fighter can still take jump, he isn't quite as good at it, but if he does he gets balance and tumble for free.

Fighters did get Survival and a couple of knowledges (including dungeoneering) added, so it isn't like their skill list was nerfed.