Binding the PCs

[fryplink]

I remember somewhere reading that any creature not on it's home plane is considered an outsider [after looking up the rules, its the extraplanar subtype, not outsider, but the spell in question targets extraplanar creatures too so it was horizontal movement
What is stopping me from having a campaign taking place in the outer planes when an demon/angel (and creature native to the outer planes) from binding a PC into service (via planer binding, lesser {they'd be 3 or 4th level at that point}), since the spell says that it lures and traps a creature from another plane ?

If angles and demons can bind PMP creatures into service like PMP creature can to Outer Planes creatures, I think I may have just found the plot of my next Campaign

EDIT: target outsider or elements makes this a non-issue

2nd EDIT: from what i've seen Gate has no such clause, though plannar bindings do

[Kylarra]

Well first it'd have to know your character's proper name, else it's extremely unlikely to the point of being statistically impossible that an angel or demon would be summoning a creature of <base race>. So given a 3rd or 4th level character, they'll need to have done something to warrant that kind of attention, else you're just railroading. If your players are fine with that, then more power to you, but I'd say that something out of the blue like that would irk me.

[The Glyphstone]

Well first it'd have to know your character's proper name, else it's extremely unlikely to the point of being statistically impossible that an angel or demon would be summoning a creature of <base race>. So given a 3rd or 4th level character, they'll need to have done something to warrant that kind of attention, else you're just railroading. If your players are fine with that, then more power to you, but I'd say that something out of the blue like that would irk me.

If it's the plot of the entire campaign, what's wrong with it? As you mentioned, the spell has to hit someone, even if it's just a creature of <race>. Why can't it be the PCs, the random chance of the spell just happening to (pregame) settle on them? It's not even a summoning spell, they can't be compelled to obey its demands - it even has to pay them for their services, and it could be a very interesting game centered around carrying out the dirty work for some demon lord while trying to find a way to break the bindings applied to the party and get away. Sort of like how people always insist that a Planar Bound creature will deliberately subvert tasks asked of it, except with PCs.


EDIT; but as noted, yeah. Extraplanar is a creature off its home plane. Outsiders are creatures whose bodies and souls are made up of the fundamental essence of their home plane, not just a resident there.

[Claudius Maximus]

Creatures aren't considered outsiders when they leave their plane of origin, they just gain the Extraplanar subtype. Thus, your PCs won't be valid targets for Planar Binding unless they really have the Outsider or Elemental types. Though of course you can do whatever you want when you're the DM.

[fryplink]

it would be the first thing to happen to the party, and once they arrived after being summoned, they would be allowed to go from there, so the campaign would take place in the world they where summoned to, its more of asking whether it would be a RAW plot-hook, I was actually thinking something more allong the lines of someone from an alternate PMP (in my setting there are hundreds of "prime material planes") would summon them

afterthought: the planar binding spells target extra-planer creatures, not outsiders

[Kylarra]

If it's the plot of the entire campaign, what's wrong with it? As you mentioned, the spell has to hit someone, even if it's just a creature of <race>. Why can't it be the PCs, the random chance of the spell just happening to (pregame) settle on them? It's not even a summoning spell, they can't be compelled to obey its demands - it even has to pay them for their services, and it could be a very interesting game centered around carrying out the dirty work for some demon lord while trying to find a way to break the bindings applied to the party and get away. Sort of like how people always insist that a Planar Bound creature will deliberately subvert tasks asked of it, except with PCs.


EDIT; but as noted, yeah. Extraplanar is a creature off its home plane. Outsiders are creatures whose bodies and souls are made up of the fundamental essence of their home plane, not just a resident there.

As I said, if it's something your players are all fine with, then sure, but the odds of randomly summoning the entire party by choosing their races is vanishingly small.

[fryplink]

1:100 odds never happen, 1 in a million is garenteed

its not that the party was summoned by race, but the party was formed by the summoning, they were summoned, met in <insert destination here> and formed a party from that

[Claudius Maximus]

afterthought: the planar binding spells target extra-planer creatures, not outsiders

The bound creature needs to be an outsider or elemental. The Extraplanar subtype will not suffice, as far as I know.

Target: One elemental or outsider with 6 HD or less

[Bibliomancer]

Still, it begs the question:

why don't PCs visit alternative worlds of the PMP when not playing Spelljammer?

If my PCs ever make to the Outer Planes (specifically, Ysgard, in Greyhawk cosmology) I was considering having them meet themselves from an alternate world.

After all, you'd need an infinite number of mortals to produce an infinite number of souls to fuel an infinite number of outsiders.

[Kylarra]

1:100 odds never happen, 1 in a million is garenteed

its not that the party was summoned by race, but the party was formed by the summoning, they were summoned, met in <insert destination here> and formed a party from that

Oh I see. I was under the assumption that this was part of an ongoing campaign. If it's just the start of a brand new campaign, then I waive my objections.

[fryplink]

so far from what im looking at, it would have to be a gate spell with loose interpretation, since it never specifies outsiders/elementals in the gate description (though if its the start to a campaign I could sort of DM hand waive it, its good to let them have reference to the exact effect they are suffering)

[Sinfire Titan]

Your idea is interesting, but it only works on the following:

Planetouched PCs.
Characters with the Otherworldly feat.
20th level Monks (which are a myth).
20th level Incarnates.
Several PrCs.
People under the effect of a Shapechange spell and currently in the form of any Outsider.
People affected by the right Bestow Curse.
People under the effects of the Fiendform spell (SC).
People under the effects of that spell in Complete Mage that turns you into either a Barghest or a Yeth, I can't remember which.

[fryplink]

Your idea is interesting, but it only works on the following:

Planetouched PCs.
Characters with the Otherworldly feat.
20th level Monks (which are a myth).
20th level Incarnates.
Several PrCs.
People under the effect of a Shapechange spell and currently in the form of any Outsider.
People affected by the right Bestow Curse.
People under the effects of the Fiendform spell (SC).
People under the effects of that spell in Complete Mage that turns you into either a Barghest or a Yeth, I can't remember which.

I dont think gate specifies a creature type, only a subtype (extraplanar), which means anything that isn't a resident of where I'm casting the spell from

[Aneantir]

People under the effects of that spell in Complete Mage that turns you into either a Barghest or a Yeth, I can't remember which.

This could make an interesting hook, actually.

PCs get hired by some studious wizard who doesn't like to take chances on his own health, so he's practicing the spell thats name I can't currently remember on willing participants, in exchange for a small sum of gold.

So the PCs take up his offer, and are transformed into the above creatures. During their transformation, pop, they seem to have been summoned to the services of a demon lord. In the following conversation of their assignment, they revert back, so the demon lord says "What the Baator, why not" and employs them anyway.

[fryplink]

This could make an interesting hook, actually.

PCs get hired by some studious wizard who doesn't like to take chances on his own health, so he's practicing the spell thats name I can't currently remember on willing participants, in exchange for a small sum of gold.

So the PCs take up his offer, and are transformed into the above creatures. During their transformation, pop, they seem to have been summoned to the services of a demon lord. In the following conversation of their assignment, they revert back, so the demon lord says "What the Baator, why not" and employs them anyway.

that is a round about way of getting the job done, maybe the wizard knew it would happen? that would be a fun first session

I'm really Hoping that someone will confirm/deny Gates ability to work here

[Sinfire Titan]

that is a round about way of getting the job done, maybe the wizard knew it would happen? that would be a fun first session

I'm really Hoping that someone will confirm/deny Gates ability to work here

The Wizard is Rule of Three, and the Demon who binds them is his father. Justification and linked plotline.