3.5 - Last resort for NPC's against megalomaniac PC's?

[Jon_Dahl]

I'm writing an adventure where NPC's fight along side with PC's to recover a huge treasure. However there is always the nasty possibility that PC's will betray the NPC's and collect treasure for themselves, thus making any further adventures with ridicolously wealthy PC's (almost) impossible.

If you had a small group of low-level NPC's following the powerful PC's (10-20 NPC's with 1-3 levels each) and they would be serious underdogs compared PC's, what kind of "safemeasures" they could have if they are suddenly betrayed?

[Jack_Simth]

I'm writing an adventure where NPC's fight along side with PC's to recover a huge treasure. However there is always the nasty possibility that PC's will betray the NPC's and collect treasure for themselves, thus making any further adventures with ridicolously wealthy PC's (almost) impossible.

If you had a small group of low-level NPC's following the powerful PC's (10-20 NPC's with 1-3 levels each) and they would be serious underdogs compared PC's, what kind of "safemeasures" they could have if they are suddenly betrayed?

Arcane Mark, plus connections in the merchant's guild - you can't sell the loot, sorry. If you try, you'll be arrested for theft.

However, an overabundance of wealth is a relatively simple fix - throw a focused Sunder build at the party, or just throw a lot of "Treasure: None" monsters at them until their XP total catches up with their wealth, so that it balances out to WBL. Alternately, instead of "Treasure: None" opponents, use opponents that doesn't have harvestable wealth - Vow of Poverty Sorcerers/Druids, mad wizards that hide their spellbooks and use a lot of grafts, Forsakers, and so on.

[Jon_Dahl]

Arcane Mark, plus connections in the merchant's guild - you can't sell the loot, sorry. If you try, you'll be arrested for theft.

However, an overabundance of wealth is a relatively simple fix - throw a focused Sunder build at the party, or just throw a lot of "Treasure: None" monsters at them until their XP total catches up with their wealth, so that it balances out to WBL. Alternately, instead of "Treasure: None" opponents, use opponents that doesn't have harvestable wealth - Vow of Poverty Sorcerers/Druids, mad wizards that hide their spellbooks and use a lot of grafts, Forsakers, and so on.

Arcane Mark was brilliant, thank you.
And I don't quite agree about your idea of sundering the loot or "Treasure: None"-opponents, because the game will just get silly... At first players get too much treasure, and after this they get no treasure for several sessions. I'd rather just TPK them if they deliberately betray their trustworthy good-doing NPC friends and start over again.

[Jarawara]

http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2010/3/29/

[magic9mushroom]

TPKing on purpose is generally something you want to avoid doing, since the players will get very angry at you.

Likewise, something that's obviously there to destroy their loot (like an Adamantine Horror) will piss them off unless you actually weave it into the plot.

Monsters with less treasure than usual are really the way to go.

[Anasazi]

^Rust Slimes/Golems work well too :)

Arcane Mark is a good idea except that players could still find a buyer, infact, there are some dealers that prefer to buy from those who are marked (better prices, rare items, etc).

TPK is just fine so long as they wakeup somewhere else, throw them in jail if they killed a bunch of your npc's. Give them the choice to fight it out or go peacefully, then run the story from there. As a GM, your players will always find ways of twisting your story, its your job to run with it and change the story when needed. If you can't handle running a game without traintracks, you're not ready to GM yet.

But there are multiple options, your players could buy the services of new npc's, give them the options of choosing who's going along with them and they'll be less likely to kill them. Give them npc options that they can relate to, write their real life stories into the game, most players will stickup for npc's they feel a real life connection too.

And if you dont like those options, then have the npc's connected to somebody that the PC's wouldnt want to piss off. Say the person who told them about the treasure/financer is a powerful lord, or the npc's have thick roots to the assassin's guild. Theres a plethora of options no matter which route you go.

[Jon_Dahl]

Well just for info this is not so much about traintracking or anything like this, since we are talking about randomly killing innocent NPC-allies just to avoid sharing the treasure like was agreed, and PC's will get filthy-rich.

Maybe for some DM's that would be a nice challenge, but I'd find that mind-numbing and ruin my joy of the game.

[Volkov]

^Rust Slimes/Golems work well too :)

Arcane Mark is a good idea except that players could still find a buyer, infact, there are some dealers that prefer to buy from those who are marked (better prices, rare items, etc).

TPK is just fine so long as they wakeup somewhere else, throw them in jail if they killed a bunch of your npc's. Give them the choice to fight it out or go peacefully, then run the story from there. As a GM, your players will always find ways of twisting your story, its your job to run with it and change the story when needed. If you can't handle running a game without traintracks, you're not ready to GM yet.

But there are multiple options, your players could buy the services of new npc's, give them the options of choosing who's going along with them and they'll be less likely to kill them. Give them npc options that they can relate to, write their real life stories into the game, most players will stickup for npc's they feel a real life connection too.

And if you dont like those options, then have the npc's connected to somebody that the PC's wouldnt want to piss off. Say the person who told them about the treasure/financer is a powerful lord, or the npc's have thick roots to the assassin's guild. Theres a plethora of options no matter which route you go.

Don't forget the grandaddy of all the rust creatures, the dreaded rust monster itself. If you really want to be mean, use the Rust Dragon.

[shadow_archmagi]

Put everything in a chest.

Seal the chest using a staff, so if they try to force it...


KABOOM!

[Wannabehero]

Have the NPC's affiliated with an organization or consortium of some means.

If the PC's betray the NPC's, the consortium hires detectives/Bounty Hunters to bring in the PC's (think Pinkertons for historical analog). The hired Detectives/Bounty Hunters should not outrageously outclass the PC's, but defeat should be very likely. If the PC's defeat their pursuers they will be continually hounded by ever increasing numbers of more powerfully NPC's until defeated. You can spring these NPC's on the Players at anytime, hopefully the most inopportune moment, aka right after an exhausting battle or during some calamity.

When subdued, PC's find themselves stripped of all their wealth, imprisoned, and likely on trial. RP to escape prison or negotiate parole. Hopefully Players learn a lesson on broader game implications for their actions, as they should be pretty close to penny-less after the ordeal.