OOTS #716 - The Discussion Thread

[silvadel]

Ok -- you see a really exotic dagger sticking out of a wanted poster in the middle of the square.

Do you pick it up?

I would sincerely doubt it -- it looks like the kind of set up that would get you KILLED. People just dont leave something around like that in that way without a purpose.

At worst someone is in the shadows ready to destroy anyone who touches the dagger. At best someone is going to want it back and hunt you down.

[slayerx]

[deleted]........

[The MunchKING]

why would Haley be beat up? When you go for a bounty, healthy people are usualy worth more.

That's Slaves.

Bountys tend to only care about "dead or Alive". Or possibly "Well enough to answer questions".

[SaintRidley]

Hmmm, I wonder where they're teleporting to? And how is Roy supposed to find out where they are?

Read thread, obtain answers.

[The MunchKING]

Perhaps because when she started losing, she didn't revert to demon type and start using natural abilities?

Heck WE know (although I don't think they did) that Sabine had Level drain on touch. The mere fact that he COULD grapple her without having his levels eaten down to nothing would clue any someone who knew Sabine.

[The MunchKING]

Very clever. But as others have opined, their plan depends on the following:


With any luck, whoever pays the ransom will also take 5 minutes to use Divination magic to determine their real identities. But who know. Fun and completely unexpected twist though. Keep up the awesomeness.

There are apperently Aristocrat freindly prestige classes that let you fool Magic divinations.

For starters, we have already seen evidence that V and Elan do not make good solo partners- especially when alone. The "Don't Split the Party" arc was clear evidence of this fact. They have different enough views, and neither know how to take care of each other.

Well when V is still mostly sane she's pretty good at Getting the Most out of Elan's spellcasting abilities.

I mean, face it. If it's his last breath- ever-, Belkar's at a young age. Were he ever killed before the end of the story, Roy's likely to just have him raised.

Roy doesn't WANT him back though.

[Solara]

I can't believe so many people are worried about the dagger getting stolen. Unless there just happens to be another party of PCs wandering around that are good at making spot checks, that dagger is perfectly safe and Haley is awesome.

Also, I noticed a few people assuming the whole 'Elan is not Nale' thing would be cleared up right away and they'd all be free to go or something...but, um, I think even with being found completely innocent without a doubt, a lot depends on whether the Empress of Blood is as gleefully Evil as her title would suggest. "What do we have here, a couple of Good adventurers? Excellent, toss 'em in the sandworm pit for a little after dinner entertainment!"

[Woodsman]

I can't believe so many people are worried about the dagger getting stolen. Unless there just happens to be another party of PCs wandering around that are good at making spot checks, that dagger is perfectly safe and Haley is awesome.

Er, yeah, given the characters' history with Spot checks, I wouldn't be so sure.

Well, mostly Belkar.

[Herald Alberich]

Doubt it.

The Oracle said it'd be before the end of the year. The Giant is probably not going to off Belkar that easily. Especially if it's his "last breath ever".

I mean, face it. If it's his last breath- ever-, Belkar's at a young age. Were he ever killed before the end of the story, Roy's likely to just have him raised.

So something must be stopping him from being raised.

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My money is that he gets eaten by the Snarl at the end of the story.

Funnily enough, I don't think any in-story effect will prevent Belkar from being raised.

Roy doesn't WANT him back though.

Precisely. Two reasons here:

1. The prophecy was made to Roy. He is expecting that Belkar will die, permanently. So, he's not going to bother to raise him, even if he could, because it would break the prophecy (which of course makes it self-fulfilling).

2. Roy has already confirmed to both Haley and the deva that he only keeps Belkar around because he's useful and does less Evil with the party than he would on his own. If Belkar's dead, he can't do any Evil at all. Roy's not about to turn him loose on the world again when there's finally a prison - death itself - guaranteed to hold him permanently.

[Conuly]

1. The prophecy was made to Roy. He is expecting that Belkar will die, permanently. So, he's not going to bother to raise him, even if he could, because it would break the prophecy (which of course makes it self-fulfilling).

I think he's not going to bother because he just doesn't like the guy. I mean, he might use "The prophecy says it won't work...!" as an excuse if called on it, but... who's gonna call him on it? This is Belkar!

[Swordpriest]

Also, I noticed a few people assuming the whole 'Elan is not Nale' thing would be cleared up right away and they'd all be free to go or something...but, um, I think even with being found completely innocent without a doubt, a lot depends on whether the Empress of Blood is as gleefully Evil as her title would suggest. "What do we have here, a couple of Good adventurers? Excellent, toss 'em in the sandworm pit for a little after dinner entertainment!"

A very good point. And if she learns that Elan is Nale's brother, and she has it in for Nale, and she's evil .... well, if you can't kill the guy you're really after, taking it out on his brother will do!

[factotum]

Hmmm, I wonder where they're teleporting to? And how is Roy supposed to find out where they are?

Look carefully at the wanted poster--we got a good close-up of it in the previous strip. You might notice something that gives a clue where they're heading.

[lothos]

I was just thinking about the latest developments and then something occurred to me.

Maybe this whole thing with the bounty hunters has nothing to do with Nale at all. Maybe Girad is behind this. OK, probably been reading too much conspiracy fiction but ever since the order arrived where Girad's gate was supposed to be, I keep going back to the comment in Strip 277 that he hid his gate behind an endless series of illusions, replying on the power of deception to protect the gate.

I took that to mean that as well as magical deception, he would use mundane means. I wonder if anything the illusion of Draketooth said can be trusted, perhaps he did know Soon would not break his oath and only pretended to think he did as part of some elaborate deception.

Perhaps now these two bounty hunters are not after Nale at all. They just are trying to catch some of the Order to take them back to Draketooth (or somewhere else safe to interrogate them). They used some kind of magic to find out about each member of the order after scrying on them in the desert, then made up a plausible wanted poster.... So the rest of the order would be deceived to go look for those they took elsewhere... planning all along for the poster to somehow get left behind.....

OK, in the real world this is far fetched and on a level with many other conspiracy theories in terms of credibility.... but we are actually talking about a story here where the author has surprised me so many times with twists I didn't see coming that I'm starting to second guess almost every character's intentions...... I'm just waiting to find out O-Chul is actually a blackguard and Xykon is a a celestial :-)

Seriously though, does this idea about Girad seem plausible to anyone else ? It's just speculation, but it keeps going round in my mind. I'd welcome comments or thoughts about it.

Cheers.

[Kareasint]

Well, Iothos, for that to occur, Girard would have to know about the Order from way earlier back when they were dungeon crawling and fighting at Azure City. Hard to get that kind of info off a single scry. Girard could cast other spells to research information but it seems a little elaborate to set something like this up. This is likely something to do with Nale's activities and the bounty hunters think that Elan is Nale.

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I still think the other members of the Order will enter the area rapidly and soon due to hearing the power word. They can locate V, Elan and Haley through magical means. Getting there is going to be a trick depending on how far away it is.

[Garwain]

According to the map the OOTS is quite close to The Empire of Blood since they left the dessert to the north-north-east. Roy counted only the biggest city, so most probably they are in Dictatoria, which would logically be the first city for them to visit.

We know that to get out the desert it's a 4day trip. So with windwalk at 60mph, they can cover the distance from Dictatoria to Empire of Blood in 1 day.

Interesting to mention is that we also know that the Azure fleet is epic teleported to an island close to these lands, which we see on the map as well. The Azurites are maybe 4 days away and since the Empire of Blood has a seaport, I bet there will be another invasion at hand!

[WreckedElf]

So if Nale has a reputation in this area, maybe Girard thinks Elan is Nale. Girard saw the "Nale" at the false coordinates when the trap blew up, thus he things the Order is all working with Nale. Thus he tips off some bounty hunters to start looking for him.... maybe?



And as for the debate over Haley's actions, I suspect that had V, Elan and Haley not been taken at a disadvantage, then they probably could have beaten the bounty hunters. So letting herself get captured, her rogue skills gives them a better chance at escaping, and arranging a fight to their advantage... Also, and perhaps more importantly, she's a chaotic good-ish rogue whose love interest was just kidnapped. Do you really think a silly thing like a risky gambit is going to stop her? Seriously, that's what her alignment\class combination was designed for.

And about the dagger and poster. We don't know how long is left until they were expected to meet with Roy.. he may be there in minutes. It's night time, so there not much pedestrian traffic. And this is not Greysky city so the night isn't swarming with theives at all times. And as in my previous statement, I don't think Haley is scared of a little risk.

Though I suspect that with all that risk involved, at least some of it will not work in Haley's favor... here's my prediction for the upcomming event:

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Roy, Belkar and Durkon meet up... the dagger and poster are clearly in the background nearby. They all fail their spot check, wait around for a while a go to the inn.

[Dark Matter]

2. Roy has already confirmed to both Haley and the deva that he only keeps Belkar around because he's useful and does less Evil with the party than he would on his own. If Belkar's dead, he can't do any Evil at all. Roy's not about to turn him loose on the world again when there's finally a prison - death itself - guaranteed to hold him permanently.

Agreed. And I'd love to see Belkar replaced with some Paladin, preferably O'Chul.

And on a side note, that wanted posting hints Nale may have replaced his elf-mage.

[Scactha]

Ack, they just got back together! Not another party split for a hundred strips

[Shale]

And on a side note, that wanted posting hints Nale may have replaced his elf-mage.

The wanted poster includes Yikyik, meaning it's out of date by some 650 strips at least.

[silvadel]

Agreed. And I'd love to see Belkar replaced with some Paladin, preferably O'Chul.

And on a side note, that wanted posting hints Nale may have replaced his elf-mage.

They could always replace him with an epic-monk with a grudge.

[Adeptus]

What is that blue draconian thing?

4th edition has Dragon Born, but I suppose this has to be something else? Help me out D&D people.

[DSCrankshaw]

What is that blue draconian thing?

4th edition has Dragon Born, but I suppose this has to be something else? Help me out D&D people.

Half-dragon, probably, though there were a few other possibilities being batted around earlier.

[plasma ball]

why in the world would he have two telleport spells bought?? It's almost like he knew that he would loose one.
O, right. Plot. Or side plot/quest.

[DSCrankshaw]

why in the world would he have two telleport spells bought?? It's almost like he knew that he would loose one.
O, right. Plot. Or side plot/quest.

Or they frequently have to travel quickly (not exactly far fetched for bounty hunters who don't want to be carting bounties all over the continent, and thus giving them an increased chance of escape), so they stock up whenever they have the chance.

[Crod]

Yay! Isn't power word stun an 8th level spell? If so I think it's the first time we see Vaarsuvius use one, I guess there has been a level up lately.

[Doug Lampert]

why in the world would he have two telleport spells bought?? It's almost like he knew that he would loose one.
O, right. Plot. Or side plot/quest.

Or he might roll a 1 on UMD. You can't take ten, you can't assist another, and on a 1 you can't use that particular item for 24 hours.

So a second scroll is potentially REALLY useful unless his UMD check is at +28 or more he can fail on any teleport scroll and need a backup. If we go BtB then it's him + 3 medium or smaller creatures and one large creature, for a caster level of 15 or more, for a UMD of +34 needed to guarantee he doesn't need a backup.

[Kareasint]

Yay! Isn't power word stun an 8th level spell? If so I think it's the first time we see Vaarsuvius use one, I guess there has been a level up lately.

Yes, it is 8th level and that makes V at least 15th level. As I stated before, Durkon could be 15th level also which would make for some interesting spell use.

[Shatteredtower]

Just two things:

1. Technically, Haley is obeying "Don't split the party!" guidelines.

2. This is a case in which Search checks are more effective than Spot checks. Even Thog could find that dagger, though he might need to take 20 on the check. Roy could probably find it taking 10.

[Swordpriest]

It would make sense to have a good supply of extra teleport scrolls if that's your main way of making a quick exit after grabbing people who may have high-level friends, or who may be wanted other bounty hunters who are none too scrupulous about taking your quarry from you.

Plus, they're extremely handy. I mean, if I could get teleport scrolls for different destinations in real life, I'd have about 100 of them.

[Me!]

As has been stated earlier in this thread--this is incorrect. The teleport scroll disappeared when it fizzled, and the remaining paper in his hand not only looks like the wanted poster, you can see Wanted written at the top. And a teleport scroll does not designate the location to which you teleport, and even if it did, none of Roy, Durkon, and Belkar can use a teleport scroll.

ok thanks, now i know