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Thread: Spells for Killing Undead
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2010-07-02, 10:24 AM (ISO 8601)
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Spells for Killing Undead
Are there any that aren't mind effecting? (apart from Mind Poison, which won't work unfortunately)
Really anything good at killing really huge undead. 11th level sorcerer.
Thank you!
EDIT: changed titleLast edited by Tinydwarfman; 2010-07-02 at 11:46 AM.
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2010-07-02, 10:35 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Spells that deal Mental Ability Damage
Power Leach (BoVD pg. #101)
Does 1 damage per round for 1 round/level. You also gain an enhancement to the same ability at 1:1, max +10.
Edit: You do take 1 point of wisdom drain, but there are ways around that.Last edited by EvilJoe15; 2010-07-02 at 10:35 AM.
Just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get me.
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2010-07-02, 10:40 AM (ISO 8601)
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2010-07-02, 10:41 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Spells that deal Mental Ability Damage
Hrm... Mindcrusher weapons deal damage to a target's psionic point pool, and once that runs out, they take 1 wisdom damage each hit. This applies to non-psionic creatures. They get a DC 17 will save though, but it's non-mind-affecting. It applies this affect to ammunition, as well. It's a +2 bonus.
A 13th level Soulknife that has at least one level in Illumine Soul can deal mental damage to Undead with Knife to the Soul through their psychic strike.
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2010-07-02, 10:41 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Spells that deal Mental Ability Damage
Wait, I thought undead were immune to ability damage/drain as part of their type.
Ahh, so there is a loophole and that's what this thread is about.
Hmm. Good luck. :/hope there's something better than a soul knife. x.x
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2010-07-02, 10:45 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Spells that deal Mental Ability Damage
There's a spell somewhere that makes undead count as living for things like this, but I don't remember it's name.
Just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get me.
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2010-07-02, 11:01 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Spells that deal Mental Ability Damage
Hah, I can make a Soulknife build that's awesome. It won't be a killer loop-hole rich wizard or cleric build, but it's not bad. With the right feats, you can turn them into a psychic chain tripper that can make trip attempts on all the enemies within reach, delivering a psychic strike for each one that they kill. Since it's not precision damage, I can cleave, kill, recharge strike, deal cleave damage with another psychic strike, kill, then make iterative attacks. So long as I kill a target every attack, I can continue to deal psychic strike damage every attack.
For instance, say I'm surrounded by undead enemies. With my levels in illumine soul, I can do a Bladewind attack with my reshaped spiked mind chain, it deals 2d6 extra damage from undead bane +7. If I have my psychic strike charged when I attack, and I kill an undead creature, Mind Cleave recharges my psychic strike, then the next attack hits, dealing more psychic strike damage, and so on. My last attack roll will be on the stronger creature, with a psychic strike charged, I can then deal mental damage. If it's a lich, I hit them with a wisdom damaging attack. If my spiked mind chain has Mindcrusher, I can deal 1 wisdom damage to every undead I hit with iterative strikes.
If I focus on using Knife to the Soul, I can disable opponents with mental damage, then when I feel the need, reattune my mind chain to Bodyfeeding or Mindfeeding (with a feat that lets me reattune my mind chain) and coup de grace them with psychic strike at my leisure, granting me large amounts of temporary hit points and psionic points (I use a few levels of psychic warrior to grant me expansion, compression, and some other powers)
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2010-07-02, 11:05 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Spells that deal Mental Ability Damage
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2010-07-02, 11:20 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Spells that deal Mental Ability Damage
Sure is, Dragon Magazine #341
Mind Cleave is in Complete PsionicLast edited by Hague; 2010-07-02 at 11:26 AM.
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2010-07-02, 01:21 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Spells that deal Mental Ability Damage
NOW COMPLETE: Let's Play Starcraft II Trilogy:
Hell, It's About Time: Wings of Liberty
Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat: Heart of the Swarm
My Life For Aiur? I Barely Know 'Er: Legacy of the Void
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2010-07-02, 02:13 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Spells for Killing Undead
Well, with all the feats, you can definitely see the advantage. Notably, if you combine the Practiced Mind Blade and the Kensai PrC, you can get a Mind Blade that has +5 or more enhancement bonus and +15 in other abilities.
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2010-07-02, 02:23 PM (ISO 8601)
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2010-07-02, 02:31 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Spells for Killing Undead
One tiny problem, Circle of Death has that damn
.No creature of 9 or more HD can be affected
This spell functions like circle of death, except that it destroys undead creatures as noted above.
I'd go for a more simple wall of fire, no save double damage vs undead. Make it a circular wall and you may be able to force the undead to pass through twice. Throw in a shadow binding and you an hold the undead in place via a reflex save so it takes continual damage from the spell.
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2010-07-02, 02:53 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Spells for Killing Undead
Disintigrate is your go-to spell for killing undead. With a poor Fort save and no Con modifier, they're pushovers to that spell. That's not going to help you much as a sorcerer 11 though.
Orb of fire works. Anything that deals enormous damage and doesn't offer a Will save, really. LV's wall of fire suggestion is pretty good. Your best tactic against powerful undead is often just to blow them to bits with the biggest blasting spell you've got.Subclasses for 5E: magus of blades, shadowcraft assassin, spellthief, void disciple
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2010-07-02, 03:01 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Spells for Killing Undead
How's this: Cast Stone Bones on him, yes I know that's a buff, but hear me out. It turns their bones to stone, now cast Transmute Rock to Mud No More Bones. Or you could cast Stone Shape, and lock them all together.
Just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get me.
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2010-07-02, 03:10 PM (ISO 8601)
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2010-07-02, 03:30 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Spells for Killing Undead
What about plain old Command Undead? It's only one at a time, but it's level 2 (and thus fairly spammable at level 11) and non-intelligent undead don't even get a save. Then tell them to walk off a cliff, which non-intelligent undead also don't get a save against. Slightly less one-shot for intelligent undead, but still.
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2010-07-02, 09:57 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Spells for Killing Undead
Thanks for the great advice guys, but unfortunately I really need a save or die. I don't think we'll be killing this thing with HP damage any time soon, so it needs to die from supernatural means. I didn't think command undead would work on it, seeing as it has HUGE HD, and a good will save, but it's worth a shot.
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2010-07-02, 10:38 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Spells for Killing Undead
Last edited by Cheesy74; 2010-07-02 at 10:38 PM.
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2010-07-02, 10:53 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Spells for Killing Undead
Spark of Life (Cl 3, Druid 4) is the spell you're looking for. It requires a will save and a touch attack, so it's kind of limited. however, it makes undead vulnerable to the same things as a living creature and lasts a round per level. From there, enervate knock down the saves and then hit it with whatever save or die you'd use on a living creature. (aside from anything that deals con damage, since they still don't have a con score.)
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2010-07-02, 11:15 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Spells for Killing Undead
Well if he's mindless it doesn't matter command undead offers NO save for mindless undead. A ray of enfeeblement to lower his strength combined with a shadowbinding spell could keep him stuck in one place for a while giving you time to blast from a distance.
The real advantage undead have is those save or die powers tend not to work.Last edited by Lord Vukodlak; 2010-07-02 at 11:18 PM.
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2010-07-02, 11:25 PM (ISO 8601)
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2010-07-02, 11:38 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Spells for Killing Undead
Split Ray Disintegrate under Beads of Karma would be what the doctor ordered. Unfortunately, don't think you have means to cast that given it's a level 6 spell and you're only 11... Metamagic Rod of Split Ray could be available though but I guess that doesn't help here.
But yeah, outside Disintegrate you could try the Will- and Reflex-save stuff. Unfortunately most of it won't kill it (Slow, Glitterdust, etc.) but they could make him more manageable. Unfortunately Polymorph Any Object is the first true Fort SoD I can think of that can target Undead.
EDIT: You could get a scroll of PAO crafted by someone with particularly high Int; that could work.Last edited by Eldariel; 2010-07-02 at 11:39 PM.
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2010-07-02, 11:41 PM (ISO 8601)
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2010-07-02, 11:43 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Spells for Killing Undead
Campaign Journal: Uncovering the Lost World - A Player's Diary in Low-Magic D&D (Latest Update: 8.3.2014)
Being Bane: A Guide to Barbarians Cracking Small Men - Ever Been Angry?! Then this is for you!
SRD Averages - An aggregation of all the key stats of all the monster entries on SRD arranged by CR.
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2010-07-02, 11:46 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Spells for Killing Undead
How has disrupting weapon not been mention? Sure you give it to those meaty things that stand in front of you, but it works well.
Originally Posted by Alabenson
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2010-07-02, 11:49 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Spells for Killing Undead
It gives Will-save, which was already determined to be somewhat unreliable in this scenario. Also, it's only a Cleric-spell. Disruption Weapon itself is a joke; DC 14 means it's basically 5% chance of killing the thing with each hit. You only need 14 hits to achieve over 50% probabilities of it dying with one of those. The issue, of course, is achieving 14 hits on the thing and managing to not kill it the oldfashioned way.
Undeath to Death is a fine SoD against undead except it also has a Will-save.Campaign Journal: Uncovering the Lost World - A Player's Diary in Low-Magic D&D (Latest Update: 8.3.2014)
Being Bane: A Guide to Barbarians Cracking Small Men - Ever Been Angry?! Then this is for you!
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2010-07-02, 11:49 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Spells for Killing Undead
Are we talking about intelligent or unintelligent dead? Because if unintelligent, illusions are your friend. You can lure them into pitfalls, hide behind illusory walls, and pull off all kinds of evil tricks.
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2010-07-02, 11:54 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Spells for Killing Undead
Even intelligent undead are immune to mind affecting effects.
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2010-07-02, 11:57 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Spells for Killing Undead
Last edited by Lord Vukodlak; 2010-07-02 at 11:58 PM.