What the F... eats?

[Morph Bark]

JUST A HENCHMAN
Prerequisites: Str 9 or lower
Benefit: You can carry four times as much as normal, having trained yourself in lifting heavier things while relinquishing fighting ability and the use of strength-based skills.


JUST A MEATSHIELD
Prerequisites: Dex 9 or lower, BAB+1, 1st level only
Benefit: Once per round, you can and must willingly fail the first Reflex save you are entitled to or allow the first attack that targets you to hit you without fail. You gain an additional 3 hit points per level.


JUST A LINGUIST
Prerequisites: Int 9 or lower, must be capable of speaking languages, 1st level only
Benefit: Your Int penalty functions instead as an Int bonus for the purpose of determining bonus languages gained. Furthermore, at level 4 and every four levels thereafter, you gain one bonus language.

However, you aren’t perfect with the use of these languages and every time you speak in a language gained through this feat, you must make a level check (1d20 + character level). On a result of 15 you manage to say what you want perfectly. If you fail, you mispronounce some words and don’t convey your meaning well enough and the other party might misinterpret you. If you fail by 5 or more, you say some really embarrassing or offensive things, causing the other party to become two steps closer to hostile (hostile if they were indifferent or worse before, unfriendly if they were friendly, indifferent if they were helpful). This attitude remains until the end of the encounter and 1d6 hours afterwards.


JUST A GUARD
Prerequisites: Wis 9 or lower
Benefit: All Int- and Cha-based skills are never class skills for you. Listen and Spot are always class skills for you. You gain a +4 bonus on Listen and Spot checks.


JUST A MESSENGER
Prerequisites: Cha 9 or lower
Benefit: By going about it slowly and carefully, you can voice the words of your leader well in another language. By taking ten times as long, you may use someone else’s Diplomacy check in your place, but if that other person is not present (or can’t convey the words to you through magic), you must have a written version of what to say with you and you must be able to read.


JUST ACKNOWLEDGEABLE
Prerequisites: Cha 9 or lower
Benefit: You can use Knowledge skills that you have 0 ranks in untrained, but only if the DC of the check is 20 or less. However, you must also re-roll Bluff, Diplomacy, Gather Information and Intimidate checks and use the lower roll.


I'M JUST SAIYAN
Prerequisites: BAB+6, Int and Cha 9 or lower
Benefit: You gain the ability to enter a state that is similar to a barbarian's rage as a full-round action once per day. Your hair turns golden and your eyes turn green and your body seems to bulk up and pulse with power. For 1 round/level or until you fall unconscious, your Str, Dex and Con modifiers count as double. At the end of this transformation, you must make a Will save (DC 10 + your character level) or fall unconscious for 1 hour. Even if you succeed you become fatigued instead.


JUST ICE
Prerequisites: Int 9 or lower, Good alignment
Benefit: You gain the ability to serve evildoers a cold glass of justice. Once per day per level you can use detect evil as a supernatural ability at will. If you determine a creature to be evil in this manner, you can spend a standard action to deal 1d6/2 levels points of cold damage to each evil creature in the area of your detect evil ability.



Partly inspired by this thread, even though it wasn't brought up in there. I suppose you could call them anti-feats?

Antifeats can be implemented in several ways:

Spoiler

Show

As normal feats
Antifeats could just be used as normal feats, the normal way. However, antifeats may seem rather weak for this, as they are essentially more like traits, except for the fact that you can learn them and exchange them.

The idea for antifeats is always that if you lose access to one of them - permanently (like the ability score was raised and it wasn't an enhancement bonus), you can get another one by practicing for a day or so.


As extra traits
When used as extra traits, antifeats are gained every few levels, every 4 levels being an okay standard (make it less and it would be too much, but more, like every 5 or 7 levels is likely better).

[Temotei]

Just a Meatshield takes away hit points, usually. Say they get an additional three hit points.

[Morph Bark]

Just a Meatshield takes away hit points, usually. Say they get an additional three hit points.

Ah! Thanks for noticing that small thing. It is so easily overlooked. Fixed that now.

Do the others have any similar problems?

[For Valor]

other than the feats making me want to cry? No.

This stuff is somehwere between Alertness and Power Attack. It's befitting of Fighters and Monks, but nothing better.

[Temotei]

Do their attitudes return to their normal statuses after 1d6 hours (Just a Linguist)?

Other than that, I don't see anything problematic, other than the fact that these will never be taken as feats. Maybe if you granted one free anti-feat per character...if they wanted them...they might be okay. Just a Guard wouldn't be awful for a fighter, for example.

[Dairun Cates]

Holy Crap! That Squirrel Speaks 5 Languages... Poorly!

[Silverscale]

I think these look like excellent ways to help out characters who rolled really low on one or more stats. I agree that players should be given a free "Anti-feat" at first level if they want it.

[Darkxarth]

I agree that they make nice level 1 feats for players who rolled poorly in a stat.

Just a Messenger seems weak compared to the others, though, if you intend player use (fine if it is for NPCs).

I would also revise Just a Linguist so that it looks more like this:
{table]Intelligence Modifier|Bonus Languages
-1|+4
-2|+3
-3|+2
-4|+1[/table]
Or maybe a flat bonus of 2 extra languages at 1st level and an additional language every 4 levels. After all, the other feats don't scale according to penalty.

Of course, now you need one for Constitution, but its only uses are HP, Fortitude saves, and the Concentration skill, and I will almost guarantee that if you have a low Con give a bonus to Concentration skill, 80% of Wizards and Sorcerers will take it, possibly deliberately putting their low score into Constitution for the increased bonus to Concentration.

[Tinydwarfman]

My Frenzied Berzerker with -14 AC would love Just a Meatshield.

[Morph Bark]

other than the feats making me want to cry? No.

This stuff is somehwere between Alertness and Power Attack. It's befitting of Fighters and Monks, but nothing better.

What, is it bad to give characters something a little nice if they otherwise suck badly enough already?

And if you thought Just A Henchman was PC stuff, that was your first mistake.

Do their attitudes return to their normal statuses after 1d6 hours (Just a Linguist)?

That is the intention.

Other than that, I don't see anything problematic, other than the fact that these will never be taken as feats. Maybe if you granted one free anti-feat per character...if they wanted them...they might be okay. Just a Guard wouldn't be awful for a fighter, for example.

Perhaps. That could be an idea to use. I will think about it once my head is clearer and I'm not as tired as now.

I think these look like excellent ways to help out characters who rolled really low on one or more stats. I agree that players should be given a free "Anti-feat" at first level if they want it.

Thanks, that was the intention. I intend to try and make more of these, perhaps some involving 0 skill ranks, bad BAB or bad saves.

I agree that they make nice level 1 feats for players who rolled poorly in a stat.

Just a Messenger seems weak compared to the others, though, if you intend player use (fine if it is for NPCs).

I would also revise Just a Linguist so that it looks more like this:
{table]Intelligence Modifier|Bonus Languages
-1|+4
-2|+3
-3|+2
-4|+1[/table]
Or maybe a flat bonus of 2 extra languages at 1st level and an additional language every 4 levels. After all, the other feats don't scale according to penalty.

Hm, could do that instead. My intention was to make it more like it is though:

{table]Intelligence Modifier|Bonus Languages
-1|+1
-2|+2
-3|+3
-4|+4[/table]

Prettymuch just because you're already going about with an abysmal Int and big penalties to other stuff. These are meant to not entirely make sense, but still aid a character in some way as to not suck as much for one small thing that depends off a certain ability score that is low.

Of course, now you need one for Constitution, but its only uses are HP, Fortitude saves, and the Concentration skill, and I will almost guarantee that if you have a low Con give a bonus to Concentration skill, 80% of Wizards and Sorcerers will take it, possibly deliberately putting their low score into Constitution for the increased bonus to Concentration.

Yeah, I was stuck on that one and then dinna bother with it. I was considering putting that with Just A Meatshield at one point, but as it is, that just didn't work for me.

And maybe I should put in something for Just A Meatshield to not make it too saucy... but right now my mind is blank on that.

[Mongoose87]

My Frenzied Berzerker with -14 AC would love Just a Meatshield.

It would be great for ensuring you never pass that save on Grease to keep you from killing your party.

[imp_fireball]

Do their attitudes return to their normal statuses after 1d6 hours (Just a Linguist)?

Other than that, I don't see anything problematic, other than the fact that these will never be taken as feats. Maybe if you granted one free anti-feat per character...if they wanted them...they might be okay. Just a Guard wouldn't be awful for a fighter, for example.

A nice alternative to traits. Maybe if they get an extra boost at a later level (ie. a bonus feat; or two bonus feats if this costs a feat and doesn't actually replace traits).

[DracoDei]

LINK for wikipedia like cross-referencing purposes.

[Morph Bark]

It would be great for ensuring you never pass that save on Grease to keep you from killing your party.

Kind of why it'd probably be a good idea to get something against such things. Any suggestions?

LINK for wikipedia like cross-referencing purposes.

Heh, honestly hadn't ever seen that. I knew of your acid classes, but hadn't seen any anti-feats like these before.

[Xallace]

I'm gonna be just an orc linguist! Now I can speak in fractured everything!

Now this reminds me of something I saw in a 3rd party book; a variant wherein you get a special ability for having a particularly low score. Yours are far better than that book's, and as such I think you should expand the list!

[Morph Bark]

I'm gonna be just an orc linguist! Now I can speak in fractured everything!

Now this reminds me of something I saw in a 3rd party book; a variant wherein you get a special ability for having a particularly low score. Yours are far better than that book's, and as such I think you should expand the list!

Thanks! Always great to hear a little support. Ego-boosting gives the confidence to keep on going with homebrew, after all.

I don't suppose you still know the name of the 3rd party book? I might be able to get a look into it and be inspired by it (and do better of course).

[DracoDei]

Heh, honestly hadn't ever seen that. I knew of your acid classes, but hadn't seen any anti-feats like these before.

It wasn't originally intended as a joke at all. It was designed as a mechanical solution to the problem that, as one later thread put it, "In D&D the term 'Dumb Jock' is an oxymoron." and being especially useful for half-orc (and other Int penalty races) fighters and monks and such. It does relate in its effects to what you have though, which is why I posted it, and I suppose if grouped with them it might take on their humorous aspects.

I certainly wouldn't group them with the Acid Classes... those are SPECIFICALLY meant to be crippled or outright "does not compute" such as having the names of living organisms for attack bonuses in some cases. BTW, someone else rounded out the rest of the PHB mirroring Acid Classes.

EDIT: In case it isn't obvious, yours might work better as Traits (retaining the pre-requisites), rather than Feats. Mine I am not so sure about.

[Mongoose87]

Kind of why it'd probably be a good idea to get something against such things. Any suggestions?

You want to kill your party?

[Morph Bark]

You want to kill your party?

Of course, I'm the DM.

More on the point, I want the feats to be somewhat counter-intuitive (that's the whole point prettymuch), but yet also somewhat balanced. I think most are so far, only Just A Meatshield is perhaps a problem, so if anyone has any suggestions for it, I'd welcome them.

[Xallace]

I don't suppose you still know the name of the 3rd party book? I might be able to get a look into it and be inspired by it (and do better of course).

Advanced Player's Guide from Sword and Sorcery.

The book itself is not particularly worthwhile; maybe one or two things actually stand out. The variant in question actually has a second half: penalties for characters with ability scores at 18+. Kinda interesting, I guess.

[Temotei]

Advanced Player's Guide from Sword and Sorcery.

The book itself is not particularly worthwhile; maybe one or two things actually stand out. The variant in question actually has a second half: penalties for characters with ability scores at 18+. Kinda interesting, I guess.

Nice rolls! *subtracts 1 hit point per level*
What'd you do that for?
You rolled well in a game centered around rolling dice.

[imp_fireball]

Besides potential traits or the special flaws I proposed, some of these are good feats for npc mooks.

[Xallace]

Nice rolls! *subtracts 1 hit point per level*
What'd you do that for?
You rolled well in a game centered around rolling dice.

Yeaaaaah that was my reaction to it.

I only say it was "kinda interesting" because options included things like having Con 20+ meant that if you made a save against poison, you didn't realize the poison was there.

...and honestly that's only a drawback if you're, like, testing food for the king.

[UndeadCleric]

Holy Crap! That Squirrel Speaks 5 Languages... Poorly!

My thought exactly.

But just a henchman isnt horrible. I can see a wizard taking it though.

[ericgrau]

I'd make just a linguist a flat 20% failure chance or at very low or high levels it gets messy. Just a guard is an easy victim of minmaxing for anyone who only has 2 skills anyway. Maybe you want that, but then it should be free with a houserule not from a feat.

Just a henchman + dwarf could make a hilarious 360 lb. carrying capacity without reducing movement speed. Similar to a strength of 28. Maybe tag it on a poor dwarf cleric healbot that carries all of the party's loot and sees only by peeking through the cracks between treasure.

[Morph Bark]

Just a henchman + dwarf could make a hilarious 360 lb. carrying capacity without reducing movement speed. Similar to a strength of 28.

Perhaps, but his carrying capacity is still only about a fourth of someone with Str 28 at best.

And perhaps for Just A Linguist I should include "humanoid, monstrous humanoid giant or outsider type"? Or just "Int can't be 1 or 2"?

[Thieves]

Like. +1. Have antifeats be received at 1, 5, 10 and 15. Further specialization and descent into madness as power (?) increases?

More antifeats, moar!

Perhaps Just An Extra, a bonus to Hide checks equal to 1,5 x Charisma penalty? Puh...puh...puh...puh-ker fays, for a penalty to enemy's Sense Motive checks against you equal to 1,5 your Wisdom / Intelligence penalty? Possibilities are endless!

[DracoDei]

Is that second one an "A Fish Called Wanda" reference of some sort? I suspect not, but other than that I got nothin'.

[ericgrau]

Perhaps Just An Extra, a bonus to Hide checks equal to 1,5 x Charisma penalty? Puh...puh...puh...puh-ker fays, for a penalty to enemy's Sense Motive checks against you equal to 1,5 your Wisdom / Intelligence penalty? Possibilities are endless!

Or how about +4 to hide checks for each level or CR you are below those around you .

Perhaps, but his carrying capacity is still only about a fourth of someone with Str 28 at best.

Ya but practically speaking the str 28 guy doesn't like to carry more than a light load, which is the same amount of weight, unless he is also a dwarf. I was merely combo-ing dwarfness with that feat, to get an effective strength of 28 for carrying loot... as a str 9 wizard. Dwarfness alone already provides a big boost. I showed the result of double boosting... a str 9 wizard carrying 360 lbs. without slowing down. "What? I'm just a dwarf henchman."

[Morph Bark]

Like. +1. Have antifeats be received at 1, 5, 10 and 15. Further specialization and descent into madness as power (?) increases?

More antifeats, moar!

Perhaps Just An Extra, a bonus to Hide checks equal to 1,5 x Charisma penalty? Puh...puh...puh...puh-ker fays, for a penalty to enemy's Sense Motive checks against you equal to 1,5 your Wisdom / Intelligence penalty? Possibilities are endless!

Heh, glad you like it.

I don't think I will include mechanics for including these, unless I'd put several ways to implement them as an aside. The Just An Extra is a nice idea. The only anti-feat I had in mind yet was something to do with Knowledge checks as long as you don't have any ranks in them. I don't get the reference with your second idea though.

Ya but practically speaking the str 28 guy doesn't like to carry more than a light load, which is the same amount of weight, unless he is also a dwarf. I was merely combo-ing dwarfness with that feat, to get an effective strength of 28 for carrying loot... as a str 9 wizard. Dwarfness alone already provides a big boost. I showed the result of double boosting... a str 9 wizard carrying 360 lbs. without slowing down. "What? I'm just a dwarf henchman."

Only if the Str 28 (29 actually) guy is wearing no armour or light armour, since otherwise his speed is being reduced anyway.

But eh, the point is that carrying capacity ain't that big of a deal most of the time. These feats aren't meant to be huge boons, but moreso to be nifty and more or less on par with most other feats.